Hi, I seem to get snapped at all the time when I tell people to do that. There was some kind of TDV or MOTA related topic earlier this year tht Regards, Hayden
-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 9:15 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] MOTA Audio Support Although I have been gotten after for telling people to read the documentation because the answer is in there, I haven't been thrown off any lists for doing so, and I'll stand by what I say about the user's manuals. They're there for a purpose, and we should be using them. --- Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to heart. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Trouble" <[email protected]> To: "Gamers Discussion list" <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 8:11 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] MOTA Audio Support > Got a question for you. With all the lists your on and all the questions > you see, and know the answers are in the help or doc's for the program. > How many do you actually know that read them? > I get throne off lists just for telling them to read help files and docs. > Ignorance is bless and abundant in the blind community. > > At 08:51 PM 6/14/2011, you wrote: >>I still contend that a beta is just that. A trial version that is still >>under development. Anyone who doesn't know that will find out by, maybe, >>reading the documentation that comes with the game. If you state in the >>documentation, maybe on the download page and in the license?, that this >>is a beta, it still under development and is, therefore, not a final >>release, and that gamers are working with it at their own risk, and the >>gamer doesn't read it but does agree to it by using the software, it's >>their problem. >> >>--- >>Laughter is the best medicine, so look around, find a dose and take it to >>heart. >>----- Original Message ----- From: "Thomas Ward" >><[email protected]> >>To: "Philip Bennefall" <[email protected]>; "Gamers Discussion list" >><[email protected]> >>Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 3:55 PM >>Subject: Re: [Audyssey] MOTA Audio Support >> >> >>>Hi Philip, >>> >>>Well, I think you are right. The primary mistake I made with beta 19 >>>was simply that I didn't explain to the end users that this was to be >>>considered an experimental release only and not in anyway a full >>>production release. Beta 18 was an official production release were >>>beta 19 wasn't. Beta 19 was an experiment to see how well the >>>cross-platform engine run on Windows XP, Vista, and Windows 7 which I >>>should have been up front about from the beginning. Plus I didn't say >>>why I had removed joystick and mouse support, and people assumed the >>>worst and thought that I was intending on taking it out of the >>>final release when it was only intended for that specific release or >>>build only. >>> >>>The thing is, and I wish I had made this clearer from the beginning, >>>what we have is two different engines more or less in production at >>>the same time. I've got the Windows specific version of the engine >>>which is definitely production quality, has been in development for a >>>couple of years, and is fairly stable. Then, we've got the >>>cross-platform or Linux version of the engine that isn't yet >>>production quality mainly because I haven't found something comparable >>>to DirectX I can replace those components with. I've not actually >>>converted the full Windows engine over to Linux yet so there are a lot >>>of things that need doing like adding joystick support, for example, >>>before it is 100% up to par for writing production quality games as is >>>in evidence with beta 19. >>> >>>Plus I confess when it comes to writing applications for Linux I'm >>>still largely in the dark about many of the libraries and APIs it >>>uses. I've been writing both private and professional software for >>>Windows for probably 10 years so when it comes to Windows core APIs >>>and components I pretty much know what I'm doing so I can put together >>>something pretty quickly and it will be pretty stable because of my >>>past experience. With Linux if you tell me to write an application >>>using one of the graphics toolkits like GTK+, QT, WX, etc I'm going to >>>have to study up on it, write some experimental code, etc because I >>>have no background experience working with those APIs. The only times >>>I've been called upon to write a professional application for Linux >>>such as a graphical front end for a MySQL database I wrote it in Java >>>using the cross-platform Swing toolkit, and since Java is all pretty >>>self-contained that doesn't count as practical experience for what i'm >>>doing now with this cross-platform engine. So its all pretty much >>>experimental code at this point as far as the cross-platform engine >>>is concerned. >>> >>>I think the best thing to do right now is to finish MOTA using the >>>Windows specific engine since it is production quality, get the game >>>sold using that technology, and put off finishing the cross-platform >>>engine until that is out of the way. That way when I say I've got an >>>experimental release that might be cross-platform people aren't going >>>to be as upset with me because if they don't like the experimental >>>cross-platform version they can fallback on 1.0 which is stable and up >>>to their personal standards. >>> >>>The lesson I've learned is this. First, be up front about my >>>intentions, long term goals or plans, and people will understand what >>>I'm after. Second, attach, if possible, a buglog.txt file to the >>>release so people will be informed what problems are in the release >>>and what is on the todo list for the next upgrade. Third, don't try >>>and remove a bunch of features after you just released them in a prior >>>release as some people aren't going to respond well to bleeding edge >>>code regardless of how temporary the removal might or might not be. >>> >>>Cheers! >>> >>>--- >>>Gamers mailing list __ [email protected] >>>If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to >>>[email protected]. >>>You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >>>http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >>>All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >>>http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]. >>>If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the >>>list, >>>please send E-mail to [email protected]. >> >> >>--- >>Gamers mailing list __ [email protected] >>If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to >>[email protected]. >>You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at >>http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. >>All messages are archived and can be searched and read at >>http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]. >>If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the >>list, >>please send E-mail to [email protected]. > > > --- > Gamers mailing list __ [email protected] > If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to > [email protected]. > You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at > http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. > All messages are archived and can be searched and read at > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]. > If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the > list, > please send E-mail to [email protected]. --- Gamers mailing list __ [email protected] If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [email protected]. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [email protected]. --- Gamers mailing list __ [email protected] If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to [email protected]. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to [email protected].
