Linux-Misc Digest #88, Volume #19 Thu, 18 Feb 99 21:13:07 EST
Contents:
Re: Searching for a Linux Sequencer (Sam E. Trenholme)
Re: floating point accuracy on Linux? (Johan Kullstam)
Re: Linux has too many problems (MS employee trolling?) ("Stefan Verkoyen")
Re: Programming for ISA card ("Dirty Fly")
DosLinux 7.7 Kernel recompile problem ("Bob Sinko")
KDE and shortcuts ("Alvaro A. Novo")
Re: Linux Security Questions ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: H E L P !!! (Stéphane Brunet)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Sam E. Trenholme)
Subject: Re: Searching for a Linux Sequencer
Date: 18 Feb 1999 17:02:39 -0800
>I found several web pages that list gobs of music and sound software for
>linux.
http://sound.lovebead.com is (a primary mirror of) the canonical list.
- Sam
--
Email address here: http://www.samiam.org/ssi/mailme.shtml
Music I write here: http://www.mp3.com/sam http://www.samiam.org/mp3
Mp3 reviews here: http://www.samiam.org/music
------------------------------
Subject: Re: floating point accuracy on Linux?
From: Johan Kullstam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 17 Feb 1999 23:18:31 -0500
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rob Komar) writes:
> Georg Schwarz ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
> : [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rob Komar) writes:
> :
> : >I believe that -ffloat-store forces (some) intermediate 80-bit results
> : >to be moved in and out of 64-bit memory to round them to 64-bit results.
> :
> : are they actually rounded or just truncated?
>
> I don't know. You'll probably have to look at the specs for the
> 387 FPU to find out.
what happens is this. the x87 has a 8 register stack internally. all
the registers are (normally) 80 bits. sometimes, during a calculation
with many terms, you want to juggle more than 8 quantities. to make
room, one (or more) of the registers are saved to memory and reloaded
again when you need it. the save is done in double-precision (ie 64
bits). the precision is lost during the save.
thus depending on how much you are juggling during a given problem,
the x87 stack may or may not overflow and cause a register to be
spilled into memory.
optimization settings can have a large impact on how the x87 is fed
and how many quantities are active at a time. thus changing
optimization can cause a register spill which did not exist at a
different optimization setting.
> : for pgf77, there is a -pc 64 option, which actually speeds up things a
> : bit. Also, at least for the calculation I have posted here, it correctly
> : gets 0.0 with that option vs. the "incorrect" output when using the
> : default -pc 80.
>
> I'm glad you put "incorrect" in quotes, because both results are
> actually correct. If "b" had actually been initialized to
> "2.0000000000000000000e-01" rather than "2.0000000000000001110e-01",
> then both 80 and 64 bit modes would have given the same answer.
> Because "b" isn't exactly "0.2" in 80-bit mode, you don't get
> the expected answer of "0.0". I'd put most of the blame on the
> compiler here, but only half-heartedly, because it's hard to
> deal with 80-bit numbers in a language that only supports 32
> and 64-bit numbers. I think that's why Johan Kullstam advised
> to stay away from x86 machines.
>
> : >You can put the FPU into 64-bit mode by setting the FPU control
> : >register. On x86 machines, libc provides (or used to, anyway)
> : >the __setfpucw function for doing this. It's a C function, so
> :
> : how big is its impact? does it influcence the calculation of any process
> : running, just that process or just that process and its children?
> : Could I compile a brief C program which just does that and run that before
> : any actual application?
afaik linux does not save/restore the fpu control word when it
switches tasks. so you set it once and it will hit every process you
have running. i think this was the motivation behind -ffloat-store --
to avoid touching the floating point control word.
i am not sure what happens in the case of SMP. perhaps you need to
set it on each processor. if you set fpucw for 64 bit processing on
the one cpu and the task is moved to a different one, you may lose.
> Although I previously said `believe' because I wouldn't bet my life
> on it, I'm actually very sure that the FPU control word is part of
> each process's context. So, you only have to set it inside your
> program, and the other processes will continue to use whatever
> they were using.
i do not think this is true.
> I don't know about children forked off by the
> parent because I deal mainly with Fortran code, and you don't
> generally fork off other processes from Fortran programs. My
> guess is that the children would have the same FPU control
> word as the parent, but it's only a guess.
>
> I'm pretty sure that the calculations won't be slower in 64-bit
> mode than in 80-bit mode, but I don't know if they'll be faster.
> The program _will_ run faster if you don't use `-ffloat-store'
> because you were able to change the FPU mode.
the 64 bit mode is faster than 80 bit mode.
> In general, even with the FPU set to 64-bit mode, you won't get
> the same answers that you got on workstations. This is due to
> a lot of reasons. The transcendental functions that are
> accelerated in hardware in the 387 probably won't return exactly
> the same result as those calculated on traditional workstations.
and there are a number of `traditional workstations' using all manner
of floating point formats.
> They are also always returned as 80-bit numbers, regardless of
> what mode the FPU is set to. I've heard that the 64-bit mode
> isn't really that; rather the mantissa is reduced to 53 bits
> from 64 in the FPU, but the exponent has the same number of bits
> as in the 80-bit mode (if someone knows for sure, I'd like to hear
> it). So, the answers may differ from what you "expect" in the
> last significant decimal place, but they aren't "wrong", and your
> code should recognize that.
--
Johan Kullstam [[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Don't Fear the Penguin!
------------------------------
From: "Stefan Verkoyen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Linux has too many problems (MS employee trolling?)
Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 20:53:30 +0100
Yeah right,
that is the biggest bunch of crap I've ever heared.
If you didn't know anything about computers you couldn't install redhat in
three hours and knowing it works.
Or you are enormous intelligent or you aren't telling the thruth over here.
If you don't know a thing about computers, but you know everything about
swapfiles, bootmanagers, xwindows, choosing drivers,
etc.. I need to hire you in our company to install computers... Because we
have experience with computers over 8 years and still have some problems to
configure them under Windows, Linux , ....
I think I have to ask my mom to install my computer in the future. (She is a
real good housewife you know)
This software engineer can be right that he had some problems with Linux.
Especially when has some up to date hardware for which the drivers aren't
available yet or still have some bugs in it.... I think using windows you
don't have these problems because the drivers are usually accompanied with
the hardware and tested by the manufacturor.
Greetings Jack The Ripper
Kerry J. Cox <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>When I first installed Linux I knew absolutely nothing about computers.
>A friend recommneded that I try it out. I got it all installed in less
>than 3 hours and that was on a 486 with 8 megs of RAM. I had my
>X-Windows up and running within an hour after taking off the cover and
>actually looking at the video card. And that was all with RedHat 3.0.3
>with a 2.0.x kernel.
>Sounds to me like you are one of those MS employees I read about, posing
>as a valid user trying to discredit Linux. You sure don't sound like
>any programmer that I know. In fact, you don't sound like much of a
>programmer at all. Most progarmmers document their efforts and are a
>bit more descriptive than what you posted..
>KJ
>
------------------------------
From: "Dirty Fly" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Programming for ISA card
Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 23:09:36 -0000
READ THIS
Rick Wheeler wrote in message
<7af9ut$fn9$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>...
>I have an ISA Industrial Digital I/O card, caple of driving up to 64
>seperate outputs (namely, Relays). I need to be able to drive solenoids off
>each relay separately & eclusively. I have programming examples for VB on
>Windows 95/NT using the DLL provided by the manufacturer. I wish to control
>the card via a Linux application written in C.
>
>Can anyone provide programming examples in C, documentation or other advise
>that
>may be of benefit to me?
>
>Thanks
>Rick
>
>
>
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/&[U%07_^"W*7CGA+:P``
`
end
------------------------------
From: "Bob Sinko" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: DosLinux 7.7 Kernel recompile problem
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 04:32:10 GMT
I recently downloaded doslinux 7.7 and had it running on my old 486 in good
time.
However when trying to configure the box to support IP masquerade I
discovered that the doslinux kernel is not configured for IP Firewalling as
I believe is required for IP masquerading to work.
I downloaded 2.2.1 source and gcc compiler and have succesfully compiled a
new kernel image.
However, when the linuxrc script called by the initrd boot process tries to
mount the loop file system on the dos partition it fails with the message:
"Trying to mount /dev/hda1 on msdos..."
"Mounted OK..."
"VFS: Cannot open root device 00:00"
"Kernel panic: VFS: Unable to mount root fs on 00:00"
The only change I made to the kernel config file that shipped with the
doslinux 7.7 distribution was to enable IP firewalling, I also verified that
loop block device support was enabled as a kernel level driver when running
the "make menuconfig".
I suspect that the canned doslinux kernel uses kernel level patches not
included in the standard linux kernel source to properly handle the loop
file system created during the initial installation.
Any information on what additional pieces may be necessary to get the new
kernel to work with the loop system created by the doslinux install would be
appreciated.
Thanks,
Bob Sinko
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Alvaro A. Novo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: KDE and shortcuts
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 19:12:44 -0600
Hi,
I have just installed KDE and I am already missing my 'old' shortcuts...
I realize that I can change "global keys" and "standard keys" using KDE
control center. But reading through the help files, I know that this
method will not allow me to create shortcuts to launch my applications.
Q: How do I create my own shortcuts? (I knew it under FVWM)
Thanks a lot for (future) answers.
Alvaro Novo
-- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
Alvaro A. Novo
2116 S. Orchard St., #304
Urbana, IL 61801
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.students.uiuc.edu/~novo/Alvaro.htm
217-337-4893
-- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Linux Security Questions
Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 01:06:27 GMT
On 17 Feb 1999 21:23:14 GMT, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rob Komar) wrote:
>Lyno Sullivan ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
>: I have been told that there is a serious security flaw in Linux in
>: that the storage and transmission of passwords is not encrypted yet?
>
>I would like to add to the other reponses that passwords _are_
>encrypted when stored in Linux (as in all Unixes). When stored
>in the `/etc/passwd' file, the encrypted passwords are viewable
>by anybody, but when stored in the `/etc/shadow' file, only
>root processes can view the encrypted passwords. So, the shadow
>password suite helps to cut down on the cracking of encrypted
>passwords. Unencrypted passwords aren't stored in any official
>location (but you can't stop users from storing them in personal
>files ;).
>
>Cheers,
>Rob Komar
I believe he ment during login. telnet expects you to send plain text
passwds like NT does...
If he ment for network transmition, all unixes use either pap or chap
which is encrypted on the wire depending on your equipment. Windows
95 used plain text network passwords, win 98 uses encrypted passwords,
samba can do either.
at my Linux based ISP, pap encrypted passwords uptained from dialup
are again encryped using chap to send on the wire to the radius server
which decrypts it and authenticates it. using all linux based
servers.
plain text passwords are not stored anywhere on the system. IN FACT
passwords are NOT stored on the computer at all. Linux along with all
other unixes to a one way hash on a passwd that cannot be decrypted.
when a user enters his/her password is again hashed using the stored
randum number and compaired with the stored hash in the /etc/passwd
database. if the two hashed passwords match, the password is good.
if not, try again
------------------------------
From: Stéphane Brunet <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: H E L P !!!
Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:16:51 -0500
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hey! Don't fret!
I have two not-so-helpful recommendations:
1. get a book by O'Reily
2.
How do you start your X server? Do you use the "startx" command?
If so, do "which startx": that'll give the path of the script that's
running.
Read the header of the script; it'll give you config details.
If your X server starts when you boot, it's being run in one of your rc
scripts.
Check the rc.S startup scripts in /etc/rc.???. In that directory,
you'll find (hopefully) files that start with the letter 'S' ("START",
the 'K's stand for KILL) and a sequence number (the lower the number,
the earlier it starts).
Each of these 'S' scripts starts an application/daemon. Find the one
that starts you X server and check out the comments.
My point is that linux is usually defaulted to 640x480 (standard VGA) so
that evreyone can run the X server, right out of the box (even old
286/386s...) You have to set it to higher resolutions by changing the
config files at the appropriate places.
Hope this helps...
Robert Criss wrote:
>
> Ok, I admit it I'm a rank amateur at this (RH5.2) Linux stuff. I am the
> information systems administrator for the company I work at and I
> understand NT pretty well. I thought I would pick up Linux in a snap.
> No way homie! I would like to use Linux as server on a couple of
> machines on the network. I will survive this. Right now I would just
> be tickled pink if someone would tell me how to get more than 640X480
> out of my Trident TGUI9440 PCI video card. When I was setting up Linux
> (all things considered, a pleasent experience) it found the card easy
> enough but would only let me set the resolution to 640X480 in 256
> colors, no options. Now I don't know how to increase the Res. The card
> has 2meg of ram and I know it is capable of 1024X 768 because I was
> using it in another computer at that Res. Help! I'll completely
> reload Linux if necessary.
> P.S. ( I would like to add that although I can't get Linux to give me
> any decent video resolution, I have managed to make it talk to the
> network and I can access it from other machines on the network. Maybe
> I'm just concentrating on the important stuff a little too hard.).
--
+-------------------------------------+
| Stéphane Brunet ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) |
| B.Eng. Computer (450)476-4392 |
| Software Systems Developper |
| Dept. 49, CF-18 Systems Engineering |
| CAE Electronics Ltd, Montreal, CAN |
+-------------------------------------+
------------------------------
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The service address, to which questions about the list itself and requests
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You can send mail to the entire list (and comp.os.linux.misc) via:
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Linux may be obtained via one of these FTP sites:
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End of Linux-Misc Digest
******************************
