Hi to all,

I have already signaled, some time ago I think, that this behaviour is somewhat cumbersome, and that the students (doctoral and post-doctoral students) to whom I was teaching LyX as a general front end to everything (R, PDF, etc.) were somewhat baffled by the operations necessary to create a simple frame. Since I was already adapted to the process (and automated many steps using Keyboard maestro macro player :-) ), I was a bit surprised by their strong reaction. So, I think that we should take into account these reactions.

If we can get back the switch to Standard function of the double returns, that would be an amelioration I think.

We had in the recent past some abusive criticisms in the list, but that should not make us immediately adopt a defensive discourse when a new criticism appears, especially if it is constructive and detailed as here.

Best regards,


Julio Rojas <mailto:jcredbe...@gmail.com>
8 mai 2014 04:54
Dear Jürgen, there is no need for irony on your comments. Everybody is doing an honest effort to work with the "new" Beamer environment.

You have quoted the behavior of other environments as the reference for the "Frame" environment. If I am in a, for example, "Problem" environment and I want to get out of it into the standard environment, all I have to do is issue a couple of returns. This behavior is nowhere to be found in the "Frame" environment, as I can issue as many returns as I wish and the UI will accept them. This is, at least IMHO, a first in Lyx.

As for the behavior after getting out of the frame title, what Neal was explaining is related to the previous paragraph. After issuing return outside of the frame title, another return should get you to the standard environment. Then issuing a tab would indent this standard environment into the "Frame" environment and you can keep working. This is the behavior I was expecting from my experience with Lyx and all sorts of environments. In this moment, you can issue as many returns as you wish and Lyx would keep adding empty white lines of a "Frame" environment. This behavior is not only annoying and useless, to say the least, but also is nowhere to be found in other environments.

I hope that you understand our concerns.


Julio Rojas
jcredbe...@gmail.com <mailto:jcredbe...@gmail.com>

Jürgen Spitzmüller <mailto:sp...@lyx.org>
7 mai 2014 17:46

    Which brings up another question.  Alt-A return?  How could I have
    discovered this?

Reading the beamer manual perhaps? Also, the shortcut is displayed in the respective menu (Edit). And it is also documented generally in the LyX manuals.

Neal Becker <mailto:ndbeck...@gmail.com>
7 mai 2014 17:41
Which brings up another question. Alt-A return? How could I have discovered this? If I look at Help/Shortcuts, I don't see it (or am I blind?)

I wish lyx had a way to discover things like emacs does.

Neal Becker <mailto:ndbeck...@gmail.com>
7 mai 2014 17:38
After arrow right, return.
I can type some text. Looks nice. Oh, it's not nested in the frame. Hit tab.

Now you have Frame inside Frame.

Jürgen Spitzmüller <mailto:sp...@lyx.org>
7 mai 2014 17:31
2014-05-07 17:14 GMT+02:00 Neal Becker:

    OK, I'm confused here.  Let's consider workflow to make a bullet

I was talking about the Standard paragraph, not Itemize.

    Insert sep.  Hit return.
    Select Frame
    Fill in Title
    oops - return in title does nothing, navigate past title (right
    arrow), hit


Alt-A Return
Fill in title
Arrow right

    Now I'm in Frame.  Certainly not what I want - I don't even know
    what this frame
    in a frame would do.

I do not understand what you mean by "Frame in a frame". You are still in the same frame. Would you also say "Quotation in a quotation" if the style still is called "quotation" after hitting return? Or "Itemize in an itemize"? Or "Theorem in a Theorem"? Or, for that matter, "Standard in Standard"?

    Switch to itemize
    Use mouse to hit -> icon to nest itemize within frame.

Yes. The same as you need to do when using itemize in an Example box, or Quotation, or Theorem, or ...


Université de Bordeaux <http://www.u-bordeaux.fr> CNRS <http://www.cnrs.fr/aquitaine-limousin>

Prof. Murat Yildizoglu <mailto:yi...@u-bordeaux4.fr>

CS 50057

Bureau : E-331

yildizoglu.info <http://yildizoglu.info>

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