Like Vam I think we have to be able to see beauty in the ordinary. There was once something rather beautiful to me on resting on a spade after some hard work, sharing a tab with a mate, perhaps rather ironically pleased with our efforts and the desultory pay that went off home to Mum with enough left over for a few pints in the pub. England's "magnificent" draw yesterday with our hapless last wicket batters lasting half-an-hour against the might of Australia after a day of probably the most stupid shots ever played by better players had a certain beauty. Others might wonder what the five days of boredom were about, until the always winning Aussies saw there efforts rendered futile, dashed on the rocks of Burnley and Indian (Monty Panesar Vam) pride as the clock ticked down in the depths of Wales. Neither of our guys knew one end of the bat from the other and a Welsh poet was suggesting the stumps be burned so that the finest dust of England would remain forever in Wales. And then the clock ticked past a heady triumph to sour Australian tears and the victory of an English draw.
I suspect beauty is too often restricted to our triumphs over adversity and the real stuff might well lie in straightening our society out. On 13 July, 03:48, Vamadevananda <[email protected]> wrote: > Molly, I 've indicated that beauty is what it does to me, in the > several domains within me. Let me list a couple of instances : > > I see beauty when I see a child leading his parent on the road, finger > in palm, joy and cheer in his eyes. Or, in the early morning, when the > husband is pulling at his bycycle with wife seated on the carrier seat > behind him, both off to work, to deal with the demands of the day, for > themselves and their children. Or, in the attitude : I want nothing > from you, what can I do for you ? Or, when a person walks away with > light, hope and self - belief in his heart, after a conversing with a > ' wise ' one. Or, when I ' see ' an Einstein arrive at an integrating > discovery, which includes and explains the details ... > > The ' sight ' unclouded by ego - want - emotions is beautiful ! > > On Jul 12, 11:19 pm, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > I can agree that what we call the beauty industry is merely > > merchandising to enhance appearance, and has little to do with real > > beauty. How do we recognize true beauty when we see it? > > > On Jul 11, 8:02 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > What entertains many can be ruthlessly boring, and the beauty industry > > > certainly conforms with ruthlessness. Scientists are rather prone to > > > bemoan those waiting for the blow job from god so routinely expected > > > to underlie their work in elegance, beauty and perfect form. The > > > beautiful moment is not boring. > > > > On 11 July, 03:35, Tinker <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > I believe the answer is in your "deviant compulsion". It can be > > > > compelled by the force that is Love, but it is deviated or twisted > > > > from the "patient and kind" that we recognize as the way of Love. > > > > > peace & Love > > > > > On Jul 10, 7:50 am, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Is it really love in those cases, Lee, or something more along the > > > > > lines of deviant compulsion? Both examples would certainly fall > > > > > outside of the "love is patient, love is kind..." definition. > > > > > > I think that love and beauty have much in common, as they move us in > > > > > spirit, or to higher consciousness. > > > > > > On Jul 10, 5:12 am, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Surly any type of love is a beautiful thing? Umm unless it is > > > > > > peadophilic love, or love of violence. Okay okay scracth that one, > > > > > > bad Idea. > > > > > > > Yeah Dipu what do you mean? > > > > > > > On 10 July, 00:15, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > International communication can be very difficult. Can you please > > > > > > > explain how your reply to Molly's post is relevant?? > > > > > > > > You are replying to a post that poses pertinent wording about > > > > > > > beauty > > > > > > > and concept but which excludes any reference to love. > > > > > > > > So what do you mean by "any type of love"?? > > > > > > > > Please explain. > > > > > > > > On Jul 9, 2:16 pm, dipu banerjee <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > any type of love > > > > > > > > > On 7/10/09, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Boring beauty. Quiet a concept. Can beauty be boring? > > > > > > > > > > On Jul 9, 9:03 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Einstein and others drew relativity from obscure > > > > > > > > > > experiments to glean > > > > > > > > > > the size of molecules and the movement of pollen grains in > > > > > > > > > > solution. > > > > > > > > > > Beauty tends to fit with experiment and eventual > > > > > > > > > > communication beyond > > > > > > > > > > the almost non-verbal beholder's eye. It may well bore > > > > > > > > > > most people > > > > > > > > > > and end up being taught in school chemistry. > > > > > > > > > > > On 8 July, 20:23, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps another case of beauty being in the eye of the > > > > > > > > > > > beholder. > > > > > > > > > > > Music of a particular artist may require relativity of > > > > > > > > > > > taste. Music > > > > > > > > > > > as an art form, absolutely beautiful. There are a hell > > > > > > > > > > > of alot of > > > > > > > > > > > people who found Jackson's work beautiful, as evidenced > > > > > > > > > > > in hundreds of > > > > > > > > > > > thousands, if not millions of people all over the world > > > > > > > > > > > dancing and > > > > > > > > > > > singing his music after he died. How many people in your > > > > > > > > > > > lifetime > > > > > > > > > > > could evoke such a global response, opinion aside. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Jul 8, 3:57 am, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ian really, the Caravaggio comparison is pertinent but > > > > > > > > > > > > only in the > > > > > > > > > > > > context of that era and Jackson in this era. Equally > > > > > > > > > > > > they crossed > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > line, creating a frenzy of mind boggling spectacle. I > > > > > > > > > > > > must say that > > > > > > > > > > > > your comment "Michael Jackson produced a lot of popular > > > > > > > > > > > > PRODUCT, but > > > > > > > > > > > > very little art." is indeed a consequence of tunnel > > > > > > > > > > > > vision. Of > > > > > > > > > course > > > > > > > > > > > > if you can produce evidence of another artist that > > > > > > > > > > > > issued such > > > > > > > > > > > > extraordinary talent preceding that of Jackson, I, as > > > > > > > > > > > > well as others, > > > > > > > > > > > > would concede to your view. I personally have no > > > > > > > > > > > > interest, never > > > > > > > > > had, > > > > > > > > > > > > in the Jackson attraction. I am only motivated by your > > > > > > > > > > > > lack of > > > > > > > > > > > > recognition of the innovation, regardless of the > > > > > > > > > > > > underlying product > > > > > > > > > > > > value, of such motivation in artistic influence as well > > > > > > > > > > > > as the perks > > > > > > > > > > > > within the industry (for the sharks). Art is something > > > > > > > > > > > > of a misnomer > > > > > > > > > > > > in that people will and are paying thousands of dollars > > > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > > contemporary "Graffiti" art, which for me as an artist > > > > > > > > > > > > styled in > > > > > > > > > > > > Renaissance period art view as pure "garbage". So in > > > > > > > > > > > > that sense, > > > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > > > view of Micheal Jackson as less than an art form is > > > > > > > > > > > > reflective of > > > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > > > lack of understanding what "art" is all about. > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Jul 8, 2:19 am, Ian Pollard <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2009/7/7 frantheman <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Behind all the weirdness (perhaps even perversion) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the disgusting commercial hype surrounding his > > > > > > > > > > > > > > death, that was > > > > > > > > > what > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Michael Jackson was at his best. There have been > > > > > > > > > > > > > > other similar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > artistic wonders throughout history - Caravaggio > > > > > > > > > > > > > > comes to mind. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Did you just compare Michael Jackson to Caravaggio? :) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Whilst I think there is much artistic merit in music, > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is > > > > > > > > > almost > > > > > > > > > > > > > always missing from the mainstream. Michael Jackson > > > > > > > > > > > > > produced a lot > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > popular PRODUCT, but very little art. He also > > > > > > > > > > > > > understood, for a > > > > > > > > > time, how to > > > > > > > > > > > > > market that product as good as anyone. This was made > > > > > > > > > > > > > remarkably > > > > > > > > > easier by > > > > > > > > > > > > > the team of people around him. The album 'Thriller', > > > > > > > > > > > > > whilst a good > > > > > > > > > album, > > > > > > > > > > > > > initially looked to have only been a minor hit for > > > > > > > > > > > > > him. The first > > > > > > > > > single, > > > > > > > > > > > > > 'The Girl Is Mine', did okay, but didn't set the > > > > > > > > > > > > > world on fire. > > > > > > > > > However, > > > > > > > > > > > > > over the next three years Jackson marketed the hell > > > > > > > > > > > > > out of that > > > > > > > > > album. He > > > > > > > > > > > > > bled it dry, releasing nine songs from it. And of > > > > > > > > > > > > > course, that > > > > > > > > > $500,000 > > > > > > > > > > > > > video (which he did not choreograph, by the way) was > > > > > > > > > > > > > a stroke of > > > > > > > > > marketing > > > > > > > > > > > > > genius. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To call Michael Jackson an artist deeply devalues the > > > > > > > > > > > > > word. I don't > > > > > > > > > just say > > > > > > > > > > > > > that because I am a music snob (I freely admit I am > > > > > > > > > > > > > and that it is > > > > > > > > > a factor > > > > > > > > > > > > > here). I think the roles of the musician and artist > > > > > > > > > > > > > are almost > > > > > > > > > always in a > > > > > > > > > > > > > state of conflict; such is the nature of a creative > > > > > > > > > > > > > person peddling > > > > > > > > > > > > > commodities (CDs, etc) and being subjected to > > > > > > > > > > > > > commercial pressure. > > > > > > > > > However, > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think the continuing decline of the music > > > > > > > > > > > > > industry's business > > > > > > > > > model -- > > > > > > > > > > > > > coupled with the reduced cost of home recording -- is > > > > > > > > > > > > > a great thing > > > > > > > > > for the > > > > > > > > > > > > > "art" in music to take a more prominent role. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ian- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. 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