I have answered this repeatedly for you, Slip and I think that D has also pointed out that I am not talking about prayer as modality for healing. Why you keep coming back to it as a basis of argument, I am not sure. I do think that your idea of prayer is skewed to your own bias. Gregg Braden does a good job in categorizing types of prayer he has observed in his global research in his book "The lost mode of prayer." This is not to say it is a study of prayer as applied to healing, it is not. It is an examination of prayer historical and globally. I reference it because I think it may broaden your view of prayer.
On Aug 9, 3:40 am, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > Have you run into a brick wall Molly? Have you no say to my posts, > have they just hit a nerve or are you exercising your right to > ignore. Isn't it true that prayer is a voodoo? Isn't it true that > prayer is a desperate attempt to validate a belief in the existence of > a supernatural being? A being that will opt to save one and let the > rest suffer? Some people just choose to demonstrate their fervor in > regards to belief even if the belief is without substantiation. > > On Aug 8, 6:50 am, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Agreeing with Vam, I think what you propose can be done without > > belittling or using derogatory language. As D points out, presenting > > an alternate argument is very different than name calling someones > > ideas and experiences. By doing that, you also berate anyone having > > like experiences. Anyone can present a different viewpoint without > > that, but someone looking to cut the other down chooses not to. I'm > > surprised you can't see that. > > > On Aug 8, 2:11 am, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > There's been a > > > > > cure for being stressed out and mildly depressed that humans have used > > > > for a > > > > thousand years. It's called three friends and a Pub. > > > > Ruba dub dub, three friends in a tub. I like it. Throw in some > > > bourbon or a nice smooth scotch and I'll be right over. > > > > This discussion group is better then a soap opera. More drama then a > > > Health Care Reform Bill town hall discussion. Maybe I'm a male > > > chauvinist pig but I'm seeing a little Men are from Mars; Women are > > > from Venus action going on here. I'm not surprised Molly is feeling a > > > little picked on lately but I don't see any bad behavior from any > > > moderators either. Sometimes those in authority seem to be bullying > > > when they are being nothing of the sort simply because we know they > > > have authority over us. I don't see any abuse here at all but that > > > may be because I agree with Ian and Chris in this debate. > > > > I find it discombobulating when someone I respect deconstructs my > > > beliefs or worse, shows ridicule for them. This doesn't make it their > > > fault I'm so insecure. Sometimes, it makes me re-evaluate my beliefs. > > > Sometimes it makes me re-evaluate my respect for my fellow > > > interlocutor. Always I learn something. > > > > dj > > > > On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 9:29 AM, Chris Jenkins<[email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > > What you saw on TV the other day was implicitly wrong. Prozan is an > > > > SSRI, > > > > and has a specific and complex brain functionality. > > > > > Additionally, the citation you provided is cleverly styled to appear to > > > > be > > > > the APA website, but by navigating to the root domain, we see that it > > > > is in > > > > actuality a virulently anti-psych website: > > > > >http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/ > > > > > This tends to color their data a bit, no? > > > > > Here are some links to non-biased, peer reviewed studies at PubMed, the > > > > general repository for scientific research in the US, directly > > > > addressing > > > > the question of SSRI versus placebo. > > > > >http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11405969?ordinalpos=1&itool=Entrez... > > > > >http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19468281?ordinalpos=9&itool=Entrez... > > > > >http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18922243?ordinalpos=25&itool=Entre... > > > > > Here's a great quote: > > > > > "In a 10-week randomised, double-blind trial in patients with panic > > > > disorder, escitalopram (flexible doses 5-10 mg/d) was significantly more > > > > effective than placebo in reducing the panic attack frequency, with a > > > > faster > > > > onset of action than citalopram." > > > > > In fact, in all the studies that I've seen where the efficacy of the > > > > medication over placebo dropped to less than 30%, they were 'mild to > > > > moderate' cases to begin with. > > > > > In other words, the Prozac didn't help much because there wasn't much > > > > of a > > > > chemical problem there to help with. Those cases should have been > > > > referred > > > > to psychologists, not psychiatrists. Blaming the medication for > > > > not fixing a > > > > problem that is not chemical in nature is downright silly. There's been > > > > a > > > > cure for being stressed out and mildly depressed that humans have used > > > > for a > > > > thousand years. It's called three friends and a Pub. > > > > > On Fri, Aug 7, 2009 at 8:28 AM, deripsni <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >> I found this article that claims that the placebo effect accounts for > > > >> 50% of the improvement in depressed patients taking anitdepressents, > > > >> while only 27% is due to the actual drug. I also saw something on TV > > > >> the other day stating that Prozac was basically a sugar coated > > > >> placebo. This seems to support a lot of what Molly is saying. > > > > >>http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/1996-APA-placebo-vs-SSRI.htm --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/Minds-Eye?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
