I do believe that as we live, our actions, even our seeming mistakes, provide collective harmony for the universe. If you have very strong feelings against something like drug abuse, there may be some very personal reasons for them. We all find our own way in life, and what may seem to be a mistake is simply a redirection to our greater self calling, whether it is our own mistakes or the mistakes of others we examine. In truth, what we witness in others is also true of us, and when we are feeling those strong emotions, we are being called into witness of our own (sometimes shadow) selves.
On Oct 3, 4:20 pm, iam deheretic <[email protected]> wrote: > Most I will answer privately Molly, > > but even causal use of drugs effect thinking. > Allan > > > > On Sun, Oct 3, 2010 at 6:45 PM, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > I do understand, Allan. I worked in the field of Prevention for ten > > years. I see drug addiction as a completely different issue, as > > substances are used by shaman and holy men throughout the ages. I > > completely agree that they are not necessary for the journey, and as I > > understand it, are used by the Shaman to "journey with" the > > uninitiated and allow their healing, getting them to the state that is > > otherwise unaccessible to them without years of study. > > > Many people who dabble in psychedelics never become drug addicts. On > > the other hand, most soft drugs are considered gateway drugs to drug > > addiction. I look at the state of medicine now in the US and see that > > mind altering drugs like anxiety relieving or anti depressants are > > used by a large majority of the population. It is not difficult to > > get prescriptions for muscle relaxers, sleeping pills, diet pills or > > narcotics for chronic pain either. Those prone to addiction will find > > their substances one way or another. > > > I too saw several lives ruined with the prolific use of psychedelics. > > Unfortunate indeed. Timothy Leary's use and distribution of it is > > difficult not to judge, I leave the judgement to history. Aldous > > Huxley is a success story coming out to the group. John Lily (Mind of > > the Dolphin) probably the best example of the pitfalls of addiction. > > I try to recognize the merits of these folks individually, and the > > revolutionary movement of self examination that they lead in the US as > > a part of the greater evolution of the species. > > > On Oct 3, 2:04 am, iam deheretic <[email protected]> wrote: > > > I want to thank you Molly for making me mad or at least mad enough to > > look > > > up a spelling. > > > > years ago I hear a 12 year old boy tell me about his latest acid trip and > > it > > > pissed me off I knew who sold it to him and it pissed me off as he was > > > destroying the mind of a child. it went from there.. > > > > What the realization came to me the realization that making these addicts > > > Icons if that is the right word really created a drug culture. because > > > before that if you smoked dope you were known as a mugglehead.this drug > > > culture of all drugs including cocaine went rampant and one heard on the > > > news one thing or another about the problem and thinking back a lot of it > > > focused around wall street as well as the nations capital. It is about > > this > > > time the extreme greed stared to show its ugly head . > > > > Looking at what is going on to day we literally and foolishly turned our > > > economic well being over to drug addicts and there desire for the nest > > fix. > > > > I am sorry true enlightenment does not come in a pill, all though thou > > may > > > cross the time / space barrier and come back with an idea then write a > > book > > > does not make one enlightened. Enlightenment is a long hard grind that > > > allows for tempering of concepts for social good and there is a certain > > > wisdom that come from the process. > > > > I know you have read Carlos Castaneda's books the first book I see a > > student > > > from Berkeley going to Mexico to get his drugs hiding it as research for > > a > > > university paper.(not a nice way of putting it but true) by the third > > book > > > he found out that you do not need the drug and the series show the long > > hard > > > struggle. He was very lucky in who he meet and took him under his wing. > > > > Molly I can not see glorifying drug addicts. > > > Allan > > > > On Sat, Oct 2, 2010 at 6:31 PM, iam deheretic <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > > > My experience with people that have been on LSD is not a good one, to > > me > > > > they are just another junkie , I know one thing if I had to see him as > > a > > > > psychologist I would run as fast and as far as I could in the other > > > > direction. > > > > > Those lsd junkies have I have no respect for in looking up some of the > > past > > > > back ground (actually a spelling check) I suddenly found out why I knew > > so > > > > many of them, and it was not from my work. None of the one I knew were > > not > > > > really worth knowing. > > > > So I am dropping it from there I do not like talking about friends > > > > Allan > > > > > On Sat, Oct 2, 2010 at 4:03 PM, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >> If only all mommies and daddies could teach their children to be here > > > >> now. I do agree, it is a simple concept, so important, and a thread > > > >> of truth that runs through the world as a common state available to > > > >> all, not accessed by those trapped in ego, memory or speculation. > > > >> that Ram Das studied this concept in India doesn't preclude any one > > > >> else from learning it from a different tradition. His exploration in > > > >> LSD may have prepared him, as did PhD in psychology, in different > > > >> ways. Why some people are able to articulate the vision and others > > > >> follow it is, indeed, part of the mystery, > > > > >> On Oct 2, 3:13 am, iam deheretic <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> > I understand it is the title of a book the point is that living > > in > > > >> the > > > >> > hear and now is not a eastern concept but rather a world wide one.. > > > >> > As for it being popular ,, well that simply show that many people > > don't > > > >> > listen to their mommies and daddies but would rather listen to > > someone > > > >> else. > > > >> > Allan > > > > >> > On Thu, Sep 30, 2010 at 5:30 PM, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> > > Be Here Nowt was the title of his book, that was popular in the > > 70s > > > >> > > and sales are still strong. That's the credit I am giving him, > > along > > > >> > > with an ability to point the way to a great number of folks in his > > > >> > > life time. > > > > >> > > On Sep 30, 1:41 am, iam deheretic <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> > > > Be here now Molly I have know of that since I was a child and > > there > > > >> was > > > >> > > no > > > >> > > > RamDas and as far as I can tell it has been around for > > generation. I > > > >> > > think > > > >> > > > it is wrong to credit someone for creating a concept that has > > been > > > >> around > > > >> > > > for generations. > > > >> > > > Allan > > > > >> > > > On Thu, Sep 30, 2010 at 4:09 AM, Molly <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > > >> > > > > "Be Here Now" was the bible for youth uprising that offered > > the > > > >> civil > > > >> > > > > rights demonstrations and Vietnam war protests in the US in > > the > > > >> late > > > >> > > > > 60s and early 70s. RamDas taught with Timothy Leary at > > Harvard in > > > >> the > > > >> > > > > Psychology dept, they shared an office, and both left when > > Leary > > > >> was > > > >> > > > > dismissed - moving to the Leary family home in California that > > > >> became > > > >> > > > > infamous for his experiments in LSD. After having enough of > > that, > > > >> > > > > RamDas left for India and found his guru, returned to his > > family > > > >> home > > > >> > > > > on the east coast afterward, and wrote "Be Here Now," gaining > > a > > > >> large > > > >> > > > > following for his Westernized, Eastern ideas. > > > > >> > > > > On Sep 29, 7:39 pm, Ash <[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> > > > > > On 9/29/2010 8:52 AM, Molly wrote:> You do what you do > > because > > > >> that > > > >> > > s > > > >> > > > > what the harmony of the universe > > > >> > > > > > > requires, > > > > >> > > > > > That is something I've been able to accept but not willing > > to be > > > >> > > > > > comfortable with.> RamDas, "Be Here Now" > > > > >> > > > > > :) Now that sounds like a plea (kidding). While you are not, > > > >> here is > > > >> > > a > > > >> > > > > > hard place to find, someplace between yesterday and > > tomorrow. At > > > >> the > > > >> > > > > > moment thinking 'where' is informed by the past as a > > formative > > > >> > > > > > world-perspective and 'what' comes from tomorrow, potentials > > > >> pushing > > > >> > > > > > toward emergence. I am in awe at the mystery, William Blake > > > >> echoing > > > >> > > > > > around the mental aether, and metaphysics of mind. To think > > I am > > > >> > > great > > > >> > > > > > and small, like everything else is inducing a very stable > > > >> waveform. > > > > >> > > > > > > On Sep 29, 2:13 am, Ash<[email protected]> wrote: > > > >> > > > > > >> Every time I try to respond to this it seems I am a > > > >> different > > > >> > > > > person > > > >> > > > > > >> and can't make any sense. Things are changing rapidly > > now, > > > >> and I > > > >> > > > > > >> switched from recreational research in evenings to work > > > >> related > > > >> > > > > research > > > >> > > > > > >> to make pace with recovery and development efforts. The > > > >> greatest > > > >> > > > > changes > > > >> > > > > > >> are my history, it is strange but it seems like once or > > twice > > > >> a > > > >> > > week > > > >> > > > > now > > > >> > > > > > >> my perception changes dramatically regarding who and > > where I > > > >> have > > > >> > > > > been. > > > >> > > > > > >> A shock came last week when I made an intentional > > experiment, > > > >> and > > > >> > > saw > > > >> > > > > > >> myself as a 50 year old man which was not too shocking > > except > > > >> that > > > >> > > I > > > >> > > > > > >> became him in an instant and saw the progression of life > > > >> until > > > >> > > now. > > > >> > > > > What > > > >> > > > > > >> I saw was a child (myself), and being free from him was > > > >> beyond > > > >> > > > > > >> comprehension, many things I've known and not understood. > > > >> This is > > > >> > > > > > >> something I have no idea how to convey, it seems so alien > > and > > > >> > > beyond > > > >> > > > > > >> ontogenesis. This probably belongs in psk's thread but > > what > > > >> to > > > >> > > write > > > >> > > > > > >> here has been on my mind frequently. I've been riding the > > > >> wave if > > > >> > > you > > > >> > > > > > >> will and it is bringing good things to me, but facing > > many > > > >> > > challenges > > > >> > > > > > >> I've been stuck with for a long > > ... > > read more »
