one last thing:

Every single one of the former print shop employees we have received these
posters from has referred to them as "proofs".

Dave

On Sun, Nov 26, 2023 at 6:38 AM David Lieberman <[email protected]>
wrote:

>
> However one wishes to describe them:
>
> A. Uncut Overrun Poster
> B. Printer's Test
> C. Printer's Proof
>
> Regardless of what they really truly are, and I doubt that anyone will
> ever have a definitive answer, they are rarer, much more valuable, and much
> more desirable than a regular one sheet. Poster collectors have spoken time
> and time again by paying high prices at auction and at retail.
>
>
> Dave
>
> On Sun, Nov 26, 2023 at 6:13 AM <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> David,
>>
>> I have do not doubt that they are original and that employees took them
>> home. My question remains, though: Are these actually test prints or just
>> uncut onesheets? After all, that color control bar was on every single
>> sheet they printed and the posters were cut to size afterwards.
>>
>> Unlike digital printing, where you can print  (and usually pay for) exact
>> numbers, with analog offset the majority of the cost is in the prepress
>> process. While it is perfectly possible to print five or ten test posters,
>> once the actual production has started, it did not make much of a
>> difference if they printed 10,000 or 11,000 copies. In fact, it is
>> basically impossible to print a perfectly 'exact' number on those big
>> machines. So there usually was an overrun, and it is perfectly plausible
>> that employees would've been allowed to take some of them home. In case of
>> STAR WARS it may have even been an intentional overrun, who knows.
>>
>> My point being: In my book, an uncut overrun poster is just that. For me,
>> it does not qualify as a 'test print' or 'printer's proof'. It's simply a
>> onesheet that has not been cut down to size.
>>
>> Helmut
>>
>>
>> *Gesendet:* Sonntag, 26. November 2023 um 13:49 Uhr
>> *Von:* "David Lieberman" <[email protected]>
>> *An:* [email protected]
>> *Betreff:* Re: [MOPO] STAR WARS PROOFS 💥 CineMasterpieces VINTAGE MOVIE
>> POSTERS
>> one last note......the proofs that were made into book covers were from
>> REVENGE OF THE JEDI.
>>
>> now everybody scream!
>>
>> On Sun, Nov 26, 2023 at 5:27 AM David Lieberman <
>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> I forgot ANIMAL HOUSE, the advance and regular one sheets. Another title
>>> with a lot of proofs.
>>>
>>> On Sun, Nov 26, 2023 at 5:16 AM David Lieberman <
>>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "why do we see so many of the STAR WARS tests in comparison to any
>>>> other title?"
>>>>
>>>> Great question Helmut. I wondered about this for a long time. After
>>>> acquiring several of these proofs from at least four or five different
>>>> former print shop employees over the past 20 years, I finally had a lengthy
>>>> discussion with one of them and his answer was this. First of all, it isn't
>>>> just Star Wars, there are a few other titles from that era 1977-1980 where
>>>> a lot of proofs exist. There are a lot of JAWS 2, CLOSE ENCOUNTERS OF THE
>>>> THIRD KIND, and a few other nothing titles that no one really cares about.
>>>> A lot of these haven't survived or haven't been noticed on ebay or other
>>>> auction sites over the past 40+ years because no one really wants them and
>>>> they don't sell for much. Secondly......these former employees were
>>>> basically just kids at the time mostly in their early twenties. They took
>>>> stuff home all the time that was meant for the dumpster because they were
>>>> allowed to. They took stuff that they thought was "cool". Star Wars was
>>>> cool and became collectible almost immediately. One of our clients who used
>>>> to work at GORE GRAPHICS told me about his kids in the 1980's who took some
>>>> of his proofs and made book covers for their school books to show off to
>>>> their classmates.
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Nov 26, 2023 at 4:47 AM Helmut Hamm <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Whatever you want to call them, test printings or proofs: When it
>>>>> comes to STAR WARS, there way too many of these around for my taste. Bruce
>>>>> alone has auctioned more than thirty copies of the Style C Onesheet 'test
>>>>> print'. Frankly, I can't see any difference to the regular onesheets.
>>>>> Actually, they just look like untrimmed onesheets to me.
>>>>>
>>>>> As to all of these being 'test prints' that were 'sent out to the
>>>>> client for confirmation': For all I know, this is NOT common practice for
>>>>> print shops anywhere in the world, and it never was. If that was the case,
>>>>> why do we see so many of the STAR WARS tests in comparison to any other
>>>>> title? This does not make any sense to me.
>>>>>
>>>>> Here's an actual test print for the BLADE RUNNER onesheet:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> https://www.filmposter.net/en/blade-runner-original-release-us-test-proof-movie-poster.html
>>>>>
>>>>> As all print shops do, the printer saved a small number of these
>>>>> posters (for all I know, it was more than five, but less than ten) for
>>>>> their archive. These prints came to the market after the company folded 
>>>>> and
>>>>> somebody cleared out their inventory.
>>>>>
>>>>> As you can see, the image is very different from the final onesheet.
>>>>> Apparently, somebody took a serious effort to get things right, but in the
>>>>> pre-digital days, creating a test like this was seriously expensive and
>>>>> therefore a rare exception, not common practice.
>>>>>
>>>>> Helmut
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Gesendet:* Samstag, 25. November 2023 um 14:05 Uhr
>>>>> *Von:* "Bruce Hershenson" <[email protected]>
>>>>> *An:* [email protected]
>>>>> *Betreff:* Re: [MOPO] BLACK FRIDAY SALE 2023 💥 CineMasterpieces
>>>>> VINTAGE MOVIE POSTERS ��
>>>>> I agree he has a MASSIVE amount of super helpful information and bravo
>>>>> to Dave. especially where he helps newbies not get ripped off by eBay
>>>>> sellers openly selling fakes..
>>>>>
>>>>> But does he still call "printer's test" posters "proofs"? I hope not,
>>>>> because 99% of the ones circulating in the hobby are test posters that 
>>>>> were
>>>>> printed to get people's reactions before the final print run.
>>>>>
>>>>> The few true PROOF posters are sent back to the printer with markings
>>>>> as to what needs to be changed OR have an approval stamped area where it 
>>>>> is
>>>>> OK'ed for printing.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Nov 25, 2023 at 6:40 AM David Kusumoto <
>>>>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Don't know how many others are on Dave Lieberman's newsletter but I
>>>>>> hadn't visited his site in a long time and I went straight to his Star 
>>>>>> Wars
>>>>>> section - and I was floored by the wealth of information about almost 
>>>>>> every
>>>>>> known poster iteration of Star Wars - from concept to its celebrated
>>>>>> inaugural year of 1977 - (theatrical and commercial) - in roughly
>>>>>> chronological order.  The section includes detailed images and 
>>>>>> descriptions
>>>>>> of known fakes, including personal testimonials of oddball things he
>>>>>> concedes he was initially fooled about like a lot of us.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> He also provides a detailed study of printer's proofs - which - while
>>>>>> I've never had the desire to collect nor own, is still interesting 
>>>>>> insofar
>>>>>> there are collectors who DO love and pay $$$ for them.  He explains how
>>>>>> they came to be, their ubiquitous presence and the differences between 
>>>>>> PMS
>>>>>> (pantone) vs. CMYK proofs, which came first, etc. - and why it matters to
>>>>>> some collectors and not to others.  Great stuff for SW completists.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Encourage anyone interested to venture over there and take a gander,
>>>>>> not just at the massive Star Wars section - but also other sections,
>>>>>> including the one where he re-lives the entire minty white insert and 
>>>>>> lobby
>>>>>> card counterfeit saga - from his own point of view as a gallery owner of
>>>>>> many years in AZ.  He further provides in one section - a long list of
>>>>>> titles and accompanying formats he implicates as having been faked - in
>>>>>> line with other dealers who've said the same.  He also sources the
>>>>>> geographic locations of some suspect dealers who - to this day - are 
>>>>>> still
>>>>>> peddling these things as originals.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Between this, eMoviePoster, Learn About Movie Posters, Walter Reuben
>>>>>> and others - this is a storehouse of information grouped by category /
>>>>>> genre that's available right now - for free.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Best, David near San Diego, still the biggest fan of the never-faked
>>>>>> (to date) - and grossly underrated Star Wars half-sheet from 1977 with
>>>>>> alternate Jung art.  Cinemasterpieces image below.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> P.S. - The Chantrell art on the Style C is probably my true fav among
>>>>>> the SW one-sheets - were it not for the fakes and not even knowing until
>>>>>> recently about the "hair on Leia's back" as a marker on that style - sort
>>>>>> of a "bookend" to the style A repro.  But I still think the alternate 
>>>>>> Jung
>>>>>> landscape art on the half-sheet is excellent and affordable - and after
>>>>>> nearly 50 years - it still puzzles me how unloved it is by so many. (Not
>>>>>> the centerpiece of anyone's SW collection that I know of.)  I know it 
>>>>>> will
>>>>>> never reach the heights of a Casablanca of Oz half-sheet in my remaining
>>>>>> lifetime - (which are admittedly more rare) - but maybe future 
>>>>>> generations
>>>>>> of Disney fans will.  -d.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>> *From:* David Lieberman <[email protected]>
>>>>>> *Sent:* Friday, November 24, 2023 3:03 PM
>>>>>> *Subject:* BLACK FRIDAY SALE 2023 STARTS NOW 💥 CineMasterpieces
>>>>>> VINTAGE MOVIE POSTERS 💥
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *CINEMASTERPIECES HOLIDAY SALE <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *20% OFF*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *ALL VINTAGE ORIGINAL MOVIE POSTERS*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *(ONLY AT CINEMASTERPIECES.COM <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>,
>>>>>> NOT ON EBAY)*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Payment Plan / Layaway Available
>>>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cineshipping.htm#paymentplan>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>> therefore your purchase may be subject to prior sale.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We do not have unlimited quantities.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Shop now before the item you want is gone!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The CineMasterpieces Archive has thousands of Vintage Original Movie
>>>>>> Posters in stock. Over $5,000,000.00 in inventory. Prices range from 
>>>>>> $50.00
>>>>>> to over $50,000.00. If you are looking for a specific poster and you 
>>>>>> don't
>>>>>> see it while shopping, we may have one in our archive or we may be able 
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> locate one for you. Please contact us
>>>>>> <[email protected]?subject=CineMasterpieces,%20please%20help%20me%20find%20this%20poster.>
>>>>>>  for
>>>>>> details.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Click Here
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>>>>>> Customer Testimonials and see our Celebrity Clients.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To see pricing, details, and to start shopping please browse through
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>>>>>> organized alphabetically & searchable by title. Purchasing is easy. Our
>>>>>> shopping cart accepts most forms of payment. Orders usually ship within 
>>>>>> 24
>>>>>> hours.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> CineMasterpieces.com was first established in 2001 and is one of the
>>>>>> most recognized and visited vintage movie poster websites in the world.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As of January 2022 our office/gallery in Scottsdale, Arizona is
>>>>>> closed. We are now online-only.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *David A. Lieberman*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *President*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David A. Lieberman is the owner and founder of CineMasterpieces. He
>>>>>> has been buying and selling vintage posters for over 30 years. David is a
>>>>>> recurring expert featured on the History Channel TV show *Pawn Stars*
>>>>>> .
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The World's Finest Selection of Vintage Original Movie Posters
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Recurring Expert Featured on*
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> Star Wars <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinestarwars.htm> *|* James
>>>>>> Bond <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinejamesbond.htm> *|* V.I.P.
>>>>>> Archive <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/newest.htm> *|* Consignment
>>>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/consignment.htm> *|* We Buy Posters
>>>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/consignment.htm#buy>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hitchcock <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cine_H.htm#hitch> *|* Marilyn
>>>>>> Monroe <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cine_marilyn.htm> *|* Elvis
>>>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cine_elvis.htm> *|* Favorites By
>>>>>> Decade <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/favorites.htm>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/customertestimonials.htm> *|* Special
>>>>>> Orders <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cine-specialorders.htm> *|* 
>>>>>> Payment
>>>>>> Plan / Layaway
>>>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cineshipping.htm#paymentplan>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 602.309.0500
>>>>>>
>>>>>> © 2003 - 2025, CineMasterpieces.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> All rights reserved.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> est. 2001
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *The World's Finest Selection of Vintage Original Movie Posters*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *DAVID A. LIEBERMAN*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> President
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Featured Expert on The History Channel TV Show Pawn Stars*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 602 309 0500
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *STAR WARS <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinestarwars.htm>  |
>>>>>> JAMES BOND <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinejamesbond.htm>  |  
>>>>>> V.I.P.
>>>>>> ARCHIVE <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/newest.htm>*
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *    REFERENCES
>>>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/customertestimonials.htm>  |  FAQ
>>>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/faq.htm>  |  ABOUT US
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>> <https://www.facebook.com/VintageOriginalMoviePosters/>
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>>>>>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj2I8OsG6pbc3eRUr6h7Qhg>
>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To unsubscribe from the MoPo-L list, click the following link:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://listserv.american.edu/scripts/wa-american.exe?SUBED1=MoPo-L&A=1
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Bruce Hershenson and the other 22 members of the eMoviePoster.com team
>>>>> P.O. Box 874
>>>>> West Plains, MO 65775
>>>>> Phone: 417-256-9616 (hours: Mon-Fri 9 to 5 except from 12 to 1 when
>>>>> we take lunch)
>>>>> our site <http://www.emovieposter.com/>
>>>>> our auctions <http://www.emovieposter.com/agallery/all.html>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Complete Buyer Protection
>>>>> <http://www.emovieposter.com/unused/20120625ad_emovieposter_no_buyer_beware_buyer_warranty.jpg>
>>>>> - *No time limit on our guarantees & *NO* buyer beware
>>>>> *Hershenson Help Hotline
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>>>>> Also, please read the following three pages of in-depth* Customer
>>>>> Reviews *of our company * - Page 1
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>>>>> Page 2
>>>>> <http://www.emovieposter.com/images/announcements/buyerreviews_page2.jpg>,
>>>>> Page 3
>>>>> <http://www.emovieposter.com/images/announcements/buyerreviews_page3.jpg>*,
>>>>> which shows you in our customers' own words exactly what makes our company
>>>>> and our auctions so very different from all others!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>
>>>>
>>>> *The World's Finest Selection of Vintage Original Movie Posters*
>>>>
>>>> *DAVID A. LIEBERMAN*
>>>>
>>>> President
>>>>
>>>> *Featured Expert on The History Channel TV Show Pawn Stars*
>>>>
>>>> 602 309 0500
>>>>
>>>> *STAR WARS <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinestarwars.htm>
>>>> |  JAMES BOND <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinejamesbond.htm>  |  
>>>> **V.I.P.
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>>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/consignment.htm#buy>*
>>>>
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>>>> <https://www.facebook.com/VintageOriginalMoviePosters/>
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>>>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj2I8OsG6pbc3eRUr6h7Qhg>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>>
>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>
>>>
>>> *The World's Finest Selection of Vintage Original Movie Posters*
>>>
>>> *DAVID A. LIEBERMAN*
>>>
>>> President
>>>
>>> *Featured Expert on The History Channel TV Show Pawn Stars*
>>>
>>> 602 309 0500
>>>
>>> *STAR WARS <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinestarwars.htm>  |  JAMES
>>> BOND <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinejamesbond.htm>  |  **V.I.P.
>>> ARCHIVE <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/newest.htm>*
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>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/faq.htm>  |  ABOUT US
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>>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/consignment.htm#buy>*
>>>
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>>> <https://www.facebook.com/VintageOriginalMoviePosters/>
>>> <https://www.ebay.com/str/cinemasterpieces>
>>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-lieberman-cinemasterpieces/>
>>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj2I8OsG6pbc3eRUr6h7Qhg>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>
>>
>> *The World's Finest Selection of Vintage Original Movie Posters*
>>
>> *DAVID A. LIEBERMAN*
>>
>> President
>>
>> *Featured Expert on The History Channel TV Show Pawn Stars*
>>
>> 602 309 0500
>>
>> *STAR WARS <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinestarwars.htm>  |  JAMES
>> BOND <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinejamesbond.htm>  |  **V.I.P.
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>> <https://www.facebook.com/VintageOriginalMoviePosters/>
>> <https://www.ebay.com/str/cinemasterpieces>
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-lieberman-cinemasterpieces/>
>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj2I8OsG6pbc3eRUr6h7Qhg>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> To unsubscribe from the MoPo-L list, click the following link:
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>>
>
>
> --
>
> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>
>
> *The World's Finest Selection of Vintage Original Movie Posters*
>
> *DAVID A. LIEBERMAN*
>
> President
>
> *Featured Expert on The History Channel TV Show Pawn Stars*
>
> 602 309 0500
>
> *STAR WARS <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinestarwars.htm>  |  JAMES
> BOND <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinejamesbond.htm>  |  **V.I.P.
> ARCHIVE <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/newest.htm>*
>
> *    REFERENCES
> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/customertestimonials.htm>  |  FAQ
> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/faq.htm>  |  ABOUT US
> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/aboutus.htm>  |  **WE BUY POSTERS
> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/consignment.htm#buy>*
>
> <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>    <[email protected]>
> <https://www.facebook.com/VintageOriginalMoviePosters/>
> <https://www.ebay.com/str/cinemasterpieces>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-lieberman-cinemasterpieces/>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj2I8OsG6pbc3eRUr6h7Qhg>
> ------------------------------
>
>
>


-- 

<https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>

*The World's Finest Selection of Vintage Original Movie Posters*

*DAVID A. LIEBERMAN*

President

*Featured Expert on The History Channel TV Show Pawn Stars*

602 309 0500

*STAR WARS <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinestarwars.htm>  |  JAMES
BOND <https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinejamesbond.htm>  |  **V.I.P.
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*    REFERENCES
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<https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/consignment.htm#buy>*

<https://www.cinemasterpieces.com/>    <[email protected]>
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