Hello Mati 

On 6 Nov.you wrote:

> Gav I certainly understand your cynicism and it is well founded.
> Washington has become so static in various social bi-partisanship
> dominated by the Republicans over the past 8 years it is sad.  Bush
> has shown such a lack of leadership that the US presidency vacuum of
> any true power and leadership.  It is my hope that Obama gets this and
> will do better.  I am betting that Obama will be one of the most
> watched and followed president we have had.  I hope that he will lead
> with quality.

Gav is an Australian and they love foul language, remember John 
Beasly?  

 
> Bo,  you wrote:  "We ought to at least, but intellect's tentacles are
> tough and even Pirsig wasn't able to free himself from them by his
> insisting that the MOQ is an intellectual pattern. It started as one,
> but then took off on a purpose of its own. ... "Neo intellect  ...
> must you?" 

> Mati: My apology but I couldn't resist.  I am in agreement that MOQ
> was born from intellect and is not intellet SOM, but it does function
> as a new metaphysical tool that functions in some cases like SOM in
> that it we use it as a philosophical/reflective  tool to delineate and
> define reality. To just say MOQ is MOQ and not intellect doesn't
> discribe how it functions (or it own purpose)  or gives us a basis to
> understand its difference.  Perhaps Neo Intellect isn't perfect but I
> thought it wasn't a bad shot. My father used to love to share the
> Estonian saying "to do better is never forbidden."  :-)

OK, It isn't easy to find our way - language included - in a new 
metaphysical territory (like America it will be many New ... this and 
that) but I believe that the "SOM as intellect" tenet is now generally 
accepted (among the thinkers) and that means that the MOQ is no 
intellectual pattern and thus saved. DMB will probably repeat "Bo is 
wrong" till he drops, but that can't be helped.      


Bo






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