Sweet, sweet, John,
You've switched terms. Theism and religion are not equivalent terms. The
MoQ supports an atheistic religious point-of-view, Buddhism for instance, but
RMP has stated clearly that the MoQ is not just atheistic with regards to the
term 'God', but is anti-theistic. In the Copleston Annotations, RMP has gone
so far as to state: "The MOQ is an atheistic religious outlook that solves
rather
than bypasses religious problems."
Marsha
On Mar 8, 2010, at 1:26 AM, John Carl wrote:
> David,
>
>
>> dmb replies sarcastically:
>>
>> Oh, yea. I know exactly what you mean. When people only vaguely recall a
>> story that I love, it's just devastating. Sometimes I mope around for days
>> when people don't recall the details about the things I love. And this
>> memory lapse reveals their true nature of course, as a person who doesn't
>> believe in good, as a person who doesn't "get it". Sigh. What's wrong with
>> people? Why can't they obsessively cling to the things I love? I mean, if I
>> love it and they don't, well obviously that means there is something wrong
>> with them.
>>
>> For example, people who choose vanilla when they could've had chocolate
>> ought to be shot. How dare they!
>>
>> And the nonsense just keeps gets deeper, doesn't it? Good advice for guys
>> stuck in holes: Stop digging.
>>
>>
> I agree completely. Please clarify for me before I address your implied
> concerns whether this is a confession or an accusation.
>
> I don't want to make THAT mistake again.
>
> But seriously, I honestly feel that every time I get in a debate with you,
> you come to a certain point and then close down. There's no resolution to
> scores of arguments I've proposed and there's no continuation to completion
> any dialogue we've had.
>
> It's discouraging to me, and even you must admit there must be something
> wrong.
>
> I understand you are under time pressures and other pressures and it's sorta
> facile for me to judge, laying back in my broken down shack with all the
> time in the world to be annoying. I admit, it's hardly fair. But I don't
> spend hours thinking up stuff to say, or figuring out the correctness of my
> position, I just state my case as logically as I can in the moment, and
> invite you to do the same. No need to overthink, if either one of us makes
> a mistake there's only a bazillion sharp-eyed critics constantly watching
> over our shoulders, keen to offer correction.
>
> Just take a deep breath, and I'll carefully explicate my position as of this
> moment -
>
> Your own James admits the value of variety of religious experiences. The
> fact that I've found value for myself personally, in a juxtapositioned
> meta-christianity and the MoQ, why is that bad?
>
> To my mind, all religions evolve for the needs of men. Pirsig offers an
> argument for a pre-existing good which is creative of these differing
> analogies, and understanding the metaphysical existence of this good, does
> not trap us in any particular religion. Nay, it sets us free to enter into
> religious play.
>
> The idea of religious play within a context of a Quality metaphysics, seems
> so offensive to you that you can't be objective. It seems you take your own
> religious views of atheism so fundamentally, that you don't allow any other
> game.
>
> That's projection on my part. How accurate, you'd have to tell me. But the
> primary essense of my assertion, that the MoQ is a unification of science
> AND religion, and that both are EQUALLY patterns of value, then why can't a
> theist also be an MoQist?
>
>
> Explain this rationally to me please.
>
> if you're so busy earning the right to be a philosopher, that you can't
> philosophize, then that IS a pathetic spectacle.
>
> And it saddens me we had to see it, on the air. Tonight.
>
> John from his deepening, deepening whole
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