Ron,
I have no desire to make this into discussion on the meaning - denotation, connotation or interpretation - of words, but when you translated the word I used 'unattached' for the more emotionally charged word 'escape,' the meaning of my statement changed. I have no desire to defend the idea of 'escaping value.' What was your rationale for making such a switch. Marsha Marsha, Point taken, I did not realize I made the switch and it does cast a charge on the meaning. I apologize sincerely. But I am interested in why you feel becoming unattached to value is better considering we are composed of value. It hints at wanting to die rather than wanting to improve your life. what are your reasons for valuing "no value" or becoming unattached to value? you must feel that it is better in some way. -Ron On Apr 21, 2011, at 7:34 PM, X Acto wrote: > Marsha, > what exactly are my assumptions? > > That you are a rational human being that has reasons for their beliefs? > > I suppose you are correct Marsha. > > -Ron > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: MarshaV <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Thu, April 21, 2011 3:55:08 PM > Subject: Re: [MD] [Bulk] Re: the story of "me" > > > Ron, > > It's a philosophical question from your heart and head. I have a different > philosophical perspective, a different heart and head. You're looking for > affirmation from and for your point-of-view, your personal interpretation. > I suppose since you composed and asked the question, you need to > answer it for yourself. Your question's assumptions make no sense to me. > > > Marsha > > > > > On Apr 21, 2011, at 2:22 PM, X Acto wrote: > >> >> >> >> Ron, >> >> I reject your analysis. But thanks for the projection; it's always >> interesting. >> >> >> Marsha >> >> Marsha, >> Then you are rejecting a philosophical question not a subjective analysis. >> >> The Question: >>> >>> if we are composed of value, doesent it make more >>> sense to develop those value than to try to escape them? >> >> >> >> >> >> On Apr 20, 2011, at 8:53 AM, X Acto wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> Hello Ron, >>> >>> Having stated that the "Cartesian 'Me" is an illusion, and the definition >>> of >>> self is a flow of ever-changing, interdependent, impermanent inorganic, >>> biological, social and intellectual static patterns of value, I would have >>> to > > >>> say NO, I do not stand for any-thing. If you recognize "me" standing for >>> something, I would suspect you are recognizing social and intellectual >>> patterns >>> >>> we both share: patterns that attract and patterns that repel. If you want >>> me > > >>> to >>> >>> admit an "intention," it would be to become "unattached" to these >>> patterns. >>> That doesn't mean destroy them, it means to become unattached. If this all >>> sounds too lofty to be "real," I'll confess that the "Cartesian Me" pattern >>> has >>> >>> >>> >>> me in it's grip far, far FAR too often. I am "human, all too human." >>> >>> >>> >>> Marsha >>> >>> Marsha, >>> Why fight being human, refine it dont deny it. if we are composed of >>> value, >>> doesent it make more >>> sense to develop those value than to try to escape them? >>> >>> -Ron >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Apr 18, 2011, at 11:14 PM, X Acto wrote: >>> >>>> well, maybe perhaps one day you'll actually stand for something. >>>> >>>> I think you already do >>>> >>>> but you have yet to admit it. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ---- >>>> From: MarshaV <[email protected]> >>>> To: [email protected] >>>> Sent: Mon, April 18, 2011 4:58:28 AM >>>> Subject: Re: [MD] [Bulk] Re: the story of "me" >>>> >>>> >>>> Interesting Ron, >>>> >>>> I had lunch with a friend early last week, and as we were talking, >>>> I was realizing that my words were not really True. We were discussing >>>> experiences in other countries. And it made me uncomfortable to give >>>> any opinion at all. What I spoke of my experiences in Italy, would be >>>> different if I explained them to someone else, or explained them on >>>> different day. They'd have been different if I were talking at a >>>> different >>>> hour. These Italian utterances were so transitory. The talk was harmless >>>> enough, so I chalked it up to being social. But it made me squirm none >>>> the less because it represents all semantic expression. >>>> >>>> Maybe this will help you see why bottom line is always "not this, not >>>> that." >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Marsha >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Apr 17, 2011, at 11:43 PM, X Acto wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Hi Ron, >>>>> >>>>> Are you suggesting that we add 'stories' as another synonym too, and I >>>>> forgot >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>> Good. >>>>> >>>>> Really, are you suggesting that these are additional synonyms? Or >>>>> something >> >> >> >>>>> else. >>>>> I'd like to know how you're thinking about this. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Marsha >>>>> >>>>> Marsha, >>>>> I'm going after general meanings of the terms we use, I think : >>>>> Good >>>>> Choice >>>>> preference >>>>> selection >>>>> Value >>>>> And yes freedom >>>>> >>>>> All have meaning very similar to the word Quality >>>>> >>>>> I think our stories our biographies tell more about our values >>>>> than any concept of a cartesian self. >>>>> >>>>> I venture to suppose that our stories are our static values. >>>>> And I believe we do have a choice in following them or not. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Apr 17, 2011, at 9:38 AM, MarshaV wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> But it sounds like you are saying you are assigning 'choice' and >>>>>> 'freedom' as >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> additional synonyms for Quality. So synonyms for Quality are Value, >>>>>> Experience, >>>>>> Morality, Choice, and Freedom. Are there more? Is that what you are >>>>>> saying, >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> that >>>>>> >>>>>> choice and freedom are additional synonyms? Or are those synonyms for >>>>>> static >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>> quality alone? >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>> Archives: >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>> >>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>> Archives: >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >> >> >> >> ___ >> >> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html > > > > ___ > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html ___ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
