[Platt] If you care about your readers, you should be sorry for any word that might give them trouble. You will not find words like "dialogism" in Pirsig's writings.
[Arlo] Sorry, I assume people here are are either more read, or know how to use online dictionaries. [Platt] I did. Seems you agree with "common knowledge" instead of "collective consciousness." If so, it's a sign of progress. [Arlo] What is it a sign of that you don't actually read what I write? [Platt] Adding the word "individually" points to the fact that you, me, Lila and the brujo each consist of the four static levels or morality plus the ability to respond to DQ. If that's S/O dualism, Pirsig is equally guilty. [Arlo] No, he states clearly the collective consciousness unites our minds like cells in a body. The "individual" is a pragmatic reference point, but does not exist apart from the patterns of which it emerges. Since it emerges from the collective consciousness (in part) it is not apart from them. [Platt] The ability to respond to DQ is the normal state of being a human being. [Arlo] Really, so nothing could respond to DQ prior to humans? Or did other things stop responding to DQ the moment the first human was "created"? All patterns are capable of responding to DQ on their level. Since the "self" contains the collective consciousness (mythos and logos), it is capable of responding to DQ on the social and intellectual levels. A dog is capable of responding to DQ on the biological level. [Platt] As Pirsig made clear, no culture needed for a baby to respond to DQ. She just does what comes naturally. Later she acquires social/intellectual patterns (common knowledge) that are "transmitted from generation to generation." (Lila, 9) [Arlo] No culture is needed to respond to DQ from a bodily-kinesthetic POV. But "what comes naturally" on that level does not include participation in social and intellectual patterns. That comes only after culture. "So and so culture exists, therefore I think, therefore I am". I'm skipping your "translations", as all they are attempts to restate what I said in the language of S/O dualism. I have no interest in that. moq_discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
