Majoni! Homosexuality is nonsense. We can live with those people but cannot legislate their nonsense. If all serial killers likes and enjoy killing I think to some that will be their democratic right. We can live with serial killers but cannot legislate their right of killing. So majoni stop this democratic nonsense and be realistic. We cannot condone homosexuality. Payco comrades who are ANC in their thinking must live PAC not later than yesterday. I share Mugabe's view on homosexuality "They are worse than dogs"
Izwe Lethu! ________________________________ From: Thembeka Majali <thembeka.maj...@gmail.com> To: payco@googlegroups.com Sent: Sat, January 30, 2010 2:21:56 PM Subject: Re: [PAYCO] Do not impose your views on others and be selective in your definition of an african and those are your views not that of the PAC. Its heartening to hear such individuals rejecting other fellow africanists because of their sexual orientation weather you like it or not there are homesexuals inside the PAC and live with that reality. Furthermore to your utter rubish PAC signed that liberal rights based SA Constitution that you are referring to including your member of Parliament, is darking and dancing with that charterists constitution. Politically and Strategicallyso, you can amend the countries constitution once you take political and economic power but as long as you are a handful of members your views are just a dream if you are serious about the growth of your membership. Remember PAC's aim is to rally and Unite the africans. Many of you sometimes who are now homophobic were once homosexuals or have slept with other men but no one wants to interfere with anyones private life or sexual orientation. Its fallacious to think that homesexuality has western origins, its roots can also be traced in africa particularly among traditional healers perhaps you could do your own research about it. You are unfair to those african men and women who have given birth to those children whose sexual orientation is different from yours. Weather you like it or not they will remain as members of the PAC and wont be threatened by such utterances. There are many youthful issues that you should be responding to not boast about your immature intellectual disorientation. On Sat, Jan 30, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Thembeka Majali <thembeka.maj...@gmail.com> wrote: > > >On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 3:15 PM, khuliso emmanuel <khuliso...@yahoo.com> wrote: > >I agree with Mo-Africa Pitso Mphasha. First President of PACYL >> >> >>Vhahashu Ma-afrika, homosexuality and lesbianism should be rejected and >>condemned as they are regarded as totally unacceptable to cultural norms and >>values of African society," those who wants to be Africans, they should >>refrain from evil deeds. If PAYCO comrades want to align themselves with the >>constitution of these chaterists, they should do so. But PAC Youth League is >>saying "gay rights are immoral. It's right in the bible" and anybody who will >>be against the PAC Youth League voice will lebelled sellout. >> >>I remain noble son >>Khuliso >> >>--- On Thu, 1/28/10, Thembeka Majali <thembeka.maj...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >>>From: Thembeka Majali <thembeka.maj...@gmail.com> >>>>>>Subject: Re: [PAYCO] >>>To: payco@googlegroups.com >>>Date: Thursday, January 28, 2010, 11:35 AM >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>Or maybe ask why did we have Azanian Peoples Revolutionary Party a breakaway >>>group from PAC in exile? >>> >>> >>> >>>On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 11:32 AM, Thembeka Majali >>><thembeka.maj...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>M'afrika what you are asking could be a similar question to why do we have >>>some faction calling themselves Youth League or Women's League. Is it about >>>branding or moving with fashion times? >>>> >>>>PAYCO I hope you could issue a statement to the Human Rights Commission, >>>>dismiss those charges against you and publicly distance yourselves from the >>>>League's confussion. >>>> >>>>Read todays SOWETAN. >>>> >>>> >>>>On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 11:31 AM, Mothibe, Lucas <mothib...@doe.gov.za> >>>>wrote: >>>> >>>>Izwe lethu >>>>> >>>>>Maafrica I need clarity in the following: >>>> >>>>Are we Comrades or Africanist ? >>>> >>>Comrade is the term that was used by soviets (Marxists and Leninists) when >>>greeting each other during those days. >>> >>>Are we socialist or communist ? >>> >>>Are we for a National Democratic Revolution(NDR) or African Nationalism? >>> >>>If NDR ,what is the difference between us and SACP. >>> >>> >>>Regards >>>Lucas Mothibe >>> >>>From:payco@googlegroups.com [mailto:pa...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of >>>Mawande Jack >>>Sent: 19 January 2010 05:24 PM >>>To: payco@googlegroups.com; PAYCO Azania >>>Subject: [PAYCO] >>> >>> >>>Haiti-A Call For Global Action >>>by Randall Robinson >>>January 07, 2004 >>> >>>Part I >>>January 1, 1804 – January 1, 2004: >>>This day is sacred. >>> >>>It is the 200th anniversary of the Haitian Revolution. >>> >>>Fought by Haitians. >>> >>>Won for us all. >>> >>>Between 1791 and 1804, hundreds of thousands of Africans enslaved in Haiti >>>ignored the rivers, forests, precipices, swamps, mountains, gorges, >>>bloodhounds, rifles, cannon, and whips that separated them and united to >>>launch a massive, brilliantly executed, spectacular war of liberation that >>>the armies of Spain, England, and France (with the help of the United >>>States) all fought desperately – and failed absolutely – to crush. >>> >>>The Haitian Revolution was no "lucky break" involving "a few unruly slaves." >>> >>>This was no "plantation uprising." >>> >>>St. Domingue (as Haiti was then called by the French) was at that time the >>>most prosperous colonial possession of any European power. It created far >>>greater wealth for France than the thirteen American colonies combined. Its >>>massive wealth-generating capacity caused it to be known far and wide as >>>"The Pearl of the Antilles" and its French owners had a clear and proven >>>management strategy for profit maximization: push the slaves to their >>>absolute physical limit, work them literally to death, and then quickly >>>import replacement slaves from Africa who would, in turn, be worked to >>>death. This, St. Domingue's plantocracy had discovered, controlled operating >>>costs, kept the pace of economic activity at a highly efficient and >>>productive pace, minimized slack and wastage, and produced massive, >>>stupendous profits. >>> >>>Two hundred years ago today, however, after a 13-year war of liberation, the >>>slaves of St. Domingue celebrated their victory over France and other >>>European powers by establishing the Republic of Haiti. They had wrested from >>>Napoleon the engine of France's economic expansion, banished slavery from >>>the land, and ended European domination of 10,000 square miles of fertile >>>land and hundreds of thousands of slaves to work it. >>> >>>They had shattered the myth of European invincibility. >>> >>>"Most have assumed that (Haiti's) slaves had no military experience prior to >>>the revolution," John K. Thornton explains in African Soldiers in the >>>Haitian Revolution. "Many assume that they rose from agricultural labour to >>>military prowess in an amazingly short time.... However, it is probably a >>>mistake to see the slaves of St. Domingue as simply agricultural workers, >>>like the peasants of Europe... ...A majority of St. Domingue's slaves, >>>especially those who fought steadily in the revolution, were born in >>>Africa... ...In fact, a great many... ...had served in African armies prior >>>to their enslavement and arrival in Haiti... ....Sixty to seventy per cent >>>of the adult slaves listed on (St. Domingue's) inventories in the late >>>1780's and 1790's were African born... ... ...(coming) overwhelmingly from >>>just two areas of Africa: the Lower Guinea coast region of modern Benin, >>>Togo and Nigeria (also known as the "Slave Coast"), and the Angola coast >>>area.... >>> >>>"Where the African military background of the slaves counted most was in >>>those areas, especially in the north (of St. Domingue), where slaves >>>themselves led the revolution, both politically and militarily... ... >>>...These areas...threw up the powerful armies of Toussaint Louverture and >>>Dessalines and eventually carried the revolution." >>> >>>A successful revolution in Haiti, Thornton explains, "required the kind of >>>skill and discipline that could be found in veteran soldiers, and it was >>>these veterans, from wars in Africa, who made up the general will of the St. >>>Domingue revolt... ...Kongolese armies contributed the most to St. Domingue >>>rebel bands... ...(Their) tactical organization was very different from that >>>of Europe... ...(and they) had learned to deal successfully with Portuguese >>>armies and tactics in the years of struggle (in Africa), driving out >>>invaders... ...No doubt these tactics could help those who found themselves >>>in St. Domingue on the eve of the revolution. >>> >>>"Kongolese armies seem to have been organized in...platoons...that struck at >>>enemy advancing columns and sustained an engagement for a time before >>>breaking off and retreating... ...They made use of cover, both from terrain >>>and from woods and tall grass, in hiding their movements and directing their >>>fire. When they fled it was not possible to follow them." Portuguese troops >>>who had fought the Kongolese in Africa also reported that the Kongolese used >>>"shocks – larger engagements involving massed Kongolese units. According to >>>the Portuguese accounts, large bodies were assembled for shocks supported by >>>artillery, sometimes they formed in extensive half moon formations which >>>apparently sought partial envelopment of opposing forces, in other cases in >>>columns of great depth along fronts of 15-20 soldiers.... >>> >>>"Their tactics showed a penchant for skirmishing attacks rather than the >>>heavy assaults favoured by Europeans in the same era... ...Kongolese armies >>>had a higher command structure that could mass troops quickly, and soldiers >>>were also accustomed to forming effectively into larger units for major >>>battles when the situation warranted.... ...Dahomey's armies included a >>>fairly large professional force... ...Oyo relied heavily on cavalry forces, >>>had relatively few foot soldiers and throughout the 1700's was the >>>pre-eminent....military power in (west Africa)... ...Dahomey's troops... >>>...fought in close order using fire discipline quite similar to that of >>>Europe... ... >>> >>>"It was from these disparate 'arts of war' that the revolutionary African >>>soldier of St. Domingue was trained... ... >>> >>>"One can easily see, in the formation of the bands mentioned in the early >>>descriptions of the (Haitian Revolution), the small platoons of the >>>Kongolese armies, each under an independent commander and accustomed to >>>considerable tactical decision making; or perhaps those small units >>>characteristic of locally organized Dahomean units; the state armies of the >>>Mahi country; or the coastal forces of the Slave Coast... ... >>> >>>"In addition the pattern of attacks with small scale harassing maneuvers, >>>short, sustained battles and then rapid withdrawals are also reminiscent of >>>the campaign diaries of the Portuguese field commanders in Angola. Felix >>>Carteau, an early observer of the war in the north of St. Domingue noted >>>that the (slave revolutionaries) harassed French forces day and night. >>>Usually, he commented, they were repelled, but each time, they dispersed so >>>quickly, so completely in ditches, hedges and other areas of natural cover >>>that real pursuit was impossible. However, rebel casualties were light in >>>these attacks, so that the next day they reappeared with great numbers of >>>people. They never mass in the open, wrote another witness, or wait in line >>>to charge, but advance dispersed, so that they appear to be six times as >>>numerous as they really are. Yet they were disciplined, since they might >>>advance with great clamor and then suddenly and simultaneously fall >>>silent.... >>> >>>"It was not long before observers noted that the rebels (in St. Domingue) >>>had developed the sort of higher order tactics that was also characteristic >>>of Kongolese forces, or those of the Slave Coast.... >>> >>>"In addition to these tactical similarities to African wars, especially in >>>Kongo, there were other indications of the African ethos of the fighters... >>>...they marched, formed and attacked accompanied by the 'music peculiar to >>>Negroes....' Their religious preparation, likewise, hearkened back to >>>Africa.... >>> >>>"It is unlikely that many slaves would have learned equestrian skills as a >>>part of their plantation labor... ...Since there was virtually no cavalry in >>>Angola, one can speculate that rebels originating from Oyo might have >>>provided at least some of the trained horsemen. Also, the Senegalese, though >>>a minority, also came from an equestrian culture... ... >>> >>>"African soldiers may well have provided the key element of the early >>>success of the revolution. They might have enabled its survival when it was >>>threatened by reinforced armies from Europe. Looking at the rebel slaves of >>>Haiti as African veterans rather than as Haitian plantation workers may well >>>prove to be the key that unlocks the mystery of the success of the largest >>>slave revolt in history." >>> >>>St. Domingue's policy of working its slaves to death and then quickly >>>importing replacements from Africa proved to be the ultimate karmic >>>boomerang. St. Domingue's African-born slaves not only were not yet broken >>>psychologically, but they were also in possession of significant military >>>training and experience gained on the other side of the Atlantic. And they >>>combined with brilliant, indefatigable, St. Domingue-born blacks like >>>Toussaint L'Ouverture and Dessalines to create a black revolutionary >>>juggernaut the likes of which Europe and the United States had not seen >>>before – or since.. >>> >>>The blacks of St. Domingue forced the world to see both them and the >>>millions of other Africans enslaved throughout the Americas with new eyes. >>>No longer could it be assumed that they could forever be brutalized into >>>creating massive fortunes and building sprawling empires for the glory of >>>Europe and America. >>> >>>On January 1, 1804, hundreds of thousands of slave revolutionaries >>>established an independent republic and named it Haiti in honor of the >>>Amerindian people, long since killed off by European brutality and diseases, >>>who had called the land Ayiti – Land of Many Mountains. They had banished >>>slavery from their land and proclaimed it an official refuge for escaped >>>slaves from anywhere in the world. They had defeated the mightiest of the >>>mighty. They had shattered the myth of European invincibility. >>> >>>Europe was livid. America, apoplectic. The blacks in St. Domingue had >>>forgotten their place and would be made to pay. Dearly. For the next two >>>hundred years. >>> >>>Toussaint L'Ouverture, Dessalines, and their slave revolutionaries must >>>forever live in our hearts as inspiring, authentic counterweights to the >>>"yassuh-nosuh-scratch- where-ah-don'-itch-and-dance-tho-there-ain'-no-music" >>>image of our forebears that Europe and the United States have drilled into >>>our psyches. >>> >>>And we must remember that history forgets, first, those who forget >>>themselves. Via means direct and indirect, crass and subtle, there have been >>>whispers and street corner shouts that "current conditions in Haiti" make >>>our celebration of the Haitian Revolution "inappropriate" at this time. >>> >>>We, whose souls and psyches have been bleached of everything prior to the >>>Middle Passage are now being told that we must tear from our consciousness >>>and rip from our hearts the most dramatic and triumphal assertion of >>>forebears' dignity, worth, and perspicacity since the Middle Passage. >>> >>>How diabolically contemptuous. >>> >>>Not only must we not forget the Haitian Revolution, we must celebrate it. >>>Today, through all of this its bicentennial year, and beyond. >>> >>>And we must research, understand, and expose what happened to Haiti and in >>>Haiti since the revolution. We must become fully conversant with the role of >>>"the world's leading democracies" in Haiti between 1804 and today. We must >>>develop a keen understanding of the repercussions of the 61-year economic >>>embargo that the United States imposed on Haiti in response to its >>>declaration of independence, and we must recognize the current-day >>>consequences of France forcing Haiti to pay 90 million in gold francs >>>(equivalent today to some $20 billion) in 1825 as "compensation" for Haiti >>>declaring its independence – or be crushed militarily by France. >>> >>>Today, "the world's leading democracies" cluck and gloat at their ongoing >>>stranglehold – in the form of a crushing financial embargo – on today's >>>descendants of Toussaint, Dessalines, and their freedom fighters. Throughout >>>the Americas, we who benefited from the daring war waged by the slaves of >>>St. Domingue, must reject the maneuverings of the world's most powerful >>>nations in Haiti and find ways to build bridges to the Haitian people and >>>the officials they choose – through the ballot – to lead them. >>> >>>Just over two hundred years ago, after there had been a "cessation of >>>hostilities" and the brilliant military strategist Toussaint L'Ouverture had >>>already retired to a quiet life in the St. Domingue country-side, France >>>decided, nonetheless, to arrest and ship him to a prison cell 3,000 feet up >>>the Jura Mountains of France where he would freeze to death. As he stepped >>>on board the boat that would forever take him away from St. Domingue, >>>Toussaint issued a promise to his captors and a call to us all. >>>"In overthrowing me, you have cut down in St. Domingue only the trunk of the >>>tree of liberty. It will spring up again by the roots for they are numerous >>>and deep." >>>We are those roots. >>> >>>The revolution was fought by Haitians, but won for us all. >>> >>>Through our work and with our resources, in a spirit of self-respect and >>>self-awareness, we must serve as counterweights to the powerful nations who >>>deem the ballot box sacrosanct in their countries, but surreptitiously >>>encourage and manipulate its rejection by "the opposition" in Haiti. We must >>>serve as proponents of political civility and social justice in Haiti while >>>"the world's leading democracies" slyly encourage recalcitrance, tumult, and >>>division. We must reject being manipulated by the corporate media into >>>embracing the notion that in France, Germany, the United States and other >>>"civilized nations" elections are the only legitimate determinant of the >>>will of the people, but in Haiti those street demonstrations specially >>>selected by the corporate media for coverage tell us all we need to know >>>about anybody's will. We must impress upon all Haitians the fact that the >>>outside world does not distinguish between – and cares nothing about – Lavalas, Convergence, or any other political grouping. The world sees only "Haiti," "Haitians," and all the connotations that western media have attached thereto. Those nations that two hundred years ago failed desperately in their attempts to crush the Haitian Revolution today have a deep psychic need to "prove" Toussaint's progeny capable of nothing but disaster. We must reach out to and work with our Haitian brothers and sisters to prove these nations wrong. >>> >>>Throughout the Diaspora, we must stand with and defend Haiti – on this the >>>anniversary of the Haitian Revolution, throughout this bicentennial year, >>>and for all time. For in so doing, we stand for and defend ourselves. >>-- >>Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com >> >>Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>> >>You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco >> >>Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com >> >>-- >>Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com >> >>Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>> >>You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco >> >>Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com >> >>-- >>Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com >> >>Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >>>> >>You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco >> >>Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com > -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups..com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com -- Sending your posting to payco@googlegroups.com Unsubscribe by sending an email to payco-unsubscr...@googlegroups.com You can also visit http://groups.google.com/group/payco Visit our website at www.mayihlome.wordpress.com
