First of all, if you are referring to me I never said "this is a shit".
Second what you see as negativity I see it as honesty and for me is far more important than "Pharo is yours". Assuming honesty does not become rudeness. Third I dont recall anyone ever demanding a feature of you guys working 24/7 to implement something disregarding your limited resources. Fourth I have to say that I really don't get the "Pharo is yours" motto. Is there software out there , open source or not that does not listen to its community and does not try hard to makes its users happy ? Pharo is not mine, If I designed Pharo I would make a lot more diffirent choices than the ones that are included in Pharo and many of them would be proven bad and stupid in the long run because I have made many of them already. I want to contibute and keep pushing Pharo forward but realistically Pharo will never become mine and that maybe is more a good than a bad thing for the rest of you. Fifth, the community overall is friendly, we had our clashes from time to time but lets be realistic, what community does not ? I have had my bad experiences while coding with python and just a daily participation in irc channels and forums can prove this point easily. These things make one mature emotionally and learn how to treat people online in a productive way. Communities benefit more than fall apart from these incidents because they really prove what kind of metal they are made of. Not helping does not help is something we will agree to disagree, Companies invest billions of dollars on surveys to see how people feel about a product. You may hate the idea of Pharo viewed as a product but maybe then maybe you understimate the importance of this approach. Sooner or later Pharo will need some serious funding to get more full time developers and investors will see Pharo as a product. In the end if what drives you all is to create a super cool product go out and ask people what they truly feel about Pharo. Very few people use smalltalk implementations , why ? What they don't like is far more important to what they like. Learning to target features that your users need the most is the path to success but even if the user does not really know what he or she want getting to know your user needs or the way he/she thinks is what will help you design tools that make people smile but most importantly make people use on a day to day basis. If you are not ready to take in the negativity you wont go very far because there is a ton of negativity out there. If you find my negative bad, boy you have seen nothing . There is a lot of frustration out there for things even unrelated to coding, sometimes accepting that help you communicate easily with people . Dont try to suppress negative it will become a volcano that will erupt eventually. On the other hand do not tolerate trolling either, isolate these kind of people who love to annoy others and throw the away from poisoning the community. "Anything done with a measure is perfection" On Fri, Oct 3, 2014 at 2:44 PM, Esteban Lorenzano <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi, > > I’m writing this because I’m sad about what is happening in this list. > I’m seeing a lot of general negativity and non constructive ways to > discuss things. > I’m also seeing more and more people using Pharo for their particular > interests (which is of course a good thing) but less and less people who > contribute back to Pharo. > Finally, I’m seeing more frequently an attitude of “customer”, more than > the conviction than this, Pharo, is also yours… > > Please people, we (the pharo “core” team) cannot do everything. We do not > have the manpower or the resources to hire manpower. We would like, but we > just do not have the resources (is already a blessing that we can work on > this, for now: INRIA is paying, but what it pays is *research*, not “pharo > the language”, so this is a collateral advantage….) > > So, having an OPEN SOURCE project, with limited resources means that there > is a lot of things that depend on the community. > It depends on the community not just to fix, but to enlarge the ecosystem > in general too. > > So, I refuse to believe that we cannot be a cool and helpful community. > I refuse to believe that general negativity and bad humor can overcome the > joy of participating in this collective effort. > > So, here some recommendations for enhance the way we participate: > > - Be positive. Just “this is a s**t” does not help. Even if it is. > - Be propositional. Just “this is a s**t”, and not telling what you > want/prefer does not help. > - Be proactive. Just “this is a s**t”, and not report, discuss and (at > least time to time) provide a fix/enhancement does not help. > > In conclusion: not helping does not help :) > After all, this is the “pharo-dev” list. I mean, the list of people > wanting to participate from this great, community effort. > > cheers, > Esteban, still grateful of belonging to this community > > > >
