> On Mon, 2005-02-07 at 11:28 -0500, Jody Goldberg wrote:
> > - Getting Road map in Wiki
> > : Luis seems to be making progress. The old roadmap is on the wiki and
> > needs to be updated.
>
> Having spent some time evaluating Wikis the last two weeks, I have to say
> GNOME is run
> I have no particular horse here, but I will note that if we want to use
> wiki for serious documents, we must have high quality RCS, and mediawiki
> and whatever ubuntu use have that, and live.gnome.org does not, which is a
> serious bummer.
We do our serious document authoring in CVS, and whi
> I put of a small tutorial on l.g.o, and it occured to me that I could not
> find any policy on the wiki itself wrt copyrights. It seems a bit odd to
> put up content on a wiki with a copyright statement (since the purpose is
> to let anyone improve it), but I would like to make sure I get a lit
> It'd be cool if we could have a "powered by" logo that distros could
> include in marketing material, splash screens, documentation etc.
So I'm taking this interesting subthread to foundation-list. :-)
> Of course, we have no way to make it mandatory, but GNOME as a brand has
> suffered great
> On Maw, 2005-03-08 at 19:09, Rob Adams wrote:
> > Of course, I see no reason why women can't be hackers. I don't see
> > anything in the culture that should keep women out. In fact, from what
> > I can tell, most IT organizations and schools bend over backwards to try
> > to get women.
>
> I
> And it did not occur to the GNOME society (or anyone else) earlier to do
> anything about this fact
I hope "anyone else" doesn't include Debian Women, Linuxchix, Gnurias, and
other groups who are doing excellent work related to women's participation
in FOSS. I know of a number of GNOME people
Cool!
http://www.fsfeurope.org/about/funds/funds.en.html
- Jeff
--
GUADEC 2005: May 29th-31st http://2005.guadec.org/
"It's like having someone say to you, 'You should get back together
with your first wife. You guys were good together'. It's not that
>ACTION: Dave to start looking for vendors to host the GNOME online shop
How did e-flow go? (Or MozSource if that's what they are now.) I asked Tim
to follow this up when I was on last year's board. They seemed very good,
very professional, and have done a great job for the Mozilla Foundatio
> How about "'Planet.GNOME.org' is an open forum for discussion and debate
> regarding topics of interest to the GNOME project. Content posted here is
> the opinion and responsibility of the individual poster, and does not
> necessarily represent the opinion or policy of the GNOME Foundation"
I
> On Tue, 2005-03-15 at 10:31 +0200, Toni Willberg wrote:
>
> > My employer Movial Corporation has several open positions for GTK+ /
> > GNOME hackers. The positions are located in Helsinki, Finland.
>
> Hi there Toni,
>
> While I'm glad there's companies doing free software development,
>
>
> I am not sure that this is quite what we meant. But at Guadec I remember a
> couple of us were discussing the possibility of a [EMAIL PROTECTED] sort
> of mailing list.
> I haven't explained this very well. The only other person I remember in
> the conversation was Jeff
> In an effort to let developers do what they do best and get on with
> developing software [2] so I would like to propose a standard build flag
> which could be used to fence off code that could be effected by software
> patents.
A few mostly rhetorical questions:
Are you violating the paten
> I was part of the fundraising team for GUADEC when User Day and the
> government/business speakers were added. They were added in response to
> the fact that we were getting firm "no"s from potential sponsors. Those
> same companies came on board later on that year, as a result of us adding
>
> GUADEC has been sustainable for six years and survived economic up and
> down cycles. GUADEC planning is a good place for discussing next year's
> conference model.
... with emergency sponsorship from existing advisory board members,
inconsistent and badly communicated registration fee stru
> > At least one reason... there were a number of things that didn't work
> > well in Stuttgart that need to be fixed. We once again had too many
> > parallel sessions, too much stuff on the schedule, too many
> > unanticipated sessions that had to be added in the weeks before the
> > conference.
> I'm sure we can find activities for all of them.
*snip* -> all the ideas in your email are awesome. :-)
- Jeff
--
OSCON 2005: August 1st-5th http://conferences.oreillynet.com/os2005/
"I'm just mucking round down the shallow end of the literary pool, I
> > I'd also like some (or even one) real beginner talks to sell GNOME to
> > complete newbies, telling people what GNOME is, what it looks/feels
> > like, and what it can do. But that's just a question of someone
> > proposing such talks and the papers committee accepting them.
>
> So this is c
> whatever distro is being used/promoted in Lithuania, I myself would be
> really happy to see GUADEC there. Once we conquer Eastern Europe, Russia
> and Asia are very close :)
And we won't even need elephants! :-)
- Jeff
--
EuroOSCON: October 17th-20thhttp://conferences.oreillynet.com/eu
> [For informative purposes of the foundation, I figured I'd answer these as
> best as possible for the previous three years.][This would all have been
> easier had the data been presented as a .gnumeric file instead of pdf :)
Excellent summary, thank you!
- Jeff
--
linux.conf.au 2006: Dunedi
> We're a little late on the get-go, but I think we should do something for
> Software Freedom Day - http://softwarefreedomday.org/ - September 10th
> this year.
Don't know why it didn't occur to me to pimp this to GNOME, we've been doing
lots of stuff about it in Australia and Ubuntu-land.
And
> When I was elected to the board last year, the GNOME foundation marketing
> was done by a closed little cabal on a private mail alias. Now we have a
> growing community of people on a public list, with the private list for
> writing press releases and dealing with press contacts.
That's not en
> There have been a couple of *really* good examples this year - the hiring
> of someone to do a contract on docs (which stalled for 3 months on the
> writing of a job contract, until the person got another job) is one.
How is it that with a full time employee, a small task such as this was
stal
> I was planning to do a follow up on last years very successful talks on
> open standards and open file formats. Many might remember the
> presentations from capacities like Bruce Perens et all?
>
> Things that are crucial to coders trying to make better applications for
> the function of our
> > I thought we still had a relationship with SPI?
>
> I'm not clear on what our relationship is with them right now; obviously
> we're still on good terms (I'm on their trademark committee) but I don't
> know if we still have some kind of formal affiliation/partnership.
I'm still Foundation r
Hey everyone,
I've been meaning to write a usefully detailed email about why I'll be
voting "NO" for the current referendum, but with my insane travel schedule
at the moment, I haven't had an opportunity to sit down and write it. A
journalist (who hasn't pushed out an article yet, so I've not iden
> I've heard lots of unconvincing arguments as well--on both sides. But,
> what is very convincing to me is the fact that it strongly appears that we
> don't have 11 motivated people running for the board.
Motivated to do what? To "get things done"? That should not be the function
of the board.
> Interesting input. But why is it better to do this with 11 directors than
> 7 directors? :-)
Broader, more diverse representation - this is a *big* community, and even
the current board has massive msising chunks of it, whether you look at
regional representation, developer representation, or
> > > I've heard lots of unconvincing arguments as well--on both sides.
> > > But, what is very convincing to me is the fact that it strongly
> > > appears that we don't have 11 motivated people running for the board.
> >
> > Motivated to do what? To "get things done"? That should not be the
> >
> I agree that this is important, and I'll be running on a very similar
> platform in the next election, but this doesn't solve the problem of the
> number of involved/qualified people. If anything, it makes it worse by
> increasing the demands on at least some of the people involved. Long-term,
ke decisions.
This is only because the purpose of the board is badly defined and
communicated.
> Jeff Waugh:
> "We've had very motivated people, to the point where some of them
> have run to make sure less trustworthy people would not get on
> the board! :-)"
> >That is not what the board - or even the foundation - is for! Innovating
> >the future of GNOME is a *COMMUNITY* responsibility, not an
> >organisational one.
>
> My fear is that people who've been reluctant to run but have run anyway
> will cripple the board from making decisions based on th
> > It's not about radical things happening, it's about untrustworthy people
> > being elected.
>
> Who are these untrustworthy people? I have never been a candidate but am
> getting tired of these implications that some of the candidates in the
> past have been untrustworthy or that others have
> In other words, people not getting things done is not about the number of
> people, it's about the lack of process and/or infrastructure to help them
> get those things done.
Yep. I am advocating a 'standard' four member elected executive (President,
Vice President, Secretary, Treasurer), as o
> > Consensus and execution become crippling problems because no director
> > has a responsibility to the organisation to push it forward (by either
> > dropping an issue for that term or executing it).
>
> I'm not convinced you can do this with 11 people though - it's too big a
> number to crea
> > This is only because the purpose of the board is badly defined and
> > communicated.
>
> I think it is worth pointing out, that if the role of the board is better
> defined in the future and if the board is "fixed", there is no reason that
> the number of directors can not be increased again
> On Thu, October 27, 2005 03:15, Jeff Waugh wrote:
> > 7 is way too small to represent the diversity of our community. Consider
> > it in these terms: 2 people from 3 contributing companies and 1 other
> > person.
> >
> > No thanks. Our community deserve
> Jeff Waugh wrote:
>
> > I'm saying no because in the general case, it's not basic agreement that
> > is the problem, it's the finality and commitment of execution that is.
> > Even on this particular issue, there was broad agreement among board
> &g
> I agree, since Tim's been the one who has been collect the advisory board
> fees, finding new sponsors and board members, etc. The board has had
> little to do with raising money to date.
In quite a few cases, however, that has relied on board members talking to
their own companies in order to
> Probably it sounds plain, simple and stupid. But it's incredible how
> people get stuck even getting in touch; moreover when you need a point of
> start.
Germán Poó Caamaño for GNOME Foundation Board!
- Jeff
--
UbuntuBelowZero in Montreal! http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBelowZero
> How much time do you think a director should dedicate to board tasks in
> order to be efficient?
>
> Please suggest an estimate of [minimum - average] hours par week or month.
Because "getting things done" shouldn't be the Board's agenda, it should be
able to deal with its "tasks" in monthly
> This is my first election period in the GNOME Foundation, so I'm surprised
> by the lack of candidates few days before the deadline. :)
So, I'm planning to run again this year, but I'm all caught up in the middle
of the BadgerBadgerBadger tour, so haven't had time to sit down and write my
can
> I never said _you_ did. The exact words used were: "It's not about radical
> things happening, it's about untrustworthy people being elected." see
> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/foundation-list/2005-October/msg00068.html
One of the reasons why we have elections is so that we can vote for peo
> Apparently, in your own opinion, there are people in the foundation tahat
> are not trusted by some (and who have run for election in the past).
(Which is not surprising for a community of our size or diversity.)
> So why should one trust a candidate who is also heavily involved in the
> runn
> I personally read the recent referendum as "Let's make the board smaller
> so that the seat-fillers can leave, rather than let other qualified people
> try their hand at it."
I pretty much feel the same way. I understand why it was done, I used to be
an avid supporter of reducing the number of
> The board has previously said that we would abide by the decision of the
> referendum (in the board meeting where it was proposed), so I don't
> consider any announcement necessary.
Ah - crucial information which didn't seem to be stated publically.
Be the signal,
- Jeff
--
Ubuntu USA & Eu
Name: Jeff Waugh
Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] / [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Nick: jdub
Affl: Canonical Ltd, sponsors of Ubuntu
(Apologies for my late candidacy statement. I had to make a hurried return
from the USA to Australia, which unfortunately coincided with the original
deadline. Though I was
Hmm,
Are we going to have candidate questions this year? We had better do it fast
if we expect candidates to answer them before the voting period. If everyone
can post their questions in response to this mail, we can ask the membership
committee (sans Vincent, I'd imagine) to select the best and r
> 1) Why are you running for Board of Directors? What will you do more or
> better than previous years Boards have done?
I've had a year off after two years on. So I understand the workings of the
Board from the inside and have watched it from the outside with and without
that experience. I'm ru
> How important are desktop standards for you. How will you attempt to let
> the GNOME developers cooperate even more with the freedesktop.org
> movement? Or do you dislike that movement? In in general: What should
> GNOME "do" with fd.org?
I'd like to make sure that our relationships with other
Questions 1, 2, 3 and 5 answered in previous mail.
> 4. Explain how you expect to meet you goals.
* I will more effectively communicate the role and scope of the Board among
the directors, Foundation members and Advisory Board.
* I will encourage the adoption of an elected executive as part
> What do you think of the composition of the current board, where a couple
> of big companies hold half of the chairs?
I trust those individuals as members of the GNOME Foundation and community,
*and* as representatives of companies that contribute a great deal to GNOME
(in development resource
> I would be happy to help out. As Jonathan mentions, Murray and I have
> been sorting through some of the issues on live.gnome.org by putting
> together an Interface Specification that is hopefully useful to ISV's
>
> Does "ISV" stand for "Independent Software Vendor"? If so, the
Given that you're fond of being very precise, Richard, perhaps it would be
better to say that the people you've endorsed have championed Free Software
ideals in this forum and elections period in particular.
Knowing all of the candidates running for the Board this year, I have full
confidence in e
> If you are interested about giving a talk, please send me an email telling
> me what you want to give a talk about.
I'll be there - would love to do a talk about GNOME advocacy and kicking
arse in that field. :-)
- Jeff
--
Ubuntu USA & Europe Tour: Oct-Nov 2005http://wiki.ubuntu
Yo,
Voting's going to close soon - December 10, 23:59 UTC - remember to have
your say. :-)
http://foundation.gnome.org/elections/2005/
- Jeff
--
linux.conf.au 2006: Dunedin, New Zealand http://linux.conf.au/
"The worst vice is ad-vice." - Al Pacino, The Devil's Advocat
> Want to have fun in Brussels?
>
> Here is a reminder, we are still looking for people to give talks in the
> gnome devroom during FOSDEM.
Christophe,
I made a page on the GNOME wiki about the FOSDEM devroom earlier today, but
didn't want to announce it until I'd spoken to you about it... I g
> Axis Informática
>
>
> * We are fine with giving them permission to sell products with the
> GNOME Logo.
>
> * Need to find the contract that we got Killermundi to sign, so that
> we can use the same contract for Axis Informática.
>
> * Let's give the cut to GNOME Hispan
> some Chilean people already asked, and we asked killermundi, who says no
> problem from their part. The problem is the cost of an international
> parcel. Don't remember the exact price but it made the t-shirt cost its
> weight in gold :)
Heh. :-)
> we also talked with killermundi about them d
Hi all,
Please consider this email a formal request from the GNOME Foundation.
We, being the GNOME Foundation, as well as many GNOME Foundation members and
contributors to the project, have contacted you numerous times over the last
four years regarding the use of the old GNOME logo on Slashdot.
> I just wanted to take the time to let everyone know how the GNOME booth at
> Eclipse Con went.
Thanks very much for the report, and all your work on the stand - sounds
like a great success! :-)
- Jeff
--
GUADEC 2006: Vilanova i la Geltrú, Spainhttp://2006.guadec.org/
"O
> I think this is a big part of Ubuntu's success at getting new
> contributors. But I'd like our code of conduct to be a little shorter and
> I don't think we need a whole organisation to police it.
Agree, particularly about shortening/simplifying it. We can continue to use
(albeit more obviousl
> I do think GNOME is better than most though. I'd like to use this code of
> conduct to advertise that we are better.
Yes, it's worth mentioning, particularly for the journalists on the list ;)
that a *huge* number of GNOME developers claim that the main reason they
stuck around after dipping t
> I think GNOME would be a less exciting place with a Code of Conduct.
8< snip 8<
> > Here's a simple start: http://live.gnome.org/CodeOfConduct
>
> Isn't this just common sense? I don't see the need to push a long debate
> to end up having a list of points based on common sense.
So, does c
> Instead of writing a new code why don't we just encourage people to be
> good persons, participants, contributors...?
That's precisely what it's for. It's not a list of *rules*, it's a statement
of intent, of expectations. Boiled down to the very basics, the Ubuntu Coc
just says - "be excellen
> If you read Planet GNOME and some of the mailing lists, you'll notice that
> many developers use the term "Open Source" and call the operating system
> "Linux", instead of GNU or GNU/Linux. Some of them were even excited when
> a popular non-free software was relicensed recently, allowing easi
> If greater clarity and emphasis on freedom is the goal why not say
> _Freedom Software_ and avoid the abiguity which in part lead other to come
> up with different terminology?
This is not a discussion for this list - please take this off-list if you
wish to pursue it.
Thanks,
- Jeff
--
GU
> I don't think anyone is arguing against being courteous; I'm certainly
> not. I just think we'd be better off focusing on actually making people
> more courteous, instead of writing rules about it.
I think most everyone else has got out of the "characterising it as rules"
thing already. It's p
> I think a fun way to deal with this criticism ('cos it's valid and
> expected) is to actually make it a Very GNOMEy Code of Conduct. Let's not
> beat around the bush - first point: "Be Excellent to Each Other".
>
> *guitar lick*
(added this point to the wiki page)
- Jeff
--
linux.conf.au 2
> But, they can't be members of the board without an election.
Just want to point out that, yes, they can be - please read the Foundation
by-laws. The board can change the size of the board at will, and nominate
members at will.
The referendum process was not done because it was necessary, it w
> The Board would like to propose to you a temporary enlargement of the
> board with two persons: Behdad Esfahbod and Germán Poó-Caamaño.
My personal opinion on this, as stated to the board:
* We made our bed with the one-two-punch combination of change in board
size and change in number o
> > Just want to point out that, yes, they can be - please read the
> > Foundation by-laws. The board can change the size of the board at will,
> > and nominate members at will.
>
> Which is clearly a hole in the democratic process, the right thing to do
> would be to fix the bylaws, not jump on
> Jeff Waugh wrote:
> > * We are attempting to do big things without the benefit of having a
> > face to face meeting. Every board so far has been more effective
> > post-GUADEC, after they've had the opportunity to sit down, grind
> > through the issues wi
> In reality, we will likely hire someone who is already competent in the
> use of free software - but I agree with Quim that this should not be a
> requirement (obviously (at least to me), *using* free software will be
> part of the job, where possible).
>
> I think the Foundati
> A few years ago I solved this bounty and did receive a cheque (check
> comment 19).
(Just wanted to note, so it did not look like we were ignoring Philip, that
this has been followed up on the Board mailing list.)
- Jeff
--
linux.conf.au 2007: Sydney, Australia http://lca2007.linu
> Who can help me give these machines a final home with a useful task to
> perform ?
With my board hat on - yeah, I think this is a great idea. :-)
- Jeff
--
linux.conf.au 2007: Sydney, Australia http://lca2007.linux.org.au/
"Whoever wrote [the Twisted documentation] uses a vivi
Ni hao,
At the end of the month, my affiliation will change from Canonical Ltd to
"unaffiliated". (Technically Waugh Partners, but only as a convenience; I
am not doing anything related to its existing business, it's just a close
and convenient structure to start from.)
Thanks,
- Jeff
--
linux
> - Note that an agreement with the GNOME Foundation implies that the user
> group has a legal entity.
Note that we have to take our tax status in the US into account when talking
about relationships with international groups - it has come up as an issue
in the past, so we need some legal advice
> I also still think it is a pretty bad idea
I'd like to find out why people think it's a bad idea, when I think the idea
has been pretty soundly proven as good by the Ubuntu community (albeit, the
CoC was part of the Ubuntu community's creation, but I thinke everyone is
being realistic about th
> its obvious that not everyone shares the same values
It seems from the conversation that no one disagrees with the content of the
CodeOfConduct page, but *does* disagree with the name and the existence of a
document of what we expect of our community.
I just wish people would stop whining abo
> If your argument is that these are "shared community values", better to
> call it that instead.
Okay, so if we say "call it what you want, lay out the intent in your own
words" and you could discuss the actual content of the document, what would
you say? Because arguing about abstracts and sem
> The Ubuntu community decided to have a CoC since their early stages and
> there was not much fuzz about it. This shows that probably a CoC is good
> for that community.
>
> The GNOME community has growth for years without a CoC and now that it is
> being proposed to have one there is no conse
> Attending GUADEC I found out that I can become GNOME Foundation member.
> After arriving in Ulaanbaatar, Mongolia, I applied for membership.
> Yesterday The GNOME Foundation Membership Committee accepted me, so from
> now I'm member of GNOME Foundation.
>
> Few days ago I contributed my first
> Do you really think that writing down "Be nice" makes us nicer and makes
> us look nicer to the outsiders?
That's the funny thing - YES! Strange analogy, but even while a lot of
people have lost confidence in the USA in recent times, I don't think
anyone's forgotten about the ideas the countr
> Bypassing the wording thing and also the content of the CoC, two questions
> I think we should agree on in order to move forward:
(Yay, this is the important bit.)
> - Do we aim to have an official GNOME
> approved and assumed by the GNOME Foundation or is it enough with a of behavior princ
> I wonder what would have happened if the board has simply written this
> code of conduct and announced it without consultation.
We'd be viciously flamed for making rules called the "Code of Conduct", I'd
suspect. ;-)
- Jeff
--
linux.conf.au 2007: Sydney, Australia http://lca2007.l
> Yes. My only objection to that phrase (which I tried in the draft before
> people complained about it) is that it's a cultural reference that isn't
> fully understood by many eople whose first language is not English.
Maybe we can put an IMDB reference in, and educate the world about this
impo
> These documents reflect already the content and intent of the GNOME
> Foundation. They don't need any extra blessing or acceptance, what is in
> there is a right, a duty and a guidance for all of us. If they need
> updating let's update them. If they need advertisement let's advertise
> them.
> Doing the process of updating the charter would be a failure? I don't see
> why, this process could be healthy for the community, and the result would
> be stronger and more sounded. In the meantime the list of recommendations
> could be discussed, tested, improved, applied (it was being applie
> To me, it sounds like at least some important people would like the CoC to
> be a set of enforcable rules, or at least would be open to discussing
> whether they should be. This would violate earlier claims to the contrary
> [1] and clearly expresses the sentiment that some folks would like to
> This is a request to the the GNOME Foundation Board for action/decision
> regarding this matter.
Thanks Yavor, we will discuss it at our next board meeting.
- Jeff
--
linux.conf.au 2007: Sydney, Australia http://lca2007.linux.org.au/
Web development with PHP is like inje
>
>
> > This is a request to the the GNOME Foundation Board for action/decision
> > regarding this matter.
>
> Thanks Yavor, we will discuss it at our next board meeting.
Yavor,
Could you provide references to the use of "Linux" and "GNU/Linux" in the
GNOME documentation? viewcvs links are f
> Could you provide references to the use of "Linux" and "GNU/Linux" in the
> GNOME documentation? viewcvs links are fine.
I should have clarified - just pertinent examples, this doesn't have to be
exhaustive. :-)
(Sorry for the reply-replies.)
- Jeff
--
linux.conf.au 2007: Sydney, Australia
> > This is a request to the the GNOME Foundation Board for action/decision
> > regarding this matter.
>
> Thanks Yavor, we will discuss it at our next board meeting.
(One of the reasons I responded so quickly was that I was hoping to avoid
the usual "heard it all before" debate about this topi
> I received today a request for travel sponsorship to GNOME.conf.au.
> Obviously, GNOME.conf.au, being run as a no-money event (where we charge
> no entry, but all the facilities we require are provided for us by
> linux.conf.au).
>
> It seems to me that sponsorship to this event should really
> My linux.conf.au 2007 lead organiser hat is very firmly on for this reply
With my GNOME Foundation hat on: There are *lots* of Foundation members who
I would love to fund to attend linux.conf.au (thus GNOME.conf.au too), as I
believe it is one of the most valuable and influential events in the
> - In the very few cases where the operative systems need to be enumerated,
> we recommend the use of the formula "GNU/Linux (commonly called Linux)",
> that has already been used i.e. in the release notes.
Quim mentioned, but didn't quite emphasise, that in the majority of cases we
*should avo
> Ar Llu, 2006-10-23 am 15:45 +1000, ysgrifennodd Jeff Waugh:
> > where our documentation could be easily branded and changed by
> > distributors, that would be the place to mention specifics -- and those
> > specifics would be trademarks of distributions and opera
> You've mis-spelled "correctly" as commonly and ignored the view of the
> owners of the Linux kernel and the Linux mark. Unfortunate.
> With the name GNU/Linux we try to share the credit with the developers of
> Linux.
Alan was pointing out that you don't have permission to create a tr
> I would have resigned from the board back on September if my colleagues
> would have requested it. I can resign now if you think it's appropriate.
> As I told Dave last week, I will do whatever it's best. I just want to
> defend my candidacy for the job like any other candidate.
Hi Quim,
Give
> On Wed, 2006-11-15 at 11:26 +1300, Glynn Foster wrote:
>
> > I don't want to be a rock star, I just want to help. If more suitable
> > candidates are running, I'm happy to cheer them from the sidelines.
>
> Too late, Glynn, you *are* already a rock star :)
I feel there is a subtle distinctio
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