subject:"\[jira\] \[Commented\] \(SOLR\-6260\) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2"


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14068330#comment-14068330
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


Reasonable people can disagree.  One should not have to face hurtful personal 
attacks when they do.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14068645#comment-14068645
]

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

There is nothing person in anything I wrote. Feel free to pull out what you
think is and I'll correct it.

Reasonable people can disagree, and the same culture that had Lucene locked up
for years in the mid 2000's can lock up Solr here.

We need a couple things:

* To transition to a SolrCloud first world where everything is sensible and not
because of history baggage.
* To encourage and develop new contributors.

Pushing back on this simple issue and issues like it is part of an overall
culture that hurts both those things.

When I joined, I wanted to fix crap like this too. I was slowly beaten down
over time until I just accepted that a lot of our code was crap. I stopped even
trying to fix it. I won't be part of beating that out of a new generation of
committers. This needs to be fixed. The benefits are bigger than you understand
IMO. And the benefits of not doing it, are super minor. Solr needs to worry
about the future, not the past.

Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
---

Key: SOLR-6260
URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
Project: Solr
Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch

DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2
should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what
direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or
UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions

--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14068652#comment-14068652
 ] 

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

If we cannot come to consensus on this issue, I think we should put it to a 
vote.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

2014-07-21 Thread Noble Paul (JIRA)


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14068669#comment-14068669
 ] 

Noble Paul commented on SOLR-6260:
--

We should not hang on to an old name because it was there for some time

+1 to make a name change

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069029#comment-14069029
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


-1

The benefits to this simple class rename are blown way out of proportion by 
fallaciously linking it to real improvements.  Further, if you're worried about 
attracting new committers, fostering a more civil (and less aggressive and 
combative) environment would go a long way.

Although there are multiple minor downsides (countering the minor upside), I'll 
remove my -1 if we can at least implement back compat with existing 
solrconfigs.  It should be trivial.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

2014-07-21 Thread Shalin Shekhar Mangar (JIRA)


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069051#comment-14069051
 ] 

Shalin Shekhar Mangar commented on SOLR-6260:
-

-1 to breaking compatibility in 4.x (but I'm quite sure we weren't debating 
that, were we?)

bq. Further, if you're worried about attracting new committers, fostering a 
more civil (and less aggressive and combative) environment would go a long way.

Big +1 and thank you for putting it so well. This has become a big pain point. 
We're all working towards the same goal of making Solr better, we can surely be 
more courteous to each other.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

2014-07-21 Thread JIRA


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069062#comment-14069062
 ] 

Tomás Fernández Löbbe commented on SOLR-6260:
-

bq. I'll remove my -1 if we can at least implement back compat with existing 
solrconfigs. 
Sure, I can do this
bq. -1 to breaking compatibility in 4.x (but I'm quite sure we weren't debating 
that, were we?)
Yes, I was thinking on doing this change in trunk only. If merged to 4.x it 
should have been in a backward compatible way. 

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069064#comment-14069064
]

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

bq. I'll remove my -1 if we can at least implement back compat with existing
solrconfigs. It should be trivial.

Of course we would handle back compat where it makes sense. That's an absurd
condition.

In any case, if you want to -1 over a vote that shows Solr developers want this
change, be my guest. We will see how long that works out for you.

bq. Further, if you're worried about attracting new committers,

I think the current culture of push back is worse than combating those that
foster the pushback. I plan on continuing to push very hard for change in our
obstructionist culture - one that I've played my part in at times too. It's
necessary. Being aggressive is necessary. I can find a variety of issues that
Tomas has filed that have a quick wet blanket thrown on them. We have done
everything we can to push him away rather than pull him in from where I am
standing.

Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
---

--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069076#comment-14069076
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


bq.  Being aggressive is necessary.

I disagree.  It wasn't necessary in the early days of Lucene/Solr.
Although, I'll partially agree - the culture has changed such that one often 
does now need to be aggressive else those more aggressive will run right over 
you.  It's sad.  It makes me enjoy participating here much less.  But it's only 
currently necessary because the culture has changed to allow it.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Assignee: Mark Miller
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069078#comment-14069078
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


bq. Yes, I was thinking on doing this change in trunk only. If merged to 4.x it 
should have been in a backward compatible way.

I meant implementing back compat in trunk too - making it easy for users to 
upgrade is important (as long as it's not a burden of course.)

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Assignee: Mark Miller
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069079#comment-14069079
]

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

It's currently necessary because the old culture was obstructionist. Same as
the old Lucene culture. It's a great culture for maintenance mode. Lucene
changed that because of a couple aggressive people. The results speak for
themselves. I've watched people spin in circles for years trying another
approach. We have made very little progress on many simple, common sense
issues. I'm ready to make some progress or go home. To let contributors help
us. To get their patches in. To help them work around problems rather than just
put up easy to lay down road blocks.

We have a lot to do. Our current pace, the pace of the past 5+ years, it won't
cut it. It's no good.

Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
---

Key: SOLR-6260
URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
Project: Solr
Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Assignee: Mark Miller
Priority: Minor
Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch

--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069110#comment-14069110
]

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

bq. We're all working towards the same goal of making Solr better ... more
courteous to each other.

We all have a variety of different goals and motivations actually. Let's not
pretend everyone is simply working towards making Solr better. That's a lot of
people and changing motivations to account for.

Where are people not being courteous to each other in this thread? The absence
of lively debate tends to mean one thing: people don't care.

Now Yonik seems to have taken my broader message personally - the message of ,
We tend to push back on everything and not help contributors, especially
promising contributors, get things done. We favor obstructionism because it's
low effort.

But it's not meant for him personally. Everyone has played their part in this.
I'm not quite sure where I called anyone out for any personal behavior. I
called out what I think is happening to Tomas - the wet blanket responses he
has received. I think the behavior of the project must change. That these
issues must get in. And if you think that happens easily, guess again. I can
find a lot of issues that are killed with a comment or two. It takes something
like this to get these issues over the hump - to make an issue out of this. To
cause discussion around this. To move forward.

Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
---

--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069167#comment-14069167
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


bq. It takes something like this to get these issues over the hump - to make an 
issue out of this.

See, I was looking at this issue just based on it's technical merits.  That 
should always be OK.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Assignee: Mark Miller
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069183#comment-14069183
]

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

That was okay. But so is my coming to try and make the issue happen anyway.

When someone with enough merit comes in and only mentions, I'm pretty much
against this, it has a strong chilling effect!

If you had come in with, I have these concerns, but if we do this or this
and/or figure out this, we could probably make this happen, I wouldn't have
felt so much that I have to try and make sure this issue still happens.

I've just seen too many of these issues die summarily with light and easy
pushback. For some crap JIRAs, perhaps that is sensible. Given the history of
Tomas and his recent contributions and the quality of work I have seen and my
own personal history and interest in this change...here we are!

However, I'm not saying you shouldn't have done whatever you want to do. I'm
responding to it. I'm trying to start a tone going forward that will let us
dump single core and non cloud mode and all the baggage that makes the system
not as beautiful as it needs to be. Developers want to work on beautiful, not
ugly. That's our largest issue. Not any internal community communication.

Now when I look at the pace of this happening, we will be done in 5-10 years.
Perhaps. It's not going to cut it. We will be marginalized.

Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
---

--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

2014-07-21 Thread Jack Krupansky (JIRA)


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069198#comment-14069198
 ] 

Jack Krupansky commented on SOLR-6260:
--

I noticed that the SolrCore code does in fact default the update handler class 
to DIH2/SIH if the class attribute is not specified, so maybe the upgrade 
instructions can simply be for users to remove the updateHandler class 
attribute, rather than for them to have to learn yet another internal name.

And I would reiterate my proposal to remove the class attribute from the 
example solrconfig.xml files, for both 5.0 and 4.x.

Either way, the patch should include changes to the Upgrading section of 
CHANGES.txt.

Do those three things and then I'm an easy +1!


 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Assignee: Mark Miller
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069202#comment-14069202
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


bq. I noticed that the SolrCore code does in fact default the update handler 
class to DIH2/SIH if the class attribute is not specified

Then we should probably remove it in the example solrconfigs.  That will also 
lessen the pain next time someone comes up with a better name ;-)

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Assignee: Mark Miller
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14069233#comment-14069233
]

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

bq. That will also lessen the pain next time someone comes up with a better
name

That's an important part of this issue too. We should clearly document that
this is an expert and internal class. We need to own this, and right now it's
in a grey area. What better time to clear up that it's internal and not user
supported and rename it all in one. Take it out of config, document at as
expert/internal.

Unless someone has a burning desire to call it NewUpdateHandler3 in a couple
years, I think a new name will stick for some time. Anytime you name a class
Foo2, I think you can expect someone is going to want to fix it later. Call
it Foo or Bar and you will get less name change demand.

Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
---

--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

2014-07-20 Thread Ramkumar Aiyengar (JIRA)


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067839#comment-14067839
 ] 

Ramkumar Aiyengar commented on SOLR-6260:
-

On a similar vein, SearchHandler should be SolrSearchHandler then?

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067935#comment-14067935
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


 bq. I don't know really what direct means here.

It's right in the class javadoc comment:
{code}
/**
 * codeDirectUpdateHandler2/code implements an UpdateHandler where 
documents are added
 * directly to the main Lucene index as opposed to adding to a separate smaller 
index.
{code}

In general, renames like this can cause more pain than the meager benefits they 
provide.
This would break compatibility for users schemas who are trying to upgrade.

Regarding renaming public APIs in general:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-3830?focusedCommentId=13454299page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel#comment-13454299

Along the lines of collective knowledge, that includes a whole ton of mail 
archives, blogs, books, etc, that refer to this class (or it's shortened name 
DUH2... which actually works to type into the class finder in intellij).


 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067944#comment-14067944
 ] 

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

At some point you have to start cleaning up ugly baggage though. 5x seems a 
great place to clean this one up.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067948#comment-14067948
]

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

bq. the meager benefits

I think if you look at this very narrowly, perhaps it seems meager. But it's
this kind of issue that makes the code unattractive to deal with. Facilitating
the clean up for users that want to fix it will encourage those users to
contribute more. Cleaning up these fairly ugly code warts (I've particularly
been annoyed by this DirectUpdateHandler2) will also help and encourage newer
contributors.

We need to encourage and facilitate cleaning up the crap that we have always
said can't be cleaned up. If we have to compromise on some of it, fine, make it
only in 5x like we did with 4x. But let's not settle for crap because of back
compat. Back compat will sink our ship. It's important to consider, but we
can't let it strangle us. Major releases need to allow freedom to fix at a
minimum.

Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
---

--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067963#comment-14067963
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


bq. We need to encourage and facilitate cleaning up the crap

I agree.  But I disagree that a simple rename will accomplish that.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067964#comment-14067964
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


In fact I'd love to see DUH2 / SolrCoreState  and related code refactored and 
cleaned up.  But back compat is not holding us back... the difficulty there is 
correctness I think.  This has to do with the type of code it is.  For example, 
refactoring  changing a faceting/search method is easy - it's deterministic 
without a lot of threading/concurrency concerns and we have random tests for 
correctness.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067965#comment-14067965
 ] 

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

It's just a part of it. And the pushback against it is the thousand pin pricks 
that have kept so many ugly things around for so long.

When we change big things, the repercussions are never that bad.

When we let newer users that see ugly things change them, we don't discourage 
them and give the impression that it's hard to change ugly stuff and don't even 
bother trying because we will slowly beat you back on each issue.

There is a level of back compat that we support at http that I support 100%. 
Beyond that, we have always been fairly loose really. I've broken an insane 
amount of back compat stuff myself - to get major new features to work or fix 
broken design. A lot of that *in* 3x or 4x, not over a major version. Now we 
have all those advances, and the screams of pain along the way where not heard.

I think, until we are in a better spot code wise, we should favor improvement 
over back compat beyond the http layer. Even in 4x. But good god, for 5x, let 
the flood gates open. It's way too easy to error on stifling the project. We 
need to error way the other way IMO. Until a lot of the baggage is dealt with 
and SolrCloud is first class and in shape, we need to error way the other way. 
If we want to compete as a search engine over the next decade, we need to take 
off the leg weights.

DirectUpdateHandler2 should die. We all know it. Let's let it go.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067973#comment-14067973
]

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:

bq. I've broken an insane amount of back compat stuff myself - to get major new
features to work or fix broken design.

Exactly... back compat is only one factor of many in these decisions.

Looking at this patch specifically, on it's own merits, it doesn't seem worth
it to me.
As far as encouraging new users to make changes, I'd rather encourage them to
make more meaningful changes. If someone wants to refactor DUH2 (or implement
a new one and remove the old one), have at it! I won't stand in the way
because of back compat. Maybe correctness concerns, but not back compat.

Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
---

--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

2014-07-20 Thread JIRA


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067981#comment-14067981
 ] 

Tomás Fernández Löbbe commented on SOLR-6260:
-

bq. It's right in the class javadoc comment:
I see, I missed that. 
Sorry for my ignorance, but does this comment make sense now? Is it possible in 
Solr to add documents to a different index (other than having a separate core) 
or is this comment outdated?

I agree with Mark, cleaning ugly code should be encouraged, and a class called 
“DirectUpdateHandler2” is an ugly name. I someone new to Solr sees this they 
would ask “Why is it called like this? Why is this ‘2’? Is there another number 
‘1’? does it accomplish the same?”, and responding “It’s for historic reasons” 
is a bad response I think. 

bq. Looking at this patch specifically, on it's own merits, it doesn't seem 
worth it to me.

What does that mean? I can clean the patch if needed. As I said, I did  mostly 
a search and replace, maybe there is more to be done. 

bq. As far as encouraging new users to make changes, I'd rather encourage them 
to make more meaningful changes

I find this change as a step forward, that’s why I suggested it. 


 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14067984#comment-14067984
 ] 

Yonik Seeley commented on SOLR-6260:


bq.  Looking at this patch specifically, on it's own merits, it doesn't seem 
worth it to me.
bq. What does that mean?

It means that the disadvantages of this specific rename outweigh the 
advantages.  I was trying to separate this specific rename from lumping it in 
with a broader fallacy of if we can't change this, then we can't make bigger 
changes.

Of course I fear this thread will again demonstrate Sayre's law ;-)

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

[
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14068063#comment-14068063
]

Mark Miller commented on SOLR-6260:
---

I've wanted to fix this since 2008. When can it be fixed, never? In 2028?

There is a history and a pattern of pushing back on stuff like this. All it
does is discourage new contributors and hobble willing contributors.

If we changed, would anything crazy or bad happen? No. If we leave it, it's
just a pattern of screwing the project from a high level under the guise of
small improvements not being worth it.

IMO, this is push back for push backs sake. Forget committing this so that
Tomas can move on and improve the next little thing. Let's tie him up and red
tape and squeeze the life out of him so that he doesn't do anything crazy, like
get a little enthusiasm and momentum on improving our crap load of ugly
technical debt.

Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
---

--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

2014-07-20 Thread Alan Woodward (JIRA)


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14068062#comment-14068062
 ] 

Alan Woodward commented on SOLR-6260:
-

+1 to the rename.  If we're concerned with it breaking schemas, then maybe keep 
DirectUpdateHandler2 in 4x as an empty class that extends SolrUpdateHandler?  
And then nuke it in trunk.

 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2

2014-07-20 Thread Jack Krupansky (JIRA)


[ 
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanelfocusedCommentId=14068068#comment-14068068
 ] 

Jack Krupansky commented on SOLR-6260:
--

Could we at least remove it from the example solrconfig in 5.0? Change the name 
as you see fit, and make it the default for the updateHandler class 
attribute? I mean, it always was kind of a wart to have to specify that kind 
of internal detail externally like that.



 Rename DirectUpdateHandler2
 ---

 Key: SOLR-6260
 URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/SOLR-6260
 Project: Solr
  Issue Type: Improvement
Affects Versions: 5.0
Reporter: Tomás Fernández Löbbe
Priority: Minor
 Attachments: SOLR-6260.patch, SOLR-6260.patch


 DirectUpdateHandler was removed, I think in Solr 4. DirectUpdateHandler2 
 should be renamed, at least remove that 2. I don't know really what 
 direct means here. Maybe it could be renamed to DefaultUpdateHandler, or 
 UpdateHandlerDefaultImpl, or other good suggestions



--
This message was sent by Atlassian JIRA
(v6.2#6252)

-
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@lucene.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@lucene.apache.org

[jira] [Commented] (SOLR-6260) Rename DirectUpdateHandler2