Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-11 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Monday 11 February 2013 11:26:56 Mark Wendt did opine:

> On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 12:11 PM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > On Sunday 10 February 2013 11:55:13 Andy Pugh did opine:
> > Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
> > 
> >> On 10 Feb 2013, at 14:05, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> >> > So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space
> >> > the center races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back
> >> > on the block, pushing in on the outer races, they will
> >> 
> >> Turn a cup shape on the lathe, part off to the desired thickness.
> >> I wouldn't try for exact thickness, in fact I would shim the outer
> >> races and adjust the nip with the nut.
> > 
> > Its feels like both inner and outer races are touching each other when
> > assembled in the direction they were installed.  Both bearings are
> > installed into the block from the nut end, with nothing between either
> > set of races ATM. I could turn them around though, which would mean
> > that spacing the outers would achieve the same effect, and that would
> > then allow the nut to adjust the preload.  In that event, even a 20
> > thou thick spacer would be fine.  If it wasn't for the thin face on
> > the outers when assembled that way, its only about .55mm wide on that
> > side.  But it should work.  So, put one bearing in with the thicker
> > outer edge facing left, a dab of grease to hold a formed piece of 30
> > gage kynar wire stripped, laid in the grease and push the 2nd bearing
> > in to trap the angular and the nut, which has a set-screw for
> > locking, brought up to put some pressure on the inners, sound like
> > that would work just fine.  That wire wire is too thick, but it will
> > cold flow some, so if the nut is snugged up, eventually it should be
> > able for the wire to support the loading for a long time.
> > 
> > Sounds like a winner to me Andy, thanks.
> > 
> > I'll check in later when I've tried it.
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> 
> Or maybe use a Belleville washer?
> 
> Mark
 
Physical size differences between the sides at contact points would seem to 
preclude even considering that.

What I did was to install the bearings such that pressure from the shaft 
nut would preload them if the outer races were prevented from touching, in 
this case by a single turn of 20 gage copper wire formed into a loop and 
placed between the wider, now in the center, faces of the outer races.  The 
end cap is then installed and brought to so as to crush the wire between 
the two outer races, leaving a barely visible gap between the bearing block 
and the cap, 5 thou or thereabouts, then the shaft nut installed and 
brought up snug on those fine threads, and preloaded and additional quarter 
of a turn.  There is a black iron spacer on the shaft on each side of the 
bearing pair, and an oil seal, on in the back face of the block, and one in 
the bearing cap. It feels like the bearings are probably stretching the 
outer races a small amount, but the bearing block restrains them from 
growing by more than .0005" as its a very snug fit, taking considerable 
care to walk them out of the housing, and best done by removing the cap and 
turning the screw in the hard to move nut, pushing them out as a package.

If my preload pressure winds up destroying these bearings, I would imagine 
that an angled tapered roller, with half again as many rollers could 
probably be refitted.

The measured end play is now about 0.0017", but since the bearings are now 
preloaded to several hundred lbs, I have no clue where the rest of it is. 
The bearing block itself isn't moving that my 30-0-30 dial indicator can 
see.

At the top of the QC tool post, its a red one above 0.004, with that growth 
being the carriage, now tail heavy with the triple stack X motor hanging 
off the back about 3.5" to its front face, causing the V way up front to 
rise till the adjuster bars are in solid contact with the bottom face of 
the way.

Those adjustments on the rear of the carriage are easily done although 
inconvenient to get to, but on the front, doing it right will require the 
apron (its new, big block of ALU) to be removed, and the allen wrench 
ground down another 1/8" shorter to gain access to those cap screws over 
the screw as it goes by. I suspect the cap screw on the right needs pulled 
up another 2 or 3 degrees, its leaving a noticeably thicker layer of vactra 
on the way faces back there.

Overall, its doing a much better job than before.  I need to reset the 
HOME_OFFSET in the [AXIS0] block to make it cut about half a thou smaller, 
and that will then be spot on.

But because I am calibrating HOME against the tip of the tool, and I now 
have the HOME_SEQUENCE setup, I do a lot of HOME_ALL's, on purpose, so if I 
could do away with that (unprintable) requester that pops up when you do it 
again, it would be a lot less mouse work.

BTW, for whoever on IRC said the keyboard combo to home was ctl+h, thats 
wrong, its cntl+home. :)

F

Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-11 Thread Mark Wendt 
On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 12:11 PM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> On Sunday 10 February 2013 11:55:13 Andy Pugh did opine:
> Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
>
>> On 10 Feb 2013, at 14:05, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>> > So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space the
>> > center races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back on the
>> > block, pushing in on the outer races, they will
>>
>> Turn a cup shape on the lathe, part off to the desired thickness.
>> I wouldn't try for exact thickness, in fact I would shim the outer races
>> and adjust the nip with the nut.
>
> Its feels like both inner and outer races are touching each other when
> assembled in the direction they were installed.  Both bearings are
> installed into the block from the nut end, with nothing between either set
> of races ATM. I could turn them around though, which would mean that
> spacing the outers would achieve the same effect, and that would then allow
> the nut to adjust the preload.  In that event, even a 20 thou thick spacer
> would be fine.  If it wasn't for the thin face on the outers when assembled
> that way, its only about .55mm wide on that side.  But it should work.  So,
> put one bearing in with the thicker outer edge facing left, a dab of grease
> to hold a formed piece of 30 gage kynar wire stripped, laid in the grease
> and push the 2nd bearing in to trap the angular and the nut, which has a
> set-screw for locking, brought up to put some pressure on the inners, sound
> like that would work just fine.  That wire wire is too thick, but it will
> cold flow some, so if the nut is snugged up, eventually it should be able
> for the wire to support the loading for a long time.
>
> Sounds like a winner to me Andy, thanks.
>
> I'll check in later when I've tried it.
>
> Cheers, Gene

Or maybe use a Belleville washer?

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Sunday 10 February 2013 18:42:48 John Thornton did opine:

> McMaster Carr does not have a minimum order... I've ordered $2 parts
> from them, you still pay reasonable shipping on anything you order.
> 
> John

Thats better, thanks John.  Now to remember it.  In any event, Andy gave me 
a clue that turned out to be the fix.  Turn the bearings around, and then 
shim between the outer races does the whole thing, so I am down to a decent 
backlash setting now.  I also filled them with grease before re-assembly.  
Wouldn't want to burn them up as I can now go 60 ipm for rapids now.

Thanks John.

> On 2/10/2013 8:05 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Sunday 10 February 2013 08:34:10 Mark Wendt did opine:
> > Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
> > 
> >> On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Steve Blackmore 
> > 
> > wrote:
>  That may work for most 'Murkan made machines, but those with the
>  made overseas in Asia tend to have a pretty lousy fit for the
>  standard grease gun fitting.
> >>> 
> >>> Hi Mark - oil nipple heads often aren't the same size and shape as
> >>> grease nipples. Myford's were fitted with oil nipples, not grease
> >>> nipples. I still have the original Wanner oil gun off one. It
> >>> doesn't clip on the nipple. The end is simply a recess that you
> >>> push against the nipple and pump.
> >>> 
> >>> There's a link on this page that shows oil nipples (and the
> >>> expensive pump ;)
> >>> 
> >>> http://www.lathespares.co.uk/oil-lubrication-c-31/wanner-oil-gun-for
> >>> -t he-myford-lathe-new-p-646
> >>> 
> >>> The round head type nipple generally has a smaller diameter head
> >>> than a grease nipple with the same thread.
> >>> 
> >>> Plenty of Myford spindles were damaged though by people forcing
> >>> grease into them using those grease guns with an adjustable
> >>> clamping nozzle. It often forced the wick (hidden in the hole) into
> >>> the bearing..
> >>> 
> >>> Steve Blackmore
> >> 
> >> Steve,
> >> 
> >> Yah, I'd heard about some of the horror stories where folks had
> >> forced grease into an oil fitting.  That was why I was concerned for
> >> Gene when he mentioned his grease gun wouldn't fit the zerk.  A
> >> number of guys on Practical Machinist had bought machines where the
> >> previous owner had forced grease into an oil fitting, and left a
> >> mess.
> >> 
> >> Gene, check the link for the image of the two type oil fittings at
> >> the bottom of Steve's link.  Does your zerk look like either of
> >> those?
> >> 
> >> Mark
> > 
> > The photo isn't as clear as it could be.  However folks, we aren't
> > talking about a high speed spindle.  This is a ball nut on a 16x5mm
> > screw, that I was able to get 60 ipm rapids out of last night with a
> > 2/1 geardown so the motor is charging right along, thinking I was
> > home free, but the backlash setting I needed was excessive IMO,
> > someplace in the .0045" to .0048" range, which seemed awful sloppy
> > for a ball screw that was supposedly a C7 grade.  Turns out there is
> > zero preload on the angular ball bearings in the drive end bearing
> > block regardless of the torque applied to the tensioning nut.
> > 
> > So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space the
> > center races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back on the
> > block, pushing in on the outer races, they will then be preloaded
> > about a thou. Or is that too much crush?  .1mm is the thinest I can
> > get, but that will only take up about 60% of the end play which as
> > is, looks to be as above, measured on either end of the screw.
> > 
> > Besides, the grease fitting has been replaced with a Murican version
> > (finding that turned into an all afternoon job Thursday) and the nut
> > has been greased enough to push a small amount past the felt (or
> > whatever, its white, wipers at each end of the nut.  Since its maxed
> > at maybe 300 rpm, std lithium grease will make it outlive me.
> > 
> > It turns out, in my tour of the place looking for suitable shim
> > material, that the alu slider on a 3.5" floppy disk is about that
> > thickness.  But cutting a shim out of that would probably be an EDM
> > job to do it neat enough without burrs on the edges.  Unless somebody
> > else has an idea.
> > 
> > McMaster-Carr has them in either 316 or 18-8 SS, straddling a $10 bill
> > but whats their minimum order?  More than a tenner IIRC.
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene

Cheers, Gene
-- 
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My web page:  is up!
My views 

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One to hold the giraffe and one to fill the bathtub with brightly colored
power tools.
I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting 
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Sunday 10 February 2013 18:31:55 andy pugh did opine:

> On 10 February 2013 17:11, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> >Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
> 
> Incidentally, this bugs me.

Sorry Andy.  It's a pre-emptive strike as I am on a couple lists that come 
through yahoo's servers, and at one time yahoo was trying to claim 
copyright on everything that passes through their servers regardless of who 
wrote it.  To say that I don't trust yahoo is an understatement.  I can't 
find it in their TOS now, but there's a ton of legaleze in it that is 
written expressly to obfuscate the issue.

I haven't figured out a way to make it selectively applied in this old 
kmail.  I'll try to remember to nuke it for the LCNC list.

Cheers, Gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
My web page:  is up!
My views 

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Sunday 10 February 2013 17:20:45 Andy Pugh did opine:
Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

> On 10 Feb 2013, at 14:05, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space the
> > center races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back on the
> > block, pushing in on the outer races, they will
> 
> Turn a cup shape on the lathe, part off to the desired thickness.
> I wouldn't try for exact thickness, in fact I would shim the outer races
> and adjust the nip with the nut.

Since the lathe was apart, I first tried a loop of 30 gage kynar wrapping 
wire, stripped.  But that apparently disappeared into the bevels on the 
outer edge of the races.  So I jumped to a piece of 20 gage, which when 
assembled & the end cap torqued well down, left a 6 or 7 thou gap between 
the block and the end cap.

Then, drawing fairly snug on the nut, I was able to get the end slop down 
to about 0.0017".  Still about 0.0036" at the toolpost because of its heavy 
back tail tends to make it climb the front V-way, but thats 10x better than 
it was two weeks ago.

Chucking up a hunk of 5/8" cold roll rod, I zeroed the lathe using the pcb 
faced gage block I'd made, I fired off some gcode to make a 209 nipple for 
one of my BP rifles.  Off size, my code was junk, fixed that, teaching me 
how to write better code, and 3 cycles later I had a perfect part that was 
about a thou over sized on the outside.  More to do on it of course, but 
that is certainly close enough for my BP rifle.  The thread isn't cut yet, 
thats a separate operation anyway.

That code will also need work as I wasn't aware that the x drive screw had 
gotten loose from its anchor in the cross-feed bearing, so I had to cut 
that open & tighten that up again.  That is the joint using the difference 
in the threads tpi to tighten a tapered joint.  Hopefully it will stay 
tight this time.

I also set some soft limits to keep from running out of screws.  So I'm 
getting there. :)

Overall, I may yet dress this thing up as a silk purse, hiding everything 
but the blue paint on this sows ear. :)

Cheers, Gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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My web page:  is up!
My views 

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread John Thornton 
McMaster Carr does not have a minimum order... I've ordered $2 parts 
from them, you still pay reasonable shipping on anything you order.

John

On 2/10/2013 8:05 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Sunday 10 February 2013 08:34:10 Mark Wendt did opine:
> Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
>
>> On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Steve Blackmore 
> wrote:
 That may work for most 'Murkan made machines, but those with the made
 overseas in Asia tend to have a pretty lousy fit for the standard
 grease gun fitting.

>>> Hi Mark - oil nipple heads often aren't the same size and shape as
>>> grease nipples. Myford's were fitted with oil nipples, not grease
>>> nipples. I still have the original Wanner oil gun off one. It doesn't
>>> clip on the nipple. The end is simply a recess that you push against
>>> the nipple and pump.
>>>
>>> There's a link on this page that shows oil nipples (and the expensive
>>> pump ;)
>>>
>>> http://www.lathespares.co.uk/oil-lubrication-c-31/wanner-oil-gun-for-t
>>> he-myford-lathe-new-p-646
>>>
>>> The round head type nipple generally has a smaller diameter head than
>>> a grease nipple with the same thread.
>>>
>>> Plenty of Myford spindles were damaged though by people forcing grease
>>> into them using those grease guns with an adjustable clamping nozzle.
>>> It often forced the wick (hidden in the hole) into the bearing..
>>>
>>> Steve Blackmore
>> Steve,
>>
>> Yah, I'd heard about some of the horror stories where folks had forced
>> grease into an oil fitting.  That was why I was concerned for Gene
>> when he mentioned his grease gun wouldn't fit the zerk.  A number of
>> guys on Practical Machinist had bought machines where the previous
>> owner had forced grease into an oil fitting, and left a mess.
>>
>> Gene, check the link for the image of the two type oil fittings at the
>> bottom of Steve's link.  Does your zerk look like either of those?
>>
>> Mark
>>
> The photo isn't as clear as it could be.  However folks, we aren't talking
> about a high speed spindle.  This is a ball nut on a 16x5mm screw, that I
> was able to get 60 ipm rapids out of last night with a 2/1 geardown so the
> motor is charging right along, thinking I was home free, but the backlash
> setting I needed was excessive IMO, someplace in the .0045" to .0048"
> range, which seemed awful sloppy for a ball screw that was supposedly a C7
> grade.  Turns out there is zero preload on the angular ball bearings in the
> drive end bearing block regardless of the torque applied to the tensioning
> nut.
>
> So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space the center
> races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back on the block,
> pushing in on the outer races, they will then be preloaded about a thou.
> Or is that too much crush?  .1mm is the thinest I can get, but that will
> only take up about 60% of the end play which as is, looks to be as above,
> measured on either end of the screw.
>
> Besides, the grease fitting has been replaced with a Murican version
> (finding that turned into an all afternoon job Thursday) and the nut has
> been greased enough to push a small amount past the felt (or whatever, its
> white, wipers at each end of the nut.  Since its maxed at maybe 300 rpm,
> std lithium grease will make it outlive me.
>
> It turns out, in my tour of the place looking for suitable shim material,
> that the alu slider on a 3.5" floppy disk is about that thickness.  But
> cutting a shim out of that would probably be an EDM job to do it neat
> enough without burrs on the edges.  Unless somebody else has an idea.
>
> McMaster-Carr has them in either 316 or 18-8 SS, straddling a $10 bill but
> whats their minimum order?  More than a tenner IIRC.
>
> Cheers, Gene


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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread andy pugh 
On 10 February 2013 17:11, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

Incidentally, this bugs me.

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Sunday 10 February 2013 11:55:13 Andy Pugh did opine:
Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

> On 10 Feb 2013, at 14:05, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space the
> > center races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back on the
> > block, pushing in on the outer races, they will
> 
> Turn a cup shape on the lathe, part off to the desired thickness.
> I wouldn't try for exact thickness, in fact I would shim the outer races
> and adjust the nip with the nut.

Its feels like both inner and outer races are touching each other when 
assembled in the direction they were installed.  Both bearings are 
installed into the block from the nut end, with nothing between either set 
of races ATM. I could turn them around though, which would mean that 
spacing the outers would achieve the same effect, and that would then allow 
the nut to adjust the preload.  In that event, even a 20 thou thick spacer 
would be fine.  If it wasn't for the thin face on the outers when assembled 
that way, its only about .55mm wide on that side.  But it should work.  So, 
put one bearing in with the thicker outer edge facing left, a dab of grease 
to hold a formed piece of 30 gage kynar wire stripped, laid in the grease 
and push the 2nd bearing in to trap the angular and the nut, which has a 
set-screw for locking, brought up to put some pressure on the inners, sound 
like that would work just fine.  That wire wire is too thick, but it will 
cold flow some, so if the nut is snugged up, eventually it should be able 
for the wire to support the loading for a long time.

Sounds like a winner to me Andy, thanks.

I'll check in later when I've tried it.

Cheers, Gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
My web page:  is up!
My views 

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I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting 
harder and harder to find any...

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread Andy Pugh 


On 10 Feb 2013, at 14:05, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space the center 
> races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back on the block, 
> pushing in on the outer races, they will 

Turn a cup shape on the lathe, part off to the desired thickness. 
I wouldn't try for exact thickness, in fact I would shim the outer races and 
adjust the nip with the nut. 
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Sunday 10 February 2013 09:56:28 Dave did opine:
Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

> On 2/10/2013 9:05 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> > On Sunday 10 February 2013 08:34:10 Mark Wendt did opine:
> > Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
> > 
> >> On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Steve Blackmore
> > 
> > wrote:
>  That may work for most 'Murkan made machines, but those with the
>  made overseas in Asia tend to have a pretty lousy fit for the
>  standard grease gun fitting.
> >>> 
> >>> Hi Mark - oil nipple heads often aren't the same size and shape as
> >>> grease nipples. Myford's were fitted with oil nipples, not grease
> >>> nipples. I still have the original Wanner oil gun off one. It
> >>> doesn't clip on the nipple. The end is simply a recess that you
> >>> push against the nipple and pump.
> >>> 
> >>> There's a link on this page that shows oil nipples (and the
> >>> expensive pump ;)
> >>> 
> >>> http://www.lathespares.co.uk/oil-lubrication-c-31/wanner-oil-gun-for
> >>> -t he-myford-lathe-new-p-646
> >>> 
> >>> The round head type nipple generally has a smaller diameter head
> >>> than a grease nipple with the same thread.
> >>> 
> >>> Plenty of Myford spindles were damaged though by people forcing
> >>> grease into them using those grease guns with an adjustable
> >>> clamping nozzle. It often forced the wick (hidden in the hole) into
> >>> the bearing..
> >>> 
> >>> Steve Blackmore
> >> 
> >> Steve,
> >> 
> >> Yah, I'd heard about some of the horror stories where folks had
> >> forced grease into an oil fitting.  That was why I was concerned for
> >> Gene when he mentioned his grease gun wouldn't fit the zerk.  A
> >> number of guys on Practical Machinist had bought machines where the
> >> previous owner had forced grease into an oil fitting, and left a
> >> mess.
> >> 
> >> Gene, check the link for the image of the two type oil fittings at
> >> the bottom of Steve's link.  Does your zerk look like either of
> >> those?
> >> 
> >> Mark
> > 
> > The photo isn't as clear as it could be.  However folks, we aren't
> > talking about a high speed spindle.  This is a ball nut on a 16x5mm
> > screw, that I was able to get 60 ipm rapids out of last night with a
> > 2/1 geardown so the motor is charging right along, thinking I was
> > home free, but the backlash setting I needed was excessive IMO,
> > someplace in the .0045" to .0048" range, which seemed awful sloppy
> > for a ball screw that was supposedly a C7 grade.  Turns out there is
> > zero preload on the angular ball bearings in the drive end bearing
> > block regardless of the torque applied to the tensioning nut.
> > 
> > So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space the
> > center races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back on the
> > block, pushing in on the outer races, they will then be preloaded
> > about a thou. Or is that too much crush?  .1mm is the thinest I can
> > get, but that will only take up about 60% of the end play which as
> > is, looks to be as above, measured on either end of the screw.
> > 
> > Besides, the grease fitting has been replaced with a Murican version
> > (finding that turned into an all afternoon job Thursday) and the nut
> > has been greased enough to push a small amount past the felt (or
> > whatever, its white, wipers at each end of the nut.  Since its maxed
> > at maybe 300 rpm, std lithium grease will make it outlive me.
> > 
> > It turns out, in my tour of the place looking for suitable shim
> > material, that the alu slider on a 3.5" floppy disk is about that
> > thickness.  But cutting a shim out of that would probably be an EDM
> > job to do it neat enough without burrs on the edges.  Unless somebody
> > else has an idea.
> > 
> > McMaster-Carr has them in either 316 or 18-8 SS, straddling a $10 bill
> > but whats their minimum order?  More than a tenner IIRC.
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> 
> I don't know what Gene's fittings looked like, but if you look at this
> page, the top brass fitting looks somewhat like a conventional zerk
> fitting, but to me, the nipple looks a little long.
> 
> http://factory.dhgate.com/other-auto-parts/10-1-straight-grease-zerk/gre
> ase-fitting-p43044204.html
> 
> Scroll down and you will see some straight fittings that are truly
> straight on the sides of the nipple.   I have no idea why a straight
> grease fitting would be a good idea, but I've seen
> fitting such as these on Chinese hydraulic jacks and some other Chinese
> equipment.  Apparently you hold a grease gun against the fitting??  But
> those do not work at all with a conventional grease gun.
> 
> http://factory.dhgate.com/other-auto-parts/10-1-straight-grease-zerk/gre
> ase-fitting-p43044204.html
> 
> I think this company should hire a more competent translator.
> 
> Dave

Yeah, there's some real NSFW's there.  Anyway:

Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread Dave 
On 2/10/2013 9:05 AM, Gene Heskett wrote:
> On Sunday 10 February 2013 08:34:10 Mark Wendt did opine:
> Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
>
>
>> On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Steve Blackmore
>>  
> wrote:
>
 That may work for most 'Murkan made machines, but those with the made
 overseas in Asia tend to have a pretty lousy fit for the standard
 grease gun fitting.

  
>>> Hi Mark - oil nipple heads often aren't the same size and shape as
>>> grease nipples. Myford's were fitted with oil nipples, not grease
>>> nipples. I still have the original Wanner oil gun off one. It doesn't
>>> clip on the nipple. The end is simply a recess that you push against
>>> the nipple and pump.
>>>
>>> There's a link on this page that shows oil nipples (and the expensive
>>> pump ;)
>>>
>>> http://www.lathespares.co.uk/oil-lubrication-c-31/wanner-oil-gun-for-t
>>> he-myford-lathe-new-p-646
>>>
>>> The round head type nipple generally has a smaller diameter head than
>>> a grease nipple with the same thread.
>>>
>>> Plenty of Myford spindles were damaged though by people forcing grease
>>> into them using those grease guns with an adjustable clamping nozzle.
>>> It often forced the wick (hidden in the hole) into the bearing..
>>>
>>> Steve Blackmore
>>>
>> Steve,
>>
>> Yah, I'd heard about some of the horror stories where folks had forced
>> grease into an oil fitting.  That was why I was concerned for Gene
>> when he mentioned his grease gun wouldn't fit the zerk.  A number of
>> guys on Practical Machinist had bought machines where the previous
>> owner had forced grease into an oil fitting, and left a mess.
>>
>> Gene, check the link for the image of the two type oil fittings at the
>> bottom of Steve's link.  Does your zerk look like either of those?
>>
>> Mark
>>
>>  
> The photo isn't as clear as it could be.  However folks, we aren't talking
> about a high speed spindle.  This is a ball nut on a 16x5mm screw, that I
> was able to get 60 ipm rapids out of last night with a 2/1 geardown so the
> motor is charging right along, thinking I was home free, but the backlash
> setting I needed was excessive IMO, someplace in the .0045" to .0048"
> range, which seemed awful sloppy for a ball screw that was supposedly a C7
> grade.  Turns out there is zero preload on the angular ball bearings in the
> drive end bearing block regardless of the torque applied to the tensioning
> nut.
>
> So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space the center
> races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back on the block,
> pushing in on the outer races, they will then be preloaded about a thou.
> Or is that too much crush?  .1mm is the thinest I can get, but that will
> only take up about 60% of the end play which as is, looks to be as above,
> measured on either end of the screw.
>
> Besides, the grease fitting has been replaced with a Murican version
> (finding that turned into an all afternoon job Thursday) and the nut has
> been greased enough to push a small amount past the felt (or whatever, its
> white, wipers at each end of the nut.  Since its maxed at maybe 300 rpm,
> std lithium grease will make it outlive me.
>
> It turns out, in my tour of the place looking for suitable shim material,
> that the alu slider on a 3.5" floppy disk is about that thickness.  But
> cutting a shim out of that would probably be an EDM job to do it neat
> enough without burrs on the edges.  Unless somebody else has an idea.
>
> McMaster-Carr has them in either 316 or 18-8 SS, straddling a $10 bill but
> whats their minimum order?  More than a tenner IIRC.
>
> Cheers, Gene
>

I don't know what Gene's fittings looked like, but if you look at this 
page, the top brass fitting looks somewhat like a conventional zerk 
fitting, but to me, the nipple looks a little long.

http://factory.dhgate.com/other-auto-parts/10-1-straight-grease-zerk/grease-fitting-p43044204.html

Scroll down and you will see some straight fittings that are truly 
straight on the sides of the nipple.   I have no idea why a straight 
grease fitting would be a good idea, but I've seen
fitting such as these on Chinese hydraulic jacks and some other Chinese 
equipment.  Apparently you hold a grease gun against the fitting??  But 
those do not work at all with a conventional grease gun.

http://factory.dhgate.com/other-auto-parts/10-1-straight-grease-zerk/grease-fitting-p43044204.html

I think this company should hire a more competent translator.

Dave

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread John Stewart 
Mark;

On 2013-02-10, at 7:45 AM, Mark Wendt wrote:
> 
> Yah, I'd heard about some of the horror stories where folks had forced
> grease into an oil fitting.  That was why I was concerned for Gene
> when he mentioned his grease gun wouldn't fit the zerk.  A number of
> guys on Practical Machinist had bought machines where the previous
> owner had forced grease into an oil fitting, and left a mess.

Hey, I did this. My small lathe (Emco Compact-8) has grease fittings, and the 
instruction manual says where to grease and/or oil.

My larger British lathe came pre-greased, in the same areas that the Compact-8 
uses grease, so it seemed fairly natural.

Have been (slowly) flushing the grease out of the system; it is well oiled now. 
Only one fitting can not be greased; I think I'll have to take the apron off 
and really see what's happening. (the fitting is right beside the threading 
lever, and it's either a tapped hole for a stop that someone put a fitting on 
by mistake/mischief, or it's blocked. Not a lot of threading done on the lathe)

My oil gun is a "jet" lever grease gun, bottom cut off and plugged; so where 
the spring plunger is is blanked off. To use it I invert the gun, so grease 
goes into the lever mechanism and gets squirted in.

The quick change gearbox leaks oil, so lots of maintenance on the list for this 
lathe; I'd like the gearbox to hold oil, and I'd like to just clean up the 
apron.

John A. Stewart.
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Sunday 10 February 2013 08:34:10 Mark Wendt did opine:
Message additions Copyright Sunday 10 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

> On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Steve Blackmore  
wrote:
> >>That may work for most 'Murkan made machines, but those with the made
> >>overseas in Asia tend to have a pretty lousy fit for the standard
> >>grease gun fitting.
> >>
> > Hi Mark - oil nipple heads often aren't the same size and shape as
> > grease nipples. Myford's were fitted with oil nipples, not grease
> > nipples. I still have the original Wanner oil gun off one. It doesn't
> > clip on the nipple. The end is simply a recess that you push against
> > the nipple and pump.
> > 
> > There's a link on this page that shows oil nipples (and the expensive
> > pump ;)
> > 
> > http://www.lathespares.co.uk/oil-lubrication-c-31/wanner-oil-gun-for-t
> > he-myford-lathe-new-p-646
> > 
> > The round head type nipple generally has a smaller diameter head than
> > a grease nipple with the same thread.
> > 
> > Plenty of Myford spindles were damaged though by people forcing grease
> > into them using those grease guns with an adjustable clamping nozzle.
> > It often forced the wick (hidden in the hole) into the bearing..
> > 
> > Steve Blackmore
> 
> Steve,
> 
> Yah, I'd heard about some of the horror stories where folks had forced
> grease into an oil fitting.  That was why I was concerned for Gene
> when he mentioned his grease gun wouldn't fit the zerk.  A number of
> guys on Practical Machinist had bought machines where the previous
> owner had forced grease into an oil fitting, and left a mess.
> 
> Gene, check the link for the image of the two type oil fittings at the
> bottom of Steve's link.  Does your zerk look like either of those?
> 
> Mark
> 
The photo isn't as clear as it could be.  However folks, we aren't talking 
about a high speed spindle.  This is a ball nut on a 16x5mm screw, that I 
was able to get 60 ipm rapids out of last night with a 2/1 geardown so the 
motor is charging right along, thinking I was home free, but the backlash 
setting I needed was excessive IMO, someplace in the .0045" to .0048" 
range, which seemed awful sloppy for a ball screw that was supposedly a C7 
grade.  Turns out there is zero preload on the angular ball bearings in the 
drive end bearing block regardless of the torque applied to the tensioning 
nut.

So, I need a 12mm bore, 18mm OD, .2mm thick shim washer to space the center 
races apart far enough that when I put the end cap back on the block, 
pushing in on the outer races, they will then be preloaded about a thou.  
Or is that too much crush?  .1mm is the thinest I can get, but that will 
only take up about 60% of the end play which as is, looks to be as above, 
measured on either end of the screw.

Besides, the grease fitting has been replaced with a Murican version 
(finding that turned into an all afternoon job Thursday) and the nut has 
been greased enough to push a small amount past the felt (or whatever, its 
white, wipers at each end of the nut.  Since its maxed at maybe 300 rpm, 
std lithium grease will make it outlive me.

It turns out, in my tour of the place looking for suitable shim material, 
that the alu slider on a 3.5" floppy disk is about that thickness.  But 
cutting a shim out of that would probably be an EDM job to do it neat 
enough without burrs on the edges.  Unless somebody else has an idea.

McMaster-Carr has them in either 316 or 18-8 SS, straddling a $10 bill but 
whats their minimum order?  More than a tenner IIRC.

Cheers, Gene
-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-10 Thread Mark Wendt 
On Sat, Feb 9, 2013 at 7:15 PM, Steve Blackmore  wrote:
>>That may work for most 'Murkan made machines, but those with the made
>>overseas in Asia tend to have a pretty lousy fit for the standard
>>grease gun fitting.
>
> Hi Mark - oil nipple heads often aren't the same size and shape as
> grease nipples. Myford's were fitted with oil nipples, not grease
> nipples. I still have the original Wanner oil gun off one. It doesn't
> clip on the nipple. The end is simply a recess that you push against the
> nipple and pump.
>
> There's a link on this page that shows oil nipples (and the expensive
> pump ;)
>
> http://www.lathespares.co.uk/oil-lubrication-c-31/wanner-oil-gun-for-the-myford-lathe-new-p-646
>
> The round head type nipple generally has a smaller diameter head than a
> grease nipple with the same thread.
>
> Plenty of Myford spindles were damaged though by people forcing grease
> into them using those grease guns with an adjustable clamping nozzle. It
> often forced the wick (hidden in the hole) into the bearing..
>
> Steve Blackmore

Steve,

Yah, I'd heard about some of the horror stories where folks had forced
grease into an oil fitting.  That was why I was concerned for Gene
when he mentioned his grease gun wouldn't fit the zerk.  A number of
guys on Practical Machinist had bought machines where the previous
owner had forced grease into an oil fitting, and left a mess.

Gene, check the link for the image of the two type oil fittings at the
bottom of Steve's link.  Does your zerk look like either of those?

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-09 Thread Steve Blackmore 
On Sat, 9 Feb 2013 07:07:17 -0500, you wrote:

>On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 12:24 PM, Jon Elson  wrote:
>> Hmmm, I've converted two grease guns to use on Bridgeports for oiling.
>> They seemed to work quite well, using the standard grease fitting that came
>> with the gun on the fittings on the mill.  (I've now converted to a "Fly
>> Horse"
>> Chinese one-shot system, so don't use it anymore.)
>>
>> Jon
>
>Jon,
>
>That may work for most 'Murkan made machines, but those with the made
>overseas in Asia tend to have a pretty lousy fit for the standard
>grease gun fitting.

Hi Mark - oil nipple heads often aren't the same size and shape as
grease nipples. Myford's were fitted with oil nipples, not grease
nipples. I still have the original Wanner oil gun off one. It doesn't
clip on the nipple. The end is simply a recess that you push against the
nipple and pump.  

There's a link on this page that shows oil nipples (and the expensive
pump ;)

http://www.lathespares.co.uk/oil-lubrication-c-31/wanner-oil-gun-for-the-myford-lathe-new-p-646

The round head type nipple generally has a smaller diameter head than a
grease nipple with the same thread.

Plenty of Myford spindles were damaged though by people forcing grease
into them using those grease guns with an adjustable clamping nozzle. It
often forced the wick (hidden in the hole) into the bearing..

Steve Blackmore
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-09 Thread Mark Wendt 
On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 12:24 PM, Jon Elson  wrote:
> Hmmm, I've converted two grease guns to use on Bridgeports for oiling.
> They seemed to work quite well, using the standard grease fitting that came
> with the gun on the fittings on the mill.  (I've now converted to a "Fly
> Horse"
> Chinese one-shot system, so don't use it anymore.)
>
> Jon

Jon,

That may work for most 'Murkan made machines, but those with the made
overseas in Asia tend to have a pretty lousy fit for the standard
grease gun fitting.

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Friday 08 February 2013 19:55:33 andy pugh did opine:
Message additions Copyright Friday 08 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

> On 8 February 2013 20:49, dave  wrote:
> > http://www.malonespecialtyinc.com/Identifying_Threads.html
> 
> I also have, for your delight and delectation:
> http://www.bodgesoc.org/thread_dia_pitch.html
> 
> (You can click the column headers to sort differently)
> 
> The list is less complete than I would like, one day I will add the
> missing small metric and pipe threads.
Well, after 2 trips to town because the first one made a hit, but the one 
he handed me & said Merry Christmas turned out to be the only 1/4-28 in a 
$30 box of supposedly all metric fittings.  Then I spied another nominally 
10 pack that looked promising so I bought that one.

Brought it home, dismounted the nut long enough to get swinging room to 
install a 90 degree out of that kit, then spent an hour re-arranging the 
place looking for my mini grease gun before I remembered I had binned it 
last summer for excessive leakage, so back to town again for a grease gun.  
Got that, a better one that holds the pressure off the grease with a 
friction latch, so maybe this one won't always be empty when I reach for 
it.  Greased it up, draped a paper towel over the screw and homed it to my 
gage, checked & saw the x was off about .3", fixed that in the .ini file, 
restarted, rehomed and fired off a routine that does the first 3 cuts for a 
BP #209 nipple.  About 4 to 9 thou undersized, but before I try to get that 
any closer, I need to reset the routine to do a final 2 or 3 passes at each 
exact size, at which point I can fine tune the home offset to remove the 
last of that error.

My GMC didn't get to cool off from about 11AM-ish till around 16:30.  I had 
to remove some of the 3.2 thou backlash comp as the homing didn't work, 
throwing errors because the backlash move was opening contact.

In the process of this conversion I found a lot more of my 'rubber 
toolpost' syndrome, so I believe I can make 2 to 4x heavier cuts than 
before.  The left front carriage adjuster is all the way out, and that bolt 
well snugged up, the left front corner of the carriage was lifting, and I 
found the rear end was also bouncing some, so some takeup was done there 
too.

So its still a sows ear, but a cleaner shaved version now. :)

Thanks for the help on the grease fitting Guy's, it helped to clarify what 
I really needed to do.

Cheers, Gene
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread andy pugh 
On 8 February 2013 20:49, dave  wrote:

> http://www.malonespecialtyinc.com/Identifying_Threads.html

I also have, for your delight and delectation:
http://www.bodgesoc.org/thread_dia_pitch.html

(You can click the column headers to sort differently)

The list is less complete than I would like, one day I will add the
missing small metric and pipe threads.

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Dave 
I've been through this before a few times.  I have a couple of hydraulic 
floor jacks that were made in China that have non standard zerk fitting 
on them.

The Chinese zerk is too small for a standard SAE gun chuck to grip 
properly.  The sides of the fittings are close to being straight.

I went to Tractor supply and bought their metric assortment pack of zerk 
fitting and none of them fit into the tapped hole.

I gave up and tapped the holes to fit a standard US 1/4-28 fitting.

I think those particular zerk fitting may be a totally non standard 
Chinese invention.

I've never seen a gun in the US that can deal with them.

Dave



On 2/8/2013 1:49 PM, dave wrote:
> On Fri, 2013-02-08 at 10:36 -0800, dave wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 2013-02-08 at 17:44 +0100, Peter Blodow wrote:
>>  
>>> Gene,
>>> I, too, had to guess what a zerk might be. It's not im my dictionary.
>>> Are you aware that zerks according to DIN and ISO (6 and 8 mm) have
>>> conic 1 mm threads, just like whitworth pipe threads, and this way they
>>> are supposed to be oil pressure proof after tightening.
>>>
>>> Peter
>>>
>>> Am 08.02.2013 16:16, schrieb Gene Heskett:
>>>
 On Friday 08 February 2013 10:11:20 andy pugh did opine:
 Message additions Copyright Friday 08 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

  
> On 8 February 2013 12:59, Mark Wendt  wrote:
>
>> I'll dig around and see if I can find the link to that oil gun the
>> fella posted when I get a chance later this morning.
>>  
> I just had to share this URL
> http://www.thenippleshop.co.uk/acatalog/Oil_Dispensers.html
>
 There is a slim chance they might have something, but their artwork isn't
 clear enough to identify.  I'd call but thats across the pond&  my plan
 isn't international.  So the local, not at all well stocked NAPA is next
 stop I guess.  We've a Ford dealer in town who might have something too.

 I'll let the list know what I found when I get back.

 Cheers, Gene
  
>>>
>>>
>> Just a few  options listed here:  ;-)
>>
>> http://www.saeproducts.com/grease-fittings.html
>>
>> Help or confusion ... take your choice.
>>
>> Dave
>>  
> It gets even worse: too many choices.
>
> http://www.malonespecialtyinc.com/Identifying_Threads.html
>
> Amazing what google will do. ;-)
>
> Dave
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread dave 
On Fri, 2013-02-08 at 10:36 -0800, dave wrote:
> On Fri, 2013-02-08 at 17:44 +0100, Peter Blodow wrote:
> > Gene,
> > I, too, had to guess what a zerk might be. It's not im my dictionary. 
> > Are you aware that zerks according to DIN and ISO (6 and 8 mm) have 
> > conic 1 mm threads, just like whitworth pipe threads, and this way they 
> > are supposed to be oil pressure proof after tightening.
> > 
> > Peter
> > 
> > Am 08.02.2013 16:16, schrieb Gene Heskett:
> > > On Friday 08 February 2013 10:11:20 andy pugh did opine:
> > > Message additions Copyright Friday 08 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
> > >
> > >> On 8 February 2013 12:59, Mark Wendt  wrote:
> > >>> I'll dig around and see if I can find the link to that oil gun the
> > >>> fella posted when I get a chance later this morning.
> > >> I just had to share this URL
> > >> http://www.thenippleshop.co.uk/acatalog/Oil_Dispensers.html
> > > There is a slim chance they might have something, but their artwork isn't
> > > clear enough to identify.  I'd call but thats across the pond & my plan
> > > isn't international.  So the local, not at all well stocked NAPA is next
> > > stop I guess.  We've a Ford dealer in town who might have something too.
> > >
> > > I'll let the list know what I found when I get back.
> > >
> > > Cheers, Gene
> > 
> > 
> Just a few  options listed here:  ;-)
> 
> http://www.saeproducts.com/grease-fittings.html
> 
> Help or confusion ... take your choice. 
> 
> Dave

It gets even worse: too many choices.

http://www.malonespecialtyinc.com/Identifying_Threads.html

Amazing what google will do. ;-)

Dave

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread dave 
On Fri, 2013-02-08 at 17:44 +0100, Peter Blodow wrote:
> Gene,
> I, too, had to guess what a zerk might be. It's not im my dictionary. 
> Are you aware that zerks according to DIN and ISO (6 and 8 mm) have 
> conic 1 mm threads, just like whitworth pipe threads, and this way they 
> are supposed to be oil pressure proof after tightening.
> 
> Peter
> 
> Am 08.02.2013 16:16, schrieb Gene Heskett:
> > On Friday 08 February 2013 10:11:20 andy pugh did opine:
> > Message additions Copyright Friday 08 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
> >
> >> On 8 February 2013 12:59, Mark Wendt  wrote:
> >>> I'll dig around and see if I can find the link to that oil gun the
> >>> fella posted when I get a chance later this morning.
> >> I just had to share this URL
> >> http://www.thenippleshop.co.uk/acatalog/Oil_Dispensers.html
> > There is a slim chance they might have something, but their artwork isn't
> > clear enough to identify.  I'd call but thats across the pond & my plan
> > isn't international.  So the local, not at all well stocked NAPA is next
> > stop I guess.  We've a Ford dealer in town who might have something too.
> >
> > I'll let the list know what I found when I get back.
> >
> > Cheers, Gene
> 
> 
Just a few  options listed here:  ;-)

http://www.saeproducts.com/grease-fittings.html

Help or confusion ... take your choice. 

Dave
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Jon Elson 
Mark Wendt wrote:
>
> Yah, there is a diff between the two.  I recently saw a link on the
> Practical Machinist forum for a rather nice oil gun that was also
> relatively inexpensive.  The oil zerks look quite similar to the
> grease zerks, but a regular grease gun doesn't seem to fit them very
> well.
>   
Hmmm, I've converted two grease guns to use on Bridgeports for oiling.
They seemed to work quite well, using the standard grease fitting that came
with the gun on the fittings on the mill.  (I've now converted to a "Fly 
Horse"
Chinese one-shot system, so don't use it anymore.)

Jon


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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Peter Blodow 
Gene,
I, too, had to guess what a zerk might be. It's not im my dictionary. 
Are you aware that zerks according to DIN and ISO (6 and 8 mm) have 
conic 1 mm threads, just like whitworth pipe threads, and this way they 
are supposed to be oil pressure proof after tightening.

Peter

Am 08.02.2013 16:16, schrieb Gene Heskett:
> On Friday 08 February 2013 10:11:20 andy pugh did opine:
> Message additions Copyright Friday 08 February 2013 by Gene Heskett
>
>> On 8 February 2013 12:59, Mark Wendt  wrote:
>>> I'll dig around and see if I can find the link to that oil gun the
>>> fella posted when I get a chance later this morning.
>> I just had to share this URL
>> http://www.thenippleshop.co.uk/acatalog/Oil_Dispensers.html
> There is a slim chance they might have something, but their artwork isn't
> clear enough to identify.  I'd call but thats across the pond & my plan
> isn't international.  So the local, not at all well stocked NAPA is next
> stop I guess.  We've a Ford dealer in town who might have something too.
>
> I'll let the list know what I found when I get back.
>
> Cheers, Gene


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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Friday 08 February 2013 10:11:20 andy pugh did opine:
Message additions Copyright Friday 08 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

> On 8 February 2013 12:59, Mark Wendt  wrote:
> > I'll dig around and see if I can find the link to that oil gun the
> > fella posted when I get a chance later this morning.
> 
> I just had to share this URL
> http://www.thenippleshop.co.uk/acatalog/Oil_Dispensers.html

There is a slim chance they might have something, but their artwork isn't 
clear enough to identify.  I'd call but thats across the pond & my plan 
isn't international.  So the local, not at all well stocked NAPA is next 
stop I guess.  We've a Ford dealer in town who might have something too.

I'll let the list know what I found when I get back.

Cheers, Gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Mark Wendt 
On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 6:22 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>> Gene,
>>
>> Yah, there is a diff between the two.  I recently saw a link on the
>> Practical Machinist forum for a rather nice oil gun that was also
>> relatively inexpensive.  The oil zerks look quite similar to the
>> grease zerks, but a regular grease gun doesn't seem to fit them very
>> well.
>>
>> I'll dig around and see if I can find the link to that oil gun the
>> fella posted when I get a chance later this morning.
>>
>> Mark
>>
> Thanks Mark.
>
> Cheers, Gene

Found it!  Here's the link for the gun itself:

http://www.armysurpluswarehouse.com/hardware/alemite-screw-type-grease-gun-c600.html

And the link to the forum topic is was posted in:

http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/general/i-found-good-source-oil-gun-zert-fittings-258187/

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread andy pugh 
On 8 February 2013 12:59, Mark Wendt  wrote:
> I'll dig around and see if I can find the link to that oil gun the
> fella posted when I get a chance later this morning.

I just had to share this URL
http://www.thenippleshop.co.uk/acatalog/Oil_Dispensers.html


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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Friday 08 February 2013 06:21:44 Mark Wendt did opine:
Message additions Copyright Friday 08 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

> On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 5:53 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> >> Gene,
> >> 
> >> Are you sure it's a grease zerk fitting and not an oiler zerk
> >> fitting?
> >> 
> >> Mark
> > 
> > If there is a diff, where can I get the oiler to fit it.  In 78 years,
> > I've not seen such a device on this side of the pond,
> > 
> > Not saying there isn't one though.  This has the usual top closure of
> > a small spring loaded ball in the tip to keep the dirt out just like
> > a std zerk.  The oil cups generally have a spring loaded flip top lid
> > and have to face up to be useful.
> > 
> > Thanks Mark.
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> 
> Gene,
> 
> Yah, there is a diff between the two.  I recently saw a link on the
> Practical Machinist forum for a rather nice oil gun that was also
> relatively inexpensive.  The oil zerks look quite similar to the
> grease zerks, but a regular grease gun doesn't seem to fit them very
> well.
> 
> I'll dig around and see if I can find the link to that oil gun the
> fella posted when I get a chance later this morning.
> 
> Mark
> 
Thanks Mark.

Cheers, Gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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My views 

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Erik Christiansen 
On 08.02.13 12:33, andy pugh wrote:
> On 8 February 2013 12:26, Mark Wendt  wrote:
> 
> > Are you sure it's a grease zerk fitting and not an oiler zerk fitting?
> 
> Good point. My (Imperial) milling machine has non-clipping fittings
> for an oil gun, relying purely in the push-pressure for sealing.

Andy, if they're "non-clipping", then are they those completely flat and
flush oiling points, with sprung ball valve?

Incidentally, does anyone know of a good non-leaking oiling gun for
them?

(Looked up wikipedia to learn what a zerk might be, and see that it's a
grease nipple. Had guessed, I'll admit.)

Erik

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Mark Wendt 
On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 5:53 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>> Gene,
>>
>> Are you sure it's a grease zerk fitting and not an oiler zerk fitting?
>>
>> Mark
>>
> If there is a diff, where can I get the oiler to fit it.  In 78 years, I've
> not seen such a device on this side of the pond,
>
> Not saying there isn't one though.  This has the usual top closure of a
> small spring loaded ball in the tip to keep the dirt out just like a std
> zerk.  The oil cups generally have a spring loaded flip top lid and have to
> face up to be useful.
>
> Thanks Mark.
>
> Cheers, Gene

Gene,

Yah, there is a diff between the two.  I recently saw a link on the
Practical Machinist forum for a rather nice oil gun that was also
relatively inexpensive.  The oil zerks look quite similar to the
grease zerks, but a regular grease gun doesn't seem to fit them very
well.

I'll dig around and see if I can find the link to that oil gun the
fella posted when I get a chance later this morning.

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Friday 08 February 2013 05:49:05 Mark Wendt did opine:
Message additions Copyright Friday 08 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

> On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 4:28 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > I don't think my tap collection includes that one, and #12 screws seem
> > to have become an endangered specie over the last 50 years. ISTR one
> > of the ancient equipment racks we have at the tv station was tapped
> > 12-24 & it took Ace Hdwe about 6 weeks to find me a box of them 25
> > years ago.
> > 
> > I have some 6x1mm bolts, I'll clean one up and see if it will fit the
> > hole. If that flies, I might try to bore a socket head to 1/4-28, run
> > a #60 drill thru it and use an American fitting.  I also have not
> > stopped at NAPA, where, due to the metrification of the auto industry
> > here, they may have a 6mm zerk with an American sized head on it. 
> > The chinese versions head is about 0.021" smaller OD, and a different
> > profile that doesn't even try to fit our grease gun sockets.  No
> > place in my touring last evening had a grease gun tip for the std
> > 1/8" pipe grease guns that had any mention of the word metric on the
> > blister pack card.
> > 
> > Frankly, my country is becoming a fossilized 3rd world island,
> > Zimbabwe is the only other holdout to all metric.  I think the word
> > is PIMA?  IMO, tooling wears out, and when it wears out, replace it
> > with metric equ's and be done with it.  But some fossil like me in a
> > corner office that represents TPTB, can't think in metric.  Don't
> > these folks ever retire?
> > 
> >> No metric threads in that size are coarser than 1mm.
> > 
> > Good to know, thanks Andy.
> > 
> > Cheers, Gene
> 
> Gene,
> 
> Are you sure it's a grease zerk fitting and not an oiler zerk fitting?
> 
> Mark
> 
If there is a diff, where can I get the oiler to fit it.  In 78 years, I've 
not seen such a device on this side of the pond,

Not saying there isn't one though.  This has the usual top closure of a 
small spring loaded ball in the tip to keep the dirt out just like a std 
zerk.  The oil cups generally have a spring loaded flip top lid and have to 
face up to be useful.

Thanks Mark.

Cheers, Gene
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
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My web page:  is up!
My views 

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Dave Caroline 
This thread reminds me I had to buy a UNS tap for some nipples a few weeks ago

Dave Caroline

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread andy pugh 
On 8 February 2013 12:26, Mark Wendt  wrote:

> Are you sure it's a grease zerk fitting and not an oiler zerk fitting?

Good point. My (Imperial) milling machine has non-clipping fittings
for an oil gun, relying purely in the push-pressure for sealing.

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Mark Wendt 
On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 4:28 AM, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
> I don't think my tap collection includes that one, and #12 screws seem to
> have become an endangered specie over the last 50 years. ISTR one of the
> ancient equipment racks we have at the tv station was tapped 12-24 & it
> took Ace Hdwe about 6 weeks to find me a box of them 25 years ago.
>
> I have some 6x1mm bolts, I'll clean one up and see if it will fit the hole.
> If that flies, I might try to bore a socket head to 1/4-28, run a #60 drill
> thru it and use an American fitting.  I also have not stopped at NAPA,
> where, due to the metrification of the auto industry here, they may have a
> 6mm zerk with an American sized head on it.  The chinese versions head is
> about 0.021" smaller OD, and a different profile that doesn't even try to
> fit our grease gun sockets.  No place in my touring last evening had a
> grease gun tip for the std 1/8" pipe grease guns that had any mention of
> the word metric on the blister pack card.
>
> Frankly, my country is becoming a fossilized 3rd world island, Zimbabwe is
> the only other holdout to all metric.  I think the word is PIMA?  IMO,
> tooling wears out, and when it wears out, replace it with metric equ's and
> be done with it.  But some fossil like me in a corner office that
> represents TPTB, can't think in metric.  Don't these folks ever retire?
>
>> No metric threads in that size are coarser than 1mm.
>
> Good to know, thanks Andy.
>
> Cheers, Gene

Gene,

Are you sure it's a grease zerk fitting and not an oiler zerk fitting?

Mark

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-08 Thread Gene Heskett 
On Friday 08 February 2013 04:02:44 andy pugh did opine:
Message additions Copyright Friday 08 February 2013 by Gene Heskett

> On 8 February 2013 07:21, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> > Does anyone know the tpi or tpmm of those miniature zerks on Chinese
> > ball nuts is?  Its 5.75mm for the major thread diameter, so I assume
> > they might be able to call it a 6mm thread, but it is obviously a
> > coarser tpmm than the 6x1mm's bolts I have.
> 
> 12-20?

I don't think my tap collection includes that one, and #12 screws seem to 
have become an endangered specie over the last 50 years. ISTR one of the 
ancient equipment racks we have at the tv station was tapped 12-24 & it 
took Ace Hdwe about 6 weeks to find me a box of them 25 years ago.

I have some 6x1mm bolts, I'll clean one up and see if it will fit the hole.
If that flies, I might try to bore a socket head to 1/4-28, run a #60 drill 
thru it and use an American fitting.  I also have not stopped at NAPA, 
where, due to the metrification of the auto industry here, they may have a 
6mm zerk with an American sized head on it.  The chinese versions head is 
about 0.021" smaller OD, and a different profile that doesn't even try to 
fit our grease gun sockets.  No place in my touring last evening had a 
grease gun tip for the std 1/8" pipe grease guns that had any mention of 
the word metric on the blister pack card.

Frankly, my country is becoming a fossilized 3rd world island, Zimbabwe is 
the only other holdout to all metric.  I think the word is PIMA?  IMO, 
tooling wears out, and when it wears out, replace it with metric equ's and 
be done with it.  But some fossil like me in a corner office that 
represents TPTB, can't think in metric.  Don't these folks ever retire?

> No metric threads in that size are coarser than 1mm.

Good to know, thanks Andy.

Cheers, Gene
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
My web page:  is up!
My views 

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A:  Throw him a rock.
I was taught to respect my elders, but its getting 
harder and harder to find any...

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Re: [Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-07 Thread andy pugh 
On 8 February 2013 07:21, Gene Heskett  wrote:

> Does anyone know the tpi or tpmm of those miniature zerks on Chinese ball
> nuts is?  Its 5.75mm for the major thread diameter, so I assume they might
> be able to call it a 6mm thread, but it is obviously a coarser tpmm than
> the 6x1mm's bolts I have.

12-20?

No metric threads in that size are coarser than 1mm.


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[Emc-users] Chinese grease zerk. 6mm

2013-02-07 Thread Gene Heskett 
Greetings;

Does anyone know the tpi or tpmm of those miniature zerks on Chinese ball 
nuts is?  Its 5.75mm for the major thread diameter, so I assume they might 
be able to call it a 6mm thread, but it is obviously a coarser tpmm than 
the 6x1mm's bolts I have.

I am considering making an adapter to go from the 6mm hole in the nut 
flange, to the American 1/4x28 fittings I already have a box of.  Sticking 
out 3/4" would not be a problem as that might give clearance to use an SAE 
wrench on it, room it doesn't have now, even an 8mm end wrench is a lot of 
fiddling per turn on this OEM Chinese fitting.

Thanks.

Cheers, Gene
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