Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Hello again guys,

Well, the situation is this: The machine always turns on with all it's
functions working properly, with the exception of the screen which
sometimes works and sometimes does not (when it fails sometimes there's no
signal at all on the LCD monitor, and sometimes there are white lines on
the screen). Voltage on the graphics board falls within the limits the
manual says it should be so I'm guessing this should be a graphics card
problem, but this could also be a main board problem too, no way to know.

It's a real pain in the ass because the machine all works properly, but I
also have all the means and components to convert it to LCNC (replacing the
servo motors entirely, I don't have too much time to experiment controlling
the original fanuc motors).

If I replace the fanuc motors I will try to control them outside the
machine with a new encoder and a generic driver for PM motors so I can
re-use them. Or maybe I'll sell them on ebay with their drives and power
supply and forget about fanuc equipment.

Next time we purchase a machine, we'll try to find one with the control
burned and convert it directly to LCNC, I don't even need to mention the
advantages...

Thank you guys and I hope you're all doing well!




El sáb, 9 dic 2023 a las 13:55, gene heskett ()
escribió:

> On 12/9/23 10:19, John Figie wrote:
> > Gene
> >
> > Yes I understand the catastrophic failure mode of Buck converters. But
> what
> > is BBLB?
> >
> Built By Lowest Bidder, John.  Slanguage I assumed everybody understood.
> ;o)>
>
> I still have one or two of those, not in service except as proof of
> concept maybe, with an output display even, $9.95 on fleabay at the
> time. A couple decades ago now. I needed some 5 volts for a breakout
> board, so it was more the smoke and aggravation than the money, worked
> less than a year, replaced by a new breakout board and a 5 volt 5 amp
> supply that is still running. With all the various pi clones running 3d
> printers on those 5x5 supplies, I've 6 or 7 of those here now, zip
> failures in 15+ years for some of them. Shopping on amazon, can
> occasionally get them for under $15 yet. My biggest lathe started out on
> an rpi3b running on its wall wart, 2 amp wasn't stable by the time the
> interfaceing load was added but I put a 5x5 box in, and an rpi4b now
> runs from long power failure to long power failure. Considering it's on
> a 650 WS ups, and there's a 20kw auto standby in the back yard with a 5
> second start to power output. the long power failures are me pulling the
> plug to swap u-sd cards that boot it. I wish my wintel dells were that
> good.  All of the pi's and dell's also control all machine power from
> the F1 key of LCNC, so they're never turned off, just the machines.
> Those machines converted to stepper/servo's are also powered down by a
> stepper loss of home, but while well tested, has never occurred mid job.
> I'm in the middle of collecting enough stuff to rebuild my go704 4 axis
> milling machine to use them. Costs maybe an additional $20 bill per axis
> but well worth it. Runs much cooler, does away with pid's in linuxcnc
> because the pid is in the smarter controller, They do exactly what the
> TP tells them to do or stop LCNC in the next millisecond.
>
> I'm also not a for profit shop, just a hobbyist, clearly with too many
> hobbies. I'm a CET, (we teach EE's what they should have learned in
> school), retired broadcast Chief Engineer in danger of falling asleep in
> my diabetic & dotage years, 89 so far.
>
>
> > John Figie
> >
> > On Sat, Dec 9, 2023, 7:39 AM gene heskett  wrote:
> >
> >> On 12/9/23 06:13, andy pugh wrote:
> >>> On Wed, 6 Dec 2023 at 16:08, Leonardo Marsaglia  >
> >> wrote:
> 
>  Just a little update. We're going to try and feed all the voltages on
> >> the
>  main board of the control (+5V, +15V, -15V, and 24V) with normal
> >> switching
>  PSUs
> >>>
> >>> Depending on the current requirements on each channel you might want
> >>> to look at using a single PSU and a bunch of buck or boost converter
> >>> modules.
> >>>
> >>> My mill has a 2kw 24V supply and then 4x buck converters (with LED
> >>> voltage displays) to feed the PC motherboard, 5V and 12V logic.
> >>>
> >> Those tend to be BBLB stuff, and I've not had great luck. A to 5 volt
> >> buck crowbared thru, putting the full 24 on the 5 volt stuff with the
> >> expected results, lots of smoke. Lasted under a year, so I don't
> >> consider it since.
> >> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> >> --
> >> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >>soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> >> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> >> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law
> respectable.
> >>- Louis D. Brandeis
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Emc-users mailing list
> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >>
> >
> > ___

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[gene heskett]

On 12/9/23 10:19, John Figie wrote:

Gene

Yes I understand the catastrophic failure mode of Buck converters. But what
is BBLB?

Built By Lowest Bidder, John.  Slanguage I assumed everybody understood. 
;o)>


I still have one or two of those, not in service except as proof of 
concept maybe, with an output display even, $9.95 on fleabay at the 
time. A couple decades ago now. I needed some 5 volts for a breakout 
board, so it was more the smoke and aggravation than the money, worked 
less than a year, replaced by a new breakout board and a 5 volt 5 amp 
supply that is still running. With all the various pi clones running 3d 
printers on those 5x5 supplies, I've 6 or 7 of those here now, zip 
failures in 15+ years for some of them. Shopping on amazon, can 
occasionally get them for under $15 yet. My biggest lathe started out on 
an rpi3b running on its wall wart, 2 amp wasn't stable by the time the 
interfaceing load was added but I put a 5x5 box in, and an rpi4b now 
runs from long power failure to long power failure. Considering it's on 
a 650 WS ups, and there's a 20kw auto standby in the back yard with a 5 
second start to power output. the long power failures are me pulling the 
plug to swap u-sd cards that boot it. I wish my wintel dells were that 
good.  All of the pi's and dell's also control all machine power from 
the F1 key of LCNC, so they're never turned off, just the machines. 
Those machines converted to stepper/servo's are also powered down by a 
stepper loss of home, but while well tested, has never occurred mid job. 
I'm in the middle of collecting enough stuff to rebuild my go704 4 axis 
milling machine to use them. Costs maybe an additional $20 bill per axis 
but well worth it. Runs much cooler, does away with pid's in linuxcnc 
because the pid is in the smarter controller, They do exactly what the 
TP tells them to do or stop LCNC in the next millisecond.


I'm also not a for profit shop, just a hobbyist, clearly with too many 
hobbies. I'm a CET, (we teach EE's what they should have learned in 
school), retired broadcast Chief Engineer in danger of falling asleep in 
my diabetic & dotage years, 89 so far.




John Figie

On Sat, Dec 9, 2023, 7:39 AM gene heskett  wrote:


On 12/9/23 06:13, andy pugh wrote:

On Wed, 6 Dec 2023 at 16:08, Leonardo Marsaglia 

wrote:


Just a little update. We're going to try and feed all the voltages on

the

main board of the control (+5V, +15V, -15V, and 24V) with normal

switching

PSUs


Depending on the current requirements on each channel you might want
to look at using a single PSU and a bunch of buck or boost converter
modules.

My mill has a 2kw 24V supply and then 4x buck converters (with LED
voltage displays) to feed the PC motherboard, 5V and 12V logic.


Those tend to be BBLB stuff, and I've not had great luck. A to 5 volt
buck crowbared thru, putting the full 24 on the 5 volt stuff with the
expected results, lots of smoke. Lasted under a year, so I don't
consider it since.
Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
   - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

I'm starting to think that maybe the original PSU had its alarm state
triggered by an external fault, maybe on the video card. I'm just guessing
because the manuals only say that the PSU has an external alarm contact
that will turn off the PSU in case the contact is closed, but It doesn't
say what can cause this of course. The matter is, the control doesn't show
any alarm on its control leds on the mainboard so I'm not sure.

I don't have any luck finding any documents about the boards or how they
should be properly checked. There's only very basic info.

El sáb, 9 dic 2023 a las 12:36, Leonardo Marsaglia ()
escribió:

> Hello guys again
>
> Just a little update, we fed all the voltages through some test pins on
> the main board (not using the original PSU connector yet) and the machine
> started up but with no video signal. The LCD monitor lights up but no
> signal on the screen. The video board is showing 4.92 volts on its test
> pins so it's getting the voltage but maybe there's something missing (I'll
> try to increase the 4.92 V  to 5.05 V or so, although I don't think that's
> causing the problem). All the other systems on the machine are working fine
> and there are no alarms present. We're almost there..
>
> El sáb, 9 dic 2023 a las 12:17, John Figie ()
> escribió:
>
>> Gene
>>
>> Yes I understand the catastrophic failure mode of Buck converters. But
>> what
>> is BBLB?
>>
>> John Figie
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 9, 2023, 7:39 AM gene heskett  wrote:
>>
>> > On 12/9/23 06:13, andy pugh wrote:
>> > > On Wed, 6 Dec 2023 at 16:08, Leonardo Marsaglia <
>> ldmarsag...@gmail.com>
>> > wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >> Just a little update. We're going to try and feed all the voltages on
>> > the
>> > >> main board of the control (+5V, +15V, -15V, and 24V) with normal
>> > switching
>> > >> PSUs
>> > >
>> > > Depending on the current requirements on each channel you might want
>> > > to look at using a single PSU and a bunch of buck or boost converter
>> > > modules.
>> > >
>> > > My mill has a 2kw 24V supply and then 4x buck converters (with LED
>> > > voltage displays) to feed the PC motherboard, 5V and 12V logic.
>> > >
>> > Those tend to be BBLB stuff, and I've not had great luck. A to 5 volt
>> > buck crowbared thru, putting the full 24 on the 5 volt stuff with the
>> > expected results, lots of smoke. Lasted under a year, so I don't
>> > consider it since.
>> > Cheers, Gene Heskett.
>> > --
>> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>> >   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
>> > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law
>> respectable.
>> >   - Louis D. Brandeis
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ___
>> > Emc-users mailing list
>> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>> >
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Hello guys again

Just a little update, we fed all the voltages through some test pins on the
main board (not using the original PSU connector yet) and the machine
started up but with no video signal. The LCD monitor lights up but no
signal on the screen. The video board is showing 4.92 volts on its test
pins so it's getting the voltage but maybe there's something missing (I'll
try to increase the 4.92 V  to 5.05 V or so, although I don't think that's
causing the problem). All the other systems on the machine are working fine
and there are no alarms present. We're almost there..

El sáb, 9 dic 2023 a las 12:17, John Figie ()
escribió:

> Gene
>
> Yes I understand the catastrophic failure mode of Buck converters. But what
> is BBLB?
>
> John Figie
>
> On Sat, Dec 9, 2023, 7:39 AM gene heskett  wrote:
>
> > On 12/9/23 06:13, andy pugh wrote:
> > > On Wed, 6 Dec 2023 at 16:08, Leonardo Marsaglia  >
> > wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Just a little update. We're going to try and feed all the voltages on
> > the
> > >> main board of the control (+5V, +15V, -15V, and 24V) with normal
> > switching
> > >> PSUs
> > >
> > > Depending on the current requirements on each channel you might want
> > > to look at using a single PSU and a bunch of buck or boost converter
> > > modules.
> > >
> > > My mill has a 2kw 24V supply and then 4x buck converters (with LED
> > > voltage displays) to feed the PC motherboard, 5V and 12V logic.
> > >
> > Those tend to be BBLB stuff, and I've not had great luck. A to 5 volt
> > buck crowbared thru, putting the full 24 on the 5 volt stuff with the
> > expected results, lots of smoke. Lasted under a year, so I don't
> > consider it since.
> > Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> > --
> > "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> > -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> > If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
> >   - Louis D. Brandeis
> >
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[John Figie]

Gene

Yes I understand the catastrophic failure mode of Buck converters. But what
is BBLB?

John Figie

On Sat, Dec 9, 2023, 7:39 AM gene heskett  wrote:

> On 12/9/23 06:13, andy pugh wrote:
> > On Wed, 6 Dec 2023 at 16:08, Leonardo Marsaglia 
> wrote:
> >>
> >> Just a little update. We're going to try and feed all the voltages on
> the
> >> main board of the control (+5V, +15V, -15V, and 24V) with normal
> switching
> >> PSUs
> >
> > Depending on the current requirements on each channel you might want
> > to look at using a single PSU and a bunch of buck or boost converter
> > modules.
> >
> > My mill has a 2kw 24V supply and then 4x buck converters (with LED
> > voltage displays) to feed the PC motherboard, 5V and 12V logic.
> >
> Those tend to be BBLB stuff, and I've not had great luck. A to 5 volt
> buck crowbared thru, putting the full 24 on the 5 volt stuff with the
> expected results, lots of smoke. Lasted under a year, so I don't
> consider it since.
> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>   - Louis D. Brandeis
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[gene heskett]

On 12/9/23 06:13, andy pugh wrote:

On Wed, 6 Dec 2023 at 16:08, Leonardo Marsaglia  wrote:


Just a little update. We're going to try and feed all the voltages on the
main board of the control (+5V, +15V, -15V, and 24V) with normal switching
PSUs


Depending on the current requirements on each channel you might want
to look at using a single PSU and a bunch of buck or boost converter
modules.

My mill has a 2kw 24V supply and then 4x buck converters (with LED
voltage displays) to feed the PC motherboard, 5V and 12V logic.

Those tend to be BBLB stuff, and I've not had great luck. A to 5 volt 
buck crowbared thru, putting the full 24 on the 5 volt stuff with the 
expected results, lots of smoke. Lasted under a year, so I don't 
consider it since.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[andy pugh]

On Wed, 6 Dec 2023 at 16:08, Leonardo Marsaglia  wrote:
>
> Just a little update. We're going to try and feed all the voltages on the
> main board of the control (+5V, +15V, -15V, and 24V) with normal switching
> PSUs

Depending on the current requirements on each channel you might want
to look at using a single PSU and a bunch of buck or boost converter
modules.

My mill has a 2kw 24V supply and then 4x buck converters (with LED
voltage displays) to feed the PC motherboard, 5V and 12V logic.

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Just a little update. We're going to try and feed all the voltages on the
main board of the control (+5V, +15V, -15V, and 24V) with normal switching
PSUs and activate the EN signal that the old PSU fed to the control and
that should do the trick. Anyway if this works, I'll be working on a LCNC
conversion plan as soon as possible just to be ready when something else
fails. I'll let you know how this goes!

Thank you guys!

El mié, 6 dic 2023 a las 8:59, Leonardo Marsaglia ()
escribió:

> I missed the beginning of this.  What kind a machine is this?
>>
>
> Hi Chris, since the original topic was for the power supply I didn't
> mention any details about the machine. This is a Daewoo Puma 12L turning
> center with a Fanuc OT-C control. The machine is from 1996.
>
> As for the power supply, they are very hard to debug if you don’t have a
>> schematic.   But what about replacing it entirely?
>>
>
> That would be a way to stick with the original control a little longer
> until something more critical fails, but the problem is, this PSU has a
> connector that goes directly on the motherboard of the CNC. Most of the
> pins are grounded but there are several others that I don't really know
> what they do. I can't find any schematic to see what each pin does, and
> since I can't power up the PSU I can't measure them either. These PSUs are
> like 1500 USD and up brand new (this is nuts if you ask me, we're talking
> about a switching PSU), there are cheaper used ones on Aliexpress but I'm
> not sure about them. And of course, this is a 1996 machine, something
> eventually will fill again, so I'm seriously considering the LCNC
> conversion right now. If I can solve the servo motors issue this should
> take 2 weeks maximum.
>
>
>> Good motors are always expensive.  But encoders have gotten cheap and
>> easy to use.  The last one I bout was an AS5048.  It cost less than $20 and
>> the specs are incredible.
>>
>
> I'll take a look at that because it's more than likely that I'll need to
> replace the encoders on the motors.
>
> El mar, 5 dic 2023 a las 19:20, Chris Albertson (<
> albertson.ch...@gmail.com>) escribió:
>
>> I missed the beginning of this.  What kind a machine is this?
>>
>> As for the power supply, they are very hard to debug if you don’t have a
>> schematic.   But what about replacing it entirely?
>>
>> Good motors are always expensive.  But encoders have gotten cheap and
>> easy to use.  The last one I bout was an AS5048.  It cost less than $20 and
>> the specs are incredible.
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

>
> I missed the beginning of this.  What kind a machine is this?
>

Hi Chris, since the original topic was for the power supply I didn't
mention any details about the machine. This is a Daewoo Puma 12L turning
center with a Fanuc OT-C control. The machine is from 1996.

As for the power supply, they are very hard to debug if you don’t have a
> schematic.   But what about replacing it entirely?
>

That would be a way to stick with the original control a little longer
until something more critical fails, but the problem is, this PSU has a
connector that goes directly on the motherboard of the CNC. Most of the
pins are grounded but there are several others that I don't really know
what they do. I can't find any schematic to see what each pin does, and
since I can't power up the PSU I can't measure them either. These PSUs are
like 1500 USD and up brand new (this is nuts if you ask me, we're talking
about a switching PSU), there are cheaper used ones on Aliexpress but I'm
not sure about them. And of course, this is a 1996 machine, something
eventually will fill again, so I'm seriously considering the LCNC
conversion right now. If I can solve the servo motors issue this should
take 2 weeks maximum.


> Good motors are always expensive.  But encoders have gotten cheap and easy
> to use.  The last one I bout was an AS5048.  It cost less than $20 and the
> specs are incredible.
>

I'll take a look at that because it's more than likely that I'll need to
replace the encoders on the motors.

El mar, 5 dic 2023 a las 19:20, Chris Albertson ()
escribió:

> I missed the beginning of this.  What kind a machine is this?
>
> As for the power supply, they are very hard to debug if you don’t have a
> schematic.   But what about replacing it entirely?
>
> Good motors are always expensive.  But encoders have gotten cheap and easy
> to use.  The last one I bout was an AS5048.  It cost less than $20 and the
> specs are incredible.
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Jon Elson]

On 12/5/23 11:26, Todd Zuercher wrote:

I think all Fanuc red cap encoders are digital.  The question marks are if the 
coms signal is differential quadrature or serial and if serial what format, and 
what the commutation tracks/signals are or if they are rolled into the absolute 
encoder serial signal.

The original red cap encoders were standard quadrature with 
index, but with proprietary commutation on 4 Gray-code 
signals. Later encoders (serial pulse coder) were all serial 
and interpolated a 2048-cycle analog quadrature disc into 
some higher resolution code.  Anywhere from 32K to 1 million 
counts/rev.  The digital data is a 77-bit stream at 1.024 
MBits/second, at least on the ones I have deciphered.


Obviously, the reason was that sending 1 Million counts/rev 
was impractical with quadrature.


Jon



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Chris Albertson]

I missed the beginning of this.  What kind a machine is this?

As for the power supply, they are very hard to debug if you don’t have a 
schematic.   But what about replacing it entirely?  

Good motors are always expensive.  But encoders have gotten cheap and easy to 
use.  The last one I bout was an AS5048.  It cost less than $20 and the specs 
are incredible. 

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Hello again guys,

Well, I can confirm the encoders communicate with the control using serial
interface. I have some heidenhain ERN471 encoders that I could adapt in
case these can't communicate with LCNC, so that shouldn't be a problem. My
main concern now is to interface all of this with the Mesa boards I have
and maybe purchase a couple of 8i20 to drive these motors.

By the way, should I open a new topic for this?

El mar, 5 dic 2023 a las 17:07, Todd Zuercher ()
escribió:

> I think all Fanuc red cap encoders are digital.  The question marks are if
> the coms signal is differential quadrature or serial and if serial what
> format, and what the commutation tracks/signals are or if they are rolled
> into the absolute encoder serial signal.
>
> Todd Zuercher
> P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> 630 Henry Street
> Dalton, Ohio 44618
> Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
>
> -Original Message-
> From: gene heskett 
> Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2023 11:52 AM
> To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950
>
> [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.
>
> On 12/5/23 08:17, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:
> > Hello guys, and thanks for all the replies!
> >
> > Well, we swapped the majority of the capacitors on the board and we
> > still get the alarm on the PSU. I'm almost inclined to consider this a
> > LCNC project and start doing the conversion.
> >
> > One thing I'm considering before doing that is if It's possible to use
> > the original Fanuc Servo motors replacing only the drives. I know the
> > drives will not be usable because they communicate with their own
> > Fanuc serial protocol, but maybe there's a chance I can use the same
> motors.
> >
> > I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
> > should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the
> > encoder works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I
> > don't know anything about them so swapping the servo motors is another
> > option too. I have several servo motors here just in case this happened
> so I can use them.
> >
> That looks like the output stage of a 7.5 horse vfd could drive it. A
> PID's error voltage might be used to control the driving current, much like
> the current crop of smaller 3 phase stepper drivers we have already, like
> the LCDA357H but with much higher rated output devices since that one has a
> 50 volt, 4 or 5 amp limit. Give me enough time I could figure that out but
> someone probably has already. I'm sure you could move it weakly, laying on
> the table, with an LCDA357H, a function generator to make steps, a switch
> to control direction and a 42 volt power supply.  A proof of concept test.
> You would have to find its encoder on the connector though, because w/o the
> encoder, the LCDA357H will see an error and shut down on the first step. A
> schematic of the connector and description of the encoder would be VERY
> helpful. The LCDA357H is designed for quadrature encoders (optical) but
> sin/cos magnetic analog types are a different game. The motor itself looks
> to be a std 3 phase motor.  My bet is the encoder is an analog sin/cos type
> needing a carrier frequency drive.  In which case the digital encoder input
> on the likes of the LCDA357H is worthless.  So the encoder is the
> $64,000 question.  Which is it?
>
> > Thanks again a lot for your help guys! Sorry that I don't reply
> > individually :)
> >
> > El dom, 3 dic 2023 a las 9:00, gene heskett ()
> > escribió:
> >
> >> On 12/3/23 04:42, Roland Jollivet wrote:
> >>> If you can obtain/borrow any thermal imaging device, then run with
> >>> the
> >> PSU
> >>> with covers off and check every 5min. You should identify a
> >>> cap-thermal problem.
> >>>
> >> For that, a $500 ir imager would be nice, but a $29 ir thermometer
> >> from the local lumber yard can do as well. Leonardo might even have
> >> one of those in his toolbox, if only to check his food for adequate
> >> cooking. I do. When I'm on the road, living out of the fridge and
> >> microwave of a motel room.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Sat, 2 Dec 2023 at 21:14, John Dammeyer 
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>> From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> >>>>>
> >>>>> If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to
> >>>>> debug
> >>>> and
> >>>>> repair,  LIkey it is the caps.
&

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Todd Zuercher]

I think all Fanuc red cap encoders are digital.  The question marks are if the 
coms signal is differential quadrature or serial and if serial what format, and 
what the commutation tracks/signals are or if they are rolled into the absolute 
encoder serial signal.

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031

-Original Message-
From: gene heskett 
Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2023 11:52 AM
To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.

On 12/5/23 08:17, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:
> Hello guys, and thanks for all the replies!
>
> Well, we swapped the majority of the capacitors on the board and we
> still get the alarm on the PSU. I'm almost inclined to consider this a
> LCNC project and start doing the conversion.
>
> One thing I'm considering before doing that is if It's possible to use
> the original Fanuc Servo motors replacing only the drives. I know the
> drives will not be usable because they communicate with their own
> Fanuc serial protocol, but maybe there's a chance I can use the same motors.
>
> I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
> should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the
> encoder works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I
> don't know anything about them so swapping the servo motors is another
> option too. I have several servo motors here just in case this happened so I 
> can use them.
>
That looks like the output stage of a 7.5 horse vfd could drive it. A PID's 
error voltage might be used to control the driving current, much like the 
current crop of smaller 3 phase stepper drivers we have already, like the 
LCDA357H but with much higher rated output devices since that one has a 50 
volt, 4 or 5 amp limit. Give me enough time I could figure that out but someone 
probably has already. I'm sure you could move it weakly, laying on the table, 
with an LCDA357H, a function generator to make steps, a switch to control 
direction and a 42 volt power supply.  A proof of concept test. You would have 
to find its encoder on the connector though, because w/o the encoder, the 
LCDA357H will see an error and shut down on the first step. A schematic of the 
connector and description of the encoder would be VERY helpful. The LCDA357H is 
designed for quadrature encoders (optical) but sin/cos magnetic analog types 
are a different game. The motor itself looks to be a std 3 phase motor.  My bet 
is the encoder is an analog sin/cos type needing a carrier frequency drive.  In 
which case the digital encoder input on the likes of the LCDA357H is worthless. 
 So the encoder is the
$64,000 question.  Which is it?

> Thanks again a lot for your help guys! Sorry that I don't reply
> individually :)
>
> El dom, 3 dic 2023 a las 9:00, gene heskett ()
> escribió:
>
>> On 12/3/23 04:42, Roland Jollivet wrote:
>>> If you can obtain/borrow any thermal imaging device, then run with
>>> the
>> PSU
>>> with covers off and check every 5min. You should identify a
>>> cap-thermal problem.
>>>
>> For that, a $500 ir imager would be nice, but a $29 ir thermometer
>> from the local lumber yard can do as well. Leonardo might even have
>> one of those in his toolbox, if only to check his food for adequate
>> cooking. I do. When I'm on the road, living out of the fridge and
>> microwave of a motel room.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, 2 Dec 2023 at 21:14, John Dammeyer 
>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
>>>>>
>>>>> If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to
>>>>> debug
>>>> and
>>>>> repair,  LIkey it is the caps.
>>>>>
>>>>> But switching power supplies are much harder to debug, You can
>>>>> guess it might be the same issue but these have dozens of parts that can 
>>>>> fail..
>>>> In any
>>>>> case, the cost to repair is small.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I disagree.  Switching power supplies are way more likely to fail
>>>> from high ESR.  That the system runs for a short while and then
>>>> fails is
>> again a
>>>> symptom of a capacitor overheating due to high ESR.  Or the voltage
>>>> is right on the edge and as the cap warms up the heat results in a
>>>> change
>> that
>>>> results in the power supply moving out of spec.There may even be
>> enough
>>>> heat developed

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Todd Zuercher]

You could try looking up the encoder part number or the motor part number in 
the Fanuc servo conections manual.  There "might" be a pinout for the encoder 
cable there which would tell you if it is serial or quadrature.  (Fanuc's "Info 
Link" CD is useful for this sort of thing.)

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031

-Original Message-
From: andy pugh 
Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2023 11:35 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.

On Tue, 5 Dec 2023 at 16:19, Leonardo Marsaglia  wrote:
>
> Sorry I forgot to attach the picture.

I am beyond the bounds of my knowledge in this area now. PCW (or possibly Rene) 
might know more.

--
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed for 
the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
- George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[John Dammeyer]

https://forum.linuxcnc.org/38-general-linuxcnc-questions/48987-trying-to-build-find-a-stmbl


> -Original Message-
> From: Leonardo Marsaglia [mailto:ldmarsag...@gmail.com]
> Sent: December 5, 2023 6:02 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950
> 
> Well, from what I can see on Granite Devices website, their Argon servo
> drives are now discontinued so that eliminates one big possibility for
> replacing the fanuc drives and keep the motors. I don't know if Pico
> systems or MESA has a drive for the power these motors require.
> Although I'm not going to use them nearly as hard as they are capable of...
> 
> El mar, 5 dic 2023 a las 10:15, Leonardo Marsaglia ()
> escribi�:
> 
> > Hello guys, and thanks for all the replies!
> >
> > Well, we swapped the majority of the capacitors on the board and we still
> > get the alarm on the PSU. I'm almost inclined to consider this a LCNC
> > project and start doing the conversion.
> >
> > One thing I'm considering before doing that is if It's possible to use the
> > original Fanuc Servo motors replacing only the drives. I know the drives
> > will not be usable because they communicate with their own Fanuc serial
> > protocol, but maybe there's a chance I can use the same motors.
> >
> > I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
> > should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the encoder
> > works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I don't
> know
> > anything about them so swapping the servo motors is another option too. I
> > have several servo motors here just in case this happened so I can use
> them.
> >
> > Thanks again a lot for your help guys! Sorry that I don't reply
> > individually :)
> >
> > El dom, 3 dic 2023 a las 9:00, gene heskett ()
> > escribi�:
> >
> >> On 12/3/23 04:42, Roland Jollivet wrote:
> >> > If you can obtain/borrow any thermal imaging device, then run with the
> >> PSU
> >> > with covers off and check every 5min. You should identify a cap-thermal
> >> > problem.
> >> >
> >> For that, a $500 ir imager would be nice, but a $29 ir thermometer from
> >> the local lumber yard can do as well. Leonardo might even have one of
> >> those in his toolbox, if only to check his food for adequate cooking. I
> >> do. When I'm on the road, living out of the fridge and microwave of a
> >> motel room.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Sat, 2 Dec 2023 at 21:14, John Dammeyer
> 
> >> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >>> From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> >> >>>
> >> >>> If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to debug
> >> >> and
> >> >>> repair,  LIkey it is the caps.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> But switching power supplies are much harder to debug, You can
> guess
> >> it
> >> >>> might be the same issue but these have dozens of parts that can fail..
> >> >> In any
> >> >>> case, the cost to repair is small.
> >> >>>
> >> >>
> >> >> I disagree.  Switching power supplies are way more likely to fail from
> >> >> high ESR.  That the system runs for a short while and then fails is
> >> again a
> >> >> symptom of a capacitor overheating due to high ESR.  Or the voltage is
> >> >> right on the edge and as the cap warms up the heat results in a change
> >> that
> >> >> results in the power supply moving out of spec.There may even be
> >> enough
> >> >> heat developed on the board that a solder joint becomes unreliable.
> >> >>
> >> >> In the past even PC motherboards have been repaired by a wholesale
> >> swap of
> >> >> the electrolytics.
> >> >>
> >> >> So what I would do is an initial survey of the electrolytic capacitors
> >> >> inside the power supply and order a set.  That way the machine can
> >> still
> >> >> run for an hour or so a day while you wait for parts from a reputable
> >> >> source.Then replace the capacitor when they arrive.  That won't
> >> prevent
> >> >> the power supply from working again and it may well fix the 1 to 2 hour
> >> >> failure period.

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[John Dammeyer]

Leonardo,
How many defective motors do you have?
Here's the link for the STMB motor drive.
https://github.com/rene-dev/stmbl
I don't recall the web site for the forum.  Andy might have that handy.
Might be worthwhile posting on that forum with the motor and encoder 
information.  Someone is likely to have a spare STMBL they could let go if 
indeed it would solve your problem..
John


> -Original Message-
> From: andy pugh [mailto:bodge...@gmail.com]
> Sent: December 5, 2023 7:44 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950
> 
> On Tue, 5 Dec 2023 at 13:22, Leonardo Marsaglia 
> wrote:
> 
> > I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
> > should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the encoder
> > works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I don't
> know
> > anything about them
> 
> Can you identify the encoder? If it is Aa64 then the Fanuc hostmot2
> component ought to work.
> https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/man/man9/hostmot2.9.html#Fanuc%
> 20encoder
> (Others might too)
> 
> The voltage and current are inside the range of the 8i20.
> 
> The 8i20 needs to be externally commutated (In HAL) using the "bldc"
> hal component using the encoder feedback.
> 
> I have been using 8i20s in my mill and lathe for several years with
> few problems.
> 
> The STMBL drive has a Fanuc encoder component:
> https://github.com/rene-dev/stmbl/blob/master/src/comps/encf.c
> and would probably be a very good choice, if you can find any. They
> aren't really available at the moment without making them yourself and
> sourcing discontinued parts.
> 
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> � George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
> 
> 
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[gene heskett]

On 12/5/23 11:18, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:

Sorry I forgot to attach the picture.


I'd like to see that with the pink cover carefully removed.


El mar, 5 dic 2023 a las 13:13, Leonardo Marsaglia ()
escribió:


Can you identify the encoder? If it is Aa64 then the Fanuc hostmot2

component ought to work.

https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/man/man9/hostmot2.9.html#Fanuc%20encoder
(Others might too)



Hi Andy, the encoder is the one on the picture I'm attaching now. The
model number is  *αI64 *and then TYPE A860-0365-T101.

If the 8i20 can control both servo motors It surely would be a lot easier
to replace the encoders in case they don't work with the HOSTMOT2 Fanuc
component. I really prefer to avoid replacing the motors because they are
already there with all the couplings and even the brake assembly for the X
axis.

The Z axis motor is rated at 3800 W but I don't mind having it limited to
2200 W given the kind of work this lathe does, (mostly cast iron parts
with really light cuts so no big cutting forces involved).

Thank you!

El mar, 5 dic 2023 a las 12:50, andy pugh () escribió:


On Tue, 5 Dec 2023 at 13:22, Leonardo Marsaglia 
wrote:


I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the

encoder

works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I don't

know

anything about them


Can you identify the encoder? If it is Aa64 then the Fanuc hostmot2
component ought to work.

https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/man/man9/hostmot2.9.html#Fanuc%20encoder
(Others might too)

The voltage and current are inside the range of the 8i20.

The 8i20 needs to be externally commutated (In HAL) using the "bldc"
hal component using the encoder feedback.

I have been using 8i20s in my mill and lathe for several years with
few problems.

The STMBL drive has a Fanuc encoder component:
https://github.com/rene-dev/stmbl/blob/master/src/comps/encf.c
and would probably be a very good choice, if you can find any. They
aren't really available at the moment without making them yourself and
sourcing discontinued parts.

--
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users





___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[gene heskett]

On 12/5/23 08:17, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:

Hello guys, and thanks for all the replies!

Well, we swapped the majority of the capacitors on the board and we still
get the alarm on the PSU. I'm almost inclined to consider this a LCNC
project and start doing the conversion.

One thing I'm considering before doing that is if It's possible to use the
original Fanuc Servo motors replacing only the drives. I know the drives
will not be usable because they communicate with their own Fanuc serial
protocol, but maybe there's a chance I can use the same motors.

I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the encoder
works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I don't know
anything about them so swapping the servo motors is another option too. I
have several servo motors here just in case this happened so I can use them.

That looks like the output stage of a 7.5 horse vfd could drive it. A 
PID's error voltage might be used to control the driving current, much 
like the current crop of smaller 3 phase stepper drivers we have 
already, like the LCDA357H but with much higher rated output devices 
since that one has a 50 volt, 4 or 5 amp limit. Give me enough time I 
could figure that out but someone probably has already. I'm sure you 
could move it weakly, laying on the table, with an LCDA357H, a function 
generator to make steps, a switch to control direction and a 42 volt 
power supply.  A proof of concept test. You would have to find its 
encoder on the connector though, because w/o the encoder, the LCDA357H 
will see an error and shut down on the first step. A schematic of the 
connector and description of the encoder would be VERY helpful. The 
LCDA357H is designed for quadrature encoders (optical) but sin/cos 
magnetic analog types are a different game. The motor itself looks to be 
a std 3 phase motor.  My bet is the encoder is an analog sin/cos type 
needing a carrier frequency drive.  In which case the digital encoder 
input on the likes of the LCDA357H is worthless.  So the encoder is the 
$64,000 question.  Which is it?



Thanks again a lot for your help guys! Sorry that I don't reply
individually :)

El dom, 3 dic 2023 a las 9:00, gene heskett ()
escribió:


On 12/3/23 04:42, Roland Jollivet wrote:

If you can obtain/borrow any thermal imaging device, then run with the

PSU

with covers off and check every 5min. You should identify a cap-thermal
problem.


For that, a $500 ir imager would be nice, but a $29 ir thermometer from
the local lumber yard can do as well. Leonardo might even have one of
those in his toolbox, if only to check his food for adequate cooking. I
do. When I'm on the road, living out of the fridge and microwave of a
motel room.



On Sat, 2 Dec 2023 at 21:14, John Dammeyer 

wrote:



From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]

If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to debug

and

repair,  LIkey it is the caps.

But switching power supplies are much harder to debug, You can guess it
might be the same issue but these have dozens of parts that can fail..

In any

case, the cost to repair is small.



I disagree.  Switching power supplies are way more likely to fail from
high ESR.  That the system runs for a short while and then fails is

again a

symptom of a capacitor overheating due to high ESR.  Or the voltage is
right on the edge and as the cap warms up the heat results in a change

that

results in the power supply moving out of spec.There may even be

enough

heat developed on the board that a solder joint becomes unreliable.

In the past even PC motherboards have been repaired by a wholesale swap

of

the electrolytics.

So what I would do is an initial survey of the electrolytic capacitors
inside the power supply and order a set.  That way the machine can still
run for an hour or so a day while you wait for parts from a reputable
source.Then replace the capacitor when they arrive.  That won't

prevent

the power supply from working again and it may well fix the 1 to 2 hour
failure period.  In either case $30 or so worth of caps is cheap.
John



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
   - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[andy pugh]

On Tue, 5 Dec 2023 at 16:19, Leonardo Marsaglia  wrote:
>
> Sorry I forgot to attach the picture.

I am beyond the bounds of my knowledge in this area now. PCW (or
possibly Rene) might know more.

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

>
> Can you identify the encoder? If it is Aa64 then the Fanuc hostmot2
> component ought to work.
>
> https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/man/man9/hostmot2.9.html#Fanuc%20encoder
> (Others might too)
>

Hi Andy, the encoder is the one on the picture I'm attaching now. The model
number is  *αI64 *and then TYPE A860-0365-T101.

If the 8i20 can control both servo motors It surely would be a lot easier
to replace the encoders in case they don't work with the HOSTMOT2 Fanuc
component. I really prefer to avoid replacing the motors because they are
already there with all the couplings and even the brake assembly for the X
axis.

The Z axis motor is rated at 3800 W but I don't mind having it limited to
2200 W given the kind of work this lathe does, (mostly cast iron parts
with really light cuts so no big cutting forces involved).

Thank you!

El mar, 5 dic 2023 a las 12:50, andy pugh () escribió:

> On Tue, 5 Dec 2023 at 13:22, Leonardo Marsaglia 
> wrote:
>
> > I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
> > should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the encoder
> > works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I don't know
> > anything about them
>
> Can you identify the encoder? If it is Aa64 then the Fanuc hostmot2
> component ought to work.
>
> https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/man/man9/hostmot2.9.html#Fanuc%20encoder
> (Others might too)
>
> The voltage and current are inside the range of the 8i20.
>
> The 8i20 needs to be externally commutated (In HAL) using the "bldc"
> hal component using the encoder feedback.
>
> I have been using 8i20s in my mill and lathe for several years with
> few problems.
>
> The STMBL drive has a Fanuc encoder component:
> https://github.com/rene-dev/stmbl/blob/master/src/comps/encf.c
> and would probably be a very good choice, if you can find any. They
> aren't really available at the moment without making them yourself and
> sourcing discontinued parts.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[andy pugh]

On Tue, 5 Dec 2023 at 13:22, Leonardo Marsaglia  wrote:

> I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
> should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the encoder
> works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I don't know
> anything about them

Can you identify the encoder? If it is Aa64 then the Fanuc hostmot2
component ought to work.
https://linuxcnc.org/docs/stable/html/man/man9/hostmot2.9.html#Fanuc%20encoder
(Others might too)

The voltage and current are inside the range of the 8i20.

The 8i20 needs to be externally commutated (In HAL) using the "bldc"
hal component using the encoder feedback.

I have been using 8i20s in my mill and lathe for several years with
few problems.

The STMBL drive has a Fanuc encoder component:
https://github.com/rene-dev/stmbl/blob/master/src/comps/encf.c
and would probably be a very good choice, if you can find any. They
aren't really available at the moment without making them yourself and
sourcing discontinued parts.

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[gene heskett]

On 12/5/23 08:17, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:

Hello guys, and thanks for all the replies!

Well, we swapped the majority of the capacitors on the board and we still
get the alarm on the PSU. I'm almost inclined to consider this a LCNC
project and start doing the conversion.

One thing I'm considering before doing that is if It's possible to use the
original Fanuc Servo motors replacing only the drives. I know the drives
will not be usable because they communicate with their own Fanuc serial
protocol, but maybe there's a chance I can use the same motors.

I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the encoder
works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I don't know
anything about them so swapping the servo motors is another option too. I
have several servo motors here just in case this happened so I can use them.

Thanks again a lot for your help guys! Sorry that I don't reply
individually :)



If it comes down to replacing the fanac motors, Leonardo, there is a new 
kid on the block that greatly simplifies the linuxcnc install.


Called closed loop stepper/servo's.

1. PID's in linuxcnc aren't needed, they are self contained in the 
drivers. They do exactly as motion tells them to do


2. Very power efficient, they do not run at full current all the time. 
The internal PID's in the drivers error controls the current to move the 
motor. Motor stays cold if its not working hard.


3. Later drivers from Hanpose are rated for way more voltage, their 
drivers cl42 and cl57 are rated for up to 90 volts, and the driver for 
the bugger nema 34's is good for over 100 volts.  With that sort of 
voltage, steppers limited top speeds are not an issue.


4. they have a logic error output so if they can't get there, they'll 
shut linuxcnc down in its tracks in the next servo threads time. I have 
5 of these motors in service here, 4 for quite a while, a 5th A axis on 
my go704 added just recently. with the motors for the XYZ of that go704 
on a fedex truck someplace right now.


This has been tested here, works, but has yet to occur while running a 
job. The drivers will see the impending error, and hit the motor with 
everything the power supply has, and will in not successful, shut 
themselves down to protect both them and the motor, but signal linuxcnc. 
I've positioned a chuck jaw in front  of a chip carrying tool and run 
that tool into the chuck jaw at speeds way above cutting speeds, the 
carbide chip hits the jaw, the motor is shut down so the freedom bounces 
the chip about 10 thou away from the chuck jaw, the chip is not damaged 
and the chuck jaw is not marked.


But that has yet to occur while actually doing work. So far, for me, 
they Just Work, coolly and quietly. Like Casper the ghost is turning the 
cranks on my 11x54 Sheldon lathe.


One warning though, stay away from hall effect encoders like the 42C 
sized nema-17's uses, must have optical encoders.  The time delay in 
converting the hall effect things into a usable feedback signals makes 
them move in notches, the optical stuff is as smooth as warm butter. The 
42C is ideal for a 3d printer but has been an unmitigated disaster 
because the parts look like they are shingled. For something like 
steering an rc vehicle they will work, but they will NOT move smoothly 
under load. That conversion delay causes a Nyquist error in the feedback 
loop. Opticals are instant feedback.


Bigger & higher voltage supplies for these motors have been slow to 
appear but 60 volt 6.7 amp 400 watters are now available, in machine 
control sizes, on per motor, at sub $40 USD are available and more, 
higher voltage stuff is coming. I'm rebuilding two bigger 3d printers 
with these motors and supply's, and layer shifts will be history. At 500 
to 1500mm second speeds where the usual $300 starter printer is limited 
to 50 or 60mm second speeds. We finally have a stepper that just works, 
without burning your hand if you touch it. So please consider them if 
you have to replace the fanuc's..


Take care & stay well, Leonardo.

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Well, from what I can see on Granite Devices website, their Argon servo
drives are now discontinued so that eliminates one big possibility for
replacing the fanuc drives and keep the motors. I don't know if Pico
systems or MESA has a drive for the power these motors require.
Although I'm not going to use them nearly as hard as they are capable of...

El mar, 5 dic 2023 a las 10:15, Leonardo Marsaglia ()
escribió:

> Hello guys, and thanks for all the replies!
>
> Well, we swapped the majority of the capacitors on the board and we still
> get the alarm on the PSU. I'm almost inclined to consider this a LCNC
> project and start doing the conversion.
>
> One thing I'm considering before doing that is if It's possible to use the
> original Fanuc Servo motors replacing only the drives. I know the drives
> will not be usable because they communicate with their own Fanuc serial
> protocol, but maybe there's a chance I can use the same motors.
>
> I'm attaching a picture of the X axis motor so you can see. I guess it
> should be possible to control it, but I don't really know how the encoder
> works. I know there's a Hostmot encoder module for Fanuc but I don't know
> anything about them so swapping the servo motors is another option too. I
> have several servo motors here just in case this happened so I can use them.
>
> Thanks again a lot for your help guys! Sorry that I don't reply
> individually :)
>
> El dom, 3 dic 2023 a las 9:00, gene heskett ()
> escribió:
>
>> On 12/3/23 04:42, Roland Jollivet wrote:
>> > If you can obtain/borrow any thermal imaging device, then run with the
>> PSU
>> > with covers off and check every 5min. You should identify a cap-thermal
>> > problem.
>> >
>> For that, a $500 ir imager would be nice, but a $29 ir thermometer from
>> the local lumber yard can do as well. Leonardo might even have one of
>> those in his toolbox, if only to check his food for adequate cooking. I
>> do. When I'm on the road, living out of the fridge and microwave of a
>> motel room.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Sat, 2 Dec 2023 at 21:14, John Dammeyer 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >>> From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
>> >>>
>> >>> If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to debug
>> >> and
>> >>> repair,  LIkey it is the caps.
>> >>>
>> >>> But switching power supplies are much harder to debug, You can guess
>> it
>> >>> might be the same issue but these have dozens of parts that can fail..
>> >> In any
>> >>> case, the cost to repair is small.
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> I disagree.  Switching power supplies are way more likely to fail from
>> >> high ESR.  That the system runs for a short while and then fails is
>> again a
>> >> symptom of a capacitor overheating due to high ESR.  Or the voltage is
>> >> right on the edge and as the cap warms up the heat results in a change
>> that
>> >> results in the power supply moving out of spec.There may even be
>> enough
>> >> heat developed on the board that a solder joint becomes unreliable.
>> >>
>> >> In the past even PC motherboards have been repaired by a wholesale
>> swap of
>> >> the electrolytics.
>> >>
>> >> So what I would do is an initial survey of the electrolytic capacitors
>> >> inside the power supply and order a set.  That way the machine can
>> still
>> >> run for an hour or so a day while you wait for parts from a reputable
>> >> source.Then replace the capacitor when they arrive.  That won't
>> prevent
>> >> the power supply from working again and it may well fix the 1 to 2 hour
>> >> failure period.  In either case $30 or so worth of caps is cheap.
>> >> John
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> ___
>> >> Emc-users mailing list
>> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>> >>
>> >
>> > ___
>> > Emc-users mailing list
>> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>> > .
>>
>> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
>> --
>> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>>   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
>> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
>> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>>   - Louis D. Brandeis
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[gene heskett]

On 12/3/23 04:42, Roland Jollivet wrote:

If you can obtain/borrow any thermal imaging device, then run with the PSU
with covers off and check every 5min. You should identify a cap-thermal
problem.

For that, a $500 ir imager would be nice, but a $29 ir thermometer from 
the local lumber yard can do as well. Leonardo might even have one of 
those in his toolbox, if only to check his food for adequate cooking. I 
do. When I'm on the road, living out of the fridge and microwave of a 
motel room.



On Sat, 2 Dec 2023 at 21:14, John Dammeyer  wrote:


From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]

If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to debug

and

repair,  LIkey it is the caps.

But switching power supplies are much harder to debug, You can guess it
might be the same issue but these have dozens of parts that can fail..

In any

case, the cost to repair is small.



I disagree.  Switching power supplies are way more likely to fail from
high ESR.  That the system runs for a short while and then fails is again a
symptom of a capacitor overheating due to high ESR.  Or the voltage is
right on the edge and as the cap warms up the heat results in a change that
results in the power supply moving out of spec.There may even be enough
heat developed on the board that a solder joint becomes unreliable.

In the past even PC motherboards have been repaired by a wholesale swap of
the electrolytics.

So what I would do is an initial survey of the electrolytic capacitors
inside the power supply and order a set.  That way the machine can still
run for an hour or so a day while you wait for parts from a reputable
source.Then replace the capacitor when they arrive.  That won't prevent
the power supply from working again and it may well fix the 1 to 2 hour
failure period.  In either case $30 or so worth of caps is cheap.
John



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Roland Jollivet]

If you can obtain/borrow any thermal imaging device, then run with the PSU
with covers off and check every 5min. You should identify a cap-thermal
problem.



On Sat, 2 Dec 2023 at 21:14, John Dammeyer  wrote:

> > From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> >
> > If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to debug
> and
> > repair,  LIkey it is the caps.
> >
> > But switching power supplies are much harder to debug, You can guess it
> > might be the same issue but these have dozens of parts that can fail..
> In any
> > case, the cost to repair is small.
> >
>
> I disagree.  Switching power supplies are way more likely to fail from
> high ESR.  That the system runs for a short while and then fails is again a
> symptom of a capacitor overheating due to high ESR.  Or the voltage is
> right on the edge and as the cap warms up the heat results in a change that
> results in the power supply moving out of spec.There may even be enough
> heat developed on the board that a solder joint becomes unreliable.
>
> In the past even PC motherboards have been repaired by a wholesale swap of
> the electrolytics.
>
> So what I would do is an initial survey of the electrolytic capacitors
> inside the power supply and order a set.  That way the machine can still
> run for an hour or so a day while you wait for parts from a reputable
> source.Then replace the capacitor when they arrive.  That won't prevent
> the power supply from working again and it may well fix the 1 to 2 hour
> failure period.  In either case $30 or so worth of caps is cheap.
> John
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[gene heskett]

On 12/2/23 14:12, John Dammeyer wrote:

From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]

If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to debug and
repair,  LIkey it is the caps.

But switching power supplies are much harder to debug, You can guess it
might be the same issue but these have dozens of parts that can fail..  In any
case, the cost to repair is small.



I disagree.  Switching power supplies are way more likely to fail from high 
ESR.  That the system runs for a short while and then fails is again a symptom 
of a capacitor overheating due to high ESR.  Or the voltage is right on the 
edge and as the cap warms up the heat results in a change that results in the 
power supply moving out of spec.There may even be enough heat developed on 
the board that a solder joint becomes unreliable.

In the past even PC motherboards have been repaired by a wholesale swap of the 
electrolytics.

So what I would do is an initial survey of the electrolytic capacitors inside 
the power supply and order a set.  That way the machine can still run for an 
hour or so a day while you wait for parts from a reputable source.Then 
replace the capacitor when they arrive.  That won't prevent the power supply 
from working again and it may well fix the 1 to 2 hour failure period.  In 
either case $30 or so worth of caps is cheap.
John



Spot on John.


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[gene heskett]

On 12/2/23 13:00, John Dammeyer wrote:

Replace the electrolytic capacitors in the power supply.If you can get
one of these meters  you can verify this is a good solution by measuring the
one of the old ones with a new one.
https://vi.aliexpress.com/item/4001294233271.html

The 3 phase motor controller on our expensive Bosch Fridge failed after 10
years.  Replacing the capacitors put the power supply voltages that ran the
motor control part back to the correct value.  A new capacitor, IIRC, had an
ESR of about 0.5 ohms.  The old one was 30 Ohms.There was no physical
visual indication that there was a problem.  Fridge has been running
perfectly now a year later.

John
Also true John, but I was assuming Leonardo does not have a decent ESR 
meter. If you don't have one Leonardo, get one, this is a miracle test, 
anything over 2 ohms gets replaced. Decent ones start at around 150 USD.



-Original Message-
From: Leonardo Marsaglia [mailto:ldmarsag...@gmail.com]
Sent: December 2, 2023 7:58 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

Hello everybody, I hope you're all doing well!

Sorry for the OT but I think this is a good place to ask for what I intend
to do.

One of our lathes has this Fanuc OT-C with this a16b-1212-0950 power

supply

which is now failing. I can only use the lathe a couple of hours before

the

control stops working and the PSU lights its alarm led.

The main problem is, these PSU are pretty expensive when purchased new,
and
the ones refurbished take almost three weeks to arrive in my country.

So, one of my ideas to keep the lathe running before I completely retrofit
it to LCNC is to install generic switching PSUs to match the voltages and
fool the CNC and it's control signals (which I don't know if they are too
complicated to fool but apparently there are only a couple of pins on the
PSU for that purpose, so It shouldn't be that complicated).

Is this nonsense? should I even bother? Because the next step really is to
adapt the machine to LCNC and forget about all these problems once and for
all. But if I can manage to fool the control this could be done in a

couple

of hours.

Thanks as always for your help guys!

Leonardo

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users




___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[gene heskett]

On 12/2/23 10:58, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:

Notes from a CET, Leonardo.
Bordeerline semi might be suspect but very rarely take two hows to show 
a problem,  Usually under 10 minutes


Getting closer to the top of the list it might be a carbon composition 
resister, look for discolored paint on them all. I'm amazed at the 
design engineers that never consider the breakdwn voltage of 10 meg 1/2 
wart resistor, it is only 50 volts!


Top of the list is aging electrolytic capacitors, they should NOT heat. 
let it run till it fails, shut it off and feel for any hotter than the 
chassis its sitting on. A ten F difference will be you clue.  If more 
than 5 years old they are about used up anyway.



Hello everybody, I hope you're all doing well!

Sorry for the OT but I think this is a good place to ask for what I intend
to do.

One of our lathes has this Fanuc OT-C with this a16b-1212-0950 power supply
which is now failing. I can only use the lathe a couple of hours before the
control stops working and the PSU lights its alarm led.

The main problem is, these PSU are pretty expensive when purchased new, and
the ones refurbished take almost three weeks to arrive in my country.

So, one of my ideas to keep the lathe running before I completely retrofit
it to LCNC is to install generic switching PSUs to match the voltages and
fool the CNC and it's control signals (which I don't know if they are too
complicated to fool but apparently there are only a couple of pins on the
PSU for that purpose, so It shouldn't be that complicated).

Is this nonsense? should I even bother? Because the next step really is to
adapt the machine to LCNC and forget about all these problems once and for
all. But if I can manage to fool the control this could be done in a couple
of hours.

Thanks as always for your help guys!

Leonardo


Take care & stay well, and good luck Leonardo.

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
.


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[John Dammeyer]

> From: Chris Albertson [mailto:albertson.ch...@gmail.com]
> 
> If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to debug and
> repair,  LIkey it is the caps.
> 
> But switching power supplies are much harder to debug, You can guess it
> might be the same issue but these have dozens of parts that can fail..  In any
> case, the cost to repair is small.
> 

I disagree.  Switching power supplies are way more likely to fail from high 
ESR.  That the system runs for a short while and then fails is again a symptom 
of a capacitor overheating due to high ESR.  Or the voltage is right on the 
edge and as the cap warms up the heat results in a change that results in the 
power supply moving out of spec.There may even be enough heat developed on 
the board that a solder joint becomes unreliable.

In the past even PC motherboards have been repaired by a wholesale swap of the 
electrolytics.

So what I would do is an initial survey of the electrolytic capacitors inside 
the power supply and order a set.  That way the machine can still run for an 
hour or so a day while you wait for parts from a reputable source.Then 
replace the capacitor when they arrive.  That won't prevent the power supply 
from working again and it may well fix the 1 to 2 hour failure period.  In 
either case $30 or so worth of caps is cheap.
John



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Chris Albertson]

If it is a simple linear power supply, yes they are very easy to debug and 
repair,  LIkey it is the caps.

But switching power supplies are much harder to debug, You can guess it might 
be the same issue but these have dozens of parts that can fail..  In any case, 
the cost to repair is small.

On the other hand, you might be able to replace the power supply with a PC 
power supply that you already have inside some older “junk” computer.

> On Dec 2, 2023, at 9:58 AM, John Dammeyer  wrote:
> 
> Replace the electrolytic capacitors in the power supply.If you can get
> one of these meters  you can verify this is a good solution by measuring the
> one of the old ones with a new one.
> https://vi.aliexpress.com/item/4001294233271.html
> 
> The 3 phase motor controller on our expensive Bosch Fridge failed after 10
> years.  Replacing the capacitors put the power supply voltages that ran the
> motor control part back to the correct value.  A new capacitor, IIRC, had an
> ESR of about 0.5 ohms.  The old one was 30 Ohms.There was no physical
> visual indication that there was a problem.  Fridge has been running
> perfectly now a year later.
> 
> John
> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Leonardo Marsaglia [mailto:ldmarsag...@gmail.com]
>> Sent: December 2, 2023 7:58 AM
>> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
>> Subject: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950
>> 
>> Hello everybody, I hope you're all doing well!
>> 
>> Sorry for the OT but I think this is a good place to ask for what I intend
>> to do.
>> 
>> One of our lathes has this Fanuc OT-C with this a16b-1212-0950 power
> supply
>> which is now failing. I can only use the lathe a couple of hours before
> the
>> control stops working and the PSU lights its alarm led.
>> 
>> The main problem is, these PSU are pretty expensive when purchased new,
>> and
>> the ones refurbished take almost three weeks to arrive in my country.
>> 
>> So, one of my ideas to keep the lathe running before I completely retrofit
>> it to LCNC is to install generic switching PSUs to match the voltages and
>> fool the CNC and it's control signals (which I don't know if they are too
>> complicated to fool but apparently there are only a couple of pins on the
>> PSU for that purpose, so It shouldn't be that complicated).
>> 
>> Is this nonsense? should I even bother? Because the next step really is to
>> adapt the machine to LCNC and forget about all these problems once and for
>> all. But if I can manage to fool the control this could be done in a
> couple
>> of hours.
>> 
>> Thanks as always for your help guys!
>> 
>> Leonardo
>> 
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[John Dammeyer]

Replace the electrolytic capacitors in the power supply.If you can get
one of these meters  you can verify this is a good solution by measuring the
one of the old ones with a new one.
https://vi.aliexpress.com/item/4001294233271.html

The 3 phase motor controller on our expensive Bosch Fridge failed after 10
years.  Replacing the capacitors put the power supply voltages that ran the
motor control part back to the correct value.  A new capacitor, IIRC, had an
ESR of about 0.5 ohms.  The old one was 30 Ohms.There was no physical
visual indication that there was a problem.  Fridge has been running
perfectly now a year later.

John

> -Original Message-
> From: Leonardo Marsaglia [mailto:ldmarsag...@gmail.com]
> Sent: December 2, 2023 7:58 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950
> 
> Hello everybody, I hope you're all doing well!
> 
> Sorry for the OT but I think this is a good place to ask for what I intend
> to do.
> 
> One of our lathes has this Fanuc OT-C with this a16b-1212-0950 power
supply
> which is now failing. I can only use the lathe a couple of hours before
the
> control stops working and the PSU lights its alarm led.
> 
> The main problem is, these PSU are pretty expensive when purchased new,
> and
> the ones refurbished take almost three weeks to arrive in my country.
> 
> So, one of my ideas to keep the lathe running before I completely retrofit
> it to LCNC is to install generic switching PSUs to match the voltages and
> fool the CNC and it's control signals (which I don't know if they are too
> complicated to fool but apparently there are only a couple of pins on the
> PSU for that purpose, so It shouldn't be that complicated).
> 
> Is this nonsense? should I even bother? Because the next step really is to
> adapt the machine to LCNC and forget about all these problems once and for
> all. But if I can manage to fool the control this could be done in a
couple
> of hours.
> 
> Thanks as always for your help guys!
> 
> Leonardo
> 
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] OT Fanuc ot-c cpu power supply A16B-1212-0950

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Hello everybody, I hope you're all doing well!

Sorry for the OT but I think this is a good place to ask for what I intend
to do.

One of our lathes has this Fanuc OT-C with this a16b-1212-0950 power supply
which is now failing. I can only use the lathe a couple of hours before the
control stops working and the PSU lights its alarm led.

The main problem is, these PSU are pretty expensive when purchased new, and
the ones refurbished take almost three weeks to arrive in my country.

So, one of my ideas to keep the lathe running before I completely retrofit
it to LCNC is to install generic switching PSUs to match the voltages and
fool the CNC and it's control signals (which I don't know if they are too
complicated to fool but apparently there are only a couple of pins on the
PSU for that purpose, so It shouldn't be that complicated).

Is this nonsense? should I even bother? Because the next step really is to
adapt the machine to LCNC and forget about all these problems once and for
all. But if I can manage to fool the control this could be done in a couple
of hours.

Thanks as always for your help guys!

Leonardo

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Hello again guys.

Just to tell you. I finally took the drive apart and made some checks.
Turns out one of the IGBT modules is shorted. So I'll replace that and it
should be working again.

El mar., 13 de junio de 2023 05:08, gene heskett 
escribió:

> On 6/13/23 01:41, andrew beck wrote:
> > Just to confirm also
> >
> > Gene.
> >
> > My vfd only holds the motor at full torque to resist loads briefly.
> >
> > So it never actually causes problems
> >
> >
> > I think the rating is 1min at the 150 percent rated torque.
> >
> > So it's only to respond to forces and make a good fast pid loop
> >
> > Not to run that way all the time
> >
> It appears fanuc thought of that better than linuxcnc does, altho it may
> be possible where the vfd is controlled by something like the serial
> interface I'm using on the 6040 mill, which speaks rs485 to control its
> water cooled spindle. But thats a 24k rpm spindle which I don't run
> below 2k and it doesn't have much torque at 2k and it warms the water up
> pretty fast below 8k. In this case however, the pid is in the vfd, and
> appears to be quite tightly controlled. Apparently the vfd autotunes.
> That one Just Works so I haven't investigated further. No pids involved
> anyplace else except the one in the 3 phase stepper/servo on axis B.
> Ditto my sheldon lathe, which now has 3 phase stepper/servo's, with the
> loss of home signal stopping linuxcnc in its tracks by e-stop linkage in
> the hal file, in about a millisecond. Works when tested, has yet to trip
> in use.
>
> I do use a pid on the other mill, a g0704 which has a 1hp rated brushed
> dc motor controlled by one of Jon's pwm-servo drivers, that control is
> very tight, no audible rev change right up to stall but I hear the iron
> in the motor squeaking as the servo amps current limit, set at 2x the
> motor nameplate FLA, kicks in. Been running that way for around 8 years
> now, still on the original brushes. Because Jon's amp is full 4 quadrant
> control, the rigid tap turnaround voltage hits about 170 volts for a few
> milliseconds, 125 normally on a 90 volt motor. All this isn't much use
> to you though, just stating what can be done with linuxcnc.
>
> Thanks for the clarification Andrew.  Take care & stay well.
> [...]
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>   - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[gene heskett]

On 6/13/23 01:41, andrew beck wrote:

Just to confirm also

Gene.

My vfd only holds the motor at full torque to resist loads briefly.

So it never actually causes problems


I think the rating is 1min at the 150 percent rated torque.

So it's only to respond to forces and make a good fast pid loop

Not to run that way all the time

It appears fanuc thought of that better than linuxcnc does, altho it may 
be possible where the vfd is controlled by something like the serial 
interface I'm using on the 6040 mill, which speaks rs485 to control its 
water cooled spindle. But thats a 24k rpm spindle which I don't run 
below 2k and it doesn't have much torque at 2k and it warms the water up 
pretty fast below 8k. In this case however, the pid is in the vfd, and 
appears to be quite tightly controlled. Apparently the vfd autotunes. 
That one Just Works so I haven't investigated further. No pids involved 
anyplace else except the one in the 3 phase stepper/servo on axis B. 
Ditto my sheldon lathe, which now has 3 phase stepper/servo's, with the 
loss of home signal stopping linuxcnc in its tracks by e-stop linkage in 
the hal file, in about a millisecond. Works when tested, has yet to trip 
in use.


I do use a pid on the other mill, a g0704 which has a 1hp rated brushed 
dc motor controlled by one of Jon's pwm-servo drivers, that control is 
very tight, no audible rev change right up to stall but I hear the iron 
in the motor squeaking as the servo amps current limit, set at 2x the 
motor nameplate FLA, kicks in. Been running that way for around 8 years 
now, still on the original brushes. Because Jon's amp is full 4 quadrant 
control, the rigid tap turnaround voltage hits about 170 volts for a few 
milliseconds, 125 normally on a 90 volt motor. All this isn't much use 
to you though, just stating what can be done with linuxcnc.


Thanks for the clarification Andrew.  Take care & stay well.
[...]

Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[andrew beck]

Just to confirm also

Gene.

My vfd only holds the motor at full torque to resist loads briefly.

So it never actually causes problems


I think the rating is 1min at the 150 percent rated torque.

So it's only to respond to forces and make a good fast pid loop

Not to run that way all the time

On Tue, 13 Jun 2023, 16:19 Leonardo Marsaglia, 
wrote:

> >
> > Wrong atribution Leonardo. It was posted by Andrew Beck, I was just
> > commenting that it appears Andrew was overdriving the motors a bit.
> >
>
> That's ok Gene :)
>
> I just wanted to clarify because some older Fanuc spindle drives (the mazak
> that's from 1983 had one of those) worked with 0-10 volts for speed command
> and are easy to replace. But these apparently are not that friendly. I
> would love to install LCNC on this lathe like on any machine, but that
> would take several weeks easily so It's not the happiest option at the
> moment.
>
> El mar, 13 jun 2023 a las 1:05, gene heskett ()
> escribió:
>
> > On 6/12/23 22:58, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:
> > > Guys, just to clarify, the control is still Fanuc, not LCNC. So I need
> to
> > > interface with the Fanuc control. Also, the drives on this lathe are
> all
> > > using serial communications (the lathe is from 1997) so I think it's
> not
> > > that easy to replace an original drive for a non Fanuc one. That's why
> > I'm
> > > just hoping there's some kind of interface to convert the signals
> from/to
> > > the fanuc control to use a standard VFD. If not, I guess I'll have to
> > > replace the drive entirely and try to repair the one that's not working
> > > without the rush of getting the machine working again.
> > >
> > > El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 17:36, gene heskett ()
> > > escribió:
> > >
> >
> > Wrong atribution Leonardo. It was posted by Andrew Beck, I was just
> > commenting that it appears Andrew was overdriving the motors a bit.
> >
> > >> On 6/12/23 15:58, andrew beck wrote:
> > >>> Leon I use a cheap Chinese vfd costs about 190usd
> > >>>
> > >>> And buy a encoder for it.  About 50usd and I'm controlling two fanuc
> > >>> spindle motors here fine.
> > >>>
> > >>> They auto tuned the motor in about 4 secs and run awesome.
> > >>>
> > >>> I can get 150 percent torque at zero rpm.  If I run a pid loop in
> > >> linuxcnc
> > >>> almost a servo level control response
> > >>>
> > >>> Have a look at the video there are links on there.  I made it a few
> > >> months
> > >>> ago
> > >>>
> > >>> https://youtu.be/vARlybdtC6Q
> > >>>
> > >>> I'll message you in WhatsApp too.
> > ^^
> > did you get that msg?
> > >>>
> > >>> On Tue, 13 Jun 2023, 07:40 Leonardo Marsaglia, <
> ldmarsag...@gmail.com>
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>>
> >  Forgot to attach a picture of the label on the spindle drive. Sorry.
> > 
> >  El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 16:33, Leonardo Marsaglia (<
> >  ldmarsag...@gmail.com>)
> >  escribió:
> > 
> > > Hi guys, I hope you're all doing well
> > >
> > > Sorry for the OT but we have a problem with a Daewoo lathe and as
> > >> always
> > > this is the first place I think of.
> > >
> > > So, this morning the lathe started up as always, but when we
> selected
> > >> the
> > > gear to validate the spindle movement the screen showed a 409 SERVO
> > >> ALARM
> > > and the spindle drive on the back was showing alarm number 12. From
> > >> what
> >  I
> > > could find on several forums this is an overload alarm and in the
> > worst
> > > case scenario the IGBT firing module or the IGBT module itself
> could
> > be
> > > damaged.
> > >
> > > Is there any way to check this in an easy manner?
> > >
> > >Also, is it possible to adapt a normal VFD in case this is the
> > >> problem?
> > > Because maybe there are some Fanuc Serial protocol to analog
> voltage
> > > converters (I'm just wishing such an adapter exists) that could be
> > >> used.
> > >
> > > Thanks as always for your help!
> > >
> > > Leonardo
> > >
> > >> Might be ok for short term operation, Leonardo, but 150% at zero rpm
> > >> tells me the vfd's max low speed boost exceeds the motors FLA, aka
> Full
> > >> Load Amps.  The vfd should have a variable to fix that.  Most do
> > >> anyway..  Also, most vfd's will have a minimum hz setting which should
> > >> turn off the drive below around 10% of 60 hz.  I have mine set to
> > >> disable at 5hz. I can do 5.5 for half an hour and still lay my hand on
> > >> the motor w/o burning it.  Who needs a backgear?
> >  ___
> >  Emc-users mailing list
> >  Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >  https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > 
> > >>>
> > >>> ___
> > >>> Emc-users mailing list
> > >>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >>
> > >> Cheers, Gene Heskett.

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

>
> Wrong atribution Leonardo. It was posted by Andrew Beck, I was just
> commenting that it appears Andrew was overdriving the motors a bit.
>

That's ok Gene :)

I just wanted to clarify because some older Fanuc spindle drives (the mazak
that's from 1983 had one of those) worked with 0-10 volts for speed command
and are easy to replace. But these apparently are not that friendly. I
would love to install LCNC on this lathe like on any machine, but that
would take several weeks easily so It's not the happiest option at the
moment.

El mar, 13 jun 2023 a las 1:05, gene heskett ()
escribió:

> On 6/12/23 22:58, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:
> > Guys, just to clarify, the control is still Fanuc, not LCNC. So I need to
> > interface with the Fanuc control. Also, the drives on this lathe are all
> > using serial communications (the lathe is from 1997) so I think it's not
> > that easy to replace an original drive for a non Fanuc one. That's why
> I'm
> > just hoping there's some kind of interface to convert the signals from/to
> > the fanuc control to use a standard VFD. If not, I guess I'll have to
> > replace the drive entirely and try to repair the one that's not working
> > without the rush of getting the machine working again.
> >
> > El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 17:36, gene heskett ()
> > escribió:
> >
>
> Wrong atribution Leonardo. It was posted by Andrew Beck, I was just
> commenting that it appears Andrew was overdriving the motors a bit.
>
> >> On 6/12/23 15:58, andrew beck wrote:
> >>> Leon I use a cheap Chinese vfd costs about 190usd
> >>>
> >>> And buy a encoder for it.  About 50usd and I'm controlling two fanuc
> >>> spindle motors here fine.
> >>>
> >>> They auto tuned the motor in about 4 secs and run awesome.
> >>>
> >>> I can get 150 percent torque at zero rpm.  If I run a pid loop in
> >> linuxcnc
> >>> almost a servo level control response
> >>>
> >>> Have a look at the video there are links on there.  I made it a few
> >> months
> >>> ago
> >>>
> >>> https://youtu.be/vARlybdtC6Q
> >>>
> >>> I'll message you in WhatsApp too.
> ^^
> did you get that msg?
> >>>
> >>> On Tue, 13 Jun 2023, 07:40 Leonardo Marsaglia, 
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
>  Forgot to attach a picture of the label on the spindle drive. Sorry.
> 
>  El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 16:33, Leonardo Marsaglia (<
>  ldmarsag...@gmail.com>)
>  escribió:
> 
> > Hi guys, I hope you're all doing well
> >
> > Sorry for the OT but we have a problem with a Daewoo lathe and as
> >> always
> > this is the first place I think of.
> >
> > So, this morning the lathe started up as always, but when we selected
> >> the
> > gear to validate the spindle movement the screen showed a 409 SERVO
> >> ALARM
> > and the spindle drive on the back was showing alarm number 12. From
> >> what
>  I
> > could find on several forums this is an overload alarm and in the
> worst
> > case scenario the IGBT firing module or the IGBT module itself could
> be
> > damaged.
> >
> > Is there any way to check this in an easy manner?
> >
> >Also, is it possible to adapt a normal VFD in case this is the
> >> problem?
> > Because maybe there are some Fanuc Serial protocol to analog voltage
> > converters (I'm just wishing such an adapter exists) that could be
> >> used.
> >
> > Thanks as always for your help!
> >
> > Leonardo
> >
> >> Might be ok for short term operation, Leonardo, but 150% at zero rpm
> >> tells me the vfd's max low speed boost exceeds the motors FLA, aka Full
> >> Load Amps.  The vfd should have a variable to fix that.  Most do
> >> anyway..  Also, most vfd's will have a minimum hz setting which should
> >> turn off the drive below around 10% of 60 hz.  I have mine set to
> >> disable at 5hz. I can do 5.5 for half an hour and still lay my hand on
> >> the motor w/o burning it.  Who needs a backgear?
>  ___
>  Emc-users mailing list
>  Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>  https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> 
> >>>
> >>> ___
> >>> Emc-users mailing list
> >>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >>
> >> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> >> --
> >> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
> >>soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> >> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> >> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law
> respectable.
> >>- Louis D. Brandeis
> >> Genes Web page 
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> ___
> >> Emc-users mailing list
> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >>
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-us

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[gene heskett]

On 6/12/23 22:58, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:

Guys, just to clarify, the control is still Fanuc, not LCNC. So I need to
interface with the Fanuc control. Also, the drives on this lathe are all
using serial communications (the lathe is from 1997) so I think it's not
that easy to replace an original drive for a non Fanuc one. That's why I'm
just hoping there's some kind of interface to convert the signals from/to
the fanuc control to use a standard VFD. If not, I guess I'll have to
replace the drive entirely and try to repair the one that's not working
without the rush of getting the machine working again.

El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 17:36, gene heskett ()
escribió:



Wrong atribution Leonardo. It was posted by Andrew Beck, I was just 
commenting that it appears Andrew was overdriving the motors a bit.



On 6/12/23 15:58, andrew beck wrote:

Leon I use a cheap Chinese vfd costs about 190usd

And buy a encoder for it.  About 50usd and I'm controlling two fanuc
spindle motors here fine.

They auto tuned the motor in about 4 secs and run awesome.

I can get 150 percent torque at zero rpm.  If I run a pid loop in

linuxcnc

almost a servo level control response

Have a look at the video there are links on there.  I made it a few

months

ago

https://youtu.be/vARlybdtC6Q

I'll message you in WhatsApp too.

^^
did you get that msg?


On Tue, 13 Jun 2023, 07:40 Leonardo Marsaglia, 
wrote:


Forgot to attach a picture of the label on the spindle drive. Sorry.

El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 16:33, Leonardo Marsaglia (<
ldmarsag...@gmail.com>)
escribió:


Hi guys, I hope you're all doing well

Sorry for the OT but we have a problem with a Daewoo lathe and as

always

this is the first place I think of.

So, this morning the lathe started up as always, but when we selected

the

gear to validate the spindle movement the screen showed a 409 SERVO

ALARM

and the spindle drive on the back was showing alarm number 12. From

what

I

could find on several forums this is an overload alarm and in the worst
case scenario the IGBT firing module or the IGBT module itself could be
damaged.

Is there any way to check this in an easy manner?

   Also, is it possible to adapt a normal VFD in case this is the

problem?

Because maybe there are some Fanuc Serial protocol to analog voltage
converters (I'm just wishing such an adapter exists) that could be

used.


Thanks as always for your help!

Leonardo


Might be ok for short term operation, Leonardo, but 150% at zero rpm
tells me the vfd's max low speed boost exceeds the motors FLA, aka Full
Load Amps.  The vfd should have a variable to fix that.  Most do
anyway..  Also, most vfd's will have a minimum hz setting which should
turn off the drive below around 10% of 60 hz.  I have mine set to
disable at 5hz. I can do 5.5 for half an hour and still lay my hand on
the motor w/o burning it.  Who needs a backgear?

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
   - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Guys, just to clarify, the control is still Fanuc, not LCNC. So I need to
interface with the Fanuc control. Also, the drives on this lathe are all
using serial communications (the lathe is from 1997) so I think it's not
that easy to replace an original drive for a non Fanuc one. That's why I'm
just hoping there's some kind of interface to convert the signals from/to
the fanuc control to use a standard VFD. If not, I guess I'll have to
replace the drive entirely and try to repair the one that's not working
without the rush of getting the machine working again.

El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 17:36, gene heskett ()
escribió:

> On 6/12/23 15:58, andrew beck wrote:
> > Leon I use a cheap Chinese vfd costs about 190usd
> >
> > And buy a encoder for it.  About 50usd and I'm controlling two fanuc
> > spindle motors here fine.
> >
> > They auto tuned the motor in about 4 secs and run awesome.
> >
> > I can get 150 percent torque at zero rpm.  If I run a pid loop in
> linuxcnc
> > almost a servo level control response
> >
> > Have a look at the video there are links on there.  I made it a few
> months
> > ago
> >
> > https://youtu.be/vARlybdtC6Q
> >
> > I'll message you in WhatsApp too.
> >
> > On Tue, 13 Jun 2023, 07:40 Leonardo Marsaglia, 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Forgot to attach a picture of the label on the spindle drive. Sorry.
> >>
> >> El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 16:33, Leonardo Marsaglia (<
> >> ldmarsag...@gmail.com>)
> >> escribió:
> >>
> >>> Hi guys, I hope you're all doing well
> >>>
> >>> Sorry for the OT but we have a problem with a Daewoo lathe and as
> always
> >>> this is the first place I think of.
> >>>
> >>> So, this morning the lathe started up as always, but when we selected
> the
> >>> gear to validate the spindle movement the screen showed a 409 SERVO
> ALARM
> >>> and the spindle drive on the back was showing alarm number 12. From
> what
> >> I
> >>> could find on several forums this is an overload alarm and in the worst
> >>> case scenario the IGBT firing module or the IGBT module itself could be
> >>> damaged.
> >>>
> >>> Is there any way to check this in an easy manner?
> >>>
> >>>   Also, is it possible to adapt a normal VFD in case this is the
> problem?
> >>> Because maybe there are some Fanuc Serial protocol to analog voltage
> >>> converters (I'm just wishing such an adapter exists) that could be
> used.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks as always for your help!
> >>>
> >>> Leonardo
> >>>
> Might be ok for short term operation, Leonardo, but 150% at zero rpm
> tells me the vfd's max low speed boost exceeds the motors FLA, aka Full
> Load Amps.  The vfd should have a variable to fix that.  Most do
> anyway..  Also, most vfd's will have a minimum hz setting which should
> turn off the drive below around 10% of 60 hz.  I have mine set to
> disable at 5hz. I can do 5.5 for half an hour and still lay my hand on
> the motor w/o burning it.  Who needs a backgear?
> >> ___
> >> Emc-users mailing list
> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >>
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
> Cheers, Gene Heskett.
> --
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>   soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
> If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
>   - Louis D. Brandeis
> Genes Web page 
>
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[gene heskett]

On 6/12/23 15:58, andrew beck wrote:

Leon I use a cheap Chinese vfd costs about 190usd

And buy a encoder for it.  About 50usd and I'm controlling two fanuc
spindle motors here fine.

They auto tuned the motor in about 4 secs and run awesome.

I can get 150 percent torque at zero rpm.  If I run a pid loop in linuxcnc
almost a servo level control response

Have a look at the video there are links on there.  I made it a few months
ago

https://youtu.be/vARlybdtC6Q

I'll message you in WhatsApp too.

On Tue, 13 Jun 2023, 07:40 Leonardo Marsaglia, 
wrote:


Forgot to attach a picture of the label on the spindle drive. Sorry.

El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 16:33, Leonardo Marsaglia (<
ldmarsag...@gmail.com>)
escribió:


Hi guys, I hope you're all doing well

Sorry for the OT but we have a problem with a Daewoo lathe and as always
this is the first place I think of.

So, this morning the lathe started up as always, but when we selected the
gear to validate the spindle movement the screen showed a 409 SERVO ALARM
and the spindle drive on the back was showing alarm number 12. From what

I

could find on several forums this is an overload alarm and in the worst
case scenario the IGBT firing module or the IGBT module itself could be
damaged.

Is there any way to check this in an easy manner?

  Also, is it possible to adapt a normal VFD in case this is the problem?
Because maybe there are some Fanuc Serial protocol to analog voltage
converters (I'm just wishing such an adapter exists) that could be used.

Thanks as always for your help!

Leonardo

Might be ok for short term operation, Leonardo, but 150% at zero rpm 
tells me the vfd's max low speed boost exceeds the motors FLA, aka Full 
Load Amps.  The vfd should have a variable to fix that.  Most do 
anyway..  Also, most vfd's will have a minimum hz setting which should 
turn off the drive below around 10% of 60 hz.  I have mine set to 
disable at 5hz. I can do 5.5 for half an hour and still lay my hand on 
the motor w/o burning it.  Who needs a backgear?

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[gene heskett]

On 6/12/23 15:36, Leonardo Marsaglia wrote:

Forgot to attach a picture of the label on the spindle drive. Sorry.

El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 16:33, Leonardo Marsaglia ()
escribió:


Hi guys, I hope you're all doing well

Sorry for the OT but we have a problem with a Daewoo lathe and as always
this is the first place I think of.

So, this morning the lathe started up as always, but when we selected the
gear to validate the spindle movement the screen showed a 409 SERVO ALARM
and the spindle drive on the back was showing alarm number 12. From what I
could find on several forums this is an overload alarm and in the worst
case scenario the IGBT firing module or the IGBT module itself could be
damaged.

Is there any way to check this in an easy manner?

  Also, is it possible to adapt a normal VFD in case this is the problem?
Because maybe there are some Fanuc Serial protocol to analog voltage
converters (I'm just wishing such an adapter exists) that could be used.

Thanks as always for your help!

Leonardo


Is there a schematic?




___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


Cheers, Gene Heskett.
--
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author, 1940)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[andrew beck]

Leon I use a cheap Chinese vfd costs about 190usd

And buy a encoder for it.  About 50usd and I'm controlling two fanuc
spindle motors here fine.

They auto tuned the motor in about 4 secs and run awesome.

I can get 150 percent torque at zero rpm.  If I run a pid loop in linuxcnc
almost a servo level control response

Have a look at the video there are links on there.  I made it a few months
ago

https://youtu.be/vARlybdtC6Q

I'll message you in WhatsApp too.

On Tue, 13 Jun 2023, 07:40 Leonardo Marsaglia, 
wrote:

> Forgot to attach a picture of the label on the spindle drive. Sorry.
>
> El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 16:33, Leonardo Marsaglia (<
> ldmarsag...@gmail.com>)
> escribió:
>
> > Hi guys, I hope you're all doing well
> >
> > Sorry for the OT but we have a problem with a Daewoo lathe and as always
> > this is the first place I think of.
> >
> > So, this morning the lathe started up as always, but when we selected the
> > gear to validate the spindle movement the screen showed a 409 SERVO ALARM
> > and the spindle drive on the back was showing alarm number 12. From what
> I
> > could find on several forums this is an overload alarm and in the worst
> > case scenario the IGBT firing module or the IGBT module itself could be
> > damaged.
> >
> > Is there any way to check this in an easy manner?
> >
> >  Also, is it possible to adapt a normal VFD in case this is the problem?
> > Because maybe there are some Fanuc Serial protocol to analog voltage
> > converters (I'm just wishing such an adapter exists) that could be used.
> >
> > Thanks as always for your help!
> >
> > Leonardo
> >
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Forgot to attach a picture of the label on the spindle drive. Sorry.

El lun, 12 jun 2023 a las 16:33, Leonardo Marsaglia ()
escribió:

> Hi guys, I hope you're all doing well
>
> Sorry for the OT but we have a problem with a Daewoo lathe and as always
> this is the first place I think of.
>
> So, this morning the lathe started up as always, but when we selected the
> gear to validate the spindle movement the screen showed a 409 SERVO ALARM
> and the spindle drive on the back was showing alarm number 12. From what I
> could find on several forums this is an overload alarm and in the worst
> case scenario the IGBT firing module or the IGBT module itself could be
> damaged.
>
> Is there any way to check this in an easy manner?
>
>  Also, is it possible to adapt a normal VFD in case this is the problem?
> Because maybe there are some Fanuc Serial protocol to analog voltage
> converters (I'm just wishing such an adapter exists) that could be used.
>
> Thanks as always for your help!
>
> Leonardo
>
___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] OT: Fanuc spindle drive

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Hi guys, I hope you're all doing well

Sorry for the OT but we have a problem with a Daewoo lathe and as always
this is the first place I think of.

So, this morning the lathe started up as always, but when we selected the
gear to validate the spindle movement the screen showed a 409 SERVO ALARM
and the spindle drive on the back was showing alarm number 12. From what I
could find on several forums this is an overload alarm and in the worst
case scenario the IGBT firing module or the IGBT module itself could be
damaged.

Is there any way to check this in an easy manner?

 Also, is it possible to adapt a normal VFD in case this is the problem?
Because maybe there are some Fanuc Serial protocol to analog voltage
converters (I'm just wishing such an adapter exists) that could be used.

Thanks as always for your help!

Leonardo

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc output data to PC

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Solved! The baud rate was wrong on the PC. I checked that several times,
but I'm obviously not quite awake yet...

El sáb, 2 oct 2021 a las 12:27, Leonardo Marsaglia ()
escribió:

> Hello guys,
>
> Sorry for this off topic question but I always find this list as the best
> place to start looking for help.
>
> I'm trying to send programs and parameters from a 1997 Daewoo Puma 12L
> which is equipped with a Fanuc OT control.
>
> The comunnication seems to be ok because I'm receiving data. The problem
> is, my data are only symbols that are impossible to read. I have the ISO
> parameter set to 1 but I don't know if that's the problem.
>
> I would be very thankful If you can give me a hand with this.
>
> Thanks as always!
>
> Leonardo
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] OT: Fanuc output data to PC

[Leonardo Marsaglia]

Hello guys,

Sorry for this off topic question but I always find this list as the best
place to start looking for help.

I'm trying to send programs and parameters from a 1997 Daewoo Puma 12L
which is equipped with a Fanuc OT control.

The comunnication seems to be ok because I'm receiving data. The problem
is, my data are only symbols that are impossible to read. I have the ISO
parameter set to 1 but I don't know if that's the problem.

I would be very thankful If you can give me a hand with this.

Thanks as always!

Leonardo

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Ralph Stirling]

Good to know, Phil.  I don't have any burning questions at
the moment, but they could crop up at any moment.

The NVX is mapps IV.

-- Ralph

From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 12:53 PM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University email 
system.


I'm in New Jersey but I can help with anything applications related you may
have questions with. Is it a mapps 4 or 5 machine?

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fc%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7C65ddce958317421f082908d9489381dd%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620620638787107%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=W81fNThGE3KhNeny3z2h%2Fc9k3DKQC59eAX226Vv4TcY%3D&reserved=0

Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.patreon.com%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7C65ddce958317421f082908d9489381dd%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620620638787107%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=yVawLltfijQM9irSWA5u4itOsojduY3L%2BeCcaT5BfjU%3D&reserved=0

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 3:49 PM Ralph Stirling 
wrote:

> No mapps on the Dura.  The NVX has mapps.  Are you in
> Davis?  Our NVX was serial number 1, donated from Davis.
> They bought our Haas TM-1 as a trade-in and shipped us
> the NVX.  Only tech support I can get on it is from engineers
> at Mori Mfg in Davis, since the 800 tech support line has no
> information about this unit.
>
> -- Ralph
> 
> From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 12:22 PM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!
>
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email system.
>
>
> Yeah we only made those for a few years. Not a big seller. Good machine but
> limited in options and the NL/NLX is just a better seller. You have the
> straight fanuc or mapps overlay?
>
> You'll never guess who I work for 😅
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 3:10 PM Ralph Stirling <
> ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu>
> wrote:
>
> > This Dura is a 2007 model.  I haven't tried G20 since
> > we first got it going, so don't recall exactly what the
> > issues were, but remember being very startled when
> > all the offsets were suddenly wrong when G20 was called.
> > Solution was instant and total metrification for cnc
> > machining in my lab :-).  Since few of my students have
> > any significant prior experience machining, they don't
> > generally grumble about giving up "thou's".
> >
> > The other Fanuc quirk that catches them is forgetting
> > decimal points on whole numbers.  X10 is 10microns
> > not 10mm, while X10.0 is 10mm.  It's turned a few
> > parts into big spiral chips on the finishing pass.
> >
> > -- Ralph
> > 
> > From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 11:55 AM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!
> >
> > CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> > email system.
> >
> >
> > On the dura, is the issue that it just moves the decimal instead of
> > converting the values? That's just a parameter change.
> >
> > I don't recall the dura using tc controls, i thought those started with
> td?
> > I may be wrong, it's been a while since i saw one of those in the wild.
> >
> > Phil T.
> > The Feral Engineer
> >
> > Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> >
> >
> > Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 2:21 PM Ralph Stirling <
> > ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I forbid G20 on the Mori Duraturn in my lab for that exact reason.  It
> > has
> > > a Fanuc 0i-TC.  I figure 21st century engineering students should
> develop
> > > some feel for metric measurements anyway.  Just to be safe I also
> require
> > > G21 on our Mori NVX mill e

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Feral Engineer]

I'm in New Jersey but I can help with anything applications related you may
have questions with. Is it a mapps 4 or 5 machine?

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer

Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
www.patreon.com/theferalengineer

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 3:49 PM Ralph Stirling 
wrote:

> No mapps on the Dura.  The NVX has mapps.  Are you in
> Davis?  Our NVX was serial number 1, donated from Davis.
> They bought our Haas TM-1 as a trade-in and shipped us
> the NVX.  Only tech support I can get on it is from engineers
> at Mori Mfg in Davis, since the 800 tech support line has no
> information about this unit.
>
> -- Ralph
> 
> From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 12:22 PM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!
>
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email system.
>
>
> Yeah we only made those for a few years. Not a big seller. Good machine but
> limited in options and the NL/NLX is just a better seller. You have the
> straight fanuc or mapps overlay?
>
> You'll never guess who I work for 😅
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 3:10 PM Ralph Stirling <
> ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu>
> wrote:
>
> > This Dura is a 2007 model.  I haven't tried G20 since
> > we first got it going, so don't recall exactly what the
> > issues were, but remember being very startled when
> > all the offsets were suddenly wrong when G20 was called.
> > Solution was instant and total metrification for cnc
> > machining in my lab :-).  Since few of my students have
> > any significant prior experience machining, they don't
> > generally grumble about giving up "thou's".
> >
> > The other Fanuc quirk that catches them is forgetting
> > decimal points on whole numbers.  X10 is 10microns
> > not 10mm, while X10.0 is 10mm.  It's turned a few
> > parts into big spiral chips on the finishing pass.
> >
> > -- Ralph
> > 
> > From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 11:55 AM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!
> >
> > CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> > email system.
> >
> >
> > On the dura, is the issue that it just moves the decimal instead of
> > converting the values? That's just a parameter change.
> >
> > I don't recall the dura using tc controls, i thought those started with
> td?
> > I may be wrong, it's been a while since i saw one of those in the wild.
> >
> > Phil T.
> > The Feral Engineer
> >
> > Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> >
> >
> > Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 2:21 PM Ralph Stirling <
> > ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I forbid G20 on the Mori Duraturn in my lab for that exact reason.  It
> > has
> > > a Fanuc 0i-TC.  I figure 21st century engineering students should
> develop
> > > some feel for metric measurements anyway.  Just to be safe I also
> require
> > > G21 on our Mori NVX mill even though it uses a Mits control that
> handles
> > it
> > > better.
> > >
> > > -- Ralph
> > >
> > > On Jul 16, 2021 9:11 AM, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
> > > CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> > > email system.
> > >
> > >
> > > I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
> > >
> > > Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built
> > > within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21
> > modes!
> > > It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for
> > goodness
> > > sakes!
> > >
> > > We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've
> been
> > > banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of
> > the
> > > work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed
> > up
> > > again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53
> > does)
> > > and the home positions k

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Ralph Stirling]

No mapps on the Dura.  The NVX has mapps.  Are you in
Davis?  Our NVX was serial number 1, donated from Davis.
They bought our Haas TM-1 as a trade-in and shipped us
the NVX.  Only tech support I can get on it is from engineers
at Mori Mfg in Davis, since the 800 tech support line has no
information about this unit.

-- Ralph

From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 12:22 PM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University email 
system.


Yeah we only made those for a few years. Not a big seller. Good machine but
limited in options and the NL/NLX is just a better seller. You have the
straight fanuc or mapps overlay?

You'll never guess who I work for 😅

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 3:10 PM Ralph Stirling 
wrote:

> This Dura is a 2007 model.  I haven't tried G20 since
> we first got it going, so don't recall exactly what the
> issues were, but remember being very startled when
> all the offsets were suddenly wrong when G20 was called.
> Solution was instant and total metrification for cnc
> machining in my lab :-).  Since few of my students have
> any significant prior experience machining, they don't
> generally grumble about giving up "thou's".
>
> The other Fanuc quirk that catches them is forgetting
> decimal points on whole numbers.  X10 is 10microns
> not 10mm, while X10.0 is 10mm.  It's turned a few
> parts into big spiral chips on the finishing pass.
>
> -- Ralph
> 
> From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 11:55 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!
>
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email system.
>
>
> On the dura, is the issue that it just moves the decimal instead of
> converting the values? That's just a parameter change.
>
> I don't recall the dura using tc controls, i thought those started with td?
> I may be wrong, it's been a while since i saw one of those in the wild.
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
>
>
> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 2:21 PM Ralph Stirling <
> ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu>
> wrote:
>
> > I forbid G20 on the Mori Duraturn in my lab for that exact reason.  It
> has
> > a Fanuc 0i-TC.  I figure 21st century engineering students should develop
> > some feel for metric measurements anyway.  Just to be safe I also require
> > G21 on our Mori NVX mill even though it uses a Mits control that handles
> it
> > better.
> >
> > -- Ralph
> >
> > On Jul 16, 2021 9:11 AM, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
> > CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> > email system.
> >
> >
> > I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
> >
> > Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built
> > within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21
> modes!
> > It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for
> goodness
> > sakes!
> >
> > We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've been
> > banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of
> the
> > work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed
> up
> > again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53
> does)
> > and the home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all because a
> > stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003 can't handle switching between
> G21
> > and G20 modes without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes and
> > completely resetting all the work coordinate systems settings.  FOR
> > REAL!!  Even Mach3 can do this right! If this is the case why
> > even have G20/G21 available as a G-code! It should only be a parameter
> > setting that can't be changed from a file.  This is even more annoying
> than
> > G92 or jogging a paused program, at least a power cycle can fix those
> screw
> > ups.
> >
> > Todd Zuercher
> > P. Graham Dunn Inc.<
> >
> > >
> > 630 Henry Street
> > Dalton, Ohio 44618
> > Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
> >
> >
> > ___

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Feral Engineer]

That's the thing i hate about fanuc. Everything is proprietary. The io
modules we use on our machines give standard sinking and sourcing io but
unless you can find a circuit in the ladder can activate, you need ladder 3
software to make your own.

On the flip side, their control has goto in their logic, which i miss in
lcnc 😅

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer

Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
www.patreon.com/theferalengineer

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 1:22 PM Andrew  wrote:

> пт, 16 лип. 2021 о 19:14 Todd Zuercher  пише:
>
> > I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
> >
> > Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.
> >
>
> I also had a kind of disappointment with Fanuc recently.
> I was asked to help install an automated clamping fixture to a new machine
> with a Fanuc controller. The fixture has a controlled actuator to adjust
> for the part depth, and also has an analog pressure sensor. So it's
> necessary to pass the part size to the fixture from the CNC program. I was
> thinking of a PLC with Modbus output for the stepper actuator and analog
> input. But it's kind of impossible to connect any PLC to a Fanuc
> controller! They have a proprietary I/O link interface only. OK, we
> contacted Fanuc for advice. And their advice was pretty short: contact our
> certified services only. So if you ever bought a CNC machine with a Fanuc
> controller - you're in slavery. Of course there are solutions but they cost
> a lot. And the service costs a lot too.
>
> Another story.
> I know an owner of a pretty complicated CNC machine with a Siemens
> controller, 20+ years old. The controller was not functional. The guy could
> not repair it for a very long time. No service wanted to deal with it! So
> he contacted the machine manufacturer. They said no problem, we can supply
> a brand new controller cabinet for the machine. Priced at $ 200K... oops!
> So he spent a lot of time and money until he found some guy who was able to
> repair the controller.
>
> So... beware those brand CNC controllers and interfaces.
>
> Just my 2 cents, anyways.
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Rob C]

I know zero about fanuc conversion, but don't these boards from Pico
Systems sort the ability to reuse the servos

https://pico-systems.com/fanuc_pins.html

http://pico-systems.com/osc2.5/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=33


On Fri, 16 Jul 2021, 20:20 Todd Zuercher,  wrote:

> That decimal point issue can usually be turned on/off with parameter
> 3401.0.
>
> Todd Zuercher
> P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> 630 Henry Street
> Dalton, Ohio 44618
> Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Ralph Stirling 
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 3:07 PM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!
>
> [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.
>
> This Dura is a 2007 model.  I haven't tried G20 since we first got it
> going, so don't recall exactly what the issues were, but remember being
> very startled when all the offsets were suddenly wrong when G20 was called.
> Solution was instant and total metrification for cnc machining in my lab
> :-).  Since few of my students have any significant prior experience
> machining, they don't generally grumble about giving up "thou's".
>
> The other Fanuc quirk that catches them is forgetting decimal points on
> whole numbers.  X10 is 10microns not 10mm, while X10.0 is 10mm.  It's
> turned a few parts into big spiral chips on the finishing pass.
>
> -- Ralph
> 
> From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 11:55 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!
>
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email system.
>
>
> On the dura, is the issue that it just moves the decimal instead of
> converting the values? That's just a parameter change.
>
> I don't recall the dura using tc controls, i thought those started with td?
> I may be wrong, it's been a while since i saw one of those in the wild.
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fc%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800384160%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=hi3Npyz8PDJOx5pMdcjpSmFxPqukb6BewMMBEFJTGRo%3D&reserved=0
>
> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.patreon.com%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800384160%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2FpEs5khf51sB%2Bo3s2qOcL6ri5AKPL%2BbHHMNQOWG9F98%3D&reserved=0
>
> On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 2:21 PM Ralph Stirling <
> ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu>
> wrote:
>
> > I forbid G20 on the Mori Duraturn in my lab for that exact reason.  It
> > has a Fanuc 0i-TC.  I figure 21st century engineering students should
> > develop some feel for metric measurements anyway.  Just to be safe I
> > also require
> > G21 on our Mori NVX mill even though it uses a Mits control that
> > handles it better.
> >
> > -- Ralph
> >
> > On Jul 16, 2021 9:11 AM, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
> > CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> > email system.
> >
> >
> > I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
> >
> > Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built
> > within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21
> modes!
> > It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for
> > goodness sakes!
> >
> > We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've
> > been banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why
> > all of the work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then
> > they are messed up again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over
> > traveling (but G90G53 does) and the home positions keep moving around.
> > Turns out its all because a stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003
> > can't handle switching between G21 and G20 modes without 3 power
> > cycles, a couple of parameter changes and completely resetting all the
> > work coordinate systems settings.  FOR REAL!!  Even Mach3
> 

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Feral Engineer]

Yeah we only made those for a few years. Not a big seller. Good machine but
limited in options and the NL/NLX is just a better seller. You have the
straight fanuc or mapps overlay?

You'll never guess who I work for 😅

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer

Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
www.patreon.com/theferalengineer

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 3:10 PM Ralph Stirling 
wrote:

> This Dura is a 2007 model.  I haven't tried G20 since
> we first got it going, so don't recall exactly what the
> issues were, but remember being very startled when
> all the offsets were suddenly wrong when G20 was called.
> Solution was instant and total metrification for cnc
> machining in my lab :-).  Since few of my students have
> any significant prior experience machining, they don't
> generally grumble about giving up "thou's".
>
> The other Fanuc quirk that catches them is forgetting
> decimal points on whole numbers.  X10 is 10microns
> not 10mm, while X10.0 is 10mm.  It's turned a few
> parts into big spiral chips on the finishing pass.
>
> -- Ralph
> 
> From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 11:55 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!
>
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email system.
>
>
> On the dura, is the issue that it just moves the decimal instead of
> converting the values? That's just a parameter change.
>
> I don't recall the dura using tc controls, i thought those started with td?
> I may be wrong, it's been a while since i saw one of those in the wild.
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fc%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800384160%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=hi3Npyz8PDJOx5pMdcjpSmFxPqukb6BewMMBEFJTGRo%3D&reserved=0
>
> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.patreon.com%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800384160%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2FpEs5khf51sB%2Bo3s2qOcL6ri5AKPL%2BbHHMNQOWG9F98%3D&reserved=0
>
> On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 2:21 PM Ralph Stirling <
> ralph.stirl...@wallawalla.edu>
> wrote:
>
> > I forbid G20 on the Mori Duraturn in my lab for that exact reason.  It
> has
> > a Fanuc 0i-TC.  I figure 21st century engineering students should develop
> > some feel for metric measurements anyway.  Just to be safe I also require
> > G21 on our Mori NVX mill even though it uses a Mits control that handles
> it
> > better.
> >
> > -- Ralph
> >
> > On Jul 16, 2021 9:11 AM, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
> > CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> > email system.
> >
> >
> > I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
> >
> > Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built
> > within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21
> modes!
> > It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for
> goodness
> > sakes!
> >
> > We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've been
> > banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of
> the
> > work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed
> up
> > again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53
> does)
> > and the home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all because a
> > stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003 can't handle switching between
> G21
> > and G20 modes without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes and
> > completely resetting all the work coordinate systems settings.  FOR
> > REAL!!  Even Mach3 can do this right! If this is the case why
> > even have G20/G21 available as a G-code! It should only be a parameter
> > setting tha

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Todd Zuercher]

That decimal point issue can usually be turned on/off with parameter 3401.0.

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street 
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031

-Original Message-
From: Ralph Stirling  
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 3:07 PM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.

This Dura is a 2007 model.  I haven't tried G20 since we first got it going, so 
don't recall exactly what the issues were, but remember being very startled 
when all the offsets were suddenly wrong when G20 was called.
Solution was instant and total metrification for cnc machining in my lab :-).  
Since few of my students have any significant prior experience machining, they 
don't generally grumble about giving up "thou's".

The other Fanuc quirk that catches them is forgetting decimal points on whole 
numbers.  X10 is 10microns not 10mm, while X10.0 is 10mm.  It's turned a few 
parts into big spiral chips on the finishing pass.

-- Ralph

From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 11:55 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University email 
system.


On the dura, is the issue that it just moves the decimal instead of converting 
the values? That's just a parameter change.

I don't recall the dura using tc controls, i thought those started with td?
I may be wrong, it's been a while since i saw one of those in the wild.

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fc%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800384160%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=hi3Npyz8PDJOx5pMdcjpSmFxPqukb6BewMMBEFJTGRo%3D&reserved=0

Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.patreon.com%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800384160%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2FpEs5khf51sB%2Bo3s2qOcL6ri5AKPL%2BbHHMNQOWG9F98%3D&reserved=0

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 2:21 PM Ralph Stirling 
wrote:

> I forbid G20 on the Mori Duraturn in my lab for that exact reason.  It 
> has a Fanuc 0i-TC.  I figure 21st century engineering students should 
> develop some feel for metric measurements anyway.  Just to be safe I 
> also require
> G21 on our Mori NVX mill even though it uses a Mits control that 
> handles it better.
>
> -- Ralph
>
> On Jul 16, 2021 9:11 AM, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University 
> email system.
>
>
> I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
>
> Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built 
> within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21 modes!
> It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for 
> goodness sakes!
>
> We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've 
> been banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why 
> all of the work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then 
> they are messed up again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over 
> traveling (but G90G53 does) and the home positions keep moving around.  
> Turns out its all because a stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003 
> can't handle switching between G21 and G20 modes without 3 power 
> cycles, a couple of parameter changes and completely resetting all the 
> work coordinate systems settings.  FOR REAL!!  Even Mach3 
> can do this right! If this is the case why even have G20/G21 available 
> as a G-code! It should only be a parameter setting that can't be 
> changed from a file.  This is even more annoying than
> G92 or jogging a paused program, at least a power cycle can fix those 
> screw ups.
>
> Todd Zuercher
> P. Graham Dunn Inc.<
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.p
> grahamdunn.com%2Findex.php&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawa
> lla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb7
> 5e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800394159%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiM
> C4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&s
> data

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Ralph Stirling]

This Dura is a 2007 model.  I haven't tried G20 since
we first got it going, so don't recall exactly what the
issues were, but remember being very startled when
all the offsets were suddenly wrong when G20 was called.
Solution was instant and total metrification for cnc
machining in my lab :-).  Since few of my students have 
any significant prior experience machining, they don't
generally grumble about giving up "thou's".

The other Fanuc quirk that catches them is forgetting
decimal points on whole numbers.  X10 is 10microns
not 10mm, while X10.0 is 10mm.  It's turned a few
parts into big spiral chips on the finishing pass.

-- Ralph

From: Feral Engineer [theferalengin...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 11:55 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University email 
system.


On the dura, is the issue that it just moves the decimal instead of
converting the values? That's just a parameter change.

I don't recall the dura using tc controls, i thought those started with td?
I may be wrong, it's been a while since i saw one of those in the wild.

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fc%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800384160%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=hi3Npyz8PDJOx5pMdcjpSmFxPqukb6BewMMBEFJTGRo%3D&reserved=0

Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.patreon.com%2Ftheferalengineer&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800384160%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2FpEs5khf51sB%2Bo3s2qOcL6ri5AKPL%2BbHHMNQOWG9F98%3D&reserved=0

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 2:21 PM Ralph Stirling 
wrote:

> I forbid G20 on the Mori Duraturn in my lab for that exact reason.  It has
> a Fanuc 0i-TC.  I figure 21st century engineering students should develop
> some feel for metric measurements anyway.  Just to be safe I also require
> G21 on our Mori NVX mill even though it uses a Mits control that handles it
> better.
>
> -- Ralph
>
> On Jul 16, 2021 9:11 AM, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email system.
>
>
> I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
>
> Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built
> within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21 modes!
> It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for goodness
> sakes!
>
> We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've been
> banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of the
> work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed up
> again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53 does)
> and the home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all because a
> stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003 can't handle switching between G21
> and G20 modes without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes and
> completely resetting all the work coordinate systems settings.  FOR
> REAL!!  Even Mach3 can do this right! If this is the case why
> even have G20/G21 available as a G-code! It should only be a parameter
> setting that can't be changed from a file.  This is even more annoying than
> G92 or jogging a paused program, at least a power cycle can fix those screw
> ups.
>
> Todd Zuercher
> P. Graham Dunn Inc.<
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pgrahamdunn.com%2Findex.php&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cc0601cb995c746d1254208d9488b64bb%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C0%7C637620585800394159%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=VDdiVni%2FePJD71WvCSxNoqQ1CUzEUwC%2FjrcTIU0syA8%3D&reserved=0
> >
> 630 Henry Street
> Dalton, Ohio 44618
> Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirli

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Feral Engineer]

On the dura, is the issue that it just moves the decimal instead of
converting the values? That's just a parameter change.

I don't recall the dura using tc controls, i thought those started with td?
I may be wrong, it's been a while since i saw one of those in the wild.

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer

Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
www.patreon.com/theferalengineer

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 2:21 PM Ralph Stirling 
wrote:

> I forbid G20 on the Mori Duraturn in my lab for that exact reason.  It has
> a Fanuc 0i-TC.  I figure 21st century engineering students should develop
> some feel for metric measurements anyway.  Just to be safe I also require
> G21 on our Mori NVX mill even though it uses a Mits control that handles it
> better.
>
> -- Ralph
>
> On Jul 16, 2021 9:11 AM, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University
> email system.
>
>
> I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
>
> Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built
> within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21 modes!
> It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for goodness
> sakes!
>
> We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've been
> banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of the
> work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed up
> again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53 does)
> and the home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all because a
> stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003 can't handle switching between G21
> and G20 modes without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes and
> completely resetting all the work coordinate systems settings.  FOR
> REAL!!  Even Mach3 can do this right! If this is the case why
> even have G20/G21 available as a G-code! It should only be a parameter
> setting that can't be changed from a file.  This is even more annoying than
> G92 or jogging a paused program, at least a power cycle can fix those screw
> ups.
>
> Todd Zuercher
> P. Graham Dunn Inc.<
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pgrahamdunn.com%2Findex.php&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cfbcd3391855548c9fb0808d948744cc8%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C1%7C637620486609683146%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=6aFWrgW7S5RrjTYlDRZtghl1oQRnLHYJnxE4K1tFpkc%3D&reserved=0
> >
> 630 Henry Street
> Dalton, Ohio 44618
> Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>
> https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cfbcd3391855548c9fb0808d948744cc8%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C1%7C637620486609683146%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=aMuCUwk%2FQ3zgr2I6DnJCpqL3DusQeoX9D%2FI2aJPvAwI%3D&reserved=0
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Ralph Stirling]

I forbid G20 on the Mori Duraturn in my lab for that exact reason.  It has a 
Fanuc 0i-TC.  I figure 21st century engineering students should develop some 
feel for metric measurements anyway.  Just to be safe I also require G21 on our 
Mori NVX mill even though it uses a Mits control that handles it better.

-- Ralph

On Jul 16, 2021 9:11 AM, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
CAUTION: This email originated from outside the Walla Walla University email 
system.


I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post

Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built within 
the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21 modes!  It's a 
flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for goodness sakes!

We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've been 
banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of the work 
coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed up again, 
G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53 does) and the 
home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all because a stupid Fanuc 
180iM control built in 2003 can't handle switching between G21 and G20 modes 
without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes and completely resetting 
all the work coordinate systems settings.  FOR REAL!!  Even Mach3 
can do this right! If this is the case why even have G20/G21 available as a 
G-code! It should only be a parameter setting that can't be changed from a 
file.  This is even more annoying than G92 or jogging a paused program, at 
least a power cycle can fix those screw ups.

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn 
Inc.
630 Henry Street
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Flists.sourceforge.net%2Flists%2Flistinfo%2Femc-users&data=04%7C01%7Cralph.stirling%40wallawalla.edu%7Cfbcd3391855548c9fb0808d948744cc8%7Cd958f048e43142779c8debfb75e7aa64%7C0%7C1%7C637620486609683146%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=aMuCUwk%2FQ3zgr2I6DnJCpqL3DusQeoX9D%2FI2aJPvAwI%3D&reserved=0

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Feral Engineer]

You'd have to get around the proprietary crap in the Fanuc servo amps and
whatnot, methinks

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer

Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
www.patreon.com/theferalengineer

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 12:31 PM Rob C  wrote:

> rip it out an put linuxcnc in?
>
> is it possible to build a plugin replacement controller?
>
> On Fri, 16 Jul 2021, 17:20 Feral Engineer, 
> wrote:
>
> > The 180i is an earlier windows version of a Fanuc, so I'm sure it's got
> > some quirks 😅
> >
> > Phil T.
> > The Feral Engineer
> >
> > Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> > www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
> >
> > Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
> > www.patreon.com/theferalengineer
> >
> > On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 12:14 PM Todd Zuercher 
> > wrote:
> >
> > > I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
> > >
> > > Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built
> > > within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21
> > modes!
> > > It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for
> > goodness
> > > sakes!
> > >
> > > We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've
> been
> > > banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of
> > the
> > > work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed
> > up
> > > again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53
> > does)
> > > and the home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all because a
> > > stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003 can't handle switching between
> > G21
> > > and G20 modes without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes and
> > > completely resetting all the work coordinate systems settings.  FOR
> > > REAL!!  Even Mach3 can do this right! If this is the case
> why
> > > even have G20/G21 available as a G-code! It should only be a parameter
> > > setting that can't be changed from a file.  This is even more annoying
> > than
> > > G92 or jogging a paused program, at least a power cycle can fix those
> > screw
> > > ups.
> > >
> > > Todd Zuercher
> > > P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> > > 630 Henry Street
> > > Dalton, Ohio 44618
> > > Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> > >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Andrew]

пт, 16 лип. 2021 о 19:14 Todd Zuercher  пише:

> I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
>
> Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.
>

I also had a kind of disappointment with Fanuc recently.
I was asked to help install an automated clamping fixture to a new machine
with a Fanuc controller. The fixture has a controlled actuator to adjust
for the part depth, and also has an analog pressure sensor. So it's
necessary to pass the part size to the fixture from the CNC program. I was
thinking of a PLC with Modbus output for the stepper actuator and analog
input. But it's kind of impossible to connect any PLC to a Fanuc
controller! They have a proprietary I/O link interface only. OK, we
contacted Fanuc for advice. And their advice was pretty short: contact our
certified services only. So if you ever bought a CNC machine with a Fanuc
controller - you're in slavery. Of course there are solutions but they cost
a lot. And the service costs a lot too.

Another story.
I know an owner of a pretty complicated CNC machine with a Siemens
controller, 20+ years old. The controller was not functional. The guy could
not repair it for a very long time. No service wanted to deal with it! So
he contacted the machine manufacturer. They said no problem, we can supply
a brand new controller cabinet for the machine. Priced at $ 200K... oops!
So he spent a lot of time and money until he found some guy who was able to
repair the controller.

So... beware those brand CNC controllers and interfaces.

Just my 2 cents, anyways.

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Todd Zuercher]

I really don't want to go there.  Retrofitting a Fanuc machine is much more 
involved because of how their servos work.  Besides Fanuc's motion control is a 
bit better.

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street 
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031

-Original Message-
From: Rob C  
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2021 12:28 PM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.

rip it out an put linuxcnc in?

is it possible to build a plugin replacement controller?

On Fri, 16 Jul 2021, 17:20 Feral Engineer, 
wrote:

> The 180i is an earlier windows version of a Fanuc, so I'm sure it's 
> got some quirks 😅
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at 
> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>
> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
> www.patreon.com/theferalengineer
>
> On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 12:14 PM Todd Zuercher 
> wrote:
>
> > I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
> >
> > Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control 
> > built within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 
> > and G21
> modes!
> > It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for
> goodness
> > sakes!
> >
> > We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've 
> > been banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why 
> > all of
> the
> > work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are 
> > messed
> up
> > again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but 
> > G90G53
> does)
> > and the home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all 
> > because a stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003 can't handle 
> > switching between
> G21
> > and G20 modes without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes 
> > and completely resetting all the work coordinate systems settings.  
> > FOR REAL!!  Even Mach3 can do this right! If this is the 
> > case why even have G20/G21 available as a G-code! It should only be 
> > a parameter setting that can't be changed from a file.  This is even 
> > more annoying
> than
> > G92 or jogging a paused program, at least a power cycle can fix 
> > those
> screw
> > ups.
> >
> > Todd Zuercher
> > P. Graham Dunn Inc.<http://www.pgrahamdunn.com/index.php>
> > 630 Henry Street
> > Dalton, Ohio 44618
> > Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Rob C]

rip it out an put linuxcnc in?

is it possible to build a plugin replacement controller?

On Fri, 16 Jul 2021, 17:20 Feral Engineer, 
wrote:

> The 180i is an earlier windows version of a Fanuc, so I'm sure it's got
> some quirks 😅
>
> Phil T.
> The Feral Engineer
>
> Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
> www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer
>
> Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
> www.patreon.com/theferalengineer
>
> On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 12:14 PM Todd Zuercher 
> wrote:
>
> > I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
> >
> > Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built
> > within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21
> modes!
> > It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for
> goodness
> > sakes!
> >
> > We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've been
> > banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of
> the
> > work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed
> up
> > again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53
> does)
> > and the home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all because a
> > stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003 can't handle switching between
> G21
> > and G20 modes without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes and
> > completely resetting all the work coordinate systems settings.  FOR
> > REAL!!  Even Mach3 can do this right! If this is the case why
> > even have G20/G21 available as a G-code! It should only be a parameter
> > setting that can't be changed from a file.  This is even more annoying
> than
> > G92 or jogging a paused program, at least a power cycle can fix those
> screw
> > ups.
> >
> > Todd Zuercher
> > P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> > 630 Henry Street
> > Dalton, Ohio 44618
> > Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Feral Engineer]

The 180i is an earlier windows version of a Fanuc, so I'm sure it's got
some quirks 😅

Phil T.
The Feral Engineer

Check out my LinuxCNC tutorials, machine builds and other antics at
www.youtube.com/c/theferalengineer

Help support my channel efforts and coffee addiction:
www.patreon.com/theferalengineer

On Fri, Jul 16, 2021, 12:14 PM Todd Zuercher  wrote:

> I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post
>
> Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built
> within the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21 modes!
> It's a flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for goodness
> sakes!
>
> We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've been
> banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of the
> work coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed up
> again, G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53 does)
> and the home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all because a
> stupid Fanuc 180iM control built in 2003 can't handle switching between G21
> and G20 modes without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes and
> completely resetting all the work coordinate systems settings.  FOR
> REAL!!  Even Mach3 can do this right! If this is the case why
> even have G20/G21 available as a G-code! It should only be a parameter
> setting that can't be changed from a file.  This is even more annoying than
> G92 or jogging a paused program, at least a power cycle can fix those screw
> ups.
>
> Todd Zuercher
> P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> 630 Henry Street
> Dalton, Ohio 44618
> Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] OT Fanuc!

[Todd Zuercher]

I need to voice some frustration.  So pardon the OT post

Fanuc is making me pull my hair out.  You'd think a cnc control built within 
the last 20 years could handle switching between G20 and G21 modes!  It's a 
flippin command line code that can be issued in a file for goodness sakes!

We bought a used machine that was being used in G21 mode.  And I've been 
banging my head on this thing for a week.  Can't figure out why all of the work 
coordinates are so screwed up, reset them and then they are messed up again, 
G91G28 commands won't work and keep over traveling (but G90G53 does) and the 
home positions keep moving around.  Turns out its all because a stupid Fanuc 
180iM control built in 2003 can't handle switching between G21 and G20 modes 
without 3 power cycles, a couple of parameter changes and completely resetting 
all the work coordinate systems settings.  FOR REAL!!  Even Mach3 
can do this right! If this is the case why even have G20/G21 available as a 
G-code! It should only be a parameter setting that can't be changed from a 
file.  This is even more annoying than G92 or jogging a paused program, at 
least a power cycle can fix those screw ups.

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] OT: Fanuc wrist

[Roland Jollivet]

Interesting, never thought they'd use a gear with so little engagement;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iblqrfu5wdw
(note, it's immersed in oil)

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[Roland Jollivet]

Thanks for all the replies.
I'll know more when I get the machine. The agent will probably do the mod,
but even then I'm hesitant. If he screws up I'm the one sitting with a big
anchor...

I think I'll use it as-is for a few months, learn more, then take the leap.

Roland

On Tue, 20 Oct 2020 at 22:16, Dave Cole  wrote:

> I forget what version of the Fanuc Controllers this applies to, but
> there were some controllers that had a compact flash slot on the front.
> The compact flash slot was used to load and read out the PLC program
> logic and the other controller settings.   The programming was done
> offline on a laptop and the logic was written to the compact flash
> module, then the module was used to load the controllers memory.
> It was awkward.
> You needed a $$ license to run the software.
> This was years ago, but the Fanuc tech guy was charging way over $200/hr
> to make changes.
> Dave
>
> On 10/20/2020 10:49 AM, Jon Elson wrote:
> > On 10/20/2020 02:29 AM, Roland Jollivet wrote:
> >> Also, if I want to ditch the controller at a later stage, are the Fanuc
> >> servo drives interfaceable to EMC?
> >>
> > Can you say what servo amps you have?  The oldest Fanuc had standard
> > analog velocity servos, but instead of a DC tachometer, they
> > synthesized the tach signal from the encoder.  Some machines had the
> > tach in the motor but didn't use it, so it could be set up to use the
> > existing tach.  This applies to the brush motor (yellow cap) series.
> >
> > Later units had brushless motors (red cap) and the servo amps were
> > supplied 6 separate PWM signals, one for each transistor.  That uses
> > up a lot of PWM outputs.
> >
> > Jon
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[Dave Cole]

I forget what version of the Fanuc Controllers this applies to, but 
there were some controllers that had a compact flash slot on the front.
The compact flash slot was used to load and read out the PLC program 
logic and the other controller settings.   The programming was done 
offline on a laptop and the logic was written to the compact flash 
module, then the module was used to load the controllers memory.

It was awkward.
You needed a $$ license to run the software.
This was years ago, but the Fanuc tech guy was charging way over $200/hr 
to make changes.

Dave

On 10/20/2020 10:49 AM, Jon Elson wrote:

On 10/20/2020 02:29 AM, Roland Jollivet wrote:

Also, if I want to ditch the controller at a later stage, are the Fanuc
servo drives interfaceable to EMC?

Can you say what servo amps you have?  The oldest Fanuc had standard 
analog velocity servos, but instead of a DC tachometer, they 
synthesized the tach signal from the encoder.  Some machines had the 
tach in the motor but didn't use it, so it could be set up to use the 
existing tach.  This applies to the brush motor (yellow cap) series.


Later units had brushless motors (red cap) and the servo amps were 
supplied 6 separate PWM signals, one for each transistor.  That uses 
up a lot of PWM outputs.


Jon


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[Jon Elson]

On 10/20/2020 02:29 AM, Roland Jollivet wrote:

Also, if I want to ditch the controller at a later stage, are the Fanuc
servo drives interfaceable to EMC?

Can you say what servo amps you have?  The oldest Fanuc had 
standard analog velocity servos, but instead of a DC 
tachometer, they synthesized the tach signal from the 
encoder.  Some machines had the tach in the motor but didn't 
use it, so it could be set up to use the existing tach.  
This applies to the brush motor (yellow cap) series.


Later units had brushless motors (red cap) and the servo 
amps were supplied 6 separate PWM signals, one for each 
transistor.  That uses up a lot of PWM outputs.


Jon


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[Todd Zuercher]

I'm not going to be any help there either.  Never tried to retrofit a Fanuc 
machine.  But my understanding is the older the better for trying to retrofit.  
The newer all digital amps (they are more amps than drives because even the 
commutation is done in the control) with optical connections and wonky hi-res 
serial absolute encoders are all but impossible.

For PLC editing start by looking at the PLC, then try to make a change (make 
sure it is backed up first),  Does your machine have a PC front end?  (The 
machines I'm working with all have a PC running the user interface under 
Windows 2k or XP.)  If so, check the HD for Fanuc software such as the "Ladder 
Editing Package".  Our machines that don't  have LEP you can look at and edit 
the PLC through the user interface pressing SYSTEM/PMC/PMCLAD.  It is possible 
editing will be write protected, you might have to contact the machine 
manufacturer or the machine manuals, to get a password to unlock the write 
protection.  Even when unlocked you will have to have the machine in MDI mode 
and set the PWE bit to allow editing (you should also probably have it in 
e-stop as well).  Changes you make don't actually take effect until you save 
and reload the PLC.

Be careful, you can truly screw something up messing around in there if you 
don't know what you are doing.

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street 
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031

-Original Message-
From: andy pugh  
Sent: Tuesday, October 20, 2020 3:39 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.

On Tue, 20 Oct 2020 at 08:32, Roland Jollivet  wrote:

> Also, if I want to ditch the controller at a later stage, are the 
> Fanuc servo drives interfaceable to EMC?

Some are.

Which isn't a very helpful answer, I suppose.

--
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed for 
the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[andrew beck]

Sorry about the spelling!  My phone Autocorrect keyboard made a mess

On Tue, Oct 20, 2020, 9:42 PM andrew beck  wrote:

> Hat just saw this.  I'm currently stripping a old fanuc lathe to run
> linuxcnc.  I found that the fanuc servo drives are too hard to with with.
> But to mention so old.  I just buy new Chinese servo motors and drives.
> They are $300 usd for a 2.4kw matching drive and motor.  And really high
> quality.
>
> Also I managed to get my original fanuc velocity amp working with a pot
> and switches I lucked out and it just uses a 0_10v signal and fwd/rev
> switches.  The option is some custom pwm thing.
>
> My lathe is a 1989 model nakurma (Okuma)
>
> Let me know if you want more info..
>
> On Tue, Oct 20, 2020, 8:43 PM andy pugh  wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 20 Oct 2020 at 08:32, Roland Jollivet 
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Also, if I want to ditch the controller at a later stage, are the Fanuc
>> > servo drives interfaceable to EMC?
>>
>> Some are.
>>
>> Which isn't a very helpful answer, I suppose.
>>
>> --
>> atp
>> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
>> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
>> lunatics."
>> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[andrew beck]

Hat just saw this.  I'm currently stripping a old fanuc lathe to run
linuxcnc.  I found that the fanuc servo drives are too hard to with with.
But to mention so old.  I just buy new Chinese servo motors and drives.
They are $300 usd for a 2.4kw matching drive and motor.  And really high
quality.

Also I managed to get my original fanuc velocity amp working with a pot and
switches I lucked out and it just uses a 0_10v signal and fwd/rev
switches.  The option is some custom pwm thing.

My lathe is a 1989 model nakurma (Okuma)

Let me know if you want more info..

On Tue, Oct 20, 2020, 8:43 PM andy pugh  wrote:

> On Tue, 20 Oct 2020 at 08:32, Roland Jollivet 
> wrote:
>
> > Also, if I want to ditch the controller at a later stage, are the Fanuc
> > servo drives interfaceable to EMC?
>
> Some are.
>
> Which isn't a very helpful answer, I suppose.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[andy pugh]

On Tue, 20 Oct 2020 at 08:32, Roland Jollivet  wrote:

> Also, if I want to ditch the controller at a later stage, are the Fanuc
> servo drives interfaceable to EMC?

Some are.

Which isn't a very helpful answer, I suppose.

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[Roland Jollivet]

Thanks Todd

Is there an easy way for me to check on the console if the ladder is
editable, as is?

Also, if I want to ditch the controller at a later stage, are the Fanuc
servo drives interfaceable to EMC?

Regards
Roland

On Mon, 19 Oct 2020 at 15:42, Todd Zuercher  wrote:

> If your Fanuc machine came with PLC editing installed and enabled, then
> doing that part will be relatively simple.  (All of the Fanuc machines I'm
> currently working with have).  But that doesn't mean that yours does.  We
> have Fanuc machines from 3 different manufactures all built around the same
> time period (2001-2006) and they all have different Ladder editing
> packages.  Some I have to look at and edit the ladder through the control's
> user interface, others require a separate ladder editing program (that did
> come installed on the machine.)  The trickier part might be finding unused
> IO points to physically connect to the control.  if there are unused io
> pins available, it might not be much more than adding wires to un used pins
> on plugs.  But it could get expensive if new io modules need to be added to
> the control.
>
> Todd Zuercher
> P. Graham Dunn Inc.
> 630 Henry Street
> Dalton, Ohio 44618
> Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Roland Jollivet 
> Sent: Monday, October 19, 2020 3:45 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
> Subject: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup
>
> [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.
>
> Hi All
>
> I'm looking at getting a small VMC that has a Fanuc 0M controller on it.
>
> Much to my chagrin, I found out that there is no I/O on the machine. (for
> fixtures, probes etc.)  I was expecting a Harting plug on the side.
> So any functionality has to be 'enabled' and hardware added and brought
> out to a plug.
>
> So the hardware side is easy enough, to add a few relays, but then this
> functionality still has to be enabled in the controllers ladder logic.
>
> So does anyone know if this is easy to do? Maybe just a password and do it
> from the user keypad?
> Or does one need special cables and codes for a secret society?
>
> Roland
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

Re: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[Todd Zuercher]

If your Fanuc machine came with PLC editing installed and enabled, then doing 
that part will be relatively simple.  (All of the Fanuc machines I'm currently 
working with have).  But that doesn't mean that yours does.  We have Fanuc 
machines from 3 different manufactures all built around the same time period 
(2001-2006) and they all have different Ladder editing packages.  Some I have 
to look at and edit the ladder through the control's user interface, others 
require a separate ladder editing program (that did come installed on the 
machine.)  The trickier part might be finding unused IO points to physically 
connect to the control.  if there are unused io pins available, it might not be 
much more than adding wires to un used pins on plugs.  But it could get 
expensive if new io modules need to be added to the control.

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street 
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031

-Original Message-
From: Roland Jollivet  
Sent: Monday, October 19, 2020 3:45 AM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
Subject: [Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[EXTERNAL EMAIL] Be sure links are safe.

Hi All

I'm looking at getting a small VMC that has a Fanuc 0M controller on it.

Much to my chagrin, I found out that there is no I/O on the machine. (for 
fixtures, probes etc.)  I was expecting a Harting plug on the side.
So any functionality has to be 'enabled' and hardware added and brought out to 
a plug.

So the hardware side is easy enough, to add a few relays, but then this 
functionality still has to be enabled in the controllers ladder logic.

So does anyone know if this is easy to do? Maybe just a password and do it from 
the user keypad?
Or does one need special cables and codes for a secret society?

Roland

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users


___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users

[Emc-users] OT: Fanuc 0M setup

[Roland Jollivet]

Hi All

I'm looking at getting a small VMC that has a Fanuc 0M controller on it.

Much to my chagrin, I found out that there is no I/O on the machine. (for
fixtures, probes etc.)  I was expecting a Harting plug on the side.
So any functionality has to be 'enabled' and hardware added and brought out
to a plug.

So the hardware side is easy enough, to add a few relays, but then this
functionality still has to be enabled in the controllers ladder logic.

So does anyone know if this is easy to do? Maybe just a password and do it
from the user keypad?
Or does one need special cables and codes for a secret society?

Roland

___
Emc-users mailing list
Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users