Re: [Heb-NACO] newest member of the AJL RAS Cataloging Committee

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thanks, Haim, for the welcome, and Heidi, for the kind words. So happy to 
rejoin the committee in official capacity.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-bounces+jshino=pobox.upenn@lists.osu.edu] 
On Behalf Of Gottschalk, Haim via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, January 07, 2019 5:37 PM
To: 'Heidi G Lerner'; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'; heb-naco
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] newest member of the AJL RAS Cataloging Committee

Welcome Jasmin. So glad you are joining the cataloging committee.

~Haim

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Heidi G Lerner via 
Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, January 07, 2019 2:19 PM
To: heb-naco 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] newest member of the AJL RAS Cataloging Committee


Hi all,



I would like to announce with that Jasmin Nof has agreed to join the AJL RAS 
Cataloging Committee as a full member. She brings many years of Hebraica 
cataloging experience. a strong knowledge of Hebrew grammar (so necessary for 
our hands on work), and a very strong sense of collegiality. She has assumed 
responsibility for maintaining and serving as editor of the

AJL RAS Cataloging Committee Wiki 
  for a number of  years and 
does a superb job. I hope that all of you will  join me in welcoming her.

Sincerely, Heidi



Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Dept.

Stanford University Libraries

Stanford, CA 94305-6004

ph: 650-725-9953

fax: 650-725-1120

e-mail: ler...@stanford.edu
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[Heb-NACO] geo. subdivision for Eruv

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, the LCSH term Eruv is not geographically sub-dividable, while the LCSH term 
Mikvah is. Do we know why the discrepancy? Is it possible to change the 
designation for Eruv?

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] geo. subdivision for Eruv

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thank you, Reb Kuperman, your insights have been most helpful! Apologies for 
violating the halakha of avoiding cataloging philosophy talk on Erev Shabbos ☺.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Kuperman, Aaron [mailto:a...@loc.gov]
Sent: Friday, March 01, 2019 10:46 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin
Cc: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel (heb-naco@lists.osu.edu)
Subject: RE: [Heb-NACO] geo. subdivision for Eruv

But “Eruv” is clearly a “Jewish law” heading, so a book “Eruv--Jerusalem” would 
be on the halachic problems of building an eruv there as opposed to New York 
(e.g. building an eruv in a walled city, building an eruv in a city with over 
60 Jews, etc.).  This gets you into two issues. First, “Jewish law” 
headings do not subdivide geographically since halacha is the same everywhere, 
so perhaps there should be separate headings for “Eruv (Jewish law)” and “Eruv” 
the physical construction.  Second, since an Eruv is a type of building how 
does it relate both to the LCSH rules for buildings (meaning it should be in 
the plural, and if “Eruv” can be found in English reference sources that plural 
might arguably(has ve-shalom) be “Eruvs”, cf Agunahs),  and also getting it to 
fit into the infamous “Division of the world” memo.

Of course, without a proposal, and treating the current heading as “inherently 
legal” meaning it refers to the halachos of an Eruv, one could create a heading 
“Eruv—Social aspects—[place]” under current rules. This resolve the problem, 
distinguishes halachic from historical/sociological works, and avoids excessive 
amounts of philosophy (should I advocate a halacha that one should avoid 
cataloging philosophy on Erev Shabbos☺).

Aaron Kuperman, LC Law Cataloging Section.
This is not an official communication from my employer


From: Shinohara, Jasmin 
Sent: Friday, March 01, 2019 10:23 AM
To: Kuperman, Aaron ; 'Joan Biella' ; 
'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel' 
Subject: RE: [Heb-NACO] geo. subdivision for Eruv

Good question, Aaron. The title is Toldot ha-ʻeruv bi-Yerushalayim (original 
bib forthcoming post-BIBCO review), a multi-vol. publ. Dec. 2016- by 
Ohel Binyamin le-Torah ule-ḥokhmat Yiśraʼel (Yerushalayim). Given the 
content, my gut reaction was to give a 650 Eruv – Jerusalem – History, but no 
such luck. Indeed, there is no Eruv—History heading to be found anywhere, 
though, as Joan said, perhaps there hasn’t been literary warrant till now. For 
now I’ve assigned

Eruv ǂx History
Sabbath (Jewish law)
Jerusalem ǂx Religious life and customs

But I do wish I could be more specific. There are numerous titles in LC’s 
database discussing the ‘eruv of Brooklyn, but folks got around it by assigning 
the above three subjects (though the titles aren’t histories, so just Eruv, 
without |x History, and Borough Park instead of Jerusalem). A title about the 
‘eruv in Har Nof used a 610 for the Va’ad ha-‘eruv shekhunat Har Nof 
(Jerusalem). There is no mention anywhere in my work of a “va’ad ha-‘eruv” of 
Yerushalayim, so I’m not concerned about the need for a 610. Given the 
preponderance of works on the Brooklyn ‘eruv, is there a reason no one thought 
to make Eruv geographically subdivide-able?

Thanks, Jasmin


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Re: [Heb-NACO] geo. subdivision for Eruv

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Good question, Aaron. The title is Toldot ha-ʻeruv bi-Yerushalayim (original 
bib forthcoming post-BIBCO review), a multi-vol. publ. Dec. 2016- by 
Ohel Binyamin le-Torah ule-ḥokhmat Yiśraʼel (Yerushalayim). Given the 
content, my gut reaction was to give a 650 Eruv – Jerusalem – History, but no 
such luck. Indeed, there is no Eruv—History heading to be found anywhere, 
though, as Joan said, perhaps there hasn’t been literary warrant till now. For 
now I’ve assigned

Eruv ǂx History
Sabbath (Jewish law)
Jerusalem ǂx Religious life and customs

But I do wish I could be more specific. There are numerous titles in LC’s 
database discussing the ‘eruv of Brooklyn, but folks got around it by assigning 
the above three subjects (though the titles aren’t histories, so just Eruv, 
without |x History, and Borough Park instead of Jerusalem). A title about the 
‘eruv in Har Nof used a 610 for the Va’ad ha-‘eruv shekhunat Har Nof 
(Jerusalem). There is no mention anywhere in my work of a “va’ad ha-‘eruv” of 
Yerushalayim, so I’m not concerned about the need for a 610. Given the 
preponderance of works on the Brooklyn ‘eruv, is there a reason no one thought 
to make Eruv geographically subdivide-able?

Thanks, Jasmin


From: Kuperman, Aaron [mailto:a...@loc.gov]
Sent: Friday, March 01, 2019 6:09 AM
To: 'Joan Biella'; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'; Shinohara, Jasmin
Subject: RE: [Heb-NACO] geo. subdivision for Eruv

What is the book?  Would an individual eruv, e.g. the Baltimore eruv, be a 110 
or a 151, rather than a 150. In the authority file?  Thinking of Baltimore, the 
Baltimore eruv would probably be a corporate body (it has officers, publishes a 
guide book, etc.), and the Baltimore eruv directory would not warrant a heading 
for “Eruv” but would get a heading for “Jews—Maryland—Baltimore Region”.

Aaron Kuperman, LC Law Cataloging Section.
This is not an official communication from my employer


From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Joan 
Biella via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2019 11:03 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] geo. subdivision for Eruv

Perhaps no one thought there was “literary warrant” before.  Make a case to the 
policy folks!

Joan
Sent from my iPad

On Feb 28, 2019, at 2:09 PM, Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi, the LCSH term Eruv is not geographically sub-dividable, while the LCSH term 
Mikvah is. Do we know why the discrepancy? Is it possible to change the 
designation for Eruv?

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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[Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g. בגלל has a direct entry, so 
I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, 
the sheva would be considered merahef, ignored in romanization), but the entry 
also says “see גלל”. So which is it: Biglal or Bi-gelal?

Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thanks, Gabe. In romanization it is NEVER “majority rules”; the majority can 
often be wrong. ☺ Romanization is based on what is grammatically correct and 
the HCM-RDA, with the latter being bound by E-Sh., hence my question.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Gabriel Angulo [mailto:gang...@brandeis.edu]
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:24 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hi Jasmin,

It appears that most libraries opt for bi-gelal. Try a title search in 
connexion, you'll see that there are un-authorized variants.

Gabe Angulo

On Thu, Feb 7, 2019 at 12:09 PM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g. בגלל has a direct entry, so 
I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, 
the sheva would be considered merahef, ignored in romanization), but the entry 
also says “see גלל”. So which is it: Biglal or Bi-gelal?

Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, Haim, bi-gelal would be correct if the ב is considered a prefix to the word 
גלל. But since there is a direct entry for the word as a whole, I’m asking if 
we should romanize it as a whole word instead of as a compound word.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Gottschalk, Haim [mailto:h...@loc.gov]
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:24 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'
Subject: RE: בגלל

I think it should be “biglal” and not “bi-gelal” because of the sheva being 
treat as a sheva nach (which is how it is in the Alcalay).  This is in my 
humble opinion.

~Haim

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 11:00 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g. בגלל has a direct entry, so 
I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, 
the sheva would be considered merahef, ignored in romanization), but the entry 
also says “see גלל”. So which is it: Biglal or Bi-gelal?

Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Yes! Thank you, Shoshanah, that was helpful! I looked in the Heb-NACO archives 
and found a discussion from 2012 regarding 
li-fene<https://www.mail-archive.com/heb-naco@lists.service.ohio-state.edu/msg00256.html>.
 At the time, Joan weighed in with a citation of HCM, p. 21:
“’In the few cases where Even-Shoshan may show the same word under more than 
one entry element, the more 'analytical' option is chosen.’  There are 
definitions of "li-fene" under both lamed and peh, and therefore the standard 
romanization is "li-fene."”
However, looking at the current HCM-RDA, those instructions were not carried 
over. The question is, why not? And which (if any) of the 10 words below need 
to be switched back?

From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-bounces+jshino=pobox.upenn@lists.osu.edu] 
On Behalf Of Rose Shoshanah Seidman via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 5:31 PM
To: Galron, Joseph; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hi hope Joan will pitch in.

I remember we had this same discussion we few years ago … bi-gelal …

Shoshanah

Shoshanah Seidman
Faculty Liaison, Program for Jewish Studies,
Northwestern University Library
847-467-2914



From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 4:26 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

I checked  previous editions of ES and their also was a refrence to Gelal or 
Shevil
It is not a change from previous editions of the Dictionary.

I don’t agree that it is wrong.  I wouldn’t change it.

Yossi

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Robert M. TALBOTT via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 4:52 PM
To: Neil Manel Frau-Cortes mailto:nf...@umd.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Folks:

I have to say that I'm in Yosi's camp. A vote for "bi-gelal" is a vote for 
sanity.

B

On Thu, Feb 7, 2019 at 1:23 PM Neil Manel Frau-Cortes via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
I agree with Jasmin.


Neil

On Thu, Feb 7, 2019 at 4:20 PM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
I hear the concern, Yossi, but I’m afraid we’ve already started down the 
proverbial slope. Per the 
FAQ<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__rascat.pbworks.com_w_page_109347700_Romanization-2520FAQ=DwMGaQ=yHlS04HhBraes5BQ9ueu5zKhE7rtNXt_d012z2PA6ws=16SoAV47CIfZoss58D_H0doRSteNqo65SPQan5BgSVs=0HNfKVPYLRCF5nEQFs2l5YkFSzKnz8XkNIfP5NXmsNo=GsCvrzP6URxKWSdcRsEhyfPLcXYuQXHFr6kkUP637-k=>,
 we’ve agreed to romanize the words as

Bediʻavad
Bahem
Bilvad
Kaʻet
Kefi
Levad
Lemaʻan
Lefi
Mimeni
Sheli

No one can argue for Shvil since the sheva na’ at the beginning of a word 
requires it to be Shevil. No one can argue for Birushalayim because there is no 
E-Sh. entry for the compound.

So do I hear consensus on Biglal (and Bishvil – when it means “because/on 
behalf of”; otherwise bi/ba-shevil when it means “on a/the path)?

From: Heb-naco 
[mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>] 
On Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:52 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

It is “dangerous” going to Biglal or Bishvil – tomorrow we will say: If it is 
Bishvil so why not change it to Shvil
We also Romanize בירושלים  to “Bi-Yerushalayim” and not to “Birushalayim”

Yossi



From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 12:31 PM
To: Gottschalk, Haim mailto:h...@loc.gov>>; 'Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel' mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hi, Haim, bi-gelal would be correct if the ב is considered a prefix to the word 
גלל. But since there is a direct entry for the word as a whole, I’m asking if 
we should romanize it as a whole word instead of as a compound word.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Gottschalk, Haim [mailto:h...@loc.gov]
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:24 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'
Subject: RE: בגלל

I think it should be “biglal” and not “bi-gelal” because of the sheva being 
treat as a sheva nach (which is how it is in the Alcalay).  This is in my 
humble opinion.

~Haim

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 11:00 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g. בגלל has a direct entry, so 
I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, 
the sheva would

Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

I hear the concern, Yossi, but I’m afraid we’ve already started down the 
proverbial slope. Per the 
FAQ<http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/109347700/Romanization%20FAQ>, we’ve 
agreed to romanize the words as

Bediʻavad
Bahem
Bilvad
Kaʻet
Kefi
Levad
Lemaʻan
Lefi
Mimeni
Sheli

No one can argue for Shvil since the sheva na’ at the beginning of a word 
requires it to be Shevil. No one can argue for Birushalayim because there is no 
E-Sh. entry for the compound.

So do I hear consensus on Biglal (and Bishvil – when it means “because/on 
behalf of”; otherwise bi/ba-shevil when it means “on a/the path)?

From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu] On Behalf Of Galron, 
Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:52 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

It is “dangerous” going to Biglal or Bishvil – tomorrow we will say: If it is 
Bishvil so why not change it to Shvil
We also Romanize בירושלים  to “Bi-Yerushalayim” and not to “Birushalayim”

Yossi



From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 12:31 PM
To: Gottschalk, Haim ; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel' 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hi, Haim, bi-gelal would be correct if the ב is considered a prefix to the word 
גלל. But since there is a direct entry for the word as a whole, I’m asking if 
we should romanize it as a whole word instead of as a compound word.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Gottschalk, Haim [mailto:h...@loc.gov]
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:24 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'
Subject: RE: בגלל

I think it should be “biglal” and not “bi-gelal” because of the sheva being 
treat as a sheva nach (which is how it is in the Alcalay).  This is in my 
humble opinion.

~Haim

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 11:00 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g. בגלל has a direct entry, so 
I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, 
the sheva would be considered merahef, ignored in romanization), but the entry 
also says “see גלל”. So which is it: Biglal or Bi-gelal?

Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Sorry, but there’s no such thing as melo’ut. It’s bi-melot. See E-Sh. for מלא.

From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-bounces+jshino=pobox.upenn@lists.osu.edu] 
On Behalf Of Abend-David,Ilana via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 1:07 PM
To: Galron, Joseph; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

If so how would you transliterate במלאות 25 שנה  ? Would this be correct 
bi-melo'ut ?

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via 
Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 12:52 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

It is “dangerous” going to Biglal or Bishvil – tomorrow we will say: If it is 
Bishvil so why not change it to Shvil
We also Romanize בירושלים  to “Bi-Yerushalayim” and not to “Birushalayim”

Yossi



From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 12:31 PM
To: Gottschalk, Haim mailto:h...@loc.gov>>; 'Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel' mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hi, Haim, bi-gelal would be correct if the ב is considered a prefix to the word 
גלל. But since there is a direct entry for the word as a whole, I’m asking if 
we should romanize it as a whole word instead of as a compound word.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Gottschalk, Haim [mailto:h...@loc.gov]
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:24 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'
Subject: RE: בגלל

I think it should be “biglal” and not “bi-gelal” because of the sheva being 
treat as a sheva nach (which is how it is in the Alcalay).  This is in my 
humble opinion.

~Haim

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 11:00 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g. בגלל has a direct entry, so 
I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, 
the sheva would be considered merahef, ignored in romanization), but the entry 
also says “see גלל”. So which is it: Biglal or Bi-gelal?

Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

So then why did we decide to change practice with the 10 words below? If we 
strive for accuracy and consistency, something needs to change.

From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-bounces+jshino=pobox.upenn@lists.osu.edu] 
On Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 5:26 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

I checked  previous editions of ES and their also was a refrence to Gelal or 
Shevil
It is not a change from previous editions of the Dictionary.

I don’t agree that it is wrong.  I wouldn’t change it.

Yossi

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Robert M. TALBOTT 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 4:52 PM
To: Neil Manel Frau-Cortes ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Folks:

I have to say that I'm in Yosi's camp. A vote for "bi-gelal" is a vote for 
sanity.

B

On Thu, Feb 7, 2019 at 1:23 PM Neil Manel Frau-Cortes via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
I agree with Jasmin.


Neil

On Thu, Feb 7, 2019 at 4:20 PM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
I hear the concern, Yossi, but I’m afraid we’ve already started down the 
proverbial slope. Per the 
FAQ<http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/109347700/Romanization%20FAQ>, we’ve 
agreed to romanize the words as

Bediʻavad
Bahem
Bilvad
Kaʻet
Kefi
Levad
Lemaʻan
Lefi
Mimeni
Sheli

No one can argue for Shvil since the sheva na’ at the beginning of a word 
requires it to be Shevil. No one can argue for Birushalayim because there is no 
E-Sh. entry for the compound.

So do I hear consensus on Biglal (and Bishvil – when it means “because/on 
behalf of”; otherwise bi/ba-shevil when it means “on a/the path)?

From: Heb-naco 
[mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>] 
On Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:52 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

It is “dangerous” going to Biglal or Bishvil – tomorrow we will say: If it is 
Bishvil so why not change it to Shvil
We also Romanize בירושלים  to “Bi-Yerushalayim” and not to “Birushalayim”

Yossi



From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 12:31 PM
To: Gottschalk, Haim mailto:h...@loc.gov>>; 'Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel' mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hi, Haim, bi-gelal would be correct if the ב is considered a prefix to the word 
גלל. But since there is a direct entry for the word as a whole, I’m asking if 
we should romanize it as a whole word instead of as a compound word.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Gottschalk, Haim [mailto:h...@loc.gov]
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:24 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'
Subject: RE: בגלל

I think it should be “biglal” and not “bi-gelal” because of the sheva being 
treat as a sheva nach (which is how it is in the Alcalay).  This is in my 
humble opinion.

~Haim

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 11:00 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g. בגלל has a direct entry, so 
I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, 
the sheva would be considered merahef, ignored in romanization), but the entry 
also says “see גלל”. So which is it: Biglal or Bi-gelal?

Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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--

Neil M. Frau-Cortes, Ph.D. (he, him, his)

Judaica, Hebraica and Metadata Cataloger



University of Maryland

4109 McKeldin Library

College Park, MD 20742

Phone (301) 405-9337

nf...@umd.edu<http://nf...@umd.edu>

ORCID ID: https://orcid.org/-0002-1881-1405


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--
Bob Talbott

Principal cataloger/Hebraica cataloger

UC Berkeley

250 Moffitt

Berkeley, CA 94720

If they're too small for court, they're probably shorts.
If they're long and advanced, you're looking at pants
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Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

osu.edu> or 
jgal...@gmail.com<mailto:jgal...@gmail.com>

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress





From: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>>
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 2:01 PM
To: Galron, Joseph mailto:galro...@osu.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: RE: בגלל

I hear the concern, Yossi, but I’m afraid we’ve already started down the 
proverbial slope. Per 
theFAQ<http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/109347700/Romanization%20FAQ>, we’ve 
agreed to romanize the words as

Bediʻavad
Bahem
Bilvad
Kaʻet
Kefi
Levad
Lemaʻan
Lefi
Mimeni
Sheli

No one can argue for Shvil since the sheva na’ at the beginning of a word 
requires it to be Shevil. No one can argue for Birushalayim because there is no 
E-Sh. entry for the compound.

So do I hear consensus on Biglal (and Bishvil – when it means “because/on 
behalf of”; otherwise bi/ba-shevil when it means “on a/the path)?

From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu]On Behalf Of Galron, 
Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:52 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

It is “dangerous” going to Biglal or Bishvil – tomorrow we will say: If it is 
Bishvil so why not change it to Shvil
We also Romanize בירושלים to “Bi-Yerushalayim” and not to “Birushalayim”

Yossi



From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>>On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 12:31 PM
To: Gottschalk, Haim mailto:h...@loc.gov>>; 'Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel' mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hi, Haim, bi-gelal would be correct if theבis considered a prefix to the word 
גלל. But since there is a direct entry for the word as a whole, I’m asking if 
we should romanize it as a whole word instead of as a compound word.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Gottschalk, Haim [mailto:h...@loc.gov]
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:24 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'
Subject: RE: בגלל

I think it should be “biglal” and not “bi-gelal” because of the sheva being 
treat as a sheva nach (which is how it is in the Alcalay).  This is in my 
humble opinion.

~Haim

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>>On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 11:00 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g.בגללhas a direct entry, so I’d 
think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, the 
sheva would be considered merahef, ignored in romanization), but the entry also 
says “seeגלל”. So which is it: Biglal or Bi-gelal?

Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

lists.osu.edu] On Behalf Of Galron, 
Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:52 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

It is “dangerous” going to Biglal or Bishvil – tomorrow we will say: If it is 
Bishvil so why not change it to Shvil
We also Romanize בירושלים  to “Bi-Yerushalayim” and not to “Birushalayim”

Yossi



From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 12:31 PM
To: Gottschalk, Haim mailto:h...@loc.gov>>; 'Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel' mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hi, Haim, bi-gelal would be correct if the ב is considered a prefix to the word 
גלל. But since there is a direct entry for the word as a whole, I’m asking if 
we should romanize it as a whole word instead of as a compound word.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Gottschalk, Haim [mailto:h...@loc.gov]
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:24 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'
Subject: RE: בגלל

I think it should be “biglal” and not “bi-gelal” because of the sheva being 
treat as a sheva nach (which is how it is in the Alcalay).  This is in my 
humble opinion.

~Haim

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 11:00 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g. בגלל has a direct entry, so 
I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, 
the sheva would be considered merahef, ignored in romanization), but the entry 
also says “see גלל”. So which is it: Biglal or Bi-gelal?

Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Re: [Heb-NACO] Updated HCM-RDA

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

My pleasure – we’re all in this together, after all… ☺

From: Gabriel Angulo [mailto:gang...@brandeis.edu]
Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2019 4:23 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Updated HCM-RDA

Very nice Jasmin!

Thank you!

Gabe Angulo

On Tue, Feb 19, 2019 at 4:15 PM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hello all, happy Purim Katan.

Per recent discussions, and with Heidi’s approval, I’ve updated the 
HCM2<http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/file/fetch/132080235/HCM%20RDA%202019rev.pdf?force_download=1>
 to include the missing HCM p. 21 guidance on analytic E.-Sh. entries. While in 
the document, I also made minor edits (e.g., u-prozah) and updated the Yiddish 
names of Hebrew origin romanization chart in the appendix. I also cleaned up 
many widows/orphans, so don’t let the change in pagination (98 to 90) scare you 
– nothing was removed (other than blank space). The summary of changes is also 
attached and linked on the wiki.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Re: [Heb-NACO] פלסטינים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Yes, I should have been more clear in my original email. Thank you for asking. 
Per E.-Sh., all words that are פלסטינ* are Falasṭin* (where * = wildcard). So 
it’s Falasṭini (masculine), Falasṭinit (feminine), Falasṭinim (masc. 
plural), Falasṭiniyot (fem. plural). The name of land is Falasṭin.

Thanks again and kol ṭuv, Jasmin


From: Gerstein, Nahid 
Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2019 7:26 AM
To: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron; Shinohara, Jasmin
Subject: RE: פלסטינים

Jasmin,
I am working on changing the romaniztion for this word.
How about “Palestin?”  or “Palestini?”

Thanks,

Nahid

From: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron 
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2019 4:23 PM
To: Gerstein, Nahid 
Subject: FW: פלסטינים

Nahid,

Please see Jasmin’s correction below. Could you make these corrections in the 
LC database? If it’s too many, I could ask Yisrael to split this with you.

Thanks so much,
A

From: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>>
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2019 5:15 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
(heb-naco@lists.osu.edu) 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Cc: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron mailto:a...@loc.gov>>
Subject: פלסטינים

Hi, just a friendly notice that, per E-Sh., the above is romanized Falasṭinim, 
not Palesṭinim. (It is in the Romanization 
FAQchart.)

I don’t know if it’s a changed romanization, but we all have clean-up to do in 
our respective databases…

Kol tuv, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] פלסטינים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Sigh. How many times must it be repeated that “how Israeli’s say it” is 
entirely irrelevant? Without standards, the catalog is chaos. Even-Shoshan is 
our standard.

From: Kuperman, Aaron [mailto:a...@loc.gov]
Sent: Friday, May 17, 2019 8:05 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'; Gerstein, Nahid; Taub, 
Jeremiah Aaron
Subject: RE: פלסטינים

Do users actually say that?   I don’t recall Hebrew speakers pronouncing that 
initial letter as other than a “P”?

Aaron Kuperman, LC Law Cataloging Section.
This is not an official communication from my employer


From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2019 10:44 AM
To: Gerstein, Nahid ; Taub, Jeremiah Aaron ; Hebrew 
Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] פלסטינים

Yes, I should have been more clear in my original email. Thank you for asking. 
Per E.-Sh., all words that are פלסטינ* are Falasṭin* (where * = wildcard). So 
it’s Falasṭini (masculine), Falasṭinit (feminine), Falasṭinim (masc. 
plural), Falasṭiniyot (fem. plural). The name of land is Falasṭin.

Thanks again and kol ṭuv, Jasmin


From: Gerstein, Nahid mailto:n...@loc.gov>>
Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2019 7:26 AM
To: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron; Shinohara, Jasmin
Subject: RE: פלסטינים

Jasmin,
I am working on changing the romaniztion for this word.
How about “Palestin?”  or “Palestini?”

Thanks,

Nahid

From: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron mailto:a...@loc.gov>>
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2019 4:23 PM
To: Gerstein, Nahid mailto:n...@loc.gov>>
Subject: FW: פלסטינים

Nahid,

Please see Jasmin’s correction below. Could you make these corrections in the 
LC database? If it’s too many, I could ask Yisrael to split this with you.

Thanks so much,
A

From: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>>
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2019 5:15 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
(heb-naco@lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>) 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Cc: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron mailto:a...@loc.gov>>
Subject: פלסטינים

Hi, just a friendly notice that, per E-Sh., the above is romanized Falasṭinim, 
not Palesṭinim. (It is in the Romanization 
FAQchart<http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/109347700/Romanization%20FAQ#p>.)

I don’t know if it’s a changed romanization, but we all have clean-up to do in 
our respective databases…

Kol tuv, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Heb-naco@lists.osu.edu
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Re: [Heb-NACO] פלסטינים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Per Even-Shoshan, the addition of an א changes the word from Falasṭini to 
Palesṭinai or, second entry, Palesṭina’i (hirik under the alef).

(Am I the only one with a copy of the dictionary?)

From: Yossi Galron [mailto:jgal...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, May 17, 2019 8:25 AM
To: Aaron Kuperman; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Cc: Shinohara, Jasmin; Nahid D Gerstein; Taub, Jeremiah Aaron
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] פלסטינים

and what about פלשתינאים?
Is it also with an F?

Yossi


On Fri, May 17, 2019, 08:22 Kuperman, Aaron via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Do users actually say that?   I don’t recall Hebrew speakers pronouncing that 
initial letter as other than a “P”?

Aaron Kuperman, LC Law Cataloging Section.
This is not an official communication from my employer


From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2019 10:44 AM
To: Gerstein, Nahid mailto:n...@loc.gov>>; Taub, Jeremiah Aaron 
mailto:a...@loc.gov>>; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] פלסטינים

Yes, I should have been more clear in my original email. Thank you for asking. 
Per E.-Sh., all words that are פלסטינ* are Falasṭin* (where * = wildcard). So 
it’s Falasṭini (masculine), Falasṭinit (feminine), Falasṭinim (masc. 
plural), Falasṭiniyot (fem. plural). The name of land is Falasṭin.

Thanks again and kol ṭuv, Jasmin


From: Gerstein, Nahid mailto:n...@loc.gov>>
Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2019 7:26 AM
To: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron; Shinohara, Jasmin
Subject: RE: פלסטינים

Jasmin,
I am working on changing the romaniztion for this word.
How about “Palestin?”  or “Palestini?”

Thanks,

Nahid

From: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron mailto:a...@loc.gov>>
Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2019 4:23 PM
To: Gerstein, Nahid mailto:n...@loc.gov>>
Subject: FW: פלסטינים

Nahid,

Please see Jasmin’s correction below. Could you make these corrections in the 
LC database? If it’s too many, I could ask Yisrael to split this with you.

Thanks so much,
A

From: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>>
Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2019 5:15 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
(heb-naco@lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>) 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Cc: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron mailto:a...@loc.gov>>
Subject: פלסטינים

Hi, just a friendly notice that, per E-Sh., the above is romanized Falasṭinim, 
not Palesṭinim. (It is in the Romanization 
FAQchart<http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/109347700/Romanization%20FAQ#p>.)

I don’t know if it’s a changed romanization, but we all have clean-up to do in 
our respective databases…

Kol tuv, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Re: [Heb-NACO] RAS Cataloging question

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, Neil, thank you for your question. Yes, membership rotation takes place at 
conference. So you are a member through the end of this coming meeting.

Please don’t hesitate to ask if there are further questions.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-bounces+jshino=pobox.upenn@lists.osu.edu] 
On Behalf Of Neil Manel Frau-Cortes via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, June 3, 2019 2:24 PM
To: heb-n...@lists.service.ohio-state.edu
Subject: [Heb-NACO] RAS Cataloging question

Hi,

Quick question: my second term at RAS Cataloging Committee expires on 2019. 
Does this mean at the end of the year, at the conference, or when?

Thanks,


Neil

--

Neil M. Frau-Cortes, Ph.D. (he, him, his)

Judaica, Hebraica and Metadata Cataloger



University of Maryland

4109 McKeldin Library

College Park, MD 20742

Phone (301) 405-9337

nf...@umd.edu

ORCID ID: https://orcid.org/-0002-1881-1405


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Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - "Jewish-Arab Relations in LCSH" by Roger Kohn Now Available on the AJL RAS Cataloging Committee Wiki

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

6th bullet down in the Documentation section of the wiki, "LC Presentation on 
Jewish-Arab Relations in LCSH (June 
2019)"

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Marlene Schiffman via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, June 12, 2019 12:38 PM
To: Taub, Jeremiah Aaron ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - "Jewish-Arab Relations in LCSH" by Roger Kohn 
Now Available on the AJL RAS Cataloging Committee Wiki

Can you send a direct link to this file? I cannot locate it.
Thanks,
MRS

Marlene Schiffman
Gottesman Library Technical Services
Yeshiva University
500 West 185th Street
New York, NY 10033

646 592-4276 (direct)
646 592-4100 (general office)

From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu] On Behalf Of Taub, 
Jeremiah Aaron via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, June 06, 2019 11:44 AM
To: heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu
Subject: [EXT] - [Heb-NACO] "Jewish-Arab Relations in LCSH" by Roger Kohn Now 
Available on the AJL RAS Cataloging Committee Wiki

**External Email**
Dear Colleagues,

Roger Kohn of the Israel and Judaica Section at the Library of Congress has 
prepared an in-depth analysis entitled "Jewish-Arab Relations in LCSH." The 
file is now available for viewing on the AJL RAS Cataloging Committee wiki 
under "Documentation." Roger welcomes your feedback at 
r...@loc.gov. Thank you, Roger, for preparing this file, 
and thank you, Jasmin, for mounting it on the wiki!

Best wishes,
Aaron


http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/7836007/Home

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[Heb-NACO] פלסטינים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, just a friendly notice that, per E-Sh., the above is romanized Falasṭinim, 
not Palesṭinim. (It is in the Romanization FAQ 
chart.)

I don’t know if it’s a changed romanization, but we all have clean-up to do in 
our respective databases…

Kol tuv, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] resource for vocalization for non-Hebrew personal names

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

A vocalization source: 
https://www.materna.co.il/%D7%94%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%95%D7%9F-%D7%95%D7%9C%D7%99%D7%93%D7%94/%D7%A9%D7%9E%D7%95%D7%AA-%D7%9C%D7%AA%D7%99%D7%A0%D7%95%D7%A7%D7%95%D7%AA/%D7%91%D7%A0%D7%95%D7%AA?name=%D7%95%D7%99%D7%A7%D7%98%D7%95%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%94
 ☺

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Yossi Galron via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, July 11, 2019 4:55 PM
To: Heidi G Lerner ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] resource for vocalization for non-Hebrew personal names

Viktoryah


Joseph Galron-Goldschläger
––
Joseph (Yossi) Galron-Goldschläger
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies 
Library
and German Language and Literature Librarian
305 G Thompson Memorial Library
The Ohio State University Libraries
1858 Neil Ave. Mall
Columbus, Ohio 43210 USA
Tel.: (614) 292-3362, Fax: (614)292-1918
Mobile: (614) 285-4290
E-Mail: galro...@osu.edu or 
jgal...@gmail.com

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress


On Thu, Jul 11, 2019 at 4:53 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:

Hi all,



Do we know of any resource that can provides vocalized forms for non-Hebrew 
personal names.



I have יוקטוריה and I don't know if I should do it as



Ṿiḳṭoriyah



or



Ṿiḳṭoryah



Any thoughts will be appreciated.



Thanks, Heidi



Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Dept.

Stanford University Libraries

Stanford, CA 94305-6004

ph: 650-725-9953

fax: 650-725-1120

e-mail: ler...@stanford.edu
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[Heb-NACO] Survey on romanization

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

This message is being cross-posted. Please excuse duplication.



Dear colleagues,



The Non-Latin Script Materials Affinity 
Group
 of the Linked Data for Production-2 project invites you to participate in an 
online survey on romanization in library catalogs. Library catalogs include 
romanization to support the use of resources in non-Latin scripts. As library 
systems become more powerful in handling native scripts, and with the move to 
linked data, there is a desire to re-evaluate the current practice regarding 
romanization. Before any decisions can be made, libraries need to consider the 
impact on patrons, library staff, and systems used to manage those resources.



This survey will be used to help make recommendations on the use of 
romanization in library catalogs within a linked data environment.



This online survey should take approximately 5-7 minutes to complete and will 
be available at the following link until October 8

https://umich.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_0xmDmv1NgzCfBtP



Please forward the survey to anyone that you think might be interested.



If you have questions about the survey, please contact Xiaoli Li 
(x...@ucdavis.edu) or Larisa Walsh 
(wal...@uchicago.edu)



We are grateful for your participation and look forward to your feedback.



Kind regards,



On behalf of the Non-Latin Script Materials Affinity Group


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Yes, this was resolved back in February, with the critical text from HCM p. 21 
(“In the rare cases where Even-Shoshan may show the same word under more than 
one entry element, the more 'analytical' option is chosen.”) re-added to 
HCMRDA, and we agreed that standard romanization of בגלל is bi-gelal (and בשביל 
is bi-shevil in all cases).

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Joan Biella via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2019 7:10 PM
To: Yossi Galron via Heb-naco 
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Jasmine writes:

 בגלל has a direct entry, so I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT 
bigelal because as a whole word, the sheva would be considered merahef, ignored 
in romanization), but the entry also says “see גלל”. So which is it: Biglal or 
Bi-gelal?

Doesn't HCM say, more or less, "If Even-Shoshan gives both, use THE MORE 
ANALYTICAL FORM"--that is, the form with the hyphen?  This is done, in the same 
way as we write "Yerushalayim," so the 2nd part of the word will be searchable. 
 Not that I expect people who want to search "biglal" will search "gelal" and 
expect to find it, but people wanting "Yerushalayim" will find 
"bi-Yerushalayim" also.  And so that all catalogers will romanize these things 
the same way, after having once looked them up in the dictionary.

Joan


On Wed, Sep 18, 2019 at 1:29 PM Yossi Galron via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Bi-melot ...

On Wed, Sep 18, 2019, 22:28 Marlene Schiffman via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
We have a title that uses this word: Zeʼev Z'aboṭinsḳi, ha-ish u-mishnato : \b 
(bi-melot meʼah shanah le-huladto)

Marlene Schiffman
Gottesman Library Technical Services
Yeshiva University
500 West 185th Street
New York, NY 10033

646 592-4276 (direct)
646 592-4100 (general office)

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:yu@lists.osu.edu>> 
On Behalf Of Abend-David,Ilana via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 1:07 PM
To: Galron, Joseph mailto:galro...@osu.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

If so how would you transliterate במלאות 25 שנה  ? Would this be correct 
bi-melo'ut ?

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 12:52 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

It is “dangerous” going to Biglal or Bishvil – tomorrow we will say: If it is 
Bishvil so why not change it to Shvil
We also Romanize בירושלים  to “Bi-Yerushalayim” and not to “Birushalayim”

Yossi



From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 7, 2019 12:31 PM
To: Gottschalk, Haim mailto:h...@loc.gov>>; 'Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel' mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hi, Haim, bi-gelal would be correct if the ב is considered a prefix to the word 
גלל. But since there is a direct entry for the word as a whole, I’m asking if 
we should romanize it as a whole word instead of as a compound word.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Gottschalk, Haim [mailto:h...@loc.gov]
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 12:24 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel'
Subject: RE: בגלל

I think it should be “biglal” and not “bi-gelal” because of the sheva being 
treat as a sheva nach (which is how it is in the Alcalay).  This is in my 
humble opinion.

~Haim

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2019 11:00 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] בגלל

Hello Collective Wisdom, please remind me: if there’s an entry in E-Sh., even 
if it ends with a “see also”, is that sufficient justification for romanizing 
the word as a word as opposed to a compound? E.g. בגלל has a direct entry, so 
I’d think it would be romanized biglal (NOT bigelal because as a whole word, 
the sheva would be considered merahef, ignored in romanization), but the entry 
also says “see גלל”. So which is it: Biglal or Bi-gelal?

Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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[Heb-NACO] Reminder: Survey on romanization

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello friends and shanah tovah!



Just a friendly reminder to please participate in the Survey on Romanization 
that will close next Monday, October 7. Many thanks to those who already 
responded. If you haven't yet completed it, we would really appreciate your 
input.

The link to the survey is here: 
https://umich.qualtrics.com/jfe/form/SV_0xmDmv1NgzCfBtP

This survey will be used to help make recommendations on the use of 
romanization in library catalogs within a linked data environment.

Many thanks for your time and consideration!

Jasmin Shinohara, on behalf of
LD4P2 Non-Latin Script Materials Affinity Group


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] Romanization survey report

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Sure. Heidi, is there room to add the topic to the Cataloging Committee meeting 
agenda?

From: Neil Manel Frau-Cortes 
Sent: Thursday, March 5, 2020 8:30 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Romanization survey report

Very interesting results. I would want to see further discussion of this at the 
AJL conference.

Neil

On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 5:35 PM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Dear Heb-NACO Members,

Thank you for participating in the Linked Data for Production-2 Non-Latin 
Script Materials Affinity Group Survey on Romanization. The survey was designed 
to help make recommendations on the use of romanization in library catalogs 
within a linked data environment.

On behalf of the Group we would like to share the report summarizing survey 
results. 
This<https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HVmtQxXSE0aphipdACNTTck6rzT3gPEoqjzKynYgL78/edit?ts=5e4323ce>
 is the link to the report; a PDF version of the report is also attached.

If you have any questions, please send them to Xiaoli 
Li<mailto:x...@ucdavis.edu> or Larisa Walsh<mailto:wal...@uchicago.edu>.

Thanks again, kol tuv, and a festive Purim to all,

Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
551.1 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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--

Neil M. Frau-Cortes, Ph.D. (he, him, his)

Senior Catalog Librarian

Supervisor for Non-Roman and Special Collections Cataloging



University of Maryland

2200 McKeldin Library

College Park, MD 20742

Phone (301) 405-9337

nf...@umd.edu<http://nf...@umd.edu>

ORCID ID: https://orcid.org/-0002-1881-1405


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Re: [Heb-NACO] congratulations, Jasmin!

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thank you, all. Thanks and kudos to Neil for leading the way for us! :)

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2020 11:44 AM
To: Neil Manel Frau-Cortes ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] congratulations, Jasmin!

Congratulations to Jasmin.!!!

Thank you Neil for letting us know.




Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Dept.

Stanford University Libraries

Stanford, CA 94305-6004

ph: 650-725-9953

fax: 650-725-1120

e-mail: ler...@stanford.edu


From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> on 
behalf of Neil Manel Frau-Cortes via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2020 7:56 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] congratulations, Jasmin!

Join me in congratulating Jasmin Shinohara, who has gained independence in 
merging print monographs in OCLC's Member Merge Program, as part of our Hebrew 
language cohort.

Great job!

--

Neil M. Frau-Cortes, Ph.D. (he, him, his)

Senior Catalog Librarian

Supervisor for Non-Roman and Special Collections Cataloging



University of Maryland

2200 McKeldin Library

College Park, MD 20742

Phone (301) 405-9337

nf...@umd.edu

ORCID ID: https://orcid.org/-0002-1881-1405


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Re: [Heb-NACO] Lockdown Contingency Proposals

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

If folks are looking for ideas of work without books, cleanup is at the top of 
my list. I’d recommend reviewing the list of frequently misromanized words on 
the wiki and 
checking which records in your local catalog need correcting (and ideally, 
fixing them in OCLC, too). If there’s enough interest, perhaps we can split the 
list among a number of folks; many hands make light work…

I managed to bring my copy of Even Shoshan home, so if anyone has questions, 
please feel free to reach out.

Kol tuv and good health to all, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Yossi Galron via 
Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2020 1:31 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Lockdown Contingency Proposals

From: Yaniv Levi mailto:yaniv.l...@nli.org.il>>
To: "heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu" 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>>
Cc: Rini Goldsmith 
mailto:marina.goldsm...@nli.org.il>>, Ahava Cohen 
mailto:ahava.co...@nli.org.il>>
Bcc:
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2020 13:19:16 +
Subject: RE: [Heb-NACO] Lockdown Contingency Proposals

Dear Heidi and Neil,



A short update from the NLI on the issues rasied below (not sure it helps but 
might).



1. Hebrew books (HB): At NLI we have already linked our bib records to the 
scanned books in HB, this means we have a full standard record for all the 
books scanned in HB. The issue is that our records are cataloged in Hebrew and 
do not have transliteration  and the general fields (3xx, 5xx) are in Hebrew. 
Not sure if that can help american libraries but If there is a library that 
this information is of intrest to her we will be happy to share. In addition we 
are planing to share the records through the Alma Community Zone (CZ) and are 
in contact with ExL on that matter but the same limitation will apply.



2. Other digitized collection: the work above is not limited to HB, but also to 
other digitized books worldwida, including the YBC (Yiddish book center) 
collection, Libraries in Germany, Yizkor book (NYPL), Internet archive and 
others. But again same limitation apply. I would mention that we are working 
with Google to scan any out of copy rights book in our collection (till now 
over 40'000) and that will also be avalible.



3. NACO  “provisional” vernacular - at NLI we have connected our authority file 
to LC, so we have the official hebrew form for the LC forms. This is not true 
for all authors in LC, but only to authors that published books in Hebrew. You 
can see the infomration in VIAF.org. If this can help with a jump start will be 
happy to share.



4. Wikidata authorities for Hebrew personal names - the VIAF information is 
merged with wikidata, but any additions to Wikidata will be welcome.





BR,



Yaniv Levi-Korem

Head of Technical Services

National Library of Israel



E.J. Safra Campus, Givat Ram, P.O.B. 39105; Jerusalem 91390, Israel
(E) yaniv.l...@nli.org.il (C) 972-52-8600-747 (W) 
972-2-6586424


From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> on 
behalf of Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Sent: Tuesday, March 31, 2020 1:57 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel; Neil Manel Frau-Cortes
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Lockdown Contingency Proposals

Neil,

That is a great idea if there are Hebrew catalogers whose institutions really 
don't have things to do.I  am working in tandem with my unit on a variety of 
different projects, some Hebrew dependent, some different projects that have 
been sitting around that we now are able to tackle because of a lack of print 
resources.

At the present time I have more than enough to keep me busy but perhaps there 
are others who would jump at the opportunity. I do suspect that managers' will  
need to be involved in these explorations.

Best, Heidi


Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Dept.

Stanford University Libraries

Stanford, CA 94305-6004

ph: 650-725-9953

fax: 650-725-1120

e-mail: ler...@stanford.edu


From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> on 
behalf of Neil Manel Frau-Cortes via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2020 8:21 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Lockdown Contingency Proposals

Hi everybody,

I hope you are well and keeping safe and isolated.

One of my big projects at work has been generating tasks for teleworkers, 
particularly for catalogers that are print-dependent and new to remote work, 
and now find themselves almost idle.

I have a proposal: can we find things we could invest time in, as a group? If 
nothing else, I would like to start this discussion.

Potential ideas --




1.Hebrewbooks bib records - unlike HathiTrust, Hebrewbooks does not set 
high standards for its metadata. We could revisit the 

Re: [Heb-NACO] dates given in chronogram only

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Very nice, though you may wish to fix the wonky brackets around the 770 in the 
880 264. :-)

Kol tuv and gut mo’ed, Jasmin

Get Outlook for iOS

From: Heb-naco  on 
behalf of Gottschalk, Haim via Heb-naco 
Sent: Wednesday, October 7, 2020 12:08:10 PM
To: 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel' 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] dates given in chronogram only


Dear  חברה,



מועדים לשימחה!!



Recently on Heb-NACO there was a discussion about handling the date when it is 
given in chronogram only. There was some back and forth.  I just completed one 
work with the date given in chronogram only following LCC-PCC PS for 2.8.6.4:



[cid:image004.png@01D69CA2.85760E70]



I place the dates in square brackets since it is supplied.

All the best,

Haim



~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

Haim A. Gottschalk

Hebraica and Judaica Cataloging Librarian

Asian and Middle Eastern Division, Israel and Judaica Section



The Library of Congress

101 Independence Ave, SE, LM-537

Washington, DC 20540-4222



Direct: 202-707-2498

h...@loc.gov



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Re: [Heb-NACO] romanization question

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

My pleasure, any time ☺

From: Heidi G Lerner 
Sent: Thursday, August 6, 2020 4:12 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: romanization question

Thank you


Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Dept.

Stanford University Libraries

Stanford, CA 94305-6004

ph: 650-725-9953

fax: 650-725-1120

e-mail: ler...@stanford.edu


From: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>>
Sent: Thursday, August 6, 2020 1:05 PM
To: Heidi G Lerner mailto:ler...@stanford.edu>>; Hebrew 
Name Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: RE: romanization question


Yes, with the addition of the alif diacritic, mit’agdim. The sheva under the 
gimel would be naʻ because it has a dagesh, but per HCM-RDA, it’s ignored in 
ALA-LC romanizaztion.



Kol tuv, Jasmin



From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, August 6, 2020 2:59 PM
To: heb-naco@lists.osu.edu
Subject: [Heb-NACO] romanization question



Hi all,



The verb "מתאגדים"



I believe that it would be romanized as:



"mitagdim"  as per RDA Hebraica



The first and most easily definable of these categories is the sheṿa occurring 
between the second and third consonants of the plural forms of benoni 
(participles, nouns, etc. having the same vowel pattern) and other verb forms 
of the pa‘al/ḳal, pi‘el, and hitpa‘el binyanim (stems), including all sheṿas 
following consonants with dagesh ḥazaḳ

Any agreement or disagreement would be greatly appreciated





I look forward to hearing from those  who agree and those who don't.



Thanks, Heidi



Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Dept.

Stanford University Libraries

Stanford, CA 94305-6004

ph: 650-725-9953

fax: 650-725-1120

e-mail: ler...@stanford.edu
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Re: [Heb-NACO] Announcement: AJL RAS Cataloging Committee Meeting 2020

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, in the middle of the response to the email from Laura.

In the meantime, is it possible that the agenda item "a potential OCLC project: 
an informal funnel-like group to merge duplicate OCLC records (Sharon, 5 
minutes)" was mistakenly copied from last year's agenda?

Are there updates from Haim about the Hebrew grammar guide discussed last year?

"Non-Latin Script Affinity Group - part of PCC LD4P" appears both in the 
bulleted part of the agenda and in the New Business section. I think it only 
needs to be in one place.

Do we have minutes from 2019?  Approval of the minutes needs to be added to the 
agenda, but it's hard to approve a non-existing document...

Finally, is there any way to schedule this meeting during the course of the 
online conference, June 28-July 2?

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, June 22, 2020 2:43 PM
To: heb-naco@lists.osu.edu
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Announcement: AJL RAS Cataloging Committee Meeting 2020


Dear safranim,



The AJL RAS Cataloging Committee will hold  its annual meeting on June 25, 2020 
8:15-9:15 PDT.

Please see below for access information:

Association of Jewish Libraries is inviting you to a scheduled Zoom meeting.

Topic: RAS Cataloging Committee
Time: Jun 25, 2020 08:15 AM Pacific Time (US and Canada)

Join Zoom Meeting
https://us02web.zoom.us/j/86579872626

Meeting ID: 865 7987 2626
One tap mobile
+16699006833,,86579872626# US (San Jose)
+12532158782,,86579872626# US (Tacoma)

Dial by your location
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Meeting ID: 865 7987 2626
Find your local number: https://us02web.zoom.us/u/keHJdbJfpX



Agenda

Welcome and introductions, approve 2019 minutes

  *   Welcome to Neil Frau-Cortes - Incoming chair, AJL RAS Cataloging Cmomittee
  *   an update to the committee on the UCLA project to add non-Latin scripts 
to Russian records in OCLC
  *   a potential OCLC project: an informal funnel-like group to merge 
duplicate OCLC records (Sharon, 5 minutes)
  *   NACO Hebraica project to clean up and evaluate non-Latin script 
references in the model of NACO CJK Funnel?
  *   Non-Latin Script Affinity Group - part of PCC LD4P (Heidi and Jasmin, 5 
minutes)

New business

  1.  Implementation of OCLC merge project (Neil, Jasmin) - 5 minutes
  2.  Non-Latin Script Affinity Group - part of PCC LD4P (Jasmin) 5-10 minutes
  3.  Wikidata  Judaica Project (Heidi) - 5 minutes
  4.  Other business?



Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Dept.

Stanford University Libraries

Stanford, CA 94305-6004

ph: 650-725-9953

fax: 650-725-1120

e-mail: ler...@stanford.edu
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Re: [Heb-NACO] we have two new mergers!

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

This is wonderful news! Welcome aboard, Sharon and Caroline!

A happy Zot Chanukah to all, Jasmin



Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
F. 215-573-9610
jsh...@upenn.edu


From: Heb-naco  on 
behalf of Neil Manel Frau-Cortes via Heb-naco 
Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2020 4:27 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] we have two new mergers!

Dear all,

I'm glad to announce that Sharon Benamou and Caroline Miller, working in 
tandem, have concluded their review period and now are officially independent 
in merging print book format on OCLC. A great pleasure working with them!

If anybody has any questions regarding the Hebrew Merge Program, please let me 
know.

חודש טוב וחג אורים שמח,

--

Neil M. Frau-Cortes, Ph.D. (he, him, his)

Assistant Head, Cataloging & Metadata Services

(Metadata Creation & Enhancement)


University of Maryland

2200 McKeldin Library

College Park, MD 20742

Phone (301) 405-9337

nf...@umd.edu

ORCID ID: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://orcid.org/-0002-1881-1405__;!!KGKeukY!lLHWl9d0-iZiSsanqlyxTD_TPox1a-uZIHlhsdg_IWcsJQLU6qegaY2NlwzEXTdGrSJP$
 


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Re: [Heb-NACO] Fwd: Hasafran post from schif...@yu.edu requires approval

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Predominant practice has been to romanize as “ha-A.B.” or “ha-A-B” (both found 
in LC’s OPAC; not sure which is correct/preferred). We do not spell out 
initialisms/acronyms/abbreviations in other cases, so I’m not sure why we would 
here.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Hasafran via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, November 9, 2020 3:07 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Fwd: Hasafran post from schif...@yu.edu requires approval

From: Marlene Schiffman mailto:schif...@yu.edu>>
To: "'hasaf...@lists.osu.edu'" 
mailto:hasaf...@lists.osu.edu>>
Cc:
Bcc:
Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2020 17:30:48 +
Subject: romanize this
Hello Colleagues,
How to romanize  על סדר הא''ב. Ha-alef bet? Or ha-A. B.? My preference would be 
ha-A[lef] B[et], but I presume that’s not allowed. ☹

MRS


Marlene Schiffman
Judaica Cataloger
Gottesman Library
Yeshiva University
500 West 185th Street
New York, N.Y. 10033

Gottesman Library
Room 301
646 592 4276




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Re: [Heb-NACO] Sacred work

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

I second Bob’s proposal of creating a list. Ahava, would such a list be 
included in the new Resources section of RDA? Or would it only belong on our 
user community’s wiki?

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Robert M. TALBOTT via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2021 12:21 PM
To: Neil Manel Frau-Cortes ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Sacred work

Discussing it during the summer session is a good idea.  I also suggest the 
creation of a working list of sacred works that we can all agree upon, though I 
realize this may be problematic.

B


On Mon, Jan 25, 2021 at 8:58 AM Neil Manel Frau-Cortes via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
I think this is a great question, and probably the fruit of applying an 
anglocentric category to a body of literature that doesn't match. We should 
consider if anything we call sifre kodesh is actually a sacred text in the 
spirit of the LC category.

That said, even inside of the sphere of sifre kodesh, I think that the Zohar is 
major, called Zohar ha-kadosh, which is a qualificative we don't find applied 
to many other rabbinic works. This brings me to the question: what else is 
Sacred Texts in our cannon? Other than the Tanakh, should we include the Talmud 
(Mishnah, Tosefta?)? I wouldn't include the midrash as a number of rishonim, 
like Duran, consider it to be holy, yet "not to be taken literally." Yet, the 
Zohar is midrashic in nature. It's all a conundrum. If people are interested, 
perhaps we can talk more about that in our RAS Cataloging Summer meeting, since 
the Winter's agenda is already quite full.

On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 11:47 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi all,

I have a question: for purposes of correct application of LC Subject Heading 
Manual and RDA, is the Zohar considered a Sacred work.

Thanks , Heidi


Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Dept.

Stanford University Libraries

Stanford, CA 94305-6004

ph: 650-725-9953

fax: 650-725-1120

e-mail: ler...@stanford.edu
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--

Neil M. Frau-Cortes, Ph.D. (he, him, his)

Assistant Head, Cataloging & Metadata Services

(Metadata Creation & Enhancement)



University of Maryland

2200 McKeldin Library

College Park, MD 20742

Phone (301) 405-9337

nf...@umd.edu

ORCID ID: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://orcid.org/-0002-1881-1405__;!!KGKeukY!hgLVpjro8WGqHsGY1TU-u5MHMUvTVcgtJWJQkUXJhqF_en3jFtJbSh88BiTyOZK_-b2w$
 



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--
Bob Talbott

Hebraica cataloger/Curatorial Assistant to the Judaica Collection

UC Berkeley

250 Moffitt

Berkeley, CA 94720

Lue musaraba shu biburueada Bilgameshe nam habadabkure.
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Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - Re: Sacred work

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Yes, Marlene, that's correct because the Haggadah is a liturgical work not a 
sacred work. Per LC's SHM 1435, the subdivision Commentaries only applies to 
sacred works not religious works.

The Written (i.e., Tanakh) and Oral (i.e., Mishnah and Gemara [together, the 
Talmud]) Torah would be considered "sacred works" for the purposes of applying 
SHM and RDA. The rest, including the Zohar, Midrash, commentaries, codes, 
liturgies (incl. Haggadah), etc., are all considered "religious works" as 
opposed to "sacred works".

I caution against Bob's "do what you feel" approach in cataloging. For 
libraries, that would spell chaos and only be a disservice to patrons.

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Marlene Schiffman 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2021 12:00 PM
To: Neil Manel Frau-Cortes ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - Re: Sacred work

I might be like Haggadah which does not take "Commentaries." Only bible and 
Talmud do. That was my understanding.

Marlene Schiffman
Metadata and Services Department
Gottesman Library
Yeshiva University
500 West 185th Street
New York, N.Y. 10033

Gottesman Library
Room 301
646 592 4276

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-bounces+schiffma=yu@lists.osu.edu>>
 On Behalf Of Neil Manel Frau-Cortes via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, January 25, 2021 8:21 AM
To: Heidi G Lerner mailto:ler...@stanford.edu>>; Hebrew 
Name Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [EXT] - Re: [Heb-NACO] Sacred work

**External Email**
I think this is a great question, and probably the fruit of applying an 
anglocentric category to a body of literature that doesn't match. We should 
consider if anything we call sifre kodesh is actually a sacred text in the 
spirit of the LC category.

That said, even inside of the sphere of sifre kodesh, I think that the Zohar is 
major, called Zohar ha-kadosh, which is a qualificative we don't find applied 
to many other rabbinic works. This brings me to the question: what else is 
Sacred Texts in our cannon? Other than the Tanakh, should we include the Talmud 
(Mishnah, Tosefta?)? I wouldn't include the midrash as a number of rishonim, 
like Duran, consider it to be holy, yet "not to be taken literally." Yet, the 
Zohar is midrashic in nature. It's all a conundrum. If people are interested, 
perhaps we can talk more about that in our RAS Cataloging Summer meeting, since 
the Winter's agenda is already quite full.

On Sun, Jan 24, 2021 at 11:47 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi all,

I have a question: for purposes of correct application of LC Subject Heading 
Manual and RDA, is the Zohar considered a Sacred work.

Thanks , Heidi


Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Dept.

Stanford University Libraries

Stanford, CA 94305-6004

ph: 650-725-9953

fax: 650-725-1120

e-mail: ler...@stanford.edu
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--

Neil M. Frau-Cortes, Ph.D. (he, him, his)

Assistant Head, Cataloging & Metadata Services

(Metadata Creation & Enhancement)



University of Maryland

2200 McKeldin Library

College Park, MD 20742

Phone (301) 405-9337

nf...@umd.edu

ORCID ID: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://orcid.org/-0002-1881-1405__;!!KGKeukY!gCSRO8cvH5Apapb3EmjzdRyV_aYMsax_Xdbb1CPiM-1eZtVlEnPd8UjIibx-eq3-waK9$
 

[Heb-NACO] FYI: not a series: Sifrut makor by Medyah 10

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, I've been noticing that in the last couple of years the publisher Medyah 10 
has been adding the statement "Sifrut makor" on their covers and that it's been 
recorded as a series statement in numerous records (including those by LC). As 
an unnumbered phrase indicating a broad category (meaning simply "original 
fiction"), Sifrut makor by Medyah 10 is not a series. The publisher 
website, too, gives no indication of their considering it a series. (For more 
specifics, see the PCC series 
training, session 
12, series-like phrases.)

Since there seems to be some confusion, I'll create a SAR indicating treatment.

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
551.1 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - Re: 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

P39UN*2Fh6By2Yyr8Zkrg0PE*3D=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSU!!KGKeukY!hx0QYJPGVeB1Jg3zYS6GBwNaCTscsu0IKhBpyWQYCPOEysnigfp0knYfauNJsnXbyNRr$
 >

My two Groschen to the issue

Yossi


יוסי גלרון-גולדשלגר
טלפון נייד 1.614.805.9954
Йозеф Галрон Гольдшлегер
Joseph (Yossi) 
Galron-Goldschläger<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Flibrary.osu.edu*2Fpeople*2Fgalron.1=04*7C01*7Cschiffma*40yu.edu*7Caaf82c40e24340a3f72a08d906b96a34*7C04c70eb48f2648079934e02e89266ad0*7C1*7C1*7C637548215708522358*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C2000=kgksfes8piWF9cOukgFy3qeAYsE74d399TmDF7lYMqY*3D=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUl!!KGKeukY!hx0QYJPGVeB1Jg3zYS6GBwNaCTscsu0IKhBpyWQYCPOEysnigfp0knYfauNJspULLogb$
 >
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies 
Library<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2Fclicktime.symantec.com*2F35nyXVx1aw9CrjvPVzwN5of6H2*3Fu*3Dhttp*3A*2F*2Fguides.osu.edu*2Fc.php*3Fg*3D337806*26p*3D2274681__*3BJSUlJSUlJSU!!KGKeukY!kUTYt7T7txseqvv_MbDA40Qc8GOigrxqsE-7Zi5NkfP2ikN57ei5Adhh0Mse6Etz*24=04*7C01*7Cschiffma*40yu.edu*7Caaf82c40e24340a3f72a08d906b96a34*7C04c70eb48f2648079934e02e89266ad0*7C1*7C1*7C637548215708532313*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C2000=EuZMNLXOhLY5Nk1*2FE*2FA*2FlrSKxG3KaYxjAIPGfuRWKHI*3D=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSoqKioqKioqJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUl!!KGKeukY!hx0QYJPGVeB1Jg3zYS6GBwNaCTscsu0IKhBpyWQYCPOEysnigfp0knYfauNJsgegILSW$
 >
and German Language and Literature Librarian
305 G Thompson Memorial Library
The Ohio State University Libraries
1858 Neil Ave. Mall
Columbus, Ohio 43210 USA
Tel.: (614) 292-3362, Fax: (614)292-1918
Mobile: (614) 805-9954
E-Mail: galro...@osu.edu<mailto:galro...@osu.edu> or 
jgal...@gmail.com<mailto:jgal...@gmail.com>

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2Fclicktime.symantec.com*2F3QFzqKM4bhoMEbRUtvt5Cwi6H2*3Fu*3Dhttp*3A*2F*2Fgo.osu.edu*2Fhebrewlit__*3BJSUlJQ!!KGKeukY!kUTYt7T7txseqvv_MbDA40Qc8GOigrxqsE-7Zi5NkfP2ikN57ei5Adhh0GlG_VHC*24=04*7C01*7Cschiffma*40yu.edu*7Caaf82c40e24340a3f72a08d906b96a34*7C04c70eb48f2648079934e02e89266ad0*7C1*7C1*7C637548215708532313*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C2000=8TAoMF8ImNtXZFYuAz9P8m3gzw9Ai71c2JqTLSTdXaU*3D=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSoqKiolJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSU!!KGKeukY!hx0QYJPGVeB1Jg3zYS6GBwNaCTscsu0IKhBpyWQYCPOEysnigfp0knYfauNJsv2GgnkM$
 >

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://nam02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2Fclicktime.symantec.com*2F3T7oGBhra4qxPxXMeh5okCG6H2*3Fu*3Dhttp*3A*2F*2Fgo.osu.edu*2Fjpress__*3BJSUlJQ!!KGKeukY!kUTYt7T7txseqvv_MbDA40Qc8GOigrxqsE-7Zi5NkfP2ikN57ei5Adhh0OJa_eeX*24=04*7C01*7Cschiffma*40yu.edu*7Caaf82c40e24340a3f72a08d906b96a34*7C04c70eb48f2648079934e02e89266ad0*7C1*7C1*7C637548215708542267*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C2000=sz7gWMDech9hmZY7a1QBy*2BHZgLRUkpOJ*2BLfpt3kXXxU*3D=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSoqKiolJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJQ!!KGKeukY!hx0QYJPGVeB1Jg3zYS6GBwNaCTscsu0IKhBpyWQYCPOEysnigfp0knYfauNJsjdrDijr$
 >




From: Heb-naco On Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2021 5:32 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

Hi, folks, I hope this email finds you all well.

I recently had the opportunity to get some guidance on how to code dates in the 
authority 046 when the date/s available is/are only using the Hebrew calendar. 
This was my question:

“Hebrew dates span two calendar days and, as such, two Gregorian dates. Till 
now, the majority of catalogers have made an assumption that the Hebrew date is 
the latter of the two Gregorian dates and only coded that date in the 046 
(indicating certainty). The question is, is such practice ok/correct? Or should 
catalogers be erring on the side of caution and coding the 046 date as 
uncertain, e.g. [2012-07-31, 2012-08-01], unless a Gregorian date is also given 
to confirm the date? I don’t recall seeing any guidance on this subject. Can 
you please advise?”

This was the response from LC:

“What an interesting question about EDTF, especially since it was a topic here 
at LC a couple of weeks ago (not about Hebrew dates, but about what catalogers 
are supposed to do in the 046 field in general). I would err on the side of 
caution and give both dates in the 046 field when the Gregorian date is not 
known. Come to think of it, maybe I will add something about this to the DCM Z1 
046 update that 

Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - Re: 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Dear friends,

I’d like to thank you for participating in this discussion. We’ve heard back 
from LC, who after consulting with our colleagues in the IJ section, has 
reconsidered. This is the guidance the IJ section shared:

For a specific day, follow the Gregorian calendar equivalent provided on 
standard date converters such as Heb-Cal. Do not worry about the few hours 
between nightfall and midnight. If the exact hour of the person’s date of birth 
or death is provided and that happens to be before midnight, then the cataloger 
would go with the day before. But we cannot routinely add the “or” construction 
to the day the way we do for the year.

So, while from a NACO and EDTF standpoint it is possible to record the 
uncertainty presented by Hebrew dates (and this is NLI practice), from an 
LC/PCC standpoint, it is not required to so. In other words, feel free to 
continue with your current practice.

Happy cataloging, Jasmin

From: Ahava Cohen 
Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2021 1:38 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; 'Hebrew Name Authority Funnel' 
; Marlene Schiffman ; 
rtalb...@library.berkeley.edu
Subject: RE: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - Re: 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

Yossi cited our old work practice of 5000 and adding 1240, so I thought I'd 
chime in with NLI's current policy within our authority database – like the 
recommendation which started this thread, if all we have is a Hebrew date we do 
code the two possible dates in 046. It takes an extra few seconds and we prefer 
to preserve the information at hand, having had people of the same name with 
birthdates within the same month.

- Ahava
[cid:image001.jpg@01D73B77.630C5AA0]<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.nli.org.il/__;!!KGKeukY!kv0pHRgDsDRvfr7Bn3HJPYPH-6A-obqy-BA41Y0A_x_rPJAkT1Wr_ttUtbWUj7DB8zmC$
 >

Dr. Ahava Cohen|Head
Hebrew Catalogue Department
Mobile: +972-54-549-3644
Tel.:  +972-74-733-6231
The National Library of Israel, Jerusalem
ahava.co...@nli.org.il<mailto:ahava.co...@nli.org.il>  |  
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.nli.org.il__;!!KGKeukY!kv0pHRgDsDRvfr7Bn3HJPYPH-6A-obqy-BA41Y0A_x_rPJAkT1Wr_ttUtbWUj-9wvaLL$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://web.nli.org.il/sites/NLI/English/Pages/default.aspx__;!!KGKeukY!kv0pHRgDsDRvfr7Bn3HJPYPH-6A-obqy-BA41Y0A_x_rPJAkT1Wr_ttUtbWUj4KQEASW$
 >
[cid:image002.png@01D73B77.630C5AA0]<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.facebook.com/NationalLibraryIsrael__;!!KGKeukY!kv0pHRgDsDRvfr7Bn3HJPYPH-6A-obqy-BA41Y0A_x_rPJAkT1Wr_ttUtbWUj4gjC9BU$
 >  [cid:image003.png@01D73B77.630C5AA0] 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.youtube.com/user/NLI2010/featured__;!!KGKeukY!kv0pHRgDsDRvfr7Bn3HJPYPH-6A-obqy-BA41Y0A_x_rPJAkT1Wr_ttUtbWUj2N0DHue$
 >   [cid:image004.png@01D73B77.630C5AA0] 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://instagram.com/nli_israel__;!!KGKeukY!kv0pHRgDsDRvfr7Bn3HJPYPH-6A-obqy-BA41Y0A_x_rPJAkT1Wr_ttUtbWUj0mcGkA5$
 >   [cid:image005.png@01D73B77.630C5AA0] 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.flickr.com/photos/64126959@N03/collections/__;!!KGKeukY!kv0pHRgDsDRvfr7Bn3HJPYPH-6A-obqy-BA41Y0A_x_rPJAkT1Wr_ttUtbWUj7UbGU6q$
 >




From: Heb-naco [mailto:heb-naco-bounces+ahava.cohen=nli.org...@lists.osu.edu] 
On Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2021 2:06 AM
To: Marlene Schiffman; 
rtalb...@library.berkeley.edu<mailto:rtalb...@library.berkeley.edu>
Cc: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - Re: 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

I doubt Paul Frank reads Heb-NACO. I am working on a draft with your responses 
and counter-arguments.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Marlene Schiffman mailto:schif...@yu.edu>>
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2021 7:05 PM
To: rtalb...@library.berkeley.edu<mailto:rtalb...@library.berkeley.edu>; 
Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>>
Cc: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>; Galron, Joseph 
mailto:galro...@osu.edu>>
Subject: RE: [EXT] - Re: [Heb-NACO] 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

Maybe we should send this correspondence to Paul Frank? Does he read Heb-NACO?

Sent from 
Mail<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986__;!!KGKeukY!hx0QYJPGVeB1Jg3zYS6GBwNaCTscsu0IKhBpyWQYCPOEysnigfp0knYfauNJsvY6eIW0$>
 for Windows 10

From: Robert M. TALBOTT<mailto:rtalb...@library.berkeley.edu>
Sent: Friday, April 23, 2021 8:39 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin<mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>
Cc: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel<mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>; Galron, 
Joseph<mailto:galro...@osu.edu>; Marlene Schiffman<mailto:schif...@yu.edu>
Subject: [EXT] - Re: [Heb-NACO] 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

**External Email**
I was under the impression that rules didn't go into effect until published.

On Fri, Apr 23, 2021 at 11:58 AM Shinohara, Jasmin 
mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>> wrote:
Dear colleagues, I regret that the guidance coming from LC/PCC is not more 

Re: [Heb-NACO] 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Dear colleagues, I regret that the guidance coming from LC/PCC is not more 
popular among you. Nevertheless, our NACO work is bound by LC/PCC policy. As 
such, henceforth, please code Hebrew dates that are not substantiated by 
Gregorian dates as uncertain in NACO records.

Thanks and kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Robert M. TALBOTT 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Friday, April 23, 2021 9:34 AM
To: Galron, Joseph ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

I agree with Yosi. There's no real benefit in ramping up the complexity of the 
046 to cover the possibility that someone was born before sunset.

Bob

On Thu, Apr 22, 2021 at 8:50 PM Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
I encountered this issue for my Lexicon as well for entering dates in Wikidata 
(and encyclopedic entries in the Hebrew Wikipedia).
My opinion is that we should put the later date and only in cases we know the 
two dates then to prefer the Hebrew date. Our life is complicated enough. We 
have a tool to convert Hebrew calendar to the Gregorian calendar and 
vis-a-versa 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.hebcal.com/converter__;!!KGKeukY!n7nXpX2CHuBV54LBNUh6HadT3b8QaCIgtKaEaIJjCd7Qk-C3AtpfWwo-s0CNlkE1PJvJ$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/www.hebcal.com/converter__;!!KGKeukY!g6jo72cqPGAkRZsVt0EeQnhrZu9zS3cFAFARzc0i99f1WheV_NlPXA9gGVhfQlTvnqs5$>
Is it really critical to know if someone was born in the evening before sunset 
or after sunset? (the only case for us will be if someone was born/died on 
December 31, 1969 or January 1, 1970 – this changes the heading in the 100 
field).
I have so many stories I encountered while doing my biographical research for 
“my authors” where the Hebrew date is totally different then the Gregorian date 
on tombstones, in encyclopedias (Tidhar for example), Lexicons (Kressel and 
others). I saw letters by people who wrote that their Zeide told them they were 
born on Erev Shabbes of Hanukka, of תר"ע  1910 (Erev Shabbes of Hanukka was 
December 1909 and not 1910)
Remember – we have a backlog of Sforim we need to catalog – not too much time 
to spend on the issue if someone was born or died before or after sunset.

At this opportunity I invite you to view my working document in which I record 
the biographical information
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1IPXgRBQE689SB8GpXKHjmSIlNP50n7hAJQEHaoVt8U4/edit?usp=sharing__;!!KGKeukY!n7nXpX2CHuBV54LBNUh6HadT3b8QaCIgtKaEaIJjCd7Qk-C3AtpfWwo-s0CNluOaP0PZ$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1IPXgRBQE689SB8GpXKHjmSIlNP50n7hAJQEHaoVt8U4/edit?usp=sharing__;!!KGKeukY!g6jo72cqPGAkRZsVt0EeQnhrZu9zS3cFAFARzc0i99f1WheV_NlPXA9gGVhfQiCVzkPV$>

My two Groschen to the issue

Yossi


יוסי גלרון-גולדשלגר
טלפון נייד 1.614.805.9954
Йозеф Галрон Гольдшлегер
Joseph (Yossi) Galron-Goldschläger<https://library.osu.edu/people/galron.1>
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies 
Library<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/clicktime.symantec.com/35nyXVx1aw9CrjvPVzwN5of6H2?u=http*3A*2F*2Fguides.osu.edu*2Fc.php*3Fg*3D337806*26p*3D2274681__;JSUlJSUlJSU!!KGKeukY!kUTYt7T7txseqvv_MbDA40Qc8GOigrxqsE-7Zi5NkfP2ikN57ei5Adhh0Mse6Etz$>
and German Language and Literature Librarian
305 G Thompson Memorial Library
The Ohio State University Libraries
1858 Neil Ave. Mall
Columbus, Ohio 43210 USA
Tel.: (614) 292-3362, Fax: (614)292-1918
Mobile: (614) 805-9954
E-Mail: galro...@osu.edu<mailto:galro...@osu.edu> or 
jgal...@gmail.com<mailto:jgal...@gmail.com>

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/clicktime.symantec.com/3QFzqKM4bhoMEbRUtvt5Cwi6H2?u=http*3A*2F*2Fgo.osu.edu*2Fhebrewlit__;JSUlJQ!!KGKeukY!kUTYt7T7txseqvv_MbDA40Qc8GOigrxqsE-7Zi5NkfP2ikN57ei5Adhh0GlG_VHC$>

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/clicktime.symantec.com/3T7oGBhra4qxPxXMeh5okCG6H2?u=http*3A*2F*2Fgo.osu.edu*2Fjpress__;JSUlJQ!!KGKeukY!kUTYt7T7txseqvv_MbDA40Qc8GOigrxqsE-7Zi5NkfP2ikN57ei5Adhh0OJa_eeX$>




From: Heb-naco On Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2021 5:32 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

Hi, folks, I hope this email finds you all well.

I recently had the opportunity to get some guidance on how to code dates in the 
authority 046 when the date/s available is/are only using the Hebrew calendar. 
This was my question:

“Hebrew dates span two calendar days and, as such, two Gregorian dates. Till 
now, the majority of catalogers have made an assumption that the Hebrew date is 
the latter of the two Gregorian dates and only coded that date in the 046 
(indicating certainty). The question is, is such practice ok/correct? Or should 
catalogers be erring on the

[Heb-NACO] 046 Hebrew date coding in NARs

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, folks, I hope this email finds you all well.

I recently had the opportunity to get some guidance on how to code dates in the 
authority 046 when the date/s available is/are only using the Hebrew calendar. 
This was my question:

"Hebrew dates span two calendar days and, as such, two Gregorian dates. Till 
now, the majority of catalogers have made an assumption that the Hebrew date is 
the latter of the two Gregorian dates and only coded that date in the 046 
(indicating certainty). The question is, is such practice ok/correct? Or should 
catalogers be erring on the side of caution and coding the 046 date as 
uncertain, e.g. [2012-07-31, 2012-08-01], unless a Gregorian date is also given 
to confirm the date? I don't recall seeing any guidance on this subject. Can 
you please advise?"

This was the response from LC:

"What an interesting question about EDTF, especially since it was a topic here 
at LC a couple of weeks ago (not about Hebrew dates, but about what catalogers 
are supposed to do in the 046 field in general). I would err on the side of 
caution and give both dates in the 046 field when the Gregorian date is not 
known. Come to think of it, maybe I will add something about this to the DCM Z1 
046 update that I am working on as a result of that meeting we had here a 
couple of weeks ago. That will document it." (highlight added)

Please let me know if you have any questions.

Best wishes, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
551.1 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] Joel Hahn’s macros updates for Connexion client 3.0

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Not I. I was also wondering about this, Sharon, thanks for taking the lead!

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Benamou, Sharon via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2021 3:43 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Fwd: Joel Hahn’s macros updates for Connexion client 3.0

I was wondering if anyone has looked at the new Hebrew macro. I will play with 
it and see if the disappearing alefs and unexpected nekudot have been fixed.  
Has anyone helped him to work on the macro?

Sharon

From: OCLC-Cataloging mailto:oclc-...@oclclists.org>> 
on behalf of Dalgord,Chelsea mailto:dalgo...@oclc.org>>
Sent: Monday, October 25, 2021 5:08:29 AM
To: oclc-...@oclclists.org 
mailto:oclc-...@oclclists.org>>
Subject: [OCLC-CAT] Joel Hahn’s macros updates for Connexion client 3.0


Joel Hahn has shared that he has made updates to his macros for Connexion 
client 3.0 users which are now available on his web 
page.
 Joel stated that most macros are unchanged except for one commend that changed 
between 2.63 and 3.0.  He has also rewritten the Greek and Hebrew 
transliteration macros and created two new transliteration macros for Cherokee 
and Inuktitut.



Please use the updated versions of Joel’s macros if you are using Connexion 
client 3.0.



Download Connexion client 3.0 now 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://oc.lc/cat-downloads__;!!KGKeukY!iHqcaQo-mz6zimIs4oldPC6T5W-IcbzXxp-2oHh5XFJeNNke7twuVSBGfBvF-BNuQZP-$
 




More information about the improvements made to the client, system 
requirements, bug fixes and known issues can be found on the Update Connexion 
client
 web page.  An overview recording is available at this 
link.



If you have any questions or issues while using Connexion client 3.0, please 
contact OCLC 
Support.







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[Heb-NACO] friendly reminder: זהרה

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello all and happy 2022.

A quick and friendly reminder regarding the above name: it is vocalized 
זָהֳרָהּ, with a hataf-kamats under the ה. The hataf-kamats makes the 
romanization (and [correct] pronunciation) of the name Zohorah. For the 14 
libraries with holdings on the 2020 publication with this title, on1200832462 
and also the merged dup on1181995750 (lccn 2020431001), you may wish to update 
your local catalogs. As always, this (and other words with challenging 
romanizations) can be found on our romanization 
FAQ.

Please let me know if there are any questions or if there are new words to be 
added to our FAQ.

Thanks and kol tuv, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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[Heb-NACO] BFM FYI: Orna Levin

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello, friends, and happy Monday.

There are 3 authors with the above name that had previously been conflated 
under one NAR, that of the Portuguese author, Levin, Orna, (b. 1960, lccn n  
89149837). With thanks to Ahava Cohen at NLI, new NARs have been created for 
Levin, Orna, 1982- (lccn no2022019914), author of the recent title Sheveretsef 
(on 1142822081, with 23 holdings) and Levin, Orna, 1957- (lccn no2022019908), 
who wrote on acupuncture/Chinese medicine in the 1980s and 90s.

The original NAR for Levin, Orna (b. 1960) was revised to remove Hebrew 
variants. Those libraries not using WMS may wish to check their local records 
and update accordingly.

Please let me know if there are any questions. Thanks, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - Roger's Demographic Group Term tentative monthly list 03x (March 11, 2022)

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

If you have literary warrant for establishing such a heading, then please feel 
free to submit a SACO proposal. I’ll gladly review it for you.

Kol tuv and gut Shabbos, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  on behalf of Marlene Schiffman 
via Heb-naco 
Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2022 5:03:54 PM
To: Kohn, Roger ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - Roger's Demographic Group Term tentative 
monthly list 03x (March 11, 2022)


We have SH Berit milah but no heading for Mohalim.

We have other headings for actions and also headings for practitioners.

150 Cantors (Judaism)



Rabbis

550 Judaism ǂx Functionaries



No Mohalim. Sometimes the book is not about Berit millah or its role in Jewish

law, but biography of Mohalim. I wonder why there is no heading for these 
people. We had to use Berit milah instead.



Marlene Schiffman

Metadata and Services Department

Gottesman Library

Yeshiva University

500 West 185th Street

New York, N.Y. 10033



Gottesman Library

Room 301

646 592 4276



From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of 
Kohn, Roger via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 17, 2022 4:57 PM
To: Gerstein, Nahid ; Kuperman, Aaron ; Taub, 
Jeremiah Aaron ; Creeger, Edith ; Shirazi, Gail 
; Teverovsky, Galina ; 
'heb-n...@lists.service.ohio-state.edu' 
; 'jbiella2...@gmail.com' 
; Gottschalk, Haim 
Subject: [EXT] - [Heb-NACO] Roger's Demographic Group Term tentative monthly 
list 03x (March 11, 2022)



**External Email**



---





https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://classweb.org/tentative-subjects/2203x.html__;!!KGKeukY!hjxDqwZndI3dlEZKjmsZ2W0TogOKnGK7DSwJo5nLJgItdR54HgSVMjkX4Meo165_hLrr$
 






LIBRARY OF CONGRESS DEMOGRAPHIC GROUP TERMS
TENTATIVE MONTHLY LIST 03x (March 11, 2022)



The proposed headings on this list are NOT YET APPROVED and not yet available 
for use in current cataloging.



Send all comments on this list to the LCDGT Project - Email: 
lc...@loc.gov



"(A)" indicates pre-approved proposals for material in Priority 1. "(C)" 
indicates proposals submitted by libraries in the Subject Authority Cooperative 
Program (SACO).











150

Cantors[dp2017060274]

(C)

072

occ



450

UF Chazanim



450

UF Chazzanim



450

UF Ḥazanim



450

UF Ḥazonim



450

UF Ḥazzanim



550

BT Singers









  *   - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
  *   Roger Kohn
  *   Cataloger, Israel & Judaica Section
  *   Library of Congress
  *   LS/ABA/ASME/IJ (4222)
  *   LM 537
  *   101 Independence Avenue, SE
  *   Washington, D.C. 20540-4222
  *   (202) 707-3997

“Opinions expressed are those of the author, and are not official statements by 
the Library of Congress.”

  *   - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


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[Heb-NACO] title BFM FYI: לפני

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, all, and חודש טוב,

For the 8 libraries with holdings on on1181992540/lccn2020426216, the above 
word in the title proper is correctly romanized li-fene, not the current lifne. 
One can find the romanization for this and other challenging words on our 
romanization 
FAQ.

Thanks and kol tuv, Jasmin
---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] RAS Cataloging Committee winter meeting: Link and Agenda

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thanks for the meeting link, Neil.

Please see 
here<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/147554199/Minutes*202021*20Summer__;JSU!!KGKeukY!mbZnSXDtt-NPIKIz2Ggm9kALU_pjHBhNQJVyGh_cRUXDfimtBq6EJyaicI4cRc2cMH2b$
 > for the Summer 2021 minutes; their approval will come to a vote at the 
beginning of the meeting.

Happy Adar, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Frau-Cortes, Neil 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, February 1, 2022 2:22 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco ; 
hasaf...@lists.osu.edu
Subject: [Heb-NACO] RAS Cataloging Committee winter meeting: Link and Agenda


Dear all,
On Feb 10, 11:30am-1pm EST (8:30 PST, 5:30pm CET, 6:30pm IST) you are all 
invited to attend the RAS Cataloging Committee winter meeting, which will 
happen online. We will do our best to record it as well.
Here's the link to the online meeting: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89032999713__;!!KGKeukY!mbZnSXDtt-NPIKIz2Ggm9kALU_pjHBhNQJVyGh_cRUXDfimtBq6EJyaicI4cRTlzDlNl$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/us02web.zoom.us/j/89032999713__;!!KGKeukY!m9Te9tVnmjG2k38oC9UCgkM-T3VlsUzIYgeFUxMS2UhoS47Ub54PSwAwB5DfIQDDn_Sq$>

This is the agenda for the event. If you have any last minute items to add or 
change, kindly let me know (neilf...@gmail.com<mailto:neilf...@gmail.com>).

1.  New RDA Toolkit's Community Resources section and the Judaica/Hebraica 
community (Ahava), continue discussion
2.  Inclusion of patronymic in NARs regardless of the placement of the 
patronymic element (Jasmin, Neil)
3.  What constitutes "Sacred Works?" Should we have a list of such works 
(Robert). Ahava has a list from NLI, which she will post for contributions and 
comments
4.  Update on BM201-449 class schedule expansion (Haim, Marlene, Gabe)
5.  Cancellation of Marranos as a subject heading (Nahid, Haim).
6.  Any feedback on the Cataloging Forum (Neil and all).
7.  Romanization: updates on Dicta automation and other projects (Ahava and 
others)
8.  Helping libraries that have a Hebraica/Judaica collection but no 
cataloger (Haim)

Hope to see many of you there. Take good care!



Neil M. Frau-Cortes
PhD, MLIS
(pronouns<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/www.glsen.org/activity/pronouns-guide-glsen__;!!KGKeukY!m9Te9tVnmjG2k38oC9UCgkM-T3VlsUzIYgeFUxMS2UhoS47Ub54PSwAwB5DfISsUFXY3$>:
 he/him/his)

Cataloger - Libraries Division - Collection Management
100 S. Andrews Avenue, MN7
Fort Lauderdale, FL 33301
954-357-5593
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.broward.org/library__;!!KGKeukY!mbZnSXDtt-NPIKIz2Ggm9kALU_pjHBhNQJVyGh_cRUXDfimtBq6EJyaicI4cRfyyz7v5$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.broward.org/library__;!!KGKeukY!m9Te9tVnmjG2k38oC9UCgkM-T3VlsUzIYgeFUxMS2UhoS47Ub54PSwAwB5DfIYLQ64bj$>


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[cid:image002.jpg@01D8184E.20862E90]




Under Florida law, most e-mail messages to or from Broward County employees or 
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Re: [Heb-NACO] romanization question

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, Rachel, I’m sure you’ve seen all sorts of ways...

The correct romanization is ke-ilu. אילו appears in the dictionary as an entry 
unto itself, making it the “more analytical” option referred to in HCM-RDA on 
p. 19 at the bottom, section “Little words,”

“In the few cases where Even-Shoshan may show the same word under more than one 
entry element, the more ‘analytical’ option is chosen. For example, the Hebrew 
form of “In the beginning” or “Genesis” is entered in his lexicon under both 
bet and resh. Choosing the analytical option results in hyphenation: Be-reshit 
[not: Bereshit]”

Since the alef is at the beginning of the word אילו, there is no diacritic 
added before the i. => ke-ilu.

I will add this word to our FAQ. Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Rachel Simon via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 3, 2022 10:33 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] romanization question

How is  כאילו   romanized? I saw several ways.

Thanks,

Rachel
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[Heb-NACO] BFM: גפרית

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, friends,

Per E-Sh, the above word is pronounced gofrit (i.e., the kamats under the gimel 
is a kamats katan). For the 8 libraries with holdings on on1193589324/lccn 
2020460321, בארות הגפרית הישנות, you may wish to correct your local catalogs.

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] romanization question

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

I second the motion! 

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Joan Biella via 
Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, February 3, 2022 10:04 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel ; Nancy 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] romanization question

Maybe we should declare a holiday to celebrate romanization!

Joan



On Thu, Feb 3, 2022 at 12:45 PM Nancy via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi, Rachel!
Are you still romanizing? How are you?

Nancy
On 2/3/2022 5:33 AM, Rachel Simon via Heb-naco wrote:
How is  כאילו   romanized? I saw several ways.

Thanks,

Rachel


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[Heb-NACO] קלוקלים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, all,

The above is found in a couple titles by Toviyah Rubner (and is cited from him 
in the E.-Sh. entry for word). It has historically been romanized as 
ḳeloḳelim. My question is, why is the sheva under the second kof romanized as 
though it were a vocalized sheva? As a sheva merahef, wouldn’t it be ignored 
and the word romanized ḳeloḳlim?

Looking forward to your input.

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] קלוקלים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thank you, Jerry Anne, for the great explanation. Yes, it probably applies to 
the pronunciation but not to the romanization – for better and worse…

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Dickel, Geraldine 
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 9:45 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] קלוקלים

Hi Jasmin,

In biblical Hebrew grammar, the sheva under the second kof would be a vocal 
sheva.  Because a vav holem is a long vowel, the syllable kof vav holem is an 
open syllable so the second kof is the beginning of the next syllable and 
therefore the sheva is a vocal sheva.  I don’t know if this historical grammar 
applies to modern Hebrew pronunciation of the word.

best wishes,
Jerry Anne
Sent from my iPad


On Feb 7, 2022, at 11:30 PM, Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:

Hi, all,

The above is found in a couple titles by Toviyah Rubner (and is cited from him 
in the E.-Sh. entry for word). It has historically been romanized as 
ḳeloḳelim. My question is, why is the sheva under the second kof romanized as 
though it were a vocalized sheva? As a sheva merahef, wouldn’t it be ignored 
and the word romanized ḳeloḳlim?

Looking forward to your input.

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] BFM: גפרית

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thanks, Lenore, for bringing this NAR to our attention. I’ll update it to RDA 
and revise accordingly.

Thanks again, Jasmin

From: Bell, Lenore 
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 10:00 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Cc: n...@loc.gov
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] BFM: גפרית

Thank you, Jasmin, for pointing out this romanization issue.

I am wondering if there should be reconsideration of the NAR for Gafrit, 
Ḥanah, 1935- 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://lccn.loc.gov/n98032977__;!!KGKeukY!hb0ywxG2-2_KPFqbE1ejvjMI25LOcbJDhVTaoN5Txr-kyH2eKY54_lqD2RCbMU20FFJS$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/lccn.loc.gov/n98032977__;!!IBzWLUs!Bu11F1mvrPv6khjHEGLIzd48fsfWQhTyWc61wgUCB9qHI8REds8vYz-VJIzfwnr_U_P6$>?

Many thanks!
Lenore

Lenore Bell Senior Advisor for Strategic Initiatives
202.560.7505
National Institute for Holocaust Documentation
United States Holocaust Memorial Museum
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.ushmm.org__;!!KGKeukY!hb0ywxG2-2_KPFqbE1ejvjMI25LOcbJDhVTaoN5Txr-kyH2eKY54_lqD2RCbMY_xkbRc$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.ushmm.org/__;!!IBzWLUs!Bu11F1mvrPv6khjHEGLIzd48fsfWQhTyWc61wgUCB9qHI8REds8vYz-VJIzfwg13xjtJ$>


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 the Campaign for the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 5:19 PM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi, friends,

Per E-Sh, the above word is pronounced gofrit (i.e., the kamats under the gimel 
is a kamats katan). For the 8 libraries with holdings on on1193589324/lccn 
2020460321, בארות הגפרית הישנות, you may wish to correct your local catalogs.

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] קלוקלים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thank you, Barry, this is very helpful. Applying this rule, then, to the word 
הולך: there’s a tsere under the lamed and the plural הולכים is romanized 
holkhim, not holekhim.

Thanks again, Jasmin

From: Barry Dov Walfish 
Sent: Monday, February 7, 2022 11:48 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] קלוקלים

Hi, Jasmin,

The rule seems to be that if in the singular base word the letter in question 
has a vowel underneath it, then, in the plural
the sheva is a sheva na. So, since the sing. is kelokel, with tsere under the 
kof, then the plural should be kelokelim.
See:
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://hebrew-academy.org.il/2013/09/01/**I-**G-**K/__;16LXmden16jXmdeq15XXqNeq15TXoNeZ16fXldeT!!KGKeukY!lPrZVNfKHA69H36KtCyoMIGA3hzF8JiFJms7fweU150vKbQV0JyqnPMg_n_uWyA2QaTa$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/hebrew-academy.org.il/2013/09/01/**I-**G-**K/__;16LXmden16jXmdeq15XXqNeq15TXoNeZ16fXldeT!!IBzWLUs!DuceNoIzL3Vuc4RBevknBzs40Mw70Uo0w-imPMwfcpgOjpBcnxjMWqJWYb3kqjrviDDu$>
Hope this helps,
Best,
Barry


On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 11:29 PM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi, all,

The above is found in a couple titles by Toviyah Rubner (and is cited from him 
in the E.-Sh. entry for word). It has historically been romanized as 
ḳeloḳelim. My question is, why is the sheva under the second kof romanized as 
though it were a vocalized sheva? As a sheva merahef, wouldn’t it be ignored 
and the word romanized ḳeloḳlim?

Looking forward to your input.

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] BFM: גפרית

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thanks, Yossi. The NAR was revised this morning:

010  n  98032977  ǂz no 99057604
040  DLC ǂb eng ǂe rda ǂc DLC ǂd DLC ǂd OCoLC ǂd DLC ǂd PU-HC
046  ǂf 1935 ǂ2 edtf
1001 Gofrit, Hannah, ǂd 1935-
370  Biała Rawska (Poland) ǂe Tel Aviv (Israel) ǂ2 naf
372  Public health nursing ǂ2 lcsh
374  Nurses ǂa Public health nurses ǂ2 lcsh
375  Females ǂ2 lcdgt
377  heb
4001 ǂw nne ǂa Gafrit, Ḥanah, ǂd 1935-
4001 Gofrit, Ḥanah, ǂd 1935-
4001 Gafrit, Hannah, ǂd 1935-
4001 גפרית, חנה
4001 גופרית, חנה
667  Machine-derived non-Latin script reference project.
667  Non-Latin script references not evaluated.
670  Ratsiti la-ʻuf kemo parpar, 1994 or 1995: ǂb t.p. (Ḥanah Gofrit) p. 1 (b. 
Byalah Raṿsḳah, Poland, 1935; daughter of Hershl and Zisl Hershḳovits; lives 
in Tel-Aviv)
670  I wanted to fly like a butterfly, 1998: ǂb p. 36 (Hannah Gofrit) p. 2 (b. 
1935 in Biala Ravska, Pol.; nee Hanechka Hershkowitz)
670  Nat. Lib. of Israel NAF, via WWW, 8 Feb. 2022 ǂb (access pt.: גופרית, חנה, 
1935- = Gofrit, Ḥanah, 1935-; variants: גפרית, חנה, 1935- = Gofrit, Ḥanah, 
1935- ; Gofrit, Hannah, 1935- [in rom.], Hershkowitz, Hannah, 1935- [in rom.], 
Hershkowitz, Hanechka, 1935- [in rom.]; rom. access pt. changed to Gafrit, 
Ḥanah, 1935-, to conform to [former] LC form)
670  Yad Vashem website, 8 Feb. 2022 ǂb (Hannah Gofrit; Jan. 1949 emigrated to 
Israel and settled in Tel Aviv; After attending nursing school, she worked as a 
public health nurse, working as the chief nurse in Tel Aviv's Public Health 
Division until her retirement) ǂu 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.yadvashem.org/remembrance/archive/torchlighters/gofrit.html__;!!KGKeukY!hx4bqWWAhv5VTQ2YEW2qD7r457mB68Uvwv7JoYYdConjckq9qTpFKBnH9Vuzi-tsu5v8$
 
670  Ynet news website, 8 Feb. 2022: ǂb 'Iran threatens, world remains silent,' 
article dated 04.11.10 (Hannah Gafrit; worked as a nurse in public health in 
the Ajami neighborhood of Tel Aviv, where she managed the Tipat Halav center 
for young mothers; as a sign of her dedicated work, she was awarded the Namir 
prize) ǂu 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3874386,00.html__;!!KGKeukY!hx4bqWWAhv5VTQ2YEW2qD7r457mB68Uvwv7JoYYdConjckq9qTpFKBnH9VuziyVdlhaH$
 

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via 
Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 2:29 PM
To: Bell, Lenore ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] BFM: גפרית

The correct romanized form for חנה גפרית should be Gofrit
See VIAF 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://viaf.org/viaf/6706417__;!!KGKeukY!hx4bqWWAhv5VTQ2YEW2qD7r457mB68Uvwv7JoYYdConjckq9qTpFKBnH9Vuzi1nDa1i3$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/viaf.org/viaf/6706417__;!!IBzWLUs!DBXVOwb4Duft2wMPVV71mTdPzmSiypti_MTx8TUCVbOZdoUoXEja2l5fk2LKZC4Mnt1Y$>
The policy of the National Library in Jerusalem is to follow the romanized form 
of Library of Congress (also if it is wrong). The Hebrew form of her name in 
Hebrew script is:  גופרית
See:  
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://viaf.org/processed/J9U*7C987007261701605171__;JQ!!KGKeukY!hx4bqWWAhv5VTQ2YEW2qD7r457mB68Uvwv7JoYYdConjckq9qTpFKBnH9Vuzi2Z7Iydw$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/viaf.org/processed/J9U*7C987007261701605171__;JQ!!IBzWLUs!DBXVOwb4Duft2wMPVV71mTdPzmSiypti_MTx8TUCVbOZdoUoXEja2l5fk2LKZCwdp47f$>



From: Heb-naco On Behalf Of Bell, Lenore via Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, February 08, 2022 10:00 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>>; 
Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] BFM: גפרית

Thank you, Jasmin, for pointing out this romanization issue.

I am wondering if there should be reconsideration of the NAR for Gafrit, 
Ḥanah, 1935- 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://lccn.loc.gov/n98032977__;!!KGKeukY!hx4bqWWAhv5VTQ2YEW2qD7r457mB68Uvwv7JoYYdConjckq9qTpFKBnH9VuzizO1PuqO$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/lccn.loc.gov/n98032977__;!!KGKeukY!iLj5sFoDeLCZKv8gEUxdXwp4hnoySEDPSZEXbJoAu3H_k70oGPYQhbz1ZTMheWAGnLsh$>?

Many thanks!
Lenore

Lenore Bell Senior Advisor for Strategic Initiatives
202.560.7505
National Institute for Holocaust Documentation
United States Holocaust Memorial Museum
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.ushmm.org__;!!KGKeukY!hx4bqWWAhv5VTQ2YEW2qD7r457mB68Uvwv7JoYYdConjckq9qTpFKBnH9Vuzi6WL6GvZ$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.ushmm.org/__;!!KGKeukY!iLj5sFoDeLCZKv8gEUxdXwp4hnoySEDPSZEXbJoAu3H_k70oGPYQhbz1ZTMhecOq5Wt4$>


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Support<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.ushmm.org/campaign/__;!!KGKeukY!iLj5sFoDeLCZKv8gEUxdXwp4hnoySEDPSZEXbJoAu3H_k70oGPYQhbz1ZTMheVt7bYWQ$>
 the Campaign for the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum



On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 5:19 PM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi, friends,

Per E-Sh, the above word is pronounced gofrit (i.e., the kamats under the gimel 
is a kamats katan). For the 8 libraries with holdings on on1193589324/lcc

Re: [Heb-NACO] קלוקלים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

The email chain below has combined different issues.

דרמתי, as Yossi wrote, is of Greek/Latin origin and is romanized following 
HCM-RDA instructions on foreign loan words, p.17: “In the case of foreign loan 
words of Latin or Greek origin, Alcalay should not be followed, and an initial 
consonantal cluster is treated as a sheṿa naḥ.”

קלוקלים is a Hebrew word and is romanized following HCM-RDA instructions on 
sheṿa, pp. 15-17, copied here:

The transcription of the sheṿa is problematic. The ALA-LC Romanization system 
attempts to approximate standard Israeli pronunciation throughout the 
romanization process while at the same time reflecting the general principles 
of traditional Hebrew grammar. Obviously, this is a difficult gap to bridge. 
Other considerations to keep in mind are the basic continuity of romanization 
practice in spite of profound cataloging changes over the years on the one 
hand, and the accessibility of one’s data on the other. Although there are only 
a few systems where capitalization practice or the presence or absence of a 
diacritic or special character will affect retrieval per se, the romanization 
or non-romanization of a vowel is quite another matter.

Alcalay is useful for the identification of sheṿa naḥ (quiescent) and sheṿa na‘ 
(mobile) in that he usually does not transcribe the sheṿa naḥ in his 
vocalization scheme.

With regard to the romanization or non-romanization of the sheṿa na‘, there are 
several principles to be kept in mind.

All sheṿas in Hebrew initial syllables are sheṿa na‘ and are transcribed as "e" 
regardless of pronunciation.
teḳufah [not: tḳufah (era)]   תקופה
teshuvah [not: tshuvah (response)]   תשובה

There are however, at least two categories of sheṿa na‘ in which the 
romanization system attempts to follow generally accepted pronunciation a 
little more closely. Both categories consist of cases of sheṿa na‘ which result 
from what some linguists call “vowel reduction.”

The first and most easily definable of these categories is the sheṿa occurring 
between the second and third consonants of the plural forms of benoni 
(participles, nouns, etc. having the same vowel pattern) and other verb forms 
of the pa‘al/ḳal, pi‘el, and hitpa‘el binyanim (stems), including all sheṿas 
following consonants with dagesh ḥazaḳ. Exceptions apply if the lamed ha-po’al 
(third consonant of the root) is the same as the second (‘ayin ha-po‘al), or if 
the second consonant is a yod (‘ayin-yod pattern).

lomdim [not: lomedim] לומדים
lomdot [not: lomedot]   לומדות
from: lomed לומד

rof’im [not: rofe’im]   רופאים
rof’ot [not: rofe’ot]רופאות
from: rofe רופאים

munḥe [not: muneḥe]מונחי
from: munaḥimמונחים

tedabru [not: tedaberu]תדברו
tedabri [not: tedaberi]   תדברי
from: tedaber   תדבר

mitsṭarfim [not: mitsṭarefim]   מצטרפים
mitsṭarfot [not: mitsṭarefot]מצטרפות
from: mitsṭarefמצטרף
…

(highlights added for emphasis/easy browsing)

קלוקל falls into the above category. Hence, ḳeloḳlim, not: ḳeloḳelim or 
ḳloḳlim (from: ḳeloḳel).

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, February 8, 2022 1:41 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] קלוקלים


I agree with Barry – it should be Kelokelim and not Keloklim or Kloklim. It is 
a Hebrew word.

It is not the same as Dramati (that is a non-Hebrew word)

From: Heb-naco On Behalf Of Barry Dov Walfish via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, February 07, 2022 11:48 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>>; 
Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] קלוקלים

Hi, Jasmin,

The rule seems to be that if in the singular base word the letter in question 
has a vowel underneath it, then, in the plural
the sheva is a sheva na. So, since the sing. is kelokel, with tsere under the 
kof, then the plural should be kelokelim.
See:
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://hebrew-academy.org.il/2013/09/01/**I-**G-**K/__;16LXmden16jXmdeq15XXqNeq15TXoNeZ16fXldeT!!KGKeukY!mSG9j8-SHaSbEpeQ3boetyNNb68Hp4s-yJHFmHAQGkLEulmknIKh_NCkMTbSmnf2iH4i$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/hebrew-academy.org.il/2013/09/01/**I-**G-**K/__;16LXmden16jXmdeq15XXqNeq15TXoNeZ16fXldeT!!KGKeukY!kfyp455q_TPBY6DDi9TdY5pTxdZfi2EiioJlp5K5FC7qtCWMurG2Lb2MsMFy_NzmQJio$>
Hope this helps,
Best,
Barry


On Mon, Feb 7, 2022 at 11:29 PM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi, all,

The above is found in a couple titles by Toviyah Rubner (and is cited from him 
in the E.-Sh. entry for word). It has historically been romanized as 
ḳeloḳelim. My question is, why

[Heb-NACO] AJL Cat. Cmte. link now live

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Sorry for the delay - technical difficulties. The meeting link, 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://us02web.zoom.us/j/89032999713__;!!KGKeukY!kvOcvrFSVk2OLWfC1o224EAsY-PWdXTaiNBc2hx7Qhip6dTdePKZpadA0Wyf9NhuurBP$
 

 is now live. Please join if you wish.

Thanks, Jasmin
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[Heb-NACO] Minutes of 2021 summer mtg posted (was: RE: Save the date: RAS Cataloging Committee winter meeting)

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, all, the minutes of our last meeting, held during annual conference this 
past summer, have been posted to the 
wiki. There will be a vote on approving the minutes in our upcoming meeting, so 
please take a moment to review.

Also, unfortunately, the recording was lost and there is no way to recreate the 
list of attendees. If you recall being present, would you kindly let me know so 
I can update the roster.

Thanks and kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Frau-Cortes, Neil via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 1:44 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel ; 
hasaf...@lists.osu.edu
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Save the date: RAS Cataloging Committee winter meeting

Dear all,

Please save the date Feb 10, 11:30am-1pm EST (8:30 PST, 5:30pm CET, 6:30pm IST) 
for the RAS Cataloging Committee winter meeting, which will happen online. A 
link to the meeting and an agenda will be distributed shortly. In the meantime, 
if you have any items for the agenda, please let me know 
(neilf...@gmail.com).

Hope to see many of you there. Take good care!



Neil M. Frau-Cortes (he/him/his)
PhD, MLIS

Cataloger - Libraries Division - Collection Management
100 S. Andrews Avenue, MN7
Fort Lauderdale, FL 33301
954-357-5593
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.broward.org/library__;!!KGKeukY!kPE6Mjs9eupGdsq6tuvujKYToiPCQZxdFUymCYJq-t0fyOxsdUDhJiTg0LfyADv66l_m$
 



[Broward County Library Logo for Email Signature]


[cid:image002.jpg@01D80D3F.9B5F1470]




Under Florida law, most e-mail messages to or from Broward County employees or 
officials are public records, available to any person upon request, absent an 
exemption. Therefore, any e-mail message to or from the County, inclusive of 
e-mail addresses contained therein, may be subject to public disclosure.
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Re: [Heb-NACO] RAS Cataloging Committee winter meeting: Agenda

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thanks, Neil. The 
agenda<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/147691926/Agenda*202022*20Winter__;JSU!!KGKeukY!isFdzZcskoCmvNnv4tJ-gOMNbcHwLS5Ar29-R20qDfM_zdmZ4bv2QhWStBpkZj_u-a4x$
 > has also been posted to the Wiki for easy access 
(https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/147691926/Agenda*202022*20Winter__;JSU!!KGKeukY!isFdzZcskoCmvNnv4tJ-gOMNbcHwLS5Ar29-R20qDfM_zdmZ4bv2QhWStBpkZj_u-a4x$
 ). Looking forward to seeing you there,

Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels


From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Frau-Cortes, Neil 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, January 24, 2022 11:15 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco ; 
hasaf...@lists.osu.edu
Subject: [Heb-NACO] RAS Cataloging Committee winter meeting: Agenda

Dear all,Please save the date Feb 10, 11:30am-1pm EST (8:30 PST, 5:30pm CET, 
6:30pm IST) for the RAS Cataloging Committee winter meeting, which will happen 
online. A link to the meeting will be distributed shortly. In the meantime, 
here you have the draft agenda. If you have any items to add or change, kindly 
let me know (neilf...@gmail.com<mailto:neilf...@gmail.com>).

1.  New RDA Toolkit's Community Resources section and the Judaica/Hebraica 
community (Ahava), continue discussion
2.  Inclusion of patronymic in NARs regardless of the placement of the 
patronymic element (Jasmin, Neil)
3.  What constitutes "Sacred Works?" Should we have a list of such works 
(Robert). Ahava has a list from NLI, which she will post for contributions and 
comments
4.  Update on BM201-449 class schedule expansion (Haim, Marlene, Gabe)
5.  Cancellation of Marranos as a subject heading (Nahid, Haim).
6.  Any feedback on the Cataloging Forum (Neil and all).
7.  Romanization: updates on Dicta automation and other projects (Ahava and 
others)
8.  Helping libraries that have a Hebraica/Judaica collection but no 
cataloger (Haim)

Hope to see many of you there. Take good care!



Neil M. Frau-Cortes
PhD, MLIS
(pronouns<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/www.glsen.org/activity/pronouns-guide-glsen__;!!KGKeukY!i73FeCCT8zQ4Qyd2BX79bVSDu5l4T6HjYvm80X8QvIF3BnISnJ08_ZeztldSsogbBCNx$>:
 he/him/his)

Cataloger - Libraries Division - Collection Management
100 S. Andrews Avenue, MN7
Fort Lauderdale, FL 33301
954-357-5593
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.broward.org/library__;!!KGKeukY!isFdzZcskoCmvNnv4tJ-gOMNbcHwLS5Ar29-R20qDfM_zdmZ4bv2QhWStBpkZix74Kn4$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http:/www.broward.org/library__;!!KGKeukY!i73FeCCT8zQ4Qyd2BX79bVSDu5l4T6HjYvm80X8QvIF3BnISnJ08_ZeztldSssCuXY8G$>


[Broward County Library Logo for Email Signature]


[cid:image002.jpg@01D81123.45FEBE80]




Under Florida law, most e-mail messages to or from Broward County employees or 
officials are public records, available to any person upon request, absent an 
exemption. Therefore, any e-mail message to or from the County, inclusive of 
e-mail addresses contained therein, may be subject to public disclosure.
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[Heb-NACO] PSA: 246|g--cease and desist request

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello, friends,

This is a brief Public Service Announcement regarding the 246 Varying Form of 
Title field. Recently, the |g has seen an increase in use for the purpose of 
recording the author's name as it appears with varying forms of the title. 
There is no basis for this practice nor is it standard practice for the 246 
field.

Looking in MARC 21 Format for Bibliographic Data by LC (or Bibliographic 
Formats and Standards by OCLC), the 246 subfield g is defined as "miscellaneous 
information". That is, miscellaneous information regarding the variant form of 
title, not just any miscellaneous information about the book or its author. 
Variant forms of author name are the domain of authority records not the 
bibliographic record. Please stop using the 246|g for recording the variant 
author name as it appears with the variant tile.

Thank you! Comments and questions always welcome,

Best wishes, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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[Heb-NACO] FYI: התרבות שקודדה מחדש

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello again, friends,

Just a heads up that the above title proper is in huf‘al form (as opposed to 
pi‘el or po‘al). This means the second word is romanized as she-ḳudedah 
instead of the current she-ḳodedah (“the nation that was re-encoded” vs. “the 
nation that re-encoded”). To the 14 libraries with holdings on on1181994601, 
you may wish to revise your local records.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] PSA: 246|g--cease and desist request

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Just a request (note the presence of the word in the subject line) for people 
to please follow the instructions and guidelines that are the backbone of our 
work. Apologies to anyone offended--such was not intended.

Get Outlook for 
iOS<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://aka.ms/o0ukef__;!!KGKeukY!mIiaI9TIDckIcUNibAje5dYnF2hBKB29vKfxvPqsXZIvCHS91CIGuyF49X6db7_wW0e6$
 >

From: Rose Shoshanah Seidman 
Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2022 9:20:30 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: PSA: 246|g--cease and desist request

Cease and desist???

Is that a new way of cataloging?
I Was never instructed with that kind of language

Shoshanah

Get Outlook for 
iOS<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://aka.ms/o0ukef__;!!IBzWLUs!Aw7n1gGWQ2_9rVpNelsorkqJZltx-6pzbfrtmjiS4syjgZJAYJ34EgLw6P0A-9wmnC16$>

From: Heb-naco  on behalf of Shinohara, Jasmin 
via Heb-naco 
Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2022 12:57:14 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] PSA: 246|g--cease and desist request


Hello, friends,



This is a brief Public Service Announcement regarding the 246 Varying Form of 
Title field. Recently, the |g has seen an increase in use for the purpose of 
recording the author’s name as it appears with varying forms of the title. 
There is no basis for this practice nor is it standard practice for the 246 
field.



Looking in MARC 21 Format for Bibliographic Data by LC (or Bibliographic 
Formats and Standards by OCLC), the 246 subfield g is defined as “miscellaneous 
information”. That is, miscellaneous information regarding the variant form of 
title, not just any miscellaneous information about the book or its author. 
Variant forms of author name are the domain of authority records not the 
bibliographic record. Please stop using the 246|g for recording the variant 
author name as it appears with the variant tile.



Thank you! Comments and questions always welcome,



Best wishes, Jasmin



---

Jasmin Shinohara

Hebraica Cataloging Librarian

University of Pennsylvania

131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center

3420 Walnut Street

Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206

T. 215-746-6397

jsh...@upenn.edu

Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels


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Re: [Heb-NACO] Please fix OCLC #1309321420

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, Rachel, thank you for bringing the record to our attention. I’ve made the 
requested corrections.

Kol tuv and besorot tovot, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of 
Rachel Leket-Mor via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, November 1, 2023 4:19 PM
To: heb-naco@lists.osu.edu
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Please fix OCLC #1309321420

Shalom, RAS Cataloging Committee, Please correct Matan Hermoni’s last name in 
this record. It is notהרמני and certainly not חרמני(!), but חרמוני. Thanks, 
Rachel Rachel Leket-Mor, Librarian Curator, Open Stack Collections, IsraPulp 
Collection
Shalom, RAS Cataloging Committee,

Please correct Matan Hermoni’s last name in this record.

It is notהרמני  and certainly not חרמני(!), but חרמוני.

Thanks,
Rachel


Rachel Leket-Mor, Librarian
Curator, Open Stack Collections, IsraPulp Collection
Affiliate, Center for Jewish Studies, Center for Maghrib Studies
Arizona State University Library

Editor, Judaica Librarianship (2012–Present)
Association of Jewish Libraries
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://ajlpublishing.org__;!!KGKeukY!1ehUQcZJfHn_ZNLUyGXN0tlQeO2lzngJbffbqm65CpST5LtvpeMKxTm5QljXqohqLrDH5Fz6J8DVWk6_SRd96g$
 


I live and work on the ancestral 
lands
 of the Akimel O’odham (Pima) and Pe​e Posh (Maricopa) peoples and benefit from 
their ongoing stewardship and place-based knowledge.


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[Heb-NACO] romanization of שיהיו

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, the above word is romanized she-yihyu (not she-yihEyu). It is the first 
title word in on1286012676; the 12 libraries with holdings may wish to update 
their local records.

(יהיה is in the rom. FAQ chart; יהיו follows the pattern.)

Thanks, Jasmin

---
J a s m i n  S h i n o h a r a
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
[Penn Libraries 
logo]

PCC Funnels Coordinator:
Hebraica BIBCO & NACO | Judaica SACO
215-746-6397 | jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] ספרה של תמר הרשקוביץ "רגע לפני שנאבד"

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Excellent, thanks for following up, Yossi.

—Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  on behalf of 
Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco 
Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2023 6:14:07 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
Subject: [Heb-NACO] FW: ספרה של תמר הרשקוביץ "רגע לפני שנאבד"


Dafna Schori is the editor of Tamar Hershkovits’ book. Here is the answer to 
the question.



From: Dafna Schori
Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2023 2:49 AM
To: Galron, Joseph 
Subject: Re: ספרה של תמר הרשקוביץ "רגע לפני שנאבד"

ZjQcmQRYFpfptBannerEnd

היי יוסי, כיף לשמוע ממך! שנה טובה! 

לגבי שאלתך: מדובר עלינו שנלך לאיבוד ואז שנֹאבָד.



והלוואי שממשלת הזדון תאבד, תישאר מאחור ותתפוגג



‫בתאריך יום ה׳, 21 בספט׳ 2023 ב-8:00 מאת ‪Galron, Joseph‏ 
<‪galro...@osu.edu‏>:

שלום דפנה ושנה טובה,

לאחרונה הגיע אלינו ספרה של תמר הרשקוביץ "רגע לפני שנאבד", ואנו (ספרנים המקטלגים 
באות עברית ובמקביל גם באותיות לטיניות) תמהים לגבי המילה "שנאבד" – האם היא 
shenovad או shene’abed (או שמא shene’aved), כלומר באיזה בניין יש לקרוא ולבטא את 
המילה האחרונה בשם הספר.



שוב, שנה טובה ונקווה שהמהפכה החוקתית תעלם (ביחד עם ממשלת הזדון)



כל טוב



יוסי גלרון-גולדשלגר





Yossi Galron-Goldschläger



--

יוסי גלרון-גולדשלגר

טלפון נייד 1.614.805.9954

Йозеф Галрон Гольдшлегер

Joseph (Yossi) 
Galron-Goldschläger
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies 
Library
and German Language and Literature Librarian
305 G Thompson Memorial Library
The Ohio State University Libraries
1858 Neil Ave. Mall
Columbus, Ohio 43210 USA
Tel.: (614) 292-3362, Fax: (614)292-1918
Mobile: (614) 805-9954
E-Mail: galro...@osu.edu or 
jgal...@gmail.com

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress



OSU Libraries Historic Jewish Pamphlets Collection

https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://archive.org/details/osulhjpc__;!!KGKeukY!3R0_wNBrdwaxykuAhRpa9qK_F9ksUreybS1Iuv7_ojlTkIiY6ltoEL9CI6CHKrDBD_OQIMfcwd7XbU-wjmojUw$
 





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Re: [Heb-NACO] רגע לפני שנאבד

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thank you for the source, Yossi. Per HCM-RDA, E-Sh is our dictionary of record. 
Ne’evad is thus correct as the nif‘al.

If you think it’s useful to give the Hebrew Academy form, please add it in a 
246. Of course, I’m not sure that the intended binyan is nif‘al. Looking 
forward to hearing what the author says!

Thanks again and kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Galron, Joseph 
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2023 2:58 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: RE: רגע לפני שנאבד

https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://hebrew-academy.org.il/**I-**I-**I/?action=netiot=**E=10__;15zXldeX15XXqteg15jXmdeZ16rXlNek15XXotec15DXkdeT!!KGKeukY!1RLeFviMp08juhC0QB2bgC-2xBZ-Hsrr-6veh-IN8qUL0KZnDwgAxdqsZHKziJyZhJ-C1nQvW3Op5skR_VKQog$
 


From: Shinohara, Jasmin
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2023 2:43 PM
To: Galron, Joseph mailto:galro...@osu.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: RE: רגע לפני שנאבד

Hi, Yossi, Even-Shoshan gives the nif ‘al form as נֶאֱבַד, i. e. , ne'evad. 
What is the source for ne’aved? Thanks, Jasmin From: Heb-naco 
 On Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco 
Sent: Sunday, September

Hi, Yossi, Even-Shoshan gives the nif ‘al form as נֶאֱבַד, i.e., ne'evad. What 
is the source for ne’aved?

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2023 11:56 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] רגע לפני שנאבד

Colleagues
There are 10 libraries on OCLC the hold this book by Tamar Hershkovitz: רגע 
לפני שנאבד = Just before we lost. (OCLC # 1371506533)
It was transliterated as: Rega’ li-fene she-ne’evad.
It does not look right to me. There are two or three ways that I would 
transcribe it:

Rega’ li-fene she-ne’aved (Binyan Nif’al)
Or
Rega’ li-fene she-novad (Binyan Kal)
Or
Rega’ li-fene she-ne’abed (Binyan Pi’el)

What do you think?
(I wrote to the author and asked her)

Yossi Galron-Goldschläger

--
יוסי גלרון-גולדשלגר
טלפון נייד 1.614.805.9954
Йозеф Галрон Гольдшлегер
Joseph (Yossi) 
Galron-Goldschläger
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies 
Library
and German Language and Literature Librarian
305 G Thompson Memorial Library
The Ohio State University Libraries
1858 Neil Ave. Mall
Columbus, Ohio 43210 USA
Tel.: (614) 292-3362, Fax: (614)292-1918
Mobile: (614) 805-9954
E-Mail: galro...@osu.edu or 
jgal...@gmail.com

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress

OSU Libraries Historic Jewish Pamphlets Collection
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://archive.org/details/osulhjpc__;!!KGKeukY!1RLeFviMp08juhC0QB2bgC-2xBZ-Hsrr-6veh-IN8qUL0KZnDwgAxdqsZHKziJyZhJ-C1nQvW3Op5sm5NEwCSA$
 



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Re: [Heb-NACO] Yiddish romanization question

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, Cliff.


Yiddish romanization is nothing like Hebrew romanization.



In the case below, we’re dealing with a Yiddish word of Hebrew origin, which is 
“romanized in a ‘Yiddishlike’ manner if found in what the cataloger determines 
to be a Yiddish context. … the current practice has been expanded to follow 
more closely the romanization in both [Wienreich] as well as Isidoro Niborski’s 
Ṿerṭerbukh fun Loshn-Ḳoydesh shṭamiḳe ṿerṭer (Paris, 2012) for most 
consonants, as well. … Use Weinreich and Niborski as guides for romanization of 
vowels and most consonants. However, differentiate between כ/ח and תּ/ט, כּ/ק 
with the underscore dots and transcribe final ה with an .” (HCM-RDA, p. 22)



Looking in Niborski, then, under חתן (we are instructed to search for words 
without the article א), we see it given as כאסן with a קמץ under the א --> 
khosn; differentiating between כ and ח and adding the required diacritics 
yields ḥos̀n; adding the article yields aḥos̀n. As the first word in the 
title, it is capitalized, Aḥos̀n.



Please let me know if there are further questions. A joyous Sukot to all!


From: Cliff Miller 
Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2023 9:19:40 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: RE: [Heb-NACO] Yiddish romanization question


Does the presence of the second vowel kamets not affect the romanization?

Clifford Miller



From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of 
Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 6:36 PM
To: Barry Dov Walfish ; Hebrew Name Authority 
Funnel 
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Yiddish romanization question



CAUTION: This email originated from outside JTSA. Do not click links or open 
attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.

Yes, samekh and sin (and sof) are always distinguished. From: Heb-naco 
 On Behalf Of Barry Dov Walfish via Heb-naco 
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 4: 51 PM To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
;

Yes, samekh and sin (and sof) are always distinguished.



From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Barry Dov Walfish via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 4:51 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>; Heidi G Lerner 
mailto:ler...@stanford.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Yiddish romanization question



It’s in Weinreich also as khosn. So no differentiation between samekh and sin? 
On Wed, Sep 27, 2023 at 4: 34 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco  wrote: Hi Caroline My thought is that based on our current of HCM, I 
would

It’s in Weinreich also as khosn.

So no differentiation between samekh and sin?



On Wed, Sep 27, 2023 at 4:34 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:

Hi Caroline My thought is that based on our current of HCM, I would romanize it 
as "Aḥosn" "Use Weinreich and Niborski as guides for romanization of vowels 
and most consonants. However, differentiate between כ/ח and תּ/ט, כּ/ק

Hi Caroline



My thought is that based on our current of HCM, I would romanize it as "Aḥosn"





"Use Weinreich and Niborski as guides for romanization of vowels and most 
consonants. However, differentiate between כ/ח and תּ/ט, כּ/ק with the 
underscore dots and transcribe final ה with an “h.” When Weinreich offers a 
choice of romanizations, the first is adopted. If a Hebrew two-word expression 
is written as two words in a Yiddish context, this spacing is imitated in the 
romanization. Hebrew Script Weinreich Niborski ALA-LC Romanization טוב יום 
YONTEV/YONTEF יאָנטעװ yon ṭev Kiper Yin יאָנקיפּער/יאָמקיפּער YONKIPER/YINKIPER 
יום כיפור הסופר עזרא -- -- Ezra ha-Soyfer.



I could not locate "חתן" in Weinrich so I went to Niborski.



Just my thoughts.



best, Heidi







From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> on 
behalf of Miller, Caroline via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 9:36 AM
To: HEB-NACO List Posting 
(heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu<mailto:heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu>) 
mailto:heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Yiddish romanization question



All, I have a Yiddish literary work published in Vilna in 1897. The first word 
in the title is אחתן with patah under א, kamats under both ח and ת. The copy I 
see for a later edition romanizes it as “Aḥos̀n” but I don’t know how the 
nikud appeared

All,



I have a Yiddish literary work published in Vilna in 1897.  The first word in 
the title is אחתן  with patah under א, kamats under both ח and ת.



The copy I see for a later edition romanizes it as “Aḥos̀n” but I don’t know 
how the nikud appeared on that piece.  Wouldn’t my piece be romanized 
“Aḥos̀on?” because of the two successively appearing kamatsim?



Wishing you all a happy Sukkot!



Caroline



Caroline R. Miller

Team 

[Heb-NACO] romanization: בין יציבות למהפכה

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello, friends, and shanah ṭovah!

The above title, on 1289500403, is correctly romanized Ben yatsivut 
le-mahpekhah : ʻaśor la-Aviv ha-ʻArvi (instead of the current Ben yetsivut 
la-mahapekhah : ʻaśor le-Aviv ha-ʻAravi). Fixed fields and other fields were 
corrected/added.

For the 16 libraries with holdings on the title, you may wish to update your 
local records.

Please let me know if there are any questions.

(All three words, יציבות, מהפכה, ערבי, are in the romanization FAQ. LC was 
notified separately)

Thanks, Jasmin

---
J a s m i n  S h i n o h a r a
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
[Penn Libraries 
logo]

PCC Funnels Coordinator:
Hebraica BIBCO & NACO | Judaica SACO
215-746-6397 | jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] Yiddish romanization question

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Yes, samekh and sin (and sof) are always distinguished.

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Barry Dov Walfish 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 4:51 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel ; Heidi G Lerner 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Yiddish romanization question

It’s in Weinreich also as khosn. So no differentiation between samekh and sin? 
On Wed, Sep 27, 2023 at 4: 34 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco  wrote: Hi Caroline My thought is that based on our current of HCM, I 
would
It’s in Weinreich also as khosn.
So no differentiation between samekh and sin?

On Wed, Sep 27, 2023 at 4:34 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi Caroline My thought is that based on our current of HCM, I would romanize it 
as "Aḥosn" "Use Weinreich and Niborski as guides for romanization of vowels 
and most consonants. However, differentiate between כ/ח and תּ/ט, כּ/ק
Hi Caroline

My thought is that based on our current of HCM, I would romanize it as "Aḥosn"


"Use Weinreich and Niborski as guides for romanization of vowels and most 
consonants. However, differentiate between כ/ח and תּ/ט, כּ/ק with the 
underscore dots and transcribe final ה with an “h.” When Weinreich offers a 
choice of romanizations, the first is adopted. If a Hebrew two-word expression 
is written as two words in a Yiddish context, this spacing is imitated in the 
romanization. Hebrew Script Weinreich Niborski ALA-LC Romanization טוב יום 
YONTEV/YONTEF יאָנטעװ yon ṭev Kiper Yin יאָנקיפּער/יאָמקיפּער YONKIPER/YINKIPER 
יום כיפור הסופר עזרא -- -- Ezra ha-Soyfer.

I could not locate "חתן" in Weinrich so I went to Niborski.

Just my thoughts.

best, Heidi



From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> on 
behalf of Miller, Caroline via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 9:36 AM
To: HEB-NACO List Posting 
(heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu) 
mailto:heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Yiddish romanization question

All, I have a Yiddish literary work published in Vilna in 1897. The first word 
in the title is אחתן with patah under א, kamats under both ח and ת. The copy I 
see for a later edition romanizes it as “Aḥos̀n” but I don’t know how the 
nikud appeared

All,



I have a Yiddish literary work published in Vilna in 1897.  The first word in 
the title is אחתן  with patah under א, kamats under both ח and ת.



The copy I see for a later edition romanizes it as “Aḥos̀n” but I don’t know 
how the nikud appeared on that piece.  Wouldn’t my piece be romanized 
“Aḥos̀on?” because of the two successively appearing kamatsim?



Wishing you all a happy Sukkot!



Caroline



Caroline R. Miller

Team Leader, Discovery Team

UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions and Metadata Services

2400 Life Sciences Building

621 Charles E Young Drive 
South

Box 957230

Los Angeles, CA  90095-7230


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Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - romanization: שם ועבר

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thank you for the Divre ha-yamim reference, Cliff. It is found as a pair in 
Rashi<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/www.sefaria.org/Rashi_on_Genesis.25.22.1?vhe=Pentateuch_with_Rashi*27s_commentary_by_M._Rosenbaum_and_A.M._Silbermann,_1929-1934=he__;JQ!!IBzWLUs!XVoalnD7Xz6QsjrEjfJoveh6CiKJPfFNJny1ut72Brqmrms5-W2JvdQHmJRv9tw4W8MEIeImoOz9xBqX$>
 on Be-reshit 25:22, which is vocalized with the kamats.

I have added the pair to the Fixed expressions wiki 
page<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://rascat.pbworks.com/w/page/7836006/Fixed*20Expressions*view=page__;JSM!!KGKeukY!xkNdqe21duB4EfKxRKfsnUOWgUafKSdmwFQl7t9jlIZ7d-9tYIHjgx7-DSep_DdmpfiGd8e_wfBkRu4IewKKsQ$
 >.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of 
Cliff Miller via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 4:48 PM
To: Marlene Schiffman ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - romanization: שם ועבר

Marlene, The two names do not appear as a pair in the Bible, as they do in 
Talmud and Midrash (which have no sacred vocalization) The name Ever does 
appear with the conjunctive vav in First Chronicles 5. 13, vocalized with a 
kamets, just as
Marlene,
The two names do not appear as a pair in the Bible, as they do in Talmud and 
Midrash (which have no sacred vocalization)
The name Ever does appear with the conjunctive vav in First Chronicles 5.13, 
vocalized with a kamets, just as you surmised.
Shanah tovah u-metukah,
Clifford Miller

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Marlene Schiffman via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2023 3:32 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - romanization: שם ועבר


CAUTION: This email originated from outside JTSA. Do not click links or open 
attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.
Hi Jasmin, Quick question: Shem ve-Ever? Shem va-Ever? I found 2 records on LC 
that have it both ways—naturally! Does it follow the pattern of Yom va-lailah? 
Thanks, חג שמח MRS Marlene Schiffman Metadata and Services Department Gottesman 
Library
Hi Jasmin,
Quick question: Shem ve-Ever?
Shem va-Ever?
I found 2 records on LC that have it both ways—naturally!
Does it follow the pattern of Yom va-lailah?
Thanks, חג שמח
MRS

Marlene Schiffman
Metadata and Services Department
Gottesman Library
Yeshiva University
500 West 185th Street
New York, N.Y. 10033

Gottesman Library
Room 301
646 592 4276

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-bounces+schiffma=yu@lists.osu.edu>>
 On Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2023 8:17 PM
To: heb-naco@lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>
Subject: [EXT] - [Heb-NACO] romanization: בין יציבות למהפכה

**External Email**
Hello, friends, and shanah ṭovah! The above title, on 1289500403, is correctly 
romanized Ben yatsivut le-mahpekhah : ʻaśor la-Aviv ha-ʻArvi (instead of the 
current Ben yetsivut la-mahapekhah : ʻaśor le-Aviv ha-ʻAravi). Fixed fields 
and other
Hello, friends, and shanah ṭovah!

The above title, on 1289500403, is correctly romanized Ben yatsivut 
le-mahpekhah : ʻaśor la-Aviv ha-ʻArvi (instead of the current Ben yetsivut 
la-mahapekhah : ʻaśor le-Aviv ha-ʻAravi). Fixed fields and other fields were 
corrected/added.

For the 16 libraries with holdings on the title, you may wish to update your 
local records.

Please let me know if there are any questions.

(All three words, יציבות, מהפכה, ערבי, are in the romanization FAQ. LC was 
notified separately)

Thanks, Jasmin

---
J a s m i n  S h i n o h a r a
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
[Penn Libraries 
logo]<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/www.library.upenn.edu/__;!!KGKeukY!yOnSrIKmPWNzzAUdsZqWt4kQh7QtO8JP_ZAVIPuXd1YgOeoAdHmFhbgrdqmiEmASsCX9vy1x-oyik12woHnuJw$>

PCC Funnels Coordinator:
Hebraica BIBCO & NACO | Judaica SACO
215-746-6397 | jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>

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Re: [Heb-NACO] רגע לפני שנאבד

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

It’s hard to know without context. If it is novad, then the English would be 
Just before we were lost. Reading the summary blurb, I wonder if it isn’t Regaʻ 
li-fene she-neʼabed, i.e., Just before we lose. Here’s hoping the author weighs 
in.

--Jasmin

From: Barry Dov Walfish 
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2023 3:25 PM
To: Galron, Joseph ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Cc: Shinohara, Jasmin 
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] רגע לפני שנאבד

I agree with Yossi. But then there's a problem with the English title, which 
probably should be Just Before We Lose.
Barry

On Mon, Sep 18, 2023 at 3:13 PM Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
I did not get a response yet from the author, but I think it should be Rega’ 
li-fene she-novad

Yossi

--
יוסי גלרון-גולדשלגר
טלפון נייד 1.614.805.9954
Йозеф Галрон Гольдшлегер
Joseph (Yossi) 
Galron-Goldschläger
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies 
Library
and German Language and Literature Librarian
305 G Thompson Memorial Library
The Ohio State University Libraries
1858 Neil Ave. Mall
Columbus, Ohio 43210 USA
Tel.: (614) 292-3362, Fax: (614)292-1918
Mobile: (614) 805-9954
E-Mail: galro...@osu.edu or 
jgal...@gmail.com

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress

OSU Libraries Historic Jewish Pamphlets Collection
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://archive.org/details/osulhjpc__;!!KGKeukY!zL4D_bv4Ft60Y8diTtf_pe1vo-KHTq1fp1EovDnlVM3fidVT9WetNggwHZnQYzKd9WcGNW60QT-TrafvV7xSzA$
 




From: Shinohara, Jasmin
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2023 3:04 PM
To: Galron, Joseph mailto:galro...@osu.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: RE: רגע לפני שנאבד

Thank you for the source, Yossi. Per HCM-RDA, E-Sh is our dictionary of record. 
Ne’evad is thus correct as the nif‘al. If you think it’s useful to give the 
Hebrew Academy form, please add it in a 246. Of course, I’m not sure that the 
intended
Thank you for the source, Yossi. Per HCM-RDA, E-Sh is our dictionary of record. 
Ne’evad is thus correct as the nif‘al.

If you think it’s useful to give the Hebrew Academy form, please add it in a 
246. Of course, I’m not sure that the intended binyan is nif‘al. Looking 
forward to hearing what the author says!

Thanks again and kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Galron, Joseph mailto:galro...@osu.edu>>
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2023 2:58 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: RE: רגע לפני שנאבד

https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://hebrew-academy.org.il/**I-**I-**I/?action=netiot=**E=10__;15zXldeX15XXqteg15jXmdeZ16rXlNek15XXotec15DXkdeT!!KGKeukY!zL4D_bv4Ft60Y8diTtf_pe1vo-KHTq1fp1EovDnlVM3fidVT9WetNggwHZnQYzKd9WcGNW60QT-TracMdAkViw$
 


From: Shinohara, Jasmin
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2023 2:43 PM
To: Galron, Joseph mailto:galro...@osu.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: RE: רגע לפני שנאבד

Hi, Yossi, Even-Shoshan gives the nif ‘al form as נֶאֱבַד, i. e. , ne'evad. 
What is the source for ne’aved? Thanks, Jasmin From: Heb-naco 
 On Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco 
Sent: Sunday, September

Hi, Yossi, Even-Shoshan gives the nif ‘al form as נֶאֱבַד, i.e., ne'evad. What 
is the source for ne’aved?

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Sunday, September 17, 2023 11:56 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] רגע לפני שנאבד

Colleagues
There are 10 libraries on OCLC the hold this book by Tamar Hershkovitz: רגע 
לפני שנאבד = Just 

[Heb-NACO] bib BFM, lccn2021420547

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello and גמר חתימה טובה to all!

A friendly reminder that there is neither ‘oy’ nor ‘ei’ in Hebrew romanization. 
The title in on1273559327/lccn2021420547 (with 11 library holdings) should be 
romanized Noishṭain instead of the current Noyshṭein.

Please let me know if there are any questions.

Thanks and kol tuv, Jasmin

---
J a s m i n  S h i n o h a r a
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
[Penn Libraries 
logo]

PCC Funnels Coordinator:
Hebraica BIBCO & NACO | Judaica SACO
215-746-6397 | jsh...@upenn.edu

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[Heb-NACO] Fwd: Identifying duplicate records using machine learning—non-Latin data labeling for WorldCat

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Dear colleagues, please see below for an opportunity to contribute to OCLC 
deduplication efforts specific to records for Hebraica. I hope you'll consider 
participating!

Besorot tovot, Jasmin



From: Whitacre,Cynthia
Sent: Monday, October 23, 2023 9:53 AM
To: OCLC-CJK ; OCLC-CAT 
Subject: Identifying duplicate records using machine learning—non-Latin data 
labeling for WorldCat



As part of continuous quality improvement efforts, earlier this year we began 
implementation of our machine learning model to identify duplicate records in 
WorldCat. The initial phase focused on records for print books and e-books 
published in Latin-script languages; the results of these efforts have improved 
the cataloging, discovery, and interlibrary loan experiences for library staff 
and end users across the world.

 In our next phase, we’re expanding the focus to records that include non-Latin 
script describing print books, e-books, audiobooks, journals, and videos 
published in Chinese, Japanese, Korean, Thai, Arabic, Hebrew, and Russian. We 
invite metadata experts in those languages to validate our machine learning 
model’s understanding of duplicates by participating in a data labeling 
exercise using a simple, intuitive, online interface. Are the two records 
functionally equivalent? Do they represent the same manifestation? Or are they 
truly different manifestations that just seem the same, except for some 
important differences that only you can spot.

Put my skills to the 
test!

 The interface will remain open through 15 December 2023, at which time we will 
begin analyzing the collected data. For more information, check out the 
participation 
instructions
 and read the 
FAQs.

With your help we can better scale the resolution of duplicate records in 
WorldCat, saving countless hours of time and improving the experience for the 
global library community. Thanks for all you do to advance the mission of 
libraries worldwide—we appreciate your ongoing collaboration!





Cynthia M. Whitacre  (she/her)

OCLC · Senior Metadata Operations Manager, Membership & Research Division

6565 Kilgour Place, Dublin, Ohio, 43017  United States

T +1-800-848-5878, ext. 6183

Direct: +1-614-764-6183

[cid:image001.png@01DA0596.217A56F0]

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[Heb-NACO] FW: Reminder_ Online program: Developing ALA-LC Romanization Tables Alongside New Technologies for Improved Discovery: Case Study ADLaM

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Sharing a session of possible interest.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: ld4p2-non-latin-materi...@googlegroups.com 
 On Behalf Of Dagher, Iman
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2023 9:58 AM
To: ld4p2-non-latin-materi...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Reminder_ Online program: Developing ALA-LC Romanization Tables 
Alongside New Technologies for Improved Discovery: Case Study ADLaM

Hi,
Apology for the duplication. Sending a reminder to consider joining the CC:AAM 
program on Wednesday..

Iman
*

Title: Developing ALA-LC Romanization Tables Alongside New Technologies for 
Improved Discovery: Case Study ADLaM


Sponsored by: Core Committee on Cataloging: African and Asian Materials 
(CC:AAM), ALA-LC Romanization Table Review Board

Presenters: Beacher Wiggins, Charles Riley, Erin Freas-Smith, Neil Patel, 
Jessalyn Zoom

Moderator: Boutsaba Janetvilay


Date: Aug 23, 2023 1:00 Eastern/12:00 Central/11:00 Mountain/10:00 Pacific; 1 
hour


Registration link: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://ala-events.zoom.us/webinar/register/WN_oCQ9DSZpRYSFe7IVAyBfow*/registration__;Iw!!KGKeukY!0hdzN4rbxKtTad0L9jjp5iFZtS0QzC5BLIfNhIuWNC_GuDMf3tVo30kKkfPUuEJO_R8OKIuN-bECQSbMv4pHyg$
 


Description: Romanization Tables are jointly maintained by the American Library 
Association and the Library of Congress. The Review Board, formed in May 2021, 
is charged with appointing Review Subcommittees to conduct the review and 
approval of new and updated romanization proposals. In spring 2023, the ALA-LC 
Romanization Table Review Board approved the newly created romanization table 
for ADLaM, a script developed in the late 1980s for a group of Fulani languages 
spoken chiefly in West Africa. The table was independently created by Africana 
cataloger Charles Riley of Yale University over several years in response to 
the marked increase in publications in ADLaM script. The program will highlight 
the development of the ADLaM Romanization table with active engagement of the 
script user community. The new table covers several areas of development 
including: the display of Unicode code points to clarify the identification of 
the characters in the table, the test of character input in the Bibframe Editor 
MARVA, and the creation and integration of a bi-directional transliteration 
tool into the ScriptShifter, an application to facilitate input of non-Latin 
scripts. This process underscores the critical role played by technology to 
streamline the workflow of romanization and improve bibliographic accuracy and 
discoverability of non-Latin script material. The presentation will conclude 
with a future look at the potential of technological integration and the role 
of the Review Board.


Iman Dagher
Arabic & Islamic Studies Metadata Librarian
UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions & Metadata Services
Email: idag...@library.ucla.edu
Phone: (310) 825-8642


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.
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[Heb-NACO] FW: [PCCLIST] Announcement: Update on the use of the MARC 21 667 for notes regarding URIs in NACO records

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

FYI. Please let me know if there are any questions. Thanks and kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging  On Behalf 
Of Mackenzie, Tricia
Sent: Friday, August 18, 2023 2:57 PM
To: pccl...@listserv.loc.gov
Subject: [PCCLIST] Announcement: Update on the use of the MARC 21 667 for notes 
regarding URIs in NACO records


Announcement: Update on the use of the MARC 21 667 for notes regarding URIs in 
NACO records


Background: In 2019, participants in the PCC URIs in MARC 
Pilot
 began adding URIs to the MARC 21 Authority 024 field. Later, the pilot was 
expanded to include 3XX and 5XX fields.  As part of the pilot, a 667 note was 
required.

Originally, the 667 note added was:

667 ## $a URIs added to this record for the PCC URI MARC Pilot. Please do not 
remove or edit the URIs.

Eventually, the requirement to add the 667 note for URIs in the 024 was 
discontinued, but a 667 note was still required when adding URIs to 3XX and/or 
5XX fields:

667 ## $a URIs added to 3XX and/or 5XX fields in this record for the PCC URI 
MARC Pilot. Please do not remove or edit these URIs.

One of the outcomes of the subgroup was the creation of best practice 
guidelines
 for using the 024 field in NACO records.

Current Practice: NACO catalogers should no longer add a MARC 21 667 field note 
in name authority records when adding URIs in the 024, 3XX, or 5XX fields. When 
updating a NACO record for another reason, catalogers may delete any existing 
667 notes about the inclusion of URIs. Catalogers are free to edit $0s and $1s 
in MARC authority fields if they contain errors that need to be corrected.


_

Tricia Mackenzie
Librarian
Cataloging Policy Specialist
Policy, Training, and Cooperative Programs Division
Library of Congress | tmacken...@loc.gov



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[Heb-NACO] FW: [PCCLIST] Announcement: NACO MARC21 046: Subfields $q and $r available for use

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

FYI. Please let me know if there are any questions. Thanks, Jasmin

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging  On Behalf 
Of Mackenzie, Tricia
Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2023 3:19 PM
To: pccl...@listserv.loc.gov
Subject: [PCCLIST] Announcement: NACO MARC21 046: Subfields $q and $r available 
for use


Announcement: NACO MARC21 046: Subfields $q and $r available for use

MARC field 046 subfields $q (establishment date) and $r (termination date) are 
now valid for use in NACO corporate name authority records. Existing NACO 
corporate body records that have establishment date and termination date in 
subfields $s and $t will not be programmatically updated to use subfields $q 
and $r. However, when updating an already existing corporate body record, NACO 
catalogers are encouraged to evaluate the 046 field and manually update the 
subfields to $q and $r as needed.

Note: Subfield $s (start period) and subfield $t (end period) are also valid 
for use in NACO corporate name authority records in some cases. If subfield $s 
and subfield $t do not represent establishment date and termination date, do 
not change the subfield values.

NACO documentation will be updated soon to reflect the change in practice.

_
Tricia Mackenzie
(she/her)
Cataloging Policy Specialist
Policy, Training, and Cooperative Programs Division
Library of Congress | tmacken...@loc.gov



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[Heb-NACO] romanization of לפני ולפנים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, for the 12 libraries with holdings on the above title, on1266383474, you 
may wish to update your local records. The title proper is correctly romanized 
Li-fenai ṿeli-fenim (not Li-fene).

Please let me know if there are any questions.

Thanks, Jasmin

---
J a s m i n  S h i n o h a r a
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
[Penn Libraries 
logo]

PCC Funnels Coordinator:
Hebraica BIBCO & NACO | Judaica SACO
215-746-6397 | jsh...@upenn.edu

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Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - romanization of לפני ולפנים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thank you, Barry and Yossi, for your prompt responses to Marlene! —Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  on 
behalf of Barry Dov Walfish via Heb-naco 
Sent: Monday, August 28, 2023 10:11:49 PM
To: Marlene Schiffman ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] [EXT] - romanization of לפני ולפנים

Hi, Marlene, See: https: //hebrew-academy. org. 
il/2018/10/29/%D7%9C%D7%A4%D7%A0%D7%99-%D7%95%D7%9C%D7%A4%D7%A0%D7%99%D7%9D/ 
Barry On Mon, Aug 28, 2023 at 9: 44 PM Marlene Schiffman via Heb-naco 
 wrote: Can you explain
Hi, Marlene,
See: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://hebrew-academy.org.il/2018/10/29/**G-**K/__;15zXpNeg15nXldec16TXoNeZ150!!KGKeukY!3PqRUxDBIrSyFU917fFTJkHhPKk6xJ7iW9NkFVbGZVzezuhUp_-MknRfro5-2KOusnqshtto-5DQZYLh_WLj6Q$
 
<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://hebrew-academy.org.il/2018/10/29/**G-**K/__;15zXpNeg15nXldec16TXoNeZ150!!KGKeukY!1B5lQNy9ogVy5j_rXO0wNvq_nkNvA-6Rz1UlQA923Qasg_XLdNXZspvU7nc0FV5em4B_wcp1ImWQfb7hapwcXpfAk9V96jI$>
Barry

On Mon, Aug 28, 2023 at 9:44 PM Marlene Schiffman via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Can you explain why it's not li-fene? Sent from my T-Mobile 5G Device Get 
Outlook for Android From: Heb-naco  on 
behalf of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco  Sent: 
Monday, August
Can you explain why it's not li-fene?

Sent from my T-Mobile 5G Device
Get Outlook for 
Android<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://aka.ms/AAb9ysg__;!!KGKeukY!zG9MdpfFFFpp8AKiwWSgu9u_f0GZr0EPJVxdS3qEAUihsbr3kffDJaEiGqXN5UKrLLsk9lAe4h8UBJBDcDL_DA$>

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> on 
behalf of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Sent: Monday, August 28, 2023 6:48:56 PM
To: heb-naco@lists.osu.edu<mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu> 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [EXT] - [Heb-NACO] romanization of לפני ולפנים

**External Email**
Hi, for the 12 libraries with holdings on the above title, on1266383474, you 
may wish to update your local records. The title proper is correctly romanized 
Li-fenai ṿeli-fenim (not Li-fene). Please let me know if there are any 
questions. Thanks,

Hi, for the 12 libraries with holdings on the above title, on1266383474, you 
may wish to update your local records. The title proper is correctly romanized 
Li-fenai ṿeli-fenim (not Li-fene).



Please let me know if there are any questions.



Thanks, Jasmin



---

J a s m i n  S h i n o h a r a

Hebraica Cataloging Librarian

[Penn Libraries 
logo]<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.library.upenn.edu/__;!!KGKeukY!0tCdz9bSrkIp2IZCTsqT3PznANTz080CgYa-ubCRL1wuHJfT3THpb_TKLrazO4gsmqH9LAqq_IN1JetwIN4zyA$>



PCC Funnels Coordinator:

Hebraica BIBCO & NACO | Judaica SACO

215-746-6397 | jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>



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Re: [Heb-NACO] Safrut??

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Looks like LC has an earlier edition, 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://lccn.loc.gov/58050893__;!!KGKeukY!1h62S0ifmAkVSLFXylq8ZBq12YTO6LJ5QBJjG4wgPYpH0wQnQFt8ecqOVLoJUqBW_XYWcWaVKkBjsXdUENdPBTZBSRk$
 .

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Yossi Galron via 
Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2022 2:53 PM
To: Freedman, Vanessa ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Safrut??

Safrut is also correct. In any case you can add a 246 field and have it with 
Sifrut Yossi Joseph Galron-Goldschläger –– Joseph (Yossi) Galron-Goldschläger 
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies Library and German Language and Literature 
Librarian
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Safrut is also correct.
In any case you can add a 246 field and have it with Sifrut

Yossi


Joseph Galron-Goldschläger
––
Joseph (Yossi) Galron-Goldschläger
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies 
Library
and German Language and Literature Librarian
305 G Thompson Memorial Library
The Ohio State University Libraries
1858 Neil Ave. Mall
Columbus, Ohio 43210 USA
Tel.: (614) 292-3362, Fax: (614)292-1918
Mobile: (614) 285-4290
E-Mail: galro...@osu.edu or 
jgal...@gmail.com

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress


On Tue, Apr 26, 2022 at 2:50 PM Freedman, Vanessa via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hello wise cataloguers I am cataloguing the following: ‏ אוצר ספרות ישראל : 
אנתולוגיה בפרוזה ושיר לכל מקצועות היצירה העברית וחזיונותיה למן חתימת כתבי הקדש 
/ ערוך ומסודר ביד י.ל. ברוך. ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
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Hello wise cataloguers

I am cataloguing the following:

‏ אוצר ספרות ישראל : אנתולוגיה בפרוזה ושיר לכל מקצועות היצירה העברית וחזיונותיה 
למן חתימת כתבי הקדש / ערוך ומסודר ביד י.ל. ברוך.
(2nd edition, Vilna: Yehudiyah, 1919)

The title is vocalised on the title page with a pataḥ under the sameḥ so should 
I transcribe as safrut even though there’s no such vocalisation in Even Shoshan 
(and add a 246 with sifrut)?

Thanks

Vanessa

Vanessa Freedman
Subject Liaison Librarian: Hebrew & Jewish Studies

Pronouns: she/her
Work pattern: Tues-Thurs 10am to 6pm

Main Library
UCL Library Services
Library, Culture, Collections & Open Science
Gower Street
London
WC1E 6BT

Tel: 020 7679 2598
E-mail: v.freed...@ucl.ac.uk
Twitter: @UCLHJSLibrary @vrfreedman
Website: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://www.ucl.ac.uk/library__;!!KGKeukY!1h62S0ifmAkVSLFXylq8ZBq12YTO6LJ5QBJjG4wgPYpH0wQnQFt8ecqOVLoJUqBW_XYWcWaVKkBjsXdUENdP4oQ16hE$
 


**Please remember the environment and only print this if necessary**

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Re: [Heb-NACO] Romanization of מחשבות

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, Caroline,

The word you ask about underwent changes between different editions of Even 
Shoshan (see list of words affected 
here), so it makes sense that catalogs reflects that change over time. The word 
in semihut form is correctly romanized mahshevot, as in, “the thoughts of X”. 
In the case of your title, not in semihut, the current E-Sh vocalizes it 
מַחְשָׁבוֹת; its correct romanization is mahshavot. (Sorry, Yossi.)

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Miller, Caroline 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2022 6:13 PM
To: HEB-NACO List Posting (heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu) 

Subject: [Heb-NACO] Romanization of מחשבות

All, How would you romanize מחשבות? My title is מחשבות על אמנות מודרנית I’m 
seeing most records in the LC catalog are “mahshavot” (dot under h) but there 
are 24 records with “mahashavot” (dot under h) and 15 records with “mahshevot” 
(dot under
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All,

How would you romanize מחשבות?  My title is מחשבות על אמנות מודרנית

I’m seeing most records in the LC catalog are “mahshavot” (dot under h) but 
there are 24 records with “mahashavot” (dot under h) and 15 records with 
“mahshevot” (dot under h).  I see it all those ways ways in my (not up-to-date) 
version of Even Shoshan.

Thanks.

Caroline

Caroline R. Miller
Team Leader, Discovery Team
UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions and Metadata Services
2400 Life Sciences Building
621 Charles E Young Drive South
Box 957230
Los Angeles, CA  90095-7230
My pronouns are she/her/hers

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Re: [Heb-NACO] Romanization FAQ on AJL wiki

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thanks, Caroline, for asking. Yes! The FAQ is regularly updated. In addition, 
at the top of the 
wiki page, above the chart, is the line “Are we missing a word? Please let us 
know here”, with “here” linking to a Google doc 
form.

I will gladly add להיות when I’m next in front of the computer. Li-heyot is the 
correct form; how have you seen it misromanized?

Kol tuv, Shabat shalom, and a wonderful holiday weekend to all, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  on 
behalf of Miller, Caroline via Heb-naco 
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 1:29:56 PM
To: HEB-NACO List Posting (heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu) 

Subject: [Heb-NACO] Romanization FAQ on AJL wiki


Is the romanization FAQ on the AJL wiki updated regularly?  If so, can we 
suggest words that we run across in OCLC as mis-romanized?  I would like to add 
li-heyot (להיות)



Thanks.



Caroline



Caroline R. Miller

Team Leader, Discovery Team

UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions and Metadata Services

2400 Life Sciences Building

621 Charles E Young Drive South

Box 957230

Los Angeles, CA  90095-7230

My pronouns are she/her/hers


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Re: [Heb-NACO] Romanization FAQ on AJL wiki

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Excellent, thank you. Please let me know of other words as you encounter them, 
either via email or the form.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

Get Outlook for 
iOS

From: Miller, Caroline 
Sent: Friday, May 27, 2022 11:51:09 AM
To: HEB-NACO list posting ; Shinohara, 
Jasmin 
Subject: Re: Romanization FAQ on AJL wiki

Hi Jasmin,

Thanks for pointing out the link!  I totally missed it.

I've seen it as li-hiyot (most common), lihiyot (no hyphen), and liheyot (no 
hyphen)

Caroline



Caroline R. Miller

Team Leader, Discovery Team

UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions and Metadata Services

2400 Life Sciences Building

621 Charles E Young Drive South

Box 957230

Los Angeles, CA  90095-7230


From: Shinohara, Jasmin 
Sent: Friday, May 27, 2022 12:06 AM
To: Miller, Caroline ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
; HEB-NACO List Posting 
(heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu) 
Subject: Re: Romanization FAQ on AJL wiki

Thanks,
 Caroline, for asking. Yes! The FAQ is regularly updated. In addition, at the 
top of the 
wiki
 page, above the chart, is the line “Are we missing a word? Please let us know 
here”, with “here” linking to a Google doc 
form.

I will gladly add להיות when I’m next in front of the computer. Li-heyot is the 
correct form; how have you seen it misromanized?

Kol tuv, Shabat shalom, and a wonderful holiday weekend to all, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  on 
behalf of Miller, Caroline via Heb-naco 
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2022 1:29:56 PM
To: HEB-NACO List Posting (heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu) 

Subject: [Heb-NACO] Romanization FAQ on AJL wiki


Is the romanization FAQ on the AJL wiki updated regularly?  If so, can we 
suggest words that we run across in OCLC as mis-romanized?  I would like to add 
li-heyot (להיות)



Thanks.



Caroline



Caroline R. Miller

Team Leader, Discovery Team

UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions and Metadata Services

2400 Life Sciences Building

621 Charles E Young Drive South

Box 957230

Los Angeles, CA  90095-7230

My pronouns are she/her/hers


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Re: [Heb-NACO] Arab name

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, all!

Caroline, that is a good supposition, and I used to think the same, until Heidi 
informed me that Arabic names play by their own rules, not our Hebraica name 
rules.

Rachel, I’m afraid I don’t have a specific citation for you, but I’d refer you 
to the Arabic NACO Manual, 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://library.princeton.edu/departments/tsd/katmandu/cp20/aranatoc.html__;!!KGKeukY!xzttVULsUX85MH4XhhBgvvuCO85yRZA7XtifNIdqlRb7IB31qbQr6h71o7S9zRCx_WZ2O6vvghpZhvy_yWLUSJpvyec$
  .

Heidi, do you have any added pointers?

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Miller, Caroline 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 11:54 AM
To: Rachel Simon ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Arab name

I’ll take a stab at this. Per LC-PCC PS for 9.2.2.5.3, alternative, point 1 you 
need to use the Romanized form of name that appears on the piece, with all the 
appropriate 400’s. Caroline ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
I’ll take a stab at this.  Per LC-PCC PS for 9.2.2.5.3, alternative, point 1 
you need to use the Romanized form of name that appears on the piece, with all 
the appropriate 400’s.

Caroline

Caroline R. Miller
Team Leader, Discovery Team
UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions and Metadata Services
2400 Life Sciences Building
621 Charles E Young Drive South
Box 957230
Los Angeles, CA  90095-7230
My pronouns are she/her/hers

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-bounces+crmiller=library.ucla@lists.osu.edu>>
 On Behalf Of Rachel Simon via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 7:20 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Arab name

What should be the authorized form of the name of an Arab writing in Hebrew, 
when the cover also has the name in Arabic? This related to the book by עלי 
ח'ליפה . Should the Hebrew form be Romanized as Ḥ'alifah, ʻAli ? ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
What should be the authorized form of the name of an Arab writing in Hebrew, 
when the cover also has the name in Arabic? This related to the book by  עלי 
ח'ליפה . Should the Hebrew form be Romanized as Ḥ'alifah, ʻAli  ?
The Arabic would be Khalīfah, ʻAlī Ṣāliḥ
There is also a Romanized form of the name: Ali Khalefa.

Thanks,

Rachel


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Re: [Heb-NACO] Arab name

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

In a case like this, I’d be tempted to reach out to the author to ask his 
preferred form. That would trump all other considerations.

From: Rachel Simon 
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 1:27 PM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Miller, Caroline 
; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
; ler...@stanford.edu
Subject: RE: Arab name

He wrote the book in Hebrew, and it is his first publication. So, which rules 
should apply?

Rachel

From: Shinohara, Jasmin mailto:jsh...@pobox.upenn.edu>>
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 1:06 PM
To: Miller, Caroline 
mailto:crmil...@library.ucla.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>; 
Rachel Simon mailto:rsi...@princeton.edu>>; 
ler...@stanford.edu
Subject: RE: Arab name

Hi, all!

Caroline, that is a good supposition, and I used to think the same, until Heidi 
informed me that Arabic names play by their own rules, not our Hebraica name 
rules.

Rachel, I’m afraid I don’t have a specific citation for you, but I’d refer you 
to the Arabic NACO Manual, 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://library.princeton.edu/departments/tsd/katmandu/cp20/aranatoc.html__;!!KGKeukY!yUCD81N-c9yzw0ITrfqgzOMrn1ziWBHsLDRNYDZA2IYyQSq-_NUkN7Bqv-86KKK4EZ3tGBxx0XPAKGN8oHkfmkqJGEM$
 

 .

Heidi, do you have any added pointers?

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Miller, Caroline via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 11:54 AM
To: Rachel Simon mailto:rsi...@princeton.edu>>; Hebrew 
Name Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Arab name

I’ll take a stab at this. Per LC-PCC PS for 9.2.2.5.3, alternative, point 1 you 
need to use the Romanized form of name that appears on the piece, with all the 
appropriate 400’s. Caroline ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
I’ll take a stab at this.  Per LC-PCC PS for 9.2.2.5.3, alternative, point 1 
you need to use the Romanized form of name that appears on the piece, with all 
the appropriate 400’s.

Caroline

Caroline R. Miller
Team Leader, Discovery Team
UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions and Metadata Services
2400 Life Sciences Building
621 Charles E Young Drive South
Box 957230
Los Angeles, CA  90095-7230
My pronouns are she/her/hers

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-bounces+crmiller=library.ucla@lists.osu.edu>>
 On Behalf Of Rachel Simon via Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2022 7:20 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Arab name

What should be the authorized form of the name of an Arab writing in Hebrew, 
when the cover also has the name in Arabic? This related to the book by עלי 
ח'ליפה . Should the Hebrew form be Romanized as Ḥ'alifah, ʻAli ? ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
What should be the authorized form of the name of an Arab writing in Hebrew, 
when the cover also has the name in Arabic? This related to the book by  עלי 
ח'ליפה . Should the Hebrew form be Romanized as Ḥ'alifah, ʻAli  ?
The Arabic would be Khalīfah, ʻAlī Ṣāliḥ
There is also a Romanized form of the name: Ali Khalefa.

Thanks,

Rachel


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[Heb-NACO] FW: [PCCLIST] Revised Report on Recording Gender in Personal Name Authority Records

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Apologies for not sharing this sooner. To the attention of our NACO catalogers 
for immediate implementation.

Best wishes and שבת שלום, Jasmin

From: Program for Cooperative Cataloging  On Behalf 
Of Jennifer W. Baxmeyer
Sent: Friday, April 15, 2022 9:07 AM
To: pccl...@listserv.loc.gov
Subject: [PCCLIST] Revised Report on Recording Gender in Personal Name 
Authority Records

Good morning!

In spring 2021, the PCC Advisory Committee on Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion 
(DEI) reconvened the Ad Hoc Task Group on Recording Gender in Name Authority 
Records to update its original 
report
 from October 2016.

It is with deep gratitude for the task group (original members Amber Billey 
(chair), Matthew Haugen, John Hostage, Nancy Sack, and Adam Schiff, plus new 
members Jay Colbert and Violeta Ilik) for their thoughtful work and patience 
that I am sharing with you that PoCo, the PCC Policy Committee, has approved 
the task group’s “Revised Report on Recording Gender in Personal Name Authority 
Records.” A link to the revised report can be found on the PCC 
website
 under “What’s New?” but for your convenience, here is a direct link to the 
report: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.loc.gov/aba/pcc/documents/gender-in-NARs-revised-report.pdf__;!!KGKeukY!wo07dwrKVaQwVO79JuJjfimS6NZYdKNtliKbw3FJiHZPmVq8VPo0dksP4tGWAniq2TCOTEem4M4vuRU31TOBUKFbZQc$
 
.

The recommendation approved by PoCo is “Do not record the RDA gender element 
(MARC 375) in personal name authority records. Delete existing 375 fields when 
editing a record for any other reason.”

As you read the revised report, you will notice that several issues raised in 
the original report have been deferred and the plan is to address these issues 
separately in a new task group charged by the PCC Advisory Committee on DEI. 
The issues to be addressed include recording of gender or gendered terms in 
other 3XX fields (including Authority 374 for occupation/profession, 
Bibliographic or Authority 385 for audience characteristics, and Bibliographic 
or Authority 386 for creator/contributor characteristics), recording of 
unstructured information about a person’s gender in Authority 6XX fields, and 
recording of deadnames in Authority 400 and supporting 6XX fields.

The charge is currently being written, and if you are interested in serving on 
this new task group, please let me know: 
b...@princeton.edu.

With kind regards,

Jennifer
--
Jennifer Baxmeyer (Jennifer, she/her)
Chair, PCC Advisory Committee on Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion
Assistant University Librarian for Metadata Services
Princeton University Library
693 Alexander Road
Princeton NJ 08540
609.258.3631
b...@princeton.edu
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://orcid.org/-0002-8074-5322__;!!KGKeukY!wo07dwrKVaQwVO79JuJjfimS6NZYdKNtliKbw3FJiHZPmVq8VPo0dksP4tGWAniq2TCOTEem4M4vuRU31TOBMb3etbg$
 

@cellobax

[signature_1547439791]

“Do the best you can until you know better. Then when you know better, do 
better.” - Maya Angelou
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[Heb-NACO] Lamda 'iyun

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello, friends,

Please note the note in the record for the above series-like phrase: “A 
division/imprint of Universiṭah ha-petuḥah. Not to be considered a series or 
quoted as a series-like phrase. Transcribe the name as publisher. Disregard the 
hierarchical name Universiṭah ha-petuḥah.” For the 15 libraries with holdings 
on the title Nashim ṿe-ziḳnah (on 1235902819), you may wish to update your 
local records.

Thanks and kol tuv, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] Romanization question (מתווה)

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

The word has been added to the romanization 
FAQ. Thanks, Rachel, for bringing it to our attention! I’ll report the needed 
BFM to LC.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Joan Biella via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 3:47 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel ; Rachel Simon 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Romanization question (מתווה)

Chiming in late, I agree that we should follow Even-Shoshan, but adding this to 
the Miss Romanization page is a good idea. —Joan On Thu, Jul 28, 2022 at 11:32 
AM Rachel Simon via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote: I asked mainly
Chiming in late, I agree that we should follow Even-Shoshan, but adding this to 
the Miss Romanization page is a good idea.  —Joan

On Thu, Jul 28, 2022 at 11:32 AM Rachel Simon via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
I asked mainly because LC had both forms. So, maybe enter it the romanization 
wiki From: Heb-naco 
mailto:princeton@lists.osu.edu>>
 On Behalf Of Barry Dov Walfish via Heb-naco Sent: ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
I asked mainly because LC had both forms. So, maybe enter it the romanization 
wiki

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:princeton@lists.osu.edu>>
 On Behalf Of Barry Dov Walfish via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 1:58 PM
To: Galron, Joseph mailto:galro...@osu.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Romanization question (מתווה)

Rav-milim (and Morfix) have mitveh. There are other examples of -eh words 
(mikreh, mikveh, mikhreh), so that's neither here nor there. My old ES also has 
mitvah. As already mentioned, mitveh seems to be more common in spoken Hebrew, 
but
Rav-milim (and Morfix) have mitveh. There are other examples of -eh words 
(mikreh, mikveh, mikhreh),
so that's neither here nor there.
My old ES also has mitvah.
As already mentioned, mitveh seems to be more common in spoken Hebrew,  but we 
need to follow our designated authorities.
Barry

On Thu, Jul 28, 2022 at 12:55 PM Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
As Roger wrote, I also know about Mitveh, but it might be wrong, and should be 
Mitvah, the same has Mehvah מחווה

Milon Ariel ha-makif, has it as Mitvah

Yossi



From: Heb-naco On Behalf Of Kohn, Roger via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 11:58 AM
To: 'Rachel Simon' mailto:rsi...@princeton.edu>>; 'Hebrew 
Name Authority Funnel' mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] To Rachel S. (PUL) re.: Romanization question (מתווה)

--- Hi Rachel, Yes, ES2000 has “mitvah”, but all what I hear on Israeli radio 
is “mitveh” … All the best, .-r. From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
---

Hi Rachel,

Yes, ES2000 has “mitvah”, but all what I hear on Israeli radio is “mitveh” …

All the best,

.-r.

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Rachel Simon via Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, July 28, 2022 9:26 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Romanization question

For מתווה : is it “mitvah” or “mitveh” ?? My ES has “mitvah”, but LC has both. 
Thanks, Rachel ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
For  מתווה  : is it “mitvah” or “mitveh” ?? My ES has “mitvah”, but LC has both.

Thanks,

Rachel
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Re: [Heb-NACO] צדפים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Agreed.

From: Robert M. TALBOTT 
Sent: Friday, October 21, 2022 11:52 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] צדפים

True, but a two word title with one word misromanized is a different story.

On Fri, Oct 21, 2022 at 8:40 AM Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
And if I emailed the list every time I corrected misromanizations, your inboxes 
would be flooded… J From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Rachel Simon via Heb-naco ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
And if I emailed the list every time I corrected misromanizations, your inboxes 
would be flooded… ☺

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:pobox.upenn@lists.osu.edu>>
 On Behalf Of Rachel Simon via Heb-naco
Sent: Friday, October 21, 2022 11:27 AM
To: Galron, Joseph mailto:galro...@osu.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] צדפים

And the romanization of דניאל should be Daniyel (not Dani’el). Rachel From: 
Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via 
Heb-naco Sent: Friday, October 21, 2022 11: 05 AM ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
And the romanization of  דניאל  should be Daniyel (not Dani’el).
Rachel
From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Friday, October 21, 2022 11:05 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] צדפים

Colleagues,
In OCLC # 1309344146 (אוסף צדפים) by Daniel Oz the correct romanization should 
be Osef tsedafim and not Osef tsadafim (see ES – plural of Tsedaf is Tsedafim)

Have a good weekend

Yossi


Yossi Galron-Goldschläger

--
יוסי גלרון-גולדשלגר
טלפון נייד 1.614.805.9954
Йозеф Галрон Гольдшлегер
Joseph (Yossi) 
Galron-Goldschläger<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Flibrary.osu.edu*2Fpeople*2Fgalron.1=05*7C01*7Crsimon*40princeton.edu*7C3620a3ee9a324fc1856c08dab3759bc1*7C2ff601167431425db5af077d7791bda4*7C0*7C0*7C638019614973261262*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C3000*7C*7C*7C=lS82bZ*2FuyQWkTzvkO6GSKNQnexSj1oTQ5vWgZ47iaus*3D=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJQ!!KGKeukY!3JoQCsfn8eUi0Le9b3nlFsQKR7p1GX_yXGhwlfvFIVOgE0se0Fdh71S969QYJ0DcJ5jocukQEW8gljGuRYdVS1H7$>
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies 
Library<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2Fclicktime.symantec.com*2F35nyXVx1aw9CrjvPVzwN5of6H2*3Fu*3Dhttp*3A*2F*2Fguides.osu.edu*2Fc.php*3Fg*3D337806*26p*3D2274681__*3BJSUlJSUlJSU!!KGKeukY!kUTYt7T7txseqvv_MbDA40Qc8GOigrxqsE-7Zi5NkfP2ikN57ei5Adhh0Mse6Etz*24=05*7C01*7Crsimon*40princeton.edu*7C3620a3ee9a324fc1856c08dab3759bc1*7C2ff601167431425db5af077d7791bda4*7C0*7C0*7C638019614973261262*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C3000*7C*7C*7C=7zEKQuAT*2F14p1Vqu*2BDGwD8XuiL*2BKNSbs28oJCZe5j2E*3D=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSoqKioqKioqJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUl!!KGKeukY!3JoQCsfn8eUi0Le9b3nlFsQKR7p1GX_yXGhwlfvFIVOgE0se0Fdh71S969QYJ0DcJ5jocukQEW8gljGuRQ02XQRv$>
and German Language and Literature Librarian
305 G Thompson Memorial Library
The Ohio State University Libraries
1858 Neil Ave. Mall
Columbus, Ohio 43210 USA
Tel.: (614) 292-3362, Fax: (614)292-1918
Mobile: (614) 805-9954
E-Mail: galro...@osu.edu<mailto:galro...@osu.edu> or 
jgal...@gmail.com<mailto:jgal...@gmail.com>

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2Fclicktime.symantec.com*2F3QFzqKM4bhoMEbRUtvt5Cwi6H2*3Fu*3Dhttp*3A*2F*2Fgo.osu.edu*2Fhebrewlit__*3BJSUlJQ!!KGKeukY!kUTYt7T7txseqvv_MbDA40Qc8GOigrxqsE-7Zi5NkfP2ikN57ei5Adhh0GlG_VHC*24=05*7C01*7Crsimon*40princeton.edu*7C3620a3ee9a324fc1856c08dab3759bc1*7C2ff601167431425db5af077d7791bda4*7C0*7C0*7C638019614973261262*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C3000*7C*7C*7C=YCNFGVGOZqn*2FdI2aIiHW6vWLcYqKmD9j75jNolDG*2BPU*3D=0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSoqKiolJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJQ!!KGKeukY!3JoQCsfn8eUi0Le9b3nlFsQKR7p1GX_yXGhwlfvFIVOgE0se0Fdh71S969QYJ0DcJ5jocukQEW8gljGuRemOvUEp$>

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2Fclicktime.symantec.com*2F3T7oGBhra4qxPxXMeh5okCG6H2*3Fu*3Dhttp*3A*2F*2Fgo.osu.edu*2Fjpress__*3BJSUlJQ!!KGKeukY!kUTYt7T7txseqvv_MbDA40Qc8GOigrxqsE-7Zi5NkfP2ikN57ei5Adhh0OJa_eeX*24=05*7C01*7Crsimon*40princeton.edu*7C3620a3ee9a324fc1856c08dab3759bc1*7C2ff601167431425db5af077d7791bda4*7C0*7C0*7C638019614973261262*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAw

Re: [Heb-NACO] צדפים

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

And if I emailed the list every time I corrected misromanizations, your inboxes 
would be flooded… ☺

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Rachel Simon via Heb-naco
Sent: Friday, October 21, 2022 11:27 AM
To: Galron, Joseph ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] צדפים

And the romanization of דניאל should be Daniyel (not Dani’el). Rachel From: 
Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via 
Heb-naco Sent: Friday, October 21, 2022 11: 05 AM ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ 
‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍ ‍
And the romanization of  דניאל  should be Daniyel (not Dani’el).
Rachel
From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Galron, Joseph via Heb-naco
Sent: Friday, October 21, 2022 11:05 AM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] צדפים

Colleagues,
In OCLC # 1309344146 (אוסף צדפים) by Daniel Oz the correct romanization should 
be Osef tsedafim and not Osef tsadafim (see ES – plural of Tsedaf is Tsedafim)

Have a good weekend

Yossi


Yossi Galron-Goldschläger

--
יוסי גלרון-גולדשלגר
טלפון נייד 1.614.805.9954
Йозеф Галрон Гольдшлегер
Joseph (Yossi) 
Galron-Goldschläger
Head, Hebraica & Jewish Studies 
Library
and German Language and Literature Librarian
305 G Thompson Memorial Library
The Ohio State University Libraries
1858 Neil Ave. Mall
Columbus, Ohio 43210 USA
Tel.: (614) 292-3362, Fax: (614)292-1918
Mobile: (614) 805-9954
E-Mail: galro...@osu.edu or 
jgal...@gmail.com

Lexicon of Modern Hebrew Literature:
http://go.osu.edu/hebrewlit

Union List of Digitized Jewish Historic Newspapers and Periodicals
http://go.osu.edu/jpress

OSU Libraries Historic Jewish Pamphlets Collection
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://archive.org/details/osulhjpc__;!!KGKeukY!z8fP7Zslk7Gbqm5PaR6RiwOcJ96YCpZyMWM2mwVrtsn16nRCckSk-HfhbwvvfWuy5-C5FVDRNAEmEZzYMZyDkW95l3g$
  

[Heb-NACO] FW: PCC Statistics deadline: October 15, 2022

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Dear funnel members, please let me know if you have any question regarding 
submitting your statistics for this past (LC fiscal) year.

Thanks, Jasmin

From: BIBCO Cataloging Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Phillips, Amy
Sent: Monday, October 3, 2022 10:07 AM
To: bi...@listserv.loc.gov
Subject: [BIBCO] PCC Statistics deadline: October 15, 2022

Dear BIBCO members responsible for maintaining your institution's statistics:

This message is a reminder that October 15, 2022 is the deadline for entering 
your statistics in the PCC Directory for the second half of FY2022. These 
statistics represent your NACO, BIBCO, CONSER, and/or SACO contributions from 
April 2022 through September 2022. Also, if anyone has not yet entered their 
statistics for the first half of the fiscal year (October 2021 through March 
2022), it isn't too late to do so.

Guidelines for entering statistics can be found on the "Statistics" section of 
this page: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.loc.gov/aba/pcc/pccd/index.html__;!!KGKeukY!1sz6Nge1v5bvzpk88acFIf51bN3gZxG4uM9juv_cgBFDG85kJ8YPBaxLu3Fzw77UO68Sraw9FRc2EE5U8_ejvdXhJoc$
  


After the October 15th deadline, we will use the PCC Directory to generate the 
FY2022 statistical report and post it to this page: 
https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.loc.gov/aba/pcc/stats.html__;!!KGKeukY!1sz6Nge1v5bvzpk88acFIf51bN3gZxG4uM9juv_cgBFDG85kJ8YPBaxLu3Fzw77UO68Sraw9FRc2EE5U8_ejlexVbnQ$
  


All the best,


Amy Phillips (she/her)
Cataloging Policy Specialist
Policy, Training, and Cooperative Programs
Library of Congress


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[Heb-NACO] Kahana, Barukh =/= Kahane, Baruch

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hello, all.

For the 20 other libraries with holdings on lccn 2020454171/on 1225897291 (Orot 
ha-adam ṿeha-nefesh), please note that the author,
Barukh Kahana, is established as Kahana, Barukh, not as was previously given, 
Kahane, Baruch. You may wish to update your local records.

Thanks and best wishes, Jasmin


---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] A question on Sacred works

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

We never did (yet) get around to compiling an official list of what’s included 
in the term “sacred works”, did we? To the best of my recollection, it includes 
only Scripture, i.e., for Judaism, the Oral and Written Law. It does not 
include liturgy or other religious works. Last summer Ahava did send a list 
used at NLI, but NLI is not bound to following LC/PCC policies or US library 
standards and, as such, that list includes liturgical works.

The SHM at H1188, Sacred Works, has the following instructions:
“TYPES OF HEADINGS COVERED BY THE PATTERN : Headings for the uniform titles of 
individual sacred works or scriptures from all religions, including their 
individual parts. Also included are uniform titles for apocryphal works. 
Examples:   Book of Mormon ; Qur'an ; Talmud ; Tripitaka ; Vedas ; Bible. 
Wisdom   of Solomon ; Bible. Gospels ; Sermon on the mount ; Beatitudes ; 
Epistle of Barnabas . The category does not include headings for individual 
non-sacred liturgical or theological works, nor form headings for collections 
of sacred or religious works. For subdivisions used under the uniform titles of 
secular classics, see H 
1155.8.
(highlights added)

This is contrasted with Religious Works, which are addressed in SHM H1185, 
Religions. E.g., Siddur/Maḥzor/Haggadah all get the subject heading: Judaism 
|x Liturgy |v Texts (with added subjects to specify the liturgical work 
described).

RDA 6.30.1.1, Authorized Access Point Representing a Religious Work, 
differentiates between 3 types of works: sacred scriptures; theological 
creeds/confessions of faith, etc.; and liturgical works. It then adds, “For 
other types of religious works, construct the authorized access point by 
applying the general guidelines and instructions at 
6.27.1”, Authorized Access Point Representing a Work.

RDA 6.30.1.2 specifies that sacred scriptures include “…a work that is accepted 
as sacred scripture by a religious group.” Examples there include the Book of 
Mormon, Qur’an, and Ādi-Granth [Sikh sacred scripture].

To your question, Kabbalah texts do not fall under sacred scripture. This is 
based on the above instructions (and is not a personal opinion that requires 
deliberation by the Cataloging Committee; of course, clarifications by the 
committee are always welcome ☺). Please follow the instructions at 6.27.1 and 
do not apply subject subdivisions that are specific to sacred scriptures (i.e., 
Introductions; Criticism, interpretation, etc.; etc.).

I see that 9 LC records use Cabala—Introductions, but these are invalid per 
LCSH. I’ll send a separate email for BFM. The correct subjects are just Cabala 
and/or Cabala |x History. See examples at LCCN 2021039069 and 2004300639. The 
two works cited in the 670s for the Cabala subject heading are at LCCN 75012820 
(Kabbalah and criticism, with Cabala |x History) and at OCLC # 16426918 (An 
introduction to the study of the kabbalah, with just Cabala).

Hope this helps. Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Heidi G Lerner via 
Heb-naco
Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2023 1:30 PM
To: Gottschalk, Haim ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] A question on Sacred works

Hi Haim, The definition for religious iwork" in the updated RDA Toolkit is a 
much looser definition than in the first iteration: " Religious work A work 
that is held sacred by a religion and its followers, or a work that has a direct
Hi Haim,
The definition for religious iwork" in the updated RDA Toolkit is a much looser 
definition than in the first iteration:

"
Religious work

A work that is held sacred by a religion and its followers, or a work that has 
a direct association with a sacred work.

See also:  liturgical work"



Original Toolkit



See A.17.8

Old Testament


Five Scrolls

Historical Books

Minor Prophets

etc.

My sense is that ultimately it will depend onwhich version of RDA you are 
currently utilizing. I would speculate that after the complete adoption of the 
new edition that the decision of what is included will depend on individual 
religious communities to develop best practices If we go by EJ they consider 
Kaballah as  emodying "mysticism and esoterica. "As such, I would not consider 
it a "sacred work" even under the new version of the Toolkit. But that is just 
my opinion, this should ultimate be discussed and decided up on by the AJL RAS 
Cataloging Commitee.

Thanks, Heidi














Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica 

Re: [Heb-NACO] Online Ladino reference resources?

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thank you, Lili, for posing your question, and to Gabe Mordoch, for sharing 
your wonderful 
libguide on Ladino.

With Gabe’s permission, the libguide has been added to our 
wiki (under General resources --> External resources).

Best wishes for a חנוכה שמח and happy, healthy holidays to all, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Heidi G Lerner via 
Heb-naco
Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2022 7:38 PM
To: Lili Brown ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Online Ladino reference resources?

Hi Lili, That is a good question with a less than satisfactory answer. 
Unfortunately Ladino does not have a standard orthography and lacks a single 
authoritative or normative dictionary to be employed for the romanization of 
Ladino. For words
Hi Lili,

That is a good question with a less than satisfactory answer. Unfortunately 
Ladino does not have a standard orthography and lacks a single authoritative or 
normative dictionary to be employed for the romanization of Ladino.

For words of Hebrew/Aramaic derivation, as per the ALA/LC table we generally 
romanize them according to the ALA/LC table for Hebrew.

I don't remember if I ever came across a word that was taken from Turkish or 
Arabic. Certainly for those I would consult with Asuman and Magda.

I strongly encourage you to read the article by Zachary Baker "Some Problems of 
Ladino/Judezmo Romanization) that appeared in Judaica Librarianship v. 9, 
v.1/2, p. 48

The best recommendation is for words emanating from the Spanish, use a good 
standard Spanish dictdionary. In the above-mentioned article Zachary offers 
some for other resoureces on help with romanization (Baker, p. 53-54). SUL 
should have these and I would encourage you to check them out or order if 
available.

My best wishes for a lovely time off and Happy Hanukah!!!
Sincerely, Heidi


Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica Emerita, Stanford University 
Libraries




From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-bounces+lerner=stanford@lists.osu.edu>>
 on behalf of Lili Brown via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2022 3:04 PM
To: heb-naco@lists.osu.edu 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Online Ladino reference resources?

Hi all, I’m new to the world of Hebraica cataloging (started at Stanford in 
September!) and am curious if folks have any recommendations for online 
reference resources that they use when romanizing Ladino. I’m working on 
ordering

Hi all,



I’m new to the world of Hebraica cataloging (started at Stanford in September!) 
and am curious if folks have any recommendations for online reference resources 
that they use when romanizing Ladino. I’m working on ordering the physical 
dictionaries that the ALA/LC romanization chart lists, but I’m hoping that 
there is an online tool I can access in the meantime.



Thanks in advance for your time and suggestions!



Best,

Lili



Lili Brown (she/her)

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica

Metadata Services

[cid:image002.png@01D91479.C67EB010]




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[Heb-NACO] title BFM: לפני המבול

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, for those with holdings on the above title, oclc # 1225897261, please note 
that the first word is romanized Li-fene (not lifne).

Kol tuv, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] help with vocalizing, meaning of Aramaic word

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Miriam, I don’t think that איכרא is the same as איכרסא. Like Heidi, I don’t see 
it in Jastrow. I do have in (Barukh) Karu an entry for irkhas, meaning lost.

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Miriam Gloger via Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2022 4:51 PM
To: Heidi G Lerner ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] help with vocalizing, meaning of Aramaic word

Ketuba de- ikarsa a replacement ketuba for one that was lost or stolen page 48 
Jastrow איכרא On Tue, Dec 20, 2022 at 4: 37 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco 
 wrote: Hi, I am cataloging a document related to 
ketubot
Ketuba de- ikarsa
a replacement ketuba for one that was lost or stolen

page 48 Jastrow

איכרא

On Tue, Dec 20, 2022 at 4:37 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi, I am cataloging a document related to ketubot and within is a word 
(Aramaic?) "דאירכסא". I have tried to locate a vocalized form of the word via 
Sefaria, checked Jastrow for meaning/vocalization and I cannot find anything to 
clarify. 
Hi,

I am cataloging a document related to ketubot and within is a word (Aramaic?)

"דאירכסא".

I have tried to locate a vocalized form of the word via Sefaria, checked 
Jastrow for meaning/vocalization
and I cannot find anything to clarify.

Any help on transcription and meaning, as well as the root of the word will be 
greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance,

Heidi Lerner



Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica Emerita, Stanford University 
Libraries


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--
Miriam Gloger
Senior Librarian
Cataloging Metadata Team
BookOps

New York Public Library &
Brooklyn Public Library
31-11 Thomson Avenue, Long Island City, NY 11101
(917) 229-9575

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Re: [Heb-NACO] help with vocalizing, meaning of Aramaic word

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Agree with Barry.

Looking at E-Sh under the root רכס, the third option gives the Aramaic 
אִירְכַּס, irkas, and shows it in the nif‘al form as נִירְכְּסָא, nirkesa. So I 
think the form you’re looking for, Heidi, is ketubah de-irkesa (created to 
replace a lost ketubah).

--Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Barry Dov Walfish 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2022 4:55 PM
To: Heidi G Lerner ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] help with vocalizing, meaning of Aramaic word

I would say ketubah de-irkesa, which seems to mean a ketubah that was lost. See 
Tur, Even ha-ezer, 66. Barry On Tue, Dec 20, 2022 at 11: 37 PM Heidi G Lerner 
via Heb-naco  wrote: Hi, I am cataloging a document 
related
I would say ketubah de-irkesa, which seems to mean a ketubah that was lost. See 
Tur, Even ha-ezer, 66.
Barry

On Tue, Dec 20, 2022 at 11:37 PM Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>> wrote:
Hi, I am cataloging a document related to ketubot and within is a word 
(Aramaic?) "דאירכסא". I have tried to locate a vocalized form of the word via 
Sefaria, checked Jastrow for meaning/vocalization and I cannot find anything to 
clarify. 
Hi,

I am cataloging a document related to ketubot and within is a word (Aramaic?)

"דאירכסא".

I have tried to locate a vocalized form of the word via Sefaria, checked 
Jastrow for meaning/vocalization
and I cannot find anything to clarify.

Any help on transcription and meaning, as well as the root of the word will be 
greatly appreciated.

Thank you in advance,

Heidi Lerner



Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica Emerita, Stanford University 
Libraries


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[Heb-NACO] Gan Eden trees per LSCH

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

There were two trees in Eden, the Tree of Knowledge (of Good and Evil) and the 
Tree of Life. Anybody know why LCSH conflates the two?

150  Tree of life
450  Knowledge, Tree of
450  Life, Tree of
450  Tree of knowledge
550  ǂw g ǂa Christian art and symbolism
550  ǂw g ǂa Eden
550  ǂw g ǂa Immortality
550  ǂw g ǂa Paradise

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] Gan Eden trees per LSCH

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Thanks, Haim.

If you need an LC title to justify your inquiry, see lccn 00439237, ʻEts 
ha-daʻat : ṭov o raʻ?, clearly about the Tree of knowledge but given the 
subject heading Tree of life.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Gottschalk, Haim 
Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2022 11:54 AM
To: Shinohara, Jasmin ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 

Subject: RE: Gan Eden trees per LSCH

The database only dates back to 1999. I’ll check later to see what is the story 
and see how this subject heading with the 450 came to be.

Haim

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-bounces+hgot=loc@lists.osu.edu>>
 On Behalf Of Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, December 20, 2022 7:11 PM
To: Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Gan Eden trees per LSCH

There were two trees in Eden, the Tree of Knowledge (of Good and Evil) and the 
Tree of Life. Anybody know why LCSH conflates the two? 150 Tree of life 450 
Knowledge, Tree of 450 Life, Tree of 450 Tree of knowledge 550 ǂw g ǂa 
Christian art
There were two trees in Eden, the Tree of Knowledge (of Good and Evil) and the 
Tree of Life. Anybody know why LCSH conflates the two?

150  Tree of life
450  Knowledge, Tree of
450  Life, Tree of
450  Tree of knowledge
550  ǂw g ǂa Christian art and symbolism
550  ǂw g ǂa Eden
550  ǂw g ǂa Immortality
550  ǂw g ǂa Paradise

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu<mailto:jsh...@upenn.edu>
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] Date Status (DtSt) and Dates in the fixed field

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, Cliff,

Your thought about probability is interesting. Nevertheless, our documented 
practice has been to use the earlier of the two possible dates for both the 
call no. date and fixed field date. Please see the Classification and 
Shelflisting Manual, G140 
(Dates), where a list of examples is given:

2012
use 2012
MMX
use 2010
[2011]
use 2011
[2008?]
use 2008
[1995 or 1996]
use 1995
1980-2013
use 1980
MMI-MMII
use 2001
MCMXCI-2010
use 1991
1980-[2013]
use 1980
[1965]-2005
use 1965
[1965-2005]
use 1965
[not before March 1, 1800]
use 1800
[not after April 23, 1700]
use 1700
[between May 1,1801 and May 2, 1805]
use 1801
[between 1700 and 1799]
use 1700z [if corporate body, use 1700]
[between 1700 and 1799?]
use 1700z [if corporate body, use 1700]
[between 1990 and 1999]
use 1990z [if corporate body, use 1990]
[between 1990 and 1999?]
use 1990z [if corporate body, use 1990]
[between 1950 and 2012?]
use 1950z [if corporate body, use 1950]

For fixed field dates, per my email from yesterday, please see example in BFAS 
on 
DtSt.

Probability notwithstanding, a unified, consistent practice serves our users 
better. Please let me know if there are further questions.

Thanks and kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Cliff Miller via 
Heb-naco
Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2022 10:20 AM
To: Gottschalk, Haim ; Hebrew Name Authority Funnel 
; Miller, Caroline 
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Date Status (DtSt) and Dates in the fixed field

Dear Colleagues, I'm working remotely so I cannot check any references at my 
Seminary Library desk. As I recall the single date "s" is to be used when the 
date is certain or probable. 5783 might be any of 9 months of 2023
Dear Colleagues,
I'm working remotely so I cannot check any references at my Seminary Library 
desk.
As I recall the single date "s" is to be used when the date is certain or 
probable.
5783 might be any of 9 months of 2023 or any of 3 months of 2022.
When the odds are 3 to 1 of the later date, I think we are justified in using 
the later date and not both years as questionable.
Is not 9 months out of 12 a high probability?
Thank you.
Clifford Miller, speaking for myself and not for
Library of the Jewish Theological Seminary

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-bounces+clmiller=jtsa@lists.osu.edu>>
 On Behalf Of Gottschalk, Haim via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2022 5:25 PM
To: Miller, Caroline 
mailto:crmil...@library.ucla.edu>>; Hebrew Name 
Authority Funnel mailto:heb-naco@lists.osu.edu>>
Subject: Re: [Heb-NACO] Date Status (DtSt) and Dates in the fixed field


CAUTION: This email originated from outside JTSA. Do not click links or open 
attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is safe.
Hi Caroline, Haim here. What I do is use the first date as THE date with the 
DtSt: s. Granted we don't know fully if the date is 2012 or 2013, but this is 
the practice we do. The questionable date is when there is no date whatsoever in
Hi Caroline,

Haim here.

What I do is use the first date as THE date with the DtSt: s. Granted we don't 
know fully if the date is 2012 or 2013, but this is the practice we do. The 
questionable date is when there is no date whatsoever in the book and we have 
to surmise when it was published. I do use a detailed date (DtSt: e) when I 
have the month available, such as erev Rosh Hodesh Nisan, plus year.

I hope that this helps

Haim
Expressing my views. Ideas & opinions in this email are not intended to 
represent those of the Library of Congress or its staff.

From: Heb-naco 
mailto:heb-naco-boun...@lists.osu.edu>> On 
Behalf Of Miller, Caroline via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2022 4:49 PM
To: HEB-NACO List Posting 
(heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu) 
mailto:heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu>>
Subject: [Heb-NACO] Date Status (DtSt) and Dates in the fixed field

All, This may sound like a newbie question but I have never seen an official 
policy on coding the date status for materials that only have a Hebrew date. 
It's clear in RDA and the PS's how to transcribe the date in the 264. Example
All,

This may sound like a newbie question but I have never seen an official policy 
on coding the date status for materials that only have a Hebrew date.  It's 
clear in RDA and the PS's how to transcribe the date in the 264.   Example from 
the book I'm cataloging:

673 [1912 or 1913]

I have seen this coded in the fixed field as:

DtSt: s  Dates 1912 ,

DtSt: q  Dates 1912 ,   1913

Is there an official policy on MARC coding for these fixed fields?  I've done a 
little hunting on Heb-NACO and 

Re: [Heb-NACO] Date Status (DtSt) and Dates in the fixed field

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, Caroline, thank you for asking!

There may be other sources of documentation, but the first one I could find is 
found in Bib Formats and Standards (BFAS), under DtSt, Type of Date/Publication 
Status. There, included as the last of the examples for the code s, is the example
DtSt

s
Dates


1983,[blank character][blank character][blank character][blank character]
264
_
1
Yerushalayim : ǂb E. Fisher, ǂc 744 [1983 or 1984]
[Non-Gregorian dates with no single Gregorian equivalent]

Thus, records with DtSt code q and the two years in Date 1 and Date 2 are 
incorrectly coded.

I’ll let you know if I find other documentation for this practice. In the 
meantime, hope this helps.

Kol tuv, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On Behalf Of Miller, Caroline 
via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2022 4:49 PM
To: HEB-NACO List Posting (heb-n...@lists.acs.ohio-state.edu) 

Subject: [Heb-NACO] Date Status (DtSt) and Dates in the fixed field

All, This may sound like a newbie question but I have never seen an official 
policy on coding the date status for materials that only have a Hebrew date. 
It’s clear in RDA and the PS’s how to transcribe the date in the 264. Example
All,

This may sound like a newbie question but I have never seen an official policy 
on coding the date status for materials that only have a Hebrew date.  It’s 
clear in RDA and the PS’s how to transcribe the date in the 264.   Example from 
the book I’m cataloging:

673 [1912 or 1913]

I have seen this coded in the fixed field as:

DtSt: s  Dates 1912 ,

DtSt: q  Dates 1912 ,   1913

Is there an official policy on MARC coding for these fixed fields?  I’ve done a 
little hunting on Heb-NACO and couldn’t find any official guidance.

Thanks.

Caroline

Caroline R. Miller
Team Leader, Discovery Team
UCLA Library Resource Acquisitions and Metadata Services
2400 Life Sciences Building
621 Charles E Young Drive South
Box 957230
Los Angeles, CA  90095-7230



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[Heb-NACO] title proper romanization correction fyi

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Hi, for the 18 libraries with holdings on the Dov Schwartz title מרוממות לחרדה 
(on1199311102), please note that the title proper is correctly romanized 
Me-romemut la-ḥaradah and not Mi-romemut le-ḥaradah.

Please let me know if there are any questions.

Thanks, Jasmin

---
Jasmin Shinohara
Hebraica Cataloging Librarian
University of Pennsylvania
131 Van Pelt-Dietrich Library Center
3420 Walnut Street
Philadelphia, PA 19104-6206
T. 215-746-6397
jsh...@upenn.edu
Coordinator, Hebraica BIBCO, NACO, & SACO Funnels

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Re: [Heb-NACO] ALA/LC romanization(?) for Aramic as used in Babylonian Talmud, Talmud Yerushalmi, midrashitc texts

[Shinohara, Jasmin via Heb-naco]

Excellent question, Heidi! I know of no codified Aramaic romanization table. I, 
too, have applied the Hebrew standards for Aramaic terms as needed. The 
question is whether or not there is sufficient justification to consider 
Aramaic its own discrete language requiring its own standard. I'm not sure 
there is, but perhaps others think otherwise?

As to the list of resources you list below, I'd shy away from Sefaria as a 
romanization reference source simply because, as an open-source resource, I 
don't know how reliable/stable the vocalizations found there might be.

Thanks for bringing this up, Jasmin

From: Heb-naco  On 
Behalf Of Heidi G Lerner via Heb-naco
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2022 12:14 PM
To: heb-naco@lists.osu.edu
Subject: [Heb-NACO] ALA/LC romanization(?) for Aramic as used in Babylonian 
Talmud, Talmud Yerushalmi, midrashitc texts

Dear safranim, Is it possible that in our years of developing romanization 
schemata for several Jewish languages written in Hebrew script we have not 
codified any guidelines for Aramaic used in talmudic and 
midrashic/aggadic/cabalistic texts?
Dear safranim,

Is it possible that in our years of developing romanization schemata for 
several Jewish languages written in Hebrew script we have not codified any 
guidelines for Aramaic used in talmudic and midrashic/aggadic/cabalistic  texts?

Up until now my practice has been to follow the ALA/LC table for Hebrew. If I 
don't find a particular Aramaic word in  Even-Shoshan or Alkalay, i turn to 
Jastrow,  Sefaria, Comprehensive Aramaic Lexicon (covers all dialects).

What have the rest of you been doing? Should a preferred  method be codified?

I look forward to learning your practices have been.

Best, Heidi




Heidi G. Lerner

Metadata Librarian for Hebraica and Judaica Emerita, Stanford University 
Libraries


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