Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[scott.tho...@sparkpa.org]

Kathy,
   Thank you. I took your advice and posted, to the best of my ability, a 
description of how we think Holdings View should work. It can be found here: 
https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1715697 I hope everyone who values 
this feature looks at it and comments.

Scott

From: Open-ils-general 
[mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] On Behalf Of Kathy 
Lussier
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 11:45 AM
To: open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org
Subject: Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

Regarding Holdings View, we can describe how we want it to work. (One of our 
libraries provided excellent screen shots.) Do I share that here or LP both?
I would put it on the Launchpad bug. However, whenever I add something to LP 
that I believe needs broader end-user feedback, I usually post a message to a 
list to let people know since they may not be following that particular LP bug.
Regarding IRC, I am not shy about my opinions on that. I have to use it for EOB 
meetings, but find it to be arcane to the uninitiated. Also, it is simply not 
the way people in libraries communicate.
Please note that the one tiny reference to IRC in an email was not a way to 
push people to IRC who don't want to go there. It was just one of many options 
I cited for discussing problematic bugs. People should use the communication 
venue that works best for them. For many in the community, librarian and 
developer alike (FWIW, I am a librarian), that's IRC, but we're all on the list 
too and are listening to the concerns and ideas raised here. My main concern, 
for tracking purposes, is that any discussions happening here or in IRC about a 
particular bug eventually get linked from the bug in the question. Otherwise, 
it's too easy to lose the different threads of that discussion.

Kathy

On 03/30/2018 11:26 AM, 
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org<mailto:scott.tho...@sparkpa.org> wrote:
Hi Kathy,
   Your points about “positive advocacy” are well-stated and well-taken, but 
advocacy is what we are doing with Congress as we try to get IMLS money 
restored for FY2019. We who live in the non-developer neighborhood of the 
Evergreen community have more power than that, and, yes, it does involve 
sponsoring development or bug-fixing projects.
   I also agree on the need for very good communication between those of us who 
want a feature, but are not developers, and those who have the skills to do the 
work. It is almost like I’m the patron and the developer is the reference 
librarian, and I am probably in need of a good reference interview. Regarding 
Holdings View, we can describe how we want it to work. (One of our libraries 
provided excellent screen shots.) Do I share that here or LP both? Regarding 
IRC, I am not shy about my opinions on that. I have to use it for EOB meetings, 
but find it to be arcane to the uninitiated. Also, it is simply not the way 
people in libraries communicate.
   I’ve been involved with Evergreen, us a user and then as a consortium 
leader, since 2015, and these recent discussion have been incredibly 
illuminating. I feel privileged to be a part of this community.

Scott


From: Open-ils-general 
[mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] On Behalf Of Kathy 
Lussier
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 10:46 AM
To: 
open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org<mailto:open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org>
Subject: Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client


Hi,

In regards to this question:
What can we do to get this fixed in 3.2 if not sooner?
And the responses thus far:

1. Fix it yourself.

2. Hire someone else to fix it.

3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.

#4: work together to get it fixed (i.e. funding through development 
partnerships)
I also would like to talk about the role of positive advocacy in getting 
attention on particular bugs, which may not guarantee that they get fixed, but 
certainly could draw enough developer attention towards the bug to result in it 
getting fixed. I guess this is really another spin on Jason's solution #3 - 
wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.

What exactly is positive advocacy? It's raising discussion on the lists, just 
as we did here, to ask about a bug and to see if it also has an impact on other 
Evergreen sites. It involves participating in LP discussions or raising 
questions in IRC. It not only involves discussing why the bug is important, but 
contributing to discussions on the best approach to fix it. In the case of this 
particular bug, for example, there was discussion of adding a "show empty 
libraries" option and a question of whether it should replace the "show empty 
volumes" option or not. Getting feedback on questions like this is very 
helpful. If a developer decides to take on the bug, it will give them a clear 
direction for moving forward. Positive advocacy also includes committing to 
test a fix when it is available.

On

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Diane Disbro]

Good morning -

I like this discussion. The example of a reference interview is a good one.
Sometimes I don't even know the question that needs to be asked. I look
forward to attending this session Tuesday at the conference and learning
how to have positive input in correcting problems.




Diane Disbro
Branch Manager/Circulation Coordinator
Union Branch
Scenic Regional Library
308 Hawthorne Drive
Union, MO 63084
(636) 583-3224
ddis...@scenicregional.org

On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 10:26 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org <
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org> wrote:

> Hi Kathy,
>
>Your points about “positive advocacy” are well-stated and well-taken,
> but advocacy is what we are doing with Congress as we try to get IMLS money
> restored for FY2019. We who live in the non-developer neighborhood of the
> Evergreen community have more power than that, and, yes, it does involve
> sponsoring development or bug-fixing projects.
>
>I also agree on the need for very good communication between those of
> us who want a feature, but are not developers, and those who have the
> skills to do the work. It is almost like I’m the patron and the developer
> is the reference librarian, and I am probably in need of a good reference
> interview. Regarding Holdings View, we can describe how we want it to work.
> (One of our libraries provided excellent screen shots.) Do I share that
> here or LP both? Regarding IRC, I am not shy about my opinions on that. I
> have to use it for EOB meetings, but find it to be arcane to the
> uninitiated. Also, it is simply not the way people in libraries
> communicate.
>
>I’ve been involved with Evergreen, us a user and then as a consortium
> leader, since 2015, and these recent discussion have been incredibly
> illuminating. I feel privileged to be a part of this community.
>
>
> Scott
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Open-ils-general [mailto:open-ils-general-
> boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] *On Behalf Of *Kathy Lussier
> *Sent:* Friday, March 30, 2018 10:46 AM
> *To:* open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org
> *Subject:* Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client
>
>
>
> Hi,
>
> In regards to this question:
>
> What can we do to get this fixed in 3.2 if not sooner?
>
> And the responses thus far:
>
> 1. Fix it yourself.
>
> 2. Hire someone else to fix it.
>
> 3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.
>
> #4: work together to get it fixed (i.e. funding through development 
> partnerships)
>
> I also would like to talk about the role of positive advocacy in getting
> attention on particular bugs, which may not guarantee that they get fixed,
> but certainly could draw enough developer attention towards the bug to
> result in it getting fixed. I guess this is really another spin on Jason's
> solution #3 - wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.
>
> What exactly is positive advocacy? It's raising discussion on the lists,
> just as we did here, to ask about a bug and to see if it also has an impact
> on other Evergreen sites. It involves participating in LP discussions or
> raising questions in IRC. It not only involves discussing why the bug is
> important, but contributing to discussions on the best approach to fix it.
> In the case of this particular bug, for example, there was discussion of
> adding a "show empty libraries" option and a question of whether it should
> replace the "show empty volumes" option or not. Getting feedback on
> questions like this is very helpful. If a developer decides to take on the
> bug, it will give them a clear direction for moving forward. Positive
> advocacy also includes committing to test a fix when it is available.
>
> On a related side note, that Sandbox request form we use for Bug Squashing
> Day is never turned off. If you ever want to test a bug fix when it's not
> Bug Squashing Day, feel free to submit it or contact me directly. If I have
> the a server and the time, I'm happy to load fixes so that people can help
> with getting that bug fix merged to Evergreen. It's available at
> https://goo.gl/forms/PE4fYfWDh5AixYpy2
>
> I use the word 'positive' because I do think there is a thin line between
> advocating that *we* as a community work together to fix a bug and
> treating the community as a *they *that should be fixing a given bug or
> introducing a new feature. FWIW, I am not saying that Scott was doing this
> when he raised his question. Given the amount of sponsored development that
> has come for both enhancements and bug fixes from PaILS, it's clear that he
> already recognizes his organization's role in contributing to the
> improvement of Evergreen. In general, though, I have seen this sentiment in
> other disc

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Kathy Lussier]

Regarding Holdings View, we can describe how we want it to work. (One 
of our libraries provided excellent screen shots.) Do I share that 
here or LP both?
I would put it on the Launchpad bug. However, whenever I add something 
to LP that I believe needs broader end-user feedback, I usually post a 
message to a list to let people know since they may not be following 
that particular LP bug.


Regarding IRC, I am not shy about my opinions on that. I have to use 
it for EOB meetings, but find it to be arcane to the uninitiated. 
Also, it is simply not the way people in libraries communicate. 
Please note that the one tiny reference to IRC in an email was not a way 
to push people to IRC who don't want to go there. It was just one of 
many options I cited for discussing problematic bugs. People should use 
the communication venue that works best for them. For many in the 
community, librarian and developer alike (FWIW, I am a librarian), 
that's IRC, but we're all on the list too and are listening to the 
concerns and ideas raised here. My main concern, for tracking purposes, 
is that any discussions happening here or in IRC about a particular bug 
eventually get linked from the bug in the question. Otherwise, it's too 
easy to lose the different threads of that discussion.


Kathy


On 03/30/2018 11:26 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org wrote:


Hi Kathy,

Your points about “positive advocacy” are well-stated and well-taken, 
but advocacy is what we are doing with Congress as we try to get IMLS 
money restored for FY2019. We who live in the non-developer 
neighborhood of the Evergreen community have more power than that, 
and, yes, it does involve sponsoring development or bug-fixing projects.


I also agree on the need for very good communication between those of 
us who want a feature, but are not developers, and those who have the 
skills to do the work. It is almost like I’m the patron and the 
developer is the reference librarian, and I am probably in need of a 
good reference interview. Regarding Holdings View, we can describe how 
we want it to work. (One of our libraries provided excellent screen 
shots.) Do I share that here or LP both? Regarding IRC, I am not shy 
about my opinions on that. I have to use it for EOB meetings, but find 
it to be arcane to the uninitiated. Also, it is simply not the way 
people in libraries communicate.


   I’ve been involved with Evergreen, us a user and then as a 
consortium leader, since 2015, and these recent discussion have been 
incredibly illuminating. I feel privileged to be a part of this community.



Scott

*From:*Open-ils-general 
[mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] *On Behalf 
Of *Kathy Lussier

*Sent:* Friday, March 30, 2018 10:46 AM
*To:* open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org
*Subject:* Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

Hi,

In regards to this question:

What can we do to get this fixed in 3.2 if not sooner?

And the responses thus far:

1. Fix it yourself.

2. Hire someone else to fix it.

3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.

#4: work together to get it fixed (i.e. funding through development 
partnerships)

I also would like to talk about the role of positive advocacy in 
getting attention on particular bugs, which may not guarantee that 
they get fixed, but certainly could draw enough developer attention 
towards the bug to result in it getting fixed. I guess this is really 
another spin on Jason's solution #3 - wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.


What exactly is positive advocacy? It's raising discussion on the 
lists, just as we did here, to ask about a bug and to see if it also 
has an impact on other Evergreen sites. It involves participating in 
LP discussions or raising questions in IRC. It not only involves 
discussing why the bug is important, but contributing to discussions 
on the best approach to fix it. In the case of this particular bug, 
for example, there was discussion of adding a "show empty libraries" 
option and a question of whether it should replace the "show empty 
volumes" option or not. Getting feedback on questions like this is 
very helpful. If a developer decides to take on the bug, it will give 
them a clear direction for moving forward. Positive advocacy also 
includes committing to test a fix when it is available.


On a related side note, that Sandbox request form we use for Bug 
Squashing Day is never turned off. If you ever want to test a bug fix 
when it's not Bug Squashing Day, feel free to submit it or contact me 
directly. If I have the a server and the time, I'm happy to load fixes 
so that people can help with getting that bug fix merged to Evergreen. 
It's available at https://goo.gl/forms/PE4fYfWDh5AixYpy2


I use the word 'positive' because I do think there is a thin line 
between advocating that *we* as a community work together to fix a bug 
and treating the co

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Terran McCanna]

ble of fixing it.
>
> Does the developer believe it will also affect the people in their own
> organization? In organizations that have a developer, the positive advocacy
> may be the thing that brings it to the attention of some cataloger or circ
> person who then communicates to their developer that it is indeed a
> critical issue. If the problem is related to serials and the developer
> works at a library that doesn't use serials, they are less likely to work
> on it.
>
> Think of it in terms of volunteering that you may do in your own home
> communities. If somebody asks you to bake something for a bake sale to
> raise funds for a cause you believe in, you may quickly say yes without a
> thought. If they ask you to organize the bake sale, the answer may depend
> on whether you have time or on how strongly you feel about the cause. If
> you don't care about the cause at all (i.e. you can't understand why anyone
> would ever want Evergreen to work that way), you may never say yes no
> matter how much time you have. If the fundraiser is actually a capital
> campaign project for a new library, it doesn't matter how many people feel
> strongly about the issue, you may still need to hire a professional
> fundraiser to organize the campaign for you.
>
> No matter how much positive advocacy I personally do for specific bugs, in
> the end, I know if the MassLNC organizations feel strongly about a bug fix
> or feature, we need to be prepared to fund it or have one of our internal
> developers work on it. There are times when I've gritted my teeth while
> funding a project, either because I think the software should just work
> that way or because I feel like we've already invested enough into the
> feature. However, I also know we are also indebted to many developers in
> this community who have quickly fixed issues, both large and small, as a
> result of our positive advocacy. In the end, it all balances out.
>
> Kathy
>
>
>
> On 03/29/2018 02:02 PM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org wrote:
>
> Jason,
>Thank you for this information. Regarding this particular bug, it is too 
> serious to leave to #3, and we don't have the wherewithal to do #1 so we may 
> try to do #2...but will likely need funding partners...which brings us to #4: 
> work together to get it fixed.
>
> Scott
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Open-ils-general 
> [mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org 
> ] On Behalf Of Jason 
> Stephenson
> Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 1:44 PM
> To: open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org
> Subject: Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client
>
> On 03/29/2018 11:27 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org wrote:
>
> I agree this is an impediment to implementing the Web Client in
> centralized or semi-centralized cataloging departments (of which we
> have many). I am just not conversant on the ins & outs of how to get
> fixes into a release versus a maintenance release versus a patch
>
> Bug targeting is done by one of the members of the drivers group. It is 
> usually done only for bugs that have patches or where someone is working on 
> it and is likely to have a patch ready in time for the release. We (mostly I) 
> sometimes break the unwritten rules and target bugs prematurely.
>
> As for how to get specific bugs fixed, you basically have 3 options:
>
> 1. Fix it yourself.
> 2. Hire someone else to fix it.
> 3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.
>
> HtH,
> Jason
>
>
>
> --
> Kathy Lussier
> Project Coordinator
> Massachusetts Library Network Cooperative(508) 343-0128kluss...@masslnc.org
> Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/kmlussier
>
>

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[scott.tho...@sparkpa.org]

Hi Kathy,
   Your points about “positive advocacy” are well-stated and well-taken, but 
advocacy is what we are doing with Congress as we try to get IMLS money 
restored for FY2019. We who live in the non-developer neighborhood of the 
Evergreen community have more power than that, and, yes, it does involve 
sponsoring development or bug-fixing projects.
   I also agree on the need for very good communication between those of us who 
want a feature, but are not developers, and those who have the skills to do the 
work. It is almost like I’m the patron and the developer is the reference 
librarian, and I am probably in need of a good reference interview. Regarding 
Holdings View, we can describe how we want it to work. (One of our libraries 
provided excellent screen shots.) Do I share that here or LP both? Regarding 
IRC, I am not shy about my opinions on that. I have to use it for EOB meetings, 
but find it to be arcane to the uninitiated. Also, it is simply not the way 
people in libraries communicate.
   I’ve been involved with Evergreen, us a user and then as a consortium 
leader, since 2015, and these recent discussion have been incredibly 
illuminating. I feel privileged to be a part of this community.

Scott


From: Open-ils-general 
[mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] On Behalf Of Kathy 
Lussier
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 10:46 AM
To: open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org
Subject: Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client


Hi,

In regards to this question:
What can we do to get this fixed in 3.2 if not sooner?
And the responses thus far:

1. Fix it yourself.

2. Hire someone else to fix it.

3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.

#4: work together to get it fixed (i.e. funding through development 
partnerships)
I also would like to talk about the role of positive advocacy in getting 
attention on particular bugs, which may not guarantee that they get fixed, but 
certainly could draw enough developer attention towards the bug to result in it 
getting fixed. I guess this is really another spin on Jason's solution #3 - 
wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.

What exactly is positive advocacy? It's raising discussion on the lists, just 
as we did here, to ask about a bug and to see if it also has an impact on other 
Evergreen sites. It involves participating in LP discussions or raising 
questions in IRC. It not only involves discussing why the bug is important, but 
contributing to discussions on the best approach to fix it. In the case of this 
particular bug, for example, there was discussion of adding a "show empty 
libraries" option and a question of whether it should replace the "show empty 
volumes" option or not. Getting feedback on questions like this is very 
helpful. If a developer decides to take on the bug, it will give them a clear 
direction for moving forward. Positive advocacy also includes committing to 
test a fix when it is available.

On a related side note, that Sandbox request form we use for Bug Squashing Day 
is never turned off. If you ever want to test a bug fix when it's not Bug 
Squashing Day, feel free to submit it or contact me directly. If I have the a 
server and the time, I'm happy to load fixes so that people can help with 
getting that bug fix merged to Evergreen. It's available at 
https://goo.gl/forms/PE4fYfWDh5AixYpy2

I use the word 'positive' because I do think there is a thin line between 
advocating that we as a community work together to fix a bug and treating the 
community as a they that should be fixing a given bug or introducing a new 
feature. FWIW, I am not saying that Scott was doing this when he raised his 
question. Given the amount of sponsored development that has come for both 
enhancements and bug fixes from PaILS, it's clear that he already recognizes 
his organization's role in contributing to the improvement of Evergreen. In 
general, though, I have seen this sentiment in other discussions, and, as 
frustrating as it can be when you're dealing with a problematic bug, we have to 
keep in mind that we're all on this together. The more people who take on the 
responsibility of helping improve Evergreen in some small or even large way, 
the better the software will be for all of our users.

I'm guessing that part of the original question really related to how positive 
advocacy turns into an actual bug fix. With the release of 3.1, I think we're 
all seeing that 3.2, when the xul client will no longer be available for our 
users, is just around the corner. Although the web client has come a long way, 
I think it's natural that there is some anxiety over remaining bugs that are 
preventing staff from using the new client or making it difficult for them to 
use it.

Based on my observations over the past eight years, I would say all of the 
following are factors in whether a bug gets fixed through these community 
channe

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Kathy Lussier]

s you to bake something for a bake sale to 
raise funds for a cause you believe in, you may quickly say yes without 
a thought. If they ask you to organize the bake sale, the answer may 
depend on whether you have time or on how strongly you feel about the 
cause. If you don't care about the cause at all (i.e. you can't 
understand why anyone would ever want Evergreen to work that way), you 
may never say yes no matter how much time you have. If the fundraiser is 
actually a capital campaign project for a new library, it doesn't matter 
how many people feel strongly about the issue, you may still need to 
hire a professional fundraiser to organize the campaign for you.


No matter how much positive advocacy I personally do for specific bugs, 
in the end, I know if the MassLNC organizations feel strongly about a 
bug fix or feature, we need to be prepared to fund it or have one of our 
internal developers work on it. There are times when I've gritted my 
teeth while funding a project, either because I think the software 
should just work that way or because I feel like we've already invested 
enough into the feature. However, I also know we are also indebted to 
many developers in this community who have quickly fixed issues, both 
large and small, as a result of our positive advocacy. In the end, it 
all balances out.


Kathy



On 03/29/2018 02:02 PM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org wrote:

Jason,
Thank you for this information. Regarding this particular bug, it is too 
serious to leave to #3, and we don't have the wherewithal to do #1 so we may 
try to do #2...but will likely need funding partners...which brings us to #4: 
work together to get it fixed.

Scott

-Original Message-
From: Open-ils-general 
[mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] On Behalf Of Jason 
Stephenson
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 1:44 PM
To: open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org
Subject: Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

On 03/29/2018 11:27 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org wrote:

I agree this is an impediment to implementing the Web Client in
centralized or semi-centralized cataloging departments (of which we
have many). I am just not conversant on the ins & outs of how to get
fixes into a release versus a maintenance release versus a patch

Bug targeting is done by one of the members of the drivers group. It is usually 
done only for bugs that have patches or where someone is working on it and is 
likely to have a patch ready in time for the release. We (mostly I) sometimes 
break the unwritten rules and target bugs prematurely.

As for how to get specific bugs fixed, you basically have 3 options:

1. Fix it yourself.
2. Hire someone else to fix it.
3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.

HtH,
Jason



--
Kathy Lussier
Project Coordinator
Massachusetts Library Network Cooperative
(508) 343-0128
kluss...@masslnc.org
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/kmlussier

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[scott.tho...@sparkpa.org]

Jason,
   Thank you for this information. Regarding this particular bug, it is too 
serious to leave to #3, and we don't have the wherewithal to do #1 so we may 
try to do #2...but will likely need funding partners...which brings us to #4: 
work together to get it fixed.

Scott

-Original Message-
From: Open-ils-general 
[mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] On Behalf Of Jason 
Stephenson
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 1:44 PM
To: open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org
Subject: Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

On 03/29/2018 11:27 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org wrote:
> I agree this is an impediment to implementing the Web Client in 
> centralized or semi-centralized cataloging departments (of which we 
> have many). I am just not conversant on the ins & outs of how to get 
> fixes into a release versus a maintenance release versus a patch

Bug targeting is done by one of the members of the drivers group. It is usually 
done only for bugs that have patches or where someone is working on it and is 
likely to have a patch ready in time for the release. We (mostly I) sometimes 
break the unwritten rules and target bugs prematurely.

As for how to get specific bugs fixed, you basically have 3 options:

1. Fix it yourself.
2. Hire someone else to fix it.
3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.

HtH,
Jason

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Jason Stephenson]

On 03/29/2018 11:27 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org wrote:
> I agree this is an impediment to implementing the Web Client in
> centralized or semi-centralized cataloging departments (of which we have
> many). I am just not conversant on the ins & outs of how to get fixes
> into a release versus a maintenance release versus a patch

Bug targeting is done by one of the members of the drivers group. It is
usually done only for bugs that have patches or where someone is working
on it and is likely to have a patch ready in time for the release. We
(mostly I) sometimes break the unwritten rules and target bugs prematurely.

As for how to get specific bugs fixed, you basically have 3 options:

1. Fix it yourself.
2. Hire someone else to fix it.
3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.

HtH,
Jason

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Kathy Lussier]

To be clear, nobody is talking about getting rid of Holdings 
Maintenance. It has a new name - holdings view - and there have been 
some changes in the display, some of which are improvements and other 
changes that are causing problems, some of which are significant. But I 
haven't heard anyone suggest getting rid of it.


Kathy


On 03/29/2018 01:00 PM, Walz, Jennifer wrote:


All –

  From a ‘end user’ / power user standpoint (and the admin) PLEASE 
PLEASE don’t get rid of the Holdings Maintenance view / screen / 
option!!    Oh my.   We use that for so many things.   It just helps 
visually to know where a volume is, if it is labeled correctly, if it 
has copies assigned, and are there others in the system.


PLEASE keep the Holdings Maintenance.  It is one of the BEST things in 
Evergreen.


    (The other BEST thing ever is the Item Status Display.   NEVER get 
rid of that either!)


Thanks!

Jennifer

--
Jennifer Walz, MLS - Head of ILS concerns
Kinlaw Library - *Asbury University*
One Macklem Drive, Wilmore, KY 40390
859-858-3511 ext. 2269
jlw...@asbury.edu

*From:*Open-ils-general 
[mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] *On Behalf 
Of *scott.tho...@sparkpa.org

*Sent:* Thursday, March 29, 2018 10:12 AM
*To:* Evergreen Discussion Group
*Subject:* [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

I just had this reported to me, and it does seem to be problematic. 
Many of our libraries use Holdings Maintenance in XUL as the first 
step in adding volumes and copies. This works out well because, even 
if a given library system has no volumes or copies under a given 
title, the org unit tree for that system appears in Holdings 
Maintenance and you can easily add volumes / copies to a specific 
branch. This tree does not appear in the Web Client so adding volumes 
to a branch requires several more steps as a user is forced to select 
the branch org unit at several junctures.  Am I missing something? Has 
anyone else noticed this?


Scott

Scott Thomas

Executive Director

*PaILS / SPARK*

(717) 873-9461

scott.tho...@sparkpa.org <mailto:scott.tho...@sparkpa.org>

Stay informed! Join the SPARK-User Email List:

https://mail.palibrary.org/mailman/listinfo/spark-users

Description: Description: Training | SPARK – Pennsylvania's Statewide 
Library System <http://www.palibrary.org/pails/>




--
Kathy Lussier
Project Coordinator
Massachusetts Library Network Cooperative
(508) 343-0128
kluss...@masslnc.org
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/kmlussier

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Walz, Jennifer]

All -

  From a 'end user' / power user standpoint (and the admin) PLEASE PLEASE don't 
get rid of the Holdings Maintenance view / screen / option!!Oh my.   We use 
that for so many things.   It just helps visually to know where a volume is, if 
it is labeled correctly, if it has copies assigned, and are there others in the 
system.

PLEASE keep the Holdings Maintenance.  It is one of the BEST things in 
Evergreen.

(The other BEST thing ever is the Item Status Display.   NEVER get rid of 
that either!)

Thanks!

Jennifer
--
Jennifer Walz, MLS - Head of ILS concerns
Kinlaw Library -  Asbury University
One Macklem Drive, Wilmore, KY 40390
859-858-3511 ext. 2269
jlw...@asbury.edu



From: Open-ils-general 
[mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] On Behalf Of 
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 10:12 AM
To: Evergreen Discussion Group
Subject: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

I just had this reported to me, and it does seem to be problematic. Many of our 
libraries use Holdings Maintenance in XUL as the first step in adding volumes 
and copies. This works out well because, even if a given library system has no 
volumes or copies under a given title, the org unit tree for that system 
appears in Holdings Maintenance and you can easily add volumes / copies to a 
specific branch. This tree does not appear in the Web Client so adding volumes 
to a branch requires several more steps as a user is forced to select the 
branch org unit at several junctures.  Am I missing something? Has anyone else 
noticed this?

Scott


Scott Thomas
Executive Director
PaILS / SPARK
(717) 873-9461
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org<mailto:scott.tho...@sparkpa.org>
Stay informed! Join the SPARK-User Email List:
https://mail.palibrary.org/mailman/listinfo/spark-users
[Description: Description: Training | SPARK - Pennsylvania's Statewide Library 
System]<http://www.palibrary.org/pails/>

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[scott.tho...@sparkpa.org]

Elaine,
   I agree this is an impediment to implementing the Web Client in centralized 
or semi-centralized cataloging departments (of which we have many). I am just 
not conversant on the ins & outs of how to get fixes into a release versus a 
maintenance release versus a patch.

Scott

From: Open-ils-general 
[mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] On Behalf Of Elaine 
Hardy
Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 11:16 AM
To: Evergreen Discussion Group 
Subject: Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

We would need it fixed sooner, if all or libraries are to move to the web 
client for cataloging.



J. Elaine Hardy
PINES & Collaborative Projects Manager
Georgia Public Library Service/PINES
1800 Century Place, Ste. 150
Atlanta, GA 30045
404.235.7128 Office
404.548.4241 Cell
404.235.7201 FAX

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 10:53 AM, 
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org<mailto:scott.tho...@sparkpa.org> 
mailto:scott.tho...@sparkpa.org>> wrote:
Elaine,
Thank you. This is ringing a bell now, but I did not internalize it until 
one of my libraries complained and documented it. This is really bad. I noticed 
it has a high priority but is unassigned. What can we do to get this fixed in 
3.2 if not sooner?

Scott
Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 29, 2018, at 10:20 AM, Elaine Hardy 
mailto:eha...@georgialibraries.org>> wrote:
Scott,
There is a bug report for this 
--https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1715697
It is very problematic. Many of or libraries have more than 5 branches and this 
bug makes it impossible for them to use the web client



J. Elaine Hardy
PINES & Collaborative Projects Manager
Georgia Public Library Service/PINES
1800 Century Place, Ste. 
150<https://maps.google.com/?q=1800+Century+Place,+Ste.+150+%0D%0A+%0D%0A+Atlanta,+GA+30045&entry=gmail&source=g>
Atlanta, GA 
30045<https://maps.google.com/?q=1800+Century+Place,+Ste.+150+%0D%0A+%0D%0A+Atlanta,+GA+30045&entry=gmail&source=g>
404.235.7128 Office
404.548.4241 Cell
404.235.7201 FAX

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 10:11 AM, 
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org<mailto:scott.tho...@sparkpa.org> 
mailto:scott.tho...@sparkpa.org>> wrote:
I just had this reported to me, and it does seem to be problematic. Many of our 
libraries use Holdings Maintenance in XUL as the first step in adding volumes 
and copies. This works out well because, even if a given library system has no 
volumes or copies under a given title, the org unit tree for that system 
appears in Holdings Maintenance and you can easily add volumes / copies to a 
specific branch. This tree does not appear in the Web Client so adding volumes 
to a branch requires several more steps as a user is forced to select the 
branch org unit at several junctures.  Am I missing something? Has anyone else 
noticed this?

Scott


Scott Thomas
Executive Director
PaILS / SPARK
(717) 873-9461
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org<mailto:scott.tho...@sparkpa.org>
Stay informed! Join the SPARK-User Email List:
https://mail.palibrary.org/mailman/listinfo/spark-users
<http://www.palibrary.org/pails/>

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Elaine Hardy]

We would need it fixed sooner, if all or libraries are to move to the web
client for cataloging.



J. Elaine Hardy
PINES & Collaborative Projects Manager
Georgia Public Library Service/PINES
1800 Century Place, Ste. 150
Atlanta, GA 30045

404.235.7128 Office
404.548.4241 Cell
404.235.7201 FAX

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 10:53 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org <
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org> wrote:

> Elaine,
> Thank you. This is ringing a bell now, but I did not internalize it
> until one of my libraries complained and documented it. This is really bad.
> I noticed it has a high priority but is unassigned. What can we do to get
> this fixed in 3.2 if not sooner?
>
> Scott
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 29, 2018, at 10:20 AM, Elaine Hardy 
> wrote:
>
> Scott,
>
> There is a bug report for this --https://bugs.launchpad.net/
> evergreen/+bug/1715697
>
> It is very problematic. Many of or libraries have more than 5 branches and
> this bug makes it impossible for them to use the web client
>
>
>
> J. Elaine Hardy
> PINES & Collaborative Projects Manager
> Georgia Public Library Service/PINES
> 1800 Century Place, Ste. 150
> 
> Atlanta, GA 30045
> 
>
> 404.235.7128 <(404)%20235-7128> Office
> 404.548.4241 <(404)%20548-4241> Cell
> 404.235.7201 <(404)%20235-7201> FAX
>
> On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 10:11 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org <
> scott.tho...@sparkpa.org> wrote:
>
>> I just had this reported to me, and it does seem to be problematic. Many
>> of our libraries use Holdings Maintenance in XUL as the first step in
>> adding volumes and copies. This works out well because, even if a given
>> library system has no volumes or copies under a given title, the org unit
>> tree for that system appears in Holdings Maintenance and you can easily add
>> volumes / copies to a specific branch. This tree does not appear in the Web
>> Client so adding volumes to a branch requires several more steps as a user
>> is forced to select the branch org unit at several junctures.  Am I missing
>> something? Has anyone else noticed this?
>>
>> Scott
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Scott Thomas
>>
>> Executive Director
>>
>> *PaILS / SPARK*
>>
>> (717) 873-9461
>>
>> scott.tho...@sparkpa.org
>>
>> Stay informed! Join the SPARK-User Email List:
>>
>> https://mail.palibrary.org/mailman/listinfo/spark-users
>>
>>  
>>
>>
>>
>
>

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[scott.tho...@sparkpa.org]

Elaine,
Thank you. This is ringing a bell now, but I did not internalize it until 
one of my libraries complained and documented it. This is really bad. I noticed 
it has a high priority but is unassigned. What can we do to get this fixed in 
3.2 if not sooner?

Scott

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 29, 2018, at 10:20 AM, Elaine Hardy 
mailto:eha...@georgialibraries.org>> wrote:

Scott,

There is a bug report for this 
--https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1715697

It is very problematic. Many of or libraries have more than 5 branches and this 
bug makes it impossible for them to use the web client



J. Elaine Hardy
PINES & Collaborative Projects Manager
Georgia Public Library Service/PINES
1800 Century Place, Ste. 150
Atlanta, GA 30045

404.235.7128 Office
404.548.4241 Cell
404.235.7201 FAX

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 10:11 AM, 
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org 
mailto:scott.tho...@sparkpa.org>> wrote:
I just had this reported to me, and it does seem to be problematic. Many of our 
libraries use Holdings Maintenance in XUL as the first step in adding volumes 
and copies. This works out well because, even if a given library system has no 
volumes or copies under a given title, the org unit tree for that system 
appears in Holdings Maintenance and you can easily add volumes / copies to a 
specific branch. This tree does not appear in the Web Client so adding volumes 
to a branch requires several more steps as a user is forced to select the 
branch org unit at several junctures.  Am I missing something? Has anyone else 
noticed this?

Scott


Scott Thomas
Executive Director
PaILS / SPARK
(717) 873-9461
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org
Stay informed! Join the SPARK-User Email List:
https://mail.palibrary.org/mailman/listinfo/spark-users

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Elaine Hardy]

Scott,

There is a bug report for this --
https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1715697

It is very problematic. Many of or libraries have more than 5 branches and
this bug makes it impossible for them to use the web client



J. Elaine Hardy
PINES & Collaborative Projects Manager
Georgia Public Library Service/PINES
1800 Century Place, Ste. 150
Atlanta, GA 30045

404.235.7128 Office
404.548.4241 Cell
404.235.7201 FAX

On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 10:11 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org <
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org> wrote:

> I just had this reported to me, and it does seem to be problematic. Many
> of our libraries use Holdings Maintenance in XUL as the first step in
> adding volumes and copies. This works out well because, even if a given
> library system has no volumes or copies under a given title, the org unit
> tree for that system appears in Holdings Maintenance and you can easily add
> volumes / copies to a specific branch. This tree does not appear in the Web
> Client so adding volumes to a branch requires several more steps as a user
> is forced to select the branch org unit at several junctures.  Am I missing
> something? Has anyone else noticed this?
>
> Scott
>
>
>
>
>
> Scott Thomas
>
> Executive Director
>
> *PaILS / SPARK*
>
> (717) 873-9461
>
> scott.tho...@sparkpa.org
>
> Stay informed! Join the SPARK-User Email List:
>
> https://mail.palibrary.org/mailman/listinfo/spark-users
>
> [image: Description: Description: Training | SPARK – Pennsylvania's
> Statewide Library System] 
>
>
>

Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[Kate Coleman]

Yes, this is one of the very first things we noticed and is a showstopper
for me personally. I do not use the web client to add items. It was so much
easier in XUL. There is a bug:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1715697



On Thu, Mar 29, 2018 at 9:12 AM scott.tho...@sparkpa.org <
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org> wrote:

> I just had this reported to me, and it does seem to be problematic. Many
> of our libraries use Holdings Maintenance in XUL as the first step in
> adding volumes and copies. This works out well because, even if a given
> library system has no volumes or copies under a given title, the org unit
> tree for that system appears in Holdings Maintenance and you can easily add
> volumes / copies to a specific branch. This tree does not appear in the Web
> Client so adding volumes to a branch requires several more steps as a user
> is forced to select the branch org unit at several junctures.  Am I missing
> something? Has anyone else noticed this?
>
> Scott
>
>
>
>
>
> Scott Thomas
>
> Executive Director
>
> *PaILS / SPARK*
>
> (717) 873-9461
>
> scott.tho...@sparkpa.org
>
> Stay informed! Join the SPARK-User Email List:
>
> https://mail.palibrary.org/mailman/listinfo/spark-users
>
> [image: Description: Description: Training | SPARK – Pennsylvania's
> Statewide Library System] 
>
>
>
-- 


Kate Coleman
Jefferson County Library - Central Services
Technical Services Supervisor
5678 State Rd. PP
High Ridge, MO 63049
636-677-8689
Fax: 636--677-1769
kcole...@jeffcolib.org

[OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client

[scott.tho...@sparkpa.org]

I just had this reported to me, and it does seem to be problematic. Many of our 
libraries use Holdings Maintenance in XUL as the first step in adding volumes 
and copies. This works out well because, even if a given library system has no 
volumes or copies under a given title, the org unit tree for that system 
appears in Holdings Maintenance and you can easily add volumes / copies to a 
specific branch. This tree does not appear in the Web Client so adding volumes 
to a branch requires several more steps as a user is forced to select the 
branch org unit at several junctures.  Am I missing something? Has anyone else 
noticed this?

Scott


Scott Thomas
Executive Director
PaILS / SPARK
(717) 873-9461
scott.tho...@sparkpa.org
Stay informed! Join the SPARK-User Email List:
https://mail.palibrary.org/mailman/listinfo/spark-users
[Description: Description: Training | SPARK - Pennsylvania's Statewide Library 
System]