Re: Pentax K10D firmware update 1.11 now available
Yes of course. It often works like that for good (most of the time) reasons. 2007/3/7, P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]: That's not surprising. I know that's the way I'd design a firmware upgrade to work. Dario Bonazza wrote: Doug Franklin wrote: Why do you say that, Ken. Am I missing something? It seems to me that I set up two SD cards, one with the old firmware and one with the new. A simple swap of the cards and the magic startup to load new firmware and I'm set. Does the 1.11 (or whatever) firmware notice that I'm trying to load an older version and refuse? Exactly, just tried that :-( Dario -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Question about pentax gallery (mostly language-wise)
At 02:15 PM 7/03/2007, Boris Liberman wrote: Hi! Yesterday I submitted two photos to Pentax gallery (http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artist). Now, when I am looking at these two photos I am seeing Approved in Gallery - does it mean that they will be shown to the public if and when the gallery becomes public, or is there something more that needs to happen? Thanks, I am really confused by the language here. Boris Sounds like your shots are in Boris. I up-loaded several on Monday and they're all still marked Ready for Review. Cheers, Dave -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Pentax K10D firmware update 1.11 now available
On Wed, Mar 07, 2007 at 08:47:18AM +0100, Thibouille wrote.. Yes of course. It often works like that for good (most of the time) reasons. Because of that most of the time clause is exactly the reason why it is a bad idea. Seen this too often with customers (that is in the professional IT area, but the principle of allowing a downgrade remains sound) Wilko 2007/3/7, P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]: That's not surprising. I know that's the way I'd design a firmware upgrade to work. Dario Bonazza wrote: Doug Franklin wrote: Why do you say that, Ken. Am I missing something? It seems to me that I set up two SD cards, one with the old firmware and one with the new. A simple swap of the cards and the magic startup to load new firmware and I'm set. Does the 1.11 (or whatever) firmware notice that I'm trying to load an older version and refuse? Exactly, just tried that :-( Dario -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net --- end of quoted text --- -- Wilko -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
Mmm 55-300 looks afwully consumer Sigma-like lens. Hope Pentax will do magic. Pentax probably needs lens like that (unfortunately maybe, I dunno). About TCs: in the mean time, any 3rd party TC with PowerZoom contacts should do the trick. Nowhere near Pentax TC quality but maybe better than nothing ? 2007/3/7, Mike Hamilton [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Updated! http://www.digital.pentax.co.jp/en/lens/roadmap.pdf -- -- Cheers, [EMAIL PROTECTED] MichaelHamilton.ca -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: K-Mount Accidents?
Bong Manayon wrote: Just curious, has anyone accidentally detached their lens from the body? I once lost a lens belonging to my father that way - it fell off the body halfway up a mountain and was last seen bounding down towards the glacier far below. I comforted my father with the reflection that it would probably reappear at the bottom of the glacier in a few hundred years' time, by which time it would be a valuable antique. I always assumed that was my fault for not mounting it properly though. (The human brain mostly packs up and goes home without you when you get above about 5000m...) S -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Question about pentax gallery (mostly language-wise)
Thanks! The way this whole web side is worded makes me think that I am most definitely not a lawyer. Boris David Savage wrote: At 02:15 PM 7/03/2007, Boris Liberman wrote: Hi! Yesterday I submitted two photos to Pentax gallery (http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artist). Now, when I am looking at these two photos I am seeing Approved in Gallery - does it mean that they will be shown to the public if and when the gallery becomes public, or is there something more that needs to happen? Thanks, I am really confused by the language here. Boris Sounds like your shots are in Boris. I up-loaded several on Monday and they're all still marked Ready for Review. Cheers, Dave -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Pentax K10D firmware update 1.11 now available
Well corporations do this because they (rightly) assume customer is dumb. It is a pity for those who know how to handle that but for the majority whose camera will end in support area of Pentax, they'd better avoid that if they can. Always like that, tune to the majority of people (dumb usually). Otherwise: too many problems. 2007/3/7, Wilko Bulte [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Wed, Mar 07, 2007 at 08:47:18AM +0100, Thibouille wrote.. Yes of course. It often works like that for good (most of the time) reasons. Because of that most of the time clause is exactly the reason why it is a bad idea. Seen this too often with customers (that is in the professional IT area, but the principle of allowing a downgrade remains sound) Wilko 2007/3/7, P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]: That's not surprising. I know that's the way I'd design a firmware upgrade to work. Dario Bonazza wrote: Doug Franklin wrote: Why do you say that, Ken. Am I missing something? It seems to me that I set up two SD cards, one with the old firmware and one with the new. A simple swap of the cards and the magic startup to load new firmware and I'm set. Does the 1.11 (or whatever) firmware notice that I'm trying to load an older version and refuse? Exactly, just tried that :-( Dario -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net --- end of quoted text --- -- Wilko -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
On 6/3/07, William Robb, discombobulated, unleashed: I'm always happy. And his wife is always in pain. -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Funny things happening...
From: Mike Hamilton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2007/03/07 Wed AM 05:53:49 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Funny things happening... In the last 2 days, I have received approximately 10-12 Mail Delivery Daemon delay messages, all relating to PDML. Not threads that I have posted to, or started... Just random threads, from various authors. Anyone else? Got any tips as to why this is happening? I'm using Gmail. The Homeland Security server is backed up? - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Question about pentax gallery (mostly language-wise)
From: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2007/03/07 Wed AM 05:15:07 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Question about pentax gallery (mostly language-wise) Hi! Yesterday I submitted two photos to Pentax gallery (http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artist). Now, when I am looking at these two photos I am seeing Approved in Gallery - does it mean that they will be shown to the public if and when the gallery becomes public, or is there something more that needs to happen? Thanks, I am really confused by the language here. You are not the only one. My reading of it would be Approved. In gallery. I can't think of another interpretation that isn't mind-bogglingly, hair-splittingly pointlessly pedantic. - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Signing
On 6/3/07, Paul Stenquist, discombobulated, unleashed: Hey, why stop now? Another pic from the same afternoon in the same coffee shop. But totally different light. Same lens: the DA 50-200 workhorse. This lady isn't giving her friend the finger. http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687954size=lg I prefer this to 'Incognito' but the blur on the hand isn't to my taste. SR on? Just as a matter of interest, what ISO would you be shooting in your coffee shop? If I shoot indoors available light (mixed daylight/ tungsten) I would pop it up to 800 without a thought. -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Funny things happening...
Weird. I use Gmail too and did not receive anything like that. 2007/3/7, Mike Hamilton [EMAIL PROTECTED]: In the last 2 days, I have received approximately 10-12 Mail Delivery Daemon delay messages, all relating to PDML. Not threads that I have posted to, or started... Just random threads, from various authors. Anyone else? Got any tips as to why this is happening? I'm using Gmail. -- -- Cheers, [EMAIL PROTECTED] MichaelHamilton.ca -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Funny things happening...
Ditto. Cheers, Dave On 3/7/07, Thibouille [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Weird. I use Gmail too and did not receive anything like that. 2007/3/7, Mike Hamilton [EMAIL PROTECTED]: In the last 2 days, I have received approximately 10-12 Mail Delivery Daemon delay messages, all relating to PDML. Not threads that I have posted to, or started... Just random threads, from various authors. Anyone else? Got any tips as to why this is happening? I'm using Gmail. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Signing
Wrong finger in any case. I keep thinking egg when I look at this. Weird. Cheers, Dave On 3/7/07, Paul Stenquist [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey, why stop now? Another pic from the same afternoon in the same coffee shop. But totally different light. Same lens: the DA 50-200 workhorse. This lady isn't giving her friend the finger. http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687954size=lg -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Question about pentax gallery (mostly language-wise)
Boris, I was just having a look at the Pentax Gallery site and came across this: Submission Complete Help Images in this section have been properly submitted to PENTAX. Images in this section may be categorized in the following ways: Approved in Collection: Your image will be displayed in the Premiere Collection, and will be viewable via the Search functions. Approved in Gallery: Your image will be viewable via the Search function, but will not be displayed in the Premiere Collection. Ready for Review: Your image has been submitted to PENTAX, and is currently in review for acceptance to the Premiere Collection or the Gallery. The full help page can be found here: http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artist/nositemesh/edit_gallery_submission_complete.jsp http://tinyurl.com/yvsk8w Cheers, Dave From: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2007/03/07 Wed AM 05:15:07 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Question about pentax gallery (mostly language-wise) Hi! Yesterday I submitted two photos to Pentax gallery (http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artist). Now, when I am looking at these two photos I am seeing Approved in Gallery - does it mean that they will be shown to the public if and when the gallery becomes public, or is there something more that needs to happen? Thanks, I am really confused by the language here. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Question about pentax gallery (mostly language-wise)
Thanks, Dave, that was most helpful! On 3/7/07, David Savage [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Boris, I was just having a look at the Pentax Gallery site and came across this: Submission Complete Help Images in this section have been properly submitted to PENTAX. Images in this section may be categorized in the following ways: Approved in Collection: Your image will be displayed in the Premiere Collection, and will be viewable via the Search functions. Approved in Gallery: Your image will be viewable via the Search function, but will not be displayed in the Premiere Collection. Ready for Review: Your image has been submitted to PENTAX, and is currently in review for acceptance to the Premiere Collection or the Gallery. The full help page can be found here: http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artist/nositemesh/edit_gallery_submission_complete.jsp http://tinyurl.com/yvsk8w Cheers, Dave From: Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2007/03/07 Wed AM 05:15:07 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Question about pentax gallery (mostly language-wise) Hi! Yesterday I submitted two photos to Pentax gallery (http://www.pentaxphotogallery.com/artist). Now, when I am looking at these two photos I am seeing Approved in Gallery - does it mean that they will be shown to the public if and when the gallery becomes public, or is there something more that needs to happen? Thanks, I am really confused by the language here. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Boris -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
On 3/7/07, David Savage pdml at arach.net.au wrote: At 01:26 PM 7/03/2007, Joseph Tainter wrote: Instead of releasing a bloody Roadmap I wish Pentax would hurry the f#k up and release the damn lenses. I agree! I had my eye on the Sigma 17-70 now I'm in agony seeing a Pentax 17-70 on the roadmap. Bong - Remember that it took Pentax 13 years--from 1987 to 2000--to complete the transition to autofocus. This transition is going much more quickly. Joe -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Incognito and Signing
Paul Stenquist wrote: http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687917size=lg http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687954size=lg Sorry, Paul, these two really do little for me. I never really liked the voyeuristic style of photography and you seem to catch these two people in odd moments. The one thing I do like is the BW rendering of signing very nicely exposed too. -- Christian http://photography.skofteland.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
Thibouille wrote: Mmm both DA55 but specially DA35; both SDM. * starts saving immeditely * SDM = Save Dollars Massively (because you're going to need them!) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT: Nikon D3
Doug Franklin wrote: Tom C wrote: Well yeah. I've known people like Ken Rockwell. Odds are that when one talks that much, they are bound to be right about something every once in a while. :-) I made this comment in a different venue recently, but it applies (to Kenny) in any venue: Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. old-timerYeah, analog clocks, you young turks. :-)/old-timer Ken is much more similar to a stopped *digital* clock... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
On 3/7/07, Joseph Tainter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 3/7/07, David Savage pdml at arach.net.au wrote: At 01:26 PM 7/03/2007, Joseph Tainter wrote: Instead of releasing a bloody Roadmap I wish Pentax would hurry the f#k up and release the damn lenses. I agree! I had my eye on the Sigma 17-70 now I'm in agony seeing a Pentax 17-70 on the roadmap. Bong - Remember that it took Pentax 13 years--from 1987 to 2000--to complete the transition to autofocus. This transition is going much more quickly. And by time I was in a financial position to buy some of those AF lenses, they were discontinued with no (Pentax) replacment available. I just wish their announcment-release cycle was a bit faster. That's what pi55es me off the most. Cheers, -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT: Nikon D3
Mark Roberts wrote: Doug Franklin wrote: Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. old-timerYeah, analog clocks, you young turks. :-)/old-timer Ken is much more similar to a stopped *digital* clock... More like the VCR clock in my parents' house: flashing 12:00 -- Christian http://photography.skofteland.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT: Nikon D3
On 3/7/07, Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Doug Franklin wrote: Tom C wrote: Well yeah. I've known people like Ken Rockwell. Odds are that when one talks that much, they are bound to be right about something every once in a while. :-) I made this comment in a different venue recently, but it applies (to Kenny) in any venue: Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. old-timerYeah, analog clocks, you young turks. :-)/old-timer Ken is much more similar to a stopped *digital* clock... More like a stop watch, I reckon. He just keeps ticking along oblivious to the actual time. Cheers, Dave -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Declined...
Well, at least they are doing something with the gallery. I had submitted 11 photos that were all tenatively accepted. This AM they show 6 in the Gallery, 1 in the Collection, 3 on hold, and 1 Declined. The declined shot was shot with a 135 SMC-M lens but they did not have a 135 in the selection menu, so I had it listed as unknown. I suspect that they don't want unknowns in the final gallery. Walt -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Pentax K10D firmware update 1.11 now available
With Failed software upgrades that makes sense, in many cases you can go back to an earlier version, with failed firmware upgrades you often have an usable device that can no longer even update it's own firmware and requires expert intervention. (if a user has the expertise for the repair then they are an expert, but they still have taken the responsibility for the result). Wilko Bulte wrote: On Wed, Mar 07, 2007 at 08:47:18AM +0100, Thibouille wrote.. Yes of course. It often works like that for good (most of the time) reasons. Because of that most of the time clause is exactly the reason why it is a bad idea. Seen this too often with customers (that is in the professional IT area, but the principle of allowing a downgrade remains sound) Wilko 2007/3/7, P. J. Alling [EMAIL PROTECTED]: That's not surprising. I know that's the way I'd design a firmware upgrade to work. Dario Bonazza wrote: Doug Franklin wrote: Why do you say that, Ken. Am I missing something? It seems to me that I set up two SD cards, one with the old firmware and one with the new. A simple swap of the cards and the magic startup to load new firmware and I'm set. Does the 1.11 (or whatever) firmware notice that I'm trying to load an older version and refuse? Exactly, just tried that :-( Dario -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net --- end of quoted text --- -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Pentax K10D firmware update 1.11 now available
Wilko Bulte wrote: Because of that most of the time clause is exactly the reason why it is a bad idea. Exactly. I've been burned too many times in the past. Development Lead: Of course we've run the full regression test suite, boss. The new version passed with flying colors!. Me: Um, then why did my frammis just burst into flame when I put your new firwmare in it? -- Thanks, DougF (KG4LMZ) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Pentax K10D firmware update 1.11 now available
On 3/07/07 12:43 AM, Doug Franklin, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why do you say that, Ken. Am I missing something? It seems to me that I set up two SD cards, one with the old firmware and one with the new. A simple swap of the cards and the magic startup to load new firmware and I'm set. Does the 1.11 (or whatever) firmware notice that I'm trying to load an older version and refuse? By the time I saw your post, Europeans responded. Considering very few actual updating item in 1.11 and the timing of it, I thought that one of the purposes of this update was to shut out the DIY AF point adjustment hack. Pentax apparently did not like it (service nightmare? :-). So, for that reason alone, it must be irreversible. I found quite a few people (including even some long time Pentax veterans) have been plagued by what they thought was the soft focus problem. After hacking, they all reported very sharp focus. This being the case, Pentax should allow users to adjust the focus point if Pentax cannot do it precisely at their factory. Maybe hacking would be a bit scary to them but can't this be done by software/menu? Canon did it in their recent 1Ds Mk III. Also, I thought that firmware is something burnt into a ROM of the camera CPU and not supposed to be easily manipulated back and forth, no? Ken -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Pentax K10D firmware update 1.11 now available
K.Takeshita wrote: Also, I thought that firmware is something burnt into a ROM of the camera CPU and not supposed to be easily manipulated back and forth, no? It can be in read-only memory, and in that case you can't upgrade it, if that's all that's available. More often what you'll have is some memory that's read-only and some that's read-write. The read-write memory contains the actual operational code for the camera and you can upgrade it. The read-only part contains the basic bootstrap loader and utility functions (like update the read-write memory) so they can't get messed up in an upgrade and you can always change the upgradeable firmware in the read-write part if something goes wrong. -- Thanks, DougF (KG4LMZ) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: K-Mount Accidents?
Ouch. A friend dropped my ME Super off a banca (an outrigger boat) here in the Philippines. Same thought came into mind...its now part of an artificial coral reef... Bong On 3/7/07, Steve Jolly [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Bong Manayon wrote: Just curious, has anyone accidentally detached their lens from the body? I once lost a lens belonging to my father that way - it fell off the body halfway up a mountain and was last seen bounding down towards the glacier far below. I comforted my father with the reflection that it would probably reappear at the bottom of the glacier in a few hundred years' time, by which time it would be a valuable antique. I always assumed that was my fault for not mounting it properly though. (The human brain mostly packs up and goes home without you when you get above about 5000m...) S -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Bong Manayon http://www.bong.uni.cc -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Pentax K10D firmware update 1.11 now available
On 3/07/07 9:10 AM, Doug Franklin, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It can be in read-only memory, and in that case you can't upgrade it, if that's all that's available. Yes, of course :-). My stupid. More often what you'll have is some memory that's read-only and some that's read-write. The read-write memory contains the actual operational code for the camera and you can upgrade it. The read-only part contains the basic bootstrap loader and utility functions (like update the read-write memory) so they can't get messed up in an upgrade and you can always change the upgradeable firmware in the read-write part if something goes wrong. Makes sense, thank you. Ken -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
From: Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2007/03/07 Wed PM 01:08:05 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Lens Roadmap Thibouille wrote: Mmm both DA55 but specially DA35; both SDM. * starts saving immeditely * SDM = Save Dollars Massively (because you're going to need them!) Spend Dollars Massively - it's what your little plastic friend is for. - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Signing
Hi Cotty, the camera was in TAv mode, f4.5 @ 1/80th. The camera set ISO 640, and shake reduction was on. I could have bumped up the shutter speed a wee bit. There was quite a bit of window light. The blur on the hand caught me by surprise too. It's a function of how fast her hands move when she's signing. It's motion blur. It's not a flattering picture of the lady, but it's an accurate example of what goes on in a signing conversation: Lots of extreme facial expressions. I guess they help convey meaning. Paul On Mar 7, 2007, at 4:52 AM, Cotty wrote: On 6/3/07, Paul Stenquist, discombobulated, unleashed: Hey, why stop now? Another pic from the same afternoon in the same coffee shop. But totally different light. Same lens: the DA 50-200 workhorse. This lady isn't giving her friend the finger. http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687954size=lg I prefer this to 'Incognito' but the blur on the hand isn't to my taste. SR on? Just as a matter of interest, what ISO would you be shooting in your coffee shop? If I shoot indoors available light (mixed daylight/ tungsten) I would pop it up to 800 without a thought. -- Cheers, Cotty ___/\__ || (O) | People, Places, Pastiche ||=|http://www.cottysnaps.com _ -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Incognito and Signing
hmm. I do agree with Christian on this pair. Neither of them are particularly interesting photographs to my eye, although technically nicely rendered. I do agree with you regards catching people unawares or, more to my way of thinking, catching expressions candidly. That doesn't necessarily mean that they don't see the camera ... to me it means that they are not *responding* to the camera's presence unnaturally. Like the photo I posted yesterday, of the child and granny ... they were quite aware I had a camera pointed at them but they were not posing for the camera. Or like the street photography that Juan does so beautifully. Many of my favorite photos of people were made candidly this way ... a connection between photographer and subject was made, but without direct influence on the subject's ability to be natural and unposed. There are of course many appealing photos taken without the subjects' being aware of the camera too ... One of the favorites of this genre that I've made was this one, in San Francisco: http://www.gdgphoto.com/paw-2005/source/40.html Godfrey On Mar 7, 2007, at 6:43 AM, Paul Stenquist wrote: Thanks for looking, Christian. I prefer to catch people unawares. I don't hide, but I hope to get a shot of people without their seeing the camera. As soon as someone sees a camera, the situation is no longer real. The shot becomes a pose. Paul On Mar 7, 2007, at 7:47 AM, Christian wrote: Sorry, Paul, these two really do little for me. I never really liked the voyeuristic style of photography and you seem to catch these two people in odd moments. The one thing I do like is the BW rendering of signing very nicely exposed too. Paul Stenquist wrote: http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687917size=lg http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687954size=lg -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Incognito and Signing
Thanks for looking, Christian. I prefer to catch people unawares. I don't hide, but I hope to get a shot of people without their seeing the camera. As soon as someone sees a camera, the situation is no longer real. The shot becomes a pose. Paul On Mar 7, 2007, at 7:47 AM, Christian wrote: Paul Stenquist wrote: http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687917size=lg http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687954size=lg Sorry, Paul, these two really do little for me. I never really liked the voyeuristic style of photography and you seem to catch these two people in odd moments. The one thing I do like is the BW rendering of signing very nicely exposed too. -- Christian http://photography.skofteland.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Incognito and Signing
Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: to me it means that they are not *responding* to the camera's presence unnaturally. Like the photo I posted yesterday, of the child and granny ... they were quite aware I had a camera pointed at them but they were not posing for the camera. Many of my favorite photos of people were made candidly this way ... a connection between photographer and subject was made, but without direct influence on the subject's ability to be natural and unposed. There are of course many appealing photos taken without the subjects' being aware of the camera too ... One of the favorites of this genre that I've made was this one, in San Francisco: http://www.gdgphoto.com/paw-2005/source/40.html I agree with this. I liked your shot of the kid and granny and the one above is nicely done too. -- Christian http://photography.skofteland.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
Pentax needs some consumer grade lenses in order to be price competitive and in order to have some lenses that match the focal range of other companies. As long as they keep putting out a higher end product Pentax can, afaic, put out a bunch of consumer lenses. And, as it's turned out, a number of the Pentax consumer lenses have been pretty good according to people here on the list. The current 50~200 seems to be an example of that, and the 18~55 kit lens is well regarded for a bottom-of-the-line-entry-level lens by a lot of people - it's certainly a good value, more so than similar lenses from N and C and 3rd party manufacturers. Shel [Original Message] From: Thibouille Mmm 55-300 looks afwully consumer Sigma-like lens. Hope Pentax will do magic. Pentax probably needs lens like that (unfortunately maybe, I dunno). -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT: Nikon D3
Which is still correct once or twice a day. Shel Ken is much more similar to a stopped *digital* clock... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: Lens Roadmap
-Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Joseph Tainter Sent: March 6, 2007 8:26 PM To: pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Lens Roadmap It's undoubtedly a replacement for the FA* 85 F1.4. As a portrait lens, it may not be the best distance performer. But we will have to see. I'm still hoping for a DA 400 SDM. And a 1.4x TC. I agree! It's on both extremes of the focal lengths that Pentax now have to come through. 400 on the long end and a prime wider than the current 14mm. I am planning on getting the 16-50 as soon as it is available and would like something a bit wider than the 14 to complement that lens. Also they need a 70mm and 135 mm macro lenses and the line up would be complete ...at least cover the whole spectrum. But, looks like they are on the right track and are introducing the most used ranges first. I was surprised by the 35 macro ...thought something in the 60 - 70 range would be more in demand. Mike. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Incognito and Signing
I agree that one can sometimes capture an interesting image when the subject is aware of the camera. Your shot of the child and woman is nice because only the child sees the camera. Juan's pictures are mixed. In some, it's obvious that the camera was not seen. In others, it's apparent that the subject was aware. Although I am no expert in this genre, I have also worked both ways and have had some success both when subjects were aware and when they were not. In this case, I was merely responding to Chirstian's remark that these were voyeuristic. That word carries negative connotations, but to be honest, all street photography is voyeuristic. We enjoy watching people as they go about their lives. It's a good thing. BTW, I'm currently trying to sell a show of street photography that was all executed on one street over a period of several years. I think it's an interesting collection. Most have been seen here at one time or another, but maybe I'll group them on a webpage when I have time. (I'll probably have to do that anyway for some of the people I've been talking to regarding this set.) Paul On Mar 7, 2007, at 9:59 AM, Godfrey DiGiorgi wrote: hmm. I do agree with Christian on this pair. Neither of them are particularly interesting photographs to my eye, although technically nicely rendered. I do agree with you regards catching people unawares or, more to my way of thinking, catching expressions candidly. That doesn't necessarily mean that they don't see the camera ... to me it means that they are not *responding* to the camera's presence unnaturally. Like the photo I posted yesterday, of the child and granny ... they were quite aware I had a camera pointed at them but they were not posing for the camera. Or like the street photography that Juan does so beautifully. Many of my favorite photos of people were made candidly this way ... a connection between photographer and subject was made, but without direct influence on the subject's ability to be natural and unposed. There are of course many appealing photos taken without the subjects' being aware of the camera too ... One of the favorites of this genre that I've made was this one, in San Francisco: http://www.gdgphoto.com/paw-2005/source/40.html Godfrey On Mar 7, 2007, at 6:43 AM, Paul Stenquist wrote: Thanks for looking, Christian. I prefer to catch people unawares. I don't hide, but I hope to get a shot of people without their seeing the camera. As soon as someone sees a camera, the situation is no longer real. The shot becomes a pose. Paul On Mar 7, 2007, at 7:47 AM, Christian wrote: Sorry, Paul, these two really do little for me. I never really liked the voyeuristic style of photography and you seem to catch these two people in odd moments. The one thing I do like is the BW rendering of signing very nicely exposed too. Paul Stenquist wrote: http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687917size=lg http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687954size=lg -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
mike wilson wrote: From: Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thibouille wrote: Mmm both DA55 but specially DA35; both SDM. * starts saving immeditely * SDM = Save Dollars Massively (because you're going to need them!) Spend Dollars Massively - it's what your little plastic friend is for. Gives new meaning to the phrase, Your plastic pal who's fun to be with ;-) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Incognito and Signing
Paul, Both child and grandmother were aware of the camera. The child was not responding to the camera, he was responding to my laughing at his getting stuck with the rear wheel of the tricycle... It was the sound of my chuckle that made his turn his head and wave, then I pointed the camera at him. Grandmother was well aware of the camera in my hand already, but was concentrating on the runaway. :-) Voyeuristic ... yea, it is a word easily miscontrued. I'm interested to see your efforts in street photography, would love to see a selection of the set. G On Mar 7, 2007, at 7:37 AM, Paul Stenquist wrote: I agree that one can sometimes capture an interesting image when the subject is aware of the camera. Your shot of the child and woman is nice because only the child sees the camera. Juan's pictures are mixed. In some, it's obvious that the camera was not seen. In others, it's apparent that the subject was aware. Although I am no expert in this genre, I have also worked both ways and have had some success both when subjects were aware and when they were not. In this case, I was merely responding to Chirstian's remark that these were voyeuristic. That word carries negative connotations, but to be honest, all street photography is voyeuristic. We enjoy watching people as they go about their lives. It's a good thing. BTW, I'm currently trying to sell a show of street photography that was all executed on one street over a period of several years. I think it's an interesting collection. Most have been seen here at one time or another, but maybe I'll group them on a webpage when I have time. (I'll probably have to do that anyway for some of the people I've been talking to regarding this set.) Paul -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
My entry at the bottom: mike wilson wrote: From: Mark Roberts msroberts01 at ysu.edu Thibouille wrote: Mmm both DA55 but specially DA35; both SDM. * starts saving immeditely * SDM = Save Dollars Massively (because you're going to need them!) Spend Dollars Massively - it's what your little plastic friend is for. Gives new meaning to the phrase, Your plastic pal who's fun to be with ;-) SDM = So Damn Much. Buy early and buy often. Joe -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Signing
In a message dated 3/6/2007 7:30:34 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hey, why stop now? Another pic from the same afternoon in the same coffee shop. But totally different light. Same lens: the DA 50-200 workhorse. This lady isn't giving her friend the finger. http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687954size=lg = Made me chuckle. Glad you don't visit fast food and coffee shops in my area. :-) Much better than the other one, but not quite complete enough for a story. Marnie aka Doe BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: Incognito
In a message dated 3/6/2007 7:19:27 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Things are slow on the old list tonight. This might provide some amusement. No danger of this young lady catching me catching her. This is with the DA 50-200 BTW. I used to strap on the FA 50 when I moved indoors. But with SR, I can usually shoot some indoor lighting pics with the DA 50-200. Brings out the lazy side in me:-). http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687917size=lg Paul = Too blurry. Does little for me. Marnie aka Doe BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO - Old Fence
In a message dated 3/6/2007 9:28:35 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Marnie, can you please tell us what was the hour of day when you took the shot. I wold venture to guess that it was very close to midday or whenever the sun is high up in the skies in your area. Very difficult to handle the bright sun is ;-). Boris == Yes, most likely. My trip to the SW was for other reasons than photography. When I did do photography, for some weird reason it was almost always mid day when I stopped. Well, not so weird, as late day I was traveling to get back home (i.e. back to a motel, or traveling back to a city to find a motel). So the light was just about always not optimal. Marnie aka Doe :-) BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: Lens Roadmap
As I see it, there is nothing new here. Except that we now know there is a 35 besides the macro somewhere down the line. I can see myself buying the 16-50. Depending on what Sigma does with their 120-300/2,8 (K-mount or not), and Pentax prising, I might buy the 60-250 too. If the 60-250 costs about half as much as the 120-300, I might go for the DA*. Tim Typo Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Hamilton Sent: 7. mars 2007 04:48 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List Subject: Lens Roadmap Updated! http://www.digital.pentax.co.jp/en/lens/roadmap.pdf -- -- Cheers, [EMAIL PROTECTED] MichaelHamilton.ca -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Old Photo
In a message dated 3/6/2007 10:13:52 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I wonder how you do that? For me, everything from more than about ten minutes ago is fragmentary. Some of the fragments stretch for hours, but they're fragments, nonetheless, with large gaps in the interstices. -- Thanks, DougF (KG4LMZ) Me too. And I've been that way a long time. So it's nothing new. I really like your description of it. Very apt. I figure my brain just wasn't recording the non-interesting stuff. Which I am thankfully for actually, I don't need to remember what I ate last Thursday. Marnie aka Doe BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
DA18-55 and DA50-200 are indeed good lenses: the 18-55 is pretty honest considering it is more or less given for free and 50-200 pleases me very much. I'm not used to use really good lenses (no money enough) except a couple affordable primes but that 50-200 gives me very nice family portraits indoor (with bounced 360FGZ). 2007/3/7, Shel Belinkoff [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pentax needs some consumer grade lenses in order to be price competitive and in order to have some lenses that match the focal range of other companies. As long as they keep putting out a higher end product Pentax can, afaic, put out a bunch of consumer lenses. And, as it's turned out, a number of the Pentax consumer lenses have been pretty good according to people here on the list. The current 50~200 seems to be an example of that, and the 18~55 kit lens is well regarded for a bottom-of-the-line-entry-level lens by a lot of people - it's certainly a good value, more so than similar lenses from N and C and 3rd party manufacturers. Shel [Original Message] From: Thibouille Mmm 55-300 looks afwully consumer Sigma-like lens. Hope Pentax will do magic. Pentax probably needs lens like that (unfortunately maybe, I dunno). -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: Lens Roadmap
It sounds like you are one step away from realising the purpose of releasing a lens roadmap ;-) Tim Typo Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bong Manayon Sent: 7. mars 2007 05:48 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List Subject: Re: Lens Roadmap On 3/7/07, David Savage [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: At 01:26 PM 7/03/2007, Joseph Tainter wrote: Instead of releasing a bloody Roadmap I wish Pentax would hurry the f#k up and release the damn lenses. I agree! I had my eye on the Sigma 17-70 now I'm in agony seeing a Pentax 17-70 on the roadmap. Bong -- Bong Manayon http://www.bong.uni.cc -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PAW - 2007 - Feb 26 - March 4
In a message dated 3/6/2007 9:23:26 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Marnie, I don't think this has enough DOF, but this is my PAW for this past week, called, Camouflage. http://members.aol.com/eactivist/PAWS/pages/pawFeb26.htm Comments welcome, naturally, although I don't think it merits many. *** DS, A 35-105, f/8, and other technical stuff. First of all, be greeted with starting of an interesting project. I think doing PAWs can be only beneficial - both for you and for us. As for the picture - it works, but I'd like to see more attempts you made on this one. My instinct tells me that the fact that the leaf is on the right and the shadow from the leaf is further right is somehow wrong. However I am mentally forcing myself not to think that way, because it does not seem right here... Thus I am wanting to see more photographs you probably took here... Boris = I took about 6 shots. All wider, this was cropped. Pigeon dropped (or something) and rusty rock with a twig and leaves in front of it. Didn't have a macro lens with me. Sun on left, shadow on the right. Probably around 3pm. So really the crop is the best of the lot. Thanks, Boris, let's wait for this week's PAW (yet to be shot) and next week's PAW (yet to be shot), then maybe a few more, then we'll see if it's really a good idea. LOL. Marnie aka Doe BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: Is Feisol 3371 an upgrade?
Judging by the wisdom of Mike, Bob and Doug, I need to look elsewhere for the answer I need ;-) But thanks for entertaining me. Seriously: I think I have found the answer I'm looking for elsewhere, a pretty positive review at a Norwegian board. I just have to check how reliable the source is. When writing the review a year ago he had tested it with a 300/4 plus TC. Tim Typo Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian) -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Tim Øsleby Sent: 6. mars 2007 20:10 To: 'Pentax-Discuss Mail List' Subject: Is Feisol 3371 an upgrade? My K10D came a few days ago. I'm very happy with it, but I am expecting a pretty large sum of money this month, so I feel an enablement coming. I have been struggling to tame a 500/4,5. I have got acceptable results, but I have a feeling that there is more living in this beast. So I'm thinking about upgrading my tripod setup, a Velbon CF-630 and the Manfrotto gimbal mount. I like the Velbon a lot, but max load is 6kg. Lens gimbal and camera weights about 5kg, so I may be a bit too close to max load with a 500mm (sometimes I use a TC too). My old knees tell me I need something light weight. I haven't got a sherpa, and I often carry other stuff too. So I've been thinking about Feisol CT-3371 (and perhaps a centre column, just in case). What do you say? Is it an upgrade or am I fooling myself? I know many of you are Gitzo fans, but it is so expensive. I'm also planning to buy a new dog, some more stuff... You get the general picture, I guess. Tim Typo Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian) -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: GESO:roadtrip
On 3/5/07, Alastair Robertson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://www.massey.ac.nz/~aroberts/mt_cook_gallery/content/index.html In January I had a work trip to Canterbury (New Zealand) and on the way back to Christchurch I was in the passenger seat with a view of Mt Cook. Jenny, the driver, was in no mood to stop for photo's so I set my K10D to 1/1000, ISO 400, fitted the FA24-90 and a polariser and grabbed frames through the open window at 100 kph! I cropped most of the these to panorama, converted a copy to B W in lightroom. You may recognise frame 3 as my latest PUG entry (my wife thinks that #1 would have been a stronger entry for the gallery). In case you are wondering, #4 is a salmon farm located on a canal that forms part of the hydro scheme, the tailrace features in frame #3. #8 is the only photo taken that wasn't shot out of the moving car. I thought that the sequence (shown in the order taken) as we passed Mt Cook and eventually reached the plains made a nice gallery - hence my first GESO for the list! Comments/critiques welcome Alastair === You forgot to tip the driver. :-) Not bad for shooting out of the window. I like the green field with the bundled hay (or grass or whatever). Marnie aka Doe :-) BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT: Nikon D3
On Wed, Mar 07, 2007 at 08:06:35AM -0500, Mark Roberts wrote: Doug Franklin wrote: Tom C wrote: Well yeah. I've known people like Ken Rockwell. Odds are that when one talks that much, they are bound to be right about something every once in a while. :-) I made this comment in a different venue recently, but it applies (to Kenny) in any venue: Even a stopped clock is right twice a day. old-timerYeah, analog clocks, you young turks. :-)/old-timer Ken is much more similar to a stopped *digital* clock... Naah - he's one of those fake plastic clocks you see in furniture stores. He might look like the real thing on the surface, but as soon as you take a closer look you realise it's all superficial, with no real function. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
On Wed, Mar 07, 2007 at 09:23:50AM +0100, Thibouille wrote: About TCs: in the mean time, any 3rd party TC with PowerZoom contacts should do the trick. Nowhere near Pentax TC quality but maybe better than nothing ? Not really good enough - it also needs to let the camera know the focal length of the lens+TC combination, so that SR works properly. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Pentax gallery : picture description
I have no idea about how one do put a description of a picture, usually. Do you say Paris by night or should it be longer (describing exactly what is on the picture) etc... I'm a bit lost. -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Lens Roadmap
Mmm I somewhat doubt we will get this but I agree on the usefulness of that. Or then... didn't the 1.7x TC indeed change the aperture display of A (or better) lens? If intercepting the data communication and changing it on the fly is simple (probably) and cost effective (no idea) we could get that indeed. Totally forgot that, John, good point ! 2007/3/7, John Francis [EMAIL PROTECTED]: On Wed, Mar 07, 2007 at 09:23:50AM +0100, Thibouille wrote: About TCs: in the mean time, any 3rd party TC with PowerZoom contacts should do the trick. Nowhere near Pentax TC quality but maybe better than nothing ? Not really good enough - it also needs to let the camera know the focal length of the lens+TC combination, so that SR works properly. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: Scrapbooking with Henry
I had a chance to look through some of the book recently. Good stuff! Thanks for posting the information. Shel Why in Hell should I have to Press 1 for English?!!! [Original Message] From: Bob W Date: 1/20/2007 12:22:03 PM Henri Cartier-Bresson described his scrapbook as his most precious possession. It has recently been recreated and published as part of a book imaginatively called Scrapbook. I bought a copy today, and although I haven't come close to looking at all of it, I can recommend it. It includes a number of very interesting biographical essays, but the particular aspect I'm enjoying is the number of previously unpublished photographs it includes. As well as new photos there are many variants of well-known photographs, giving us some insight into his thinking as he took the photos. Many of them appear to be reproduced from his own original prints, which are fascinating to look at in their own right. There are also tearsheets of articles about him, and articles showing his pictures in published contexts, as well as bits and pieces representing some of his influences. A very worthwhile book for fans. http://tinyurl.com/2rzl66 -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: Pentax gallery : picture description
Picture descriptions are an arrogant way of telling the viewer how to interpret the photo and are condescending. Just write No Title. Better yet, just give it a meaningless number. Tom C. From: Thibouille [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Pentax gallery : picture description Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2007 19:11:55 +0100 I have no idea about how one do put a description of a picture, usually. Do you say Paris by night or should it be longer (describing exactly what is on the picture) etc... I'm a bit lost. -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
OT: Kenny Boy as a Digital Clock: (My Impression) was [Re: OT: Nikon D3]
You've obviously never seen a broken digital clock. To which I give a small improvisational piece of satiric artwork I call Kenny Boy as a Digital Clock http://www.mindspring.com/~morephotos/brokendigital.html Shel Belinkoff wrote: Which is still correct once or twice a day. Shel Ken is much more similar to a stopped *digital* clock... -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: An Eye for England
Thanks for posting this Bob, I really enjoyed the photos... Norm Bob W wrote: Staithes is one of the rather hackneyed subjects for a certain type of British landscape photographer, exemplified by people such as Joe Cornish, Michael Busselle and Charlie Waite. Their work is not generally to my taste, although it is very popular here. For me it relies too much on over-dramatising the subject, using things like split ND filters, warming filters and so on. Landscape photographers I enjoy are people like Fay Godwin, Tony Ray-Jones, Mark Power and James Ravilious. Browsing the web for information about English landscape photography I came across the following exhibition catalogue, which includes a good essay on the subject, encapsulating a lot of what I think. I'd never heard of the photographer, David Robbins, before. I hope you also enjoy it. On the front page, click the photo to see the exhibition, and the text Essay by John Taylor to read the essay: http://www.an-eye-for-england.co.uk/index.html -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Declined...
Walter Hamler wrote: Well, at least they are doing something with the gallery. I had submitted 11 photos that were all tenatively accepted. This AM they show 6 in the Gallery, 1 in the Collection, 3 on hold, and 1 Declined. The declined shot was shot with a 135 SMC-M lens but they did not have a 135 in the selection menu, so I had it listed as unknown. I suspect that they don't want unknowns in the final gallery. Walt meanwhile, most of mine remain in limbo. I can picture the judges praying for more photos to arrive so they don't have to include mine. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Pentax gallery : picture description
Good to see you've seen the light, Tom :)
In the Pentax Gallery, I wrote from the Street Photographs book in
most of them, and from Water Molotov in the rest ('Water Molotov'
is the name of my photoblog)
j
On 3/7/07, Tom C [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Picture descriptions are an arrogant way of telling the viewer how to
interpret the photo and are condescending. Just write No Title. Better
yet, just give it a meaningless number.
Tom C.
From: Thibouille [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net
Subject: Pentax gallery : picture description
Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2007 19:11:55 +0100
I have no idea about how one do put a description of a picture, usually.
Do you say Paris by night or should it be longer (describing exactly
what is on the picture) etc...
I'm a bit lost.
--
Thibault Massart aka Thibouille
--
K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ...
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Juan Buhler - http://www.jbuhler.com
photoblog: http://photoblog.jbuhler.com
a book: http://www.jbuhler.com/book.html
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Re: Declined...
What's this Pentax Gallery? Shel -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Just a bit of something I experienced I thought I'd share with the club
Hi there. Couple of days ago I had a day off my work so that I took my time and visited Tel Aviv museum of arts. It turned out that I came towards the end of the day and also the museum was in the process of changing exhibitions. Yet, one of the exhibitions on display was The Poetics of Space by Raanan Levy. If you wish, you could look him up here: http://www.tamuseum.com/index.html. Please click on English on the front page and then choose Exhibitions from the icon menu on top. So I started with these paintings of empty spaces and then went on roaming the empty spaces of the museum. Very unusual feeling, I should tell you... It is a great pity photography is not allowed inside, 'cause it would make a fine set of almost-abstracts ;-). Then, eventually I got down to the museum shop to browse through the photography shelf. There I've found some albums by photographers that I might have wanted to have, such as HCB. And then it finally occurred to me that I don't want to buy a photo book by HCB or any other well known artist. Somehow I realized I'd rather see something in person on the wall and carry the emotions with me. I don't want to have these emotions with me all the time available at my whim. That would feel fake... So, I left the museum store and was on my way home... Just a bit of musings I'd put down in words, if you don't mind reading them. Boris -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Declined...
Pentax is putting together a gallery of images by Pentax users. I don't have the URL handy, you can search the archives but I bet someone will post it for you any minute now. Shel Belinkoff wrote: What's this Pentax Gallery? Shel -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PAW - 2007 - Feb 26 - March 4
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I took about 6 shots. All wider, this was cropped. Pigeon dropped (or something) and rusty rock with a twig and leaves in front of it. Didn't have a macro lens with me. Sun on left, shadow on the right. Probably around 3pm. So really the crop is the best of the lot. Thanks, Boris, let's wait for this week's PAW (yet to be shot) and next week's PAW (yet to be shot), then maybe a few more, then we'll see if it's really a good idea. LOL. This is indeed a good idea, this is undoubted. No proof is necessary. Though of course I shall be looking forward to seeing these PAWs that are yet to be shot ;-). Boris -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT -so how about a pano of moving objects ?
That's because the Miata guys are actually willing to race. I remember when some of the antics I see in spec Miata other amateur racing classes would get the perpetrator thrown out of the race Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Scott Loveless [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: OT -so how about a pano of moving objects ? On 3/3/07, Doug Franklin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a spec class like Spec Miata, where there are big globs of evenly matched cars, you're /going/ to do body work regularly. It's just the nature of the beast. I've probably seen more seriously bent Spec Miatae than any other single class. That's because the Miata guys are actually willing to race. I had a few connections at Chrysler who got me access to the infield at Gateway on a regular basis. We watched the races from the press booth and hung out in the pit areas. Lots of fun. The small budget cars were often the most fun to watch. The fast, powerful, expensive cars were boring. Seeing a bunch Viper and Cobra owners taking it easy so as to not trade paint gets old fast. Gimme a field full of Ford Escorts and Honda Civics anytime. -- Scott Loveless http://www.twosixteen.com Shoot more film! -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT -so how about a pano of moving objects ?
IOW, the short story is that he uses a photofinish camera. Not sure about that. Does it have film moving @ the speed of the horses? Kenneth Waller - Original Message - Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 9:03 AM Subject: RE: OT -so how about a pano of moving objects ? IOW, the short story is that he uses a photofinish camera. Unlike the horse track versions, this one isn't mounted opposite a mirror on the finish post, which is why the photofinish pics you see in the race results have a simultaneous view from both sides of the track. Those photofinish cameras shoot large format rollfilm, or even straight to paper. Rotating panorama cameras (but not the swinging lens type)will give the same result if they are prevented from rotating Regards, Anthony Farr -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kenneth Waller Sent: Sunday, 4 March 2007 12:24 PM To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List Subject: Re: OT -so how about a pano of moving objects ? Each image he makes is from one exposure on an entire roll of film, not a composite of several different images. He gets 66 inches of movement of the film in one second. The film is moving relative to the moving subject. He's using a standard Hasselblad 500 series but the film back contains a small motor various electronics adapted from the robotics industry. This gives him control of how fast the film moves when he opens the shutter. If he gets it right, the film is moving @ the same speed as the cars, allowing for a photo with dozens of speeding cars, all sharp. Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: cbwaters [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: OT -so how about a pano of moving objects ? Ok, I like it. How's he doing it? CW - Original Message - From: Kenneth Waller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 8:34 PM Subject: OT -so how about a pano of moving objects ? Interesting photography - Panoramas of moving objects http://www.distavision.com/index.html Kenneth Waller -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PAW - Camouflage (Repost)
suggested I work more with the crop on this one. BINGO! Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: PAW - Camouflage (Repost) Thanks to Ken who suggested I work more with the crop on this one. I think this is much more successful. http://members.aol.com/eactivist/PAWS/pages/pawFeb26.htm Comments welcome. Marnie aka Doe :-) BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO - Da Bear
Sounds like enough to notice the glaciers retreating. Or see the little cubs grow into their teenage years. v b g Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Cory Papenfuss [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: PESO - Da Bear I would love to see more shots to give a story/context to the close-up. Stay tuned. How often do you go to Denali? About every 3 to 4 years in the last 20 years. Sounds like enough to notice the glaciers retreating. I know the Mendenhall glacier in Juneau has changed *noticably* since I moved there in 1992. -Cory -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Declined...
As you say, digital images work best when they are lacking in detail and graphical in nature. Sort of style vs substance? Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: mike wilson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Declined... From: Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: 2007/03/05 Mon PM 01:47:29 GMT To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: Declined... mike wilson wrote: From: Mark Roberts [EMAIL PROTECTED] Paul Stenquist wrote: 46! I have to get busy. I think I've submitted about 22 so far. I'm trying to be selective, though; I'm only going with images that I think are very strong graphically, so they stand out as thumbnails as well as being good photographs when seen in detail. We'll see how it works out. This approach is known in NGO circles as funding led and is considered a bd thing. 8-) I don't think I understand the reference. But if anything in my life were funding led I'd have no life at all. Now that I think about it... Funding led means 'rearranging' your principles to attract the highest amount of funding. As you say, digital images work best when they are lacking in detail and graphical in nature. If your previous images were more inclined to hold a lot of detail and subtle nuance, changing the output to more graphical appearance in order to sell more might be construed as being funding led. The comment was meant mostly in jest but I think it is a valid concern as to the direction of photography in general. - Email sent from www.virginmedia.com/email Virus-checked using McAfee(R) Software and scanned for spam -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: A Paypal Question
Shel I can't be more helpful, but several years ago I was able to get Paypal to send me a check (and there was a small fee involved it that) - sorry but I don't remember the details if they will still do that. Kenneth Waller - Original Message - Sent: Monday, March 05, 2007 11:11 AM Subject: Re: A Paypal Question Well, what seemed like a simple thing has become a lot more complicated. I wanted to use the transferred funds to pay my eBay bill, but I wasn't allowed to unless I got verified, which, from what I can tell, means I have to give paypay access to my bank account. That will never happen. Then I thought to have Paypal just send me the money, but they won't do that because my mailing address is a PO box, something that should have been mentioned when I signed up. In order to add a street address to my account I have to give paypal access to my credit card information which A) I don't want to do and B) my credit card statement goes to my PO Box., which, of course, is unacceptable. Of course I now discover that there are fees to receive the money - perhaps my fault for not looking into the details more carefully, but there was nothing in the sign-up process that was obvious to me regarding charging me to receive money. Did someone say I can decline the payment? I don't think I want to deal with paypal. It's too intrusive and too complicated. Shel [Original Message] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: pdml@pdml.net Date: 3/5/2007 7:36:41 AM Subject: Re: A Paypal Question One other thing, Shel, it takes three days for fund to transfer to a real life account. Sometimes I've had it take longer, depending on when the money comes in, etc. Bear that in mind. But, overall, PayPal is pretty darn handy. Marnie aka Doe :-) BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PAW - Camouflage (Repost)
I agree, much improved - I might have named it Chameleon. Or Ken ! Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Bruce Dayton [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: PAW - Camouflage (Repost) I agree, much improved - I might have named it Chameleon. -- Bruce Monday, March 5, 2007, 6:38:06 AM, you wrote: Eac Thanks to Ken who suggested I work more with the crop on this one. Eac I think this is much more successful. Eac http://members.aol.com/eactivist/PAWS/pages/pawFeb26.htm Eac Comments welcome. Eac Marnie aka Doe :-) Eac BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers free Eac email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at Eac http://www.aol.com. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Declined...
On 3/7/07, Doug Brewer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Walter Hamler wrote: Well, at least they are doing something with the gallery. I had submitted 11 photos that were all tenatively accepted. This AM they show 6 in the Gallery, 1 in the Collection, 3 on hold, and 1 Declined. The declined shot was shot with a 135 SMC-M lens but they did not have a 135 in the selection menu, so I had it listed as unknown. I suspect that they don't want unknowns in the final gallery. Walt meanwhile, most of mine remain in limbo. I can picture the judges praying for more photos to arrive so they don't have to include mine. I'll be submitting tonight Doug. Relax, and have abeer.:-) Dave -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Equine Photography www.caughtinmotion.com http://brooksinthecountry.blogspot.com/ Ontario Canada -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch
Definitely not being critical of Paul, but I know some pros that wouldn't have taken that shot if they couldn't work around the white sky issue. Me, I might not have noticed the white issue when I took the image, but I would definitely have kept it until I could have taken a better one. Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Tom C [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch Hi Paul, I like the shot alot. Nut Hatches just don't seem to stay still for very long. Even when perched they seem to constantly be twitching. I know everyone's got a feeling about the white sky, which there was nothing you could do about in camera. Maybe a selection on just the white sky portion in photoshop and then a curves adjustment to bring it down to some level of gray...? Tom C. From: Paul Stenquist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 10:48:50 -0500 Thanks for the feedback Marnie. The white background is the sky. Paul On Mar 5, 2007, at 9:57 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 3/3/2007 2:38:19 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sorry for hogging bandwidth, but this pic might be worth a look. It demonstrates pretty good performance from a budget long-lens combo: The A 400/5.6 plus A2X-S converter. I also used the Pentax 540 FGZ in high-speed synch mode with the Kirk Flash Xtender. Handheld of course:-). Hey, it's only 800mm. Piece of cake. :-)). SR turned on. 1.500th, f5.6, ISO 1000. Cropped to about 75% of frame. http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5672710size=lg == I like everything but the white background. Since he is on a tree, it looks very unnatural. Marnie aka Doe BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: More dog pictures
Love the postures on 2249. Tough exposure nut to crack Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: William Robb [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: More dog pictures A bunch of snow, a couple of bored dogs, and a sunny afternoon made yesterday a great day to be me. I ended up machinegunning almost 300 shots in 15 or so minutes of my fellas barrelling around the yard. These were the best of the lot. Shot with the DA70mm LTD on the K10. http://users.accesscomm.ca/wrobb/fellas/bella/mar0407.html http://users.accesscomm.ca/wrobb/fellas/page3/page3.html Have fun William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
killed my D stone dead
hi folks, FYI: previously complained about here, http://www.mail-archive.com/pdml@pdml.net/msg283630.html I nursed my D along another year and a bit, during which time it stopped and starting working another 2 times. It finally permanently stopped working in January (on its 3rd birthday). I waited a few weeks to be sure it wasn't going to suddenly start working again, but it didn't, so I sent it to Pentax. They sent me back a message to say it was a short, and they'll be fixing the short and replacing some of the buttons (buh?) for a couple hundred bucks. They also said blah blah blah battery drain blah blah (I'm not a very good listener). I don't know what all that's about, I've never had a problem with drained batteries. Whatever. I remember back in year 1 when it stopped working a couple of times very briefly (a few minutes each time) and kind of wish I had sent it in then while it was still under warranty. Hindsight's 20/20 as they say. It's generally my practice not to send things in unless I can replicate the error on command, but I think I'll be changing that now. Anyhow, thought you guys would like to know. --skye -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch
Certainly! Funny that perceptions of what is natural/unnatural seem to be skewed by what we are used to being shown. In this case all elements in the composition were natural but it's perceived otherwise. Sometimes the sky is almost white or becomes very close to white to properly expose the subject. Juxtapose that sky against a straight line like the tree and voila! Tom C. From: Kenneth Waller [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2007 14:41:48 -0500 Definitely not being critical of Paul, but I know some pros that wouldn't have taken that shot if they couldn't work around the white sky issue. Me, I might not have noticed the white issue when I took the image, but I would definitely have kept it until I could have taken a better one. Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Tom C [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch Hi Paul, I like the shot alot. Nut Hatches just don't seem to stay still for very long. Even when perched they seem to constantly be twitching. I know everyone's got a feeling about the white sky, which there was nothing you could do about in camera. Maybe a selection on just the white sky portion in photoshop and then a curves adjustment to bring it down to some level of gray...? Tom C. From: Paul Stenquist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 10:48:50 -0500 Thanks for the feedback Marnie. The white background is the sky. Paul On Mar 5, 2007, at 9:57 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 3/3/2007 2:38:19 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sorry for hogging bandwidth, but this pic might be worth a look. It demonstrates pretty good performance from a budget long-lens combo: The A 400/5.6 plus A2X-S converter. I also used the Pentax 540 FGZ in high-speed synch mode with the Kirk Flash Xtender. Handheld of course:-). Hey, it's only 800mm. Piece of cake. :-)). SR turned on. 1.500th, f5.6, ISO 1000. Cropped to about 75% of frame. http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5672710size=lg == I like everything but the white background. Since he is on a tree, it looks very unnatural. Marnie aka Doe BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
PESO -- Thimble Islands at Sunset
http://www.mindspring.com/~morephotos/PESO_--_tiass.html Equipment: Pentax *ist-Ds/smc Pentax FA 70-210 f4~5.6. As usual comments are welcome but may be totally ignored. -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: OT: Rednecks (was Re: PESO: Long Morning, revisited)
This is a perfect example of what a title can do to a photo :-) No. I see it as a perfect example of what those photographed can do to a photo. Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Bong Manayon [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: OT: Rednecks (was Re: PESO: Long Morning, revisited) This is a perfect example of what a title can do to a photo :-) Bong On 3/6/07, John Sessoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Shel Belinkoff Hi Paul, Here's a couple of shots from a real trailer park wedding: I bet you didn't know I shot weddings. http://home.earthlink.net/~my-pics/wedding.html Tech details: Disposable camera, drugstore processing, edited in Etch-a-Sketch How 'bout a woman who understands fishin'? http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/2945536630071712637XDpQXO -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch
Exactly. White skies are natural, and I don't find them objectionable. I may replace it with a blue sky, but then again, I might not:-). On Mar 7, 2007, at 2:54 PM, Tom C wrote: Certainly! Funny that perceptions of what is natural/unnatural seem to be skewed by what we are used to being shown. In this case all elements in the composition were natural but it's perceived otherwise. Sometimes the sky is almost white or becomes very close to white to properly expose the subject. Juxtapose that sky against a straight line like the tree and voila! Tom C. From: Kenneth Waller [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2007 14:41:48 -0500 Definitely not being critical of Paul, but I know some pros that wouldn't have taken that shot if they couldn't work around the white sky issue. Me, I might not have noticed the white issue when I took the image, but I would definitely have kept it until I could have taken a better one. Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Tom C [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch Hi Paul, I like the shot alot. Nut Hatches just don't seem to stay still for very long. Even when perched they seem to constantly be twitching. I know everyone's got a feeling about the white sky, which there was nothing you could do about in camera. Maybe a selection on just the white sky portion in photoshop and then a curves adjustment to bring it down to some level of gray...? Tom C. From: Paul Stenquist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List pdml@pdml.net Subject: Re: PESO: White Breasted Nuthatch Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 10:48:50 -0500 Thanks for the feedback Marnie. The white background is the sky. Paul On Mar 5, 2007, at 9:57 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 3/3/2007 2:38:19 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sorry for hogging bandwidth, but this pic might be worth a look. It demonstrates pretty good performance from a budget long-lens combo: The A 400/5.6 plus A2X-S converter. I also used the Pentax 540 FGZ in high-speed synch mode with the Kirk Flash Xtender. Handheld of course:-). Hey, it's only 800mm. Piece of cake. :-)). SR turned on. 1.500th, f5.6, ISO 1000. Cropped to about 75% of frame. http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5672710size=lg == I like everything but the white background. Since he is on a tree, it looks very unnatural. Marnie aka Doe BRBRBR**BR AOL now offers -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
GESO: It Happened on Woodward
This is a rather large collection of photos taken on a half mile stretch of suburban Detroit's Old Woodward Avenue. It will hopefully end up as an eight to twelve shot gallery show and magazine article. I may decide to convert more shots to BW. I might make the set all BW, or I might make it all color. I have a few in mind that are definitely in, but I'm still trying to make my picks. I've shown the whole set to the gallery owner, and is working on a selection. The only definition here is that the pics were shot on Woodward. They're not necessarily street photography (a term I dislike almost as much as voyeuristic). Some are portraits, some are candids of unaware subjects, some are candids of people who saw the camera. It runs the range. Anyway, the whole kit and kaboodle is here: http://www.photo.net/photodb/folder?folder_id=703152 -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: More dog pictures
- Original Message - From: Kenneth Waller Subject: Re: More dog pictures Love the postures on 2249. Tough exposure nut to crack Thanks Ken. It was a happy capture, and the camera didn't let me down. When I checked the histogram, I noted that nothing was clipped on the exposure. I don't know offhand what the exposure range is on this shot, but it ranges from snow in full sun to a jet black dog. It makes me wonder how a racing car sitting under an awning on a cloudy day can be outside the dynamic range of a DSLR. William Robb http://users.accesscomm.ca/wrobb/fellas/page3/page3.html -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: PESO:The Missing link
what's it like if you try to download the file directly, bypassing all the html and javascript? http://www.web-options.com/Phone/content/bin/images/large/IMAGE_00026. jpg ? -- Bob -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of William Robb Sent: 06 March 2007 23:00 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List Subject: Re: PESO:The Missing link - Original Message - From: mike wilson Subject: Re: PESO:The Missing link Bob W wrote: In England bicycle wheels turn into autumn leaves: http://www.web-options.com/Phone/content/IMAGE_00026_large.html -- Bob Since you started to use Lightroom to make your web pages, your site has become remarkably slow. The background loads immediately but the thumbs and pictures take ages. It's like having a dedicated dial up connection just for his website, isn't it? William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: killed my D stone dead
Mmm you might want to sell for parts. Better than nothing. I feel sorry for you (and for the camera itself). 2007/3/7, skye [EMAIL PROTECTED]: hi folks, FYI: previously complained about here, http://www.mail-archive.com/pdml@pdml.net/msg283630.html I nursed my D along another year and a bit, during which time it stopped and starting working another 2 times. It finally permanently stopped working in January (on its 3rd birthday). I waited a few weeks to be sure it wasn't going to suddenly start working again, but it didn't, so I sent it to Pentax. They sent me back a message to say it was a short, and they'll be fixing the short and replacing some of the buttons (buh?) for a couple hundred bucks. They also said blah blah blah battery drain blah blah (I'm not a very good listener). I don't know what all that's about, I've never had a problem with drained batteries. Whatever. I remember back in year 1 when it stopped working a couple of times very briefly (a few minutes each time) and kind of wish I had sent it in then while it was still under warranty. Hindsight's 20/20 as they say. It's generally my practice not to send things in unless I can replicate the error on command, but I think I'll be changing that now. Anyhow, thought you guys would like to know. --skye -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: PESO:The Missing link
In England bicycle wheels turn into autumn leaves: http://www.web-options.com/Phone/content/IMAGE_00026_large.html -- Bob Since you started to use Lightroom to make your web pages, your site has become remarkably slow. The background loads immediately but the thumbs and pictures take ages. Somebody must have nicked the wheels... Is anybody else finding my site slow? Are you finding other peoples' Lightroom sites slow? I know Lightroom uses Javascript or something, maybe that has something to do with it. I'll dig around in the settings and see if there's anything I can do about it. Maybe I've overloaded my web site in some way - I'll try and figure something out. -- Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Declined...
Kenneth Waller wrote: As you say, digital images work best when they are lacking in detail and graphical in nature. Sort of style vs substance? By the way, I don't believe the statement that igital images work best when they are lacking in detail and graphical in nature. That's a massive oversimplification at *best*. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
GESO: It Happened on Woodward
This is a rather large collection of photos taken on a half mile stretch of suburban Detroit's Old Woodward Avenue. It will hopefully end up as an eight to twelve shot gallery show and magazine article. I may decide to convert more shots to BW. I might make the set all BW, or I might make it all color. I have a few in mind that are definitely in, but I'm still trying to make my picks. I've shown the whole set to the gallery owner, and is working on a selection. The only definition here is that the pics were shot on Woodward. They're not necessarily street photography (a term I dislike almost as much as voyeuristic). Some are portraits, some are candids of unaware subjects, some are candids of people who saw the camera. It runs the range. Anyway, the whole kit and kaboodle is here: http://www.photo.net/photodb/folder?folder_id=703152 -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: beauty shot: Pentax K10D- 17mm lenses are out there
Bill, DSLR cameras are showing 10 stops or more of dynamic range, which is about 3 stops more than that of print film, probably 5 stops more range than slide film. IMHO there's only one definitive truth - film emulsions react to the light in a different way than linear digital sensors. Indeed it's much easier to extract useful data from digital RAW files but does it prove that digital sensor captures wider dynamic range? IMHO it proves that current scanners are not capable of extracting data from the film more than anything else. Cheers, Peter -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Just a bit of something I experienced I thought I'd share with the club
Than you Boris. Had some emotions myself reading your story. 2007/3/7, Boris Liberman [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi there. Couple of days ago I had a day off my work so that I took my time and visited Tel Aviv museum of arts. It turned out that I came towards the end of the day and also the museum was in the process of changing exhibitions. Yet, one of the exhibitions on display was The Poetics of Space by Raanan Levy. If you wish, you could look him up here: http://www.tamuseum.com/index.html. Please click on English on the front page and then choose Exhibitions from the icon menu on top. So I started with these paintings of empty spaces and then went on roaming the empty spaces of the museum. Very unusual feeling, I should tell you... It is a great pity photography is not allowed inside, 'cause it would make a fine set of almost-abstracts ;-). Then, eventually I got down to the museum shop to browse through the photography shelf. There I've found some albums by photographers that I might have wanted to have, such as HCB. And then it finally occurred to me that I don't want to buy a photo book by HCB or any other well known artist. Somehow I realized I'd rather see something in person on the wall and carry the emotions with me. I don't want to have these emotions with me all the time available at my whim. That would feel fake... So, I left the museum store and was on my way home... Just a bit of musings I'd put down in words, if you don't mind reading them. Boris -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Thibault Massart aka Thibouille -- K10D,Z1,SuperA,KX,MX, P30t and KR-10x ;) ... -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
RE: Pentax K10D firmware update 1.11 now available
Presumably, if one wished to fiddle with oneself, one could temporarily reinstall the older firmware. I don't think fiddling is enough - you need Viagra too. In that case, you probably need a good service. that's always been true. Probably always will be. -- Bob -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Declined...
- Original Message - From: Mark Roberts Subject: Re: Declined... Kenneth Waller wrote: As you say, digital images work best when they are lacking in detail and graphical in nature. Sort of style vs substance? By the way, I don't believe the statement that digital images work best when they are lacking in detail and graphical in nature. That's a massive oversimplification at *best*. Sometimes massive oversimplifications hit the nail on the head. I carp quite often that this picture or that is worthy of a Wisner. By this, I mean that the picture is deserving of the increase in technical quality that more detail will provide. What I don't believe is that tired old saw about how a good picture will always overcome it's technical flaws. William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO -- Thimble Islands at Sunset
P. J. Alling wrote: http://www.mindspring.com/~morephotos/PESO_--_tiass.html Equipment: Pentax *ist-Ds/smc Pentax FA 70-210 f4~5.6. As usual comments are welcome but may be totally ignored. I like it... I really like the light. -- Christian http://photography.skofteland.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Is Feisol 3371 an upgrade?
Tim, I've got a Gitzo 1410 for sale that works well with larger 35mm format lenses. You really don't want to use a center column, especially with a long lens. Contact me off list if interested. Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Tim Øsleby [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: 'Pentax-Discuss Mail List' pdml@pdml.net Sent: Tuesday, March 06, 2007 2:09 PM Subject: Is Feisol 3371 an upgrade? My K10D came a few days ago. I'm very happy with it, but I am expecting a pretty large sum of money this month, so I feel an enablement coming. I have been struggling to tame a 500/4,5. I have got acceptable results, but I have a feeling that there is more living in this beast. So I'm thinking about upgrading my tripod setup, a Velbon CF-630 and the Manfrotto gimbal mount. I like the Velbon a lot, but max load is 6kg. Lens gimbal and camera weights about 5kg, so I may be a bit too close to max load with a 500mm (sometimes I use a TC too). My old knees tell me I need something light weight. I haven't got a sherpa, and I often carry other stuff too. So I've been thinking about Feisol CT-3371 (and perhaps a centre column, just in case). What do you say? Is it an upgrade or am I fooling myself? I know many of you are Gitzo fans, but it is so expensive. I'm also planning to buy a new dog, some more stuff... You get the general picture, I guess. Tim Typo Mostly harmless (just plain Norwegian) et -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
PESO (well not really) No Fun Allowed
Photographed at the local town beach. http://www.mindspring.com/~morephotos/nfa.html -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PESO:The Missing link
Not all that fast. Bob W wrote: what's it like if you try to download the file directly, bypassing all the html and javascript? http://www.web-options.com/Phone/content/bin/images/large/IMAGE_00026. jpg ? -- Bob -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of William Robb Sent: 06 March 2007 23:00 To: Pentax-Discuss Mail List Subject: Re: PESO:The Missing link - Original Message - From: mike wilson Subject: Re: PESO:The Missing link Bob W wrote: In England bicycle wheels turn into autumn leaves: http://www.web-options.com/Phone/content/IMAGE_00026_large.html -- Bob Since you started to use Lightroom to make your web pages, your site has become remarkably slow. The background loads immediately but the thumbs and pictures take ages. It's like having a dedicated dial up connection just for his website, isn't it? William Robb -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- Entropy Seminar: The results of a five yeer studee ntu the sekend lw uf thurmodynamiks aand itz inevibl fxt hon shewb rt nslpn raq liot. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
K10D RAW and Epson P2000 compatible
I hadn't checked before now, since until Lightroom v1.0 and Camera Raw v3.7 release I had the K10D set in RAW/DNG mode. I've now switched the camera to PEF mode RAW files to save on card space, and I tested downloading to the P2000. The P2000 can read the JPEG preview directly out of the PEF files! Nice, no need to do RAW+JPEG when on the road, and more storage on the SD cards to work with. Still no SDHC support, but I'm happy with 2G cards for the present at least. Godfrey -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Declined...
Sometimes massive oversimplifications hit the nail on the head. I carp quite often that this picture or that is worthy of a Wisner. By this, I mean that the picture is deserving of the increase in technical quality that more detail will provide. What I don't believe is that tired old saw about how a good picture will always overcome it's technical flaws. William Robb Define 'technical flaws'. :-) Tom C. -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: PUG Comments March 2007
Looks like the Palouse region to me. Very nice shot but for my money, I want it in color. Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Harald Rust [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: PUG Comments March 2007 Hi Tom, Thanks for the kind comment, much appreciated. Harald Tom C. wrote: Tree and Hills by Harald Rust http://pug.komkon.org/07mar/palubw.html Wonderful classic composition. Shot sure to a be a winner in color or grayscale. My personal favorite of the month. Get your own web address. Have a HUGE year through Yahoo! Small Business. http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/domains/?p=BESTDEAL -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
Re: Signing
Looks more like Gag me with a forefinger. Kenneth Waller - Original Message - From: Paul Stenquist [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hey, why stop now? Another pic from the same afternoon in the same coffee shop. But totally different light. Same lens: the DA 50-200 workhorse. This lady isn't giving her friend the finger. http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=5687954size=lg -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List PDML@pdml.net http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net
