subject:"\[RBW\] #%\*#\! Fenders\!\!\!\!"

Re: [RBW] Fenders for Roadeo

2023-10-26 Thread 'Michael Kashuba' via RBW Owners Bunch

I have aluminum fluted 63mm Velo Orange fenders on my orange 60 cm Appaloosa. Fit perfectly. No bending. Drilled one hole for added support/attachment to VO Campeur rear rack. Solid functional and handsome…… am considering mud flaps, but out here in Central Valley of California…… mud flaps…. Really?MJKSent from my iPhoneOn Oct 26, 2023, at 10:36 AM, BobW wrote:Looking for thoughts on metal fenders for my Roadeo. I believe the max tire size for fenders on a Roadeo is 32 or 33's??? So presuming a 45mm fender width works? Ideally I would like to install metal fenders. I have Berthouds on my Sam, and they are solid, work well, and look great. Wondering if anyone has has a good experience for metal fenders on a Roadeo that they can share??thanks!!Bob

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[RBW] Fenders for Roadeo

2023-10-26 Thread BobW

Looking for thoughts on metal fenders for my Roadeo.  I believe the max 
tire size for fenders on a Roadeo is 32 or 33's???  So presuming a 45mm 
fender width works?  

Ideally I would like to install metal fenders.  I have Berthouds on my Sam, 
and they are solid, work well, and look great.  Wondering if anyone has has 
a good experience for metal fenders on a Roadeo that  they can share??

thanks!!
Bob

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[RBW] Fenders on Clem and gravel bikes

2023-06-04 Thread Patrick Moore

On Sun, Jun 4, 2023 at 12:50 PM Ted Durant wrote:

*1. Can I keep my VO wavy fenders on a gravel bike? Yes, but do you really
want to? They'll limit your tire choice and it'll sound like you're shaking
a soda (pop) can (let's please not pollute the thread with that discussion)
full of rocks all ride long. As others have graphically shown, if it's
muddy, you'll just pack the mudguards full of mud. That said, I run fenders
on my Breadwinner, because most of my riding is on pavement and, until
recently, the roads were frequently wet. If was planning a longer off-road
ride, I'd ditch the fenders.*

I keep fenders on my dirt road bikes, full on the Matthews, clip-on on the
Monocog, since the fenders do help (greatly for the fulls, at least
slightly for the clip-ons) keep the dust off me and the bike; our local
very fine sand is thrown up in clouds of very fine dust. Hardly any mud
here in the high desert, of course, and slick tires on the Matthews and
very high clearances on the Monocog. (Actually, one reason I got the
Monocog was to have a "snow bike" for the 1 day every 2 years with
sufficient snow accumulation to allow a bosque snow ride. Yes, the last
time the snow did pack up the Monocog wheels -- and rd and cassette and
chain.)

*2. Slick or knobby? I can’t even get a straight answer on this. Which is
better? If it matters about the rider, this will be for a rider with a
healthy fear of crashing.Part of this comes down to what you mean by
"gravel". Tread only starts to make a difference when you're in soft stuff,
where the edges of the knobs can bite into something to provide more
acceleration/deceleration/cornering force. When you take a turn on gravel
you're going to have much less traction than on pavement, regardless of the
tires. Those pesky little gravel bits are easy to shove aside, and hooking
the edge of a knob on them just shoves them harder.*

Jan goes into this often and deeply to prove that knobs don't really help
in gravel. They do in sand, but I prefer treadless for fast pavement riding
and I'll slow in offroad corners.

*3. How wide? I have 42s on my bikes now and I don’t feel like they are
wide enough. Again, this may be a function of what type of "gravel" you're
on. For the crushed limestone trails of Wisconsin at reasonable speeds, 42
is plenty. If you get into softer, sandy trails, though, or you love to fly
through hairpin turns, bigger is always better. I ride 48s on my
Breadwinner and never feel like I have "too much tire" under me. Unlike
knobs, wider tires provide a genuine cornering advantage on loose surfaces,
as they spread the force across lots more of those pesky little gravel
bits, putting less force on each bit.*

This does indeed depend on the type and depth of sand. I've found that for
deep and silty sand, 50 mm is my minimum for relatively easy pedaling in
the deeper bits (up to 3" with some work or low gears), but 60 mm is very
noticeably better, and 72 mm just floats compared even to 60 mm. ~22/18/13
psi for each width. But for firm dirt and gravel, I'd be happy with 44s,
but I'm bigger than Leah.

*4. Tubeless or no? These wheels are tubeless-compatible but I put a tube
in them because I wasn’t riding enough to keep the sealant circulating. But
that can be changed right quick.I don't think gravel vs pavement enters
into that decision, unless by "gravel" you mean bouncing over baby heads at
high speed. One of the big benefits is eliminating pinch flats, which
generally result from hitting fairly large chunks of something at low
pressure. But you can do that in a Wisconsin pot hole on pavement, too. I'm
running tubeless on my Breadwinner, but I'm not convinced it's an
improvement, especially if you're not riding the bike frequently. I'm
careful about storing my bike, but I still get sealant drying in the valve
stems, which makes it very hard to put in air.*

IMO, sealant isn't worth the hassle and mess unless you contend with
goatheads or other very common puncture agents, or if you suffer from pinch
flats with tubes. Me, if I had to patch no more than 1 flat per ~75 miles
I'd just buy more Remas.

*Tires: what an embarrassment of riches we have today, compared to even 10
years ago.*

Amen.

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Fenders for bikes with big tires

2021-10-03 Thread Berkeleyan

I have VO fluted 52mm Zeppelin fenders on my 700x44 Compass tires 
(Snoqualmie Pass) mounted to Velocity Dyan rims. The tires measure 41mm 
when inflated to around 35psi (so delightful to ride). I like the fenders 
and the fitment. I'm using a RBW front fork, and the 52mm fenders had to be 
squished just a bit to fit, no way the 63mm would have fit there without 
Dremel tool cutting. What annoyed me was the front tire & fender would 
contact & chirp when I made quick tight turns, or stood on the pedals 
uphill. I've stopped the chirping by both spreading the fender just a bit 
wider and securely tightening the bolts that attach the stays.

I think if you go for a wider tire, you'll definitely want the 63mmm 
fenders. And know that the aluminum fenders will take careful fitting and 
adjusting, but will look beautiful.

- Andrew, Berkeley
On Sunday, October 3, 2021 at 12:47:10 PM UTC-7 Jay Lonner wrote:

> I’ll be curious to know where you wind up, both in terms of fender 
> selection and tire clearance. My Hunq has 2” Big Bens that are nearing end 
> of life and I’m thinking of replacing them with some 2.1” RH tires when the 
> time comes (probably the Antelope Pass, since my riding is 98% paved, but 
> the Fleecer Ridge just looks so much more Hunq-y). I currently have 50mm 
> SKS fenders that are cracked and chipped and are in need of replacement now 
> that the rains have returned. I’ve never used fenders other than SKS and I 
> don’t know that I have the patience to fiddle with an involved installation 
> such as I understand Honjos require. Last I looked, Riv suggests the P65 
> for all their fat tires (including 26” and 650b) which makes me concerned 
> that the radius isn’t optimized for 700c. I’ll have a look at VO though. 
>
> Jay Lonner
> Bellingham, WA
>
> Sent from my Atari 400
>
> On Oct 3, 2021, at 11:45 AM, Johnny Burrell  wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> Winter is coming **
>
> And so fenders are needed. I have a Hunqapillar with some big 2.1" tires. 
> My fender requirements are that they must fit, be pretty and not too short. 
> I like long fenders because long fenders + mud-flaps keep the muck off.  
>
> Here's where I'm at... 
>
>- Planet Bike fenders are too short, I think. These must be for 
>Californians 
>- PDW Full Metal Fenders are great, i have them on a different bike, 
>but unsure if the 55mm will fit my 2.1's
>- The SKS B65 may fit the bill, it's what Riv recommends, but they 
>look really short (here 
>
> 
>  is 
>the riv link with pic) and... plastic
>- Velo Orange seems to have some nice fenders in 63mm here they are 
>
> 
>
> These are going to last a really long time so price isn't really a 
> deciding factor. I also want them to look good, because I'm vain. After 
> typing all of this it appears I'm leaning toward the VO fenders, how do 
> folks here feel about them? How's their longevity?
>
> thank you,
> Johnny B in Portland
>
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Fenders for bikes with big tires

2021-10-03 Thread Jay Lonner

I’ll be curious to know where you wind up, both in terms of fender selection 
and tire clearance. My Hunq has 2” Big Bens that are nearing end of life and 
I’m thinking of replacing them with some 2.1” RH tires when the time comes 
(probably the Antelope Pass, since my riding is 98% paved, but the Fleecer 
Ridge just looks so much more Hunq-y). I currently have 50mm SKS fenders that 
are cracked and chipped and are in need of replacement now that the rains have 
returned. I’ve never used fenders other than SKS and I don’t know that I have 
the patience to fiddle with an involved installation such as I understand 
Honjos require. Last I looked, Riv suggests the P65 for all their fat tires 
(including 26” and 650b) which makes me concerned that the radius isn’t 
optimized for 700c. I’ll have a look at VO though. 

Jay Lonner
Bellingham, WA

Sent from my Atari 400

> On Oct 3, 2021, at 11:45 AM, Johnny Burrell  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> Winter is coming 
> 
> And so fenders are needed. I have a Hunqapillar with some big 2.1" tires. My 
> fender requirements are that they must fit, be pretty and not too short. I 
> like long fenders because long fenders + mud-flaps keep the muck off.  
> 
> Here's where I'm at... 
> Planet Bike fenders are too short, I think. These must be for Californians 
> PDW Full Metal Fenders are great, i have them on a different bike, but unsure 
> if the 55mm will fit my 2.1's
> The SKS B65 may fit the bill, it's what Riv recommends, but they look really 
> short (here is the riv link with pic) and... plastic
> Velo Orange seems to have some nice fenders in 63mm here they are
> These are going to last a really long time so price isn't really a deciding 
> factor. I also want them to look good, because I'm vain. After typing all of 
> this it appears I'm leaning toward the VO fenders, how do folks here feel 
> about them? How's their longevity?
> 
> thank you,
> Johnny B in Portland
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[RBW] Fenders for bikes with big tires

2021-10-03 Thread Johnny Burrell

Hello,
Winter is coming **

And so fenders are needed. I have a Hunqapillar with some big 2.1" tires. 
My fender requirements are that they must fit, be pretty and not too short. 
I like long fenders because long fenders + mud-flaps keep the muck off.  

Here's where I'm at... 

   - Planet Bike fenders are too short, I think. These must be for 
   Californians 
   - PDW Full Metal Fenders are great, i have them on a different bike, but 
   unsure if the 55mm will fit my 2.1's
   - The SKS B65 may fit the bill, it's what Riv recommends, but they look 
   really short (here 
   

 is 
   the riv link with pic) and... plastic
   - Velo Orange seems to have some nice fenders in 63mm here they are 
   


These are going to last a really long time so price isn't really a deciding 
factor. I also want them to look good, because I'm vain. After typing all 
of this it appears I'm leaning toward the VO fenders, how do folks here 
feel about them? How's their longevity?

thank you,
Johnny B in Portland

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Re: [RBW] Fenders for train commute

2019-12-04 Thread Patrick Moore

"Sheesh"!

On Wed, Dec 4, 2019 at 4:10 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> Shees! "Their"!
>
> On Wed, Dec 4, 2019 at 4:09 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>
>> I suppose that I am the "Patrick" in question. If so: "Glad to help."
>> And, the fenders don't look half-bad.
>>
>> I do notice the cardinal sin of SKS, which is that *they're fenders are
>> so g**dd short! *Yours aren't as bad as the 700C X 65s that I
>> installed on the Matthews (with 700C X 60 mm tires measuring actual 60 mm
>> wide and almost 30" tall); those were so short that even had I installed
>> the rear on the front, it would have been too short. But the flap makes up
>> the difference in front, and on the rear, unless you ride in pelotons, you
>> don't need full coverage in the rear.
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 4, 2019 at 12:12 PM Eric G  wrote:
>>
>>> I decided to go with SKS based on your recommendation, Patrick. The
>>> installation wasn’t so bad, but they could benefit from a bit more
>>> adjustment. Most importantly — they work!
>>>
>>> Eric
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>> an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/9255352f-620e-4a20-8876-2a887017f576%40googlegroups.com
>>> .
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> ---
>> Patrick Moore
>> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> --
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>
>
>

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Fenders for train commute

2019-12-04 Thread Patrick Moore

I suppose that I am the "Patrick" in question. If so: "Glad to help." And,
the fenders don't look half-bad.

I do notice the cardinal sin of SKS, which is that *they're fenders are so
g**dd short! *Yours aren't as bad as the 700C X 65s that I installed on
the Matthews (with 700C X 60 mm tires measuring actual 60 mm wide and
almost 30" tall); those were so short that even had I installed the rear on
the front, it would have been too short. But the flap makes up the
difference in front, and on the rear, unless you ride in pelotons, you
don't need full coverage in the rear.

On Wed, Dec 4, 2019 at 12:12 PM Eric G  wrote:

> I decided to go with SKS based on your recommendation, Patrick. The
> installation wasn’t so bad, but they could benefit from a bit more
> adjustment. Most importantly — they work!
>
> Eric
>
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> .
>

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Fenders for train commute

2019-12-04 Thread Patrick Moore

Shees! "Their"!

On Wed, Dec 4, 2019 at 4:09 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:

> I suppose that I am the "Patrick" in question. If so: "Glad to help." And,
> the fenders don't look half-bad.
>
> I do notice the cardinal sin of SKS, which is that *they're fenders are
> so g**dd short! *Yours aren't as bad as the 700C X 65s that I
> installed on the Matthews (with 700C X 60 mm tires measuring actual 60 mm
> wide and almost 30" tall); those were so short that even had I installed
> the rear on the front, it would have been too short. But the flap makes up
> the difference in front, and on the rear, unless you ride in pelotons, you
> don't need full coverage in the rear.
>
> On Wed, Dec 4, 2019 at 12:12 PM Eric G  wrote:
>
>> I decided to go with SKS based on your recommendation, Patrick. The
>> installation wasn’t so bad, but they could benefit from a bit more
>> adjustment. Most importantly — they work!
>>
>> Eric
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>> email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/9255352f-620e-4a20-8876-2a887017f576%40googlegroups.com
>> .
>>
>
>
> --
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>
>
>

-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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Re: [RBW] Fenders for train commute

2019-11-30 Thread Patrick Moore

I've used all sorts of fenders, from Blumel to Zefal, even though I live in
a high desert region. I've dented metal fenders, Berthouds, Honjos, and VOs
-- the 2 pairs of VOs I've owned seemed to be made of slightly thinner
gauge aluminum, but I emphasize "seemed". Planet Bike and SKS fenders don't
dent. The downside is that their stay system is (IMO) far inferior to that
for the metal fenders. Me, if I were to choose fenders purely for
resistance to damage, I'd install PBs or SKSs and rig up a Honjo (etc.)
type of stay system.

Suggestion: Install PB or SKS fenders, but order 2 pairs of extra-thick
gauge stays (Honjo type) and "R" clips from Kelpie, and adapt the plastic
fenders to fit them; far stiffer than even Honjo and Berthoud stays.

I'd have chosen plastic fenders for my Matthews if I could have found some
big enough. As it is, I ordered aluminums from Kelpie, which are 2X the
gauge, I think, of the usual metal makes, and come with the extra thick
stays I mentioned. I daresay you can dent Kelpies, but it would be harder
to do so.

On Fri, Nov 29, 2019 at 9:08 PM Eric G  wrote:

> The rainy season has started in SF and I am considering putting fenders on
> my Sam. I commute daily on the Caltrain where people stack their bikes side
> by side. Generally folks are not very considerate about how they place
> their bikes. Would fenders be easily broken or damaged in transit? Anyone
> have experience with this? Would certain brands be sturdier than others?
>
> Thanks!
> Eric G@rs
> SF
>
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> .
>


-- 

---
Patrick Moore
Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum

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[RBW] Fenders for train commute

2019-11-29 Thread Eric G

The rainy season has started in SF and I am considering putting fenders on my 
Sam. I commute daily on the Caltrain where people stack their bikes side by 
side. Generally folks are not very considerate about how they place their 
bikes. Would fenders be easily broken or damaged in transit? Anyone have 
experience with this? Would certain brands be sturdier than others?

Thanks!
Eric G@rs
SF

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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-14 Thread hugh flynn

Justin Oakland asks:

"Has anyone mounted the SKS B65 (
https://www.rivbike.com/collections/accessories/products/sks-esge-commuter-ii-silver-fenders-b65-700c-29er)
on a AHH/Saluki/Hillborne/Country bike that takes 42ish tires? How do they
fit?"

Well, that depends on how you want to define "fit."

I have the SKS B65's mounted on an Appaloosa running 700 x 44 (Snoqualamine
Pass) tires. As far as side to side coverage is concerned, the B65's are
great! Ample coverage on both sides of the tire. Front to back though, they
are quite a bit...shorter...than one used to P45's or Longboard's might
expect. I get that plastic fenders are often shorter than their metal
counterparts, but man, these are short even by plastic fender standards.

Depending on how you look at it, that might be an advantage. Sure, they
provide less coverage from rain splatter, but on a bike that sees off-road
use, they are certainly less likely to pick-up sticks and other debris.

Hugh "Shawty" Flynn
Newburyport, MA

On Thu, Feb 14, 2019 at 3:00 PM Justin, Oakland 
wrote:

> Has anyone mounted the SKS B65 (
> https://www.rivbike.com/collections/accessories/products/sks-esge-commuter-ii-silver-fenders-b65-700c-29er)
> on a AHH/Saluki/Hillborne/Country bike that takes 42ish tires? How do they
> fit?
>
> -J
>
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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-14 Thread RichS

Another take on fenders: sometimes you want or need fenders but sometimes you 
don’t. The advantage to a fender such as the SKS plastic models is they can be 
installed & removed without much difficulty. 

I have VO aluminum fenders on my Sam. Certainly some
work to mount but I love the look and they perform quite well. They are on for 
the long haul. Unlike the SKS fenders on my Atlantis:-)

Best,
Rich in ATL

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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-14 Thread Justin, Oakland

Has anyone mounted the SKS B65 
(https://www.rivbike.com/collections/accessories/products/sks-esge-commuter-ii-silver-fenders-b65-700c-29er)
 
on a AHH/Saluki/Hillborne/Country bike that takes 42ish tires? How do they 
fit?

-J

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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-14 Thread Ron Mc




and I forgot to add this gratuitous photo

On Thursday, February 14, 2019 at 8:03:06 AM UTC-6, Ron Mc wrote:
>
> Steve, that's a Soma Wingman, and they started by cleaning up the idea of 
> using the CP brake arm - 
> https://www.somafab.com/archives/product/wingmann-light-mount . 
> For my standoff, I used a speargun tip-thread converter, 5/16"-24 to M6.  
> The whole thing casts a really nice light pattern across the top of the 
> tire, giving me a good light cone for pedaling before dawn.  
>
> On Thursday, February 14, 2019 at 7:51:01 AM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> What is that arm?  I know some folks have used half of a centerpull brake 
>> as a lamp bracket, but that doesn't quite look like one.   In my case, I 
>> just used a piece of aluminum stock I'd gotten from Home Depot some years 
>> before that was left over from another project.  The Edelux lamp works fine 
>> when mounted to a typical front rack, and in my set-up is almost at that 
>> same height.  I can see where a lamp meant to be mounted to a handlebar 
>> such as yours might have to be mounted higher.
>>
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-14 Thread Ron Mc

Steve, that's a Soma Wingman, and they started by cleaning up the idea of 
using the CP brake arm 
- https://www.somafab.com/archives/product/wingmann-light-mount . 
For my standoff, I used a speargun tip-thread converter, 5/16"-24 to M6.  
The whole thing casts a really nice light pattern across the top of the 
tire, giving me a good light cone for pedaling before dawn.  

On Thursday, February 14, 2019 at 7:51:01 AM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
>
>
> What is that arm?  I know some folks have used half of a centerpull brake 
> as a lamp bracket, but that doesn't quite look like one.   In my case, I 
> just used a piece of aluminum stock I'd gotten from Home Depot some years 
> before that was left over from another project.  The Edelux lamp works fine 
> when mounted to a typical front rack, and in my set-up is almost at that 
> same height.  I can see where a lamp meant to be mounted to a handlebar 
> such as yours might have to be mounted higher.
>
>
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-14 Thread Steve Palincsar



On 2/14/19 8:25 AM, Ron Mc wrote:

Steve, totally effective and totally sexy.



next to compare are our two functional uses of a Brit right-fork lamp 
bracket boss




What is that arm?  I know some folks have used half of a centerpull 
brake as a lamp bracket, but that doesn't quite look like one.   In my 
case, I just used a piece of aluminum stock I'd gotten from Home Depot 
some years before that was left over from another project.  The Edelux 
lamp works fine when mounted to a typical front rack, and in my set-up 
is almost at that same height.  I can see where a lamp meant to be 
mounted to a handlebar such as yours might have to be mounted higher.






On Thursday, February 14, 2019 at 7:05:53 AM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar 
wrote:



On 2/13/19 11:40 PM, Ron Mc wrote:

Bill, those long front French-style fenders (Honjo) buffet badly
without the additional front rack attachment - to the point you
worry about them possibly contacting the tire at speed.



Let me amend that: "...without an additional front rack attachment
*/or an extra stay to stabilize the front of the fender/*" like this:



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Alexandria, Virginia
USA

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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-14 Thread Ron Mc

Steve, totally effective and totally sexy.  

 

next to compare are our two functional uses of a Brit right-fork lamp 
bracket boss

On Thursday, February 14, 2019 at 7:05:53 AM UTC-6, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
>
> On 2/13/19 11:40 PM, Ron Mc wrote:
>
> Bill, those long front French-style fenders (Honjo) buffet badly without 
> the additional front rack attachment - to the point you worry about them 
> possibly contacting the tire at speed.  
>
>
> Let me amend that: "...without an additional front rack attachment *or an 
> extra stay to stabilize the front of the fender*" like this:
>
>
> -- 
> Steve Palincsar
> Alexandria, Virginia 
> USA
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-14 Thread Steve Palincsar



On 2/13/19 11:40 PM, Ron Mc wrote:
Bill, those long front French-style fenders (Honjo) buffet badly 
without the additional front rack attachment - to the point you worry 
about them possibly contacting the tire at speed.



Let me amend that: "...without an additional front rack attachment */or 
an extra stay to stabilize the front of the fender/*" like this:



--
Steve Palincsar
Alexandria, Virginia
USA

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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-13 Thread Ron Mc

Bill, those long front French-style fenders (Honjo) buffet badly without 
the additional front rack attachment - to the point you worry about them 
possibly contacting the tire at speed.  
Regards

On Wednesday, February 13, 2019 at 8:57:35 PM UTC-6, Bill Schairer wrote:
>
> ...
> Ron, 
>
> Yours looks beautiful.  Those are the kind of pictures that sometimes make 
> think I want to try.  While my setup did have some rattle noise up front, 
> that is something I think I can address.  The noise I’m wondering about in 
> particular is not actually noise the fender is making but the drivetrain 
> noise that the rear fender seems to pick up and amplify.   
> ...
> Bill

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Re: [RBW] Fenders

2019-02-13 Thread Patrick Moore

Bill: I've installed innumerable fenders of all kinds, from Blumels to
Zefals, plastic, plasticized aluminum, polycarbonate, steel, stainless
steel, and aluminum. Here's what I've found.

Once you've installed fenders a few times, it becomes relatively easy as
long as you don't have to reshape them --eg, recurve, or dimple to clear
calipers or fork legs or chainstays. But even all of that isn't too hard if
you go slow and methodical -- I don't, and messed up several nice expensive
metal fenders on the way to learning how to do it properly.

Fenders don't play nice with horizontal dropouts, though if you are using a
derailleur, it should be possible to set them up in a way that best fits
the tire if you use dropout screws to keep the axle always at the same
point in the dropouts. And it should be possible to do this while allowing
the wheel to come out of the dropouts easily.

For example, if you were to position your axle further forward, you'd get a
better fender line wrt the tire. Alternatively, if your stays are long
enough to allow this while still allowing easy wheel removal, you could
space the forward end of the fender out from the chainstay bridge by a
little bit.

I've managed to get decent, if not perfect chainline on my 2003 Road that
has very long dropouts, at least when the drivetrain is set in the cruising
gear; but the fenders still accommodate a 5-tooth cog differnence -- 17/19
and 22 flip side. One thing that lets me do this more easily is that, for
another reason altogether -- convenience in parking the bike and shoving it
into the back of a car -- I amputate my rear fenders so that they end just
above the rearmost part of the tire; ie, just short enough that I can back
the rear tire enthusiastically into a wall and miss the fender.

As to strength and quiet: poly carb (Planet Bike) and plastic/alum (SKS)
are IME every bit as strong as metal if not strong; certainly stronger than
my current VO hammered aluminums (tho' the VOs are perfectly adequate).
I've dented Honjos, Berthouds, and VOs, but never dented or cracked PB or
SKS.

And if properly installed, polycarb and SKSs are as quiet as metal; in
fact, while the present VOs don't rattle, they are considerably more noisy
when the tire kicks a piece of gravel around the inside of the fender. I
have used PB polycarbs and, presently, SKSs on my dirt road Matthews, and
apart from the SKS strut brackets crowding the 60mm+ tires and occasionally
buzzing lightly, they are quiet and certainly strong; there is about 2" of
toe overlap with the front, so that I often kick it in turns; no problems.

*I* would like to try Kelpie's custom, hand-beated titanium fenders on the
Matthews, but at $300 to $350, it's hard to justify them in a place that
gets an average of 9" citywide rain and snow per year. I ought to refashion
the fender brackets on the SKSs, tho' even these have not been a real
problem.

On Wed, Feb 13, 2019 at 9:23 AM Bill Schairer  wrote:

> I’ve ridden with fenders off and on going way back.  I’ve only used
> plastic fenders and never paid too much attention to the cosmetics of it
> all - just tried to get them on and running without tire rub.  Naturally,
> seeing all the beautiful pictures of bikes that show up here with nice
> metal fenders, or wood, I’ve wondered what it would be like to get some
> nice aluminum fenders installed instead of the SKS I have on my Atlantis.
> Not only might they look nice but I’ve read they don’t rattle as much so
> are quieter than plastic fenders.
>
> A few weeks ago, I bought an old Univega touring bike that had been
> customized. What caught my attention was the full dynamo hub lighting
> system.  I bought the bike for no other reason than to get the lighting
> system for my Atlantis.  Although the bike was old and the build overall
> did not look too recent, the lighting system seemed to be almost unused and
> I got the whole bike for less than what I could have built up my own new
> lighting system.
>
> So back to fenders.  In addition to the lights, this bike had Honjo
> fenders so here was my chance to see what some nice aluminum fenders are
> all about.  Unfortunately, the fenders are rather narrow so there was no
> way I could install them on my Atlantis with the 50mm tires I’m running.  I
> chose instead to install them on my old Trek 720 mostly just to see what
> they were all about.  I had read that metal fenders can be a challenge to
> install requiring patience.  I learned this is true.  What, I think, I also
> discovered is that these fenders wrap so much of the tire that removing and
> installing the rear wheel with the horizontal dropouts is a bit of a
> challenge and a nice fender line pretty much impossible (not that that was
> ever very important to me).  I have tentatively decided these things are
> made for bikes with vertical dropouts.
>
> What I have not been able to confirm is that metal fenders are quiet or
> even quieter than plastic fenders.  On my first ride, the front

Re: [RBW] Fenders - worth the safety risks? Rethinking my fender use.

2017-05-26 Thread 'Dave Small' via RBW Owners Bunch

Thanks for linking to the safety tabs.  I was unaware anything like that 
existed.  Any chance you could post a picture of them with your VO fenders?

I like fenders on any bike that might get caught out in the rain, and have 
VO fenders on several bikes.  I've sometimes pondered the negative safety 
aspects, but have kept living on the edge!  At one point I was gonna try 
Riv's plastic fenders, but they're only 45mm wide.  On a Sam with 38mm 
tires I decided I'd rather have VO's 52mm Zeppelins without the release 
than have Riv's 45mm fenders with them.  If I could have the best of both 
worlds . . .

On Friday, May 26, 2017 at 7:48:29 AM UTC-4, Tim Gavin wrote:
>
> Portland Design Works sells an "FMF safety tab".  I added two sets to my 
> metal VO fenders and they work great. The FMF safer tabs incorporate a grub 
> screw for the stay length, so it's easy to micro-adjust them for a perfect 
> fender line.
>

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Re: [RBW] Fenders - worth the safety risks? Rethinking my fender use.

2017-05-26 Thread Patrick Moore

I don't ride often in the rain, but I do occasionally ride in very heavy (=
SW downpour) rain and let me tell you, even when riding through 6" of
flowing water, fenders **do** help keep you dry. They also keep the bike
much cleaner.

Do fenders make riding more risky, particularly when there is a great deal
of debris on the road? Yes, but they don't hugely increase the risk, IMO.
When there is a great deal of debris on the road, there is also more risk
of getting a stick in the spokes; or in the derailleur, assuming you use
such an effete thing. And, you can set fenders up to prevent wheel jamming:
for plastic fenders, breakwaway tabs; or by attaching the front fender
halfway up the fork legs.

Moreover, there is the argument from common experience, also known as* quod
semper et ab omnibus et ubique*: people have been riding bikes with fenders
for over a hundred years without epidemics of injuries. In most places,
fenders are stock on bicycles.

Sweat: Rain capes do work. They do blow about, but I've ridden without
undue comfort in capes in huge drenchers with huge and gusty winds. I get
soaked from neck up and from knees down, but in between is cool and dry, at
least if you use a thinner nylon cape. I found the Carradice Ducksback too
heavy, and that did make me sweat.

I use a thin and cheap Campmore, weighted down in back with 2 or 3 packets
of washers attached to the lower rear skirt. (It's been a while since I
used the cape, and it's stuffed into its sack, and I don't want to pull it
out; sufficient to say that 2 or 3 stacks of 2 or 3 sufficiently large
washers attached by rubber band or any other method you prefer do keep the
rear skirt in place and let you dispense with the annoying leg straps and
waist ties.

On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:42 AM, lum gim fong 
wrote:

> I have been using fenders now for a few years on my Rivbikes, but I get
> nervous sometimes. Where I live it rains pretty often and lotsa sticks on
> the shoulders.
> I have heard about the stick jamming effects that can happen, and
> sometimes I wonder if using fenders is worth the risk.
>
> For instance, it would be easier for me to just clean myself and the bike
> after a rain ride than to heal up after an endo.
>
> Also, Unless it is a very light rain, I get soaked anyway, even in quality
> rain gear and shoe covers, from sweat/rain. Shoes become marshlands despite
> shoe covers, etc.
>
> Today I rode 30 + miles in a light rain with full fenders and quality rain
> gear. Arms soaked, back soaked, head soaked, hands soaked. Rest of me was
> dry. So it worked pretty well. But that was a continual light rain.
>
> I got heavily rained on in the last 5 miles of a metric century last year,
> in same gear and full Honjo fenders and was drenched to the bone, sloshing
> sneakers, whole nine. I may as well have been without fenders the whole
> ride and not had the stick jam crumple fender risk.
>
> *How do you cope on long rainy rides if you don't use fenders?*
>
> I wear wool to keep warm, but if I get drenched anyway, what's the use of
> fenders if there is the endo risk? One injury endo would pretty much negate
> all the cleanness and dryness I have had. And I would probably swear off
> fenders forever.
>
> Rethinking rethinking.
>
> Here is a shot from today's rainy ride. Enjoy!
>
>
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still more!  I am offering services in trade for a road bike, or frame and
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Re: [RBW] Fenders - worth the safety risks? Rethinking my fender use.

2017-05-26 Thread Philip Kim

Thanks for sharing these Tim. Didn't know PDW had something thats nice and 
sleek like these.

Lum, I don't do any brevets or anything but commute year round.

For pants I used Makers & Riders 3 season pants, which are completely 
waterproof but super breathable. Not sure if they make them anymore but it 
wouldn't hurt to ask if they have something equivalent to that.

For summers it's a bit harder, I wear thicker nylon waterproof shorts like 
Sugoi or something. I ride wool socks and have gortex shoes. I try to wear 
the Makers & Riders pants when I can,  so the  rain doesn't drip down into 
my shoes.

I've tried to use waterproof socks, but have yet to find any that are also 
breathable.


On Friday, May 26, 2017 at 7:48:29 AM UTC-4, Tim Gavin wrote:
>
> I had a stick jam in my rear fender stays. I skidded to a stop safely. The 
> fender (SKS P45) accordioned under the brake bridge, but nothing besides 
> the fender was damaged.
>
> Since then, I use a safety tab on the rear as well as the front fender 
> stays.
> Riv sells the SKS tab.
> For metal fenders with round stays (Honjo, Berthoud, VO, PDW), Portland 
> Design Works sells an "FMF safety tab".  I added two sets to my metal VO 
> fenders and they work great. The FMF safer tabs incorporate a grub screw 
> for the stay length, so it's easy to micro-adjust them for a perfect fender 
> line.
>
>
> My points are: a rear fender jam isn't as catastrophic as a front jam. 
>  But, both can be  mitigated with safety tabs at the stay ends.
>
>
> --Tim; with full fenders on 3 bikes in "sticky" Iowa
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On May 26, 2017, at 1:42 AM, lum gim fong  > wrote:
>
> I have been using fenders now for a few years on my Rivbikes, but I get 
> nervous sometimes. Where I live it rains pretty often and lotsa sticks on 
> the shoulders.
> I have heard about the stick jamming effects that can happen, and 
> sometimes I wonder if using fenders is worth the risk.
>
> For instance, it would be easier for me to just clean myself and the bike 
> after a rain ride than to heal up after an endo.
>
> Also, Unless it is a very light rain, I get soaked anyway, even in quality 
> rain gear and shoe covers, from sweat/rain. Shoes become marshlands despite 
> shoe covers, etc.
>
> Today I rode 30 + miles in a light rain with full fenders and quality rain 
> gear. Arms soaked, back soaked, head soaked, hands soaked. Rest of me was 
> dry. So it worked pretty well. But that was a continual light rain.
>
> I got heavily rained on in the last 5 miles of a metric century last year, 
> in same gear and full Honjo fenders and was drenched to the bone, sloshing 
> sneakers, whole nine. I may as well have been without fenders the whole 
> ride and not had the stick jam crumple fender risk.
>
> *How do you cope on long rainy rides if you don't use fenders?*
>
> I wear wool to keep warm, but if I get drenched anyway, what's the use of 
> fenders if there is the endo risk? One injury endo would pretty much negate 
> all the cleanness and dryness I have had. And I would probably swear off 
> fenders forever.
>
> Rethinking rethinking.
>
> Here is a shot from today's rainy ride. Enjoy!
>
>
> -- 
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> 
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Fenders - worth the safety risks? Rethinking my fender use.

2017-05-26 Thread Tim Gavin

I had a stick jam in my rear fender stays. I skidded to a stop safely. The 
fender (SKS P45) accordioned under the brake bridge, but nothing besides the 
fender was damaged.

Since then, I use a safety tab on the rear as well as the front fender stays.
Riv sells the SKS tab.
For metal fenders with round stays (Honjo, Berthoud, VO, PDW), Portland Design 
Works sells an "FMF safety tab".  I added two sets to my metal VO fenders and 
they work great. The FMF safer tabs incorporate a grub screw for the stay 
length, so it's easy to micro-adjust them for a perfect fender line.


My points are: a rear fender jam isn't as catastrophic as a front jam.  But, 
both can be  mitigated with safety tabs at the stay ends.


--Tim; with full fenders on 3 bikes in "sticky" Iowa

Sent from my iPhone

> On May 26, 2017, at 1:42 AM, lum gim fong  wrote:
> 
> I have been using fenders now for a few years on my Rivbikes, but I get 
> nervous sometimes. Where I live it rains pretty often and lotsa sticks on the 
> shoulders.
> I have heard about the stick jamming effects that can happen, and sometimes I 
> wonder if using fenders is worth the risk.
> 
> For instance, it would be easier for me to just clean myself and the bike 
> after a rain ride than to heal up after an endo.
> 
> Also, Unless it is a very light rain, I get soaked anyway, even in quality 
> rain gear and shoe covers, from sweat/rain. Shoes become marshlands despite 
> shoe covers, etc.
> 
> Today I rode 30 + miles in a light rain with full fenders and quality rain 
> gear. Arms soaked, back soaked, head soaked, hands soaked. Rest of me was 
> dry. So it worked pretty well. But that was a continual light rain.
> 
> I got heavily rained on in the last 5 miles of a metric century last year, in 
> same gear and full Honjo fenders and was drenched to the bone, sloshing 
> sneakers, whole nine. I may as well have been without fenders the whole ride 
> and not had the stick jam crumple fender risk.
> 
> How do you cope on long rainy rides if you don't use fenders?
> 
> I wear wool to keep warm, but if I get drenched anyway, what's the use of 
> fenders if there is the endo risk? One injury endo would pretty much negate 
> all the cleanness and dryness I have had. And I would probably swear off 
> fenders forever.
> 
> Rethinking rethinking.
> 
> Here is a shot from today's rainy ride. Enjoy!
> 
> 
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[RBW] Fenders - worth the safety risks? Rethinking my fender use.

2017-05-26 Thread iamkeith

Not addressing your question directly, but did you see the blog entry a while 
back that showed a scrunched sks/esge fender, from where a stick or something 
jammed and the quick release stay "didn't?"  

It was pretty impressive and put me at ease a bit.  Im probably a bit unique - 
and definitely vain - because i use fenders on my rivs more for the protection 
of the bike than myself.  I use the plastic sks ones, precisely because they 
are expendable /disposable. 

Holefully i or someone can find that photo

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