Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] [Marketing] Dutch mirror
On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 00:12, Marten Vijn i...@martenvijn.nl wrote: On Thu, 2009-05-21 at 17:50 -0400, Walter Bender wrote: This is great work. Thanks. On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 5:36 PM, Marten Vijn i...@martenvijn.nl wrote: Hi All, I expect more mirror sites soon. So may we should have a mirror list on the wiki like: || full / limited || ftp/http || link || party || Shall I create one ? Please do so. Here it is http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Mirrors I see that http is also working for this mirror: http://ftp.snt.utwente.nl/pub/software/sugarlabs/soas/releases/ Thanks, Tomeu Kind Regards, Marten -walter -- http://martenvijn.nl Marten Vijn http://martenvijn.nl/trac/wiki/soas Sugar on a Stick http://bsd.wifisoft.org/nek/ The Network Event Kit http://har2009.org 13th-16th August http://opencommunitycamp.org 26th Jul - 2nd August ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) i...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Report on using Gnash for digital signage
2009/5/19 Kristian Frank Erikson kristian.erik...@eyemagnet.com: Hi Sugar Labs devel list I know you guys use Gnash quite a bit. I've been working for eyemagnet lately and did a little work on Gnash. One of the outcomes was this report, on using Gnash for digital signage. There are permanent versions available on: http://nz.eyemagnet.com/files/Gnash_For_Digital_Signage.pdf http://erikson.dk/archive/eyemagnet/Gnash_For_Digital_Signage.pdf I hope this is useful for others out there using and developing on Gnash. Thanks a lot! Tomeu Cheers Kristian -- Kristian Erikson, Systems Development, eyemagnet - sfi, mobile: 021 02 376737 email: kristian.erik...@eyemaget.com skype: splinter_84 web: www.eyemagnet.com ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Removing the 'Erase' options from activity righ click menu
On Mon, May 4, 2009 at 3:56 PM, Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.org wrote: Yeah, we made easy deleting activities, including Browse, because we thought we had made easy enough to update them. Yes. And also, because it's very easy to install new activities. People patching Sugar to remove 'erase' are changing one problem for another. When children discover how to install activities, they'll install *a lot of them* and fill up their storage space (it's happened a lot in Uruguay). The solution is to show them how to delete them, so you don't want to disable it :-) The right solution may be in having a configurable list of 'core' activities that the UI won't offer 'erase' for. Browse.xo belongs there surely. cheers, m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] [Marketing] Dutch mirror
On Fri, 2009-05-22 at 09:30 +0200, Tomeu Vizoso wrote: On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 00:12, Marten Vijn i...@martenvijn.nl wrote: On Thu, 2009-05-21 at 17:50 -0400, Walter Bender wrote: This is great work. Thanks. On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 5:36 PM, Marten Vijn i...@martenvijn.nl wrote: Hi All, I expect more mirror sites soon. So may we should have a mirror list on the wiki like: || full / limited || ftp/http || link || party || Shall I create one ? Please do so. Here it is http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Mirrors I see that http is also working for this mirror: http://ftp.snt.utwente.nl/pub/software/sugarlabs/soas/releases/ Fixed, and and second mirror is added from NLUUG (prof unix group) Marten Thanks, Tomeu Kind Regards, Marten -walter -- http://martenvijn.nl Marten Vijn http://martenvijn.nl/trac/wiki/soas Sugar on a Stick http://bsd.wifisoft.org/nek/ The Network Event Kit http://har2009.org 13th-16th August http://opencommunitycamp.org 26th Jul - 2nd August ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) i...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel -- http://martenvijn.nl Marten Vijn http://martenvijn.nl/trac/wiki/soas Sugar on a Stick http://bsd.wifisoft.org/nek/ The Network Event Kit http://har2009.org 13th-16th August http://opencommunitycamp.org 26th Jul - 2nd August ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] LXDE to use transiflex
Hi, wonder if this means anything for us: http://blog.lxde.org/?p=336 Regards, Tomeu ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] LXDE to use transiflex
On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 3:57 PM, Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.org wrote: Hi, wonder if this means anything for us: http://blog.lxde.org/?p=336 Transifex is a web based tool that lets you upload PO files and commits them for you (regardless of the underlying VCS). They have much grander plans, but at the moment, I think much of it is still on paper. We used to use Transifex at some point (around mid-2007), but later we decided to switch to Pootle, since it lowers the barrier to contribution significantly (and the functionality that was provided by Transifex was already covered by Pootle - you can always do offline translations and upload them). -sdg- -- Sayamindu Dasgupta [http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings] ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] possible foundation for an email activity
Hi, Anjal uses Webkit and the evolution backend and has a cool UI, may be interesting to see how to use that code in an activity. http://live.gnome.org/Anjal Regards, Tomeu ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 11:29:56PM +0200, NoiseEHC wrote: When I tried jhbuild what I found strange that it does not detect the Linux distro so I had to manually enter commands as it was specified on the wiki. That must have been quite some time ago as sugar-jhbuild does detect the distro (using lsb-release) since before I started maintaining it. I also purged outdated instructions some time ago. If your distro isn't detected (i.e. ./sugar-jhbuild depscheck is giving an error) then either a) something is broken (recently happened for Fedora because of the Rawhide - F11 switchover, but has already been fixed) or b) you don't have lsb-release installed or c) it's currently unknown/unsupported (i.e. not one of Debian squeeze/sid, Fedora 10/11, Ubuntu intrepid/jaunty). CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 01:29:12PM +0200, NoiseEHC wrote: I am talking about this: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Jhbuild/Fedora I'm assuming you're talking about the Prerequisites section. There are two answers to your question: 1. (sugar-)jhbuild needs a certain set of packages to work at all (git, svn, ...), so those need to be installed before you even start sugar-jhbuild. While we could do some wrapper checking for all of these programs and warning the user accordingly, I do not see any real advantage in doing so. The user (*) should read the instructions (i.e. the wiki page) anyway. 2. (sugar-)jhbuild only has support for single packages as dependencies, not package groups (Debian tasks, Fedora groups, ...). Adding support for this is possible, but again with little benefit (as we'd only need it for prerequisites). BTW text like the dependency check will fail if you don't have a DISPLAY set does not mean too much for Windows people like me (I did manage to google the answer so it was not a question). I've never seen that happen, so that note is gone for good now. If it evers occurs again, please file a bug (as it definitely is a bug). (*) Read: developer / power user. sugar-jhbuild is not meant for ordinary users. CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] Tracking upstream versions with sugar-jhbuild (was: Re: Simplifying sugar-jhbuild)
On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 10:03:09AM +0200, Tomeu Vizoso wrote: 1) Stop checking out random unstable versions of external projects. They break very often, and we cannot fix them. Let's instead upgrade manually every once in a while after some testing. We are supposed to be doing this already, [...] Are we? The first line of the Jhbuild wiki page still reads: Sugar-jhbuild will automatically download the latest of Sugar's dependencies as well as Sugar itself directly from their source repositories, rather than relying on source packages that may have become stale. To me, changing this is a policy decision, so I'd like to have a broader discussion about it. Advantages: + less frequent breakages (only on manual updates) + maybe less total number of breakages (because some of them might be already fixed in the meantime) Disadvantages: - we discover incompatible upstream changes only after a while when upstream is less likely to change it - regular manual updates needed - need to track security updates and apply them ASAP (already a nightmare for xulrunner) An option might be to use different modulesets in parallel (latest deps + latest Sugar, stable deps + latest Sugar, stable deps + stable Sugar) and have BuildBot instances for all of them. That way developers can use a reliable system, but we still get notified of upstream breakages early. We already use distro packages wherever possible, BTW (*). So this is just about packages where the distro version (if any) is unsuitable to Sugar, usually either because it's an old distro version or we're relying on very recent features. (*) If you find out that for any package we currently build on our own the distro version in fact suffices, please file a bug against sugar-jhbuild. I have little to no information about which versions or features we actually need. CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Tracking upstream versions with sugar-jhbuild (was: Re: Simplifying sugar-jhbuild)
On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 14:23, Sascha Silbe sascha-ml-ui-sugar-de...@silbe.org wrote: On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 10:03:09AM +0200, Tomeu Vizoso wrote: 1) Stop checking out random unstable versions of external projects. They break very often, and we cannot fix them. Let's instead upgrade manually every once in a while after some testing. We are supposed to be doing this already, [...] Are we? The first line of the Jhbuild wiki page still reads: Sugar-jhbuild will automatically download the latest of Sugar's dependencies as well as Sugar itself directly from their source repositories, rather than relying on source packages that may have become stale. That surprises me. At the beginning, we depended on several features that weren't yet released by the upstream projects. But as of today, most of it should be released (if not packaged). I would say that whoever wrote that was misinformed or it's really old info. To me, changing this is a policy decision, so I'd like to have a broader discussion about it. Advantages: + less frequent breakages (only on manual updates) + maybe less total number of breakages (because some of them might be already fixed in the meantime) Disadvantages: - we discover incompatible upstream changes only after a while when upstream is less likely to change it - regular manual updates needed - need to track security updates and apply them ASAP (already a nightmare for xulrunner) An option might be to use different modulesets in parallel (latest deps + latest Sugar, stable deps + latest Sugar, stable deps + stable Sugar) and have BuildBot instances for all of them. That way developers can use a reliable system, but we still get notified of upstream breakages early. I think that what people are asking is for simplifying jhbuild, so I would go for binary packages when possible, then released tarballs and then for pre-release tarballs (snapshots). That's for external dependencies, I think we should checkout the latest sources of all the packages maintained as part of Sugar. We already use distro packages wherever possible, BTW (*). So this is just about packages where the distro version (if any) is unsuitable to Sugar, usually either because it's an old distro version or we're relying on very recent features. (*) If you find out that for any package we currently build on our own the distro version in fact suffices, please file a bug against sugar-jhbuild. I have little to no information about which versions or features we actually need. Cheers, Tomeu CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJKFpkiAAoJELpz82VMF3DaVSwH/3OD4tLVNCZoOogFiY42LQXn OGQ6CXgcqDs55SvghmFpTpa6vOXwGn/kUo6Gk4wOqduISoVebHi8mBaM1g3Oq+/d SlsNVPoEkEb58xI1sTmSkYNqnleoIcwkuF6XtnK/qadqcu/V/hi3gNWjaKVfT/Ih pv1qwg//hkH4jiB7vMPml/12r5KBgiV/64WvqFkS/I9b0tYD49xpJuGV953pKC2K GTdTTsoHOKJid4tLl1+6WjiCovCzWpzMF+BlGwMkLiDPwgWkmtmX4qSzVORa4YAe rsLV6fUORM6tiiyzjCDFpbmiToJwwVdb9faEYLJI26JOWwFY6p3A2+9TligxrJg= =qiD/ -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 08:28:07PM +0200, Bernie Innocenti wrote: xulrunner now fails to build with gcc 4.4 (in F11) because of a tiny error in an #elif directive. Is there a way in jhbuild to apply patches to sources? Take a look at the telepathy-gabble definition. Other modules try to apply patches as well but actually don't because they're using the wrong syntax. (*) xulrunner is also one of the worst compile time hog we have. If we could only build it on distros that require it, it would save a lot of trouble to a lot of developers. +5. See [1] for what you can do to change that. ;) I'd vote for disabling it now and lazily wait to see if someone complains before actually adding a workaround. You mean you want to break Browse for Debian (the only system where we actually compile xulrunner ourselves)? No icecream for you :-P 4) We could check for prerequisites before starting the build. Some configure scripts are stupid enough to fail tests silently and proceed anyway using no as a command name in make :-) Do you mean we should run ./sugar-jhbuild depscheck before each build or is it not working at all for you? In the former case, I would recommend against at, as depscheck is rather slow. In the latter case, please provide more details (distro version, exact error output, lsb_release output, ...). (*) I've not yet had time to check whether these patches should actually be applied. Seems like it has been broken for quite some time (if it ever worked), so the patches are likely to be stale. [1] http://dev.sugarlabs.org/ticket/137 CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 08:41:40PM +0200, Tomeu Vizoso wrote: No need to do that for all users, we can do it distro by distro. I think that each distro in jhbuild should have its maintainer, as Sascha cannot run all of them. Currently I am (running an instance of all supported distros), but you're totally right this doesn't scale well. For a start, a Mandriva maintainer would be nice (currently the only distro we don't support, but have a set of dependencies for). Also, maybe what we need is better documentation rather than big changes that bring new problems? What kind of documentation are you thinking of? CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] Sugar Developer MINUTES (Thursday May 21 2009 - 14.00 (UTC))
Attendees: Tomeu, Aleksey, Walter, Sayamindu, Simon Retrospect: We have been brainstorming on the Goals of the 0.86 release. The Output can be seen at http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86 Feel free to add items you feel important to the roadmap - have in mind that it is a short release cycle and therefore we have only a certain amount of things we can do. Prospect: Next week we will iter over the points and find owners for the them. The time to propose items ends the 5th of June after the developers meeting in two weeks. By then each feature item needs a concrete plan. Examples: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Library or https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DeviceKit See you next week - a reminder will be send out. Regards, Simon PS: The schedule have been updated as well: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86#Schedule ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 01:34:20PM +0200, NoiseEHC wrote: For example by autodetecting the Linux distro, it could create a full command line. Of course, if it could be automated then it should just say something: The following dependencies are missing: long list here. To install them, type in your root password: type here. Certainly possible, though I have some thoughts regarding the details (e.g. the user shouldn't ever type any password into a random program). Please file a feature request upstream (i.e. at Gnome). And why shall I run jhbuild 3 times anyway? It could have a default option when it does an update then depscheck and then a build... Actually you only need to run it two times, as the update part is redundant: [1]: (Note that build will update first anyway, so run update separately if you want to see what changed more easily.) I agree it's a bit buried, improvements are welcome. Regarding doing a default macro consisting of depscheck + build, it's a good idea. Please file a bug at dev.sugarlabs.org against sugar-jhbuild so I don't forget about it. Patches are welcome, of course (take a look at sjhbuild/main.py). :) [1] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Jhbuild#Other_commands CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] possible foundation for an email activity
It looks lovely, even has conversations (the one absolutely necessary feature of GMail). The GUI is also very simple, most of it is the WebView. 2009/5/22 Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.org: Hi, Anjal uses Webkit and the evolution backend and has a cool UI, may be interesting to see how to use that code in an activity. http://live.gnome.org/Anjal Regards, Tomeu ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 14:59, Sascha Silbe sascha-ml-sugar-de...@silbe.org wrote: On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 02:47:22PM +0200, Tomeu Vizoso wrote: Also, maybe what we need is better documentation rather than big changes that bring new problems? What kind of documentation are you thinking of? Something like what we currently have, only that addressing the points recently raised. Can you be a bit more specific, please? Sorry, the conversation started by Bernie included lots of stuff. Maybe Bernie could enter tickets for all the jhbuild and documentation improvements he has identified? Regards, Tomeu CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJKFqGxAAoJELpz82VMF3DadZwIAJsGMWSxOxodegM6q36d3hR0 pnQH+JnBQAJb5MqMqCxx9OhgjwxjHc8TjMBw7arqGN/1+Pvzp9sRPa2Hzm87xegH kBolRaW01ZllVOttlVYiOpOpuXx8iXRgGrt6dfHGiJ19LsFR9peq8nIGZQBGkF00 xQTchZEhmfueJM0XIb1Il7t0XfkoYCsoP+guBTJ4ni7Wq1D5ASsafXq7J36h0VxT DJKYKzASlpScC4gOGW0GaUz8PWWJJ/+frxZUIF4mZYWe/0BDZ9U6M/ujjK4/cCiu Swn3PLt9DYLfqWPO0mrDOc8+nLds5htF/pZURgWGQg2qn20FCp4C8i2RcsRSWI8= =pUVc -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 02:47:22PM +0200, Tomeu Vizoso wrote: Also, maybe what we need is better documentation rather than big changes that bring new problems? What kind of documentation are you thinking of? Something like what we currently have, only that addressing the points recently raised. Can you be a bit more specific, please? CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On 05/22/09 13:29, Sascha Silbe wrote: On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 11:29:56PM +0200, NoiseEHC wrote: When I tried jhbuild what I found strange that it does not detect the Linux distro so I had to manually enter commands as it was specified on the wiki. That must have been quite some time ago as sugar-jhbuild does detect the distro (using lsb-release) since before I started maintaining it. I also purged outdated instructions some time ago. If your distro isn't detected (i.e. ./sugar-jhbuild depscheck is giving an error) then either a) something is broken (recently happened for Fedora because of the Rawhide - F11 switchover, but has already been fixed) or b) you don't have lsb-release installed or c) it's currently unknown/unsupported (i.e. not one of Debian squeeze/sid, Fedora 10/11, Ubuntu intrepid/jaunty). Support for Fedora 11 was missing in sysdeps. I pushed a patch adding it. -- // Bernie Innocenti - http://codewiz.org/ \X/ Sugar Labs - http://sugarlabs.org/ ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar with Metacity (again)
On 22 May 2009, at 11:51, Sayamindu Dasgupta wrote: Hello, Revisiting the topic of replacing matchbox with a more standard window manager[1], I have just uploaded a soas2 build in which Sugar uses (unmodified) metacity instead of matchbox. The image also has the Gimp, xterm and gcalctool so that you can test how metacity treats those normally while making activities occupy the entire screen. At the moment, a few activities are getting positioned incorrectly (I'll look into the activity code to figure out what's wrong), Here's a quick run through of the activities. Correctly positioned: Memorize IRC InfoSlicer Write Chat Terminal Browse Joke Machine Poll Builder Paint Labyrinth View Slides Image Viewer Jukebox Read Offset, incorrectly sized and/or other related issue: Jigsaw Puzzle Moon Calculate Pippy TurtleArt (locked up, very slow, unusable) Record (main window OK but preview window ends up obscuring much of the UI) Etoys (mainly black screen, very slow, unusable, would not fully stop) FreeCell (mainly black screen, very slow, unusable, would not fully stop) Story Builder TamTamSynthLab TamTamMini TamTamEdit Slider Puzzle Cartoon Builder Flipsticks Develop Log Watching the re-draw as things (messily) start-up, it kind'a looks like windows are initially opened at a mix of different sizes (some too small, some too large). The activity then sets-up its UI, and only then receive some late window manager event to go fullscreen. Activities that don't expect their window to be dynamically resized stay offset and/or incorrectly sized. and etoys is showing black screens while loading a project, but apart from those, things seem to work fine. Try running gimp-2.0 or gcalctool or xterm from the Terminal Activity to see how metacity takes care of non-activities. Please test this if possible and let the mailing list know if you find more issues. Here's a few more: - When activities are started you initially see a sugar-session window with traditional widget decoration (close/minimise/etc) and title, again after a few seconds delay the pulsing activity icon begins and then the window decorations switch off and the window re-adjusts its size/layout. - All activities end up with a 3-4 pixel grey boarder around their outer edge (Fitts's law issue as right/bottom scroll bars are no longer at the edge of the screen). - You can still drag a fullscreen activity window around using the top grey boarder. - Holding alt down and dragging, drags a fullscreen window around from anywhere. - A few times when clicking the grey boarders I managed to trigger the window manager's context palette and window resizing cursors. - Watch out for some window manager shortcut keys Alt+F9, Alt+F7, Alt +F8, Alt+F4. Regards, --Gary The relevant trac ticket is http://dev.sugarlabs.org/ticket/602 The ISO can be downloaded from: http://people.sugarlabs.org/sayamindu/isos/Soas2-200905212052_sayamindu_metacity.iso You can test the image with qemu (or qemu-kvm) with the following command: sudo qemu-kvm -cdrom Soas2-200905212052_sayamindu_metacity.iso -boot d -m 1024M (adjust the value of the -m option based on the amount of RAM you have in your system, and if you do not have qemu-kvm, you can try to run it with qemu) Thanks, Sayamindu [1] http://erikos.sweettimez.de/?p=678 -- Sayamindu Dasgupta [http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings] ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar with Metacity (again)
On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 16:33, Gary C Martin g...@garycmartin.com wrote: On 22 May 2009, at 11:51, Sayamindu Dasgupta wrote: Hello, Revisiting the topic of replacing matchbox with a more standard window manager[1], I have just uploaded a soas2 build in which Sugar uses (unmodified) metacity instead of matchbox. The image also has the Gimp, xterm and gcalctool so that you can test how metacity treats those normally while making activities occupy the entire screen. At the moment, a few activities are getting positioned incorrectly (I'll look into the activity code to figure out what's wrong), Here's a quick run through of the activities. Thanks, Gary! Sayamindu: have you considered moving the window management stuff from the sugar shell to a metacity plugin? Regards, Tomeu Correctly positioned: Memorize IRC InfoSlicer Write Chat Terminal Browse Joke Machine Poll Builder Paint Labyrinth View Slides Image Viewer Jukebox Read Offset, incorrectly sized and/or other related issue: Jigsaw Puzzle Moon Calculate Pippy TurtleArt (locked up, very slow, unusable) Record (main window OK but preview window ends up obscuring much of the UI) Etoys (mainly black screen, very slow, unusable, would not fully stop) FreeCell (mainly black screen, very slow, unusable, would not fully stop) Story Builder TamTamSynthLab TamTamMini TamTamEdit Slider Puzzle Cartoon Builder Flipsticks Develop Log Watching the re-draw as things (messily) start-up, it kind'a looks like windows are initially opened at a mix of different sizes (some too small, some too large). The activity then sets-up its UI, and only then receive some late window manager event to go fullscreen. Activities that don't expect their window to be dynamically resized stay offset and/or incorrectly sized. and etoys is showing black screens while loading a project, but apart from those, things seem to work fine. Try running gimp-2.0 or gcalctool or xterm from the Terminal Activity to see how metacity takes care of non-activities. Please test this if possible and let the mailing list know if you find more issues. Here's a few more: - When activities are started you initially see a sugar-session window with traditional widget decoration (close/minimise/etc) and title, again after a few seconds delay the pulsing activity icon begins and then the window decorations switch off and the window re-adjusts its size/layout. - All activities end up with a 3-4 pixel grey boarder around their outer edge (Fitts's law issue as right/bottom scroll bars are no longer at the edge of the screen). - You can still drag a fullscreen activity window around using the top grey boarder. - Holding alt down and dragging, drags a fullscreen window around from anywhere. - A few times when clicking the grey boarders I managed to trigger the window manager's context palette and window resizing cursors. - Watch out for some window manager shortcut keys Alt+F9, Alt+F7, Alt +F8, Alt+F4. Regards, --Gary The relevant trac ticket is http://dev.sugarlabs.org/ticket/602 The ISO can be downloaded from: http://people.sugarlabs.org/sayamindu/isos/Soas2-200905212052_sayamindu_metacity.iso You can test the image with qemu (or qemu-kvm) with the following command: sudo qemu-kvm -cdrom Soas2-200905212052_sayamindu_metacity.iso -boot d -m 1024M (adjust the value of the -m option based on the amount of RAM you have in your system, and if you do not have qemu-kvm, you can try to run it with qemu) Thanks, Sayamindu [1] http://erikos.sweettimez.de/?p=678 -- Sayamindu Dasgupta [http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings] ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Tracking upstream versions with sugar-jhbuild (was: Re: Simplifying sugar-jhbuild)
On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 2:30 PM, Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.org wrote: That surprises me. At the beginning, we depended on several features that weren't yet released by the upstream projects. But as of today, most of it should be released (if not packaged). +1 I think that what people are asking is for simplifying jhbuild, so I Yes. And generally lowering the barriers of entry to hacking on Sugar. Sugar (and the whole OLPC stack) used to carry a ton of patches that made things painful and fragile. Nowadays, most of those patches found their way upstream. Perhaps it's time to take advantage of that and simplify things :-) m -- martin.langh...@gmail.com mar...@laptop.org -- School Server Architect - ask interesting questions - don't get distracted with shiny stuff - working code first - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/User:Martinlanghoff ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] [ANNOUNCE] Bug tracker housekeeping
Dear Sugar Community, After the dust of the 0.84 release has been settled we like to clean up the database. With each new Sucrose release comes some bug tracker housekeeping. This e-mail is designed to let you know about the things we ask you to do until May 27, 2009: Submitters: Please go through all the open bugs you have submitted. If some information has been requested - please provide this information. If the bug does not apply anymore - feel free to close it and leave a short note. Owners: Please go through the bugs you own and update them accordingly. If the bugs marked 0.84 still apply - please move them to the 0.86 milestone. __ Triage day: Wednesday - 27th of May 2009 - 16.00 (UTC) - going through the list of 0.86 bugs and see if there are things that needs to be added explicitly to the Roadmap. - cleaning up left overs Thanks for reading, Simon (for the BugSquad Team [1]) [1] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/BugSquad ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
[Sugar-devel] Sugar-Developers meeting REMINDER (28 May, 2009 - 16.00 (UTC)) --- irc.freenode.net, #sugar-meeting
Hi, in the next week's developers meeting we will iterate over the roadmap proposals [1] and find owners for the them. The time to have the proposals including an owner and a description together ends the 5th of June after the developers meeting in two weeks. By then each feature item needs a concrete plan. A template for the proposal will be up soon. Note that the time is 16:00 (UTC) - I hope this will work out for everyone. Regards, Simon [1] http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86#Proposal_Goals ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Developer MINUTES
I didn't see Aleksey's espeak gstreamer plugin included in the roadmap. This is needed for text to speech with highlighting support for Read Etexts, and is being included in SoaS now. I'm looking forward to having a version of Sugar I can install on my XO where this is included. James Simmons Date: Fri, 22 May 2009 14:49:01 +0200 From: Simon Schampijer si...@schampijer.de Subject: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Developer MINUTES (Thursday May 21 2009 - 14.00 (UTC)) To: Sugar Devel sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org Message-ID: 4a169f3d.3020...@schampijer.de Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Attendees: Tomeu, Aleksey, Walter, Sayamindu, Simon Retrospect: We have been brainstorming on the Goals of the 0.86 release. The Output can be seen at http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86 Feel free to add items you feel important to the roadmap - have in mind that it is a short release cycle and therefore we have only a certain amount of things we can do. Prospect: Next week we will iter over the points and find owners for the them. The time to propose items ends the 5th of June after the developers meeting in two weeks. By then each feature item needs a concrete plan. Examples: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Library or https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DeviceKit See you next week - a reminder will be send out. Regards, Simon ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Developer MINUTES
Are there any plans to port Sugar to the XO-1 or will it be the job of OLPC so it will be effectively abandoned? Simon Schampijer wrote: Attendees: Tomeu, Aleksey, Walter, Sayamindu, Simon Retrospect: We have been brainstorming on the Goals of the 0.86 release. The Output can be seen at http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86 Feel free to add items you feel important to the roadmap - have in mind that it is a short release cycle and therefore we have only a certain amount of things we can do. Prospect: Next week we will iter over the points and find owners for the them. The time to propose items ends the 5th of June after the developers meeting in two weeks. By then each feature item needs a concrete plan. Examples: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Library or https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DeviceKit See you next week - a reminder will be send out. Regards, Simon PS: The schedule have been updated as well: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86#Schedule ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Developer MINUTES
Hi Noise. There is and there will be (i presume), a collaboration between the two teams (OLPC and Sugarlabs), to port sugar to the XO 1.5. but details on how this will be done are still missing. Rafael Ortiz On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 11:43 AM, NoiseEHC noise...@freemail.hu wrote: Are there any plans to port Sugar to the XO-1 or will it be the job of OLPC so it will be effectively abandoned? Simon Schampijer wrote: Attendees: Tomeu, Aleksey, Walter, Sayamindu, Simon Retrospect: We have been brainstorming on the Goals of the 0.86 release. The Output can be seen at http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86 Feel free to add items you feel important to the roadmap - have in mind that it is a short release cycle and therefore we have only a certain amount of things we can do. Prospect: Next week we will iter over the points and find owners for the them. The time to propose items ends the 5th of June after the developers meeting in two weeks. By then each feature item needs a concrete plan. Examples: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Library or https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DeviceKit See you next week - a reminder will be send out. Regards, Simon PS: The schedule have been updated as well: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86#Schedule ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Developer MINUTES
On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 6:43 PM, NoiseEHC noise...@freemail.hu wrote: Are there any plans to port Sugar to the XO-1 or will it be the job of OLPC so it will be effectively abandoned? Sugar sits on top of standard linux distributions. The challenge in this instance is on the shoulders of the hardware vendor to push the necessary patches, or maintain the fork, necessary to take advantage of specialized hardware. david Simon Schampijer wrote: Attendees: Tomeu, Aleksey, Walter, Sayamindu, Simon Retrospect: We have been brainstorming on the Goals of the 0.86 release. The Output can be seen at http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86 Feel free to add items you feel important to the roadmap - have in mind that it is a short release cycle and therefore we have only a certain amount of things we can do. Prospect: Next week we will iter over the points and find owners for the them. The time to propose items ends the 5th of June after the developers meeting in two weeks. By then each feature item needs a concrete plan. Examples: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Activities/Library or https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DeviceKit See you next week - a reminder will be send out. Regards, Simon PS: The schedule have been updated as well: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/Development_Team/Release/Roadmap/0.86#Schedule ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 03:45:04PM +0200, Bernie Innocenti wrote: Support for Fedora 11 was missing in sysdeps. I pushed a patch adding it. Thanks! The way Fedora versioning works is starting to get annoying (I had to add Fedora 10.93 just two weeks ago). Maybe we should add some kind of fallback hack (i.e. use Rawhide for unknown versions) for Fedora. CU Sascha -- http://sascha.silbe.org/ http://www.infra-silbe.de/ signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [Marketing] Usage scenarios for Sugar?
On Fri, 2009-05-22 at 20:03 +0200, Sean DALY wrote: Hi everyone, we have been contacted by a monthly tech publication in Europe willing to devote several pages to Sugar in their summer issue! More specifically, advising parents how to download run SoaS and do educational stuff with their kids during the summer holidays. Off the top of my head I suggested a scenario where Memorize is customized with family photos, a Turtle Art lesson, ... Suggestions please! - a custom image with a jabebr config for german-holyday-jabber-server - feedb...@sugarlabs.org form - cd image in the distribution - collect holiday story's of kids in dailymotion / wiki - German Language as default - collect emailadresses for longterm support - 3g support - static version of dailymotion / german wikipedia on usb-drive - photo/story contest. - Having SugarCamp(ings) (Opencommunitycamp :) ) just 2ct, Marten thanks Sean ___ Marketing mailing list market...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/marketing -- http://martenvijn.nl Marten Vijn http://martenvijn.nl/trac/wiki/soas Sugar on a Stick http://bsd.wifisoft.org/nek/ The Network Event Kit http://har2009.org 13th-16th August http://opencommunitycamp.org 26th Jul - 2nd August ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Developer MINUTES
On 05/22/2009 07:06 PM, David Farning wrote: On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 6:43 PM, NoiseEHCnoise...@freemail.hu wrote: Are there any plans to port Sugar to the XO-1 or will it be the job of OLPC so it will be effectively abandoned? Sugar sits on top of standard linux distributions. The challenge in this instance is on the shoulders of the hardware vendor to push the necessary patches, or maintain the fork, necessary to take advantage of specialized hardware. david Right, Sugar will work on Fedora - and the plan of OLPC is to use Fedora 12 in the future and get all the diffs (like Kernel) into Fedora mainline. The only job of Sugar itself in order to run on the XO are to keep the memory and cpu consumption low. I hope this anwers your question, Simon ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Developer MINUTES
On 05/22/2009 05:31 PM, James Simmons wrote: I didn't see Aleksey's espeak gstreamer plugin included in the roadmap. This is needed for text to speech with highlighting support for Read Etexts, and is being included in SoaS now. I'm looking forward to having a version of Sugar I can install on my XO where this is included. James Simmons This might be upstream work - non Sugar platforms can profit from that work as well I guess. Aleksey can you comment - what the plan is here? Thanks, Simon ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [Marketing] Usage scenarios for Sugar?
On 05/22/2009 08:03 PM, Sean DALY wrote: Hi everyone, we have been contacted by a monthly tech publication in Europe willing to devote several pages to Sugar in their summer issue! More specifically, advising parents how to download run SoaS and do educational stuff with their kids during the summer holidays. Off the top of my head I suggested a scenario where Memorize is customized with family photos, a Turtle Art lesson, ... Suggestions please! Using Memorize looks like a good choice. I will use it during my upcoming Project day. The idea is that the kids will create games using all the other available tools - like the camera, turtle art, paint... The material I collect here can be recycled of course. I will keep you posted. Have a nice weekend, Simon ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 11:41 AM, Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.org wrote: As with any other sugar module, people want to run the latest code because it will contain bugfixes, etc. I see hulahop in the same way. As with any other module of anything, some people want to run Stable, some want Testing, some want Unstable, the very latest code. (I am using Debian terminology, but the concepts apply anywhere.) I am willing to use Testing, but not Unstable. I want an option to build something that is known to compile, with a mechanism in place to determine when we move forward to another level, and to enforce periodic bug-triage and bug-fixing when we need to make that move. We owe this to our development community. -- Silent Thunder (默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر ج) is my name And Children are my nation. The Cosmos is my dwelling place, The Truth my destination. http://earthtreasury.org/worknet (Edward Mokurai Cherlin) ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Simplifying sugar-jhbuild
I can only speak of opensuse and mandriva but we compile xulrunner ourselves on those 2 plaftorms... David (nubae) On Fri, May 22, 2009 at 9:56 PM, Edward Cherlin echer...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, May 21, 2009 at 11:41 AM, Tomeu Vizoso to...@sugarlabs.org wrote: As with any other sugar module, people want to run the latest code because it will contain bugfixes, etc. I see hulahop in the same way. As with any other module of anything, some people want to run Stable, some want Testing, some want Unstable, the very latest code. (I am using Debian terminology, but the concepts apply anywhere.) I am willing to use Testing, but not Unstable. I want an option to build something that is known to compile, with a mechanism in place to determine when we move forward to another level, and to enforce periodic bug-triage and bug-fixing when we need to make that move. We owe this to our development community. -- Silent Thunder (默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر ج) is my name And Children are my nation. The Cosmos is my dwelling place, The Truth my destination. http://earthtreasury.org/worknet (Edward Mokurai Cherlin) ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] Sugar Developer MINUTES
NoiseEHC wrote: Are there any plans to port Sugar to the XO-1 or will it be the job of OLPC so it will be effectively abandoned? Do you mean the XO-1 or XO-1.5, specifically? Also, I hope you are aware of http://blog.printf.net/articles/2009/05/16/the-olpc-xo-1-5-and-fedora-11 which states that OLPC intends to ship Sugar 0.84. --Ben signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
Re: [Sugar-devel] [IAEP] Usage scenarios for Sugar?
Sean DALY schrieb: Hi everyone, we have been contacted by a monthly tech publication in Europe willing to devote several pages to Sugar in their summer issue! More specifically, advising parents how to download run SoaS and do educational stuff with their kids during the summer holidays. Off the top of my head I suggested a scenario where Memorize is customized with family photos, a Turtle Art lesson, ... They could do an interactive postcard using Etoys! Like greetings from ..., they could make photos using the camera, import them into Etoys and script it. I will sendmore infomation on how to do that. Greetings, Rita Suggestions please! thanks Sean ___ IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) i...@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep ___ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel
