Test 2

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi list,
For some reason when I send something to the list it doesn’t show up even after 
changing my options on the window eyes list page. this time I am trying to 
retype the address manually.

I know Jane got my reply because I included her in the CC, but if I send just 
to the list without that no one will know that I replied unless you are getting 
it and it just doesn’t show up for me despite changing my options.

Unless it just takes a while for things to process, but I would find that 
surprising.

Brenda

Dictated and sent from my iPhone
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Testing my options update

[Brenda via Talk]

Hello list,
I am just testing to see if my options updated because when I sent an earlier 
message it did not post to the list or I just didn’t get notification of it. 

Jane, I’m glad to see you still can communicate with Doug, not sure how you did 
that. it did occur to me that with him and Jeremy at Microsoft even if they 
aren’t directly working with narrator I suspect they are giving input. 

Glad to hear I’m not the only one having difficulty with windows 10 with jaws. 
I would love to see more people go to narrator especially if window eyes gets 
weaker. actually narrator reminds me of window eyes.

Brenda
Dictated and sent from my iPhone
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Re: New to the list, saying hello

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Jane,
This is Brenda with Ortiz from the February 2018 Seeing Eye class. I didn’t 
realize you were a Window Eyes user, we could’ve talked about a great screen 
reader in class had I known.

I finally upgraded to windows 10 when we moved to Tennessee. I got a deal on 
jaws because I had some W-ESMA’s left. Between a laptop, windows 10 and jaws I 
never did get very good at computers again. actually, when I’m on the laptop I 
use narrator but mostly I use my iPhone.

Hope you and sailor are doing well.

Brenda
Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 20, 2021, at 5:17 AM, Jane Carona via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> Doug just added me to this list, so I'm sticking my toe in the water to see
> who's here and to say hello.
> 
> 
> 
> I was a very happy GW Micro customer, from way back when we had Vocal-Eyes,
> and was dragged kicking and screaming into the world of jaws.  I still hate
> Jaws, and have never really come to terms with it.  I'm thinking of
> reinstalling Window-Eyes, but the last version I have is 9.0, and I don't
> know how well it works with Windows 10 and Office 365.  Anyone still using
> Window-Eyes on a daily basis, and how well does it still work?
> 
> 
> 
> Jane Carona
> 
> jane.e.car...@gmail.com  
> 
> 
> 
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Re: New to the list, saying hello

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Jane,
This is Brenda with Ortiz from the February 2018 Seeing Eye class. I didn’t 
realize you were a Window Eyes user, we could’ve talked about a great screen 
reader in class had I known.

I finally upgraded to windows 10 when we moved to Tennessee. I got a deal on 
jaws because I had some W-ESMA’s left. Between a laptop, windows 10 and jaws I 
never did get very good at computers again. actually, when I’m on the laptop I 
use narrator but mostly I use my iPhone.

Hope you and sailor are doing well.

Brenda
Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 20, 2021, at 5:17 AM, Jane Carona via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> Doug just added me to this list, so I'm sticking my toe in the water to see
> who's here and to say hello.
> 
> 
> 
> I was a very happy GW Micro customer, from way back when we had Vocal-Eyes,
> and was dragged kicking and screaming into the world of jaws.  I still hate
> Jaws, and have never really come to terms with it.  I'm thinking of
> reinstalling Window-Eyes, but the last version I have is 9.0, and I don't
> know how well it works with Windows 10 and Office 365.  Anyone still using
> Window-Eyes on a daily basis, and how well does it still work?
> 
> 
> 
> Jane Carona
> 
> jane.e.car...@gmail.com  
> 
> 
> 
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Re: Is there another jaws email list?

[Brenda via Talk]

I would like to know what window eyes users think of narrator with windows 10. 
I know it is never going to replace window eyes but it sure seems pretty 
decent, and I’m liking it better than Jaws. Just wondering what other people 
think.
Brenda

Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 30, 2019, at 11:19 AM, Butch Bussen via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> I still use window-eyes and when I can't use n v d a.  There a few strange 
> things that show up with window-eyes that don't with n v d a. Still by far my 
> favorite.
> 73
> Butch
> WA0VJR
> Node 3148
> Wallace, ks.
> 
> 
>> On Fri, 30 Aug 2019, Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk wrote:
>> 
>> Joan, you didn't mess up regarding Window-Eyes list.  The list is NOT ALWAYS
>> ACTIVE.  There are occasional posts now and then.
>> 
>> All that aside, many of us are diehards here, not quite ready to completely
>> part with Window-Eyes!  I'm sure we'll wake it up again if we could.
>> 
>> Sincerely,
>> Olusegun
>> Denver, Colorado
>> 
>> ___
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>> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>> 
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>> 
>> 
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Re: Narrator

[Brenda via Talk]

Control windows key and enter turns narrator on and off

It should bring up a screen that tells you all the new stuff and remind you of 
certain keys and a quick start guide.

I think control windows and brings up the narrator window.

I haven’t used my computer in a few days so I’m not 100% but once you turn 
narrator on it should bring up the screen that will help you.

Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 8, 2019, at 4:09 PM, Debby Franson via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone!
> 
> What is the toggle to turn Narrator on and off in 1903? I have played around 
> with it a bit, but that was when the keystroke was different than it is now.
> 
> How do I learn more about Narrator? Is there help that I would access with f1?
> 
> Thanks a lot!
> 
> Debby
> 
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Re: Microsoft Talks Raising the Bar on Accessibility

[Brenda via Talk]

I wonder if W-E would have just been absorbed sooner had Microsoft bought them 
years ago. I can’t see Microsoft letting W-E be a standalone program. Maybe GW 
micro knew this and did not want to lose control of the program to Microsoft.

The whole thing was very painful but maybe in the long run it will be a good 
thing because narrator may soon become as good as window eyes and maybe even 
better and if so, it will be included in Windows so no one will have to pay 
extra for it.

We can’t change the past, but there is hope for the future. (I just wish we had 
the W-E support people to call when we needed help.) 


Brenda





Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 6, 2019, at 8:30 PM, Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> Sky, perhaps I am terribly selfish, stupid, and a fool to boot; Microsoft
> should have bought Window-Eyes for integration into Windows.  If it had, it
> would have had a TALKING INSTALLER more than 25 years ago and would not need
> to reinvent the wheels.
> 
> I'm always dreaming, I just hope I don't fall off the cliff.  Anyhow, I'm
> sure glad that GW Micro staff are over there teaching and helping Microsoft
> to do the right thing!
> 
> Sincerely,
> Olusegun
> Denver, Colorado
> 
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Re: Microsoft Talks Raising the Bar on Accessibility

[Brenda via Talk]

Glad to see Jeremy is with Microsoft, I think Doug is there to somewhere. 
Narrator keeps getting better and better, it may not be window eyes but it sure 
has that feel to it.
Brenda

Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 6, 2019, at 6:20 PM, Patricia Krinke via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> thank you, Martha--very inberesting!
> 
> -Original Message- 
> From: Martha via Talk
> Sent: Saturday, July 06, 2019 6:52 AM
> To: via Talk
> Cc: Martha
> Subject: Fw: New: Microsoft Talks Raising the Bar on Accessibility
> 
> Passing this along for all of us who are fans of Jeremy Curry.
> 
> Martha R.
> IL
> Forwarded by Martha 
> --- Original Message ---
> From:Ricky Enger 
> To:  
> Date:Fri, 5 Jul 2019 16:20:56 +
> Subject: New: Microsoft Talks Raising the Bar on Accessibility
> 
> 
> Hadley Presents
> 
> Hadley Presents and a microphone with the braille ‘h’ appear in white on a 
> black background, framed by red curtains
> 
> 
> ** A Conversation with Microsoft 
> (https://hadley.us20.list-manage.com/track/click?u=872829398302c647169f3fad3=dabef71dfc=62aae9bab1)
> 
> Listen in as Ricky Enger chats with Microsoft’s Jeremy Curry, a Senior 
> Program Manager with the Windows Accessibility team. New vision 
> accessibility features are now available in Windows 10 for low vision and 
> screen reader users.
> 
> 
> “...everybody is different, nobody is the same. And so having the ability to 
> customize the color, and the size, and magnification...really help to make 
> it a good experience for anybody on the low vision spectrum."
> 
> Listen Now 
> (https://hadley.us20.list-manage.com/track/click?u=872829398302c647169f3fad3=4f04c828a1=62aae9bab1)
> Have a suggestion for a future episode? Email us at podc...@hadley.edu 
> (mailto:podc...@hadley.edu) or call the Hadley Presents podcast line at 
> (847) 784-2870 (tel:847-784-2870)
> 
> 
> ** Facebook 
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> ** Twitter 
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> ** LinkedIn 
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> ** Hadley Logo - Braille "H" in teal square 
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> 
> 700 Elm Street
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> 800.323.4238 | ** hadley.edu 
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> 
> You are receiving this email because you opted in at our website.
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> - Original Message Ends 
> 
> -- 
> Martha 
> 
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Test

[Brenda via Talk]

Hello list, I am just testing it because I unsubscribed with my Windstream 
email but hopefully I have not deleted my Gmail email so that I will still get 
emails from this list.

Dictated and sent from my iPhone
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Re: Window-eyes and W10 1809

[Brenda via Talk]

Narrator is not too bad, especially if you use Microsoft edge in the Microsoft 
mail app. Actually the mail app isn’t terrible, it’s great for a simple reading 
of emails, not sure about how to make folders but I do have folders in my Gmail 
account. I’ll still keep up with the jars for all while but at least I can use 
narrator quickly and efficiently. Control windows enter toggles it on and off 
and it doesn’t take as long to load as jaws does.
Brenda

Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On May 14, 2019, at 2:09 PM, Butch Bussen via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> If it comes to that, do as I do and go to n v d a, works quite well.
> 73
> Butch
> WA0VJR
> Node 3148
> Wallace, ks.
> 
> 
>> On Tue, 14 May 2019, Larry Higgins via Talk wrote:
>> 
>> Don,  With all the authority and credibility of a non expert on this matter, 
>> I fear that what this means is that some of our apps may no longer function 
>> so well.
>> 
>> 
>> I guess if I don't bend, I will break. Meaning that I might have too, but 
>> totally against my will, be forced to buy a subscription to Jaws. Man, is 
>> that gona hurt something awful.
>> 
>>> On 5/14/2019 12:33 PM, Donald L. Roberts via Talk wrote:
>>> Hope this list is still active.  I just installed Windows 10 version 1809
>>> and was delighted to find that on my Dell desktop, W E 9.5.4.0 works well
>>> with one minor exception.  Whenever Window-eyes loads, I get an error
>>> when the GW tool kit loads. However, if I click on the restart app choice,
>>> no error message is received. Does anyone know what is happening here?
>>> 
>>> Incidentally, I reinstalled the GW tool kit app with the same results.
>>> 
>>> Don Roberts
>>> 
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test

[Brenda via Talk]

I changed my email address but kept the old one. When I sent a new email I 
received it at my old address but not my gmail address.

Any ide why I don’t get mail from this list at both email addresses? I do 
receivw email from other sources to my gmail so it is working.

Thanks for any help.

Brenda

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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Windows 10 with narrator and jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Listers,

Before my win7 machine dies and/or win7 is no longer supported I decided to 
learn to use my win10 laptop.

I like Narrator for most windows things but still need jaws for ff, tb, and 
chrome.

I can’t figure out MS edge which is the only internet program that works with 
narrator. It sure would be nice to be able to use it in case jaws gets too 
expensive.

Windows mail is usuable, but I still have a lot to figure out.

Any tips on Ms edge or win10 with jaws or narrator would be appreciated. I’ll 
save learning NVDA for later as that would just be too much to learn.

Thanks for any tips etc.

Brenda
Still missing Window-Eyes but trying to move on.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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Jaws or Narratorr with Windows 10 from my n

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Listers,

I finally am learning to use windows 10. I really like Narrator for most 
windows things, but still need jaws for firefox and thunderbird. Windows mail 
is a pretty easy program which works well with either Narrator or jaws so I use 
whatever screen reader I have loaded.

Eventually Windows 7 will die either before or shortly after my win 7 pc does 
so I’m trying to learn win 10 on my laptop while I can use win 7 when I get 
really frustrated.

I wish Narrator worked with ff, tb and chrome, but it doesn’t. I can’t figure 
out MS Edge – it has a bunch of stuff like news articles and I can’t even set a 
home page or figure out how to change settings.

Any tips on win10 with jaws or narrator would be appreciated.

Thanks 
Still missing Window-eyes but moving on,
Brenda

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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Re: [WindowEyesUsers] Jaws and Narrator

[Brenda via Talk]

I did go to update in the help menu but then I wasn’t sure if I was going to 
have to put in my license code again which I don’t have memorized so I closed 
out of it. I got the email several weeks ago, just haven’t gotten around to 
doing the update and I just noticed today that I had zero SMAs left on my 
Windows 7 computer. Now that I’ve discovered the narrator works with Firefox 
and chrome I’m almost sorry I bought the SMa that aren’t mine yet for jaws

Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 1, 2019, at 6:32 PM, John Covici  wrote:
> 
> You have to go into the help menu, go to  license submenu and update
> authorization in order to see it.  You have to wait till the invoice
> is emailed to you if you purchased online.
> 
> On Tue, 01 Jan 2019 16:34:47 -0500,
> Brenda wrote:
>> 
>> Hi List,
>> Happy New Year to all.
>> 
>> A few things...
>> 
>> I upgraded my SMA with VFO or whatever their new name is BUT they
>> didn't update my number of SMAs so it still says I have 0.  Guess
>> I'll have to call them this week.
>> 
>> next, My windows 10 machine has jaws 2018.xy and says there are
>> no new updates, but my windows 7 machine has jaws 2019.xyz -- not
>> sure what's going on there.
>> 
>> Finally, has anyone played with Narrator on a windows 10 machine?
>> Because of the above I decided to try it with FF and chrome
>> because MS Edge is unappealing.  FF and Chrome both work with
>> Narrator to the extent that I can figure out narrator and windows
>> 10 as I'm clinging  to Windows 7 as long as I can
>> 
>> I'm finding Narrator on my win10 laptop quite relaxing, I just
>> need to learn the commands. I'm wondering of doug Geoffrey is
>> somewhere in the halls of Microsoft - maybe he's not working
>> directly with the Narrator programmers, but perhaps he's teaching
>> them how to make it better. Somehow when I use Narrator I feel
>> the simplicity/user-friendliness of the long lost, beloved
>> Window-eyes.
>> 
>> Any thoughts, comments, direction? Any Narrator users among you?
>> 
>> brenda
>> Floating between jaws and Narrator on a win10 machine and jaws on my win7.
>> 
>> 
>> 
> 
> -- 
> Your life is like a penny.  You're going to lose it.  The question is:
> How do
> you spend it?
> 
> John Covici wb2una
> cov...@ccs.covici.com
> 
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> 
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Re: Trying to decide

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Darrell, 
Thanks for your quick reply. I don’t use Chrome but I do use Firefox, do you 
know how well narrator works with Firefox?  I’m not real thrilled with using 
edge or internet explorer as I’m not sure how safe they are. 

And then there is the question of whether in windows s mode fire fox would even 
work. If I got the HSN HP laptop I would want to keep it in as mowed.brenda



Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 23, 2018, at 3:02 PM, Darrell Bowles  wrote:
> 
> Narrator has gotten much better. Problem with it though is if you are going 
> to use  chrome, it won't work. You can also take your windows 10 s device out 
> of s mode, but you can't return it to s mode  once it's out. As far as JAWS 
> and the 90 dollar price tag, it beats  paying $120.00 but it doesn't beat the 
> cost of NVDA wich is um, well no cost. 
> I use both JAWS and NVDA for my job, so I use both of them.
> Narrator also works well with he office suite so if you are not going to use 
> anything outside of edge and internet explorer, you are good there too.
> 
> Hope this helps,
> Darrell
> 
> -Original Message-----
> From: Talk  On Behalf Of 
> Brenda via Talk
> Sent: Friday, November 23, 2018 2:47 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Window Eyes 
> Users 
> Cc: Brenda 
> Subject: Trying to decide
> 
> Good afternoon lists,
> 
> There are some really good deals on HSN and QVC for windows 10 laptops as 
> well as iPads and Fire tablets.  I'm trying to decide what to do...
> 
> From what I'm finding, Narrator is getting better - does anyone have any 
> comments/input?
> 
> There is an HP Stream laptop with Windows S which requires no virus 
> protectionAlthough I have a Lenovo Win 10 machine, this deal is very 
> tempting. .
> 
> Jaws is going to be a subscription-based program so I will have to pay $90a 
> year to keep it updated. If Narrator works well, it is included in Windows so 
> I can use the $90 for other things like maybe Office 360
> 
> The HP laptop with Windows S would also eliminate the cost of antivirus 
> software not to mention the issues with accessibility for the antivirus 
> programs.
> 
> I am also considering just getting an iPad so I have a back-up if something 
> happens to my phone, but then I'd have to back the iPhone and iPad up to 
> something so I could move stuff from my phone to the ipad -- I get stressed 
> out when I have to deal with that. also, iPads seem to only last a few years 
> before  the iPad is no longer ubdateable.
> 
> I really don't want to try to learn how to use a Fire tablet, and I doubt the 
> accessibility is as good as Apple or Microsoft
> 
> Just hopeing to get people's thoughts. Really hoping Narrator is working so I 
> can lose Jaws. I know NVDA is an option, but that is one more thing to learn 
> and why  bother if Narrator has improved enough.
> 
> Thanks for any input,
> brenda
> Still mourning the loss of Window-Eyes in Ashtabula, Ohio
> 
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Trying to decide

[Brenda via Talk]

Good afternoon lists,

There are some really good deals on HSN and QVC for windows 10 laptops 
as well as iPads and Fire tablets.  I'm trying to decide what to do...


From what I'm finding, Narrator is getting better - does anyone have 
any comments/input?


There is an HP Stream laptop with Windows S which requires no virus 
protectionAlthough I have a Lenovo Win 10 machine, this deal is very 
tempting. .


Jaws is going to be a subscription-based program so I will have to pay 
$90a year to keep it updated. If Narrator works well, it is included in 
Windows so I can use the $90 for other things like maybe Office 360


The HP laptop with Windows S would also eliminate the cost of antivirus 
software not to mention the issues with accessibility for the antivirus 
programs.


I am also considering just getting an iPad so I have a back-up if 
something happens to my phone, but then I'd have to back the iPhone and 
iPad up to something so I could move stuff from my phone to the ipad -- 
I get stressed out when I have to deal with that. also, iPads seem to 
only last a few years before  the iPad is no longer ubdateable.


I really don't want to try to learn how to use a Fire tablet, and I 
doubt the accessibility is as good as Apple or Microsoft


Just hopeing to get people's thoughts. Really hoping Narrator is working 
so I can lose Jaws. I know NVDA is an option, but that is one more thing 
to learn and why  bother if Narrator has improved enough.


Thanks for any input,
brenda
Still mourning the loss of Window-Eyes in Ashtabula, Ohio

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Re: trying to contact Doug Geoffray

[Brenda via Talk]

Someone said they saw an entry for Doug on linked in that was up-to-date, 
perhaps if you don’t have LinkedIn someone can go there and send the 
information to him that you want.

If anyone is able to contact Doug, please tell him Brenda says she wishes him 
all the best. I doubt he will remember me, but I was in the email discussions 
at the end of window eyes year or so ago so he might.

Brenda from Ashtabula Ohio

Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 11, 2018, at 12:52 PM, Butch Bussen via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> If you are here Doug, drop me a note on
> but...@shellworld.net
> 
> or but...@fairpoint.net
> 
> I wrote you with latest address I have, not sure it is still good.
> 
> I'm wanting to send you dvd of Libbie and my wedding.
> Thanks to the list.
> 73
> Butch
> WA0VJR
> Node 3148
> Wallace, ks.
> 
> 
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Latest Firefox ESR - 60 I think

[Brenda via Talk]

I was prompted to update to Firefox ESR 60 ().

I haven't done this because I read a post about the update not working 
with Window Eyes or even Jaws.


There were no comments on the GW Talk list or this list as to more than 
one person having the issue.


Is it safe to update?

Thanks,
Brenda
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Re: Why Narrator will be better as a Screen Reader

[Brenda via Talk]

This is great news, unfortunately I cannot view the full profile because I am 
not a member of linked in. Anyway to copy and paste the complete information 
into an email?

Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 28, 2018, at 8:28 PM, George Savory via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi Guys,
> Someone on the list did mentioned that with the fall release of
> Windows ten, Narrator will be a lot better with sensible screen reader
> commands. I think there is good reason to believe why this is
> happening.
> According to a LinkedIn post, Doug Geoffray is Senior Program Manager
> at Microsoft. Check the link below to read about it.
> 
> 
> https://www.linkedin.com/in/doug-geoffray-42280011b
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Re: What's Doug up to?

[Brenda via Talk]

I had absolutely no problems viewing the video the first time

Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On May 13, 2018, at 11:40 PM, Butch Bussen via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> Same here.
> 73
> Butch
> WA0VJR
> Node 3148
> Wallace, ks.
> 
> 
>> On Sun, 13 May 2018, Lloyd Rasmussen via Talk wrote:
>> 
>> I didn't hear Doug during the first 15 minutes. This was a Microsoft 
>> demonstration from their Buidld conference. Did I not listen far enough or 
>> did my YouTube player go to the wrong place?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Lloyd Rasmussen, Kensington, MD
>> http://lras.home.sprynet.com
>> -Original Message- From: Rod Hutton via Talk
>> Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2018 4:46 PM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: Rod Hutton
>> Subject: What's Doug up to?
>> 
>> Hi everyone,
>> 
>> I thought you might be interested in an accessibility training seminar for 
>> software developers taught by our beloved Doug Geoffray:
>> 
>> http://bit.ly/2rHOahI
>> 
>> Enjoy,
>> 
>> Rod
>> 
>> Sent from Outlook 2010 for Windows
>> 
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Re: What's Doug up to?

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Rod,

Around a year ago we were all mourning the loss of window eyes and all the 
awesome support staff at GW micro. This video makes me feel good.  Thank you 
for sending this. It was so nice to listen to Doug give this seminar. I’m 
wondering if he does any seminars or tutorials on how to use narrator. It 
sounds like he is in a position to further screen reader compatibility with 
regular software. I am seriously going to check out narrator, and wondering if 
near raider advances if NVDA will be worth learning, I do have jaws for now but 
maybe I won’t have to buy the SMA or whatever Jaws calls it in the future.

I wonder if there are any tutorials on how to use narrator. It really sounds 
like maybe at some point we won’t have to buy a third-party screen reader. 
Brenda

Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On May 13, 2018, at 4:46 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk  
> wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone,
> 
> I thought you might be interested in an accessibility training seminar for 
> software developers taught by our beloved Doug Geoffray:
> 
> http://bit.ly/2rHOahI
> 
> Enjoy,
> 
> Rod
> 
> Sent from Outlook 2010 for Windows
> 
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Musings and touching base

[Brenda via Talk]

Hello Lists,

I was cleaning out my emails and ran across a bunch from GW-Micro staff 
and various list posts. Made me feel kinda sad.  It's been around a year 
since our beloved Window-eyes went the way of DOS and Word perfect. I 
still have my win7 machine but use the replacement provided by the 
conquerer because I need to get used to using it. Actually, I don't even 
get on the computer much. I'm  using FF 52.?? and am hoping Mozilla 
makes FF 57 and beyond accessible again. I usually use my phone and am 
considering getting a tablet with a keyboard but wonder how safe they 
are from  viruses.


Anyway, I read a lot of the posts on these two lists and wanted to let 
you all know I'm still around, not that you really care, and that I 
still miss Window-Eyes and the wonderful staff at GW-Micro. Still wonder 
where they all went and hoping the best for them and all of you listers.


Brenda
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Re: No mouse speech with win 7

[Brenda via Talk]

Today I updated jaws so  used  window eyes in order to set The hot key for jaws 
in properties. Using window eyes and the application key. I was not able to 
access the properties of Jaws. it only gave me a list of stuff on the screen. 
Wondering if something is going on with window eyes.
Brenda 





Dictated and sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 8, 2017, at 12:48 PM, Jim Elsner via Talk  
> wrote:
> 
> My system win 7 home premium we 9.5.4.
> Today I can't get my mouse to read anything on the screen.  It jumps to the 
> top or bottom with the numpad 1 and 7 keys however with the 8 and 2 keys no 
> speech.  Have looked through the mouse setting in the control panel but don't 
> see the problem.  Have restarted we several times as well.
> Please advise.
> Jim
> 
> -- 
> Jim Elsner
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Observations

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi List,

I usually check email on my iPhone, deleting those with topics I'm not 
interested in or saving them to reply to on my pc which I  don't visit 
that often.


today as I went through my email on my desktop it was so nice to see 
this list being active with a variety of people participating.


I'm glad Window-eyes is still hanging in there but I'm also glad I can 
get jaws help from a Window-eyes prospective. I know there is a jaws 
list but I can't spend my day reading emails.


Brenda
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Saying punctuation in Jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

How do you make jaws read punctuation in thunderbird or Word? It reads 
question mark but not period or commas.


With Window-eyes someone (sorry, can't remember who) even made a 
wonderful script where you could toggle spoken punctuation. Finding, 
buying and installing jaws scripts is out of the question, so I'm hoping 
there is an easy setting for this.


Thanks,
Brenda
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Re: Help with JAWS spell checking in Outlook and Word

[Brenda via Talk]

Thank you tom, Robin and Rebecca for this topic.

I have been struggling with jowls and missing the simplicity of ALT; or 
' to quickly do a spell check in Word.


I will try the ALT-F7 method you are talking about.

I am slowly learning jowls. I would go straight to NVDA but I don't want 
to purchase new voices for my win7 machine as it won't be around too 
much longer and I don't like the available voices for NVDA. Jowls does 
have nice voices as did Window-eyes.


Brenda

On 11/29/2017 2:45 PM, Rebecca Lineberger via Talk wrote:

I know W-E gave us its own way to check spelling, but I've used the alt-f7
method for spellchecking for years in Window-Eyes.  Just to play with JAWS
and my Office 2010, I tried the old f7 way.  JAWS does a nice job, saying
and then spelling the incorrect word, then doing the same for what it
suggests as the preferred replacement.  The only thing I had to remember is
that enter is for ignore, not change.  LOL. If you don't like the suggested
replacement, tab once to a list box with all the suggestions.  You can arrow
down through them and JAWS says and spells each.  If you continue to tab
through, you will find a grammar box which you can uncheck if you choose.
JAWS continues to find misspellings automatically without your having to
press f7 again.
  My hands just automatically press alt-f7.  If you want to check the
spelling of the suggestion, which JAWS does not give you with this method,
just press insert numpad 5 twice.
For any other misspellings you'll need to press the alt-f7 again each time
as you do with the alt-apostrophe in W-E. .
Rebecca
-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+drlineberger=embarqmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2017 1:59 PM
To: Van Lant, Robin via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: Help with JAWS spell checking in Outlook and Word

Hmm. I haven't had any problems with Window-Eyes. And I'm running the latest
fall creators update. That's why I have little incentive to figure out JAWS.
Actually I've spent more time with NVDA. I don't think either are on par
with Window-Eyes. But if I can get the freebie working I'll go that route.
Good luck,
Tom


On 11/29/2017 1:35 PM, Van Lant, Robin via Talk wrote:

Thanks, Tom.  Not as friendly on the fingers and it seems to automatically

expand the context menu before I even know what word is highlighted, but I'm
glad to have an option to play with.   Yeah, I've been pokey about the
migration process, but I keep having weird silencing issues in Window Eyes,
so I'm really trying to get myself onto JAWS.






-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+robin_van_lant=key@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2017 11:13 AM
To: Van Lant, Robin via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: Help with JAWS spell checking in Outlook and Word

Robin,
I don't know about JAWS as I've barely gotten beyond wrestling with it for

a bit here and there. But Word itself has a keyboard shortcut to jump to the
next spelling or grammatical error: Alt+F7.

Here's a link to a page with all the keyboard shortcuts.
http://www.keyxl.com/aaa2cd7/445/Microsoft-Word-2010-keyboard-shortcut
s.htm
Hth,
Tom


On 11/29/2017 12:40 PM, Van Lant, Robin via Talk wrote:

All,
I'm struggling with the transition to JAWS as it relates to spell

checking a Word document or Outlook email.  I absolutely loved the Window
Eyes feature allowing me to move to each  error with Alt semicolon and
apostrophe.   I really did not get the hang of navigating the Spell checking
dialog efficiently.   So, to those who have made the transition, can you
guide me as to the best way to spell check?  I'm in Office 2010.




Robin Van Lant | Sr. Program Manager
Strategy & Performance Management | Key Equipment Finance
720-304-1060 | robin_van_l...@key.com



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Firefos download 52.?? est

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Lists

I followed some links to get the FF 52 download so I wouldn't get ff57 
but when I open the properties it doesn't give me any indication of what 
FF the installer is so I am not sure I have the right thing.


could someone tell me where I can go to get the FF 52 business download 
that VFO and others has recommended?


Thanks for any help.

(for now my FF 56.0.2 is still working but I never know when things will 
change as I'm not real computer saavy)


Thanks for any help.
Brenda

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Worth reading

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Reeva

Thanks for sharing the link - now I don't feel so bad - and fellow 
Window-Eyes users we are not alone.


I was going to say I used jaws successfully and with better success to 
view the video, but then I tried to reply to this email and jaws froze 
and I had to shut it down and restart it.


Thanks again Reeva for sharing.
Brenda

On 10/11/2017 6:53 AM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

I'm just gonna leave this here. Any of this sound familiar?

https://youtu.be/00wQYmvfhn4

"the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised
night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho

Reeva

On Oct 11, 2017 5:40 AM, "Charles Adkins via Talk" <
talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:


let me make one thing clear, I am not bitter. I am not sure about what
merge is being talked about, Window-eyes was dropped, not merged with Jaws.
My point was Vfo had the chance to retain the best of Window-eyes and jaws
in both technology and people and produce one hell of a screen reader
unlike anything the world has ever seen and they chose not to do that, they
just trashed their "compeditor" completely like they never existed.

Sent from my iPhone


On Oct 11, 2017, at 5:05 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk <

talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:


Hi Josh,

As for Office support in NVDA, as I am subscribed to Office 365, and

will be for the  foreseeable future, I will be using NVDA to navigate it
should Window-Eyes no longer suffice.

I've been keeping my ear to the ground, though, and I know that Office

support for NVDA is a high priority.

We'll keep everyone posted.
As I've said, I will not be using the offering of the enemy of GW Micro.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail.com@lists.

window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk

Sent: October 10, 2017 6:11 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Josh Kennedy 
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

oh  well then maybe I will just stay with NVDA and I may not bother
buying jaws, not sure yet. I heard jaws has better microsoft office
support than NVDA does. But maybe that is no longer true?




On 10/10/2017 1:33 PM, net bat via Talk wrote:
you might as well junk it now.
2018 release will be in about 2 weeks.
f s has had the same 27 years as window eyes had  and it still doesn't
work as good.
i can't even pay my credit card with it. a web page that is suppose to
be jaws compatible doesn't work.
window eyes works fine.
money talks. if gwmicro was the one that had all the money it would of
been f s that would be out of business now.

-Original Message- From: Bob Tinney via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 7:01 AM
To: Chuck Adkins via Talk
Cc: Bob Tinney
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

Chuck,


I agree with you!  My s m as were carried over from W E, but when I have
to pay for an upgrade, Jaws will disappear from my computer.

Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net


On 10/10/2017 8:33 AM, Chuck Adkins via Talk wrote:
Well, I've been using Jaws for a while now and I must confess the
Window-eyes was the much better product both in speed, browsing,
usability, layout, and so much more. Like on the Ohio Lottery Website,
when reading the pick 5 Jaws will not scroll down continuously down
the page like NVDA, Narrator, and Window-eyes do. I also find
Window-eyes synthesizer support was much better. I am not whining, I
am just bemoaning the fact that a company got by with trashing a
product completely, borrowing or using nothing from the product they
trashed and acting like Window-eyes never existed, not to mention
charging so much for the product. Don't give me that similar stuff,
because I've found webpages where Jaws just doesn't work and NVDA and
Narrator do.

So why won't I just shut up? I will, just wanted to point out in my
view what I've realized, and hopefully NVDA, Narrator and others will
be able to say Thank You to VFO for pushing us to a day when a 2
thousand dollar screen reader is no longer need.

Thanks for reading, I'm now shutting up.
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Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

[Brenda via Talk]

VFO made a proposal to AI Squared AFTER AI Squared had acquired 
GW-Micro.  I kinda wonder if AI Squared was told by VFO to get GW first 
in order to become a part of the VFO family. Nothing will ever be proven


As for jaws being better than NVDA, that may be a matter of opinion. I 
know an adaptive tech person that liked NVDA before Window-eyes was 
eliminated.  Maybe he suspected W-e was on the way out. Nonetheless he 
said positive things about NVDA not jaws.


As pointed out before it is good to have multiple screen readers. This 
is probably more necessary since Window-Eyes is waning.


. Brenda
On 10/11/2017 2:47 AM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

Jaws is a very good screen reader and it's better than NVDA unfortunately one 
of the two products had to go.  VFO made a proposal to AI Squared to merge they 
didn't have to do that they chose to so being bitter to the makers of Jaws 
really serves nothing.
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Jim via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 6:11 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Jim
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

Hi THERE!

While I agree that Jaws could do more especially now that they have acquired 
Window-Eyes I haven't had a real issue with Jaws.  I can read from the current line 
to the end of a document simply by pressing the 'insert+the down arrow key.  I wonder 
what programs you are actually having issues with using Jaws? Yes, I use W.E. for 
many years and was sad to see it go, but I haven't really found any major issues with 
Jaws either. Wonder if you might give some specifics as to where your issues have 
been? I use Thunderbird, Office 2007 notepad, Internet Explorer, Firefox, Chrome  and 
several other programs regularly and I really don't seem to have any real problems 
with.  Of course, I kept Window-Eyes on my computer a long with Narrator and NVDA so 
if I have issues with one screen reader I can fall back onto another that will more 
than likely work.  As I have already said, I probably liked Window-Eye the best of 
all of them, but since Window-Eyes appears to be gone for the most part, I will 
simply have to make do with whatever I can use and the best of the remaining screen 
readers is still Jaws at least that is my opinion and everyone is entitled to their 
own opinion.  I will continue to use Window-Eyes when I need to, at 
least until the windows updates render it unusable.  Have A good 1! de

.s


On 10-Oct-17 15:00, Charles Adkins via Talk wrote:

it doesn’t seem like they affect products for the disabled does it?

Sent from my iPhone


On Oct 10, 2017, at 2:58 PM, Tony C via Talk  wrote:

No, but maybe Brainwashed. I quit using Jawws in 2004 because WE worked better 
with stuff I needed. Now Jaws still doesn't work well with a lot of very common 
programs.

-Original Message- From: Nick Sarames via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 12:42 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Nick Sarames
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

While I believe what you say, why are there so many Jaws users, even
some here, who swear by Jaws?  They can't all be ignorant, can they?
What I am guessing is happening is, each screen reader has its issues
and some websites work better on WE, and other websites work better
on Jaws.  Of course, that is a separate issue from other issues
involving the overall stability of each reader.


On 10/10/2017 8:33 AM, Chuck Adkins via Talk wrote:
Well, I've been using Jaws for a while now and I must confess the
Window-eyes was the much better product both in speed, browsing,
usability, layout, and so much more. Like on the Ohio Lottery
Website, when reading the pick 5 Jaws will not scroll down
continuously down the page like NVDA, Narrator, and Window-eyes do.
I also find Window-eyes synthesizer support was much better. I am
not whining, I am just bemoaning the fact that a company got by with
trashing a product completely, borrowing or using nothing from the
product they trashed and acting like Window-eyes never existed, not
to mention charging so much for the product. Don't give me that
similar stuff, because I've found webpages where Jaws just doesn't
work and NVDA and Narrator do.

So why won't I just shut up? I will, just wanted to point out in my
view what I've realized, and hopefully NVDA, Narrator and others
will be able to say Thank You to VFO for pushing us to a day when a
2 thousand dollar screen reader is no longer need.

Thanks for reading, I'm now shutting up.
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Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

[Brenda via Talk]

 Hey Olusegun

Keep me posted on your android success.  I would like to avoid PCs but 
find them a necessity.  I do simple things like web serfing, email and 
banking. I'm hoping an iPad willlet me do all these things safely, but 
not all apps are useable. I am trying to stay open to other solutions 
and maybe your android idea will be the right one.


Now SeroTech? Are you saying VFO is trying to eliminate them?

IAs for accepting defeat - I don't think GW accepted defeat - they tried 
to survive with AI Squared but they were tricked I suspect.


All very depressing.

I'm learning jowls because I'm forced into it due to the FF issues - 
probably a good thing in the long run.


brenda

On 10/10/2017 5:14 PM, Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk 
wrote:

Tony, I seriously doubt that the law against monopoly apply in the access
technology industry.  If it does, it is a bit too late now.  GW Micro is
gone and I doubt if it can be revived.  Besides, who truly want to spend
endless hours in court?  GW Micro went through that once, and I don't
believe Doug wants to come out of hiding to try again.

As I once opined, that which Freedom Scientific DID NOT win in the courts,
it got back by a series of tricks and arm twisting.  Its aim and objective
had been to figure out a way of running GW Micro into the ground as it did
FreedomBox, now SeroTech!

The two elephants had a good fight, the ground got terribly too hot, and the
weak one threw up its hands and walked away accepting defeat.

Anyway, back to my quest for complete and full deployment of Android!

Sincerely,m
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado


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Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

[Brenda via Talk]

I think crawling into a hole is a great idea. I'm really starting to 
hate computers.

Brenda

On 10/10/2017 1:38 PM, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote:

The consensus seems to be that WE, overall, is better.  I have yet to
use Jaws, but the more I read here, the more I realize that we each have
different systems and needs.  So while you can't seem to pay your credit
card, others can.  And while you can do certain things, others can't.  I
think I'll just craw into a hole.

On 10/10/2017 1:33 PM, net bat via Talk wrote:

you might as well junk it now.
2018 release will be in about 2 weeks.
f s has had the same 27 years as window eyes had  and it still doesn't
work as good.
i can't even pay my credit card with it. a web page that is suppose to
be jaws compatible doesn't work.
window eyes works fine.
money talks. if gwmicro was the one that had all the money it would of
been f s that would be out of business now.

-Original Message- From: Bob Tinney via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 7:01 AM
To: Chuck Adkins via Talk
Cc: Bob Tinney
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

Chuck,


I agree with you!  My s m as were carried over from W E, but when I have
to pay for an upgrade, Jaws will disappear from my computer.

Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net

On 10/10/2017 8:33 AM, Chuck Adkins via Talk wrote:

Well, I've been using Jaws for a while now and I must confess the
Window-eyes was the much better product both in speed, browsing,
usability, layout, and so much more. Like on the Ohio Lottery Website,
when reading the pick 5 Jaws will not scroll down continuously down
the page like NVDA, Narrator, and Window-eyes do. I also find
Window-eyes synthesizer support was much better. I am not whining, I
am just bemoaning the fact that a company got by with trashing a
product completely, borrowing or using nothing from the product they
trashed and acting like Window-eyes never existed, not to mention
charging so much for the product. Don't give me that similar stuff,
because I've found webpages where Jaws just doesn't work and NVDA and
Narrator do.

So why won't I just shut up? I will, just wanted to point out in my
view what I've realized, and hopefully NVDA, Narrator and others will
be able to say Thank You to VFO for pushing us to a day when a 2
thousand dollar screen reader is no longer need.

Thanks for reading, I'm now shutting up.
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Re: Latest Firefox, and accessibility

[Brenda via Talk]

I accidentally upgraded FF when I was dealing with Viper. so now I'm at 
56.01 64 bit (sp).


someone on this list suggested opening FF then opening it again in a new 
window.  I did this and things are working (h) I even shut down 
my pc and restarted it - still Window-eyes is working.


However, I'm using jowls to write this email and am primarily using 
jowls because eventually Window-Eyes will not work.


It's just sad because I know no one from GW will be fixing the problem.

jowls is ok. I use it because it was free and because on my win7/64 
machine I don't like the voice choices for NVDA.  Eventually I'll be 
forced to windows 10 and maybe narrator will be an option.  Perhaps once 
I learn NVDA I will figure out how to get more voices, but not worth it 
until windows 10 in 2.5 years.


But when I feel nastalgic I can go back and use W-e with the latest FF 
as long as I open2 windows


One question - is there a setting to have links open in new windows in 
FF? I think there is in Thunderbird. Maybe this would save me having to 
manually open a 2nd window? Just a thought.


Brenda

On 10/9/2017 2:59 PM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Hi Lloyd,

I can confirm your findings with the latest Firefox.
Funny, though.
I had been running the 32-bit version, which opened automatically from my 
desktop icon.
Now, however, I seem to be running the 64-bit version.
The plot thickens, indeed! Smile

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Lloyd Rasmussen via Talk
Sent: October 9, 2017 1:29 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Lloyd Rasmussen 
Subject: Re: Latest Firefox, and accessibility

Maybe that's what happened, but I'm not sure of that.
A new 56.01 update was available when I checked this morning. I am going to
reboot and try again, but my first finding with this new minor update is
that browse mode is no longer available anywhere in Firefox. You can still
read the menus and can tab to items, but are not even offered the
possibility of opening browse mode with Window-Eyes. The plot thickens!



Lloyd Rasmussen, Kensington, MD
http://lras.home.sprynet.com
-Original Message-
From: Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2017 1:24 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: RE: Latest Firefox, and accessibility

Hi David,

I can certainly confirm that your workaround, namely, to open another tab,
wherein Window-Eyes works as before.
My guess is that, on startup, the set file is not associated with the
browser window, but, rather, with the Firefox application window.
I've run into this problem before, when, all of a sudden, focus got lost and
stuck in the application window, since this is all I heard when I read the
title bar.
This hadn't happened for some time, and we'll see what happens now that I
can begin testing it again.
Thanks so much for your effort in diagnosing this problem, and we'll report
back our experiences.

All the best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf
Of David via Talk
Sent: October 8, 2017 8:31 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List ; Lloyd
Rasmussen 
Cc: David 
Subject: Re: Latest Firefox, and accessibility

Seems this is going to be the kind of never-ending story.


This morning, I had to restart my computer for some reason. After
rebooting, all the sudden I do see the same behavior in Firefox, as
reported by others. You can turn off Browse mode, and tab around the
website. You can reach all the menus. But with browse mode turned on,
there is absolutely no luck in having WinEyes read anything to you.


Now, i would not let this throw me off. I have been experimenting quite
a bit here now, and here is at least some kind of a workaround. Wonder
if some of you - who have trouble with Firefox 56 - please could report
back if you see the same behavior.


1. Open Firefox.

2. Open any website of your choice, by typing in the address in the
address bar, and hitting enter, just like you have always done.

3. The site comes up, but you cannot navigate it with WinEyes.

4. Try turn off Browse mode, and now use tab. Do you hear the different
links and controls spoken?


Then the workaround.

1. with all firefox windows closed, open Firefox, and direct it to any
website you might like.

2. Hit Ctrl-N, and a new session of Firefox will open in a separate window.

3. In this new window, open any website you desire - even the very same
one you opened in the first window.

3. The website in the new ((or second) window, can be navigated just
like ever before.

4. Go back to the first window you had opened with Firefox, and close it
with F4.

5. From here, keep navigating Firefox as much as you like, in the newest
window. You even can open as many windows and tabs as you want, and

Re: Latest Firefox, and accessibility

[Brenda via Talk]

Using win7/64 with ff55?+- I have not been forced to upgrade to FF56.  I 
am using jaws now in case that happens. It is taking some getting used 
to for commands like reading the page with insetty down arrow in jaws 
and escape to exit edit mode but jaws is acceptable for what I need it 
to do. I even took a survey where I found jaws read more stuff than 
Window-eyes did when it came to rating something from 1 (not acceptable) 
to 10 very satisfied etc.


I will probably let FF update soon.  I am very sorry that I'm being 
forced into learning jaws, but it will probably be a good thing in the 
longrun.


brenda


n 10/7/2017 6:01 AM, David via Talk wrote:

I do not want to start a new lengthy arguing over accessibility issues.
Yet, a few days ago, we had a discussion running here, as to the latest
version of Firefox - 56 - which some users had experienced issues with.

I did not have any intention in running into accessibility issues, and
hence told my Firefox never to update. It is done under tools, Options,
Advanced, and choose the update tab. Nevertheless, this morning when
starting my Firefox, it still updated itself. I got the message on the
screen, that the update was taking place, and though I could say a few
things about a setting in the Firefox options, which apparently is
nothing but useless - I had no choice but to let the update complete
itself. My reasoning was that first it insisted on upgrading, I could
always roll it back afterwards.

When the upgrading was finished, I checked under Tools, Help, About -
and the current installation says

      Firefox 56.0, 32bit.

I now have used it for a couple of hours, browsing around, and do see no
trouble with this version of Firefox, along with the latest (and last)
version of WinEyes, that is, version 9.5.4.

I do recall there has been a few comments about the 64bit version of
Firefox from the past. And hence i was wondering if the users who told
us not to update to the latest Firefox, due to their accessibility
issues, would happen to be running the 64bit version.

As an alternative, in attempting to see a reason for some experiencing
trouble in latest version, I do wonder if there could be a focusing
issue. Would any of you, who initially reported the loss of
accessibility in Firefox 56, maybe want to try the following.
1. Open Firefox, and go to any website.
2. Press Alt-D, as in Delta.
3. Press F6.
4. Try navigating the website.
Are you still unable to perform any action on the page? If so, check
under Help/About,and see if you are running 64- or 32bit version. Please
note, a 32bit software can be run perfectly well on a 64bit machine, but
you cannot run a 64bit software on a 32bit computer. Most computers now
aday, are 64bit machines, and yet, often you are encouraged to run the
32bit software, due to the 64bit technology being more vulnerable for
technical issues.

This is no attempt in advicing anyone, in their choice of browser or
version. I am just curious why some have reported their systems facing
issues, whereas my system had none. Could it even be there was something
going wrong in your updating process? Or, could it be due to some of the
add-ons you have installed under Firefox, and which no longer are
up-to-date, due to the new add-on policy of the Mozilla group? Try
starting your Firefox with all Add-ons disabled, and see if that solves
any issues.

Really, it would be bad, should a number of users ditch an otherwise
good browser, or abstain from updating, due to some misunderstood
accessibility issues. That's why, I decided to report my findings,
hoping to hear from others who could shed further light on what possibly
could cause issues for some. Perhaps we even could help them solve their
issues, and have them back up running the Firefox browser again; even
with last version of WinEyes.
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Re: "stand-by" ? mode in jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

hi List

Becky and Carol thanks for your replies.

I did try the Insert-spacebar and heard a pop but no choices and speech 
was not turned off (fortunately). I didn't try insert-spacebar S because 
there was not an option/prompt to do so.


Do I have a setting turned off?

Also, will turning off speech make my pc run like a normal pc so my 
husband doesn't have to deal with jaws keystrokes?  With Window-eyes I 
would turn W-e off every time he needed to use my pc.


Thanks forany help.

Brenda

On 10/4/2017 10:10 AM,

Brenda via Talk wrote:

Hi List,




I thought I ran across something about a function in jaws where you can 
put it in "stand-by" ? mode so a sighted person can use the computer 
without actually shutting jaws down?


If so how do you do that?

Thanks for any input.
brenda
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"stand-by" ? mode in jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi List,

I thought I ran across something about a function in jaws where you can 
put it in "stand-by" ? mode so a sighted person can use the computer 
without actually shutting jaws down?


If so how do you do that?

Thanks for any input.
brenda
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Crossing over to the dark side was Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

[Brenda via Talk]

So far I have not hadFirefox update automatically. It occasionally asks 
me to update and I say remind me later.


Just in case, I hate to admit it but, I'm using jaws.  Once I get more 
comfortable with jaws I'll update to FF56.


It is breaking my heart not to use Window-eyes. today I've mostely used 
jaws.  I did switch to W-e to see if I was missing something on a 
website, but things were the same with W-e and jaws which means I must 
be doing ok with jaws. I miss the sound of the tip of the day upon 
start-up and the piano scale when exiting window-eyes.


Just for fun I did a search for Doug Geoffray and found an entry on 
Linkedin. I could only access basic info (and once a day at that) 
because I'm not a member.  It says he is still at VFO in compliance and 
is working to make jaws compliant with other programs or something like 
that.  I think someone said he announced on another list that he was 
leaving vfo, but maybe he was just leaving an area of contact with 
customers.  Maybe that is why jaws seems to work better lately.  It 
would be nice to know doug was somewhere helping to make jaws as good as 
Window-Eyes.


I think this FF issue will force alot of us to learn jaws - I need FF so 
I'm sadly forced into it.


Brenda
On 10/2/2017 12:33 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

If your using windows7 and are willing to jump through hoops IE use internet
explorer reinstall fire fox everytime it updates etc you will be fine for a
few years.  Do I think in 3 years you will be able to use WE on win10?  NO.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tony C via Talk
Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2017 7:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Tony C
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Yep! I've noticed that everytime Windows updates that WE develops more and
more glitches. It's becoming less and less useable.

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 8:54 PM
To: mattc...@verizon.net ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Unfortunately I don't think you can do much.  This is what will happen more
and more with WE.  Jaws updated to fix  a firefox release.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Matthew Chao via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 9:37 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Matthew Chao
Subject: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi, any Window-Eyes Users Still Out There.  I just updated Firefox, and when
I try to navigate with MSAA mode on, I just get a ding where before I could
go up and down the page.  How can I change it so it works?  What
happened?--Matthew Chao.
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Re: App updates

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi rod
I am definitely interested in anything that would keep Window-Eyes 
working optimally. Sad that VFO won't even let you do that but they 
probably want us all to give up W-E and use jaws.  Maybe someday for me 
but not yet.


thanks for thinking of us.
Brenda

On 9/6/2017 11:14 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Thanks, Dennis.

Sounds like a good idea.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: September 5, 2017 9:52 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Cc: Dennis Long 
Subject: RE: App updates

Rod absolutely do that.  You might want to post it to the other WindowEyes
list your on.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2017 5:52 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: App updates

Hi everyone,

I have updates for a couple of my apps, and even a new app or two, but VFO
is no longer accepting app submissions.
Is anyone still interested enough in Window-Eyes to wish for someone to set
up an independent website for the purpose of app updates?
I am trying to get a handle on who is still interested in receiving support
for Window-Eyes, and so please circulate this question to any Window-Eyes
users you know.

Sincere thanks,

Rod Hutton
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Re: PDF question

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi List,
I just played a little with Acrobat and changed the setting tio show 
gaps between pages.  then I set another setting in the view section to 
allow scrolling but changed it back to single page view.


now cntrl-page up/down works.  Not sure if the show gaps between 
settings did the trick, but at least cntrl page p/down now works.


brenda

On 8/25/2017 1:33 PM, Van Lant, Robin via Talk wrote:

If I press just page up and down, I can tell that the speech is moving forward 
or backward by small leaps.  Control and Page Up and Down are not make the 
speech jump ahead, just the picture on the screen.  I'm in a 22 page document 
and trying to jump ahead mid-way through. Ugh. I really thought that keystroke 
you referenced below used to work, but it's not working now.



  


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+robin_van_lant=key@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2017 6:34 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: RE: PDF question

Hi Robin,

Ctrl-PgDn and Ctrl-PgUp will advanced to the next and previous pages, 
respectively.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Van Lant, Robin via Talk
Sent: August 24, 2017 6:34 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Van Lant, Robin 
Subject: PDF question

Please remind me, because I'm driving myself crazy with reading a multi-page 
document in Adobe.   I have Adobe set for single page display.  If I am reading 
a page and want to move to the next page, I can hit alt right arrow or the page 
down and I can tell it's visually changing on the screen, but Window Eyes 9.4 
is not advancing where speech focus is located.  What is the trick?




Robin Van Lant | Sr. Program Manager
Strategy & Performance Management | Key Equipment Finance
720-304-1060 | robin_van_l...@key.com



This communication may contain privileged and/or confidential information. It 
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Re: PDF question

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Robin,

I have always had this issue.  fortunately I have short documents to 
deal with.  I go to View then go to page and put the page number in or 
use the numpad mouse to find the current page, click on it and put the 
next page I want.


I'm wondering if there are some settings that need to be changed like 
maybe turning on scrolling or multipage view?


Hopefully someone will be more helpful than I have been.

brenda



I usually a

On 8/25/2017 1:33 PM, Van Lant, Robin via Talk wrote:

If I press just page up and down, I can tell that the speech is moving forward 
or backward by small leaps.  Control and Page Up and Down are not make the 
speech jump ahead, just the picture on the screen.  I'm in a 22 page document 
and trying to jump ahead mid-way through. Ugh. I really thought that keystroke 
you referenced below used to work, but it's not working now.



  


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+robin_van_lant=key@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2017 6:34 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: RE: PDF question

Hi Robin,

Ctrl-PgDn and Ctrl-PgUp will advanced to the next and previous pages, 
respectively.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Van Lant, Robin via Talk
Sent: August 24, 2017 6:34 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Van Lant, Robin 
Subject: PDF question

Please remind me, because I'm driving myself crazy with reading a multi-page 
document in Adobe.   I have Adobe set for single page display.  If I am reading 
a page and want to move to the next page, I can hit alt right arrow or the page 
down and I can tell it's visually changing on the screen, but Window Eyes 9.4 
is not advancing where speech focus is located.  What is the trick?




Robin Van Lant | Sr. Program Manager
Strategy & Performance Management | Key Equipment Finance
720-304-1060 | robin_van_l...@key.com



This communication may contain privileged and/or confidential information. It 
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such information for any purpose other than to provide the services for which 
you are receiving the information.

127 Public Square, Cleveland, OH 44114
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Re: contacting Doug.

[Brenda via Talk]

I too was hopeful the AI Squared merge would be good for Window-eyes. 
but, the merge was lopsided and seems more like a sale as GW had no more 
control.


I always thought AI Squared was directed by VFO to bring them 
Window-eyes as VFO didn't absorb AI Squared until after W-e was 
acquired. Maybe AI Squared was also in bad shape financially and felt 
selling out to VFO was in their best interest.


It is possible doug, Dan and Aaron were offered positions at VFO but 
refused them. Perhaps this was the same for other GW employees too. 
Perhaps not.


True, technology changes, and products/programs get discontinued, but 
for me Window-eyes was more than just another program. I have heard the 
term VFO Family" but VFO is not my family - GW Micro was and is and I'm 
still dealing with the loss.  some may not like these posts, but they 
are helping me deal with the situation.


I should have written this post using jaws to help me practice - oh well 
- I'll

 move on eventually.
Brenda









On 8/22/2017 12:04 PM, Butch Bussen via Talk wrote:
Yes, that is my understanding as well.  Again, i wonder if gw people had 
a clue a i squared would sell them down the drain.  Again I wonder, was 
this a i squared's agenda all along?  Only the shadow knows.

73
Butch
WA0VJR
Node 3148
Wallace, ks.


On Tue, 22 Aug 2017, Steve Jacobson via Talk wrote:

It is possible I am misinterpreting this note, but I really think that 
both Doug and Dan thought that the merger with AI Squared would give 
Window-Eyes a fresh burst of resources to get over the hump on changes 
that were very much needed.  Once they sold the company, even though 
they remained active employees, they would not have had a say 
regarding the purchase of AI Squared by VFO.  I remember at the time 
GW Micro was purchased by AI Squared, that Doug wrote in some context 
or other about the number of engineers and developers AI Squared had 
compared to GW Micro, and I think there was some real optimism there.  
The idea of the Fusion product with Window-Eyes may have provided  the 
new market and exposure that Window-Eyes really needed.  I really 
don't think there were two mor decent people in this industry.


Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
Dennis Long via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:00 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Cc: Dennis Long 
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

When GW sold out to AI squared that was effectively the end of WE.  
Remember everyone has their price Dan and Doug got there price.



-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
Reeva Webb via Talk

Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Reeva Webb
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

Watch fs make zt bloated and terrible with yearly updates. Oh, ai2, 
y'all shouldn't have gotten with the shark.


"the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never 
promised night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls 
Of Jericho


Reeva

On Aug 21, 2017 11:22 AM, "Sky Mundell via Talk" 


wrote:


And Zoomtext will be getting yearly updates, and so on like JAWS does.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
Russ Kiehne via Talk
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:50 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Russ Kiehne
Subject: Re: contacting Doug.

    You are correct, the article was posted for historical purposes.
It's interesting to see how many screen readers we had back then.
Jaws wonthe the battle and now is king of the hill.

-Original Message-
From: Debby Franson via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:50 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Debby Franson
Subject: Re: contacting Doug.

Hi Loy!

No, I agree that the article would not be fair today, but I think this
article was posted for historical purposes, not anything about the
current day.

Debby

At 10:25 AM 8/19/2017, Loy via Talk wrote
This would not be a air comparison now, Window Eyes progressed much 
faster
than JAWS since 1996.   - Original Message -   From: Russ 
Kiehne

via Talk   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List   Cc: Russ Kiehne   Sent:
Saturday, August 19, 2017 9:42 AM   Subject: Re: contacting Doug.   
Check
this out from times past!   Date:    Tue, 11 Jun 1996 14:49:26 EDT   
From:

Jamal Mazrui <7.1...@compuserve.com>   Subject: CSUN "Dueling

Windows"

Sensory Access Foundation has published a "Dueling Windows"   report in

the
Spring 1996 issue of Access Review.  It   summarizes a competition 
among

Windows screen readers that was   held at the 1996 CSUN conference in
March.  I am prefacing the   article with some tabulations I did 
with its

data.   Since the article does not quantify the performance of each
screen reader according to its criteria, I did 

Re: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

[Brenda via Talk]

HeyReeva,

I think you should consider taking your concern up the VFO ladder to 
someone above the people that answer the phone.  Sure seems like Fusion 
users should have gotten the same type of offer as W-E users did.  Maybe 
if you dig around you can find someone higher up the food chain to 
appeal to.


It doesn't hurt to try, even if only for the principle of it.
Brenda

On 8/22/2017 12:34 AM, Reeva Webb via Talk wrote:

For whatever stupid reason, people like me who bought the we based zoomtext
fusion got no discount at all on uprading. Despite the fact i'm in the same
boat as just we users. I'm not even saying  we should gotten free upgrades.
Sorry y'all but this makes me angry. I would've thought about going to the
jaws based version of fusion if they would've been like ok, instead of $200
for upgrade and $200 for the sma. We'll give y'all a break and do $75
upgrade and $100 for sma. Hell, even if they would've given we fusion users
blindness convention pricing without having to go to the conventions.  I
might have done that but no.   I will be using my we version of zt fusion,
slowly learn nvda better and wait to see if google puts out a new
chromebook pixel and buy that or another chromebook.

"the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised
night has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho

Reeva

On Aug 21, 2017 11:24 AM, "Sky Mundell via Talk" 
wrote:


Yeah and you know what is ironic about all of this? When Magic 12 came out,
Freedom Scientific issued a competitive upgrade plan so that people with
Zoom text could upgrade to Magic for about $100 or so.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Tom
Kingston via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 11:57 PM
To: Sky Mundell via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

That depends on the deal with APH. But they'll probably just eventually
replace Magic with ZoomText. Just like with Window-Eyes there's no
practical
reason for them to maintain two magnifiers. Magic is probably already on
death row allowing only critical updates while ZoomText is actively
developed.
Regards,
Tom


On 8/21/2017 2:06 AM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:

Oh Sure. That's right. But what about the Magic and JAWS student

editions?

Magic was used in Colombia with JAWS,and APH and FS launched student
copies of JAWS and Magic.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 10:47 PM
To: Sky Mundell via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

VFO bought AI Squared for two reasons.
1. To replace their useless Magic magnifier with the best selling

ZoomText.

2. To kill their competition in the screen reading world, Window-Eyes.
End of story.
Regards,
Tom


On 8/21/2017 12:14 AM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:

Because their still needs to be improvements made to Window-Eyes, for

example, Edge support, it needs rewritten braille support, it needs
touchscreen support, it needs this and that.


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
Nick Sarames via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 9:12 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Nick Sarames
Subject: Re: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

Why would they?

On 8/20/2017 9:22 PM, Debby Franson via Talk wrote:

Hi!

I wonder if VFO would ever sell the code.

Debby

At 12:37 PM 8/20/2017, Dennis Long via Talk wrote

They won't give code up.  Come on think that through.  What company
do you know that gives code that was a product that was sold for
profit to just give it away.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
Sky Mundell via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 1:19 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

They might give the Window-Eyes code up to a company like Humanware.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 10:04 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

I'm pretty sure they own the code.  I say this for a few reasons 1
they bought AI Squared and their products.  What are their products?
WE is one of those.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
Sky Mundell via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:46 PM
To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

I hope it does VFO didn't say anything about owning the Window-Eyes
code or anything.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
Olusegun
-- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk
Sent: Sunday, 

Re: contacting Doug.

[Brenda via Talk]

My thoughts...

I thought the NFB was supposed to help blind people - surprised they 
would sell out to a single screen reader, especially an inferior one.


aaron smithwas at VFO as Enterprise Compliance specialist.  I don't 
think VFO gave us Jaws because they wanted to, they may have had to 
legally for some reason.  wonder if aaron is still there or if he left 
with Doug.  I think he lived in Ft. Wayne so I'm thinking he worked 
remotely until he was no longer needed.


I suspect there are some folks that are still in contact with doug - if 
so, please convey my, and probably all listers, appreciation to him.  It 
would have been nice if Doug had said goodbye on this list, but I 
suspect that would have stirred things up again.


I think Jaws has a better chance of survival because it has better 
financial backing and a more diversified product line.  I really feel 
Hims did GW in after using GW to enter the U.S. market then going off on 
their own. I took a training class at GW when GW was working with Hims 
to develop and market the booksense and the folks at GW were so 
pleased/excited about this product.


All that being said, it never hurts to have multiple tools in the 
toolbox so I will learn jaws eventually. I just can't think in Jaws very 
well yet.


I think I covered everything I wanted in response to the emails in this 
thread.

Brenda



On 8/17/2017 2:45 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

Hear is why I say Jaws is going nowhere.  1 state agencies and government
contracts.  2 it's better than any other screen reader currently in
development.  3 NFB.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
ratshtron via Talk
Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2017 10:50 AM
To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: ratshtron
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

hmmm, if you can't beat the competition, kill it! I believe I'm going to
switch to apple, BIG GRIN!


Legend has it that on Wednesday 8/16/2017 08:02 PM, Olusegun --
Victory Associates LTD, said:


Well, Michael, I once opined that the war Freedom Scientific could not win
in the courts, was well fought and won outside; with its cohorts and

coterie

of friends, it succeeded in drowning the boat!

The merger with AI Square came to me as a surprise; I didn't want to see it
happen, but what voice do I have?

I long for the day when all these adaptive equipment
developers/manufacturers can TRADE THEIR STOCKS publicly; may be, just may
be, they'll have better stability!  Now, we keep our eyes on the sparrow,
Jaws may be taking its last breath as the venture capitalists will soon
squash its fins!  Then it'll be Apple and Google to fill the void at least
here in the United States!

Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado


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CREATING MESSAGE RULE WITH tHUNDERBIRD

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi List

In Thunderbird I no longer can create a rule for moving a message from 
my email provider inbox to another folder.  as in, if I get an email 
from the jaws list I want to send it to the jaws folder or from the 
window eyes users list to my gw-mail folder.


I get as far as selecting which folder to move the message to, the main 
inbox folder name is read, but I can't access the subfolders.   I'm not 
sure when I created a successful message rule recently, but I used to be 
able to do this.


Using the latest Thunderbird I tried with jaws and Window-Eyes with no 
success.  Any suggestions?


Brenda
win7/64
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Re: I'm Back!

[Brenda via Talk]

Glad you came back :) Hopefully VFO will keep this list around as 
transitioning to jaws will take time.  Since you are "bilingual" your 
expertise will be helpful.

Brenda

On 7/26/2017 1:17 PM, Pastor Gil Pries via Talk wrote:

Hi,

I'm back!  I couldn't stand being away.

  


Pastor Gil

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win10 driver issues was Re: Good Bye

[Brenda via Talk]

I got what I think was a similar issue with my lenovo laptop in 2015 
after I first purchased it.  After speaking with Steven Clower, or maybe 
it was Chris, I now start Window-eyes after the laptop boots and I'm at 
the desktop.


Can't tell you if I've had the problem since as I don't use the laptop 
much, but starting w-e manually seems to work.


brendarestart it

On 7/26/2017 9:27 AM, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote:
Here's the interesting thing, like you I get video driver  error tones 
when Window-Eyes launches when I bootup my computer.  This is with 
windows 10 1703.  I found by turning off quick start, I no longer get 
the video driver error tones.


-Original Message- From: Orlando Enrique Fiol
Sent: Tuesday, July 25, 2017 12:06 PM
To: Russ Kiehne ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: Good Bye

I've been in the Windows 10 insider preview program almost since its 
inception. Window-eyes has not worked for me using the past four insider 
previews, including the latest creator edition. I get video driver error 
tones upon launching Window-eyes, and many programs containing cursor 
and text on the screen are no longer read with the Window-eyes curso or 
mouse pointer.
Believe me, I was one of the most reluctant Jaws migrants. But upon 
experiencing this Window-eyes behavior, and knowing it would never be 
addressed with Window-eyes no longer in development, I had to keep 
working. All of you who think Window-eyes will work indefinitely in 
Windows 10 have obviously not yet encountered the insider previews or 
most current creator edition.

Orlando Enrique Fiol
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Re: Good Bye

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Pastor Gil,

sorry to see you go.

You could stayhere to help the rest of us with jaws questions from a 
window-eyes prospective.


Brenda

On 7/24/2017 1:12 PM, Pastor Gil Pries via Talk wrote:

The time  has come for me to leave the list.

I am a Jaws user, and not a Window-eyes user anymore.

May all go well with all of you.

  


Pastor Gil

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App mall was Re: updated all of my 35 apps

[Brenda via Talk]

The app mall is an excellent idea if there is someone talented and 
motivated enough to set it up.


Back in the day GW encouraged people to make their apps and websites 
accessible to screen reader users.  An app mall would be a good place 
for them to get info about how to go about it since they can no longer 
contact GW.  Apple has always encouraged app developers to make their 
apps accessible, so even links to the appropriate Apple webpage would 
also be a good idea.


I am clueless about jaws scripts and do use a few W-e apps and maybe 
someday will work on learning NVDA. Having jaws and NVDA scripts along 
with Window-eyes apps in the same place would be very handy for end 
users too.


As for the server, I think it was moved when it disappeared for a while 
during June +-.  Doug said something to the effect that as long as we 
kept topics relevant VFO would probably keep this server running.  But 
it appears Doug is gone and there is no one to look out for W-e user 
interests at VFO.


Not sure if Aaron Smith is still at VFO - he may be our only hope.  Or 
perhaps a long-shot would be pleading our case with Eric Damery (sp).


as a Window-eyes user, I find this list very helpful as I occasionally 
try to use jaws.  I just can't seem to stick with jaws because I think 
in Window-eyes.  At least on my win7 machine things should work fine for 
a while.


I'm keeping emails so if this list does disappear suddenly I will at 
least be able to contact some folks. If something happens all of a 
sudden, maybe we could all meet on the Blind Tech list or the jaws list 
(not sure what the contact info is) or another list someone mentions in 
response to my email.


Brenda




On 7/21/2017 3:05 PM, David via Talk wrote:

Unfortunately, seems like this is yet another way they try to push the
final point of WE as quickly as possible. Next thing is, they will turn
down the lists, my guess is. Perhaps the only reason why they still keep
the lists running, and App Central up, is that people actually make use
of them.


If now, they will not allow updates to be posted, that would mean noone
would use the App Central, so it is all good to hit the road for the
trash-bin. And, the day too few people are active on the list, down
which road does that take them? :)


Or, are they just awaiting the next failure of the server, then all the
sudden just determining that no more service will be done on the
machine, and we are left in the blue. The biggest trouble I find, is
that VFO simply do not care to inform anyone. They sit there till things
have reached a point, then just pull the plug. And if they even can pull
the plug unnoticed, that is their fun. Or, why have we seen no
announcement of the decision not to update apps, anything before. Too
sad, as that will make it very hard for developers to do what they
actually could, to make the screen reader stay up-to-date with the
newest technologies out there.


Someone setting up a server, might be a good idea. And first it has to
be done from scratch, why not open a service that would offer users a
cross-platform service. That is, it could hold not only an app store,
but a whole app mall. What I am suggesting is, go to the new app mall,
and here open the link for WinEyes, if that is your screen reader. You
will have the chance to pick and choose from WE apps. Or, if you are a
Jaws user, go to ap mall, open the Jaws link, and choose apps from the
list. Same with NVDA.


Sure, no apps are going to show up in all the sections, but if you
compare it with a real mall, you don't get milk in the sportsware store
either, do you. The big benefit of a combined service, would be that
people had ONE place to go, no matter which screen reader they used. It
might even encourage app developers, when they see, and read about, the
different apps for other screen readers. That way, maybe some developers
would be able to come up with more cross-platform like solutions. Of
course, it even could have a subsection for IPhone apps, or those for
Android, that are specialldesigned for visually impaired. Or, at least,
it could hold some reviews of such apps. Further, if there could be a
place for developers to go, and pick up articles and tutorials for how
to build apps under different environments, this could be yet another
way of encouraging more new apps and features to see the market, under
any of the screen readers covered.


Thing is, I wonder how long we have to get things going. As the end-date
of the Jaws transmission offer draws near, I have a tiny feeling we
might not see the list servers upp running, all that much longer. OK,
they might be using external servers, but I don't know if there is a
subscription for them to keep renewed, in such a case, likely it won't
be kept alive.


If anyone here thinks I am trying to be all negative, let me appologize.
My one and only point was to accept the facts, sad as they are, and
suggest that something else could be done to at least get the best out

Re: Behind in times.

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Dave,

I think you are correct about the home and tandum selections for your 
situation.  the VFO web page will also tell you how to check if your pc 
is a 32 or 64 byte/bit machine as you will want to download that version 
of jaws.


I kept W-e running until after the UAC box came up.  Once I knew jaws 
was downloading I turned W-e off.  It took a long, long time for 
everything to download so don't panic and for your comfort, if possible 
have a sighted person around to help you keep an eye on things.


Once jaws is downloaded there is a way to go in and put your license or 
code or whatever in.  Jaws will be running so you won't need (or even be 
able to use w-e) to do this.


I also waited until I could talk with vfo tech support.  They stayed on 
the line with me to get things started.


I am still using w-e as jaws is not very intuitive to me.  My brain 
processes/thinks in Window-eyes and it has been a challenge to do things 
with jaws keystrokes.


Hopefully someone else will reply to your post to confirm my comments.

Good luck.

Brenda


On 7/15/2017 2:22 PM, David Crowell via Talk wrote:

Hi everyone,

Well as always I have not yet migrated to JFW.  I always like to wait awhile
for people to get a new update or new screen reader before I will give it a
try.  I used to always do this with WE also because ther are numerous bugs
to be worked and so I wait until it is all in good working order.

Anyway, I am going to finally download JFW today.  I am absolutely terrified
since I had tried JFW before when I called them and they sent me a demo CD
to give it a try.  I absolutely hated it and totally forgot about JFW and
continued with WE.  d

Now I have saved a lot of the tips in a folder that has been shared on this
sight but one thing I did not save or accidently deleted is how to go about
the JFW download.

I have the link for the migration saved on IE so I am ready there.
What I am wondering is do I have to  turn WE off to do the download or
can I leave it on to help me make the choices I need to make while
downloading JFW?  I also have heard of different types of downloads like
home, professional, tandem.  Which is the best to use.  I assume it will be
home since I only have a home computer and do email, things on the web and
use Microsoft word.  If I understand I should go tandem that way I can give
FO access to my computer if I run into problems.

Any help for the behind the times user would be greatly appreciated.  Please
also keep your fingers crossed I do not throw the computer out the window if
things go haywire.


Dave

  
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Re: longshot

[Brenda via Talk]

You could write to Doug Geoffrey or VFO tech support.  They used to send 
you a link that was valid for 3 days. Hopefully they still do this.  Or 
perhaps you could ask Doug for a disk. They used to sell them for $20, 
maybe under the circumstances they would just mail you one but who knows.


good luck,
hth
brenda

On 7/14/2017 9:44 PM, Brandon Misch via Talk wrote:
Hey guys don't know if anyone on here is still involved with window-eyes 
now that it's been discontinued. But, i thought i would ask here is 
there anyway i can get my full window-eyes version emailed to me? tried 
calling ai squared and no help so thought i would ask on here in case 
some of the old developers were still around. thanks

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Window-Eyes as a trend setter anda question

[Brenda via Talk]

Good evening list

tonite I was surfing the Blind Tech Podcasts on my iPhone and came 
across a very depressing one dated May 26 where they were talking about 
in with the new and out with the old and how Window-eyes is no more. 
One of them stated words to the effect that VFO wanted everyone to use 
one screen reader.  Also, mention was made of Jaws market share (my 
words) in the voc rehab community.


I'm wondering if Window-Eyes will be the beginning of a trend where 
awesome technology gets gobbled up and lost in the future.


I ask this because I'm toying with purchasing Sendero's Seeing Eye 
GPS-Xt app.  Thing is, Sendero lists a bunch of companies they are 
somehow affiliated with - and one of those companies is Hims which used 
to be affiliated with GW.  Hims used to make the book Sense, but that 
has changed into a product called, I think, Blaze, probably no more 
support for Book Sense although, like W-E, it is probably still in use.


Hims-GW --  Window-eyes gone.  could Hims-Sendero mean the Seeing Eye 
GPs XT app will be short lived?


This may seem like an off topic question, but being Window-Eyes loyal 
users perhaps listers will best understand my concern and perhapsprovide 
me with some input.  I'm a little leary of spending cash (even at the 
discounted convention price) only to find my chosen technology disappear 
or left unsupported in a few years.


I look forward to any feedback on or off list.

Brenda
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Re: Reciprocal Idea

[Brenda via Talk]

I think many of us are in the same boat.  I will use Window-eyes as long 
as possible but am trying to learn jaws and not finding it very easy to do.


I'm glad this list is here so I can ask people who think in Window-eyes 
how to do jaws stuff.


for instance, on the internet I hit N in Window-eyes to move down the 
page.  Not sure why I like it better than arrow keys, but I seem to find 
it efficient.  What is the jaws equivalent to this?


Brenda

On 6/10/2017 3:36 PM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:
You got that right! Like they say, it's hard to teach an old dog new 
tricks. Smiles from another old buzzard!


On 6/10/2017 12:25 PM, Loy via Talk wrote:
When I learned Window Eyes, I had been a sighted user of Windows and 
the keyboard commands were more logical than JAWS.  Now I am older and 
it's harder to remember all the new commands in JAWS.  It seems to 
take more commands in JAWS than Window Eyes to do the same thing. I 
have installed JAWS and am trying it gradually to get use to it, but 
will still use WE as long as it works.

   - Original Message -
   From: Dennis Long via Talk
   To: 'Pamela Dominguez' ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
   Sent: Saturday, June 10, 2017 1:41 PM
   Subject: RE: Reciprocal Idea


   Why it's true people need to realize that.  You had to learn  new 
keyboard

   commands when you bought window eyes.

   -Original Message-
   From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]

   On Behalf Of Pamela Dominguez via Talk
   Sent: Saturday, June 10, 2017 1:12 PM
   To: Neville; Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Subject: Re: Reciprocal Idea

   You really didn't need to send this message.  Pam.

   -Original Message-
   From: Neville via Talk
   Sent: Friday, June 09, 2017 9:34 PM
   To: Matthew Chao via Talk
   Subject: Re: Reciprocal Idea

   Hi,
   Window-eyes is dead so just get on with life and learn Jaws or NVDA.

   Neville


   On 9/06/2017 10:22 PM, Matthew Chao via Talk wrote:
   > Hi, Folks.  Remember how Window-Eyes had a special keyboard 
layout for

   > JAWS defectors?  Why couldn't the folks at VFO do the same for us?
   > Besides, we had to go to JAWS somewhat kicking and screaming; it
   > wasn't our choice.  So, how about it, folks?  What do you
   > think?--Matthew Chao
   >
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Re: Thunderbird message amounts

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Neville,
Using your instructions with jaws in TB I can see how many read and 
unread messages are in a folder, but I have to go into the folder to do 
this.  Once I get to the bottom, activate  the touch cursor and right 
arrow for a while, eventually I come across the read, unread and total.


I can't do this prior to entering the folder as you first mentioned was 
doable for you.


"The total number of  messages in the folder can be obtained from the 
folder name prior to

"entering the folder.  "

Perhaps there are some view settings I need to change.

Thank you for this info.  It is a great way for me to get used to the 
touch cursor, and the more I can do with jaws that I used to do with 
Window-eyes the readier I will be for the future.


Brenda

On 6/8/2017 10:42 PM, Neville via Talk wrote:

Hi Brenda,
I have verbosity set to intermediate but no desktop icons are indexed 
unfortunately.


Although Jaws does not index the messages in Thunderbird like WE did, 
there is a way to gain the information with Jaws. The total number of 

The number of read and unread messages can be

located at the bottom of the screen with the touch cursor.
1. press control end to go to the bottom of the list of messages.
2. turn on the touch cursor with shift numpad plus.
3.use the right arrow to go down to the bottom where you will find the 
number of read and unread messages. Press numpad plus twice quickly to 
leave the touch cursor.



HTH
Neville.
On 8/06/2017 10:25 AM, Brenda via Talk wrote:

Hey Neville,

I have Jaws set to read the desktop that way (e.g. 15 of 26)but it 
doesn't work in TB.  I think I found the setting in the help menu 
under start-up options - I changed the verbosity to intermediate.  I'm 
pretty sure that is when the deskitop started reading 15 of 26 etc..


hth (if that is in fact what caused the change)
Brenda

On 6/7/2017 8:01 PM, Neville via Talk wrote:
I know exactly what you are saying Brenda because I am missing this 
feature as well.


In one of Raul's mp3 tutorials on making the switch, the desktop 
icons read out their index number as he arrows around the screen.  
e.g. 15 of 26.

  Has anyone been able to duplicate this and if so, how did you do it?

Thanks
Neville.

On 8/06/2017 1:34 AM, Brenda via Talk wrote:

In Window-eyes the number of messages in a folder is read.
with Jaws is there a way to do this?

At least jaws reads how many unread messages in a folder, but I 
could have lots and lots of messages in my inbox and have no way to 
know it with jaws.


Also, with Jaws is there a way to find out "message 10 of 125" etc 
to know where you are in the message list?


what are Window-Eyes migrants doingabout these issues?

Thanks for any help.
Brenda
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Re: Reciprocal Idea

[Brenda via Talk]

The day the official announcement about migrating to jaws, I asked Doug 
here on this list and he said there was no reciprical layout but pointed 
me to raul's migration tutorials. So probably not going to happen.

Brenda

On 6/9/2017 8:59 AM, via Talk wrote:

Heck. I'd be happy to find out whether I could redefine JAWS--whatever
they're called--hot keys? Cursor keys? I'm still waiting for a product key
from VFO Group, so I haven't bothered to install yet and don't know what I
can and cannot do with it.

I don't mind doing a little work. I had to do so with Window-Eyes. I had
always thought piling the character, word, line, paragraph hot keys on the
num pad was not intuitive at all. But, GW Micro had allowed for oddballs
like me to go their own way.

Just my two cents.
--Lou N.
-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+fenderwal=sbcglobal@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Matthew Chao via Talk
Sent: Friday, June 09, 2017 7:22 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Reciprocal Idea

Hi, Folks.  Remember how Window-Eyes had a special keyboard layout for
JAWS defectors?  Why couldn't the folks at VFO do the same for us?
Besides, we had to go to JAWS somewhat kicking and screaming; it wasn't
our choice.  So, how about it, folks?  What do you think?--Matthew Chao

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Re: Thunderbird message amounts

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Neville,

I have Jaws set to read the desktop that way (e.g. 15 of 26)but it 
doesn't work in TB.  I think I found the setting in the help menu under 
start-up options - I changed the verbosity to intermediate.  I'm pretty 
sure that is when the deskitop started reading 15 of 26 etc..


hth (if that is in fact what caused the change)
Brenda

On 6/7/2017 8:01 PM, Neville via Talk wrote:
I know exactly what you are saying Brenda because I am missing this 
feature as well.


In one of Raul's mp3 tutorials on making the switch, the desktop icons 
read out their index number as he arrows around the screen.  e.g. 15 of 26.

  Has anyone been able to duplicate this and if so, how did you do it?

Thanks
Neville.

On 8/06/2017 1:34 AM, Brenda via Talk wrote:

In Window-eyes the number of messages in a folder is read.
with Jaws is there a way to do this?

At least jaws reads how many unread messages in a folder, but I could 
have lots and lots of messages in my inbox and have no way to know it 
with jaws.


Also, with Jaws is there a way to find out "message 10 of 125" etc to 
know where you are in the message list?


what are Window-Eyes migrants doingabout these issues?

Thanks for any help.
Brenda
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quick transaction on bank site wasRe: combo boxes and drop down boxes

[Brenda via Talk]

Well, pressing ALT at the dropdown/combo box first didn't work, but when 
I remembered to press enter when on/at a dropdown/combo list I was able 
to arrow through them with Window-Eyes.


In Jaws, I had to listen to a whole lot of verbage before I found where 
I was.  I could change the dropdown to various accounts, but it was hit 
or miss, and in that area the numpad arrows didn't seem to work. 
CNTRL-HOME took me to the top, or if I couldn't get that to work tab or 
shift-tab got me out of the quick transaction area.  It is a whole lot 
of trial and a lot of error.


In the quick transaction area Jaws did say "3 rows 5 columns" but I 
wasn't sure how to use that info.


I can use W-E for now, but eventually, especially with Win10, I'm going 
to have a problem.


Any suggestions on how to use my banking site in Jaws as I do with W-E?

Brenda

On 6/7/2017 2:44 PM, Chris G via Talk wrote:

Before you start to arrow through the combo box, try alt-down arrow first.
That may work.



Chris Grabowski
Mystic Access
Where the magic is in learning.
https://www.MysticAccess.com
Ready to begin using your assistive technology with confidence while 
actually having fun? Visit us to learn about our comprehensive audio 
tutorials, one-on-one support and ongoing teleclasses. We also offer 
eclectic and timely assistive technology podcasts, a newsletter 
containing exclusive news and discounts, regularly updated free 
downloads, and so much more.

Contact:
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Facebook: mysticaccessempower


 Original Message ----
From: Brenda via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, Jun 7, 2017 12:58 PM EST
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: combo boxes and drop down boxes

On my banking site I used to get combo boxes which were easy to access
to select desired account number WITH  ENTER and arrow.
Now they seem to be drop-down boxes. I also ran into this on an
application I was filling out.

In Window-eyes if I arrow, shift-tab and tab back and forth I can read
and adjust my entries.  It is a little time consuming but doable.

Is there an easier way to do this in either Window-eyes or Jaws?

Thanks for the answer to my other 2 questions.  I will try the INSERT-B
once I get the drop-down thing figured out.

Thanks,
Brenda
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Re: Thunderbird message amounts

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Marvin,

Wow, you use 3 screen readers.  I'm having enough trouble learning jaws. 
 I keep trying to use W-E commands in jaws.


Fortunately, Window-eyes doesn't freeze (hhh) with TB. I have had an 
occasional issue with FF and W-E freezing.  I'm finding jaws is 
confusing with FF.  Probably need to practice more but W-E is just so 
smooth it makes it hard to switch.


Brenda



On 6/7/2017 12:26 PM, Marvin Commerford via Talk wrote:
Hi.  I don't know of a way to do this.  WE and NVDA do this without 
making changes but Jaws just doesn't seem to handle this list in the 
same way.  I've actually stopped using Jaws with TB because there are 
also other issues that are there.  At this point in time it seems to me 
that NVDA works the best with TB since on my system WE crashes NVDA if 
you go too fast with key presses.  For me WE is still better with TB 
than Jaws even with WE's instability with it.




On 6/7/2017 10:34 AM, Brenda via Talk wrote:

In Window-eyes the number of messages in a folder is read.
with Jaws is there a way to do this?

At least jaws reads how many unread messages in a folder, but I could 
have lots and lots of messages in my inbox and have no way to know it 
with jaws.


Also, with Jaws is there a way to find out "message 10 of 125" etc to 
know where you are in the message list?


what are Window-Eyes migrants doingabout these issues?

Thanks for any help.
Brenda
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combo boxes and drop down boxes

[Brenda via Talk]

On my banking site I used to get combo boxes which were easy to access 
to select desired account number WITH  ENTER and arrow.
Now they seem to be drop-down boxes. I also ran into this on an 
application I was filling out.


In Window-eyes if I arrow, shift-tab and tab back and forth I can read 
and adjust my entries.  It is a little time consuming but doable.


Is there an easier way to do this in either Window-eyes or Jaws?

Thanks for the answer to my other 2 questions.  I will try the INSERT-B 
once I get the drop-down thing figured out.


Thanks,
Brenda
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Pop-up boxes

[Brenda via Talk]

At my banking site I get pop-up boxes to confirm my transaction is from 
account #123 to #456.


W-E tech support explained to me years ago that these boxes were special 
and the only way to read them was with CNTRL-SHIFT-W-W which would read 
the entire page.  I think it had to do with the way certain websites 
were made.


This is very important - how do I do this in Jaws?

Thanks for your help.
Brenda
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Thunderbird message amounts

[Brenda via Talk]

In Window-eyes the number of messages in a folder is read.
with Jaws is there a way to do this?

At least jaws reads how many unread messages in a folder, but I could 
have lots and lots of messages in my inbox and have no way to know it 
with jaws.


Also, with Jaws is there a way to find out "message 10 of 125" etc to 
know where you are in the message list?


what are Window-Eyes migrants doingabout these issues?

Thanks for any help.
Brenda
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Re: Thunderbird Question

[Brenda via Talk]

Using Window-Eyes with TB I get unread.  Once it is read it just says 
the message header.  I forget what Jaws does.

Brenda

On 5/26/2017 10:53 AM, Don H via Talk wrote:
It seems that the read and unread notification doesn't work with WE or 
Jaws or Nvda.  Usjually a message will have the indication of a 
attachment.  To get to the attachments go to the menu under messages and 
arrow down to attachments.


On 5/26/2017 8:38 AM, Pastor Gil Pries via Talk wrote:

Hi,
I have 2 Thunderbird questions.
The first one is does Thunderbird indicate email unread,  read, reply, 
and attachment?

Second question is how do you get to attachments in Thunderbird?
Thanks,

Pastor Gil
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Re: Jaws hot key undefined after update

[Brenda via Talk]

Yep, every time I do a Jaws update I have to reassign the J in the 
shortcuts menue using Window-eyes.


Not sure why VFO does it this way.  It is a real pain.

brenda

On 5/26/2017 7:44 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk wrote:

Hi,

Has anyone had the experience that the hot key we had probably all set up in 
the Jaws desktop shortcut is removed after an update?
This happened to mine after the recent update.
It makes sense, of course, since I guess the icon got updated as well.
I'm just wondering if this happened to anyone else.

Thanks,

Rod
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Re: End of Life Message

[Brenda via Talk]

Yesterday, I had a message about updating apps.  After that, whenever I 
started Window-eyes it came up until I checked the "do not show" check 
box.  (I close w-E to switch to Jaws, and start W-e manually after 
rebooting my pc.)


hth
Brenda

On 5/25/2017 5:14 PM, Don H via Talk wrote:

How are people getting this end of life message to come up?

On 5/25/2017 4:10 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
You would be smart to learn Jaws or brush up on it so when you need it 
isn't

as frustrating just my opinion.

-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]

On Behalf Of Chris Skarstad via Talk
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2017 12:03 PM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Subject: Re: End of Life Message

Hi.
remember, no one is saying you have to stop using Window-eyes.  If it 
works,
keep right on using it as long as you can!  I also have JAWS once 
again on
this machine but very rarely do I ever use it. it's there if I ever 
need it.

Window-eyes is going to be my primary screenreader until it doesn't work
anymore.




On 5/25/2017 11:48 AM, Brenda via Talk wrote:

Hello List,

I turn Window-eyes on manually.  Yesterday after my computer almost
died due to multiple and random power surges, I got the Window-eyes
End of Life Notification.  Really depressing.  I wish they had just
said window-eyes Discontinuation Notice - it would have been less
ominous.

Fortunately, my husband revived my Window7 machine and Window-eyes
still works.  I need to use Jaws more often so I can learn it, but I
just can't bring myself to do so when Window-Eyes works with programs
like Vipre and Jaws doesn't.  Also, Window-Eyes has a setting which
makes it work in safe mode and Jaws doesn't.

Brenda
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Re: End of Life Message

[Brenda via Talk]

Yep, Dennis, you're right, and I'm slowly doing that.

I really appreciate all the tips on this list.  I may not use them 
instantly, but at least I'm exposed to them for future refreshing.

brenda

On 5/25/2017 5:10 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

You would be smart to learn Jaws or brush up on it so when you need it isn't
as frustrating just my opinion.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Chris Skarstad via Talk
Sent: Thursday, May 25, 2017 12:03 PM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Subject: Re: End of Life Message

Hi.
remember, no one is saying you have to stop using Window-eyes.  If it works,
keep right on using it as long as you can!  I also have JAWS once again on
this machine but very rarely do I ever use it. it's there if I ever need it.
Window-eyes is going to be my primary screenreader until it doesn't work
anymore.




On 5/25/2017 11:48 AM, Brenda via Talk wrote:

Hello List,

I turn Window-eyes on manually.  Yesterday after my computer almost
died due to multiple and random power surges, I got the Window-eyes
End of Life Notification.  Really depressing.  I wish they had just
said window-eyes Discontinuation Notice - it would have been less
ominous.

Fortunately, my husband revived my Window7 machine and Window-eyes
still works.  I need to use Jaws more often so I can learn it, but I
just can't bring myself to do so when Window-Eyes works with programs
like Vipre and Jaws doesn't.  Also, Window-Eyes has a setting which
makes it work in safe mode and Jaws doesn't.

Brenda
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Re: Raul, Carol is happily using the Caps-Lock key

[Brenda via Talk]

I may have missed the initial message or got confused with the various 
replies.


In order to use caps lock as the Jaws key do you have to turn laptop 
mode on?


Once laptop mode is on, can you still use the insert as the Jaws key and 
the numpad for navigation?


If true, it seems like laptop mode is more versitile than desktop mode.

If not, what do I have to do to have the caps lock and insert key both 
funcgtion as the Jaws key?


Thanks
Brenda

On 5/25/2017 12:56 PM, Raul A. Gallegos via Talk wrote:
Hi, I'm glad you are liking the caps lock usage. To toggle its state, 
all you need to do is press it twice quickly.


I hope that helps.


--
Raul A. Gallegos
Assistive Technology Trainer - RGA Tech Solutions
Voice and Text: 832.554.7285
Office: 832.639.4477
Personal Email: r...@raulgallegos.com
Work Email: train...@rgats.com
Twitter: @rga7285 and @RGATrainer

“Any teacher that can be replaced with a computer, deserves to be.” - 
David Thornburg


On 5/24/2017 2:26 PM, Carol and Roger wrote:

Hi Raul,

I am getting along fairly well with the cap-lock key as my default 
Jaws key now.  I do have one question  Is it possible to turn on 
caps-lock? Before, it always said Caps-Lock on or off.  Now, it says 
nothing when I press it and my letters do not speak with a higher 
pitch.  Fortunately, I don't type a lot that requires all caps, but I 
am not sure why it is no longer working.


This is really strange!  I went out of my email and when I alt-tabbed, 
or at least that was what I meant to do, I hit the alt-Caps-Lock combo 
accidently instead.  Guess what!  Alt-Caps-Lock sets and says the 
state of the Caps-Lock.  Go figure!  So, is it supposed to be 
alt-Caps-Lock, or is it supposed to be the Caps-Lock?  Pressing the 
Caps-Lock key now works just like the insert key used to.  I believe 
someone indicated there were times I should press it twice, but I 
don't remember why.  I just hope the setting stays whenever it is 
necessary to restart Jaws, since I don't know how it got this way.  I 
like it like this.


Take care,

Carol




On 5/23/2017 8:53 PM, Raul A. Gallegos wrote:
Hi, if using the laptop layout, you can activate the Jaws window by 
pressing Control Shift Caps lock J. So, basically, it's the 3 keys 
along the left side of the keyboard with the letter J. It really 
works. Personally I run Jaws in the notification area so it's out of 
the alt-tab order.



--
Raul A. Gallegos
Assistive Technology Trainer - RGA Tech Solutions
Voice and Text: 832.554.7285
Office: 832.639.4477
Personal Email: r...@raulgallegos.com
Work Email: train...@rgats.com
Twitter: @rga7285 and @RGATrainer

“Any teacher that can be replaced with a computer, deserves to be.” - 
David Thornburg


On 5/23/2017 10:26 AM, Carol and Roger via Talk wrote:
I would like to suggest, based on my own experience, if switching a 
desktop keyboard setting to laptop setting, it might be worthhwhile 
to make sure Jaws is in the alt-tab setting. Trying to use the 
capslock key to get into the Jaws setting was very tempramental for 
me.  It only worked on a very few occasions and I did try many times 
to use it.  I am certain there was some operator error, but even I 
can't have messed up that badly, LOL!


Carol, happily using my insert key!


On 5/23/2017 10:39 AM, Ed Culpepper via Talk wrote:
I have not tried the laptop layout. I will check out that 
possibility. I have not loaded Jaws on my laptop yet, but I 
certainly will be doing so. I can anticipate that using the same 
keyboard layout on both my desktop and laptop could be 
advantageous. Using the same keystrokes regardless of which 
computer I am using seems more simple and efficient.

Thanks for the suggestion and link.
Ed Culpepper
J. Edward Culpepper
Huntsville, Alabama, USA
Check out my weekly devotional blog, Blind Faith, at:
   
http://www.blindfaith.fbchsv2.org

From: Joseph Norton [mailto:joseph.nor...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, May 22, 2017 11:04 PM
To: Ed Culpepper; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: RE: Alternative for Insert as Awkward Jaws Modifier Key?
Hi:
Have you tried the laptop layout?
Here is a link to a set of mp3 files describing it.  This is also 
available in a DAISY book through FS Reader.  Here is the link;
ftp://ftp.freedomscientific.com/users/hj/private/WebFiles/JAWS/LaptopKeysWithJAWS.zip 


Hope this helps.
Sent from Mail   
for Windows 10

From: Ed Culpepper via Talk 
Sent: Monday, May 22, 2017 5:28 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Subject: Alternative for Insert as Awkward Jaws Modifier Key?
Greeting WE Migrants -
I am learning Jaws navigational keystrokes as I migrate from 
beloved WE to
Jaws. Using the insert key as a primary Jaws modifier key is very 
awkward
for me. On my keyboard the insert key is the top left key on the 
so-called
"6-pack" of keys located just above the arrow keys. The Jaws 

Re: a question regarding jaws installation

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Lee,

Just to be safe if you have the license number and authorization code, I 
would download and install Jaws but just don't use it. VFO phone support 
can say otherwise, but the info might not be correct.  If it is on your 
computer and registered you will be in the system.


Brenda

On 5/25/2017 11:47 AM, Lee Hodgson via Talk wrote:

Hi ,
I wondered if anyone can answer a question for me.

I have my jaws authorisation code, but do not really, as yet, want to 
install jaws.
Will this authorisation code work whenever I use it? in other words, 
after the 31 july when the offer of free transfer expires?


I guess what I want to know is, if I install Jaws on say the 1st of 
september this year, will the authorisation ccode still work 
regardless.   I would imagine so, but just wanted to msound out about 
it, to put my mind at rest.

thanks and sorry if this is a silly question.
Lee, Emily my guiding furry snowflake and Chester and Simba the feline 
fellas.


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End of Life Message

[Brenda via Talk]

Hello List,

I turn Window-eyes on manually.  Yesterday after my computer almost died 
due to multiple and random power surges, I got the Window-eyes End of 
Life Notification.  Really depressing.  I wish they had just said 
window-eyes Discontinuation Notice - it would have been less ominous.


Fortunately, my husband revived my Window7 machine and Window-eyes still 
works.  I need to use Jaws more often so I can learn it, but I just 
can't bring myself to do so when Window-Eyes works with programs like 
Vipre and Jaws doesn't.  Also, Window-Eyes has a setting which makes it 
work in safe mode and Jaws doesn't.


Brenda
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Re: Window-Eyes to JAWS Migration

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Nick,

I suggest starting on the Window-Eyes migration page of AI Squaared. 
Raul gives some really neat short tutorials from a Window-eyes 
prospective that are really helpful.  Jaws has some really neat on-board 
tutorials where you can listen while you performwhat the tutorial is 
explaining.


Take your time and learn a little at a time.

Brenda

On 5/17/2017 7:07 PM, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote:

Question:

Is there much in the way of training matterial and tutorials
(specifically) on Youtube?

On 5/17/2017 4:56 PM, Tony C via Talk wrote:

Hi, As good as the trainning materials are, and the Jaws help. If
someone can't take the time to read and listen to the materials that
cover the area they need help with, then that's pretty lazy in my
opinion. I haven't used Jaws since 2004 and quite a bit has changed and
I've forgotten a heck of a lot. I've had to ask a few questions, and
I've listened to a little of the trainning materials that are in the
Daisey books. So far I'm impressed with the way Jaws is working for me,
and I'm happy with all the contact that I have had with VFO. Tony

-Original Message- From: Raul A. Gallegos via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2017 2:07 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: Window-Eyes to JAWS Migration

Richard, this means you have a choice. If you can find a trainer who is
willing to work with you after hours, then you make it happen. However,
this will not happen for free in most cases. This is especially true if
you want one-on-one training. As mentioned from me and a few others, you
might be able to set something up with someone if you feel you really
need one-on-one training. Some will do this as a volunteer and for free
while most will want to be charged for their time.


Best of luck, and if you are interested, let me know.


--
Raul A. Gallegos
Assistive Technology Trainer - RGA Tech Solutions
Voice and Text: 832.554.7285
Office: 832.639.4477
Personal Email: r...@raulgallegos.com
Work Email: train...@rgats.com
Twitter: @rga7285 and @RGATrainer

“Any teacher that can be replaced with a computer, deserves to be.” -
David Thornburg

On 5/17/2017 12:43 PM, Kurlander Richard (75) via Talk wrote:

No of course not however why can't these companies have people to
work from home when the regular crew finishes their shift. Perfect
example I get home from work or maybe a ballgame or concert or
whatever it is midnight I am doing something on my home computer and I
encounter a problem, what do I do? Can't fix the problem next morning
since I must go to work.

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rkurlan=schools.nyc@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of John Farley via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2017 1:10 PM
To: 'richard kurlander' ; 'Window-Eyes
Discussion List' ; 'Juan Hernandez'

Subject: RE: Window-Eyes to JAWS Migration

Richard,

Are you really asking that a blind person, such as myself in the past,
who just happens to work in the computer field should, at the end of a
long day, find someone who is having problems with their use of the
PC, travel to wherever they live and spend a few hours helping them out?
Working as a blind person in the sighted world of computing is a hard
slog and not as easy as you may think.

I have tried to provide the hands on help in the past. It was not
successful from my viewpoint.
It often turns out that in fact you finish up teaching basic PC skills
as well as how to use a screen reader, which is not what I signed up for.

I will provide written help on user lists such as this, but no longer
hands on help.
I do, very occasionally, stand in as a trainer in a local class for
teaching visually impaired people about PC skills when the usual
trainer is on vacation.




Regards, John

Tel: +44 (0) 1442 259243
Mob: +44 (0) 7815 056076




-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+john_farley=btinternet@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of richard kurlander via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, May 17, 2017 6:39 AM
To: Juan Hernandez; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: RE: Window-Eyes to JAWS Migration

if you a computer engineer you know a lot more
than I do and people like you should help other
blind people by giving them hands on training if
you do tech support.At 04:01 PM 5/16/2017, you wrote:

Simplicity is in the eye of the beholder. We all
need different things.  I am a computer
engineer, so I need access to some of the more
advanced aspects of the screen reader to use my
various software development tools.  Screen
readers are there to help all of us.  And that
means having lots of features that some of us
will use and that others will not. Best, Juan
Hernandez juanhernande...@gmail.com 619-750-9431
(M) |  858-777-3311 (F) My WebSite |
Twitter | FaceBook | LinkedIn -Original
Message- From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+juanhernandez98=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Kurlander 

Re: FIXED Re: Jaws and Thunderbird threaded messages

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Nick,

Yep, he used tandom to repair Jaws.

Then someone on another list said you had to do this small Jaws update 
from the VFO page and not from the update function in Jaws.


In my case, the tech may have checked that before he did the repair - as 
in - you may just need to go the the VFO website to get the update.


either way, call VFO and they will help you.

Actually, I called back later for a follow-up question and didn't have 
to wait very long and the tech was very helpful.  So far, having good 
experiences with VFO tech suport.


Brenda

On 5/17/2017 7:05 PM, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote:

Hi Brenda, curious - did he fix the problem remotely or did he walk you
through the steps?  Because of my lack of computer savy, I'm a big fan
sharing my computer with a tech person.

On 5/17/2017 4:59 PM, Brenda via Talk wrote:

Hi List and Raul,

Well, someone on another list insisted the necessity of reading TB
messages in threaded view had been fixed and suggested I call VFO.

I called VFO early this afternoon.  I had very little wait time and
Keith did a repair of my jaws installation AND now I don't have to use
threaded messages as far as I can tell.

Just thought I'd share.

Brenda

On 5/17/2017 8:53 AM, Raul A. Gallegos via Talk wrote:

Hello, the part about jaws not reading message headers in Thunderbird
if you are not in threaded view seems to be something recent. I don't
know if it is a jaws bug or if it is something which recently changed
in Thunderbird 52. So for now changing it to thread view is the only
way I have found. I understand you don't like to read messages in a
thread. I don't either for all mailboxes so I understand the
frustration. In the meantime however, if you are in a message list and
you set it for threads, press the star key, which is shift number
eight and it will expand all the threads allowing you to see each
message individually.

--
Raul A. Gallegos
Assistive Technology Trainer - RGA Tech Solutions

Mobile: 832.554.7285
Work: 832.639.4477
Personal Email: r...@raulgallegos.com
Work Email: train...@rgats.com

“Any teacher that can be replaced with a computer, deserves to be.” –
David Thornburg



On May 16, 2017, at 8:07 PM, Brenda via Talk
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

Hello List,


I'm trying to transition to Jaws starting with emailing which I am
getting a lot of experience on lately.


I find with Jaws I have to view messages as threaded which I don't
like.  Is there a way to read messages as unthreaded.  Jaws doesn't
seem to read the titles unless threaded.  Hoping there is a setting
to be changed.


I like the way Window-eyes works with Thunderbird much better, hoping
this issue in jaws will be fixed.

Thanks,

Brenda


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FIXED Re: Jaws and Thunderbird threaded messages

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi List and Raul,

Well, someone on another list insisted the necessity of reading TB 
messages in threaded view had been fixed and suggested I call VFO.


I called VFO early this afternoon.  I had very little wait time and 
Keith did a repair of my jaws installation AND now I don't have to use 
threaded messages as far as I can tell.


Just thought I'd share.

Brenda

On 5/17/2017 8:53 AM, Raul A. Gallegos via Talk wrote:

Hello, the part about jaws not reading message headers in Thunderbird if you 
are not in threaded view seems to be something recent. I don't know if it is a 
jaws bug or if it is something which recently changed in Thunderbird 52. So for 
now changing it to thread view is the only way I have found. I understand you 
don't like to read messages in a thread. I don't either for all mailboxes so I 
understand the frustration. In the meantime however, if you are in a message 
list and you set it for threads, press the star key, which is shift number 
eight and it will expand all the threads allowing you to see each message 
individually.

--
Raul A. Gallegos
Assistive Technology Trainer - RGA Tech Solutions

Mobile: 832.554.7285
Work: 832.639.4477
Personal Email: r...@raulgallegos.com
Work Email: train...@rgats.com

“Any teacher that can be replaced with a computer, deserves to be.” – David 
Thornburg



On May 16, 2017, at 8:07 PM, Brenda via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

Hello List,


I'm trying to transition to Jaws starting with emailing which I am getting a 
lot of experience on lately.


I find with Jaws I have to view messages as threaded which I don't like.  Is 
there a way to read messages as unthreaded.  Jaws doesn't seem to read the 
titles unless threaded.  Hoping there is a setting to be changed.


I like the way Window-eyes works with Thunderbird much better, hoping this 
issue in jaws will be fixed.

Thanks,

Brenda


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W-e to Jaws tutorials annoying numbers

[Brenda via Talk]

Hello list and Raul,

I'm loving the tutorials, but when I listen to them I keep hearing a 
bunch of numbers - I think it is telling me how far along in the mp3 I am.


I either have to keep hitting cntrl every few seconds or change focus to 
the desktop.


Any setting I can change so I don't keep hearing this annoying string of 
numbers while listening?  It isn't a terribly big deal now, but it may 
be as I expand my horizons to listen to other things on the internet.

thanks for any help.
Brenda
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TB settings - was Re: Jaws and Thunderbird threaded messages

[Brenda via Talk]

Thank you Raul for that info.


Are there any TB settings that will make Jaws and TB use as optimal as 
possible?



thanks,

brenda


On 5/17/2017 8:53 AM, Raul A. Gallegos via Talk wrote:

Hello, the part about jaws not reading message headers in Thunderbird if you 
are not in threaded view seems to be something recent. I don't know if it is a 
jaws bug or if it is something which recently changed in Thunderbird 52. So for 
now changing it to thread view is the only way I have found. I understand you 
don't like to read messages in a thread. I don't either for all mailboxes so I 
understand the frustration. In the meantime however, if you are in a message 
list and you set it for threads, press the star key, which is shift number 
eight and it will expand all the threads allowing you to see each message 
individually.

--
Raul A. Gallegos
Assistive Technology Trainer - RGA Tech Solutions

Mobile: 832.554.7285
Work: 832.639.4477
Personal Email: r...@raulgallegos.com
Work Email: train...@rgats.com

“Any teacher that can be replaced with a computer, deserves to be.” – David 
Thornburg



On May 16, 2017, at 8:07 PM, Brenda via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:

Hello List,


I'm trying to transition to Jaws starting with emailing which I am getting a 
lot of experience on lately.


I find with Jaws I have to view messages as threaded which I don't like.  Is 
there a way to read messages as unthreaded.  Jaws doesn't seem to read the 
titles unless threaded.  Hoping there is a setting to be changed.


I like the way Window-eyes works with Thunderbird much better, hoping this 
issue in jaws will be fixed.

Thanks,

Brenda


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Jaws from a Window-eyes prospective was Re: How Ironic

[Brenda via Talk]

I like geting help with Jaws through the eyes of an experienced 
Window-eyes user.  Raoul's tutorials are a great start.  The on-board 
Jaws training materials are great, but I'm finding it very helpful to 
have the W-E prospective.



Brenda





On 5/17/2017 10:03 AM, Robert Grimwood via Talk wrote:

Dear all,


whoever would have imagined that this list would have turned into a 
Jaws discussion list?



Cheerio,

Robert




On 5/17/2017 1:53 PM, Raul A. Gallegos via Talk wrote:
Hello, the part about jaws not reading message headers in Thunderbird 
if you are not in threaded view seems to be something recent. I don't 
know if it is a jaws bug or if it is something which recently changed 
in Thunderbird 52. So for now changing it to thread view is the only 
way I have found. I understand you don't like to read messages in a 
thread. I don't either for all mailboxes so I understand the 
frustration. In the meantime however, if you are in a message list 
and you set it for threads, press the star key, which is shift number 
eight and it will expand all the threads allowing you to see each 
message individually.


--
Raul A. Gallegos
Assistive Technology Trainer - RGA Tech Solutions

Mobile: 832.554.7285
Work: 832.639.4477
Personal Email: r...@raulgallegos.com
Work Email: train...@rgats.com

“Any teacher that can be replaced with a computer, deserves to be.” – 
David Thornburg



On May 16, 2017, at 8:07 PM, Brenda via Talk 
<talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:


Hello List,


I'm trying to transition to Jaws starting with emailing which I am 
getting a lot of experience on lately.



I find with Jaws I have to view messages as threaded which I don't 
like.  Is there a way to read messages as unthreaded. Jaws doesn't 
seem to read the titles unless threaded.  Hoping there is a setting 
to be changed.



I like the way Window-eyes works with Thunderbird much better, 
hoping this issue in jaws will be fixed.


Thanks,

Brenda


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Jaws and Thunderbird threaded messages

[Brenda via Talk]

Hello List,


I'm trying to transition to Jaws starting with emailing which I am 
getting a lot of experience on lately.



I find with Jaws I have to view messages as threaded which I don't 
like.  Is there a way to read messages as unthreaded.  Jaws doesn't seem 
to read the titles unless threaded.  Hoping there is a setting to be 
changed.



I like the way Window-eyes works with Thunderbird much better, hoping 
this issue in jaws will be fixed.


Thanks,

Brenda


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Window-eyes commands using Jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

Here is a better link ... per doug

http://www.gwmicro.com/window-eyes/migrate/



This should be what we all need.

Brenda
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Re: Window-eyes commands using Jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

Has anyone found the tutorials doug is talking about?  I looked on the 
link he provided but can't find any tutorials.

thanks
Brenda
On 5/15/2017 2:58 PM, Doug Geoffray via Talk wrote:

Brenda,

Unfortunately there is not a Window-Eyes keyboard layout in JAWS.  To help 
people migrate from Window-Eyes to JAWS, there are 8 tutorials that you can 
listen to that talk about changes you may notice.  These tutorials are designed 
for Window-Eyes users switching to JAWS.  You can find the links for the 
tutorials from the following web page:

http://www.freedomscientific.com/Downloads/JAWS

Regards,
Doug

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dgeoffray=vfogroup@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Brenda via Talk
Sent: Monday, May 15, 2017 2:51 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Subject: Window-eyes commands using Jaws

Hello List and maybe Doug,


In Window-eyes there was a Jaws keyboard.  Is there a Window-eyes keyboard in 
Jaws?


Are there any tutorials specifically on how to do things I did in
Window-eyes using Jaws?


I have done some of the on-board Jaws tutorials, but I am having trouble
figuring out how do to what I used to do with W-e.  for example - using
the mouse cursor.  Using Jaws I can't seem to move the mouse cursor
around the screen.  In w-E there was CNTRL-SHIFT-B to change where the
mouse could go from full screen to focused window to active window.  I
don't know how to do that in Jaws OR if it would make the mouse cursor
read more.


I'm asking here instead of a Jaws list as I'm hoping some dual users who
understand Window-eyes will be able to help me.


Thanks,

brenda



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Window-eyes commands using Jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

Hello List and maybe Doug,


In Window-eyes there was a Jaws keyboard.  Is there a Window-eyes 
keyboard in Jaws?



Are there any tutorials specifically on how to do things I did in 
Window-eyes using Jaws?



I have done some of the on-board Jaws tutorials, but I am having trouble 
figuring out how do to what I used to do with W-e.  for example - using 
the mouse cursor.  Using Jaws I can't seem to move the mouse cursor 
around the screen.  In w-E there was CNTRL-SHIFT-B to change where the 
mouse could go from full screen to focused window to active window.  I 
don't know how to do that in Jaws OR if it would make the mouse cursor 
read more.



I'm asking here instead of a Jaws list as I'm hoping some dual users who 
understand Window-eyes will be able to help me.



Thanks,

brenda



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Downloading jaws Re: switch to Jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Brian


Maybe the server is just busy.  I remember for past Window-eyes updates 
I would wait a few hours or a day or two until everyone had gotten their 
downloads and then the W-e upgrade would download nicely.  (Oh, that 
makes meso sad to remember those days - must move   forwazrd).


brenda


On 5/15/2017 12:55 PM, Bryan Peterson via Talk wrote:
Well I do have one, albeit not a current one, so I can't take 
advantage of this. It's still back in 8.4. But for some reason I'm 
unable to download a demo of JFW to see if I can justify scraping 
together the funds for it. I've tried with both IE and Firefox and the 
download gets to a certain point, usually one where it still says 0 
percent downloaded, and just stops there for a while before failing.




Focus your powers and prepare for buttle.
-Original Message- From: Raul A. Gallegos via Talk
Sent: Monday, May 15, 2017 10:16 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: switch to Jaws

Bryan, it's too bad you feel this way. I think that perhaps you are
associating Jaws with Freedom Scientific, meaning that if there were
things that Freedom Scientific did, not VFO, you might be thinking that
all the same bad experiences may happen again, or continue to happen. In
any case, it's not FS, (Freedom Scientific) who is giving out free
copies of Jaws. So, you are right about that. It's VFO who is doing
this. can tell you that this is no scam. If you hold a retail license of
Window-Eyes, you will get a license for Jaws. Maybe you think that the
folks from the former GW Micro / Ai Squared are lying? I don't think so.
*smile*.

--
Raul A. Gallegos
Assistive Technology Trainer - RGA Tech Solutions
Voice and Text: 832.554.7285
Office: 832.639.4477
Personal Email: r...@raulgallegos.com
Work Email: train...@rgats.com
Twitter: @rga7285 and @RGATrainer

“Any teacher that can be replaced with a computer, deserves to be.” - 
David Thornburg


On 5/15/2017 10:14 AM, Bryan Peterson via Talk wrote:
I'm not altogether optimistic about the future of Window-Eyes, but at 
the same time I'm not going to stop using it unless I absolutely have 
to. As for this supposed offer of free copies of JFW for WE users I'm 
pretty sure it's a scam. I have a hard time imagining FS giving 
anyone free copies of JAWS under any circumstances. As for which 
screen reader I might switch to it probably wouldn't be JAWS, partly 
because I can't seem to download a demo of the latest version to try 
before I buy, but also because it's an absolute resource hog. I 
remember that from the twelve years I used it before switching to WE.


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Re: wineyes to jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey Brice,

Jaws has some really good tutorials.


can you give us any jaws lists for asking jaws questions?  too bad if 
they don't like new folks asking stuff, but I suspect they will be glad 
we are coming over to the dark side.





On 5/15/2017 11:25 AM, brice Mijares via Talk wrote:
I'm not happy wineyes is going away, but I'm surely glad it's not 
costing me to make the switch to Jaws. I've been slowly learning NVDA, 
so it will be no bother to slowly  learn Jaws. I just hope there is 
some good audio learning material. I've been a happy customer of 
window eyes for nearly 20 years. Will this list continue for us 
new-bes? I don't think the jaws list will be happy to all the 
questions from new-bes!

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Re: switch to Jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

doug and/or Aaron will this list be maintained?It is still very 
valuable.


I wish you the best going forward.


Brian, If you don't believe Aaron or Doug, give VFO a call and see for 
yourself.  Aaron and Doug would not scam us.



Darrel, times change, and I doubt Doug and Dan and Aaron would have 
merged with AI Squared if they didn't think it would be a good move with 
the screen reader market as it is.  I doubt they knew AI squared would 
merge with VFO.  Nonetheless, this is where we are at, and at least VFO 
is letting us migrate to a usuable screen reader that will be developed.



and List...Window-eyes is still the best screen reader for some 
programs.  I can't seem to access all of Vipre with jaws although with 
Window-eyes I can access Vipre.  And please don't leave this list -there 
are still questions to be helped with and it is good to read everyone's 
posts.



Brenda




On 5/15/2017 11:14 AM, Bryan Peterson via Talk wrote:
I'm not altogether optimistic about the future of Window-Eyes, but at 
the same time I'm not going to stop using it unless I absolutely have 
to. As for this supposed offer of free copies of JFW for WE users I'm 
pretty sure it's a scam. I have a hard time imagining FS giving anyone 
free copies of JAWS under any circumstances. As for which screen 
reader I might switch to it probably wouldn't be JAWS, partly because 
I can't seem to download a demo of the latest version to try before I 
buy, but also because it's an absolute resource hog. I remember that 
from the twelve years I used it before switching to WE.




Focus your powers and prepare for buttle.
-Original Message- From: Bob Tinney via Talk
Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2017 9:07 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: switch to Jaws

I'm not planning on switching to Jaws any time soon!  We works better
and takes less overhead!  And, I like the Butch timer app too!


Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net

On 5/14/2017 4:47 PM, Butch Bussen via Talk wrote:
I plan to keep using window-eyes as long as it works.  They're not 
going to make it diappear.  If it gets to a point where I must switch 
to something else, I'll go with n v d a. I suspect window-eyes will 
do much of what I need it to do for some time even if they stop 
selling and developping it.

73
Butch
WA0VJR
Node 3148
Wallace, ks.


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Re: More on Sohos

[Brenda via Talk]

I had been told that sophos works with Window-eyes.  glad I didn't try 
it.  I got a good deal on a vipre Internet Security from HSN and it 
works well with Window-eyes.  I haven't tried NVDA as I haven't learned 
that program yet, but I can't seem to access everything with Jaws.  Glad 
have Window-eyes.



I think Chris G from this list is a Sophos user.  Perhaps you can email 
him offlist or he will respond to your email.



Brenda


On 5/15/2017 12:37 AM, Tom Fairhurst via Talk wrote:

The Sophos Home window works a bit better with NVDA, but is not fully 
functional. It doesn’t appear that protection settings can be changed there 
although they are displayed. If anyone has gotten window-Eyes to work with it, 
let me know.
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Interesting - someone tried to unsubscribe me from the list

[Brenda via Talk]

Just got a message that a request to unsubscribe from the talk mailing 
list had been received.



Has anyone else had this happen to them?


I enjoy this list and do not want to unsubscribe  - not sure what is 
going on.



Brenda

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Re: Until VFO says so, Window-eyes is not dead.

[Brenda via Talk]

So maybe listers should consider sending a copy of their messages on 
this list to the VFO customer service or tech support or Doug or anyone 
else in the organization and see if they react or respond?



On 5/9/2017 9:47 PM, Don H via Talk wrote:
Wouldn't you think with all this WE is dead talk that someone from VFO 
would step in and say it ain't so?


On 5/9/2017 8:28 PM, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote:

Hmm, sounds like fake news Peter.  I deal in accuracy, so if VFO
discontinues WE as of July 1st 2017 (for example), then it is not dead
until that date.  I'm sorry if you don't care for reading the truth.

On 5/9/2017 8:59 PM, Peter Duran via Talk wrote:
Well, you are welcome to your personal delusions. Remember all the 
folks at

GW Micro who did the development work are gone, so who will carry on?

Peter Duran


-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+peterduran2015=outlook@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On

Behalf Of Chris Skarstad via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2017 6:38 PM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Subject: Until VFO says so, Window-eyes is not dead.

   If you're trying to get people to stop using
Window-eyes, you're probably in for a pretty good fight there. and 
there

has been no official announcement that Window-eyes is indeed dead.
people will still use it no matter what you say.



On 5/9/2017 5:32 PM, Peter Duran via Talk wrote:
Well, Window-Eyes is unfortunately definitely dead. It is 
irrational to
presuppose that VFO will support two competing screen readers, with 
one a

lot cheeper than the other.  Sad to say, JAWS won and WE lost the
screen-reader wars.

Those of us with technical skills ought to help NVDA to improve 
over time

so

we can keep up with Windows 10 advances.

Peter Duran

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+peterduran2015=outlook@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On

Behalf Of Vaughan Dodd via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2017 5:11 PM
To: Russ Kiehne; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: RE: No future; Window-Eyes is dead!

Can one be created?

Vaughan.



-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+vaughan.dodd001=msd.govt...@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On

Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, 10 May 2017 1:37 a.m.
To: Darrell Bowles; Peter Duran; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: No future; Window-Eyes is dead!

I just wished NVDA had a Window Eyes keyboard layout?

-Original Message-
From: Darrell Bowles via Talk
Sent: Monday, May 8, 2017 11:00 AM
To: Peter Duran ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: RE: No future; Window-Eyes is dead!

I didn't say that window-eyes would survive.  And didn't I already  
say

that

JAWS, NVDA and narrator are left on the windows platform?

-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+dgbowles=msn@lists.window-eyes.com] On

Behalf Of Peter Duran via Talk
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2017 1:58 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' 
Subject: No future; Window-Eyes is dead!


It always amazes me when smart folks (like on this list) prefer a 
fanticy

instead of reality.  There is absolutely no reason for Window-Eyes to
continue and compete with JFW.  Why would they do that?

There are 3 options to check out: Narrator on Windows 10, NVDA, and
VoiceOver. So, get real and get to work.

I suppose those of you who believe that Window-Eyes will stay 
around also

believe that the health care bill that passed the House last week will

cover


everybody as promised by Trump instead of leaving 24 million folks 
without

any health care.

Peter Duran

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Re: Future Of Window-Eyes

[Brenda via Talk]

Sky, you mention the sighted folks at the now VFO, but aren't the GW 
Mcro owners sighted?  I know GW had a lot of tech support who were blind 
and they knew their stuff and were more helpful than the jaws CSRs.  I'm 
not sure how many jaws customer service folks are blind, but they don't 
seem as helppful.



As for the timeline, maybe VFO wanted AI Squared to merge with GW Micro 
first.  When that happened, I thought maybe Window-eyes had a chance - 
maybe that is what GW folks thought too.



Just sad that we are hearing things everywhere but directly.







On 5/7/2017 2:47 PM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:

FS always saw Window-Eyes as a threat and I have a feeling that that lawsuit
they filed against GWMicro was part of their stradigy to destroy
Window-Eyes. That lawsuit happened when FS was under Lee Hamilton.  Then,
Lee Hamilton left in 2013, and John Blake took over and then, in November of
2015, VFO formed with Optolec and Freedom Scientific.  And then, on June
14th, 2016, VFO bought AI Squared, and then, in August of that year, John
Blake moved back to upstate New York, with Tom Teerman as the new president
and CEO, who is sighted but has family connections to blindness due to
glaucoma.  He did say in FSCast that he would probably get glaucoma
eventually.  So, Richard Chandler, Lee Hamilton, John Blake, were the
sighted presidents and CEO of Freedom Scientific, while Tom is sighted but
might eventually get Glaucoma.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, May 07, 2017 11:27 AM
To: Darrell Bowles; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: Future Of Window-Eyes

My question is why would a company pay for a company that only has one
product "Window Eyes" then shut down the product.?
   - Original Message -
   From: Darrell Bowles via Talk
   To: Dave ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
   Sent: Sunday, May 7, 2017 1:18 PM
   Subject: Re: Future Of Window-Eyes


   If the company had asked for a donation, I would have gladly given it.

   Sent from my iPhone

   > On May 7, 2017, at 1:15 PM, Dave via Talk 
wrote:
   >
   > GW Micro must have been suffering from Cash Flow problems.  The question
   > then is, how to attract more customers.  The more customers, the better
   > the cash flow.
   >
   > I have suspected the Window Eyes program was due for a Re-write from the
   > ground up, but this costs lots of money, and can take a couple of years
   > to do it right.  Not enough cash, and they ran out of time to do it.
   >
   > I doubt if there was anything the Users of Window Eyes could have done,
   > unless we all were willing to donate $500 to the cause, and even then,
   > it may not have been enough.
   >
   > Protesting and getting as many people to agree with you doesn't get much
   > in the long run, other than make all of the participants feel good about
   > themselves.   However, the end result is nothing different than what has
   > taken place.
   >
   > I too wish it were different.
   >
   > Grumpy Dave
   >
   >
   >
   > --
   > Dave 
   >
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Window-Eyes still has a place - Vipre

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi List,

My AVG expired and my search for an accessible virus/internet security 
resulted in me choosing vipre.  With Window-Eyes, I can access and 
change parameters such as email and firewall settings etc.  With Jaws, I 
can only access virus settings either from the user interface or the 
context menu in the system tray.



I have the same situation working with my click-free back-up program.


Perhaps I don't know how to use the jaws mouse cursor efficiently, but 
from comments on other lists, I think it just doesn't read everything.  
Not sure about NVDA.



Point - window-eyes is still a very valuable screen reader - at least 
for now.



Brenda

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Re: Questions re WE

[Brenda via Talk]

One person in this thread asked where the beta team was - still waiting 
to hear any kind of reply. - don't think there is a beta team though.



One idea about VFO staff not being able to anser - keep asking until you 
connect with the right person.  Hopefully someone will have a 
conversation with VFO at the NFB or ACB conventions.



One can only keeptrack of so many lists - so  - is there talk of the 
future of Window-eyes on any other lists?



It is really sad that we are being kept in the dark.  I am learning 
other screen readers, but I still would like to know what is/is not 
going on.



Brenda









On 5/4/2017 9:26 AM, Russ Kiehne via Talk wrote:
IN many cases, when you ask someone in the know, you are told they 
can't say anything because of a non disclosure agreement.


-Original Message- From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, May 3, 2017 9:42 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: Questions re WE

Karyn,

No one on this list is capable of speaking for VFO who now owns WE. We 
don't

know for sure the status of WE in the plans by VFO.

The best bet is for you to call them, get someone high up in the
organization and try to get an answer to yur questions.

Or even better: I find that I have good luck getting answers when I write
directly to the CEO of a company.

I always certify the letter. Certifying is like registering except they
don't keep the letter in the safe over night, and of course it is less
expensive.

By certifying a letter, I find that it usually reaches the CEO, or at 
least

reaches someone very close to him/her.

-Bob Ringwald


-Original Message-
From: Karyn Campbell via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2017 9:00 AM
To: Window-Eyes list
Subject: Questions re WE

Hello all,

I am back after an extended absence from this list. Sorry to come back 
with

a bang but I need some answers.

At work I am trying to get my employer to upgrade me to the latest 
version.

That's not really the issue right now. The SMA is the issue though and I
need some answers before I press them for that one.

What is the status of Window-Eyes? If it were to go away, what is the 
plan

for those of us who use it? Is it even worth getting an SMA right now?

Answers would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

Karyn Campbell, Illinois USA,  karyn1...@gmail.com
Using WE   9.4 on HP Pavilion running Windows 10 with Office 2013 and 
I.E.
11 as default browser and Asuss convertible laptop running Windows 10 
with

Office 2013 and I.E. 11 as default browser and Vipre Antivirus on boht
machines.

Join me in supporting the Illinois Council of the Blind through our 
GoFundMe

page at www.gofundme.com/icb2015.


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Re: Questions re WE

[Brenda via Talk]

Has anyone contacted Doug Geoffrey or anyone at VFO - other than asking 
the customer service people that answer the phone (the CSRs only know 
what the higher-ups tell them)?



Just a thought,

Brenda


On 5/3/2017 10:14 AM, Karyn Campbell via Talk wrote:

I happen to agree with Andre on this one. We deserve some answers.

I've seen some preliminary information for VFO at the ACB convention this
summer and there is no mention of WE in that material. That makes me wonder
what is going on.

Karyn Campbell, Illinois USA,  karyn1...@gmail.com
Using WE   9.5.4 on HP Pavilion running Windows 10 with Office 2013 and I.E.
11 as default browser and Asuss convertible laptop running Windows 10 with
Office 2013 and I.E. 11 as default browser and Vipre Antivirus on boht
machines.

Join me in supporting the Illinois Council of the Blind through our GoFundMe
page at www.gofundme.com/icb2015.




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Re: Window-Eyes suddenly invalid?

[Brenda via Talk]

If you call the Vfo  phone number they are open till 7 o'clock and may be able 
to help you


Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 18, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Bryan Peterson via Talk 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
>  I seem to have run into an issue with the Office version of WE. After having 
> my computer off for an hour or two earlier I turned it on just a few minutes 
> ago and got the message that my copy of WE does not appear to be valid and 
> that a message containing the name and serial number was sent to the 
> AISquared server. Almost mmediately upon clicking the accompanying OK button 
> I got the message that my demonstration time was about to expire. I’m not 
> sure what could be causing the problem or how to fix it. I tried running one 
> of the programs in the Office 2010 suite in the hope that it would correct 
> the problem but so far no luck. Any help would be appreciated. I also know 
> it’s not an internet issue since I can still access the web.
> Focus your powers and prepare for buttle.
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Re: 9.5.4 very unstable on my HP desktop

[Brenda via Talk]

I use Alt B to access bookmarks, control I doesn't do anything for me.  
Also, I have my history etc set to delete on exit.



brenda


On 4/16/2017 8:01 PM, net bat via Talk wrote:
one place that  w e hangs in firefox is when you press control i to 
open the bookmark list. it hangs every time for a few minutes. and 
when w e does unhangge  it will do it again.
one work around is to turn auto load and browse mode off before you 
open the bookmark list. then w e will continue to work.
firefox also gets very sluggish when you do not delete your browseing 
history. w e will take several seconds before it will talk when you 
arrow down a web page to read it or w e  can not be stopped from 
talking until it finishes reading the lines you just arrowed down too.
once i deleted the browseing history, cache , forms etc. the 
sluggisheness disapeared. i have had to do this about once per month.


-Original Message- From: Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2017 4:45 PM
To: Donald L. Roberts ; Window-Eyes DiscussionList
Subject: RE: 9.5.4 very unstable on my HP desktop

Hi Don,

I echo Netbat's suggestion of patience for the page to fully load, but 
I would add that my preferred browser is Mozilla Firefox, which I find 
to be less unstable in general.


Hth,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Donald L. Roberts via Talk

Sent: Sunday, April 16, 2017 6:32 PM
To: t...@window-eyes.com
Subject: 9.5.4 very unstable on my HP desktop

I am writing to inquire whether other list members have observed
significant instability with Window-Eyes 9.5.4 especially on web pages.
I have an HP desktop running Windows 10 Creator edition.  This
instability was also present with previous windows versions,
specifically 8.1 and Windows 10 anniversary and also 1507.  So it may
well be something unique to this machine.


It is almost the norm rather than the exception that Window-eyes will
crash whenever I launch a web page or search for something on a page,
such that I will then have to restart using alt control w.  I often have
to launch Jaws 16 to get the job done.  Today, for example I went to
wal-mart.com to search for an RCA Galileo Pro.  The main Wal-mart page
loaded without incident, and I got to the search box without
difficulty.  But as soon as I hit control shift f and typed RCA Galileo
Pro and hit enter, Window-eyes crashed.


Are any of you listers experiencing anything comparable?


Thanks.


Don Roberts


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Re: Alternative to Eset

[Brenda via Talk]

I hear Sophos Home works well with window-eyes and is free for up to 10 
users.  I guess it runs like a web page.  there are folks on the 
blindtech and this list that use it.  You have to go to their website to 
download it.



I prefer something that I load to my pc from disk so I chose Vipre.  
They have US based tech support and will help you with issues.  Also, 
they at least know what screen readers are.  The really good deal I got 
from HSN helped me make my final decision.



I hear some jaws and NVDA users have some success using vipre and I have 
"sighted assistance" if I have issues.One person said it made his 
fan run alot, but noone else has said that.



I have been trying to find an accessible antivirus/security program 
lately, and this is all I can tell you.



hth

Brenda


On 4/14/2017 4:16 PM, Samuel Wilkins via Talk wrote:

Hello everyone,

My Eset license is about to expire, and I was wondering if there is a 
more accessible solution.  I know this has been covered before, but I 
missed the thread.  Thank you in advance.





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Latest Thunderbird, window-eyes and Jaws

[Brenda via Talk]

Hey List,


Well, if anyone is a multiple screen reader user you may have found that 
Window-eyes works with the latest Thunderbird 52 as does NVDA but Jaws 
doesn't.  h


Actually, I'm kinda surprised as usually what works with W-e works with 
jaws, just a few different key strokes.



I just hope that when they do another update of Thunderbird Window-Eyes 
isn't disrupted.



Brenda

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Re: gun shy about new laptop

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi Pam,

Interesting, on my Lenovo laptop the function key is second from the 
left with the control being the far left/outside .



someone told me FN + ESC will disable the system function keys on a 
lenovo - have you tried this?  Since the location  of the control key on 
your lenovo is different then mine, I'm wondering if the FN+ESC will 
disable the system function keys on all Lenovo products.


Brenda


On 4/13/2017 2:31 PM, Pamela Dominguez via Talk wrote:
I think it was that way on my Dell.  On my Lenovo, it is in the left 
corner, and the control key is to the right of it.  So, when I use 
that computer, I have to remember that the left-hand corner key is not 
control.  Pam.Pam.


-Original Message- From: Van Lant, Robin via Talk
Sent: Thursday, April 13, 2017 11:36 AM
To: Linette Sukup ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: RE: gun shy about new laptop

The FN key is usually next to the Windows Key to the left of the space 
bar. My HP has 4 keys to the left of the spacebar, the alt key, the FN 
key, the Windows key and then the control key.  The FN key is used to 
change what the F1 through F12 keys do.  It used to be that you 
pressed this key with the appropriate function key in the top row to 
change screen brightness, volume and other such changes.  Now, because 
so few software programs use the top row function keys within the 
software, the computer manufacturers have defaulted the top row 
function keys to change the screen brightness and so forth and you 
have to press the FN key in order to trigger software specific 
actions.   Anyone who was a big WordPerfect 5.1 user will remember how 
many various actions could be done with pressing various function 
keys.  I recall having a little cheat sheet that sat on the keyboard 
above the function keys to remind sighted users of what each key did.  
F7 to print, F5 to save, and so on.
 Oh, I'm feeling nostalgic.  The menus and ribbons took away the need 
for most software programs to rely on function keys for various 
operations.








-Original Message-
From: Talk 
[mailto:talk-bounces+robin_van_lant=key@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Linette Sukup via Talk

Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2017 8:38 PM
To: bjn...@windstream.net; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: gun shy about new laptop



I have an HP Pavilion purchased nearly two years ago, and I have very 
few issues with it. Now, this may sound stupid, but where is this fn 
key that people are talking about. I thought that all of the top row 
of little keys were function keys.

Thank you.

Peace.
Linette



On 4/12/2017 1:35 PM, Brenda via Talk wrote:

Hi robin,

I have a similar story to yours.  I am now a casual home computer user
as I no longer do medical transcription.  I own a 15 inch Lenovo
laptop which I purchased last spring when my Win7 pc almost died.


When I called Window-eyes Tech support to find out what to avoid with
laptops, I was not warned about the function keys being designated and
the need to press the FN key to overide the default uses.  Best buy
didn't tell me this eather until I had already paid for Geek Squad
service/set-up, and my laptop was ready to go home.


fortunately, my laptop does have an application key.  Also, my numpad
has an insert key  as part of the numpad.  the numpad insert key is
very small, but it is there.  could you have this key without
realizing it (just a thought)?


I still don't like having to use the FN key when i want to use the
Window-eyes copy & paste key F8 in some programs. It is a nuisance to
use the FN+fF6 key in Thunderbird as if you do it wrong it turns
airplane mode on and I lose my wifi connection.  F5 to refresh is the
only other function key I have to look out for, but these are not
Window-eyes command keys.  F1 is really tricky because it will mute
speech if the FN key is not pressed.  that being said, it is sometimes
convenient to have the system function keys for things like volume and
close down.


I haven't used the laptop layout, but could that be a solution for now?


My Lenovo laptop cost $350 at Best Buy.  It was discontinued shortly
after that, but it has what I need.  Lenovo could be an option for you.


The only thing I like about laptops is that if the power goes out the
computer doesn't shut down.  My husband was able to revive my Win7
desktop, and I will use my Win7 desktop until it really dies and
forces me to become proficient with Win10 on a laptop, possibly with
the laptop layout for Window-eyes.


sorry for lengthening a short ansre.  Just my thoughts on the subject.


Brenda

because I will use my Win7 desktop until it really dies.




On 4/12/2017 12:14 PM, Van Lant, Robin via Talk wrote:

Late last summer I got a new HP laptop. The primary thing that drew
me to it in the store was the keyboard layout of having the 10-key
number pad on the right, yet only being a 15 inch screen. What I did
not realize until after I got it home and paid money for a tech to
come help me

Re: gun shy about new laptop

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi robin,

I have a similar story to yours.  I am now a casual home computer user 
as I no longer do medical transcription.  I own a 15 inch Lenovo laptop 
which I purchased last spring when my Win7 pc almost died.



When I called Window-eyes Tech support to find out what to avoid with 
laptops, I was not warned about the function keys being designated and 
the need to press the FN key to overide the default uses.  Best buy 
didn't tell me this eather until I had already paid for Geek Squad 
service/set-up, and my laptop was ready to go home.



fortunately, my laptop does have an application key.  Also, my numpad 
has an insert key  as part of the numpad.  the numpad insert key is very 
small, but it is there.  could you have this key without realizing it 
(just a thought)?



I still don't like having to use the FN key when i want to use the 
Window-eyes copy & paste key F8 in some programs. It is a nuisance to 
use the FN+fF6 key in Thunderbird as if you do it wrong it turns 
airplane mode on and I lose my wifi connection.  F5 to refresh is the 
only other function key I have to look out for, but these are not 
Window-eyes command keys.  F1 is really tricky because it will mute 
speech if the FN key is not pressed.  that being said, it is sometimes 
convenient to have the system function keys for things like volume and 
close down.



I haven't used the laptop layout, but could that be a solution for now?


My Lenovo laptop cost $350 at Best Buy.  It was discontinued shortly 
after that, but it has what I need.  Lenovo could be an option for you.



The only thing I like about laptops is that if the power goes out the 
computer doesn't shut down.  My husband was able to revive my Win7 
desktop, and I will use my Win7 desktop until it really dies and forces 
me to become proficient with Win10 on a laptop, possibly with the laptop 
layout for Window-eyes.



sorry for lengthening a short ansre.  Just my thoughts on the subject.


Brenda

because I will use my Win7 desktop until it really dies.




On 4/12/2017 12:14 PM, Van Lant, Robin via Talk wrote:
Late last summer I got a new HP laptop.  The primary thing that drew me to it in the store was the keyboard layout of having the 10-key number pad on the right, yet only being a 15 inch screen.  What I did not realize until after I got it home and paid money for a tech to come help me set it up was two things.  First, it does not have the application key, which I have learned to get around with the Shift F10 keystroke.  The bigger problem was the whole thing we've talked about with now having to push the FN key in order to get the function keys to work the way I want.  (I had not found someone who was comfortable going into the bios to help me see about changing this.)  The biggest problem Is that this function key thing also applies to the Insert key, as it is right next to the F12 key.  I've gotten pretty good at using the caps lock key instead, but this requires some real finger gymnastics to activate certain Window Eyes command.  Aside from all this, there is also some 

we

  ird clicking thing that the keyboard occasionally does that is annoying. All 
this to say, it's not been a great experience and had I not invested in paying 
a tech to set up the computer for me, I probably would have quickly returned it 
to Costco for a refund or exchange.

So, I'm in a situation now where I may be giving this laptop to my sighted 
husband and getting a new one, but I'm gun-shy about how not to repeat this 
problem in my laptop selection.  I am not a heavy computer user at home, so did 
not want to spend much money, although I'm not looking for the cheapest netbook 
thing either.  I mainly looked at Best Buy and Costco, because I wanted to get 
my hands on the keyboard and feel the layout.  I like that Costco doubles the 
manufacturer's warranty and provides great, free help desk support for the 
computers purchased there.

Any advice from those of you having purchased computers lately on how to 
navigate this keyboard dilemma, especially if buying one online?  I'd really 
like to stay in the $500 range, if possible.

Robin Van Lant | Sr. Program Manager
Strategy & Performance Management | Key Equipment Finance
720-304-1060 | robin_van_l...@key.com



This communication may contain privileged and/or confidential information. It 
is intended solely for the use of the addressee. If you are not the intended 
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you are receiving 

Window-eyes and latest Thungerbird?

[Brenda via Talk]

Hi List,

although I'm learning other screen readers, I mainly use W-E.


On the blindtech list some folks have posted concerns about TB 52 and 
jaws not working together.  They say NVDA works ok.



Just wondering if any window-Eyes users have upgraded to Thunderbird 52 
and how it is working for them?



thanks,

brenda

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Re: Crossing over to the other side

[Brenda via Talk]

If nothing else you can use the demo which is a 40 minute usage then you have 
to I think turn it off and back on or reboot or something but at least you 
would get used to using jaws and learn if you like it or don't like it, and 
nvda is free so you can always install that and try it to see if you like it 
better than Jaws or Window Eyes

Dictated and  Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 7, 2017, at 6:40 PM, Vaughan Dodd via Talk 
> <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:
> 
> So why do not ask what might be offered for you?"
> 
> 
> Vaughan.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On 4/8/2017 10:30 AM, Don H via Talk wrote:
>> I would not want to pay the going price for JAWS as I am sure a deal is in 
>> the works for all WE owners to get a deal on making the switch.
>> 
>>> On 4/7/2017 5:27 PM, Mike Rogers via Talk wrote:
>>> Hi.
>>> I have also switched to Jaws.  It works really well with Google chrome, on 
>>> the internet.  But I switch back to W.E. and firefox, for the bard page, as 
>>> I like it better.  It's a process, as I've been using W.E. since 1998.
>>> 
>>> Mike
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> www.harmonicaworkshops.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Fri, 7 Apr 2017 18:01:57 -0400
>>> Brenda via Talk <talk@lists.window-eyes.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Hello List,
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> It is with great sadness that today I installed Jaws.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> I have noticed a few things I like.  I don't know the Jaws mouse cursor, 
>>>> but I was able to use it to read the AVG Zen screen and go to my messages 
>>>> within Zen and read them.  Also, in Thunderbird, I was able to read more 
>>>> with the mouse with jaws.  The onboard training is pretty nice too.  I 
>>>> always hated trying to surf through the W-e manual.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> I'm still having issues changing settings like speech rate, etc. I am 
>>>> doing a lot of trial and error to get where I need to go. I will have to 
>>>> actually read/listen to some of the training stuff.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Of course, Window-eyes Tech Support was the best.  But as much as I love 
>>>> Window-Eyes and the former Tech Support, I have to look out for myself as 
>>>> all the GW Micro employees did.  They all have other jobs and lives 
>>>> outside of GW/window-eyes.  I had gone into vacation mode for the talk 
>>>> discussion list, but I was always subscribed to the GW News list and heard 
>>>> nothing until the manditory/necessary update was announced this January.  
>>>> When I came back to the discussion list it was you kind people who filled 
>>>> me in.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> I'll still use Window-eyes, but I will be ready to change as change is 
>>>> coming (like records to 8-track tapes, to cassettes, floppy disks, and 
>>>> on it goes.)
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Brenda
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Brenda
>>>> 
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>

Crossing over to the other side

[Brenda via Talk]

Hello List,


It is with great sadness that today I installed Jaws.


I have noticed a few things I like.  I don't know the Jaws mouse cursor, 
but I was able to use it to read the AVG Zen screen and go to my 
messages within Zen and read them.  Also, in Thunderbird, I was able to 
read more with the mouse with jaws.  The onboard training is pretty nice 
too.  I always hated trying to surf through the W-e manual.



I'm still having issues changing settings like speech rate, etc. I am 
doing a lot of trial and error to get where I need to go. I will have to 
actually read/listen to some of the training stuff.



Of course, Window-eyes Tech Support was the best.  But as much as I love 
Window-Eyes and the former Tech Support, I have to look out for myself 
as all the GW Micro employees did.  They all have other jobs and lives 
outside of GW/window-eyes.  I had gone into vacation mode for the talk 
discussion list, but I was always subscribed to the GW News list and 
heard nothing until the manditory/necessary update was announced this 
January.  When I came back to the discussion list it was you kind people 
who filled me in.



I'll still use Window-eyes, but I will be ready to change as change is 
coming (like records to 8-track tapes, to cassettes, floppy disks, 
...and on it goes.)



Brenda




Brenda

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Re: future of window-eyes

[Brenda via Talk]

when I listened to Jeff bishop talk, on the Main Menu podcast, I felt 
like he was all excited that now all the companies - Google, Microsoft, 
VFO, would all work together now.  I think this is what is being sold to 
groups like ACB and NFB, blind service agencies, etc.



To some extent, this may actually be true as now the different software 
companies only have to deal with VFO and not worry about dealing with 
multiple screen reader companies - therefore not having to deal with the 
same issue with different screen reader companies.



I just wish the one company could have been GW/AI Squared.


Brenda




On 4/7/2017 4:52 PM, Vaughan Dodd via Talk wrote:
It means that there will not be any developments, but the Window-Eyes 
for Office deal will still run.  I think the question and response 
should have brought about some probing for something more satisfactory.



It bothers me that too many people are gagged due to non-disclosure 
agreements.  Thus: we are not getting informed, independent analysis 
of this topic.



Vaughan.




On 4/8/2017 8:09 AM, Jo Taliaferro via Talk wrote:
I listened to part of the main menu podcast the other day and I was 
surprised at how little was said about the future of window eyes. For 
now, the word is that nothing is changing. I don't know what that 
means! I just don't want to get caught not having the things I need 
to do the work I need to do. Outlook 2016 is just not working for me 
and I am not not not going back to best buy because they keep putting 
things on my computer that I don't want. I am up-to-date with window 
eyes and I still have an SM a left. I have no idea what's going to 
happen to that! Just my take on things. I might make the switch.


Jo Taliaferro

On Apr 7, 2017, at 10:17 AM, Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. 
via Talk  wrote:


Tony and Vaughan, I am in your shoes!  The podcast in question HAD SCANT
information about Window-Eyes!  In fact, it seemed as if the 
statement made

was COERCED or somewhat FORCED out of the mouth of the interviewee.

For me to believe that Window-Eyes is alive, I shall have to see 
either the

same, or something close to the same kind of service I once had with GW
Micro.  If that's not the case, then, obviously Window-Eyes is dead 
and it's
only a matter of time before its funeral is announced and we can 
bring grave

flowers and also kick dirt over its grave!

Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado


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Re: Thanks for output on touch screens

[Brenda via Talk]

Dictating can be real "fun".  I have to read back everything I type, 
especially if I'm going to post on facebook, because some words are 
really messed up - typing the word "buckeye" has a distasteful 
rendering.  I dictate in short phrases and then manually type some words.



Brenda


On 4/7/2017 2:09 PM, net bat via Talk wrote:
i can not use dictate very well. i have to think about what i want to 
say then type it.

i can not think and dictate at the same time. grin


-Original Message- From: Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2017 10:19 PM
To: Larry Higgins ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: Thanks for output on touch screens

Larry,
Just to clarify, don't think for a second that anyone is doing anything
remotely resembling "normal" typing on these on screen keyboards. Think
of them as keyboards for text messaging, brief email replies, and so on.
Everyone uses real keyboards for any real typing.
Otherwise, dictation works surprisingly well. But again, at least for
myself, I don't consider it viable for anything of any real length. And
there have been times when I've spent more time after the fact
navigating back through the text to make corrections than I spent
dictating it in the first place.
And finally, you can only dictate so much in one shot before it simply
times out and enters what it heard up to that point.
Hth,
Tom


On 4/6/2017 6:01 PM, Larry Higgins via Talk wrote:

Hey Listers,

A big thanks for so many responses to my question regarding touch 
screens.


As it stands, right now, I am not quite ready to get serious about using
an iDevice or any other at present. However, there is a chance that at
some point that with the flux in the screen reading field, it might be
an option for real investigation on my part.

I think it might be fun, not to mention a challenge to become
comfortable using one of these devices, but I really get the feeling
that I would ultimately cheat just a bit and use a bluetooth keyboard
for any real  composition, and most likely only use the touch screen for
short texts, or in that circumstance, whatever text input scheme my
chosen device makes available.

But anyway, it is good to hear all of your advice and observations on
your use of these devices.

Thanks again,

Larry
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Re: future of window-eyes

[Brenda via Talk]

Maybe AI Squared was not technically forced into an agreement with VFO, 
but they may have seen the handwriting on the wall and realized it was 
their best option.  I still wonder if AI knew they were goin to join VFO 
prior to merging with GW.



Whatever the case, it is a done deal, and nothing is being announced 
about window-eyes.



brenda



On 4/7/2017 1:35 PM, Nick Sarames via Talk wrote:


You do realized that no one forced AI Squared into an agreement with
Freedom Scientific?

On 4/7/2017 11:24 AM, Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk
wrote:

Thanks Loy!  I've never ever, in the years I have been a customer of GW
Micro or AI Squared, heard the loud sound of a coin falling on the carpet.
By now, there shall have been so many teasers about upcoming add-ons to
Window-Eyes!  As a matter of fact, a number of beta-testing cycles would
have gone by.  I haven't seen any such thing in well over a year now unless
I can't count!

As I once said, that wich Freedom Scientific and her juggling fiends could
not win in the courts, it has succeeded in throwing under the bus and life
is being slowly but surely squashed out of whatever is left of Window-Eyes!
Of course, I'd love to be proven wrong and waiting for quarter 8 or 9 to do
so is absolutely unnecessary!  Heck, even this list is NO LONGER being
monitored!  And, if it is, the silence ought to have been broken so many
moons ago.

Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado


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Re: a question about using touch screens

[Brenda via Talk]

I have my typing mode set to standard keyboard.  When I touch a letter, 
if I want that letter I lift, if not I slide to the letter I want.  I 
use the backspace a lot and also dictation helps. There is a dictation 
button on the lower left near the spacebar.



If I do any writing of any length, I use my desktop with Window-eyes. 
(there, I related the topic to W-e)



Brenda


On 4/6/2017 2:13 PM, Larry Higgins via Talk wrote:
OK folks, I've been wanting to ask this for a long time. Not having 
ever attempted to use a tablet, iPhone or any other touch screen 
device, I realize just how stupid this question might sound, but bear 
with me, OK?


I just want to know how a blind user like myself avoids becoming a 
hunt and pecker when trying to  type on a touch screen. There 
obviously can't be anything like home keys, or a easily 
recognizable home base for the fingers, so short of having to buy 
and use a bluetooth keyboard, how do you  guys who make use of these 
screens do it?


Please be nice .

Larry
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Re: Another Main Memu podcast from CSUN discussing future of window-eyes

[Brenda via Talk]

Interesting podcast.  Jeff Bishop said he only said what he did because 
of the nda (nondisclosure agreement?).  His words were W-e will be here 
for now or words to that effect.



Interesting, he also said since VFO has merged that there is more unity 
(or something like that).



brenda


On 4/6/2017 11:29 AM, Rebecca Lineberger via Talk wrote:

Thanks for this podcast.  Not much was said about Window-Eyes, except that
it would continue.
I called VFO to ask if the current version of Window-Eyes would be ready for
the coming Windows update, and was told that it worked.  I also said that we
were feeling a bit neglected, smile, with all the talk about JAWS, and that
they needed to get information out to Window-Eyes users that would address
product concerns and rumors.  Window-Eyes is a great product and they need
to hear from those who appreciate it.  JMO.
Rebecca
-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+drlineberger=embarqmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2017 10:30 AM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Subject: Another Main Memu podcast from CSUN discussing future of
window-eyes

In this podcast, the future of window-eyes is discussed
http://mainmenu.acbradio.org/podcast/2017-03-31.mp3

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