Re: [talk-ph] Easy way to generate map with waypoint
Openlayers? http://openlayers.org/dev/examples/ The GeoRSS Marker example maybe? Jim Andre Marcelo-Tanner wrote, On Thursday, 24 June, 2010 08:53 AM: Is there an easy way to link to OSM.org with a waypoint on it? I know you can do the MLat + MLon in the query string for 1 marker, how about the arrow icon that OSM.org uses for Search Results? Or is there a website which lets you position a marker on the OSM map and then gives you a url to that map? Thanks, Andre ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph -- datalude: information security e: j...@datalude.com Philippines: +63 2 403 1311 / mob: +63 920 912 5830 Hong Kong: +852 6840 6693 w: http://www.datalude.com/ ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
[talk-ph] For Maning: OSM Garmin map size from 18Mb last Friday to 11Mb last night?
Hi Guys. This may be off-topic but maybe not. @Maning - Just wanted to check if the file size is right? I have Fridays OSMPH Garmin map and I haven't updated for a few days, but when I checked today the size seems off. Last friday the map was at 18Mb+, today it's at 11Mb? Bart ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
Re: [talk-ph] For Maning: OSM Garmin map size from 18Mb l ast Friday to 11Mb last night?
maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@... writes: compressed, it should be ~11 MB uncompressed, it should be ~18 MB can you double-check? Yep, that just confirms it. I'm a moron. I'll just chalk it up as a symptom of nicotine withdrawal... ;) ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
Re: [talk-ph] For Maning: OSM Garmin map size from 18Mb last Friday to 11Mb last night?
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 5:09 PM, Bart Bartolome linuxbast...@paglalakbay.com wrote: I'll just chalk it up as a symptom of nicotine withdrawal... ;) Good for you! -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
Re: [talk-ph] skillshare
Hi guys, The final venue for the Skillshare meetup is at Coffee Bean Tea Leaf at 1800 Eastwood Avenue. This branch is the one facing the Eastwood Mall park, and not the one at City Walk 2. Here's the map: http://osm.org/go/4zhSl61HJ--?m See you guys tomorrow! I'll probably be there much, much earlier so that we can reserve a table. On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 8:10 PM, maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@gmail.comwrote: On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 8:05 PM, Eugene Alvin Villar sea...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 5:01 AM, maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: additional topic: cavite mapping party discussion I think the Cavite party would need a separate meeting in itself. I've bought two cavite maps (EZ and Accumap) and I have no idea how we are going to choose which roads to cover and how to split the roads up into slices. I think it would take at least 2 hours to talk about this. Oh OK. I created a facebook event page. Hopefully interested newbies can catch the advert. http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=133607076659291 -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph -- http://vaes9.codedgraphic.com ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
[talk-ph] Waze: Real-time maps and traffic information based on the wisdom of the crowd
Just wanted to share this with the group. Another tool for mapping. Waze is a social mobile application providing free turn-by-turn navigation based on the live conditions of the road. 100% powered by users, the more you drive, the better it gets. Join the community of drivers in your area today! http://world.waze.com/guided_tour/___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
Re: [OSM-talk-be] Imde-Impde?
2010/6/25 filip wolters filip_wolt...@hotmail.com: Weet iemand de juiste spelling van een deelgemeente van Meise? Ik vind zowel Imde als Impde terug in het WWW en op de kaarten. Op http://www.google.nl/url?sa=tsource=webcd=9ved=0CD0QFjAIurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.meise.be%2Fattachments%2F1193672662371%2Finfo%2520204_LR.pdfei=0gEkTKPBG5OCOI7urP0Eusg=AFQjCNG1jnXpPnbxS4VV3PNhxQmhs7jeEQsig2=zrIRb41x8ak9WubF28Bn-w tref ik een infoblad van de gemeente Meise aan met daarin de volgende tekst: Dikwijls ziet men nog in publicaties en teksten Imde en Meuzegem op de oude wijze geschreven als Impde en Meusegem. Ook de gemeentelijke overheid is niet vrij te pleiten van zonden, want zelfs in officiële documenten of bewegwijzering ziet men de oude schrijfwijze nog opduiken en voor verwarring zorgen. Reeds in de jaren ‘80 werd door de toenmalige straatnamencommissie voorgesteld om de oude schrijfwijze aan te passen, een voorstel dat door de provincie werd goedgekeurd. Het is logisch dat de schrijfwijze van onze plaatsnamen werd aangepast, we schrijven immers ook niet meer Schaerbeeck of Raemsdonck. Dus voor alle duidelijkheid Imde en Meuzegem. Dus: de plaats heet Imde, en Impde is een verouderde spellingswijze. -- André Engels, andreeng...@gmail.com ___ Talk-be mailing list Talk-be@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:42 AM, Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.comwrote: No, they are not out of copyright. All the rights of USSR were transfered to Russian Federation. Neither USSR, nor Russian Federation ever transferred those maps to public domain or in any other way allowed free use of them. Most of that maps were stolen from exUSSR military bases in republics, which separated from USSR in 90-s. In Russia disclosing of such maps (not 100k, they were openly publiched, but 50k) is still a crime - treason. There was such a case a month ago. SO: old USSR military maps are not allowed to be used in OSM. Oh really? I read that they were sold. We had purchased them and were using them, also for osm. The consensus was that they are public domain. lets straighten this out. http://www.mail-archive.com/talk@openstreetmap.org/msg27951.html mike ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
Have you really officially purchased them from Russian government, its military divisions or perhaps from Roskartografiya? 2010/6/24 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:42 AM, Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.comwrote: No, they are not out of copyright. All the rights of USSR were transfered to Russian Federation. Neither USSR, nor Russian Federation ever transferred those maps to public domain or in any other way allowed free use of them. Most of that maps were stolen from exUSSR military bases in republics, which separated from USSR in 90-s. In Russia disclosing of such maps (not 100k, they were openly publiched, but 50k) is still a crime - treason. There was such a case a month ago. SO: old USSR military maps are not allowed to be used in OSM. Oh really? I read that they were sold. We had purchased them and were using them, also for osm. The consensus was that they are public domain. lets straighten this out. http://www.mail-archive.com/talk@openstreetmap.org/msg27951.html mike ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- Best regards, Eugene Iline ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ Here the same data is available from a usaid sponsored project : http://www.bunkertrails.org/maps.php On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 8:28 AM, Eugene Iline evge...@ily.in wrote: Have you really officially purchased them from Russian government, its military divisions or perhaps from Roskartografiya? 2010/6/24 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:42 AM, Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.comwrote: No, they are not out of copyright. All the rights of USSR were transfered to Russian Federation. Neither USSR, nor Russian Federation ever transferred those maps to public domain or in any other way allowed free use of them. Most of that maps were stolen from exUSSR military bases in republics, which separated from USSR in 90-s. In Russia disclosing of such maps (not 100k, they were openly publiched, but 50k) is still a crime - treason. There was such a case a month ago. SO: old USSR military maps are not allowed to be used in OSM. Oh really? I read that they were sold. We had purchased them and were using them, also for osm. The consensus was that they are public domain. lets straighten this out. http://www.mail-archive.com/talk@openstreetmap.org/msg27951.html mike ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- Best regards, Eugene Iline ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
I would like to say this, those maps are not very detailed, and really, have been used for very rough corrections, and adding in some streams or placing cities. mike On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 8:42 AM, jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com wrote: We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ Here the same data is available from a usaid sponsored project : http://www.bunkertrails.org/maps.php On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 8:28 AM, Eugene Iline evge...@ily.in wrote: Have you really officially purchased them from Russian government, its military divisions or perhaps from Roskartografiya? 2010/6/24 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:42 AM, Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.comwrote: No, they are not out of copyright. All the rights of USSR were transfered to Russian Federation. Neither USSR, nor Russian Federation ever transferred those maps to public domain or in any other way allowed free use of them. Most of that maps were stolen from exUSSR military bases in republics, which separated from USSR in 90-s. In Russia disclosing of such maps (not 100k, they were openly publiched, but 50k) is still a crime - treason. There was such a case a month ago. SO: old USSR military maps are not allowed to be used in OSM. Oh really? I read that they were sold. We had purchased them and were using them, also for osm. The consensus was that they are public domain. lets straighten this out. http://www.mail-archive.com/talk@openstreetmap.org/msg27951.html mike ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- Best regards, Eugene Iline ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
Did they show you any documents confirming that that do really have ANY rights to sell those maps? I\m sure they did not... K. 2010/6/24 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com: We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ Here the same data is available from a usaid sponsored project : http://www.bunkertrails.org/maps.php On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 8:28 AM, Eugene Iline evge...@ily.in wrote: Have you really officially purchased them from Russian government, its military divisions or perhaps from Roskartografiya? 2010/6/24 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:42 AM, Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.com wrote: No, they are not out of copyright. All the rights of USSR were transfered to Russian Federation. Neither USSR, nor Russian Federation ever transferred those maps to public domain or in any other way allowed free use of them. Most of that maps were stolen from exUSSR military bases in republics, which separated from USSR in 90-s. In Russia disclosing of such maps (not 100k, they were openly publiched, but 50k) is still a crime - treason. There was such a case a month ago. SO: old USSR military maps are not allowed to be used in OSM. Oh really? I read that they were sold. We had purchased them and were using them, also for osm. The consensus was that they are public domain. lets straighten this out. http://www.mail-archive.com/talk@openstreetmap.org/msg27951.html mike ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- Best regards, Eugene Iline ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
Purchasing stolen maps does not make them public domain... 2010/6/24 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com: On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:42 AM, Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.com wrote: No, they are not out of copyright. All the rights of USSR were transfered to Russian Federation. Neither USSR, nor Russian Federation ever transferred those maps to public domain or in any other way allowed free use of them. Most of that maps were stolen from exUSSR military bases in republics, which separated from USSR in 90-s. In Russia disclosing of such maps (not 100k, they were openly publiched, but 50k) is still a crime - treason. There was such a case a month ago. SO: old USSR military maps are not allowed to be used in OSM. Oh really? I read that they were sold. We had purchased them and were using them, also for osm. The consensus was that they are public domain. lets straighten this out. http://www.mail-archive.com/talk@openstreetmap.org/msg27951.html mike ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
It makes no difference how you used them!!! They are not good for osm! K. 2010/6/24 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com: I would like to say this, those maps are not very detailed, and really, have been used for very rough corrections, and adding in some streams or placing cities. mike On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 8:42 AM, jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com wrote: We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ Here the same data is available from a usaid sponsored project : http://www.bunkertrails.org/maps.php On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 8:28 AM, Eugene Iline evge...@ily.in wrote: Have you really officially purchased them from Russian government, its military divisions or perhaps from Roskartografiya? 2010/6/24 jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 7:42 AM, Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.com wrote: No, they are not out of copyright. All the rights of USSR were transfered to Russian Federation. Neither USSR, nor Russian Federation ever transferred those maps to public domain or in any other way allowed free use of them. Most of that maps were stolen from exUSSR military bases in republics, which separated from USSR in 90-s. In Russia disclosing of such maps (not 100k, they were openly publiched, but 50k) is still a crime - treason. There was such a case a month ago. SO: old USSR military maps are not allowed to be used in OSM. Oh really? I read that they were sold. We had purchased them and were using them, also for osm. The consensus was that they are public domain. lets straighten this out. http://www.mail-archive.com/talk@openstreetmap.org/msg27951.html mike ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- Best regards, Eugene Iline ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
He shouldn't draw then into the database, as this mixes OSM data and his own data. Why not just use a layer on top of the OSM data? One of the big advantages of OSM is that you the drawing tools. An option would be to create a blank database on top of the OSM data by using the OSM tools. Regards, Oliver -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Share-A-Like-non-Verifiability-because-they-are-not-publicly-accessable-tp5212191p5216612.html Sent from the Legal Talk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
Hi, Oliver (skobbler) wrote: He shouldn't draw then into the database, as this mixes OSM data and his own data. Why not just use a layer on top of the OSM data? One of the big advantages of OSM is that you the drawing tools. An option would be to create a blank database on top of the OSM data by using the OSM tools. I think that OSM as a whole - and this is not a legal issue - needs to improve interoperability. What we're currently seeing is import mania, poeple trying to stuff every possible bit of information into OSM because that's the easiest way for them to use it in conjunction with OSM data. There is too much geodata in the world for this to be sustainable - OSM must stick to things that mappers map. I hope that it will become gradually easier to mix'n'match OSM with other data at the rendering stage so that people will not feel compelled to upload any rubbish to OSM just becasue they want to render it on a map. That will then also make it easier for those who wish to create produced works from several databases, one of them being OSM, without tainting their private data in the process. Bye Frederik ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 9:11 AM, Oliver (skobbler) osm.oliver.ku...@gmx.de wrote: Hello everybody, I am still concerned that some business users cannot make use of OpenStreetMap data because of the Share-Alike-rule as they don't want or cannot share proprietary data. Umm, if you want it so that some people are exempt from sharing their data, then having a share-alike license is the wrong license. Ergo, if you want a share-alike license, people have to share their data. If you want people to not share some data, you want a non-share-alike license. I have the following interpretation in mind that could make the life of business users easier without undermining the generic Share-Alike rule: Don't call them business users, since that's just smearing lots of other businesses. Call them people trying to wriggle out of the license. Would it be possible that all objects and attributes of these objects that are non-publicly accessible to declare as non-substantial due to the lack of verifiability? No. That would be avoiding the whole point of the share-alike license. If they have geographic data that we don't have, and they mix it with OSM data, then the whole point is that we end up with access to their geographic data. It's called share-alike! Not take-ours-and-keep-yours-private! Really, if people (businesses, charities, individuals or whoever) have data they wish to keep private, they can still use OSM data internally. If they want to Publicly Convey this Database, any Derivative Database, or the Database as part of a Collective Database, then they can't avoid the licence. Cheers, Andy ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
[OSM-talk] OSM Postgres table sizes (was: Failed to download 9.5 GB planet)
Hello, thanks.
Solved. I think the problem was that I was downloading the file to a remote
disk (R: mapped to \\lanserver\data)
Another question: after exporting the whole planet (recently) to Postgres, what
is the size of the largest table created (which I presume will take up 80% of
the whole DB)? You can get the table size with:
SELECT pg_size_pretty(pg_total_relation_size('big_table'));
Regards,
Juan Lucas
--- On Tue, 6/22/10, Grant Slater openstreet...@firefishy.com wrote:
From: Grant Slater openstreet...@firefishy.com
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Failed to download 9.5 GB planet
To: Dirk-Lüder Kreie osm-l...@deelkar.net
Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org
Date: Tuesday, June 22, 2010, 11:29 AM
2010/6/22 Dirk-Lüder Kreie osm-l...@deelkar.net:
Am 21.06.2010 18:12, schrieb Juan Lucas Domínguez Rubio:
16:23:53 (1.02 MB/s) - Connection closed at byte 1621101924. Retrying.
--16:23:53--
http://ftp.heanet.ie/mirrors/openstreetmap.org/planet-100618.osm.bz2
(try: 2) = `planet_100618.osm.bz2'
Connecting to ftp.heanet.ie|193.1.193.64|:80... connected.
HTTP request sent, awaiting response... 500 ( Arithmetic result exceeded 32
bits. )
16:23:53 ERROR 500: ( Arithmetic result exceeded 32 bits. ).
Try a different mirror, or try it via ftp. (if that's possible)
Can anyone confirm if there is a problem with the heanet mirror?
Juan: you could try FTP or rsync too.
ftp://ftp.heanet.ie/mirrors/openstreetmap.org/planet-100618.osm.bz2
or
rsync://ftp.heanet.ie/mirrors/openstreetmap.org/planet-100618.osm.bz2
Regards
Grant
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Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
On 06/24/2010 09:34 AM, Andy Allan wrote: On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 9:11 AM, Oliver (skobbler) Really, if people (businesses, charities, individuals or whoever) have data they wish to keep private, they can still use OSM data internally. If they want to Publicly Convey this Database, any Derivative Database, or the Database as part of a Collective Database, then they can't avoid the licence. Yes. This is a point worth making to people who are concerned that they won't be able to deny other people their freedom. You can do (pretty much) what you like in private. I do wish people would *read* the licence. ;-) - Rob. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
Andy Allan gravityst...@... writes: No. That would be avoiding the whole point of the share-alike license. If they have geographic data that we don't have, and they mix it with OSM data, then the whole point is that we end up with access to their geographic data. It's called share-alike! Not take-ours-and-keep-yours-private! Really, if people (businesses, charities, individuals or whoever) have data they wish to keep private, they can still use OSM data internally. If they want to Publicly Convey this Database, any Derivative Database, or the Database as part of a Collective Database, then they can't avoid the licence. Hi, You are obviously reading http://www.opendatacommons.org/licenses/odbl/1.0/ , section 4.5 in a different way that I do. a. For the avoidance of doubt, You are not required to license Collective Databases under this License if You incorporate this Database or a Derivative Database in the collection, but this License still applies to this Database or a Derivative Database as a part of the Collective Database; For me it looks like business users can feel safe with their data if they do not make derivative databases, for example by enhancing their own data by taking tags from OSM database. Drawing their own data on top of OSM basemap is OK, isn't it? -Jukka Rahkonen- ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
Jukka Rahkonen wrote: Andy Allan writes: If they have geographic data that we don't have, and they mix it with OSM data, then the whole point is that we end up with access to their geographic data. [...] You are obviously reading section 4.5 in a different way that I do. [...] For me it looks like business users can feel safe with their data if they do not make derivative databases, for example by enhancing their own data by taking tags from OSM database. Drawing their own data on top of OSM basemap is OK, isn't it? Which fits in exactly with what Andy said. The key word is mix. cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Share-A-Like-non-Verifiability-because-they-are-not-publicly-accessable-tp5212191p5216880.html Sent from the Legal Talk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
On 06/24/2010 10:07 AM, Jukka Rahkonen wrote: For me it looks like business users can feel safe with their data if they do not make derivative databases, for example by enhancing their own data by taking tags from OSM database. If enhancing means incorporating the data into a single database, they are producing a derivative. Business users are not special in this. Drawing their own data on top of OSM basemap is OK, isn't it? This is considered to be different from combining the data in a single database. (IANAL, TINLA.) - Rob. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
Richard Fairhurst rich...@... writes: Jukka Rahkonen wrote: Andy Allan writes: If they have geographic data that we don't have, and they mix it with OSM data, then the whole point is that we end up with access to their geographic data. [...] You are obviously reading section 4.5 in a different way that I do. [...] For me it looks like business users can feel safe with their data if they do not make derivative databases, for example by enhancing their own data by taking tags from OSM database. Drawing their own data on top of OSM basemap is OK, isn't it? Which fits in exactly with what Andy said. The key word is mix. Ok, I missed the meaning of mix. Thus our advice for Oliver about the cable network is not to mix the private data with OSM data inside his own copy of OSM database. It will be OK to render OSM basemap tiles and use for example a separate WFS-T service [1] for showing and editing the cable network vectors. Users must just take care that they do not edit cable lines according to what they see on the OSM map, otherwise all of the cable network data will be considered to be derived from OSM data and thus fall under odbl. [1] Openlayers example combining tiles and WFS-T http://dev.openlayers.org/releases/OpenLayers-2.9.1/examples/ wfs-protocol-transactions.html -Jukka- cheers Richard ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
What we're currently seeing is import mania, poeple trying to stuff every possible bit of information into OSM because that's the easiest way for them to use it in conjunction with OSM data. There is too much geodata in the world for this to be sustainable - OSM must stick to things that mappers map. I fully agree. However, taking this thought then the current license is counterproductive in a way - unless you solve the problem with your mentioned interoperability. Regards, Oliver -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Share-A-Like-non-Verifiability-because-they-are-not-publicly-accessable-tp5212191p5217007.html Sent from the Legal Talk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ AFAIK this is not legal seller of maps, and poehali.org too. They both hosted outside Russia. So this maps can't be reliable identified as public domain maps. Here the same data is available from a usaid sponsored project : http://www.bunkertrails.org/maps.php ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
Jukka Rahkonen wrote: Users must just take care that they do not edit cable lines according to what they see on the OSM map, otherwise all of the cable network data will be considered to be derived from OSM data and thus fall under odbl. Very very broadly yes, but actually at that point (whichever licence you're using) you get into all the hoo-hah of defining substantial. Realigning one cable along one straight OSM road is unlikely to be a substantial derivative, and therefore won't trigger share-alike. Realigning a massive network along every single road is, and will. It's all fun and games until someone gets sued. :) cheers Richard -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Share-A-Like-non-Verifiability-because-they-are-not-publicly-accessable-tp5212191p5217021.html Sent from the Legal Talk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
I think you should take this to the legal list. As far as I know, the copyright laws of england count for osm, not those of russia. mike 2010/6/24 Alexandr Zeinalov shu...@sbin.ru We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ AFAIK this is not legal seller of maps, and poehali.org too. They both hosted outside Russia. So this maps can't be reliable identified as public domain maps. Here the same data is available from a usaid sponsored project : http://www.bunkertrails.org/maps.php -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
Well that got more of a reaction than floating a discussion on the tagging list, didn't it? The tagging list was set up so that the main list wouldn't be bothered with such stuff. There was no debate on the wiki, except a brief comment that presumably resulted in the tag-to-higher approach (from chriscf...), and another old comment that said the opposite. There's half a dozen unresolved items in trac, because the Mapnik rules don't work, so you end up with gaps in casings where there shouldn't be, and lower class roads rendered on top of higher class link roads. So clearly not such a big issue that the talk list should be bothered with it... So I look at the issue, consider the alternative rendering options (links interwoven, links at bottom, motorway_links treated differently), look at some commercial maps and see how they do it. And come to the conclusion that the wiki is telling me to do something wrong. So I change the wiki to give, in a succinct fashion, what I think is the best advice for going forward, and one that's only likely to improve matters. Clearly no-one's that much bothered, so it's a small service to study the matter and write it up. Onwards and upwards to better data and maps... Fortunately I have a thick hide. If there's a decent argument for tag-to-higher for roads between trunk-tertiary, other than we've always done it that way, let's hear it. Preferably on the tagging list. Richard Mann On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 3:35 PM, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 2:16 PM, James Livingston li...@sunsetutopia.com wrote: You could argue that it's wikifiddling in an attempt to influence how people map, or that it's documenting how a lot of people already map. It's all a matter of perspective. If it was documenting how a lot of people map then it would say there were two ways of doing it. This is clearly not the case, since it was just arbitrarily changed. It's not a matter of perspective. I, and from what I see in use where I live quite a few other too, have always used xxx_link tags to join a highway=xxx with a higher one, because we think what was documented on the wiki (xxx_link joins highway=xxx with a lower one) is silly. So you're saying there's two ways to do it. One has been established since forever, and is what almost everyone does (*_link is the higher of the two joined roads). The other way, which a small number of people use specifically because they don't like how the main method renders, is complex and completely daft (link is the lower of the two joined roads, except for motorway links, which are higher, and trunk links, which are only permitted between two roads of the same level). Right. I'd advise you started tagging using a more sensible, well established scheme. And to realise that if you want to change the scheme, that's an entirely different thing that can't be accomplished by changing the wiki and then claiming it's valid. Cheers, Andy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
So you want to say that you do not care for those osm-users, which are in Russia and which may have problems using osm with copyright data in it? Did I get you right? K. 24 июня 2010 г. 13:56 пользователь jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com написал: I think you should take this to the legal list. As far as I know, the copyright laws of england count for osm, not those of russia. mike 2010/6/24 Alexandr Zeinalov shu...@sbin.ru We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ AFAIK this is not legal seller of maps, and poehali.org too. They both hosted outside Russia. So this maps can't be reliable identified as public domain maps. Here the same data is available from a usaid sponsored project : http://www.bunkertrails.org/maps.php -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
I am not saying that. I am saying that this is a topic for lawyers. from what I learned about the discussion on wikipedia datapoints, it is uk law that governs osm data. mike 2010/6/24 Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.com So you want to say that you do not care for those osm-users, which are in Russia and which may have problems using osm with copyright data in it? Did I get you right? K. 24 июня 2010 г. 13:56 пользователь jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com написал: I think you should take this to the legal list. As far as I know, the copyright laws of england count for osm, not those of russia. mike 2010/6/24 Alexandr Zeinalov shu...@sbin.ru We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ AFAIK this is not legal seller of maps, and poehali.org too. They both hosted outside Russia. So this maps can't be reliable identified as public domain maps. Here the same data is available from a usaid sponsored project : http://www.bunkertrails.org/maps.php -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
Well then assuming this we can even say that anyone not being physically in UK can use any copyrighted source (Google sat.) for instance to contribute to OSM, right? 24 июня 2010 г. 14:22 пользователь jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com написал: I am not saying that. I am saying that this is a topic for lawyers. from what I learned about the discussion on wikipedia datapoints, it is uk law that governs osm data. mike 2010/6/24 Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.com So you want to say that you do not care for those osm-users, which are in Russia and which may have problems using osm with copyright data in it? Did I get you right? K. -- Best regards, Eugene Iline ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
On 24 June 2010 09:31, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: Hi, Oliver (skobbler) wrote: He shouldn't draw then into the database, as this mixes OSM data and his own data. Why not just use a layer on top of the OSM data? One of the big advantages of OSM is that you the drawing tools. An option would be to create a blank database on top of the OSM data by using the OSM tools. I think that OSM as a whole - and this is not a legal issue - needs to improve interoperability. What we're currently seeing is import mania, poeple trying to stuff every possible bit of information into OSM because that's the easiest way for them to use it in conjunction with OSM data. There is too much geodata in the world for this to be sustainable - OSM must stick to things that mappers map. I hope that it will become gradually easier to mix'n'match OSM with other data at the rendering stage so that people will not feel compelled to upload any rubbish to OSM just becasue they want to render it on a map. That will then also make it easier for those who wish to create produced works from several databases, one of them being OSM, without tainting their private data in the process. I agree with this statement quite strongly. Once the rendering step is sorted, it should be then easy to mix the data without actually mixing private data and OSM data. Emilie Laffray ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
But you should know that there are some copyright international agreements between many countries. Russian laws can't be used in England, and russian military secrets can't be protected by English laws. But it doesn't concern with copyright laws. Roscartographia is a copyright holder for soviet topo maps, so its rights may be protected by English laws. I think you should take this to the legal list. As far as I know, the copyright laws of england count for osm, not those of russia. mike 2010/6/24 Alexandr Zeinalov shu...@sbin.ru We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ AFAIK this is not legal seller of maps, and poehali.org too. They both hosted outside Russia. So this maps can't be reliable identified as public domain maps. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Share-A-Like (non-) Verifiability because they are not publicly accessable
Frederik Ramm frede...@... writes: I think that OSM as a whole - and this is not a legal issue - needs to improve interoperability. What we're currently seeing is import mania, poeple trying to stuff every possible bit of information into OSM because that's the easiest way for them to use it in conjunction with OSM data. There is too much geodata in the world for this to be sustainable - OSM must stick to things that mappers map. I agree. An EU-driven example about interoperability can be seen at http://www.paikkatietoikkuna.fi/web/en/map-window It is a pilot implemantation about what Inspire directive calls view services. Some rought OSM data from Geofabrik shapefiles are also included, on layers Transport networks - OpenStreetMap and Buildings - OpenStreetMap buildings. OSM data has a scale limit, zoom in enough and data appears but there are not many buildings outside the Helsinki district. GetFeatureInfo - the i tool works on these layers. Interoperability does not need to mean that everything that exists needs must be imported into OSM. ___ legal-talk mailing list legal-t...@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/legal-talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 10:55 AM, Richard Mann richard.mann.westoxf...@googlemail.com wrote: Well that got more of a reaction than floating a discussion on the tagging list, didn't it? The tagging list was set up so that the main list wouldn't be bothered with such stuff. The tagging list was set up to save us all from the discussions surrounding tagging proposals and other minutiae of tagging discussions. Actions such as attempting to redefine the meaning of some of the most widely used tags in the entire project is, too put it mildly, outside the scope of that mailing list. There's half a dozen unresolved items in trac, because the Mapnik rules don't work, so you end up with gaps in casings where there shouldn't be, and lower class roads rendered on top of higher class link roads. It's significantly important to separate any complaints that you have with rendering from discussions on tagging. I have no interest in whether there are rendering artefacts such as gaps in casings in the current mapnik stylesheets. We have been using the given definitions of the tags since long before mapnik even existed! So clearly not such a big issue that the talk list should be bothered with it... There's a million random discussions in a dozen venues in the project. Simply because this particular discussion went almost unnoticed can't possibly be construed as a green-light to reverse the meaning of these tags. So I look at the issue, consider the alternative rendering options (links interwoven, links at bottom, motorway_links treated differently), look at some commercial maps and see how they do it. And come to the conclusion that the wiki is telling me to do something wrong. So I change the wiki to give, in a succinct fashion, what I think is the best advice for going forward, and one that's only likely to improve matters. Clearly no-one's that much bothered, so it's a small service to study the matter and write it up. Onwards and upwards to better data and maps... You didn't really give the best advice, you just decided that you knew better than everyone else, and made a change that affects 15,000 other mappers, hundreds of renderings and subprojects. A little more due process would be in order. If there's a decent argument for tag-to-higher for roads between trunk-tertiary, other than we've always done it that way, let's hear it. Preferably on the tagging list. The obligation on those who wish to change the meaning of such widely used tags is *entirely* on those who wish to make the change. You can't take an absence of discussion (given that many people have many more pressing issues to deal with) as consent for your change, nor demand that others need to justify *not* making such drastic changes. Especially since the root of the discussion seems to have no basis in the tags, and seems entirely to be around rendering artefacts that you dislike. Cheers, Andy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
I believe this junction is tagged as per the wiki (which Andy kindly reverted to it's previous state). http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.73915lon=-1.10389zoom=15layers=B000FTF Here's the same junction as per the cycle map layer: http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=51.73915lon=-1.10389zoom=15layers=00B0FTF Clearly the tagging is just perfect and the renderers are perfect and the wiki is perfect, and it's all been wonderful for ever and nothing needs to be improved [/rant] Richard Mann ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 12:32 PM, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: the root of the discussion seems to have no basis in the tags, and seems entirely to be around rendering artefacts that you dislike. What purpose do the _link tags serve other than rendering? If there's a serious reason for tag-to-higher then we can add an additional tag so people can record the status of what it links to (and then we can render it any way we like). But I can't think of a sensible reason for recording/using the higher status, except for motorways, so it just seems like it's been copied from motorway_link without thinking it through, is producing unintended results, and is therefore an error that needs to be corrected. If people have done that thinking through, and there's a genuine reason for tag-to-higher for non-motorway roads, then I'd love to hear about it. All the reaction so far seems to be a complaint about how I did it, rather than the substance of the matter. Andy's made one of the few moderately serious points: it's confusing to treat them differently to motorway links. Not exactly a clincher, if it's wrong for other reasons. Richard Mann ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
When people in one country use servers in another country, the laws affecting those users may not be the same as those affecting the servers themselves. For example, some works are public-domain in Australia, but still in copyright in the USA. So, it is legal for those works to be on the Gutenberg Australia web site, without it being legal for users in the USA to download those works. -- John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com Reserve your right to think, for even to think wrongly is better than not to think at all. -- Hypatia of Alexandria -Original Message- From: jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com Sender: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2010 12:22:56 To: Kirill Bestoujevbestou...@gmail.com Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
This is only possible if those countries are nt members of international copyright treaties. Russia (and USSR) and UK - are members of those treaties. So same laws apply. And by the way I am 100% sure that in UK stolen and later sold copyright materials are not treated us public domain. K. 2010/6/24 John F. Eldredge j...@jfeldredge.com: When people in one country use servers in another country, the laws affecting those users may not be the same as those affecting the servers themselves. For example, some works are public-domain in Australia, but still in copyright in the USA. So, it is legal for those works to be on the Gutenberg Australia web site, without it being legal for users in the USA to download those works. -- John F. Eldredge -- j...@jfeldredge.com Reserve your right to think, for even to think wrongly is better than not to think at all. -- Hypatia of Alexandria -Original Message- From: jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com Sender: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2010 12:22:56 To: Kirill Bestoujevbestou...@gmail.com Cc: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 2:46 PM, Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.comwrote: And by the way I am 100% sure that in UK stolen and later sold copyright materials are not treated us public domain. Can I see some documentation on this theft? Why dont you start with some dcma takedown notices for the people selling them, and see what happens? mike ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 1:24 PM, Richard Mann richard.mann.westoxf...@googlemail.com wrote: On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 12:32 PM, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: the root of the discussion seems to have no basis in the tags, and seems entirely to be around rendering artefacts that you dislike. What purpose do the _link tags serve other than rendering? They can be used by routers to give more accurate descriptions - e.g. since we don't (yet) indicate junction priorities, it can be helpful if you are on a *_link and going onto a * to announce it as join the main carriageway. If it was e.g. just highway=trunk for both, the router wouldn't know you were on a slip road. Same for when you are approaching an exit, it's a nice hint to the router that you aren't following the main carriageway. If there's a serious reason for tag-to-higher then we can add an additional tag so people can record the status of what it links to (and then we can render it any way we like). But I can't think of a sensible reason for recording/using the higher status, except for motorways, so it just seems like it's been copied from motorway_link without thinking it through, is producing unintended results, and is therefore an error that needs to be corrected. There might be some edge cases, such as the one you previously linked to. But let's take this one near Cambridge: http://osm.org/go/0...@c9as- I think the slip roads on/off the trunk road dual carriageway are quite rightly tagged as trunk_link. It is very little different from the case of a normal motorway junction. If you had to choose whether those slip roads were part of the trunk road or of the secondary road crossing over it, I would think most people would go for trunk. And I suspect the facts on the ground would lean that way, when it comes to resurfacing, signage, speed limits, lane width, type of tarmac and so on, that the slip roads are more likely considered part of the trunk road. As I say though, it's a well used and well established scheme, and we should be very wary of changing it just because of some edge cases where the rendering doesn't work correctly or where a particular junction seems bizarrely tagged. If people have done that thinking through, and there's a genuine reason for tag-to-higher for non-motorway roads, then I'd love to hear about it. All the reaction so far seems to be a complaint about how I did it, rather than the substance of the matter. I think few people have expressed whether or not they support your views or oppose them, but certainly the main point of this discussion is that should we want to change it you can't just change the wiki and declare it done! Andy's made one of the few moderately serious points: it's confusing to treat them differently to motorway links. Not exactly a clincher, if it's wrong for other reasons. Cheers, Andy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
On 24 June 2010 23:00, jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com wrote: Can I see some documentation on this theft? Why dont you start with some dcma takedown notices for the people selling them, and see what happens? You do realise DCMA is only for sites hosted in the US right? You seem to have bias here maybe because you, or someone you knew, has spent money obtaining them, in any case copyright is usually the default, not public domain and unless you know otherwise you should always assume the worst. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 2:26 PM, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 1:24 PM, Richard Mann richard.mann.westoxf...@googlemail.com wrote: What purpose do the _link tags serve other than rendering? They can be used by routers to give more accurate descriptions... That's a reason for calling them links, not a reason for tag-to-higher http://osm.org/go/0...@c9as- Could equally well be tertiary_link. OS would have them as tertiary_link (my Landranger still has it as a flat junction!) As I say though, it's a well used and well established scheme, and we should be very wary of changing it just because of some edge cases where the rendering doesn't work correctly or where a particular junction seems bizarrely tagged. I don't think this is robust to non-geek rendering (which I think is going to kick off fairly soon). People are going to start rendering their towns, and tag-for-higher (and the normal renderer's response of putting links under everything) just produces too much of a mess, too often. People will find ways round it (like ignoring the wiki), but it's better to solve the issue, and issue rendering advice that'll actually work most of the time. I'm more than happy for the wiki to say that tag-for-higher was the norm for a long time and you need to be aware that it will remain in the data for a long time. But tag-for-lower is better. Richard ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Postgres table sizes (was: Failed to download 9.5 GB planet)
* Juan Lucas Domínguez Rubio juan_lucas...@yahoo.com [2010-06-24 01:34 -0700]: Another question: after exporting the whole planet (recently) to Postgres, what is the size of the largest table created (which I presume will take up 80% of the whole DB)? I can't speak for the whole planet.osm file (so this might be useless), but I have (roughly) an extract of the United States. The largest table, planet_osm_ways, is 50 GB. The next-largest table, planet_osm_nodes, is 21 GB. After that is planet_osm_line at 8 GB. -- ...computer contrarian of the first order... / http://aperiodic.net/phil/ PGP: 026A27F2 print: D200 5BDB FC4B B24A 9248 9F7A 4322 2D22 026A 27F2 --- -- Last night I met upon the stair A little man who wasn't there. He wasn't there again today. I think he's from the NSA! --- -- ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
Andy Allan wrote: They can be used by routers to give more accurate descriptions - e.g. since we don't (yet) indicate junction priorities, it can be helpful if you are on a *_link and going onto a * to announce it as join the main carriageway. If it was e.g. just highway=trunk for both, the router wouldn't know you were on a slip road. Same for when you are approaching an exit, it's a nice hint to the router that you aren't following the main carriageway. And if you don't have the *_link, then there needs to be a replacement tag to provide that information! Although it should be possible to identify links between different road types, some will still be 'motorway' while others are slip roads and so join or leave. It is more difficult to decided what is going on where the slip roads are between one motorway and another, or motorway and a major trunk road. THESE needs to be specifically identified, and we had this discussion some years ago when the *_link tags were added! -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk// Firebird - http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Thu, 24 Jun 2010 15:09:11 +0100, Richard Mann wrote: [..] But tag-for-lower is better. And I still haven't read why you think this is better, apart from rendering issues. As Andy said, the burden of demonstrating the goodness of a change is up to who wants to make that change. -- . ''`. Debian developer | http://wiki.debian.org/DavidPaleino : :' : Linuxer #334216 --|-- http://www.hanskalabs.net/ `. `'` GPG: 1392B174 | http://deb.li/dapal `- 2BAB C625 4E66 E7B8 450A C3E1 E6AA 9017 1392 B174 signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Postgres table sizes (was: Failed to download 9.5 GB planet)
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 4:34 AM, Juan Lucas Domínguez Rubio juan_lucas...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello, thanks. Solved. I think the problem was that I was downloading the file to a remote disk (R: mapped to \\lanserver\data) Another question: after exporting the whole planet (recently) to Postgres, what is the size of the largest table created (which I presume will take up 80% of the whole DB)? based on my planet and minutely mapnik: 8 GB polygon 21 GB line 2 GB point 43 GB nodes 3 GB roads 50 GB ways 4 GB rels overall disk use ~ 130 GB and growing about 2.5 GB/week at the moment. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 3:09 PM, Richard Mann richard.mann.westoxf...@googlemail.com wrote: On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 2:26 PM, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 1:24 PM, Richard Mann richard.mann.westoxf...@googlemail.com wrote: What purpose do the _link tags serve other than rendering? They can be used by routers to give more accurate descriptions... That's a reason for calling them links, not a reason for tag-to-higher Which, if you look closely, was actually the question you asked me. http://osm.org/go/0...@c9as- Could equally well be tertiary_link. Oh. I see. Good discussion, I'm totally convinced by your reasoning. As I say though, it's a well used and well established scheme, and we should be very wary of changing it just because of some edge cases where the rendering doesn't work correctly or where a particular junction seems bizarrely tagged. I don't think this is robust to non-geek rendering (which I think is going to kick off fairly soon). People are going to start rendering their towns, and tag-for-higher (and the normal renderer's response of putting links under everything) just produces too much of a mess, too often. People will find ways round it (like ignoring the wiki), but it's better to solve the issue, and issue rendering advice that'll actually work most of the time. Solving the issue would be to fix the renderers for the edge cases you are so interested it. I'm more than happy for the wiki to say that tag-for-higher was the norm for a long time and you need to be aware that it will remain in the data for a long time. But tag-for-lower is better. Tag-for-higher *is still* the norm, and certainly isn't going to change just because there's a few artefacts here and there in some of the renderers. Nor is it going to change just because you want it to. You need to explain, without referring to renderering *at any point in the discussion* why your solution is both conceptually better than what we have, and why your solution is worth all the hassle and confusion that such a change would cause. So far, I see nothing approaching the required level. Cheers, Andy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On 25 June 2010 00:22, David Paleino da...@debian.org wrote: And I still haven't read why you think this is better, apart from rendering issues. As Andy said, the burden of demonstrating the goodness of a change is up to who wants to make that change. I've been following this thread and I've seen the back and forth, but the argument for/against routing seems pointless because *_link roads aren't usually very long so I can't see how it would effect anything. Same goes for rendering, regardless who wins this debate the other side will just end up tagging how they think things should be rendered. I can see a point for motorway_links, these are a specific sort of road, but the same thing does hold true for other roads, unless they were simply meant to imply oneway=yes, lanes=1 kind of thing, but I doubt they're currently rendered in that way. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Postgres table sizes (was: Failed to download 9.5 GB planet)
On 25 June 2010 00:28, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: overall disk use ~ 130 GB and growing about 2.5 GB/week at the moment. Is there a way to reduce this overhead without re-importing? ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: You need to explain, without referring to renderering *at any point in the discussion* why your solution is both conceptually better than what we have, and why your solution is worth all the hassle and confusion that such a change would cause. So far, I see nothing approaching the required level. There is no reason. Tag-to-lower is only of benefit to the renderer. Tag-to-higher is only for the benefit of the renderer. We'll have to go with a supplementary tag then. Richard ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] cycle map not updating?
Has the update frequency changed for OpenCycleMap? Some bike lanes added in late May and early June still haven't appeared yet. Ed Hillsman Senior Research Associate Center for Urban Transportation Research University of South Florida 4202 Fowler Ave., CUT100 Tampa, FL 33620-5375 813-974-2977 (tel) 813-974-5168 (fax) hills...@cutr.usf.edu http://www.cutr.usf.edublocked::http://www.cutr.usf.edu/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Licence of Soviet military topographic maps
there is no mention of PD for these maps at mapstore.com. they are not even free of copyright from poehali.net free download doesn't mean PD Can I use the maps in my own project? You have the right to use maps for the purpose of familiarization for personal use. To use the maps or other materials in your project, you have to obtain our permission. Please use our email address i...@mapstor.com for communication. But please note: • All map images contain “poehali.net” imprint, which is our trademark • In order to avoid confusion, there should be clear distinction between your product/service and ours • We would greatly appreciate you citing us as a source of the images • We are always open to cross-marketing and/or link exchange. On 24 Jun 2010, at 3:22 , jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com wrote: I am not saying that. I am saying that this is a topic for lawyers. from what I learned about the discussion on wikipedia datapoints, it is uk law that governs osm data. mike 2010/6/24 Kirill Bestoujev bestou...@gmail.com So you want to say that you do not care for those osm-users, which are in Russia and which may have problems using osm with copyright data in it? Did I get you right? K. 24 июня 2010 г. 13:56 пользователь jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com jamesmikedup...@googlemail.com написал: I think you should take this to the legal list. As far as I know, the copyright laws of england count for osm, not those of russia. mike 2010/6/24 Alexandr Zeinalov shu...@sbin.ru We purchased them from this site : http://mapstor.com/ AFAIK this is not legal seller of maps, and poehali.org too. They both hosted outside Russia. So this maps can't be reliable identified as public domain maps. Here the same data is available from a usaid sponsored project : http://www.bunkertrails.org/maps.php -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Good book on GIS concepts
i think this can be a good start point http://linfiniti.com/dla/ videopdf to introduce the GIS with qgis ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
2010/6/24 Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com: views or oppose them, but certainly the main point of this discussion is that should we want to change it you can't just change the wiki and declare it done! I completely agree to this and think it also applies to many other wiki edits. Sadly, as these edits create new confusion and problems especially for new users who are not yet familiar with a) the tag system and b) the fact that wiki pages sometimes get changed against the common sense of mapping. cheers, Martin ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating?
Updates that I've made in the past week are now showing on zooms = 12. It's not quite there for zooms 12, but I suspect that that's simply because the tiles haven't managed to upload to Andy's web host yet from the machine where he carries out the main rendering. I do remember seeing Andy tweeting recently that there'd been an issue with updates for a while (during an upgrade IIRC???), so perhaps that may explain it. I usually notice that changes I've made prior to the Wednesday are reflected at all zoom levels by the following Friday. From: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Hillsman, Edward Sent: 24 June 2010 16:19 To: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating? Has the update frequency changed for OpenCycleMap? Some bike lanes added in late May and early June still haven't appeared yet. Ed Hillsman Senior Research Associate Center for Urban Transportation Research University of South Florida 4202 Fowler Ave., CUT100 Tampa, FL 33620-5375 813-974-2977 (tel) 813-974-5168 (fax) hills...@cutr.usf.edu blocked::http://www.cutr.usf.edu/ http://www.cutr.usf.edu ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Good book on GIS concepts
El 23/06/2010 16:33, sko...@free.fr escribió: Would anyone recommend a good book on GIS/Geodesy/etc that could be used to understand the underlying concepts behind most GIS applications ? Try: http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Library http://wiki.osgeo.org/wiki/Libros_de_SIG Best, -- Iván Sánchez Ortega i...@sanchezortega.es ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating?
Hi Gregory, Your a little out of date of the way that the cycle map is run. It uses the live mapnk rendering, with no upload required. However it is still a weekly update, and can take a week to fully update assuming that the disk doesn't fill up first. Shaun On 24 Jun 2010, at 16:40, Gregory Williams wrote: Updates that I’ve made in the past week are now showing on zooms = 12. It’s not quite there for zooms 12, but I suspect that that’s simply because the tiles haven’t managed to upload to Andy’s web host yet from the machine where he carries out the main rendering. I do remember seeing Andy tweeting recently that there’d been an issue with updates for a while (during an upgrade IIRC???), so perhaps that may explain it. I usually notice that changes I’ve made prior to the Wednesday are reflected at all zoom levels by the following Friday. From: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Hillsman, Edward Sent: 24 June 2010 16:19 To: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating? Has the update frequency changed for OpenCycleMap? Some bike lanes added in late May and early June still haven’t appeared yet. Ed Hillsman Senior Research Associate Center for Urban Transportation Research University of South Florida 4202 Fowler Ave., CUT100 Tampa, FL 33620-5375 813-974-2977 (tel) 813-974-5168 (fax) hills...@cutr.usf.edu http://www.cutr.usf.edu ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating?
Yeah I emailed Andy when I first started contributing to OSM because changes weren't showing up and some zoom levels in my area returned nothing but error tiles. He said the server was totally overloaded but that he was working on an upgrade. Since then updates have been hit and miss and the zoom levels that return error tiles have changed from time to time so I suspect he has been trying to do imports but some of them fail along the way. Two days ago he tweeted that the new server was nearly ready so hopefully things will improve soon! Toby ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating?
Ooops. Thanks for correcting my Shaun. Unfortunately I've not had quite so much time to keep up-to-date on OSM happenings of late. From: Shaun McDonald [mailto:sh...@shaunmcdonald.me.uk] Sent: 24 June 2010 16:55 To: Gregory Williams Cc: 'Hillsman, Edward'; talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating? Hi Gregory, Your a little out of date of the way that the cycle map is run. It uses the live mapnk rendering, with no upload required. However it is still a weekly update, and can take a week to fully update assuming that the disk doesn't fill up first. Shaun On 24 Jun 2010, at 16:40, Gregory Williams wrote: Updates that I've made in the past week are now showing on zooms = 12. It's not quite there for zooms 12, but I suspect that that's simply because the tiles haven't managed to upload to Andy's web host yet from the machine where he carries out the main rendering. I do remember seeing Andy tweeting recently that there'd been an issue with updates for a while (during an upgrade IIRC???), so perhaps that may explain it. I usually notice that changes I've made prior to the Wednesday are reflected at all zoom levels by the following Friday. From: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Hillsman, Edward Sent: 24 June 2010 16:19 To: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating? Has the update frequency changed for OpenCycleMap? Some bike lanes added in late May and early June still haven't appeared yet. Ed Hillsman Senior Research Associate Center for Urban Transportation Research University of South Florida 4202 Fowler Ave., CUT100 Tampa, FL 33620-5375 813-974-2977 (tel) 813-974-5168 (fax) hills...@cutr.usf.edu blocked::http://www.cutr.usf.edu/ http://www.cutr.usf.edu ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating?
On 24/06/2010 16:57, Toby Murray wrote: Two days ago he tweeted that the new server was nearly ready so hopefully things will improve soon! And don't forget, if you think OpenCycleMap.org is great, you could always call in at the shop on the way out: http://shop.opencyclemap.org/ ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On 24 Jun 2010, at 5:24 , Richard Mann wrote: On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 12:32 PM, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: the root of the discussion seems to have no basis in the tags, and seems entirely to be around rendering artefacts that you dislike. What purpose do the _link tags serve other than rendering? then the rendering is completely broken and doesn't deserve a special tag. all the commercial maps render links much smaller and on lowest layer. If there's a serious reason for tag-to-higher then we can add an additional tag so people can record the status of what it links to (and then we can render it any way we like). But I can't think of a sensible reason for recording/using the higher status, except for motorways, so it just seems like it's been copied from motorway_link without thinking it through, is producing unintended results, and is therefore an error that needs to be corrected. from a rendering point of view this shouldn't matter at all. as said above rendering is ugly for *_link If people have done that thinking through, and there's a genuine reason for tag-to-higher for non-motorway roads, then I'd love to hear about it. All the reaction so far seems to be a complaint about how I did it, rather than the substance of the matter. Andy's made one of the few moderately serious points: it's confusing to treat them differently to motorway links. Not exactly a clincher, if it's wrong for other reasons. consistency is more important to avoid confusion than an absolute statement. as others pointed out ramps to/from motorways and most likely on trunks are in the same jurisdiction and maintained by same agency as the motorway/trunk. So there is a clear evidence that *_link belongs to the higher road it connects to. Richard Mann ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Postgres table sizes (was: Failed to download 9.5 GB planet)
From: Richard Weait rich...@weait.com Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Postgres table sizes (was: Failed to download 9.5 GB planet) To: talk@openstreetmap.org Date: Thursday, June 24, 2010, 4:28 PM On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 4:34 AM, Juan Lucas Domínguez Rubio juan_lucas...@yahoo.com wrote: Hello, thanks. Solved. I think the problem was that I was downloading the file to a remote disk (R: mapped to \\lanserver\data) Another question: after exporting the whole planet (recently) to Postgres, what is the size of the largest table created (which I presume will take up 80% of the whole DB)? based on my planet and minutely mapnik: 8 GB polygon 21 GB line 2 GB point 43 GB nodes 3 GB roads 50 GB ways 4 GB rels overall disk use ~ 130 GB and growing about 2.5 GB/week at the moment. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk Hello, thanks. That's much more than what I expected. With a small example, I obtained a 1:3 ratio between the .osm format and the table size, so I estimated ~50 GB for the whole DB. Regards, Juan Lucas ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating?
Yeah. Also, as Toby says, it's pretty much totally overloaded, and has been for the last few months. What's happened recently was that the updates broke for a few weeks, and were restarted last Wednesday. The disk cache then filled up completely on Friday, so there was only a small window for the tiles to be re-rendered. Space was freed up on Monday, and then rendering was stopped again on Wednesday for the next scheduled update. I estimate it would take about 10-12 days to update all the tiles, and there simply hasn't been very many days in the last week where the system has been updating - and because it wasn't updating for three weeks before that, some tiles are seriously out of date. They should sort themselves out, over the next week or so. As for the new server that's being mentioned, that's being set up at the moment. New host, new hardware, new software (mainly newer versions of mapnik and osm2pgsql). Unfortunately it's not as fast as I'd hoped, and I'm seriously concerned about whether it'll be able to take the load! Running osm2pgsql in slim mode is soaking up much of the hardware improvements. We'll see how it goes, but I'm confident the whole thing is moving in the right direction. It starts coming down to questions of time and money, and I only have a limited supply of both :-) Cheers, Andy On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 4:54 PM, Shaun McDonald sh...@shaunmcdonald.me.uk wrote: Hi Gregory, Your a little out of date of the way that the cycle map is run. It uses the live mapnk rendering, with no upload required. However it is still a weekly update, and can take a week to fully update assuming that the disk doesn't fill up first. Shaun On 24 Jun 2010, at 16:40, Gregory Williams wrote: Updates that I’ve made in the past week are now showing on zooms = 12. It’s not quite there for zooms 12, but I suspect that that’s simply because the tiles haven’t managed to upload to Andy’s web host yet from the machine where he carries out the main rendering. I do remember seeing Andy tweeting recently that there’d been an issue with updates for a while (during an upgrade IIRC???), so perhaps that may explain it. I usually notice that changes I’ve made prior to the Wednesday are reflected at all zoom levels by the following Friday. From: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org] on Behalf Of Hillsman, Edward Sent: 24 June 2010 16:19 To: t...@openstreetmap.org Subject: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating? Has the update frequency changed for OpenCycleMap? Some bike lanes added in late May and early June still haven’t appeared yet. Ed Hillsman Senior Research Associate Center for Urban Transportation Research University of South Florida 4202 Fowler Ave., CUT100 Tampa, FL 33620-5375 813-974-2977 (tel) 813-974-5168 (fax) hills...@cutr.usf.edu http://www.cutr.usf.edu ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
Isn't this tagging redundant? If a link road leads from a primary to a secondary, or whatever, this can be seen by looking at the tags for the two roads it connects. In principle there is no need to duplicate the information. In practice a renderer such as Mapnik may not allow you to write such complex rules, and doing so would complicate its code. As a blue-sky idea, we could have 'virtual tags' which are generated by the server automatically when you download a section of map. As well as taking care of the different kinds of link road, these could also provide 'is_in', 'leading_to' and 'dead_end' for streets, and uphill/downhill for slopes (based on the layer of the endpoints). Some simple query language would define such virtual tags and new ones could be added if an application finds them useful. -- Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
Ed Avis wrote: Isn't this tagging redundant? If a link road leads from a primary to a secondary, or whatever, this can be seen by looking at the tags for the two roads it connects. In principle there is no need to duplicate the information. But how do you know that a way IS a slip from one road to another, and not just another road? Tag it motorway when it goes to another motorway where is the division between motorway and slip road. It needs something to identify the situation on the ground! -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk// Firebird - http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On 25 June 2010 02:59, Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com wrote: download a section of map. As well as taking care of the different kinds of link road, these could also provide 'is_in', 'leading_to' and 'dead_end' for dead_end can't be guessed at, it could be bad mapping, is_in is redundant, you can use admin boundaries to derive this. streets, and uphill/downhill for slopes (based on the layer of the endpoints). Layer has nothing to do with elevation, it only indicates which road goes over the other road there may not be any slope involved. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 1:14 PM, Lester Caine les...@lsces.co.uk wrote: Ed Avis wrote: Isn't this tagging redundant? If a link road leads from a primary to a secondary, or whatever, this can be seen by looking at the tags for the two roads it connects. In principle there is no need to duplicate the information. But how do you know that a way IS a slip from one road to another, and not just another road? You could always have highway=link. But IMO, it's not a big enough deal to bother changing. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
Anthony wrote: On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 1:14 PM, Lester Caine les...@lsces.co.uk mailto:les...@lsces.co.uk wrote: Ed Avis wrote: Isn't this tagging redundant? If a link road leads from a primary to a secondary, or whatever, this can be seen by looking at the tags for the two roads it connects. In principle there is no need to duplicate the information. But how do you know that a way IS a slip from one road to another, and not just another road? You could always have highway=link. But some links ARE motorway rules and some ARE trunk road so just saying link does not work. But IMO, it's not a big enough deal to bother changing. There is a lot of good detail already mapped that does not need changing. Just using as it was intended. -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk// Firebird - http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating?
An alternative is to use Maperitive and render on the local PC. Its just a matter of using the right rules for rendering but you do need an .OSM file from the web unless you have a local copy. Cheerio John On 24 June 2010 12:53, Andy Allan gravityst...@gmail.com wrote: Yeah. Also, as Toby says, it's pretty much totally overloaded, and has been for the last few months. What's happened recently was that the updates broke for a few weeks, and were restarted last Wednesday. The disk cache then filled up completely on Friday, so there was only a small window for the tiles to be re-rendered. Space was freed up on Monday, and then rendering was stopped again on Wednesday for the next scheduled update. I estimate it would take about 10-12 days to update all the tiles, and there simply hasn't been very many days in the last week where the system has been updating - and because it wasn't updating for three weeks before that, some tiles are seriously out of date. They should sort themselves out, over the next week or so. As for the new server that's being mentioned, that's being set up at the moment. New host, new hardware, new software (mainly newer versions of mapnik and osm2pgsql). Unfortunately it's not as fast as I'd hoped, and I'm seriously concerned about whether it'll be able to take the load! Running osm2pgsql in slim mode is soaking up much of the hardware improvements. We'll see how it goes, but I'm confident the whole thing is moving in the right direction. It starts coming down to questions of time and money, and I only have a limited supply of both :-) Cheers, Andy On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 4:54 PM, Shaun McDonald sh...@shaunmcdonald.me.uk wrote: Hi Gregory, Your a little out of date of the way that the cycle map is run. It uses the live mapnk rendering, with no upload required. However it is still a weekly update, and can take a week to fully update assuming that the disk doesn't fill up first. Shaun On 24 Jun 2010, at 16:40, Gregory Williams wrote: Updates that I’ve made in the past week are now showing on zooms = 12. It’s not quite there for zooms 12, but I suspect that that’s simply because the tiles haven’t managed to upload to Andy’s web host yet from the machine where he carries out the main rendering. I do remember seeing Andy tweeting recently that there’d been an issue with updates for a while (during an upgrade IIRC???), so perhaps that may explain it. I usually notice that changes I’ve made prior to the Wednesday are reflected at all zoom levels by the following Friday. From: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto: talk-boun...@openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Hillsman, Edward Sent: 24 June 2010 16:19 To: talk@openstreetmap.org Subject: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating? Has the update frequency changed for OpenCycleMap? Some bike lanes added in late May and early June still haven’t appeared yet. Ed Hillsman Senior Research Associate Center for Urban Transportation Research University of South Florida 4202 Fowler Ave., CUT100 Tampa, FL 33620-5375 813-974-2977 (tel) 813-974-5168 (fax) hills...@cutr.usf.edu http://www.cutr.usf.edu ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Postgres table sizes (was: Failed to download 9.5 GB planet)
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 10:39 AM, John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com wrote: On 25 June 2010 00:28, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: overall disk use ~ 130 GB and growing about 2.5 GB/week at the moment. Is there a way to reduce this overhead without re-importing? I'm not sure I understand your question. You can import a bounding box or extract and have smaller tables. You can import without --slim, if you have the hardware for it, and lose some large tables. But then you lose the ability to update unless you do a re-import. Other alternatives? ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Postgres table sizes (was: Failed to download 9.5 GB planet)
On 25 June 2010 04:37, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: I'm not sure I understand your question. Over time, the overhead increases, not just the amount of data. You can import a bounding box or extract and have smaller tables. You can import without --slim, if you have the hardware for it, and I didn't mean without the slim option. lose some large tables. But then you lose the ability to update unless you do a re-import. That's my question, how to eliminate overhead in the database without re-importing. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 2:21 PM, Lester Caine les...@lsces.co.uk wrote: Anthony wrote: You could always have highway=link. But some links ARE motorway rules and some ARE trunk road so just saying link does not work. I guess, but now you're using a different definition of *_link. Not tag-for-higher nor tag-for-lower, but tag-based-on-the-rules. That's excellent if we can come up with some good definitions for what those rules are. But IMO, it's not a big enough deal to bother changing. There is a lot of good detail already mapped that does not need changing. Just using as it was intended. Right now the definition of motorway_link is a link road between a motorway and another road. There's no mention of a requirement that the road be subject to motorway rules. And whether or not the link road is connected to a motorway is something that is inherent in the nodes/ways themselves. So there's no detail which wouldn't be given by highway=link. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] cycle map not updating?
On Fri, 25 Jun 2010, Andy Allan wrote: It starts coming down to questions of time and money, and I only have a limited supply of both :-) Usually one has either time OR money, and never both at once ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 4:21 AM, Lester Caine les...@lsces.co.uk wrote: You could always have highway=link. But some links ARE motorway rules and some ARE trunk road so just saying link does not work. highway=* link=yes ? ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Changed highway=*_link meaning?!
2010/6/24 Roy Wallace waldo000...@gmail.com: highway=* link=yes actually I like this, but it's not the first time it is proposed here, and I think you can hardly change tags used as often and for so long time as this. It would probably end up in a similar mess than path and footway. cheers, Martin ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] straatnamen per gemeente?
2010/6/23 Roeland Douma u...@rullzer.com: On Wednesday 23 June 2010 21:11:44 Christ van Willegen wrote: Maar, ik loop net wat wegen te editten in JOSM, krijg ik een melding: Communication with the OSM server 'http://openstreetmap.org/api/0.6/' timed out, Please retry later. Toch sund... Dat zijn de servers in de UK. Zal wel druk zijn. Neem aan dat als je het zo nog eens probeert het wel moet lukken. Ik heb al een (heel) aantal keren geprobeerd om te uploaden. Heb ook al een paar keer gekregen 'Change set already closed' (dus JOSM sluiten en opnieuw editten), maar nog steeds die time-out. Overigens binnen een paar seconden. Heeft er verder nog iemand zo'n probleem? Groeten! Christ van Willegen -- 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] straatnamen per gemeente?
On Thursday 24 June 2010 04:02:16 Andre Engels wrote: 2010/6/23 Roeland Douma u...@rullzer.com: Er was even geen ruimte op de partitie meer. Het scriptje draait nogmaals en over ongeveer 15 minuten zou alles erop moeten staan. Bedankt; ik ben gestart met het vergelijken van de lijst van 's-Hertogenbosch met de lijst bij de kaart op de website van de gemeente, om te zien wat er nog ontbreekt en waar ik daarnaar moet zoeken (plus een indicatie wat er vermoedelijk aan de hand is). Daarbij vond ik dat het Anne Frankplein niet op je lijst stond, terwijl hij wel in openstreetmap staat. Ik vermoed dat de reden is dat die straat area=yes heeft. Kan dat inderdaad de reden zijn? Zou kunnen dat er in die lijst geen pleinen staan. Ik zou area=yes eruit kunnen filteren. Maar weet niet of dat in alle gevallen gewenst is. Er zijn namelijk ook vaak situaties te bedenken waar een plein ook huizen eraan vast heeft welke dus als straatnaam de pleinnaam hebben. Voor nu kan je het gewoon negeren denk ik. Groet, --Roeland ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] straatnamen per gemeente?
On Thursday 24 June 2010 10:22:57 Christ van Willegen wrote: Ik heb al een (heel) aantal keren geprobeerd om te uploaden. Heb ook al een paar keer gekregen 'Change set already closed' (dus JOSM sluiten en opnieuw editten), maar nog steeds die time-out. Overigens binnen een paar seconden. Heeft er verder nog iemand zo'n probleem? Upload net een changeset met 6500 items en geen probleem. Heb je misschien een firewall aan staan die niet helemaal goed is geconfigureerd? Groet, --Roeland ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] straatnamen per gemeente?
2010/6/24 Roeland Douma u...@rullzer.com: Zou kunnen dat er in die lijst geen pleinen staan. Ik zou area=yes eruit kunnen filteren. Maar weet niet of dat in alle gevallen gewenst is. Er zijn namelijk ook vaak situaties te bedenken waar een plein ook huizen eraan vast heeft welke dus als straatnaam de pleinnaam hebben. Mijn verzoek was juist om ze er niet uit te filteren... Maar goed, een echt groot probleem is het ook niet: de meeste gemeenten zullen niet meer dan een paar area=yes-pleinen hebben (zeker als we ons beperken tot de gevallen waar er niet ook een 'gewone' weg met dezelfde naam is), en die ontdek je snel genoeg als je per geval even kijkt wat er aan de hand is. -- André Engels, andreeng...@gmail.com ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] straatnamen per gemeente?
2010/6/24 Roeland Douma u...@rullzer.com: On Thursday 24 June 2010 10:22:57 Christ van Willegen wrote: Ik heb al een (heel) aantal keren geprobeerd om te uploaden. Heb ook al een paar keer gekregen 'Change set already closed' (dus JOSM sluiten en opnieuw editten), maar nog steeds die time-out. Overigens binnen een paar seconden. Heeft er verder nog iemand zo'n probleem? Upload net een changeset met 6500 items en geen probleem. Heb je misschien een firewall aan staan die niet helemaal goed is geconfigureerd? Hij praat toch via HTTP? Ik dacht toch echt dat naam en wachtwoord correct zijn, heb al eerder geJOSMed... Hier is mijn revisie 3329. Christ van Willegen -- 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [Talk-br] Fwd: Mapas das cidades devastadas em PDF
Maneiríssimo. Dá para exportar para a imagem e traçar sobre no JOSM, né? O problema é ter alguma referência... tem alguma trilha GPX dessa região? []s Em 23 de junho de 2010 18:13, Vitor George vitor.geo...@gmail.comescreveu: -- Forwarded message -- From: Thiago Avila tjtav...@gmail.com Date: 2010/6/23 Subject: Mapas das cidades devastadas em PDF To: Vitor George vitor.geo...@gmail.com, guilhermelame...@gmail.com Cc: qsilv...@uol.com.br, Esdras Andrade esdras.andr...@ima.al.gov.br, candido...@gmail.com, glaub...@yahoo.com.br Vitor e demais colegas, Com o apoio do Prof. Cândido e do Sr. Sérgio Alves (IBGE/AL), segue abaixo alguns mapas da zona urbana de algumas cidades devastadas. Estaremos obtendo o restante provavelmente na segunda-feira. Acredito que dará pra fazer muita coisa com este material. Abs, Thiago http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Branquinha.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Murici.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Quebrangulo.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Rio Largo 1-1.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Rio Largo 2-1.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Rio Largo 2-2.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Rio Largo 2-3.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Rio Largo 2-4.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Rio Largo- 1-2.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Santana do Mundau.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Uniao 1 - Folha 1.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Uniao 2 - Folha 1.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Uniao 2 - Folha 2.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Uniao 2 - Folha 3.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Uniao 2 - Folha 4.pdf http://alagoasnomapa.planejamento.al.gov.br/mapas/Uniao 3-1.pdf Em 22 de junho de 2010 17:03, Vitor George vitor.geo...@gmail.comescreveu: Olá Milton, Prof. Silvana e todos envolvidos, As imagens do CBERS 2B HRC, mesmo relativamente antigas, serão muito úteis para nós porque podemos começar a desenhar os traçados das vias, e também identificar pontos importantes, como pontes, escolas, hospitais, etc. De acordo com informações de campo, podemos ir atualizando o que não condiz com a realidade, como por exemplo uma ponte colapsada. O que necessitamos, na verdade, é uma autorização do INPE, mesmo que por e-mail, permitindo que nós utilizemos as imagens para extrair informações de mapeamento. Estou sendo um pouco rígido quanto a isto porque todos os dados que estão no OpenStreetMap estão sob a licença Creative Commons CC-BY-SA e se o INPE tiver alguma restrição quanto a esta licença não podemos utilizar as imagens. Esta licença nada mais é que uma que permite o uso dos dados para qualquer fim, desde que seja atribuida fonte e que os dados sejam redistribuídos livremente. Um colaborador do OSM francês, chamado Jean-Guilhem Cailton, já montou um servidor de imagens para nós, só faltando a autorização para começarmos a mapear. Obrigado, Vitor 2010/6/22 Milton Kampel mil...@dsr.inpe.br Prezado Thiago, Lamentamos muito pelos últimos eventos extremos ocorridos em Alagoas. O Centro de Previsão do Tempo e Estudos Climáticos do INPE (CPTEC) tem divulgado previsoes, avisos meteorologicos e noticias para a regiao Nordeste neste ultimo periodo, com cuidado redobrado. Infelizmente, o satelite CBERS-2B parou de funcionar em maio deste ano, interrompendo assim, a coleta de dados pela camera HRC. Entretanto, existem imagens em arquivo, que podem ser consultadas, solicitadas e utilizadas sem custos. Abaixo, copio tutorial do Atendimento ao Usuario para facilitar o acesso as imagens online. Avisem se pudermos ser uteis em algo mais. Desejamos a vcs boa sorte e bom trabalho, torcendo para que o sol volte a brilhar muito em breve. Abracos, Milton Kampel INPE-DSR Em atenção ao e-mail encaminhado recentemente, gostaríamos de informar que a distribuição das imagens dos satélites CBERS2, CBERS-2B, LANDSAT 1,2,3,5 e 7 e IRS-P6, é feita através da DGI - Divisão de Geração de Imagens - INPE, de uma forma totalmente gratuita. Estas cenas poderão ser encontradas através de nosso catálogo de imagens, disponível em nosso site www.dgi.inpe.br. Informamos abaixo um Passo a Passo de como adquirir estas cenas através de nosso sistema, sendo um processo bem simples, onde o senhor poderá baixar as imagens em poucos minutos. Entrar na Página da DGI: -entrar em www.dgi.inpe.br -clicar em Catalogo de Imagens: CBERS-2, CBERS-2B, LANDSAT 1,2,3,5,7 e IRS-P6. CATÁLOGO - clicar em cadastro Cadastro Entrar Sair Carrinho Histórico Ajuda CADASTRO - preencher todos os campos -clicar em registrar Caso o cadastro seja aceito o sistema dará a seguinte mensagem Cadastro realizado com
Re: [Talk-br] Fwd: Imagens HRC
Hi, The CBERS images on my wms server have now been georeferenced, using precious GPS tracks when available, or Landsat otherwise (as suggested by INPE). If you have used an un-georeferenced image yesterday for mapping without adjusting with another source (as for Branquinha streets, or a portion of river nearby, apparently), you should shift / adjust your data to the georeferenced image. If you notice a positioning problem, please let me know. Best wishes, Jean-Guilhem Le 23/06/2010 16:17, Jean-Guilhem Cailton a écrit : Yes, this is what I have been doing for the Maceio image. I added 5 control points, based mainly on available GPS tracks, and warped it. It is now included in the URL in the wiki : http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:2010_Alagoas_Flooding#Servidores Jean-Guilhem Le 23/06/2010 15:46, Vitor George a écrit : This is the aswers of Julio Dalge, chief of DPI . Jean-Guilhem, the projection and datum are OK, but the images are not georreferenced. We'll need to do this manually. -- Forwarded message -- From: *Julio Dalge* ju...@dpi.inpe.br mailto:ju...@dpi.inpe.br Date: 2010/6/23 Subject: Imagens HRC To: vitor.geo...@gmail.com mailto:vitor.geo...@gmail.com Cc: Lúbia Vinhas lu...@dpi.inpe.br mailto:lu...@dpi.inpe.br Caro Vitor, As imagens do catálogo do INPE estão processadas até o que chamamos nível 2. Estão corrigidas radiometricamente e têm correção geométrica de sistema. Nesta correção não usados pontos de controle, são usados apenas parâmetros do sistema de imageamento de cada câmera a bordo do satélite, bem como dados de posição, velocidade e atitude do satélite. O resultado típico é esse deslocamento que você mencionou, que chamamos de erro de posicionamento. Em resumo, a imagem tem uma boa geometria interna (projeção e datum não são o problema), mas está fora do local correto. É necessário que os usuários façam o registro (georreferenciamento) de cada imagem, através de pontos de controle, para colocá-la no local correto. -- Julio. ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br
[Talk-br] Fwd: Press Release: SOS Alagoas – Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afet adas pelas Enchentes
Pessoal, Sabado vai rolar o esforço de mapeamento remoto de Alagoas. Em São Paulo vamos estar na Casa de Cultura Digital. Levem seus computadores! Vou fazer um webstreaming também. Temos que baixar e alinhar as imagens das áreas mais afetadas, para que as pessoas possam ajudar. Vejam o release abaixo. Vitor -- Forwarded message -- From: Diego Casaes diegocas...@gmail.com Date: 2010/6/24 Subject: Press Release: SOS Alagoas – Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afetadas pelas Enchentes To: sos-alag...@googlegroups.com Para divulgação imedita. Press Release: http://blog.esfera.mobi/press-release-sos-alagoas/ ou http://migre.me/RTIy e em anexo. Press Release: SOS Alagoashttp://blog.esfera.mobi/press-release-sos-alagoas/ *Press Release: SOS Alagoas – **Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afetadas pelas Enchentes* *[image: logo2] http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/ * O SOS Alagoas quer agregar e disponibilizar, por meio de um site colaborativo e de mapas livres, informações sobre os municípios afetados pelas enchentes de Alagoas, facilitando o trabalho da Defesa Civil, de voluntários e de todos os que querem contribuir para apoiar a situação nesses estados. *São Paulo, 24 de junho de 2010* - Diante da situação de calamidade de diversas cidades dos estados de Alagoas e Pernambuco, fortemente atingidas por enchentes nas últimas semanas, um grupo de pessoas, empresas e organizações não governamentais está organizando o SOS Alagoashttp://sosalagoas.al.org.br/, um website que pretende mapear as áreas atingidas pelas enchentes, localizando as construções afetadas, e facilitando essa informação com a Defesa Civil e voluntários envolvidos no esforço humanitário. No SOS Alagoas, publicamos uma página com dados sobre os locais que recebem doações http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/locais-de-doacao e um blog com atualizações sobre a situação no estado atualizado com dados fornecidos por voluntários do projeto na região afetada. Além disso, faremos uso de mapas livres http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/node/8 para ajudar o trabalho da defesa civil e dos voluntários trabalhando no local. Com o mapeamento colaborativo da região, tal como foi feito após o terremoto no Haiti http://haiti.openstreetmap.nl/, podemos marcar os lugares onde, por exemplo, estradas foram destruídas, pontes desabaram, casas foram levadas pelas enchentes, além de outros incidentes, e servir de suporte para as autoridades, defesa civil e o público em geral. Um Esforço de Mapeamento http://moourl.com/sosmapa remoto está sendo coordenado em São Paulo, esse sábado, na Casa de Cultura Digital. Pessoas de todas as partes do pais podem participar pela rede (veja mais detalhes sobre esse evento abaixo). *Como participar* O desempenho de ações que podem ser tomadas por qualquer um, em qualquer lugar, é um dos focos do SOS Alagoas. Nesse sentido, por meio da internet, cada indivíduo pode contribuir com os municípios atingidos pela enchente em Alagoas. É possível ajudar das seguintes formas: Locais de Doação http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/locais-de-doacao: Publicar informações sobre os locais de coleta de doações e suas demandas específicas (ou usar essas informações para enviar os donativos certos para quem precisa mais); Mapas Livres http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/node/8: Ajudar a mapear os pontos críticos das cidades atingidas: edifícios e aparelhos públicos comprometidos, acessos bloqueados, barragens e pontes em situação de risco, alojamentos formais e informais de desabrigados, locais de desaparecimento e encontro de pessoas. Cadastrar-se como voluntário (ou encontrar locais no Estado que precisam da sua colaboração – disponível em breve). Fazer doações via cartão de crédito (as doações serão feitas à uma ONG local e encaminhadas aos organismos de apoio aos municípios – aguardem mais informações, disponível em breve). *Mapas Livres em Alagoas e Pernambuco* Com o OpenStreetMap http://openstreetmap.org/, vamos mapear os municípios mais atingidos pelas enchentes no estado de Alagoas (e também no estado de Pernambuco). Essa ação permitirá que pessoas que estejam distantes dos estados afetados contribuam com o esforço humanitário, doando um pouco de seu tempo para organizar geograficamente as informações mais importantes para a Defesa Civil e outros voluntários envolvidos. Pretendemos mapear: - Acessos livres ou bloqueados aos municípios atingidos - Prédios e aparelhos públicos atingidos - Alojamentos (governamentais ou informais) de desabrigados - Pontos de desaparecimento ou de encontro de pessoas - Locais de recebimento de doações e de distribuição de itens essenciais O OpenStreetMap foi utilizado após o terremoto no Haitihttp://haiti.openstreetmap.nl/, para marcar os pontos atingidos e reconstruir o mapa das cidades afetadas. Ainda não existem mapas detalhados dos municípios atingido, e para isso, o pessoal do @mapaslivres http://twitter.com/mapaslivres
Re: [Talk-br] Fwd: Press Release: SOS Alagoas – Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afet adas pelas Enchentes
Beleza, Vou tentar chegar antes do meio-dia pra ajudar 2010/6/24 Vitor George vitor.geo...@gmail.com Pessoal, Sabado vai rolar o esforço de mapeamento remoto de Alagoas. Em São Paulo vamos estar na Casa de Cultura Digital. Levem seus computadores! Vou fazer um webstreaming também. Temos que baixar e alinhar as imagens das áreas mais afetadas, para que as pessoas possam ajudar. Vejam o release abaixo. Vitor -- Forwarded message -- From: Diego Casaes diegocas...@gmail.com Date: 2010/6/24 Subject: Press Release: SOS Alagoas – Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afetadas pelas Enchentes To: sos-alag...@googlegroups.com Para divulgação imedita. Press Release: http://blog.esfera.mobi/press-release-sos-alagoas/ ou http://migre.me/RTIye em anexo. Press Release: SOS Alagoashttp://blog.esfera.mobi/press-release-sos-alagoas/ *Press Release: SOS Alagoas – **Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afetadas pelas Enchentes* *[image: logo2] http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/ * O SOS Alagoas quer agregar e disponibilizar, por meio de um site colaborativo e de mapas livres, informações sobre os municípios afetados pelas enchentes de Alagoas, facilitando o trabalho da Defesa Civil, de voluntários e de todos os que querem contribuir para apoiar a situação nesses estados. *São Paulo, 24 de junho de 2010* - Diante da situação de calamidade de diversas cidades dos estados de Alagoas e Pernambuco, fortemente atingidas por enchentes nas últimas semanas, um grupo de pessoas, empresas e organizações não governamentais está organizando o SOS Alagoashttp://sosalagoas.al.org.br/, um website que pretende mapear as áreas atingidas pelas enchentes, localizando as construções afetadas, e facilitando essa informação com a Defesa Civil e voluntários envolvidos no esforço humanitário. No SOS Alagoas, publicamos uma página com dados sobre os locais que recebem doações http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/locais-de-doacao e um blog com atualizações sobre a situação no estado atualizado com dados fornecidos por voluntários do projeto na região afetada. Além disso, faremos uso de mapas livres http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/node/8 para ajudar o trabalho da defesa civil e dos voluntários trabalhando no local. Com o mapeamento colaborativo da região, tal como foi feito após o terremoto no Haiti http://haiti.openstreetmap.nl/, podemos marcar os lugares onde, por exemplo, estradas foram destruídas, pontes desabaram, casas foram levadas pelas enchentes, além de outros incidentes, e servir de suporte para as autoridades, defesa civil e o público em geral. Um Esforço de Mapeamento http://moourl.com/sosmapa remoto está sendo coordenado em São Paulo, esse sábado, na Casa de Cultura Digital. Pessoas de todas as partes do pais podem participar pela rede (veja mais detalhes sobre esse evento abaixo). *Como participar* O desempenho de ações que podem ser tomadas por qualquer um, em qualquer lugar, é um dos focos do SOS Alagoas. Nesse sentido, por meio da internet, cada indivíduo pode contribuir com os municípios atingidos pela enchente em Alagoas. É possível ajudar das seguintes formas: Locais de Doação http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/locais-de-doacao: Publicar informações sobre os locais de coleta de doações e suas demandas específicas (ou usar essas informações para enviar os donativos certos para quem precisa mais); Mapas Livres http://www.sosalagoas.al.org.br/node/8: Ajudar a mapear os pontos críticos das cidades atingidas: edifícios e aparelhos públicos comprometidos, acessos bloqueados, barragens e pontes em situação de risco, alojamentos formais e informais de desabrigados, locais de desaparecimento e encontro de pessoas. Cadastrar-se como voluntário (ou encontrar locais no Estado que precisam da sua colaboração – disponível em breve). Fazer doações via cartão de crédito (as doações serão feitas à uma ONG local e encaminhadas aos organismos de apoio aos municípios – aguardem mais informações, disponível em breve). *Mapas Livres em Alagoas e Pernambuco* Com o OpenStreetMap http://openstreetmap.org/, vamos mapear os municípios mais atingidos pelas enchentes no estado de Alagoas (e também no estado de Pernambuco). Essa ação permitirá que pessoas que estejam distantes dos estados afetados contribuam com o esforço humanitário, doando um pouco de seu tempo para organizar geograficamente as informações mais importantes para a Defesa Civil e outros voluntários envolvidos. Pretendemos mapear: - Acessos livres ou bloqueados aos municípios atingidos - Prédios e aparelhos públicos atingidos - Alojamentos (governamentais ou informais) de desabrigados - Pontos de desaparecimento ou de encontro de pessoas - Locais de recebimento de doações e de distribuição de itens essenciais O OpenStreetMap foi utilizado após o terremoto no Haitihttp://haiti.openstreetmap.nl/, para marcar os pontos atingidos e reconstruir o mapa das cidades afetadas. Ainda não
Re: [Talk-br] Fwd: Press Release: SOS Alagoas – Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afet adas pelas Enchentes
Caros Noticia divulgada no Geoinformação Online e também via twitter . Boa sorte e parabéns pela inciativa. Luiz Amadeu Coutinho Geógrafo http://geoinformacaonline.com - Original Message - From: Vitor George To: OSM talk-br Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 10:15 PM Subject: [Talk-br] Fwd: Press Release: SOS Alagoas – Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afetadas pelas Enchentes Pessoal, Sabado vai rolar o esforço de mapeamento remoto de Alagoas. Em São Paulo vamos estar na Casa de Cultura Digital. Levem seus computadores! Vou fazer um webstreaming também. Temos que baixar e alinhar as imagens das áreas mais afetadas, para que as pessoas possam ajudar. Vejam o release abaixo. Vitor -- Forwarded message -- From: Diego Casaes diegocas...@gmail.com Date: 2010/6/24 Subject: Press Release: SOS Alagoas – Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afetadas pelas Enchentes To: sos-alag...@googlegroups.com Para divulgação imedita. Press Release: http://blog.esfera.mobi/press-release-sos-alagoas/ ou http://migre.me/RTIy e em anexo. Press Release: SOS Alagoas Press Release: SOS Alagoas – Site Mapeará Áreas e Construções Afetadas pelas Enchentes O SOS Alagoas quer agregar e disponibilizar, por meio de um site colaborativo e de mapas livres, informações sobre os municípios afetados pelas enchentes de Alagoas, facilitando o trabalho da Defesa Civil, de voluntários e de todos os que querem contribuir para apoiar a situação nesses estados. São Paulo, 24 de junho de 2010 - Diante da situação de calamidade de diversas cidades dos estados de Alagoas e Pernambuco, fortemente atingidas por enchentes nas últimas semanas, um grupo de pessoas, empresas e organizações não governamentais está organizando o SOS Alagoas, um website que pretende mapear as áreas atingidas pelas enchentes, localizando as construções afetadas, e facilitando essa informação com a Defesa Civil e voluntários envolvidos no esforço humanitário. No SOS Alagoas, publicamos uma página com dados sobre os locais que recebem doações e um blog com atualizações sobre a situação no estado atualizado com dados fornecidos por voluntários do projeto na região afetada. Além disso, faremos uso de mapas livres para ajudar o trabalho da defesa civil e dos voluntários trabalhando no local. Com o mapeamento colaborativo da região, tal como foi feito após o terremoto no Haiti, podemos marcar os lugares onde, por exemplo, estradas foram destruídas, pontes desabaram, casas foram levadas pelas enchentes, além de outros incidentes, e servir de suporte para as autoridades, defesa civil e o público em geral. Um Esforço de Mapeamento remoto está sendo coordenado em São Paulo, esse sábado, na Casa de Cultura Digital. Pessoas de todas as partes do pais podem participar pela rede (veja mais detalhes sobre esse evento abaixo). Como participar O desempenho de ações que podem ser tomadas por qualquer um, em qualquer lugar, é um dos focos do SOS Alagoas. Nesse sentido, por meio da internet, cada indivíduo pode contribuir com os municípios atingidos pela enchente em Alagoas. É possível ajudar das seguintes formas: a.. Locais de Doação: Publicar informações sobre os locais de coleta de doações e suas demandas específicas (ou usar essas informações para enviar os donativos certos para quem precisa mais); a.. Mapas Livres: Ajudar a mapear os pontos críticos das cidades atingidas: edifícios e aparelhos públicos comprometidos, acessos bloqueados, barragens e pontes em situação de risco, alojamentos formais e informais de desabrigados, locais de desaparecimento e encontro de pessoas. a.. Cadastrar-se como voluntário (ou encontrar locais no Estado que precisam da sua colaboração – disponível em breve). a.. Fazer doações via cartão de crédito (as doações serão feitas à uma ONG local e encaminhadas aos organismos de apoio aos municípios – aguardem mais informações, disponível em breve). Mapas Livres em Alagoas e Pernambuco Com o OpenStreetMap, vamos mapear os municípios mais atingidos pelas enchentes no estado de Alagoas (e também no estado de Pernambuco). Essa ação permitirá que pessoas que estejam distantes dos estados afetados contribuam com o esforço humanitário, doando um pouco de seu tempo para organizar geograficamente as informações mais importantes para a Defesa Civil e outros voluntários envolvidos. Pretendemos mapear: - Acessos livres ou bloqueados aos municípios atingidos - Prédios e aparelhos públicos atingidos - Alojamentos (governamentais ou informais) de desabrigados - Pontos de desaparecimento ou de encontro de pessoas - Locais de recebimento de doações e de distribuição de itens essenciais O OpenStreetMap foi utilizado após o terremoto no Haiti, para marcar os pontos atingidos e reconstruir o mapa das cidades afetadas. Ainda não existem mapas detalhados dos
[Talk-de] OpenStreetMap bei Veranstaltung in Lü beck
Hi ! ich wollte die Norddeutschen nur kurz darüber informieren das die örtl. Kirche OSM für eine größere Veranstaltung nutzt - als Referenz. In der örtlichen Presse war schon eine Karte zusehen und im Web gibt es [1]. Vielleicht ein Anfang der gemacht ist. gruß Jan :-) [1] http://www.nachtderkirchenluebeck.de/index.php?id=5 ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Die Track Seuche
Moin moin, Florian Lohoff schrieb: On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 03:55:07PM +0200, Georg Feddern wrote: Bei mir ist Track alles was ich zeit meines Lebens als Fahrweg (Feldweg,Waldweg, Wirtschaftsweg) kenne. Warum wollt ihr mit aller Macht eine Zugangsbeschränkung in eine Straßen/Wege-Klasse hineinquetschen ... [snip] Das ist hier Grossflaechig zu tracks grade1 umgedeutet worden nur weil das Stadtkind da einen Maehdrescher drauf gesehen hat. Nur weil da MAL ein Maehdrescher faehrt ist das nicht ueberwiegend Landwirtschaftliche nutzung. OK, wenn es um die unclassified / track grade1 Problematik geht, kann ich das durchaus verstehen. Ich muss zudem gestehen, dass ich Deine Aussage Bei mir ist Track alles was NUR fuer Land und Forstwirtschaft ist mißverständlich als NUR was L+F ist, ist Track verstanden habe, sorry. Und das bringt mich als S-H halt auf die Palme, weil ich mich - quasi am anderen Ende der track-Skala - weigere, die hiesigen knick-gesäumten grade3-Tracks (Betonspurplattenwege) nur wegen eines gelben Wegweisers unbedingt als unclassified für den (möglicherweise) Schwerlast-Durchgangsverkehr freigeben zu müssen. Gruß Georg ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Die Track Seuche
Am 24.06.2010 03:17, schrieb Stephan Wolff: Die Bezeichnung Track Seuche ist unpassend. Na gut. In vielen Gegenden findet man lokale Vorlieben. Manchmal ist jedes Dorf mindestens mit einer Tertiary-Road versehen (in den Niederlanden sogar fast jeder Weg außerorts). war mir auch aufgefallen, dass in NL unclassified als tertiary gemappt ist. Ein Schild Fußweg mit Zusatz Zufahrt Haus Nr. 5 frei, gebe ich auch als footway mit vehicle=destination ein. Den Router möchte ich sehen, der das hinbekommt, aber wir mappen ja nicht für die Router. ;-) Der Weg, der etwas nordöstlich die L546 überquert und auf dem Acker endet, sieht mir übrigens eher wie ein Feldweg aus. Ja, da müsste man mal nachschauen, ob der Weg dort wirklich zuende ist. Chris ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Die Track Seuche
Moin moin, Stephan Wolff schrieb: Moin, moin! Am 23.06.2010 10:03, schrieb Chris66: Meiner Meinung nach sollte jede legal per Auto ansteuerbare Adresse über das Highway-Netz exclusive Tracks erreichbar sein. Der Trend geht aber eher in die Richtung, alles was halbwegs nach Landwirtschaft riecht als Track zu mappen. In SH sind die meisten Feldwege nicht gesperrt, so dass man nur nach Beschilderung, Breite, Ausbauzustand und Bebauung unterscheiden kann. [ff] Die Bezeichnung Track Seuche ist unpassend. +1, Du sprichst mir aus der Holsteiner-Seele. Liegt wohl in der hiesigen regionalen Ausprägung, das viele vermeintliche grade1-Tracks tatsächlich unclassified mit marginaler Verkehrslast sind. Während andererseits viele historische Siedlungsverbindungen aufgrund verlagerter Verkehrsströme und Umgehungsstraßen auf dem tatsächlichen Stand eines grade3-Tracks (Betonspurplattenweg) geblieben sind, wegen Wegerecht und Widmung aber ihre gelben Wegweiser behalten haben, tatsächlich aber nur noch als Wirtschaftswege benutzt werden. Gruß Georg ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Die Track Seuche
Hi, dann stelle ich mir aber prinzipiell die Frage, welchen Weg der Notarzt nehmen wuerde? Bei einem Track kann auch mal eine Schranke oder ein Forstfahrzeug im Weg sein. Auf dem Hauptzufahrtsweg zu einem bewohnbaren Grunstueck muessen Feuerwehr und Notarzt immer durchkommen koennen. Und da kommt fuer mich unter anderem die Begruendung fuer service her. Der Hauptzufahrstweg hat einfach eine andere rechtliche Grundlage. bis dann David Am 23.06.2010 23:53, schrieb Walter Nordmann: hi, war heute mal wieder im felde und da wimmelte es nur so von landwirtschaftlichen genutzten wegen - also tracks. EINER dieser Wege (grade1,3 m) war durch nix von anderen grade1-wegen zu unterscheiden, war allerdings mit anlieger frei beschildert, da er zusätzlich DER weg zu einem externen anliegen ist. irgendwie sehe ich jetzt keinen grund, diesen als service-weg einzutragen, bloss weil dessen nutzungsart anders ist. für mich bleibt das immer noch ein grade1-track mit anderen access-tags. in wohngebieten ist service eine abgrenzung zu normalen wohnstraßen. mehr nicht. walter - Der Student muß es wissen. Der Assistent muß wissen, wo es steht. Der Professor hat Assistenten. attachment: david.vcf___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
[Talk-de] Daten vom Katatsteramt: dxf oder shape?
Moin, da wir Orts- und Stadtteilgrenzen nicht selbst mappen können, habe ich beim Katasteramt nachgefragt, ob ich diese dort erhalten könnte. Da mir bekannt war, dass die Nutzungsbedingungen der niedersächsischen Geobehörden Web-Mapping-Dienste grundsätzlich von der Nutzung ausschließen [1}, habe ich verfälschte Daten angefragt. Ergebnis: Ich kann die Grenzen der sogenannten Gemarkungen, aus welchen sich die Ortsteile und somit auch die Orte konstruieren lassen, explizit für die Nutzung im OSM Projekt durch Glättung um 3 bis 5 Meter verfälscht für die ostfriesische Halbinsel [2] (Landkreise Aurich, Friesland, Leer und Wittmund sowie Städte Emden und Wilhelmshaven) für etwa 200 bis 250 Euro bekommen, die ich privat aufbringen werde. Angeboten wird wahlweise in Vektordarstellung das sogenannte dxf oder das Shapeformat. Da ich keine Ahnung von dieser Materie habe, wollte ich nachftragen, welches Format für uns günstiger wäre und ob ein Wissender diese Daten in eine osm-Datei oder ein in JOSM abmalbares Format umwandeln könnte? (1) http://www.lgn.niedersachsen.de/live/live.php?navigation_id=11063article_id=51535_psmand=35 [2] http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=53.485lon=7.518zoom=10layers=B000FTF ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Daten vom Katatsteramt: dxf oder shape?
Ja, siehe dxf2osm (twonickels branch of dime) http://www.mail-archive.com/d...@openstreetmap.org/msg10255.html mfg, mike 2010/6/24 Tirkon tirko...@yahoo.de Moin, da wir Orts- und Stadtteilgrenzen nicht selbst mappen können, habe ich beim Katasteramt nachgefragt, ob ich diese dort erhalten könnte. Da mir bekannt war, dass die Nutzungsbedingungen der niedersächsischen Geobehörden Web-Mapping-Dienste grundsätzlich von der Nutzung ausschließen [1}, habe ich verfälschte Daten angefragt. Ergebnis: Ich kann die Grenzen der sogenannten Gemarkungen, aus welchen sich die Ortsteile und somit auch die Orte konstruieren lassen, explizit für die Nutzung im OSM Projekt durch Glättung um 3 bis 5 Meter verfälscht für die ostfriesische Halbinsel [2] (Landkreise Aurich, Friesland, Leer und Wittmund sowie Städte Emden und Wilhelmshaven) für etwa 200 bis 250 Euro bekommen, die ich privat aufbringen werde. Angeboten wird wahlweise in Vektordarstellung das sogenannte dxf oder das Shapeformat. Da ich keine Ahnung von dieser Materie habe, wollte ich nachftragen, welches Format für uns günstiger wäre und ob ein Wissender diese Daten in eine osm-Datei oder ein in JOSM abmalbares Format umwandeln könnte? (1) http://www.lgn.niedersachsen.de/live/live.php?navigation_id=11063article_id=51535_psmand=35 [2] http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=53.485lon=7.518zoom=10layers=B000FTF ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de -- James Michael DuPont Member of Free Libre Open Source Software Kosova and Albania flossk.org flossal.org ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Die Track Seuche
hi, anlieger frei oder zufahrt zu haus penelope frei sagt doch, dass da jedermann fahren darf, der dort was zu erledigen hat. was soll da eine schranke/schleuse/sperre auf dem weg - eventuell auch noch abgeschlossen ? d.h technisch kann da jedermann durch. gruss walter - Der Student muß es wissen. Der Assistent muß wissen, wo es steht. Der Professor hat Assistenten. -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Die-Track-Seuche-tp5212171p5216635.html Sent from the Germany mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Jogging-Rundstrecken
Hallo zusammen, Inzwischen ist die Karte auf den Toolserver umgezogen. Ausserdem sind es jetzt keine gerenderten Tiles mehr, sondern ein weltweiter Vektor- Overlay, der seine Daten minuten-aktuell aus der Datenbank zieht: http://toolserver.org/~ti/ftm/ Gruss, Thomas ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
[Talk-de] OWL: OpenStreetMap Watch List Down??
Hallo Liste, Weiß jemand zufällig was mit dem OWL viewer los ist? http://matt.dev.openstreetmap.org/owl_viewer/ Mein RSS Feed wird seit zwei Tage nicht mehr aktualisiert und auf den Links der alten Aktualisierungen bekomme ich nur eine Fehlermeldung... Gruß UMAX974 ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Die Track Seuche
Am 24.06.2010 03:17, schrieb Stephan Wolff: Wenn ich eine Klassifizierung sehr unpassend finde, ändere ich sie einfach und schreibe den Grund z.B. als note=kein Durchgangsverkehr. Stichwort Durchgangsverkehr: Wie üblich gehen die Meinungen bei dem Thema auseinander, was heisst das für die Routerprogrammierer? Ich denke das beste Car-Routing wird sich erreichen lassen, wenn man eine Anliegerbeschränkung für Tracks impliziert. Tracks mit Durchgangsverkehr kann man mit motorcar=yes etc. taggen, dann routet sogar ORS da drüber. ;-) Chris ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Die Track Seuche
Chris66 chris66...@gmx.de wrote: Meiner Meinung nach sollte jede legal per Auto ansteuerbare Adresse über das Highway-Netz exclusive Tracks erreichbar sein. Der Trend geht aber eher in die Richtung, alles was halbwegs nach Landwirtschaft riecht als Track zu mappen. Der von Nord-Ost kommende Track ist ohne Zeichen 260 versehen und mit einem weißen Schild Zufahrt Albertushof. Nur das letzte Stück ist mit 260 + Landw. frei + Anlieger Albertushof frei beschildert. Und sollte meiner Meinung nach als service klassifiziert werden. Das Dilemma liegt darin, dass manche Tags unterschiedliche Nutzungsweisen addressieren, die beide zutreffen. Beispielsweise könnte man nach der jetzigen Formulierung der Regeln manche Hauszufahrt sowohl als service, residential oder track mappen. Der Übergang ist etwas schwammig. Ich gehe etwa so vor: Residential ist Alles, was Wohnbebauung aufweist, aber nicht mehr als primary, secondary oder tertiary einzustufen ist. Hier vereinfachen sich die Verhältnisse insofern, da der residential gleichzeitig auch eine Verbindungsfunktion zu entfernten Wohngebieten aufweisen kann. Der Unterschied zwischen unclassified und track-grade1 liegt für mich darin, dass der unclassified ähnlich wie primary, secondary oder tertiary noch eine gewisse Verbindungsfunktion aber keine oder nur vereinzelte Wohnbebauung aufweist und sich von daher von einem residential unterscheidet, der neben der Wohnbebauung einen gewissen Erschließungscharakter für andere entfernte residentials aufweist, also z.B. nicht als Sackgasse endet. Alles Andere, was zweispurig zu befahren ist, ist ein track oder ein service. Sobald der Weg einzig dazu benutzt werden kann, um eine Adresse zu erreichen, ist er dann ein service, wenn auf dem Weg dorthin nicht weitere Wohnbebauung existiert. Die Grenze ist hier schwammig, wenn nur vereinzelt Häuser an der Straße stehen. Wenn ein einzelner Hof am Ende einer hunderte Meter oder kilometerlangen Sackgasse liegt, die zudem auch noch einen gewidmeten Namen hat, kann sie durchaus auch zum track werden. Für eine Routenplanung wäre also im Entscheidungsfalle der unclassified höher zu bewerten, als ein residential, track oder service. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Die Track Seuche
Hi, mal abgesehen, dass bei uns in der Gegend der Zugangsweg zu den Forsthaeusern auch ueber eine Schranke verfuegt, duerfen auf den Forstwegen die Forstfahrzeuge einfach stehenbleiben, was auf dem Zugangsweg nicht erlaubt ist. Dort muessen sie den Rettungsweg freihalten. Ich gebe dir aber Recht, dass die Kenzeichnung eines Track mit dem Schild Anlieger frei genauso interpretiert werden koennte wie eine service Strasse, uber die alle Dienste/Services das Grundstueck erreichen koennen. Die Frage ist einfach; wird die Wegbeschaffenheit oder die Bedeutung des Weges als Grundlage genommen? Im Bereich highway=[primary|secondary|tertionary] gilt eher die Bedeutung des Weges. Im Bereich highway=path eher die Wegbeschaffenheit, wo dann ueber Zusatztags die Bedeutung geklaert wird. D.h. wo wird der Schnitt gemacht :-)? bis dann David Am 24.06.2010 10:02, schrieb Walter Nordmann: hi, anlieger frei oder zufahrt zu haus penelope frei sagt doch, dass da jedermann fahren darf, der dort was zu erledigen hat. was soll da eine schranke/schleuse/sperre auf dem weg - eventuell auch noch abgeschlossen ? d.h technisch kann da jedermann durch. gruss walter - Der Student muß es wissen. Der Assistent muß wissen, wo es steht. Der Professor hat Assistenten. attachment: david.vcf___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
[Talk-de] AIO/europe vom 23 Juni?
Hallo Welt, in Vorbereitung auf den Sommerurlaub hab ich letzte Nacht die AIO für Europa mal wieder updaten wollen, aber mein Edge 705 mit Firmware 3.10 erkennt sie nicht. Im Kartenmenü taucht nix auf, die im Garmin fest eingebaute Basiskarte ist das Einzige was noch funktioniert. Die MD5-Prüfsumme ist ok, eine Karte vom ca. 25.3.2010 funktioniert problemlos. Kann das jemand bestätigen / verifizieren? Jörg -- There are only 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't... signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
