Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Kevin demonstrates the ability to 'google' (Lance). Actually, I'd vote for his wife over him. (GWB) - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 23, 2005 16:15 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Lance wrote: ... Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. Why is it that the lib's are always, so conceited in their opinion of themselves? Quotes from lances friends: I despise him [President George W. Bush]. I despise his administration and everything they stand forTo my mind the election was stolen by George Bush and we have been suffering ever since under this man's leadershipThere has to be a movement now to really oppose what he is proposing because it's unconstitutional, it's immoral and basically illegalIt is an embarrassing time to be an American. It really is. It's humiliating. Actress Jessica Lange at a film festival in Spain, September 25. "Free Enterprise really means rich people get richer. They have the freedom to exploit and psychologically rape their fellow human beings in the process . . . Capitalism is destroying the earth. "-- Helen Caldicott, Union of Concerned Scientists "To feed a starving child is to exacerbate the world population problem"-- Lamont Cole "I suspect that eradicating small pox was wrong. It played an important part in balancing ecosystems." -- John Davis, editor of Earth First! Journal Human beings, as a species, have no more value than slugs." -- John Davis, editor of Earth First! Journal "The purpose of government is to rein in the rights of the people" -- Bill Clinton 1993 on MTV "(W)hen Communist U.S.S.R. was a superpower, the world was better off. The right-wing media is trying to marginalize the peace movement." -- Janeane Garofalo "The WTC was not just an architectural monstrosity, but also terrible for people who didn't work there, for it said to all those people: 'If you can't work up here, boy, you're out of it.' That's why I'm sure that if those towers had been destroyed without loss of life, a lot of people would have cheered. Everything wrong with America led to the point where the country built that tower of Babel, which consequently had to be destroyed. And then came the next shock. We had to realize that the people that did this were brilliant. It showed that the ego we could hold up until September 10 was inadequate." -- Norman Mailer David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lance wrote: ... Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me.Oh, please stop with the ad hominem remarks. At least she has a brain to wash and is found now to be pure.Every one of us indoctrinate each other. The question is, which doctrine do we submit ourselves unto? Are we washing our brains with the doctrine of Christ or with the liberal theology of demons?Ephesians 2:1-6(1) And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;(2) Wherein IN TIME PAST YE WALKED ACCORDING TO THE COURSE OF THIS WORLD, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:(3) Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.(4) But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,(5) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)(6) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:Peace be with you.David Miller. --"Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.orgIf you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Lance wrote: ... Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. Oh, please stop with the ad hominem remarks. At least she has a brain to wash and is found now to be pure. Every one of us indoctrinate each other. The question is, which doctrine do we submit ourselves unto? Are we washing our brains with the doctrine of Christ or with the liberal theology of demons? Ephesians 2:1-6 (1) And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; (2) Wherein IN TIME PAST YE WALKED ACCORDING TO THE COURSE OF THIS WORLD, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: (3) Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. (4) But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, (5) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) (6) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Thanks David for the multitude of scriptural quotations. I stand by what I said. It's the acorn and tree thingy. - Original Message - From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 23, 2005 11:37 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Lance wrote: ... Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. Oh, please stop with the ad hominem remarks. At least she has a brain to wash and is found now to be pure. Every one of us indoctrinate each other. The question is, which doctrine do we submit ourselves unto? Are we washing our brains with the doctrine of Christ or with the liberal theology of demons? Ephesians 2:1-6 (1) And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; (2) Wherein IN TIME PAST YE WALKED ACCORDING TO THE COURSE OF THIS WORLD, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: (3) Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. (4) But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, (5) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) (6) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Which in this case is a very good thingy! Izzy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Monday, May 23, 2005 9:58 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Thanks David for the multitude of scriptural quotations. I stand by what I said. It's the acorn and tree thingy. - Original Message - From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 23, 2005 11:37 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Lance wrote: ... Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. Oh, please stop with the ad hominem remarks. At least she has a brain to wash and is found now to be pure. Every one of us indoctrinate each other. The question is, which doctrine do we submit ourselves unto? Are we washing our brains with the doctrine of Christ or with the liberal theology of demons? Ephesians 2:1-6 (1) And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins; (2) Wherein IN TIME PAST YE WALKED ACCORDING TO THE COURSE OF THIS WORLD, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience: (3) Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. (4) But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, (5) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;) (6) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus: Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Lance wrote: ... Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. Why is it that the lib's are always, so conceited in their opinion of themselves? Quotes from lances friends: I despise him [President George W. Bush]. I despise his administration and everything they stand forTo my mind the election was stolen by George Bush and we have been suffering ever since under this man's leadershipThere has to be a movement now to really oppose what he is proposing because it's unconstitutional, it's immoral and basically illegalIt is an embarrassing time to be an American. It really is. It's humiliating. Actress Jessica Lange at a film festival in Spain, September 25. "Free Enterprise really means rich people get richer. They have the freedom to exploit and psychologically rape their fellow human beings in the process . . . Capitalism is destroying the earth. "-- Helen Caldicott, Union of Concerned Scientists "To feed a starving child is to exacerbate the world population problem"-- Lamont Cole "I suspect that eradicating small pox was wrong. It played an important part in balancing ecosystems." -- John Davis, editor of Earth First! Journal Human beings, as a species, have no more value than slugs." -- John Davis, editor of Earth First! Journal "The purpose of government is to rein in the rights of the people" -- Bill Clinton 1993 on MTV "(W)hen Communist U.S.S.R. was a superpower, the world was better off. The right-wing media is trying to marginalize the peace movement." -- Janeane Garofalo "The WTC was not just an architectural monstrosity, but also terrible for people who didn't work there, for it said to all those people: 'If you can't work up here, boy, you're out of it.' That's why I'm sure that if those towers had been destroyed without loss of life, a lot of people would have cheered. Everything wrong with America led to the point where the country built that tower of Babel, which consequently had to be destroyed. And then came the next shock. We had to realize that the people that did this were brilliant. It showed that the ego we could hold up until September 10 was inadequate." -- Norman Mailer David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lance wrote: ... Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me.Oh, please stop with the ad hominem remarks. At least she has a brain to wash and is found now to be pure.Every one of us indoctrinate each other. The question is, which doctrine do we submit ourselves unto? Are we washing our brains with the doctrine of Christ or with the liberal theology of demons?Ephesians 2:1-6(1) And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;(2) Wherein IN TIME PAST YE WALKED ACCORDING TO THE COURSE OF THIS WORLD, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:(3) Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.(4) But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,(5) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)(6) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:Peace be with you.David Miller. --"Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.orgIf you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
You don't have any idea what we are talking about, do you, Kevin. You seem to be motivated by whatever comes to mind while I have been onpoint You get so confused, Linda.I'll bet you are the kind of person who starts thinking about what you want to say just as soon as someone else starts talking. you have an "eye" problem JD psycho analeyes 101 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: You get so confused, Linda. It was not my opinion but Lance's. I'll bet you are the kind of person who starts thinking about what you want to say just as soon as someone else starts talking. That seems to explain how you can get so confused and off point. Pay attention -- but finish drying off first. JD-Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 20 May 2005 22:26:22 -0500Subject: RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Let me guess—You had that opinion before she ever said a word on TT, right? How’d I guess? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 9:09 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Expressing an opinion and "name calling" are two very different things -- but you know this. -Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 20 May 2005 17:10:00 -0500Subject: RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Note the Liberal name-calling. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Friday, May 20, 2005 3:23 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I dunno David, Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 18, 2005 09:13 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline Wong wrote: Words wound, David. Words that wound one person might alsoheal and liberate another person. Jesus said, "blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me." We cannot judge the value of words based upon whether or not somebody in society does not like them. This is Liberty 101. Peace be with you.David Miller.__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
I dunno David, Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 18, 2005 09:13 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline Wong wrote: Words wound, David. Words that wound one person might alsoheal and liberate another person. Jesus said, "blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me." We cannot judge the value of words based upon whether or not somebody in society does not like them. This is Liberty 101. Peace be with you.David Miller.
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Note the Liberal name-calling. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 3:23 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I dunno David, Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 18, 2005 09:13 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline Wong wrote: Words wound, David. Words that wound one person might alsoheal and liberate another person. Jesus said, blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me. We cannot judge the value of words based upon whether or not somebody in society does not like them. This is Liberty 101. Peace be with you. David Miller.
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Expressing an opinion and "name calling" are two very different things -- but you know this.-Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 20 May 2005 17:10:00 -0500Subject: RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Note the Liberal name-calling. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Friday, May 20, 2005 3:23 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I dunno David, Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 18, 2005 09:13 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline Wong wrote: Words wound, David. Words that wound one person might alsoheal and liberate another person. Jesus said, "blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me." We cannot judge the value of words based upon whether or not somebody in society does not like them. This is Liberty 101. Peace be with you.David Miller.
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Note the free rideShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Note the Liberal name-calling. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Friday, May 20, 2005 3:23 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I dunno David, Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 18, 2005 09:13 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline Wong wrote: Words wound, David. Words that wound one person might alsoheal and liberate another person. Jesus said, "blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me." We cannot judge the value of words based upon whether or not somebody in society does not like them. This is Liberty 101. Peace be with you.David Miller. Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Let me guessYou had that opinion before she ever said a word on TT, right? Howd I guess? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 9:09 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Expressing an opinion and name calling are two very different things -- but you know this. -Original Message- From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Fri, 20 May 2005 17:10:00 -0500 Subject: RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Note the Liberal name-calling. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 3:23 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I dunno David, Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 18, 2005 09:13 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline Wong wrote: Words wound, David. Words that wound one person might alsoheal and liberate another person. Jesus said, blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me. We cannot judge the value of words based upon whether or not somebody in society does not like them. This is Liberty 101. Peace be with you. David Miller.
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
You get so confused, Linda. It was not my opinion but Lance's. I'll bet you are the kind of person who starts thinking about what you want to say just as soon as someone else starts talking. That seems to explain how you can get so confused and off point. Pay attention -- but finish drying off first. JD-Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 20 May 2005 22:26:22 -0500Subject: RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Let me guessYou had that opinion before she ever said a word on TT, right? Howd I guess? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 9:09 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Expressing an opinion and "name calling" are two very different things -- but you know this. -Original Message-From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSent: Fri, 20 May 2005 17:10:00 -0500Subject: RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Note the Liberal name-calling. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Friday, May 20, 2005 3:23 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I dunno David, Christine sounds pretty brainwashed to me. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 18, 2005 09:13 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline Wong wrote: Words wound, David. Words that wound one person might alsoheal and liberate another person. Jesus said, "blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me." We cannot judge the value of words based upon whether or not somebody in society does not like them. This is Liberty 101. Peace be with you.David Miller.
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Raymond, note that I went back and ALSO showed you the scriptures that said GOD hardened Pharaohs heart; did you read those??? I also asked if you believe ALL of those scriptures, or only the ones that you agree with. Im still waiting for answer, please. Id really like to know. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bothoms Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 1:56 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Look ! I answered the question. The question was Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? I answered that I have read Exodus -- in fact, I probably know the book better than you. As for the other part of the question, I quoted verses that say that Pharaoh hardened his own heart. Go back and read it . And not just selectively read it. Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK the question was do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? and? Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I did and my reply was suited to it. Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Read the rest of the post! Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? See the ? that indicates a QUESTION Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are you a nut? Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you noticed? Raymond is not able to answer any questions! Q What color is your shirt? A I like golf. Q Which way to Canada? A I Drive a chevy. Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also. (Ex 7:22-23) But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said. (Ex 8:15) Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said. (Ex 8:19) And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go. (Ex 8:32) And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go. (Ex 9:7) And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken. (Ex 9:34-35) Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed? (1Sam 6:6) Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out! Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Read the rest of the post! Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? See the ? that indicates a QUESTION Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are you a nut?Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you noticed? Raymond is not able to answer any questions! Q What color is your shirt? A I like golf. Q Which way to Canada? A I Drive a chevy.Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following "And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also." (Ex 7:22-23) "But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:15) "Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:19) "And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go." (Ex 8:32) "And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go." (Ex 9:7) "And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken." (Ex 9:34-35) "Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?" (1Sam 6:6) Discover Yahoo!Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out! Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour
Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
I was an a witness. I DO NOT CONDONE ASSAULT. We were in a circle praying with eyes closed. There was a girl who requested prayer and was quite distraught. This guy was standing right there doing a sort of growling noise, for sometime. Making it hard to hear the prayer. He found the smallest guy there (he outwieghed him by 80 lbs) The victim could not even cry out, being assaulted from behind and in a choke hold. He dragged him down the sidewalk. Seems the guy was an LDS High Priest, some LDS took up a collection to help pay for his court costs. I believe he was charged with 2 felonies. Agravated assault can't remember the other charge. My pastor would not assault anyone, why do LDS High priests behave like Thugs? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: BLAINE: Questions for Kevin and Perry: I distinctly recall underwear being waved at General Conference in Salt Lake City, I recall a Mormon man reacting and attacking the wavers; were either of you involved in this?OR Did you condone it? In a message dated 5/14/2005 6:17:13 PM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I agree with Lance and am glad you conduct yourselves as a Christian. How do you deal with the violent and angry sinners? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Lance Muir To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 3:12 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Thanks Kevin. - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 14, 2005 15:42 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I do not chase people down the street, I just preach do one on one discuss teach, answer questions, and or pray with people. If they care not, that is between them God I have discharged my responsibility. I try to conduct myself as a Christian. Try being lied about slandered, put on TV for "calling people whores", having Christians repeat third hand stories they heard, Christians backpeddaling as fast as they can away from you, Dealing with the Authorities, Dealing with the angry sometimes violent sinners I preach all kinds of events and surely do not preach "Hellfire damnation" at the family events I have never been arrested in over 20 years of preaching on a regular basis. I have led a good number of lost to the Lord. I just love telling people about my savior, can't shut my mouth, look what He did for me!ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What Kevin says is not offensive to me in the least. I think when he preaches against sin it is only “offensive” to sinners. The same word of God either hardens or softens hearts. When I hear someone preach against sin like Kevin does it causes me to want to examine my own life to be sure I’m not also in need of repentance for some sin. I doubt that Kevin curses at anyone, or molests anyone. Maybe he can verify that for us. If you hate the ACLU I can agree with that! If Skin Heads, Nazi’s, etc. are cursing at me that’s a whole different matter—they are of satan, and so is cursing and molesting. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline WongSent: Friday, May 13, 2005 9:32 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Someone I don't know, trust, believe or even like shouting at me stuff that is offensive to my ears is disturbing my right to peace and quiet and my right to be unmolested and intimidated when I enter my place of worship. What if it wasn't a Street Preacher on the video but Skin Heads, NeoNazisor Satanists cursing you while you're trying to get into a meeting? Is there any law in America that you could use to stop them or are they totally protected by the ACLU too? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 4:25 PM Subject: RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline, do you believe that public preaching encroaches on your freedom? Izzy Caroline Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We took a leaf from your founding fathers: Your freedom ends when it encroaches mine. __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
I did and my reply was suited to it.Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Read the rest of the post! Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? See the ? that indicates a QUESTION Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are you a nut?Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you noticed? Raymond is not able to answer any questions! Q What color is your shirt? A I like golf. Q Which way to Canada? A I Drive a chevy.Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following "And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also." (Ex 7:22-23) "But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:15) "Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:19) "And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go." (Ex 8:32) "And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go." (Ex 9:7) "And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken." (Ex 9:34-35) "Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?" (1Sam 6:6) Discover Yahoo!Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out! Yahoo! MailStay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour
Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Caroline Wong wrote: And what did Jesus mean when he quoted Hosea, "But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance." Jesus was telling us what He preferred to see from us. He would rather we be merciful to one another than offer sacrifices to God. If you remember, by this time, God was sick of meaningless sacrifices, offerings not from the heart, rituals. That is religeon. Mercy comes from a loving heart. Terry
Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Terry, I agree. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Terry Clifton To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 9:44 AM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline Wong wrote: And what did Jesus mean when he quoted Hosea, "But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance." Jesus was telling us what He preferred to see from us. He would rather we be merciful to one another than offer sacrifices to God. If you remember, by this time, God was sick of meaningless sacrifices, offerings not from the heart, rituals. That is religeon. Mercy comes from a loving heart.Terry
Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
I kinda figured you would. Caroline Wong wrote: Terry, I agree. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Terry Clifton To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 9:44 AM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline Wong wrote: And what did Jesus mean when he quoted Hosea, "But go ye and learn what that meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice: for I am not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance." Jesus was telling us what He preferred to see from us. He would rather we be merciful to one another than offer sacrifices to God. If you remember, by this time, God was sick of meaningless sacrifices, offerings not from the heart, rituals. That is religeon. Mercy comes from a loving heart. Terry
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
OK the question was do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? and? Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I did and my reply was suited to it.Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Read the rest of the post! Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? See the ? that indicates a QUESTION Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are you a nut?Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you noticed? Raymond is not able to answer any questions! Q What color is your shirt? A I like golf. Q Which way to Canada? A I Drive a chevy.Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following "And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also." (Ex 7:22-23) "But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:15) "Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:19) "And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go." (Ex 8:32) "And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go." (Ex 9:7) "And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken." (Ex 9:34-35) "Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?" (1Sam 6:6) Discover Yahoo!Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out! Yahoo! MailStay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Look ! I answered the question. The question was Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? I answered that I have read Exodus -- in fact, I probably know the book better than you. As for the other part of the question, I quoted verses that say that Pharaoh hardened his own heart. Go back and read it . And not just selectively read it. Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK the question was do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? and? Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I did and my reply was suited to it.Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Read the rest of the post! Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? See the ? that indicates a QUESTION Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are you a nut?Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you noticed? Raymond is not able to answer any questions! Q What color is your shirt? A I like golf. Q Which way to Canada? A I Drive a chevy.Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following "And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also." (Ex 7:22-23) "But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:15) "Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:19) "And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go." (Ex 8:32) "And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go." (Ex 9:7) "And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken." (Ex 9:34-35) "Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?" (1Sam 6:6) Discover Yahoo!Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out! Yahoo! MailStay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour Yahoo! MailStay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
How canI say it so you get it? DO YOU DISAGREE WITH THE BIBLE WHEN IT SAYS GOD HARDENED PHARAOHS HEART? Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Look ! I answered the question. The question was Have you not read the book of Exodus, OR do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? I answered that I have read Exodus -- in fact, I probably know the book better than you. As for the other part of the question, I quoted verses that say that Pharaoh hardened his own heart. Go back and read it . And not just selectively read it. Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK the question was do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? and? Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I did and my reply was suited to it.Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Read the rest of the post! Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? See the ? that indicates a QUESTION Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are you a nut?Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you noticed? Raymond is not able to answer any questions! Q What color is your shirt? A I like golf. Q Which way to Canada? A I Drive a chevy.Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following "And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also." (Ex 7:22-23) "But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:15) "Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:19) "And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go." (Ex 8:32) "And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go." (Ex 9:7) "And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken." (Ex 9:34-35) "Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?" (1Sam 6:6) Discover Yahoo!Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out! Yahoo! MailStay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour Yahoo! MailStay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.
Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Jonathan does not follow God's Word Caroline, he is a follower of "Orthodoxy" which during the days of Christ's earthly ministry would have been the Scribes Pharisees - or as Jesus put it, the blind leading the blind. Now back then Jesus told his disciplesto "let them be" but Athanasuis and his cronies in the 4th Century believedthey had found a superior way to deal with those they labelled hereticks such asArius. So their peculiardoctrine and that ofChurch councils that followed became "Orthodoxy" - which BTW has nothing whateverto do with "new wineskins" Jesus baptises with the Holy Spirit and all error has at it's root the other spirit. jt On Fri, 13 May 2005 22:49:17 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Jonathan does not disagree with God's word and he is well versed in what God said in the bible. As JD found out, new wine is poured into new wineskins. Very early in my TT days, my pastor said that I can't change another person's beliefs without giving them something else to believe in. I will add that unless God changed a person, madehim intonew wineskin, new beliefswill causehim to burst. It is self preservation to reject new wine until that transformation happens. I'm referring to us all- by whatever label that's been applied to us - saint, sinner, Christian, anti-whatever, liberal, fundy. godly, godless By the way,this is the label that we (everyone of us here) give ourselves: true Christ followers. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Maybe if you read the bible, instead of fantasy books, you would have a understanding of what God's word has to say on the subject. Why is it that every time one of you Liberals disagrees with God's word of course it is a incorrect reading? Who made you chief editor of God's word? Maybe it is God who has Hardened you Bible Correctors Hearts, as his judgement of your rebellious spirit.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading? Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ differently than you? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we will then look at this text as justifying what we already believe. If we view God as being One who is love (in His very core of being) we will delve in and wrestle with the text (note that the textalso says that Pharoah hardened his own heart etc.) instead of approaching it with a tentative surface meaning. We all become like the God we adore. Those that adore a hard, vengeful, angry God tend to be hard, vengeful and angry right here on TT. A new approach to people's posts on TT would be beneficial. Before we rush to defend our own opinions with our prooftexts perhaps wrestling with why a person holds a certain belief would be in order. Would it have hurt to see that you may have agreed with Raymond when he says that God softens hearts? Has God ever softened yours? Could you have used that to continue (rather than end) the dialogue? Rather than 10 vacuous posts a day how about just one well-thought, well constructed, and well meaning post? Jonathan Truthtalk Alumnis - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 13, 2005 17:24 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of BothomsSent: Friday, May 13, 2005 2:28 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism David: Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? Raymond: I respectf
Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
So this is where we respectfully disagree. I believe Jonathan is on the right path and that you are on the wrong path having followed the wrong leaders. But that's okay. God loves you and understands all that make you think and act the way you do. There will be judgment but as His daughter, you will be with Him in eternity. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 1:56 AM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Jonathan does not follow God's Word Caroline, he is a follower of "Orthodoxy" which during the days of Christ's earthly ministry would have been the Scribes Pharisees - or as Jesus put it, the blind leading the blind. Now back then Jesus told his disciplesto "let them be" but Athanasuis and his cronies in the 4th Century believedthey had found a superior way to deal with those they labelled hereticks such asArius. So their peculiardoctrine and that ofChurch councils that followed became "Orthodoxy" - which BTW has nothing whateverto do with "new wineskins" Jesus baptises with the Holy Spirit and all error has at it's root the other spirit. jt On Fri, 13 May 2005 22:49:17 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Jonathan does not disagree with God's word and he is well versed in what God said in the bible. As JD found out, new wine is poured into new wineskins. Very early in my TT days, my pastor said that I can't change another person's beliefs without giving them something else to believe in. I will add that unless God changed a person, madehim intonew wineskin, new beliefswill causehim to burst. It is self preservation to reject new wine until that transformation happens. I'm referring to us all- by whatever label that's been applied to us - saint, sinner, Christian, anti-whatever, liberal, fundy. godly, godless By the way,this is the label that we (everyone of us here) give ourselves: true Christ followers. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Maybe if you read the bible, instead of fantasy books, you would have a understanding of what God's word has to say on the subject. Why is it that every time one of you Liberals disagrees with God's word of course it is a incorrect reading? Who made you chief editor of God's word? Maybe it is God who has Hardened you Bible Correctors Hearts, as his judgement of your rebellious spirit.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading? Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ differently than you? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we will then look at this text as justifying what we already believe. If we view God as being One who is love (in His very core of being) we will delve in and wrestle with the text (note that the textalso says that Pharoah hardened his own heart etc.) instead of approaching it with a tentative surface meaning. We all become like the God we adore. Those that adore a hard, vengeful, angry God tend to be hard, vengeful and angry right here on TT. A new approach to people's posts on TT would be beneficial. Before we rush to defend our own opinions with our prooftexts perhaps wrestling with why a person holds a certain belief would be in order. Would it have hurt to see that you may have agreed with Raymond when he says that God softens hearts? Has God ever softened yours? Could you have used that to continue (rather than end) the dialogue? Rather than 10 vacuous posts a day how about just one well-thought, well constructed, and well meaning post? Jonathan Truthtalk Alumnis - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 13, 2005 17:24 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] bap
Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
CW says Jonathan does not disagree with God's word What post did you read??? I did not see any Bible in the post, just his correction of the Bible. On what AUTHORITY do you Bible correctors operate? God has a controversy with you; DETAILS in the HOLY BIBLE Hos 4:1 EX 4 I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go. Ex 7:3,13-14; 7:22; 9:12;10:11,20,27;11:10;14:4,8,17; Jos 11:20; Is 63:7 You are confusing a hard heart with God leading into sin which He would never do. Acts 4:19 Whether it be right in the sight of God to hearken unto you more than unto God, judge ye.Caroline Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jonathan does not disagree with God's word and he is well versed in what God said in the bible. As JD found out, new wine is poured into new wineskins. Very early in my TT days, my pastor said that I can't change another person's beliefs without giving them something else to believe in. I will add that unless God changed a person, madehim intonew wineskin, new beliefswill causehim to burst. It is self preservation to reject new wine until that transformation happens. I'm referring to us all- by whatever label that's been applied to us - saint, sinner, Christian, anti-whatever, liberal, fundy. godly, godless By the way,this is the label that we (everyone of us here) give ourselves: true Christ followers. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Maybe if you read the bible, instead of fantasy books, you would have a understanding of what God's word has to say on the subject. Why is it that every time one of you Liberals disagrees with God's word of course it is a incorrect reading? Who made you chief editor of God's word? Maybe it is God who has Hardened you Bible Correctors Hearts, as his judgement of your rebellious spirit.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading? Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ differently than you? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we will then look at this text as justifying what we already believe. If we view God as being One who is love (in His very core of being) we will delve in and wrestle with the text (note that the textalso says that Pharoah hardened his own heart etc.) instead of approaching it with a tentative surface meaning. We all become like the God we adore. Those that adore a hard, vengeful, angry God tend to be hard, vengeful and angry right here on TT. A new approach to people's posts on TT would be beneficial. Before we rush to defend our own opinions with our prooftexts perhaps wrestling with why a person holds a certain belief would be in order. Would it have hurt to see that you may have agreed with Raymond when he says that God softens hearts? Has God ever softened yours? Could you have used that to continue (rather than end) the dialogue? Rather than 10 vacuous posts a day how about just one well-thought, well constructed, and well meaning post? Jonathan Truthtalk Alumnis - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 13, 2005 17:24 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of BothomsSent: Friday, May 13, 2005 2:28 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism David: Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? Raymond: I respectfully disagree. The Lord does not hardened hearts; He softens them. Discover Yahoo!Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out! Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour
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Well Caroline, everyone to their own opinion. I would take a lot of comfort in your thoughts if you were the judge, but there is a different standard which isnot near as lax. Yes God understood and loved us enough to send His ONLY begotten Son to pay for our transgressions so that we would not have to continue to wallow in them.So let the redeemed of the Lord say so ...My gospel is the "highway of holiness" (Isa 35:8-10)... Orthodoxy is the"other way" Are you aware that history is continually revised? They are fixing to make poor old John Paul who because of his Parkinsonism could barely stagger around and could not conduct a homily before he died into some kind of a miracle working superman/saint. Future generations will not recognize him as the same man we saw on TV. Along the same lines Priscilla Presley is revising her history with Elvis and this is now in the process of being transformed from the sordid tale of a very beautiful 14yr old teen who Elvis met whilein Germany and was given permission by her starstruck and misguided parents to live at Graceland with the much older Elvis (attending school in TN, while ATST beingsubject to his perverted whims) - until they were married 5-6yrs later - into a sweet andinnocent little love story for one of the Networks - Truth has perished in the streets. jt On Sat, 14 May 2005 08:20:49 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So this is where we respectfully disagree. I believe Jonathan is on the right path and that you are on the wrong path having followed the wrong leaders. But that's okay. God loves you and understands all that make you think and act the way you do. There will be judgment but as His daughter, you will be with Him in eternity. Love, Caroline From: Judy Taylor Jonathan does not follow God's Word Caroline, he is a follower of "Orthodoxy" which during the days of Christ's earthly ministry would have been the Scribes Pharisees - or as Jesus put it, the blind leading the blind. Now back then Jesus told his disciplesto "let them be" but Athanasuis and his cronies in the 4th Century believedthey had found a superior way to deal with those they labelled hereticks such asArius. So their peculiardoctrine and that ofChurch councils that followed became "Orthodoxy" - which BTW has nothing whateverto do with "new wineskins" Jesus baptises with the Holy Spirit and all error has at it's root the other spirit. jt On Fri, 13 May 2005 22:49:17 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Jonathan does not disagree with God's word and he is well versed in what God said in the bible. As JD found out, new wine is poured into new wineskins. Very early in my TT days, my pastor said that I can't change another person's beliefs without giving them something else to believe in. I will add that unless God changed a person, madehim intonew wineskin, new beliefswill causehim to burst. It is self preservation to reject new wine until that transformation happens. I'm referring to us all- by whatever label that's been applied to us - saint, sinner, Christian, anti-whatever, liberal, fundy. godly, godless By the way,this is the label that we (everyone of us here) give ourselves: true Christ followers. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Maybe if you read the bible, instead of fantasy books, you would have a understanding of what God's word has to say on the subject. Why is it that every time one of you Liberals disagrees with God's word of course it is a incorrect reading? Who made you chief editor of God's word? Maybe it is God who has Hardened you Bible Correctors Hearts, as his judgement of your rebellious spirit.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading? Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ differently than you? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we wil
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Tsk, tsk Judy! What have you been watching? - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 14, 2005 08:52 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Well Caroline, everyone to their own opinion. I would take a lot of comfort in your thoughts if you were the judge, but there is a different standard which isnot near as lax. Yes God understood and loved us enough to send His ONLY begotten Son to pay for our transgressions so that we would not have to continue to wallow in them.So let the redeemed of the Lord say so ...My gospel is the "highway of holiness" (Isa 35:8-10)... Orthodoxy is the"other way" Are you aware that history is continually revised? They are fixing to make poor old John Paul who because of his Parkinsonism could barely stagger around and could not conduct a homily before he died into some kind of a miracle working superman/saint. Future generations will not recognize him as the same man we saw on TV. Along the same lines Priscilla Presley is revising her history with Elvis and this is now in the process of being transformed from the sordid tale of a very beautiful 14yr old teen who Elvis met whilein Germany and was given permission by her starstruck and misguided parents to live at Graceland with the much older Elvis (attending school in TN, while ATST beingsubject to his perverted whims) - until they were married 5-6yrs later - into a sweet andinnocent little love story for one of the Networks - Truth has perished in the streets. jt On Sat, 14 May 2005 08:20:49 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So this is where we respectfully disagree. I believe Jonathan is on the right path and that you are on the wrong path having followed the wrong leaders. But that's okay. God loves you and understands all that make you think and act the way you do. There will be judgment but as His daughter, you will be with Him in eternity. Love, Caroline From: Judy Taylor Jonathan does not follow God's Word Caroline, he is a follower of "Orthodoxy" which during the days of Christ's earthly ministry would have been the Scribes Pharisees - or as Jesus put it, the blind leading the blind. Now back then Jesus told his disciplesto "let them be" but Athanasuis and his cronies in the 4th Century believedthey had found a superior way to deal with those they labelled hereticks such asArius. So their peculiardoctrine and that ofChurch councils that followed became "Orthodoxy" - which BTW has nothing whateverto do with "new wineskins" Jesus baptises with the Holy Spirit and all error has at it's root the other spirit. jt On Fri, 13 May 2005 22:49:17 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Jonathan does not disagree with God's word and he is well versed in what God said in the bible. As JD found out, new wine is poured into new wineskins. Very early in my TT days, my pastor said that I can't change another person's beliefs without giving them something else to believe in. I will add that unless God changed a person, madehim intonew wineskin, new beliefswill causehim to burst. It is self preservation to reject new wine until that transformation happens. I'm referring to us all- by whatever label that's been applied to us - saint, sinner, Christian, anti-whatever, liberal, fundy. godly, godless By the way,this is the label that we (everyone of us here) give ourselves: true Christ followers. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Maybe if you read the bible, instead of fantasy books, you would have a understanding of what God's word has to say on the subject. Why is it that every time one of you Liberals disagrees with God's word of course it is a incorrect reading? Who made you chief editor of God's word? Maybe it is God who has Hardened you Bible Correctors Hearts, as his judgement of your rebellious spirit.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord
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Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following "And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also." (Ex 7:22-23) "But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:15) "Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:19) "And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go." (Ex 8:32) "And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go." (Ex 9:7) "And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken." (Ex 9:34-35) "Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?" (1Sam 6:6)
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It's a different culture, David. You do understand that Britain, Europe, Eurasia, the near/far east, Russia etc. are significantly different cultures, do you not? What may pass as OK in the good old 'shoot 'em up' US of A would not pass of OK in Japan, do you not? Canada ain't America, thank God! - Original Message - From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 14, 2005 12:19 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline wrote: Someone I don't know, trust, believe or even like shouting at me stuff that is offensive to my ears is disturbing my right to peace and quiet and my right to be unmolested and intimidated when I enter my place of worship. Hmmm. Is there a problem with tolerance here? You don't have a right to quietness when you are outside your place of worship (place of worship? -- another topic that needs addressing at another time). When you are inside your place of worship then you have a right to quietness. Those who want quietness in public places do not really believe in free speech. Caroline wrote: What if it wasn't a Street Preacher on the video but Skin Heads, NeoNazis or Satanists cursing you while you're trying to get into a meeting? Cursing is another issue entirely, but if they were out in front of my place of worship rebuking those attending church, that would be just fine. That is what freedom of speech is all about. More than that, I would very much welcome it because it would cause those entering to examine themselves whether they be in the faith. What is dangerous is when you have nobody in society rebuking the sinners within it. Some of the church hypocrites need some rebuking, even if it were to come from Satanists. If you know any who want to rebuke Christians, please send them over to my church meeting place. Caroline wrote: Is there any law in America that you could use to stop them or are they totally protected by the ACLU too? Our Constitution protects the right of speech in public places. Does Canada have any laws that protect free speech? Are most Canadians against free speech? Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
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I agree with Lance and am glad you conduct yourselves as a Christian. How do you deal with the violent and angry sinners? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Lance Muir To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 3:12 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Thanks Kevin. - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 14, 2005 15:42 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I do not chase people down the street, I just preach do one on one discuss teach, answer questions, and or pray with people. If they care not, that is between them God I have discharged my responsibility. I try to conduct myself as a Christian. Try being lied about slandered, put on TV for "calling people whores", having Christians repeat third hand stories they heard, Christians backpeddaling as fast as they can away from you, Dealing with the Authorities, Dealing with the angry sometimes violent sinners I preach all kinds of events and surely do not preach "Hellfire damnation" at the family events I have never been arrested in over 20 years of preaching on a regular basis. I have led a good number of lost to the Lord. I just love telling people about my savior, can't shut my mouth, look what He did for me!ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What Kevin says is not offensive to me in the least. I think when he preaches against sin it is only offensive to sinners. The same word of God either hardens or softens hearts. When I hear someone preach against sin like Kevin does it causes me to want to examine my own life to be sure Im not also in need of repentance for some sin. I doubt that Kevin curses at anyone, or molests anyone. Maybe he can verify that for us. If you hate the ACLU I can agree with that! If Skin Heads, Nazis, etc. are cursing at me thats a whole different matterthey are of satan, and so is cursing and molesting. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline WongSent: Friday, May 13, 2005 9:32 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Someone I don't know, trust, believe or even like shouting at me stuff that is offensive to my ears is disturbing my right to peace and quiet and my right to be unmolested and intimidated when I enter my place of worship. What if it wasn't a Street Preacher on the video but Skin Heads, NeoNazisor Satanists cursing you while you're trying to get into a meeting? Is there any law in America that you could use to stop them or are they totally protected by the ACLU too? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 4:25 PM Subject: RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline, do you believe that public preaching encroaches on your freedom? Izzy Caroline Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We took a leaf from your founding fathers: Your freedom ends when it encroaches mine. Discover Yahoo!Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out!
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BLAINE: Questions for Kevin and Perry: I distinctly recall underwear being waved at General Conference in Salt Lake City, I recall a Mormon man reacting and attacking the wavers; were either of you involved in this?OR Did you condone it? In a message dated 5/14/2005 6:17:13 PM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I agree with Lance and am glad you conduct yourselves as a Christian. How do you deal with the violent and angry sinners? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Lance Muir To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 3:12 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Thanks Kevin. - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 14, 2005 15:42 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I do not chase people down the street, I just preach do one on one discuss teach, answer questions, and or pray with people. If they care not, that is between them God I have discharged my responsibility. I try to conduct myself as a Christian. Try being lied about slandered, put on TV for "calling people whores", having Christians repeat third hand stories they heard, Christians backpeddaling as fast as they can away from you, Dealing with the Authorities, Dealing with the angry sometimes violent sinners I preach all kinds of events and surely do not preach "Hellfire damnation" at the family events I have never been arrested in over 20 years of preaching on a regular basis. I have led a good number of lost to the Lord. I just love telling people about my savior, can't shut my mouth, look what He did for me!ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What Kevin says is not offensive to me in the least. I think when he preaches against sin it is only offensive to sinners. The same word of God either hardens or softens hearts. When I hear someone preach against sin like Kevin does it causes me to want to examine my own life to be sure Im not also in need of repentance for some sin. I doubt that Kevin curses at anyone, or molests anyone. Maybe he can verify that for us. If you hate the ACLU I can agree with that! If Skin Heads, Nazis, etc. are cursing at me thats a whole different matterthey are of satan, and so is cursing and molesting. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline WongSent: Friday, May 13, 2005 9:32 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Someone I don't know, trust, believe or even like shouting at me stuff that is offensive to my ears is disturbing my right to peace and quiet and my right to be unmolested and intimidated when I enter my place of worship. What if it wasn't a Street Preacher on the video but Skin Heads, NeoNazisor Satanists cursing you while you're trying to get into a meeting? Is there any law in America that you could use to stop them or are they totally protected by the ACLU too? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 4:25 PM Subject: RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline, do you believe that public preaching encroaches on your freedom? Izzy Caroline Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We took a leaf from your founding fathers: Your freedom ends when it encroaches mine.
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Truth has perished in the streets. jt And that ain't the only place! Hos 4:1 Hear the word of the LORD, ye children of Israel: for the LORD hath a controversy with the inhabitants of the land, because there is no truth, nor mercy, nor knowledge of God in the land. Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well Caroline, everyone to their own opinion. I would take a lot of comfort in your thoughts if you were the judge, but there is a different standard which isnot near as lax. Yes God understood and loved us enough to send His ONLY begotten Son to pay for our transgressions so that we would not have to continue to wallow in them.So let the redeemed of the Lord say so ...My gospel is the "highway of holiness" (Isa 35:8-10)... Orthodoxy is the"other way" Are you aware that history is continually revised? They are fixing to make poor old John Paul who because of his Parkinsonism could barely stagger around and could not conduct a homily before he died into some kind of a miracle working superman/saint. Future generations will not recognize him as the same man we saw on TV. Along the same lines Priscilla Presley is revising her history with Elvis and this is now in the process of being transformed from the sordid tale of a very beautiful 14yr old teen who Elvis met whilein Germany and was given permission by her starstruck and misguided parents to live at Graceland with the much older Elvis (attending school in TN, while ATST beingsubject to his perverted whims) - until they were married 5-6yrs later - into a sweet andinnocent little love story for one of the Networks - Truth has perished in the streets. jt On Sat, 14 May 2005 08:20:49 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So this is where we respectfully disagree. I believe Jonathan is on the right path and that you are on the wrong path having followed the wrong leaders. But that's okay. God loves you and understands all that make you think and act the way you do. There will be judgment but as His daughter, you will be with Him in eternity. Love, Caroline From: Judy Taylor Jonathan does not follow God's Word Caroline, he is a follower of "Orthodoxy" which during the days of Christ's earthly ministry would have been the Scribes Pharisees - or as Jesus put it, the blind leading the blind. Now back then Jesus told his disciplesto "let them be" but Athanasuis and his cronies in the 4th Century believedthey had found a superior way to deal with those they labelled hereticks such asArius. So their peculiardoctrine and that ofChurch councils that followed became "Orthodoxy" - which BTW has nothing whateverto do with "new wineskins" Jesus baptises with the Holy Spirit and all error has at it's root the other spirit. jt On Fri, 13 May 2005 22:49:17 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Jonathan does not disagree with God's word and he is well versed in what God said in the bible. As JD found out, new wine is poured into new wineskins. Very early in my TT days, my pastor said that I can't change another person's beliefs without giving them something else to believe in. I will add that unless God changed a person, madehim intonew wineskin, new beliefswill causehim to burst. It is self preservation to reject new wine until that transformation happens. I'm referring to us all- by whatever label that's been applied to us - saint, sinner, Christian, anti-whatever, liberal, fundy. godly, godless By the way,this is the label that we (everyone of us here) give ourselves: true Christ followers. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Maybe if you read the bible, instead of fantasy books, you would have a understanding of what God's word has to say on the subject. Why is it that every time one of you Liberals disagrees with God's word of course it is a incorrect reading? Who made you chief editor of God's word? Maybe it is God who has Hardened you Bible Correctors Hearts, as his judgement of your rebellious spirit.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading? Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ differently than you? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we will then look at this text as justifying what we already believe. If we view God as being One who is love (in His very core of being) we will delve in and wrestle with the text (note that the textalso says that Pharoah hardened his own heart etc.) instead of approaching
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Is she patting you on the head? Talk about condescension!Caroline Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So this is where we respectfully disagree. I believe Jonathan is on the right path and that you are on the wrong path having followed the wrong leaders. But that's okay. God loves you and understands all that make you think and act the way you do. There will be judgment but as His daughter, you will be with Him in eternity. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 1:56 AM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Jonathan does not follow God's Word Caroline, he is a follower of "Orthodoxy" which during the days of Christ's earthly ministry would have been the Scribes Pharisees - or as Jesus put it, the blind leading the blind. Now back then Jesus told his disciplesto "let them be" but Athanasuis and his cronies in the 4th Century believedthey had found a superior way to deal with those they labelled hereticks such asArius. So their peculiardoctrine and that ofChurch councils that followed became "Orthodoxy" - which BTW has nothing whateverto do with "new wineskins" Jesus baptises with the Holy Spirit and all error has at it's root the other spirit. jt On Fri, 13 May 2005 22:49:17 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Jonathan does not disagree with God's word and he is well versed in what God said in the bible. As JD found out, new wine is poured into new wineskins. Very early in my TT days, my pastor said that I can't change another person's beliefs without giving them something else to believe in. I will add that unless God changed a person, madehim intonew wineskin, new beliefswill causehim to burst. It is self preservation to reject new wine until that transformation happens. I'm referring to us all- by whatever label that's been applied to us - saint, sinner, Christian, anti-whatever, liberal, fundy. godly, godless By the way,this is the label that we (everyone of us here) give ourselves: true Christ followers. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Maybe if you read the bible, instead of fantasy books, you would have a understanding of what God's word has to say on the subject. Why is it that every time one of you Liberals disagrees with God's word of course it is a incorrect reading? Who made you chief editor of God's word? Maybe it is God who has Hardened you Bible Correctors Hearts, as his judgement of your rebellious spirit.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading? Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ differently than you? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we will then look at this text as justifying what we already believe. If we view God as being One who is love (in His very core of being) we will delve in and wrestle with the text (note that the textalso says that Pharoah hardened his own heart etc.) instead of approaching it with a tentative surface meaning. We all become like the God we adore. Those that adore a hard, vengeful, angry God tend to be hard, vengeful and angry right here on TT. A new approach to people's posts on TT would be beneficial. Before we rush to defend our own opinions with our prooftexts perhaps wrestling with why a person holds a certain belief would be in order. Would it have hurt to see that you may have agreed with Raymond when he says that God softens hearts? Has God ever softened yours? Could you have used that to continue (rather than end) the dialogue? Rather than 10 vacuous posts a day how about just one well-thought, well constructed, and well meaning post? Jonathan Truthtalk Alumnis - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 13, 2005 17:24 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of BothomsSent: Friday, May 13, 2005 2:28 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism David: Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? Raymond: I respectfully disag
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Blaine, Yes. I was the mormon man that attcked the street preacher. That little guy put up a heck of a fight, but he finally converted me. Perry From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Date: Sat, 14 May 2005 23:18:47 EDT BLAINE: Questions for Kevin and Perry: I distinctly recall underwear being waved at General Conference in Salt Lake City, I recall a Mormon man reacting and attacking the wavers; were either of you involved in this? OR Did you condone it? In a message dated 5/14/2005 6:17:13 PM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I agree with Lance and am glad you conduct yourselves as a Christian. How do you deal with the violent and angry sinners? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: _Lance Muir_ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org) Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 3:12 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Thanks Kevin. - Original Message - From: _Kevin Deegan_ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org) Sent: May 14, 2005 15:42 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I do not chase people down the street, I just preach do one on one discuss teach, answer questions, and or pray with people. If they care not, that is between them God I have discharged my responsibility. I try to conduct myself as a Christian. Try being lied about slandered, put on TV for calling people whores, having Christians repeat third hand stories they heard, Christians backpeddaling as fast as they can away from you, Dealing with the Authorities, Dealing with the angry sometimes violent sinners I preach all kinds of events and surely do not preach Hellfire damnation at the family events I have never been arrested in over 20 years of preaching on a regular basis. I have led a good number of lost to the Lord. I just love telling people about my savior, can't shut my mouth, look what He did for me! ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What Kevin says is not offensive to me in the least. I think when he preaches against sin it is only “offensive” to sinners. The same word of God either hardens or softens hearts. When I hear someone preach against sin like Kevin does it causes me to want to examine my own life to be sure I’m not also in need of repentance for some sin. I doubt that Kevin curses at anyone, or molests anyone. Maybe he can verify that for us. If you hate the ACLU I can agree with that! If Skin Heads, Nazi’s, etc. are cursing at me that’s a whole different matter—they are of satan, and so is cursing and molesting. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline Wong Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 9:32 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Someone I don't know, trust, believe or even like shouting at me stuff that is offensive to my ears is disturbing my right to peace and quiet and my right to be unmolested and intimidated when I enter my place of worship. What if it wasn't a Street Preacher on the video but Skin Heads, NeoNazis or Satanists cursing you while you're trying to get into a meeting? Is there any law in America that you could use to stop them or are they totally protected by the ACLU too? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: _ShieldsFamily_ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org) Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 4:25 PM Subject: RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline, do you believe that public preaching encroaches on your freedom? Izzy Caroline Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: We took a leaf from your founding fathers: Your freedom ends when it encroaches mine. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
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Blaine, I was joking, of course, in that last post. You seem to have somehow identified me as a street preacher, although I have never preached on a street in my life. I happen to believe in what they are doing, that is, street evangelism, and admire them for their courage in spreading the word of God. Perry From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Date: Sat, 14 May 2005 23:18:47 EDT BLAINE: Questions for Kevin and Perry: I distinctly recall underwear being waved at General Conference in Salt Lake City, I recall a Mormon man reacting and attacking the wavers; were either of you involved in this? OR Did you condone it? In a message dated 5/14/2005 6:17:13 PM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I agree with Lance and am glad you conduct yourselves as a Christian. How do you deal with the violent and angry sinners? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: _Lance Muir_ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org) Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 3:12 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Thanks Kevin. - Original Message - From: _Kevin Deegan_ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org) Sent: May 14, 2005 15:42 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism I do not chase people down the street, I just preach do one on one discuss teach, answer questions, and or pray with people. If they care not, that is between them God I have discharged my responsibility. I try to conduct myself as a Christian. Try being lied about slandered, put on TV for calling people whores, having Christians repeat third hand stories they heard, Christians backpeddaling as fast as they can away from you, Dealing with the Authorities, Dealing with the angry sometimes violent sinners I preach all kinds of events and surely do not preach Hellfire damnation at the family events I have never been arrested in over 20 years of preaching on a regular basis. I have led a good number of lost to the Lord. I just love telling people about my savior, can't shut my mouth, look what He did for me! ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What Kevin says is not offensive to me in the least. I think when he preaches against sin it is only “offensive” to sinners. The same word of God either hardens or softens hearts. When I hear someone preach against sin like Kevin does it causes me to want to examine my own life to be sure I’m not also in need of repentance for some sin. I doubt that Kevin curses at anyone, or molests anyone. Maybe he can verify that for us. If you hate the ACLU I can agree with that! If Skin Heads, Nazi’s, etc. are cursing at me that’s a whole different matter—they are of satan, and so is cursing and molesting. Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Caroline Wong Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 9:32 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Someone I don't know, trust, believe or even like shouting at me stuff that is offensive to my ears is disturbing my right to peace and quiet and my right to be unmolested and intimidated when I enter my place of worship. What if it wasn't a Street Preacher on the video but Skin Heads, NeoNazis or Satanists cursing you while you're trying to get into a meeting? Is there any law in America that you could use to stop them or are they totally protected by the ACLU too? Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: _ShieldsFamily_ (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org) Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 4:25 PM Subject: RE: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline, do you believe that public preaching encroaches on your freedom? Izzy Caroline Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote: We took a leaf from your founding fathers: Your freedom ends when it encroaches mine. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
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Have you noticed? Raymond is not able to answer any questions! Q What color is your shirt? A I like golf. Q Which way to Canada? A I Drive a chevy.Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following "And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also." (Ex 7:22-23) "But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:15) "Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:19) "And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go." (Ex 8:32) "And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go." (Ex 9:7) "And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken." (Ex 9:34-35) "Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?" (1Sam 6:6) Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & more. Check it out!
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Are you a nut?Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Have you noticed? Raymond is not able to answer any questions! Q What color is your shirt? A I like golf. Q Which way to Canada? A I Drive a chevy.Bothoms [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following "And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also." (Ex 7:22-23) "But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:15) "Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said." (Ex 8:19) "And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go." (Ex 8:32) "And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go." (Ex 9:7) "And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken." (Ex 9:34-35) "Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed?" (1Sam 6:6) Discover Yahoo!Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out!
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Raymond, do you accept the verses below, but reject the verses that say that God hardened Pharaohs heart? Do you think only one can be true, and not both? I accept the truth of ALL of the verses in the Bible. Do you? They are not mutually exclusive. Izzy Ex 9:12 And the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart, and he did not listen to them, just as the LORD had spoken to Moses. Ex 10:1 Then the LORD said to Moses, Go to Pharaoh, for I have hardened his heart and the heart of his servants, that I may perform these signs of Mine among them. Ex 10:20 But the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart, and he did not let the sons of Israel go. Ex 10:20 But the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart, and he was not willing to let them go. Ex 11:10 Moses and Aaron performed all these wonders before Pharaoh; yet the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart, and he did not let the sons of Israel go out of his land. Ex 14:8 The LORD hardened the heart of Pharaoh, king of Egypt, and he chased after the sons of Israel as the sons of Israel were going out boldly. Jn 12:39 40HE HAS BLINDED THEIR EYES AND HE HARDENED THEIR HEART, SO THAT THEY WOULD NOT SEE WITH THEIR EYES AND PERCEIVE WITH THEIR HEART, AND BE CONVERTED AND I HEAL THEM. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bothoms Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 9:20 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Izzy: Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Raymond: Yes, I have read Exodus. Take a look at the following And the magicians of Egypt did so with their enchantments: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, neither did he hearken unto them; as the LORD had said. And Pharaoh turned and went into his house, neither did he set his heart to this also. (Ex 7:22-23) But when Pharaoh saw that there was respite, he hardened his heart, and hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said. (Ex 8:15) Then the magicians said unto Pharaoh, This is the finger of God: and Pharaohs heart was hardened, and he hearkened not unto them; as the LORD had said. (Ex 8:19) And Pharaoh hardened his heart at this time also, neither would he let the people go. (Ex 8:32) And Pharaoh sent, and, behold, there was not one of the cattle of the Israelites dead. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, and he did not let the people go. (Ex 9:7) And when Pharaoh saw that the rain and the hail and the thunders were ceased, he sinned yet more, and hardened his heart, he and his servants. And the heart of Pharaoh was hardened, neither would he let the children Israel go; as the LORD had spoken. (Ex 9:34-35) Wherefore then do ye harden your hearts, as the Egyptians and Pharaoh hardened their hearts? when he had wrought wonderfully among them, did they not let the people go, and they departed? (1Sam 6:6)
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Lance, were you commenting on the posts below or on something entirely irrelevant? Izzy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 10:44 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism It's a different culture, David. You do understand that Britain, Europe, Eurasia, the near/far east, Russia etc. are significantly different cultures, do you not? What may pass as OK in the good old 'shoot 'em up' US of A would not pass of OK in Japan, do you not? Canada ain't America, thank God! - Original Message - From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 14, 2005 12:19 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline wrote: Someone I don't know, trust, believe or even like shouting at me stuff that is offensive to my ears is disturbing my right to peace and quiet and my right to be unmolested and intimidated when I enter my place of worship. Hmmm. Is there a problem with tolerance here? You don't have a right to quietness when you are outside your place of worship (place of worship? -- another topic that needs addressing at another time). When you are inside your place of worship then you have a right to quietness. Those who want quietness in public places do not really believe in free speech. Caroline wrote: What if it wasn't a Street Preacher on the video but Skin Heads, NeoNazis or Satanists cursing you while you're trying to get into a meeting? Cursing is another issue entirely, but if they were out in front of my place of worship rebuking those attending church, that would be just fine. That is what freedom of speech is all about. More than that, I would very much welcome it because it would cause those entering to examine themselves whether they be in the faith. What is dangerous is when you have nobody in society rebuking the sinners within it. Some of the church hypocrites need some rebuking, even if it were to come from Satanists. If you know any who want to rebuke Christians, please send them over to my church meeting place. Caroline wrote: Is there any law in America that you could use to stop them or are they totally protected by the ACLU too? Our Constitution protects the right of speech in public places. Does Canada have any laws that protect free speech? Are most Canadians against free speech? Peace be with you. David Miller. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. -- Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man. (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
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Nickolson to Cruise 'You can't handle the truth'. Hi kids! Can you all say the word 'implosion'? - Original Message - From: Caroline Wong To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 13, 2005 00:11 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Yikes, that old myth. Do you guys want the truth? Can you handle the truth? Then read this article from the Wasthington Post.Charge Often Repeated by U.S. Officials By Doug StruckWashington Post Foreign ServiceSaturday, April 9, 2005; Page A20 TORONTO -- True or false? Shortly before Sept. 11, 2001, several of the terrorists who would carry out the attacks that day slipped into the United States from Canada. Canadian officials are vexed that 3 1/2 years later, they have not dispelled the groundless claim that Canada was a route for the Sept. 11 hijackers. Frank McKenna, the new ambassador to the United States, calls it an "urban myth" and has been trying to beat it down in television interviews and letters to the editor."It took on a life of its own, like a viral infection," McKenna said in a telephone interview from Washington. This lingering headache for Canada underlines the enduring life of inaccuracies in the media and the sensitivity of Canadians to suggestions that their country's long and lightly guarded border is a threat to the United States. "It's something that won't go away," Bill Graham, Canada's defense minister, said of the apocryphal claim in an interview Monday. "We're very resentful . . . because not one suspect had been in Canada. All had been in the U.S., training in the U.S., with valid U.S. visas." The account was born in the first days after the attacks, when reporters and government investigators were scrambling to figure out how the conspirators had carried out the plot. Bernard Etzinger, a Canadian Embassy spokesman, says the "big bang" that started the legend can be traced to two Boston newspapers. A Boston Globe story on Sept. 13 said investigators were "seeking evidence" that the hijackers came through Canada. The Boston Herald reported the same day that federal investigators believed "the terrorist suspects may have traveled . . . by boat" from Canada. On Sept. 14, The Washington Post reported that an unnamed U.S. official had said two suspects "crossed the border from Canada with no known difficulty at a small border entry in Coburn Gore, Maine," and that others may have come through other Maine ports. On Sept. 16, that report was repeated by the New York Post, which also declared that "terrorists bent on wreaking havoc in the United States" had found Canada "the path of least resistance." On Sept. 19, the Christian Science Monitor referred to Canada as "a haven for terrorists." "It was just one of those things where everybody says, 'We all knew that,' and it becomes irrefutable," Etzinger said. In the weeks after the attacks, investigators established that all of the hijackers entered the United States from countries other than Canada, a finding that got the official stamp last summer with the release of the Sept. 11 commission report. But that has not stopped the story from spreading. The Canadian Embassy in Washington keeps a chart of new reports of the rumor. The chart shows that at least three U.S. representatives and one senator have recently repeated the claim. Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton (D-N.Y.) was quoted in October as saying the terrorists had crossed into New York from Canada. Her office disputes the quotes, but they prompted a flurry of outrage and demands in Canada for an apology. "It hurt Canadian feelings, particularly because we thought the Clintons were our pals," said Norman Hillmer, a professor at Carlton University in Ottawa and the author of a book on U.S.-Canadian relations. In August, Rep. Ruben Hinojosa (D-Tex.) declared to a congressional committee -- and repeated in a press release -- that "as we all know, terrorists entered the U.S. from Canada on Sept. 11, 2001, using passports that the Canadians accepted as valid despite the fact that the documents were doctored." The Canadian Embassy filed its now standard protest, and the congressman asked that the remarks be stricken from the committee record. He believed they were true from "some inferences," said his spokeswoman, Ciaran Clayton. "Those inferences were wrong." "Once a story is out there, it gets picked up and repeated," Graham, the defense minister, said with a sigh. "People don't check to see if it's been contradicted." Canadian officials concede that they are sensitive about the matter. "It vexes Canadians, because it's not just an untruth, but
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Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bothoms Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 2:28 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism David: Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? Raymond: I respectfully disagree. The Lord does not hardened hearts; He softens them.
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Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading? Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ differently than you? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we will then look at this text as justifying what we already believe. If we view God as being One who is love (in His very core of being) we will delve in and wrestle with the text (note that the textalso says that Pharoah hardened his own heart etc.) instead of approaching it with a tentative surface meaning. We all become like the God we adore. Those that adore a hard, vengeful, angry God tend to be hard, vengeful and angry right here on TT. A new approach to people's posts on TT would be beneficial. Before we rush to defend our own opinions with our prooftexts perhaps wrestling with why a person holds a certain belief would be in order. Would it have hurt to see that you may have agreed with Raymond when he says that God softens hearts? Has God ever softened yours? Could you have used that to continue (rather than end) the dialogue? Rather than 10 vacuous posts a day how about just one well-thought, well constructed, and well meaning post? Jonathan Truthtalk Alumnis - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 13, 2005 17:24 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of BothomsSent: Friday, May 13, 2005 2:28 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism David: Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? Raymond: I respectfully disagree. The Lord does not hardened hearts; He softens them.
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Maybe if you read the bible, instead of fantasy books, you would have a understanding of what God's word has to say on the subject. Why is it that every time one of you Liberals disagrees with God's word of course it is a incorrect reading? Who made you chief editor of God's word? Maybe it is God who has Hardened you Bible Correctors Hearts, as his judgement of your rebellious spirit.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading? Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ differently than you? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we will then look at this text as justifying what we already believe. If we view God as being One who is love (in His very core of being) we will delve in and wrestle with the text (note that the textalso says that Pharoah hardened his own heart etc.) instead of approaching it with a tentative surface meaning. We all become like the God we adore. Those that adore a hard, vengeful, angry God tend to be hard, vengeful and angry right here on TT. A new approach to people's posts on TT would be beneficial. Before we rush to defend our own opinions with our prooftexts perhaps wrestling with why a person holds a certain belief would be in order. Would it have hurt to see that you may have agreed with Raymond when he says that God softens hearts? Has God ever softened yours? Could you have used that to continue (rather than end) the dialogue? Rather than 10 vacuous posts a day how about just one well-thought, well constructed, and well meaning post? Jonathan Truthtalk Alumnis - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 13, 2005 17:24 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of BothomsSent: Friday, May 13, 2005 2:28 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism David: Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? Raymond: I respectfully disagree. The Lord does not hardened hearts; He softens them. Discover Yahoo! Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news & more. Check it out!
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Jonathan does not disagree with God's word and he is well versed in what God said in the bible. As JD found out, new wine is poured into new wineskins. Very early in my TT days, my pastor said that I can't change another person's beliefs without giving them something else to believe in. I will add that unless God changed a person, madehim intonew wineskin, new beliefswill causehim to burst. It is self preservation to reject new wine until that transformation happens. I'm referring to us all- by whatever label that's been applied to us - saint, sinner, Christian, anti-whatever, liberal, fundy. godly, godless By the way,this is the label that we (everyone of us here) give ourselves: true Christ followers. Love, Caroline - Original Message - From: Kevin Deegan To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 8:44 PM Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Maybe if you read the bible, instead of fantasy books, you would have a understanding of what God's word has to say on the subject. Why is it that every time one of you Liberals disagrees with God's word of course it is a incorrect reading? Who made you chief editor of God's word? Maybe it is God who has Hardened you Bible Correctors Hearts, as his judgement of your rebellious spirit.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading? Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ differently than you? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we will then look at this text as justifying what we already believe. If we view God as being One who is love (in His very core of being) we will delve in and wrestle with the text (note that the textalso says that Pharoah hardened his own heart etc.) instead of approaching it with a tentative surface meaning. We all become like the God we adore. Those that adore a hard, vengeful, angry God tend to be hard, vengeful and angry right here on TT. A new approach to people's posts on TT would be beneficial. Before we rush to defend our own opinions with our prooftexts perhaps wrestling with why a person holds a certain belief would be in order. Would it have hurt to see that you may have agreed with Raymond when he says that God softens hearts? Has God ever softened yours? Could you have used that to continue (rather than end) the dialogue? Rather than 10 vacuous posts a day how about just one well-thought, well constructed, and well meaning post? Jonathan Truthtalk Alumnis - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 13, 2005 17:24 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of BothomsSent: Friday, May 13, 2005 2:28 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism David: Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? Raymond: I respectfully disagree. The Lord does not hardened hearts; He softens them. Discover Yahoo!Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news more. Check it out!
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Izzy in blue: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 4:53 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Izzy, have you considered that your reading of the Lord hardening Pharoah's heart may not be the correct reading?No, as I can read and thats what it says. Do you have an alternative reading of I will harden his heart, that he shall not let the people go? If so, please post it. Would you consider that some may define that _expression_ (_expression_?) differently than you? You mean some may reconstruct what it actually says to suit their own biases? Consider that Raymond may be correctly assessing the heart of God (one who softens instead of hardens) and then approaching the passage in Exodus.Please supply scriptural basis when disagreeing with what scripture says. God does both; not either/or. The eyeglasses one wears always colour our perceptions. No doubt, Jonathanyou are living proof. Our view of God colours how we read Scripture.Our view on the trustworthiness of scripture colors it more. If we view God asOne who hardens hearts we will then look at this text as justifying what we already believe.I have read what the Bible says and believed what God said about it. I did not have a preconceived point of view like you, so I am free to accept what it actually says. If we view God as being One who is love (in His very core of being) we will delve in and wrestle with the text I never wrestle with Gods textI believe it, even when it doesnt say what I want it to. (note that the textalso says that Pharoah hardened his own heart etc.That does not nullify the other scriptures saying that God hardened his heartboth are true. You only accept one.) instead of approaching it with a tentative surface meaning.Please show us your subsurface meaning. We all become like the God we adore.I certainly hope so. Those that adore a hard, vengeful, angry God tend to be hard, vengeful and angry right here on TT.Again you are living proof of your own words. I am not angry, hard or vengeful. You perceive me to be, which tells us more about you than about me. A new approach to people's posts on TT would be beneficial.By and for whom? Before we rush to defend our own opinions with our prooftexts (Where were those? Ohyou mean the Bible? perhaps wrestling with why a person holds a certain belief would be in order. I really dont have time to figure out why everyone on TT believes what they doonly God knows, Im sure. Would it have hurt to see that you may have agreed with Raymond when he says that God softens hearts? God does soften hearts, but He also hardens them, as the Bible says. The SAME message will soften one hart while it hardens anotherever notice that? That is why Gods word is called a Two Edged Sword! Has God ever softened yours?Absolutely. Could you have used that to continue (rather than end) the dialogue? I guess you missed the part where I asked him further questions about why he believes God didnt harden Pharaohs heart? Rather than 10 vacuous posts a day how about just one well-thought, well constructed, and well meaning post? And who is angry, hard, and vengeful? Nice talk, Jonathan. Good thing that God is the One that I depend on for approval; not you. For that reason I dont have to suffer hurt feelings over your scathing comments. Izzy Jonathan Truthtalk Alumnis (Alumnus?) - Original Message - From: ShieldsFamily To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 13, 2005 17:24 Subject: [Bulk] RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Raymond, Have you not read the book of Exodus, or do you just disagree with it when it says the Lord hardened Pharaohs heart? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bothoms Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 2:28 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism David: Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? Raymond: I respectfully disagree. The Lord does not hardened hearts; He softens them.
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Jt:'Every dog..':I'm looking at the clock It's late in the West and early in the South and East. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 12, 2005 02:51 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Fair weather friends want to have their cake and eat it too; if Canada were invaded by an enemy you can bet the US would be invited to the party and fast. Passivity which makes no demands orwaves usually thinks it has lots of friends because it is no threat but sometimes we need to wait and see what happens when the chips are down - every dog has it's day. jt. On Wed, 11 May 2005 23:44:41 -0500 "Caroline Wong" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: There is tremendous grace in Canada. You can do stuff that annoy us. We can disagree on lots of things. We can even decline your kind invitation to join the "coalition of the willing". But we still consider you friends. This is very key. Think about it. Canada has lots of friends. America has few. Like a child in a playground, when America is upset, she cries out, you're not my friend. Canada answers but I'm still yours. Love, Caroline Kevin writes: I just saw a news item When asked who is theirclosest friend Canadians said the USA Americans said EnglandCaroline Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: We took a leaf from your founding fathers: Your freedom ends when it encroaches mine. From: Kevin Deegan What a resounding defense of the freedom you enjoy in CanaDuHCaroline Wong [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: They would probably end up in jail. No ACLU up here. No first amendment. Then they will be able to preach to the "perverts" and "sodomites" in prison. Perhaps that will be God's plan for them. Don't worry, I hear Canadian jailsare kinder and gentler places than American jails. Love, Caroline From: Judy Taylor And that would be your loss Lance ... Pray they will grace Ontario with a visit - jt On Wed, 11 May 2005 15:50:06 -0400 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I wouldn't cross the street to see the 'cow suit' or, for that matter, Kevin. From: Judy Taylor From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]I know Jesus. Kevin is no Jesus. Very bad illustration, Charles Perry Locke. (heretofor 'Chuckie' after the films) The Jesus you know is not the same being Lance. Yours is complacent and has a gospel that was never preached by Paul or any of the apostles. Have youheard Kevin preaching on the streetor areyou judging what you have experienced and giving your opinion re something you know nothing of? I thought the tactics of Chuck Spingola were a little over the top - But have repented of that because -They are out thereI'll go to seeRuben in his cow suit if he ever comes to VA -Waving that underwear getsmore than a yawn :). jt From: "Charles Perry Locke" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lance, do you think Jesus was giving Christianity a "bad rap" when he overturned the moneylenders' tables in the temple? Instead, should he have quoted some 2nd century BC greek philospopher on the existential qualities of selling in the temple, then entered into meaningful dialog about what the philosopher really meant, whether or not it applies today, and then discussed how different interpretations of the scripture (OT) fit in with the philosophy? Lets be Real Christians, okay? From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] It amazes me that could could ask this of Dave, Perry! ,at least without a 'smiley'. Kevin is a jerk and, he comes accross as one (I probably do as well) on TT. I bet he does 'on the street' also. It is such that give chris
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It's no surprize to me, and I suspect to anyone who has been reading you, that this would be your 'take'. It just may be a surprize for you to discover that it is not God's 'take' (proof texting aside). When I think of you, Kevin and the bunch who do what you do, I cannot but think of the assault on the compound housing David Koresh. Many who were innocent died. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 12, 2005 07:23 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline wrote: Did what Kevin et. al. do harden people's hearts and turn them away from Jesus Christ? Then that's bad. Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? What God hates more than hardened hearts is apathy and lukewarmness. God's ministers polarize people, dividing the wicked from the righteous. People need to be pushed toward loving God with all their hearts or toward hardened hearts and a disdain for Christianity. I see this as a good thing. Choose this day whom you will serve, then do it with all your heart. Peace be with you.David Miller.
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My, My, what strange mind convolutions Lance. I would never have put the two together in any way, shape, or form. 1. Kevin and the Street Preachers have no commune 2. Their preaching points to Jesus, not some pre eminent man 3. The assault on the Koresh Compound in Waco TX was lousy leadership permitting the BATF to run amuck On Thu, 12 May 2005 07:59:56 -0400 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: It's no surprize to me, and I suspect to anyone who has been reading you, that this would be your 'take'. It just may be a surprize for you to discover that it is not God's 'take' (proof texting aside). When I think of you, Kevin and the bunch who do what you do, I cannot but think of the assault on the compound housing David Koresh. Many who were innocent died. From: David Miller Caroline wrote: Did what Kevin et. al. do harden people's hearts and turn them away from Jesus Christ? Then that's bad. Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? What God hates more than hardened hearts is apathy and lukewarmness. God's ministers polarize people, dividing the wicked from the righteous. People need to be pushed toward loving God with all their hearts or toward hardened hearts and a disdain for Christianity. I see this as a good thing. Choose this day whom you will serve, then do it with all your heart. Peace be with you.David Miller.
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
And it was the goverment who burnt all those children under the guise of "saving" them. But what does that have to do with me? Don't look now but your Extreme Liberal views are showingLance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's no surprize to me, and I suspect to anyone who has been reading you, that this would be your 'take'. It just may be a surprize for you to discover that it is not God's 'take' (proof texting aside). When I think of you, Kevin and the bunch who do what you do, I cannot but think of the assault on the compound housing David Koresh. Many who were innocent died. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 12, 2005 07:23 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline wrote: Did what Kevin et. al. do harden people's hearts and turn them away from Jesus Christ? Then that's bad. Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? What God hates more than hardened hearts is apathy and lukewarmness. God's ministers polarize people, dividing the wicked from the righteous. People need to be pushed toward loving God with all their hearts or toward hardened hearts and a disdain for Christianity. I see this as a good thing. Choose this day whom you will serve, then do it with all your heart. Peace be with you.David Miller.__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Who is promoting Hate now? Trying to associate me with Koresh - Amazing Who was it the other day tried to fit SP's Hitler in the same sentence? Oh yeah and those Fundamentalists in Geneva It is a good thing you did not say that in CanaDuH they would arrest you Hypocrites!Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's no surprize to me, and I suspect to anyone who has been reading you, that this would be your 'take'. It just may be a surprize for you to discover that it is not God's 'take' (proof texting aside). When I think of you, Kevin and the bunch who do what you do, I cannot but think of the assault on the compound housing David Koresh. Many who were innocent died. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 12, 2005 07:23 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline wrote: Did what Kevin et. al. do harden people's hearts and turn them away from Jesus Christ? Then that's bad. Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? What God hates more than hardened hearts is apathy and lukewarmness. God's ministers polarize people, dividing the wicked from the righteous. People need to be pushed toward loving God with all their hearts or toward hardened hearts and a disdain for Christianity. I see this as a good thing. Choose this day whom you will serve, then do it with all your heart. Peace be with you.David Miller.__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
AND it was done by the Democrats with Janet Reno at the helm (remember; the Liberals in charge). Izzy 3. The assault on the Koresh Compound in Waco TX was lousy leadership permitting the BATF to run amuck
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Lance, you make the ministers of the gospel your enemy. That makes no sense for one who calls himself a Believer. How many souls do you think they must save in order to qualify for your approval? Hundreds? Dozens? One? How many would appease youor does that not matter? Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 6:00 AM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism It's no surprize to me, and I suspect to anyone who has been reading you, that this would be your 'take'. It just may be a surprize for you to discover that it is not God's 'take' (proof texting aside). When I think of you, Kevin and the bunch who do what you do, I cannot but think of the assault on the compound housing David Koresh. Many who were innocent died. - Original Message - From: David Miller To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 12, 2005 07:23 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Caroline wrote: Did what Kevin et. al. do harden people's hearts and turn them away from Jesus Christ? Then that's bad. Why would such be bad? Have you not read how the Lord hardened Pharaoh's heart? Don't you think Jesus himself hardened the hearts of the scholars (both Sadducees and Pharisees) of his day? Was that bad? What God hates more than hardened hearts is apathy and lukewarmness. God's ministers polarize people, dividing the wicked from the righteous. People need to be pushed toward loving God with all their hearts or toward hardened hearts and a disdain for Christianity. I see this as a good thing. Choose this day whom you will serve, then do it with all your heart. Peace be with you. David Miller.
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Reno? Wasn't that the one who raided someones closet to steal a terrified boy to send back to Communist Cuba! Isn't she the one that sent a confidential alert "Project Megiddo,"to Law enforcement about Demestic Terrorists (read -Christians with a literal understanding of the scriptures) don't forget Louie 'Freeah' Christians a 'hate group' http://www.theforbiddenknowledge.com/hardtruth/hate_group_christians.htm "Some groups include apocalyptic Christianity in their ideology and believe we are in, or approaching, a period of violence and social turmoil which will precede the Second Coming of Christ." Unless Reno and Sheridan can show otherwise, McCoy takes this to mean anyone with a literal interpretation of the Bible, especially in regard to scriptures on prophecy, is part and parcel of a hate group. http://permanent.access.gpo.gov/lps3578/www.fbi.gov/library/megiddo/megiddo.pdfhttp://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/apocalypse/readings/project.htmlProject Megiddo http://persecution.homestead.com/A_PS_TheComingPersecution.htmlUS Attorney General Janet Reno has sent a confidential memo to the U.S. attorneys that an investigation would take place against "right wing and fundamentalist Christians." In the event of a wide spread uprising (as in martial law or a national disaster) these individuals must be viewed as "potential terrorists."Janet Reno, former U.S. Attorney General http://www.jerryesmith.com/news/index.php?itemid=47PASTORS MUST BE ORDAINED BY THE IRS ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: AND it was done by the Democrats with Janet Reno at the helm (remember; the Liberals in charge). Izzy 3. The assault on the Koresh Compound in Waco TX was lousy leadership permitting the BATF to run amuck Discover Yahoo! Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM & more. Check it out!
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
I think that some time in the hoosegow (do they still call it that Terry?) would do Kevin a world of good. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 11, 2005 15:58 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism And that would be your loss Lance ... Pray they will grace Ontario with a visit - jt On Wed, 11 May 2005 15:50:06 -0400 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I wouldn't cross the street to see the 'cow suit' or, for that matter, Kevin. From: Judy Taylor From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]I know Jesus. Kevin is no Jesus. Very bad illustration, Charles Perry Locke. (heretofor 'Chuckie' after the films) The Jesus you know is not the same being Lance. Yours is complacent and has a gospel that was never preached by Paul or any of the apostles. Have youheard Kevin preaching on the streetor areyou judging what you have experienced and giving your opinion re something you know nothing of? I thought the tactics of Chuck Spingola were a little over the top - But have repented of that because -They are out thereI'll go to seeRuben in his cow suit if he ever comes to VA -Waving that underwear getsmore than a yawn :). jt From: "Charles Perry Locke" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lance, do you think Jesus was giving Christianity a "bad rap" when he overturned the moneylenders' tables in the temple? Instead, should he have quoted some 2nd century BC greek philospopher on the existential qualities of selling in the temple, then entered into meaningful dialog about what the philosopher really meant, whether or not it applies today, and then discussed how different interpretations of the scripture (OT) fit in with the philosophy? Lets be Real Christians, okay? From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] It amazes me that could could ask this of Dave, Perry! ,at least without a 'smiley'. Kevin is a jerk and, he comes accross as one (I probably do as well) on TT. I bet he does 'on the street' also. It is such that give christianity a bad rep. He probably sees himself as 'suffering for the cause of Christ' whereas it's just the 'jerk factor' in play. Kevin:Speaking JtoJ we ought to keep this in mind. From: "Charles Perry Locke" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dave, I can't understand why you do not hang on every word Kevin posts!He backs up all of his biblical claims with scripture references, and not just one or two, with several to many. He backs up what he claims about the Mormon church with statements from your own non-prophets and leaders.He has a passion for the Lord, and quite evidently has been called to usethis passion, and his knowledge of the Word, to spread the gospel. I would expect him to act no differently on TT than he does on the street. Justbecause he does not fit your idea of what Truth Talk should be does not mean that his exchanges are not meaningful. In fact, in terms of proclaiming the gospel to the unsaved, Kevin is probably doing more on TT than any other poster. He steadfastly sticks to the message, not straying into the pseudo-intellectual realms of so many posts. Those things are often titillating and fun to ponder, but when it comes down to it, either you believe or you don't. Perry From: Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] baptism Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 23:46:44 -0700 DAVEH: Nothing will make for easier discussions, IF one of theparties does not want to have a meaningful exchange, Kevin. I view TT asbeing a place where two or more people of contrasting opinions can explorewhy other's believe differently. I perceive that some TTers (such as yourself) are here not to have a meaningful discussion unless it results in the other person adopting your beliefs. Basically, you want to use TT as aforum to convert people to Christianity as you understand it...is thatcorrect? Assuming so, you probably don't feel a need to find areas of common belief, but rather cut right to the chase and try to overwhelm your opponent with their error of thought/belief as you perceive it. Have I analyzed it correctly, Kevin? I harbor no illusions about changing your anti attitudes, Kevin. But I
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Lance Muir wrote: I think that some time in the hoosegow (do they still call it that Terry?) would do Kevin a world of good. Only in cheap westerns.
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Wasn't it Lance's buddy who left TT after cursing at me? Jail? What are you talking about? Is canaDuH that messed up?Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think that some time in the hoosegow (do they still call it that Terry?) would do Kevin a world of good. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 11, 2005 15:58 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism And that would be your loss Lance ... Pray they will grace Ontario with a visit - jt On Wed, 11 May 2005 15:50:06 -0400 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I wouldn't cross the street to see the 'cow suit' or, for that matter, Kevin. From: Judy Taylor From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]I know Jesus. Kevin is no Jesus. Very bad illustration, Charles Perry Locke. (heretofor 'Chuckie' after the films) The Jesus you know is not the same being Lance. Yours is complacent and has a gospel that was never preached by Paul or any of the apostles. Have youheard Kevin preaching on the streetor areyou judging what you have experienced and giving your opinion re something you know nothing of? I thought the tactics of Chuck Spingola were a little over the top - But have repented of that because -They are out thereI'll go to seeRuben in his cow suit if he ever comes to VA -Waving that underwear getsmore than a yawn :). jt From: "Charles Perry Locke" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lance, do you think Jesus was giving Christianity a "bad rap" when he overturned the moneylenders' tables in the temple? Instead, should he have quoted some 2nd century BC greek philospopher on the existential qualities of selling in the temple, then entered into meaningful dialog about what the philosopher really meant, whether or not it applies today, and then discussed how different interpretations of the scripture (OT) fit in with the philosophy? Lets be Real Christians, okay? From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] It amazes me that could could ask this of Dave, Perry! ,at least without a 'smiley'. Kevin is a jerk and, he comes accross as one (I probably do as well) on TT. I bet he does 'on the street' also. It is such that give christianity a bad rep. He probably sees himself as 'suffering for the cause of Christ' whereas it's just the 'jerk factor' in play. Kevin:Speaking JtoJ we ought to keep this in mind. From: "Charles Perry Locke" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dave, I can't understand why you do not hang on every word Kevin posts!He backs up all of his biblical claims with scripture references, and not just one or two, with several to many. He backs up what he claims about the Mormon church with statements from your own non-prophets and leaders.He has a passion for the Lord, and quite evidently has been called to usethis passion, and his knowledge of the Word, to spread the gospel. I would expect him to act no differently on TT than he does on the street. Justbecause he does not fit your idea of what Truth Talk should be does not mean that his exchanges are not meaningful. In fact, in terms of proclaiming the gospel to the unsaved, Kevin is probably doing more on TT than any other poster. He steadfastly sticks to the message, not straying into the pseudo-intellectual realms of so many posts. Those things are often titillating and fun to ponder, but when it comes down to it, either you believe or you don't. Perry From: Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] baptism Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 23:46:44 -0700 DAVEH: Nothing will make for easier discussions, IF one of theparties does not want to have a meaningful exchange, Kevin. I view TT asbeing a place where two or more people of contrasting opinions can explorewhy other's believe differently. I perceive that some TTers (such as yourself) are here not to have a meaningful discussion unless it results in the other person adopting your beliefs. Basically, you want to use TT as aforum to convert people to Christianity as you understand it...is thatcorrect? Assuming so, you probably don't feel a need to find areas of common belief, but rather cut right to the chase and try to overwhelm your opponent with their error of thought/belief as you perceive it. Have I analyzed it correctly, Kevin? I harbor no illusions about changing your anti attitudes, Kevin. But I am curious as to why you are as you are (and why you believe as you do), if that makes any sense. It's just one of my hang-ups I suppose. So, every now and then you do reveal a bit about yourself, for which I am appreciative. But as I see it, you mostly put up a pretty thick wall hoping to wear your opponents down in their futile efforts toovercome that wall. Then you try to attack their perceived soft spot, hoping for a quick victory. That'll be $250 for your
RE: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Yes. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin Deegan Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 4:55 PM To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism Wasn't it Lance's buddy who left TT after cursing at me? Jail? What are you talking about? Is canaDuH that messed up? Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think that some time in the hoosegow (do they still call it that Terry?) would do Kevin a world of good. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 11, 2005 15:58 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism And that would be your loss Lance ... Pray they will grace Ontario with a visit - jt On Wed, 11 May 2005 15:50:06 -0400 Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I wouldn't cross the street to see the 'cow suit' or, for that matter, Kevin. From: Judy Taylor From: Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] I know Jesus. Kevin is no Jesus. Very bad illustration, Charles Perry Locke. (heretofor 'Chuckie' after the films) The Jesus you know is not the same being Lance. Yours is complacent and has a gospel that was never preached by Paul or any of the apostles. Have youheard Kevin preaching on the streetor areyou judging what you have experienced and giving your opinion re something you know nothing of? I thought the tactics of Chuck Spingola were a little over the top - But have repented of that because -They are out thereI'll go to seeRuben in his cow suit if he ever comes to VA -Waving that underwear getsmore than a yawn :). jt From: Charles Perry Locke [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lance, do you think Jesus was giving Christianity a bad rap when he overturned the moneylenders' tables in the temple? Instead, should he have quoted some 2nd century BC greek philospopher on the existential qualities of selling in the temple, then entered into meaningful dialog about what the philosopher really meant, whether or not it applies today, and then discussed how different interpretations of the scripture (OT) fit in with the philosophy? Lets be Real Christians, okay? From: Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] It amazes me that could could ask this of Dave, Perry! ,at least without a 'smiley'. Kevin is a jerk and, he comes accross as one (I probably do as well) on TT. I bet he does 'on the street' also. It is such that give christianity a bad rep. He probably sees himself as 'suffering for the cause of Christ' whereas it's just the 'jerk factor' in play. Kevin:Speaking JtoJ we ought to keep this in mind. From: Charles Perry Locke [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dave, I can't understand why you do not hang on every word Kevin posts! He backs up all of his biblical claims with scripture references, and not just one or two, with several to many. He backs up what he claims about the Mormon church with statements from your own non-prophets and leaders. He has a passion for the Lord, and quite evidently has been called to use this passion, and his knowledge of the Word, to spread the gospel. I would expect him to act no differently on TT than he does on the street. Just because he does not fit your idea of what Truth Talk should be does not mean that his exchanges are not meaningful. In fact, in terms of proclaiming the gospel to the unsaved, Kevin is probably doing more on TT than any other poster. He steadfastly sticks to the message, not straying into the pseudo-intellectual realms of so many posts. Those things are often titillating and fun to ponder, but when it comes down to it, either you believe or you don't. Perry From: Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] baptism Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 23:46:44 -0700 DAVEH: Nothing will make for easier discussions, IF one of the parties does not want to have a meaningful exchange, Kevin. I view TT as being a place where two or more people of contrasting opinions can explore why other's believe differently. I perceive that some TTers (such as yourself) are here not to have a meaningful discussion unless it results in the other person adopting your beliefs. Basically, you want to use TT as a forum to convert people to Christianity as you understand it...is that correct? Assuming so, you probably don't feel a need to find areas of common belief, but rather cut right to the chase and try to overwhelm your opponent with their error of thought/belief as you perceive it. Have I analyzed it correctly, Kevin? I harbor no illusions about changing your anti attitudes, Kevin. But I am curious as to why you are as you are (and why you believe as you do), if that makes any sense
Re: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism
Perry wrote: In fact, in terms of proclaiming the gospel to the unsaved, Kevin is probably doing more on TT than any other poster. He steadfastly sticks to the message, not straying into the pseudo-intellectual realms of so many posts. Those things are often titillating and fun to ponder, but when it comes down to it, either you believe or you don't. Perry BLAINE: I don't. Not the gospel of traditions, popular gain-sayings, etc., mixed with a few selected scriptures that Kevin teaches, at least. :-) Please note: message attached ---BeginMessage--- Wasn't it Lance's buddy who left TT after cursing at me? Jail? What are you talking about? Is canaDuH that messed up?Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think that some time in the hoosegow (do they still call it that Terry?) would do Kevin a world of good. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: May 11, 2005 15:58 Subject: [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] [TruthTalk] baptism And that would be your loss Lance ... Pray they will grace Ontario with a visit - jt On Wed, 11 May 2005 15:50:06 -0400 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I wouldn't cross the street to see the 'cow suit' or, for that matter, Kevin. From: Judy Taylor From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED]I know Jesus. Kevin is no Jesus. Very bad illustration, Charles Perry Locke. (heretofor 'Chuckie' after the films) The Jesus you know is not the same being Lance. Yours is complacent and has a gospel that was never preached by Paul or any of the apostles. Have youheard Kevin preaching on the streetor areyou judging what you have experienced and giving your opinion re something you know nothing of? I thought the tactics of Chuck Spingola were a little over the top - But have repented of that because -They are out thereI'll go to seeRuben in his cow suit if he ever comes to VA -Waving that underwear getsmore than a yawn :). jt From: "Charles Perry Locke" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lance, do you think Jesus was giving Christianity a "bad rap" when he overturned the moneylenders' tables in the temple? Instead, should he have quoted some 2nd century BC greek philospopher on the existential qualities of selling in the temple, then entered into meaningful dialog about what the philosopher really meant, whether or not it applies today, and then discussed how different interpretations of the scripture (OT) fit in with the philosophy? Lets be Real Christians, okay? From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] It amazes me that could could ask this of Dave, Perry! ,at least without a 'smiley'. Kevin is a jerk and, he comes accross as one (I probably do as well) on TT. I bet he does 'on the street' also. It is such that give christianity a bad rep. He probably sees himself as 'suffering for the cause of Christ' whereas it's just the 'jerk factor' in play. Kevin:Speaking JtoJ we ought to keep this in mind. From: "Charles Perry Locke" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Dave, I can't understand why you do not hang on every word Kevin posts!He backs up all of his biblical claims with scripture references, and not just one or two, with several to many. He backs up what he claims about the Mormon church with statements from your own non-prophets and leaders.He has a passion for the Lord, and quite evidently has been called to usethis passion, and his knowledge of the Word, to spread the gospel. I would expect him to act no differently on TT than he does on the street. Justbecause he does not fit your idea of what Truth Talk should be does not mean that his exchanges are not meaningful. In fact, in terms of proclaiming the gospel to the unsaved, Kevin is probably doing more on TT than any other poster. He steadfastly sticks to the message, not straying into the pseudo-intellectual realms of so many posts. Those things are often titillating and fun to ponder, but when it comes down to it, either you believe or you don't. Perry From: Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] baptism Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 23:46:44 -0700 DAVEH: Nothing will make for easier discussions, IF one of theparties does not want to have a meaningful exchange, Kevin. I view TT asbeing a place where two or more people of contrasting opinions can explorewhy other's believe differently. I perceive that some TTers (such as yourself) are here not to have a meaningful discussion unless it results in the other person adopting your beliefs. Basically, you want to use TT as aforum to convert people to Christianity as you understand it...is thatcorrect? Assuming so, you probably don't feel a need to find areas of common belief, but rather cut right to the chase and try to overwhelm your opponent with their error of thought/belief as you perceive it. Have I analy