Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[James Andrewartha]

On 07/04/16 19:44, Kees Pronk wrote:
> “you could in theory double the airtime available”
>  
> I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a
> few vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.
>  
> Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors
> marketing pages, but how about :
> 
> Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels
> plans (need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable
> DFS channels on every AP but what about false positive radar detects?
> What about the 2 radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so
> send/receive at the same time.
>  
> Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this
> 1.   Innovation
> 2.   Marketing gimmick

My vote is for 2. Marketing gimmick. Why? Because "airtime available"
isn't the limiting factor for 802.11ac performance, it's "distance from
AP" (well, the high SNR required to get the best rates). So I'd much
rather a full-featured AP with a single 5GHz radio than one with two
5GHz or band-selectable radios. That way I can have a nice dense
deployment with low powered APs and waste money on radios I'm not going
to use. Lowering the AP power also increases the possibility of using
40GHz channels without interference from other APs, which again is what
you need to get the most out of 11ac.

Yes, there's an increased cost in cabling and switch ports, but OTOH
they should run off 802.3af power, not 802.3at which would delay having
to upgrade some of our older switches.

In terms of our deployment, we have 1 AP per classroom, and sparser
coverage in other areas. I used to see 75-80% on 5GHz, now it's a bit
lower after I reduced the radio power per vendor recommendation. This is
with primarily Apple devices, which are pretty good at picking 5GHz
without band steering.

Outside of classrooms 2.4GHz is still needed for coverage, it goes
through walls in ways 5GHz can only dream of. I tried using DFS channels
and 40MHz at the start of the year but I was getting a lot of radar
alerts so went back to 20MHz and non-DFS in 5GHz.

-- 
James Andrewartha
Network & Projects Engineer
Christ Church Grammar School
Claremont, Western Australia
Ph. (08) 9442 1757
Mob. 0424 160 877

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UofH - Enterprise Network Admin 3 position (Wi-Fi Services)

[Barrantes, Rita]

Good afternoon Wireless-LAN CG members -

We are looking for a senior Wi-Fi analyst to join our team. The position is 
available at https://jobs.uh.edu/postings/30346 .
The University of Houston is a great place to work with excellent benefits and 
peer environment. Wi-Fi services is a top priority for our students and we are 
constantly looking for ways/ideas to improve our services. We provide network 
services to the UH main campus and several remote locations. We are in the 
middle of a very exciting campus-wide initiative evaluating the latest network 
Wi-Fi/Wired technologies for our campus, so this is indeed a great time to join 
the Wi-Fi team. To know more about us, you can visit http://www.uh.edu/infotech.

You are welcome to apply and/or forward the URL to anyone who may be 
interested. If you have any question about the position, feel free to reach out 
to James Schexneider (Wi-Fi manager) at 
jsche...@central.uh.edu or myself at 
rbarran...@uh.edu. Thanks in advance for your help.

Best,

Rita



___
Rita Barrantes, PhD, PMP
Director, Network Services | UIT TSS
Adjunct Faculty | College of Technology
832-842-4702 | rbarran...@uh.edu
[cid:image001.jpg@01D190F5.E6104BF0]


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RE: Who WiFi vendors does everyone use? REVISITED

[Norman Chu]

McGill University
55,000 unique MAC addresses on a typical day with peak simultaneous clients at 
30,000 devices
4300 Aruba Networks access points
Controller Based
Aruba Airwave Management
Primary SSID eduroam? - No
Guest/Visitor Management system - HP Aruba Clearpass + Homegrown

Norman Chu
Network Analyst - Network Infrastructure group
Systems Engineering - McGill NCS
(514) 398-7299

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Watters, John
Sent: Friday, April 01, 2016 10:06 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] Who WiFi vendors does everyone use? REVISITED

Can we revisit this subject? It seems to have gotten a good number of responses 
but the information is of limited use without other information to go with it.

If folks will send me information on their wireless networks I will tabulate it 
and send it back out to the list.

How about the following info:

School name
Total number of clients served (faculty + staff + students + guess at guests) 
during a typical school day
Brand(s) of APs in use and approximate number of APs for each brand
Whether the APs are standalone or controller based
Wireless management platform (e.g., Cisco Prime, HP Aruba Airwave, none, etc.)


For the University of Alabama I would answer as follows:

The University of Alabama
45,000 clients
Cisco 5,000 APs
Controller based
HP Aruba Airwave management


If others want to suggest additional questions, that is fine as long as we can 
get them soon enough so that most people who respond will have answers to all 
of the questions. Why don't we collect questions until next WED and try to get 
the poll sent out next THU?




-jcw
  [UA Logo]

John Watters   The University of Alabama
Office of Information Technology
205-348-3992


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Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[John Rodkey]

At Westmont we've got the following capabilities reported
802.11g 2.4 - 16 (0.4%)
802.11g 2.4/5 - 16 (0.4%)
802.11n 2.4 - 47 (1.3%)
802.11n 2.4/5 - 1774 (48%)
802.11ac 2.4/5 - 1831 (49%)

Hard to tell, but I think this means 63 2.4GHz (1.7%) and 3621 5GHz (98.3%)

In terms of channel width,
20MHz - 306 ( 8.3%)
40MHz - 996 ( 27%)
80MHz - 2382 (65%)

Would it be a better idea for us to limit our channel width to 40MHz, do
you think?







On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 2:37 PM, Jeffrey D. Sessler 
wrote:

> In our newly renovated residential hall, with dense 5 GHz coverage
> (basically every other room), I’m seeing:
>
> 89% 5GHz
> 11% 2.4GHz
>
> 49% of 5GHz clients are 802.11ac
>
> In areas where we don’t have the dense 5 GHz coverage, it looks more like
> this:
>
> 60% 5GHz
> 40% 2.4GHz
> 35% of 5GHz clients are 802.11ac
>
> Overall, 97% of the 2.4 population is 802.11n. The other 3% being G-only.
>
> Jeff
>
>
>
>
> On 4/7/16, 2:02 PM, "The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group
> Listserv on behalf of Chuck Enfield"  on behalf of chu...@psu.edu> wrote:
>
> >>90% on 5GHz!  That's eye-opening.  I've got some thinking to do.
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv
> >[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Hunter Fuller
> >Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 4:55 PM
> >To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> >Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?
> >
> >On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:31 AM, Chris Adams (IT) 
> >wrote:
> >> PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this
> >> conversation as Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays
> >> for many years now J
> >
> >I'm sure. :) One of our highest density areas has a couple of 8-radio
> Xirrus
> >units to serve a room of 250 students. We are running 2x2GHz radios,
> 5x5GHz
> >radios, and 1 monitor mode radio in these units. The performance is great
> >and we typically see a lot of 5GHz clients when the room is "fully
> loaded."
> >I have attached an example.
> >
> >This is definitely in contrast with what we see generally on campus, as
> >people move all around all the time, we see closer to 50/50, or maybe
> 40/60
> >toward 5GHz.
> >
> >As far as 5GHz radios in close proximity within the same unit - I don't
> >worry about it much. We generally just let auto channel take care of it
> and
> >we seem to be fine.
> >
> >--
> >Hunter Fuller
> >Network Engineer
> >VBRH Annex B-1
> >+1 256 824 5331
> >
> >Office of Information Technology
> >The University of Alabama in Huntsville
> >Systems and Infrastructure
> >
> >**
> >Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent
> >Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
> >
> >**
> >Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent
> Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
>
> **
> Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent
> Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
>
>

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Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Jeffrey D. Sessler]

In our newly renovated residential hall, with dense 5 GHz coverage (basically 
every other room), I’m seeing:

89% 5GHz
11% 2.4GHz

49% of 5GHz clients are 802.11ac

In areas where we don’t have the dense 5 GHz coverage, it looks more like this:

60% 5GHz
40% 2.4GHz
35% of 5GHz clients are 802.11ac

Overall, 97% of the 2.4 population is 802.11n. The other 3% being G-only.

Jeff  




On 4/7/16, 2:02 PM, "The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv on 
behalf of Chuck Enfield"  wrote:

>>90% on 5GHz!  That's eye-opening.  I've got some thinking to do.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
>[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Hunter Fuller
>Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 4:55 PM
>To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
>Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?
>
>On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:31 AM, Chris Adams (IT)  
>wrote:
>> PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this
>> conversation as Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays
>> for many years now J
>
>I'm sure. :) One of our highest density areas has a couple of 8-radio Xirrus 
>units to serve a room of 250 students. We are running 2x2GHz radios, 5x5GHz 
>radios, and 1 monitor mode radio in these units. The performance is great 
>and we typically see a lot of 5GHz clients when the room is "fully loaded." 
>I have attached an example.
>
>This is definitely in contrast with what we see generally on campus, as 
>people move all around all the time, we see closer to 50/50, or maybe 40/60 
>toward 5GHz.
>
>As far as 5GHz radios in close proximity within the same unit - I don't 
>worry about it much. We generally just let auto channel take care of it and 
>we seem to be fine.
>
>--
>Hunter Fuller
>Network Engineer
>VBRH Annex B-1
>+1 256 824 5331
>
>Office of Information Technology
>The University of Alabama in Huntsville
>Systems and Infrastructure
>
>**
>Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent 
>Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
>
>**
>Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
>discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

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RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Chuck Enfield]

>90% on 5GHz!  That's eye-opening.  I've got some thinking to do.

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Hunter Fuller
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 4:55 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:31 AM, Chris Adams (IT)  
wrote:
> PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this
> conversation as Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays
> for many years now J

I'm sure. :) One of our highest density areas has a couple of 8-radio Xirrus 
units to serve a room of 250 students. We are running 2x2GHz radios, 5x5GHz 
radios, and 1 monitor mode radio in these units. The performance is great 
and we typically see a lot of 5GHz clients when the room is "fully loaded." 
I have attached an example.

This is definitely in contrast with what we see generally on campus, as 
people move all around all the time, we see closer to 50/50, or maybe 40/60 
toward 5GHz.

As far as 5GHz radios in close proximity within the same unit - I don't 
worry about it much. We generally just let auto channel take care of it and 
we seem to be fine.

--
Hunter Fuller
Network Engineer
VBRH Annex B-1
+1 256 824 5331

Office of Information Technology
The University of Alabama in Huntsville
Systems and Infrastructure

**
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Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

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Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Hunter Fuller]

On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:31 AM, Chris Adams (IT)  wrote:
> PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as
> Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now J

I'm sure. :) One of our highest density areas has a couple of 8-radio
Xirrus units to serve a room of 250 students. We are running 2x2GHz
radios, 5x5GHz radios, and 1 monitor mode radio in these units. The
performance is great and we typically see a lot of 5GHz clients when
the room is "fully loaded." I have attached an example.

This is definitely in contrast with what we see generally on campus,
as people move all around all the time, we see closer to 50/50, or
maybe 40/60 toward 5GHz.

As far as 5GHz radios in close proximity within the same unit - I
don't worry about it much. We generally just let auto channel take
care of it and we seem to be fine.

--
Hunter Fuller
Network Engineer
VBRH Annex B-1
+1 256 824 5331

Office of Information Technology
The University of Alabama in Huntsville
Systems and Infrastructure

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

RE: Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Smith, Todd]

Here at the Charleston Area Medical Center, we are moving to an 802.11ac Wave 2 
rollout and due to the density requirements, (2 AP coverage at -63dbm, 3rd AP 
at -70) DFS on 5 GHz is mandatory.  We were an early adopter of 802.11a and 
still have some 11a clients around that may or may not support 802.11h.  I was 
very clear to management that some clients were going to have be replaced or 
switched to 2.4 GHz because of the requirements that had been given to me to 
support VoWiFi, VoLTE and high speed data and RTLS.

I know that a hospital is not the same as HigherEd but sometimes hard decisions 
have to be made to move forward.  802.11ac is going to push to DFS pretty 
quickly since the 8 non-DFS channels get used up in high-density deployments 
rapidly.

Todd Smith


From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Chuck Enfield
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 12:25
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

I haven’t read the whole thread, but just in case this wasn’t mentioned, DFS 
channels factor into this decision.  Some clients don’t support any or all DFS 
channels.  If those can fail over to 2.4, then DFS channel use if very 
practical.  If they can’t, you must be far more discriminate with your DFS 
channel use.

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Osborne, Bruce W 
(Network Services)
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 12:07 PM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

B-G-N is 2.4 only, by definition. AC must support 5-Gig

​You have been away from the wireless world for too long.   :D

Bruce Osborne
Wireless Engineer
IT Network Services - Wireless

(434) 592-4229

LIBERTY UNIVERSITY
Training Champions for Christ since 1971

From: Philippe Hanset [mailto:phan...@anyroam.net]
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770
GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C



On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H 
> wrote:

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.
Sent from Outlook 
Mobile


On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:
I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On 

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Chuck Enfield]

I haven’t read the whole thread, but just in case this wasn’t mentioned, DFS 
channels factor into this decision.  Some clients don’t support any or all 
DFS channels.  If those can fail over to 2.4, then DFS channel use if very 
practical.  If they can’t, you must be far more discriminate with your DFS 
channel use.



From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Osborne, Bruce W 
(Network Services)
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 12:07 PM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?



B-G-N is 2.4 only, by definition. AC must support 5-Gig



​You have been away from the wireless world for too long.   :D



Bruce Osborne

Wireless Engineer

IT Network Services - Wireless



(434) 592-4229



LIBERTY UNIVERSITY

Training Champions for Christ since 1971



From: Philippe Hanset [mailto:phan...@anyroam.net]
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?



My ears have been burning…



I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I 
have also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas

because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.



eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.

In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.



Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, 
it might be challenging.



But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?

The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client 
with both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,

or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.



I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.

Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.



Philippe



Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net 
www.eduroam.us 
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C







On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H  > wrote:



I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy 
that applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a 
long way from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move 
forward.

Sent from Outlook Mobile 





On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios"  > wrote:

I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I 
personally think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit 
the global availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 

Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to 
the third department that requests one and you've got none left for 
yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on 
the same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D.  >

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253,  >

**
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Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

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Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent 
Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
 

RE: Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Osborne, Bruce W (Network Services)]

B-G-N is 2.4 only, by definition. AC must support 5-Gig

​You have been away from the wireless world for too long.   :D

Bruce Osborne
Wireless Engineer
IT Network Services - Wireless

(434) 592-4229

LIBERTY UNIVERSITY
Training Champions for Christ since 1971

From: Philippe Hanset [mailto:phan...@anyroam.net]
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770
GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C





On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H 
> wrote:

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.
Sent from Outlook Mobile



On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:
I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. >

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253, 
>

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Jason Wang]

We're also seeing a 50-50 split as far as associations go, but for 
actual usage (based on data transferred), things do look a bit more 
promising.


Associations:
- 51% @ 5GHz (32% .11n, 17% .11ac, 2% .11a)
- 49% @ 2.4GHz (36% .11n, 13% .11g)

Usage (Data Transferred):
- 66% @ 5GHz (34% .11n, 32% .11ac)
- 34% @ 2.4GHz (32% .11n, 2% .11g)


As for turning off 2.4GHz, we've done so in certain areas where we have 
higher-density coverage (eg. larger classrooms that may have a dozen 
WAPs in them). In general, we leave both radios on. To help with the 
2.4GHz situation, though, we have disabled all data rates below 12Mbps 
to improve efficiency for remaining 802.11g/n users.


We've also considered doing separate SSID's for 2.4GHz and 5GHz but 
ultimately decided against it due to end-user support issues. Our 5GHz 
and 2.4GHz coverage footprints aren't identical, and one observation we 
had was that some devices would tend to prefer staying on or 
reconnecting to the same SSID. So, once a device got on 2.4GHz, it may 
require the user to manually move back to 5GHz (vs. just having both 
frequencies available and hoping the device will automatically select 5GHz).


Jason


On 04/07/2016 08:24 AM, Hector J Rios wrote:


I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the 
percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us 
is still 50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new 
laptops that only come with 2.4GHz adapters.


I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, 
but I don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.


Hector Rios

Louisiana State University

*From:*The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Perry Correll

*Sent:* Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
*To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
*Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other 
vendors supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, 
even up to 95% clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the 
advancement of SDR capabilities enables IT administrators to more 
efficiently and effectively address this evolution. However Wi-Fi in 
the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon either


Best Regards,

Perry


*Perry Correll*  | /Xirrus Principal Technologist/


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726

*From:*The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Chris Adams 
(IT)

*Sent:* Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
*To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 


*Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Kees,

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with 
multiple 5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same 
device will be a more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am 
in the process of getting a few AP250 to throw into a few of our 
smaller auditoriums, which should be a good test of their performance.


I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how 
well the deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, 
which eliminates many of the spectrum and channel availability issues 
found with 40mhz+ channel widths.


PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this 
conversation as Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays 
for many years now J


Thanks,

**

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services

Division of Information Technology

University of North Georgia

*From:*The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Kees Pronk

*Sent:* Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
*To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 


*Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a 
few vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.


Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors 
marketing pages, but how about :


Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your 
channels plans (need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you 
must enable DFS channels on every AP but what about false positive 
radar detects? What about the 2 radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while 
trying so send/receive at the same time.


Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this

1.Innovation

2.Marketing gimmick

(pick one ;-)

Best regards, Kees

*Van:*The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *Namens *Larry Dougher

*Verzonden:* donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
*Aan:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 

RE: Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Osborne, Bruce W (Network Services)]

A separate 5-Gig SSID might work now, but we had issues back in 2009. We had a 
5-Gig only 802.11n SSID that supported IPTV Multicast.

We then got complaints from all those with b/g/n clients so we retired that 
SSID.

​

Bruce Osborne
Wireless Engineer
IT Network Services - Wireless

(434) 592-4229

LIBERTY UNIVERSITY
Training Champions for Christ since 1971

From: Turner, Ryan H [mailto:rhtur...@email.unc.edu]
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 9:48 AM
Subject: Re: Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

As I am approaching the problem, I think there is a middle ground…  The middle 
ground is you elevate one SSID to 5 Gig only, and have a secondary SSID as 2.4. 
 In our situation, it would mean eduroam would be 5 and UNC-PSK would be 2.4 
and 5.  It creates an incentive for individuals to upgrade devices.  Also, 
since 2.4 is so cluttered, I think it makes troubleshooting easier to always 
know that if a client calls with an issue, you can know they were on the 5 gig 
band if they attached to one SSID.  Makes isolating the cause of the issue and 
replicating the issue much easier.

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Jerry Bucklaew
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 9:41 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

We are seeing the same, about 50/50


I would argue you are not going to turn off 2.4GHZ for a very long time.   It 
will take a while to get  all clients over to 5 GHZ.I see 2.4ghz becoming 
the place we put all the "Low bandwidth Non traditional" stuff.   You can leave 
your HVAC, Cameras, Controls, Specialty SSID's, Old clients, weird 
stuff.All on 2.4GHZ.  For most people who are not building new, we already 
paid for the 2.4GHZ radios.  Why not use the radios and bandwidth?   As people 
move to 5GHZ,  2.4GHZ will actually clear up and become a very usable choice, 
especially for low bandwidth stuff.
On 04/07/2016 09:24 AM, Hector J Rios wrote:
I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the 
percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us is still 
50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new laptops that only 
come with 2.4GHz adapters.

I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, but I 
don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.

[cid:image001.png@01D190C5.22D386A0]

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Perry Correll
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other vendors 
supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, even up to 95% 
clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the advancement of SDR capabilities 
enables IT administrators to more efficiently and effectively address this 
evolution. However Wi-Fi in the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon 
either

Best Regards,
Perry


Perry Correll  |  Xirrus Principal Technologist


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726




From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Chris Adams (IT)
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Kees,

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with multiple 
5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same device will be a 
more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am in the process of getting a 
few AP250 to throw into a few of our smaller auditoriums, which should be a 
good test of their performance.

I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how well the 
deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, which eliminates many 
of the spectrum and channel availability issues found with 40mhz+ channel 
widths.

PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as 
Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now ☺

Thanks,

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Kees Pronk
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Chris Murphy]

In my poking around, if a device says "B,G,N" it's always been 2.4GHz only, 
"A,B,G,N" or anything saying "AC" is safely dual-band.  Of course, if it 
doesn't even say THAT much I'm not sure I'd want to buy it…  :)

-Chris

==
Chris Murphy
Business Analyst
MIT Information Services & Technology
Room W92-191
77 Massachusetts Avenue
Cambridge, MA  02139
ch...@mit.edu
617-253-4105

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
> 
on behalf of "Danner, Mearl" >
Reply-To: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
>
Date: Thursday, April 7, 2016 at 11:26 AM
To: 
"WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU" 
>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

That's a good point Phillipe. Had to recently shop for a laptop for a relative 
to use at school. Had to open up Device Manager to find the wireless card 
description.

It appears that at about the $400 price point is the split between single band 
and dual band wireless cards.

Mearl

Sent from my Android phone using Symantec TouchDown (www.symantec.com)

-Original Message-
From: Philippe Hanset [phan...@anyroam.net]
Received: Thursday, 07 Apr 2016, 9:37AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
[WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU]
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C






On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H 
> wrote:

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.

Sent from Outlook Mobile




On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:

I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. >

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Danner, Mearl]

That's a good point Phillipe. Had to recently shop for a laptop for a relative 
to use at school. Had to open up Device Manager to find the wireless card 
description.

It appears that at about the $400 price point is the split between single band 
and dual band wireless cards.

Mearl

Sent from my Android phone using Symantec TouchDown (www.symantec.com)

-Original Message-
From: Philippe Hanset [phan...@anyroam.net]
Received: Thursday, 07 Apr 2016, 9:37AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU [WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU]
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C






On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H 
> wrote:

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.

Sent from Outlook Mobile




On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:

I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. >

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253, 
>

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Jeffrey D. Sessler]

My experience with Mac OS is that while you may start out on 2.4, it will move 
itself to 5 given a bit of time – that’s assuming the vendor-specific 
band/ap-steering isn’t mucking with it, and the 5 radio is running in 40-wide.

I see this when students roll into the residence halls after dinner. Lots of 
clients start on 2.4, but within a short period all of those stationary Macs 
are then sitting on 5 GHz.

Jeff

From: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
> 
on behalf of Philippe Hanset >
Reply-To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Date: Thursday, April 7, 2016 at 8:02 AM
To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

The Wi-Fi deployment is definitely a big part of the equation but so it the 
“sticky client”. I’m writing this email just above a nice dual band 
Access-Point with an observed RSSI of -55dBm on my Macbook Pro,
and I’m on 2.4 GHz :(  (I started my journey far away from that same AP…)

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C






On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:43 AM, Chris Adams (IT) 
> wrote:

Phillipe,

I would suggest that it’s not always an issue of the client not supporting 
5ghz, but rather that some deployments are not conducive to good 5ghz 
propagation – we’ve all seen WAPs in hallways between classrooms before. In my 
experience, clients that associate to 2.4ghz are doing so due to lack of good 
5ghz signal, and less so due to client radios.

Thanks,

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Philippe Hanset
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 10:37 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770
GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C





On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H 
> wrote:

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.
Sent from Outlook Mobile



On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:
I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Philippe Hanset]

Chris,

The Wi-Fi deployment is definitely a big part of the equation but so it the 
“sticky client”. I’m writing this email just above a nice dual band 
Access-Point with an observed RSSI of -55dBm on my Macbook Pro,
and I’m on 2.4 GHz :(  (I started my journey far away from that same AP…)

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C






> On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:43 AM, Chris Adams (IT)  wrote:
> 
> Phillipe,
> 
> I would suggest that it’s not always an issue of the client not supporting 
> 5ghz, but rather that some deployments are not conducive to good 5ghz 
> propagation – we’ve all seen WAPs in hallways between classrooms before. In 
> my experience, clients that associate to 2.4ghz are doing so due to lack of 
> good 5ghz signal, and less so due to client radios.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Chris Adams, CISSP
> 
> Director, Network & Telecom Services
> Division of Information Technology
> University of North Georgia
> 
> From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
> [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
> ] On Behalf Of Philippe Hanset
> Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 10:37 AM
> To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
> 
> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?
> 
> My ears have been burning…
> 
> I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I 
> have also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
> because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
> eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.
> 
> eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
> school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
> In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
> locations.
> 
> Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, 
> it might be challenging.
> 
> But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
> The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client 
> with both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
> or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
> know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.
> 
> I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
> “Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
> Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.
> 
> Philippe
> 
> Philippe Hanset
> www.anyroam.net 
> www.eduroam.us 
> +1 (865) 236-0770
> 
> GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H  > wrote:
> 
> I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy 
> that applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a 
> long way from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.
> 
> Sent from Outlook Mobile 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios"  > wrote:
> 
> I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I 
> personally think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit 
> the global availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.
> 
> Hector Rios
> Louisiana State University
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
> [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
> ] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
> To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
> 
> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?
> 
> On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> > We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> > departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> > that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> > So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> > and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> > worked well and we can play together nicely
> 
> What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to 
> the third department that requests one and you've got none left for 
> yourselves?
> 
> And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on 
> the same frequency?
> 
> Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)
> 
> Matthew
> 
> 
> --
> Matthew Newton, Ph.D. >
> 
> Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
> Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom
> 
> For IT help 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Jeffrey D. Sessler]

I would add that band selection is far more complicated when a device is moving 
then when stationary. In the case of some mobile devices, they will prefer a 
2.4 anchor just to lesson the number of times they have to roam re-associate 
i.e. Maintain that WiFi call.

Jeff

From: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
> 
on behalf of "Chris Adams (IT)" 
>
Reply-To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Date: Thursday, April 7, 2016 at 7:43 AM
To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Phillipe,

I would suggest that it’s not always an issue of the client not supporting 
5ghz, but rather that some deployments are not conducive to good 5ghz 
propagation – we’ve all seen WAPs in hallways between classrooms before. In my 
experience, clients that associate to 2.4ghz are doing so due to lack of good 
5ghz signal, and less so due to client radios.

Thanks,

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Philippe Hanset
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 10:37 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770
GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C





On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H 
> wrote:

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.
Sent from Outlook Mobile



On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:
I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Turner, Ryan H]

Well, we went to eduroam as our primary last fall.  There are many clients that 
don't support advanced EAP types, so we removed our duplicative EAP-tls SSID 
leaving 3 major SSIDs.  Eduroam, UNC-psk and our onboarding SSID.

Ryan Turner
Senior Network Engineer, ITS
The University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
+1 919 274 7926 Mobile
+1 919 445 0113 Office

On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:52 AM, Jeffrey D. Sessler 
> wrote:

On the eduroam question, our consortium think at this point is to abandon our 
“branded” SSID in favor of eduroam. I’ve yet to find a compelling technical 
reason to continue support of a branded SSID in addition to eduroam, so it sort 
of forces the need to continue support of both 2.4 and 5 – and it keeps eduroam 
from becoming a red-headed-step-child to the branded SSID.

Jeff

From: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
> 
on behalf of Philippe Hanset >
Reply-To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Date: Thursday, April 7, 2016 at 7:36 AM
To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C






On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H 
> wrote:

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.

Sent from Outlook Mobile




On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:

I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. >

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253, 
>

**

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Jeffrey D. Sessler]

On the eduroam question, our consortium think at this point is to abandon our 
“branded” SSID in favor of eduroam. I’ve yet to find a compelling technical 
reason to continue support of a branded SSID in addition to eduroam, so it sort 
of forces the need to continue support of both 2.4 and 5 – and it keeps eduroam 
from becoming a red-headed-step-child to the branded SSID.

Jeff

From: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
> 
on behalf of Philippe Hanset >
Reply-To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Date: Thursday, April 7, 2016 at 7:36 AM
To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C






On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H 
> wrote:

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.

Sent from Outlook Mobile




On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:

I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. >

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253, 
>

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

** Participation and subscription 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Trinklein, Jason R]

According to our management console, on our campus more than 11% of client 
stations are 2.4GHz capable only, and incapable of 5GHz.
--
Jason Trinklein
Wireless Engineering Manager
College of Charleston
81 St. Philip Street | Office 311D | Charleston, SC 29403
trinkle...@cofc.edu | Office - (843) 300-8009

From: Philippe Hanset >
Reply-To: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
>
Date: Thu, 7 Apr 2016 10:36:58 -0400
To: 
>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations.

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C






On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H 
> wrote:

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.

Sent from Outlook 
Mobile




On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:

I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. >

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253, 
>

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at 
http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and 

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Chris Adams (IT)]

Phillipe,

 

I would suggest that it’s not always an issue of the client not supporting 
5ghz, but rather that some deployments are not conducive to good 5ghz 
propagation – we’ve all seen WAPs in hallways between classrooms before. In my 
experience, clients that associate to 2.4ghz are doing so due to lack of good 
5ghz signal, and less so due to client radios.

 

Thanks,

 

Chris Adams, CISSP

 

Director, Network & Telecom Services

Division of Information Technology

University of North Georgia

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Philippe Hanset
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 10:37 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

 

My ears have been burning…

 

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas

because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

 

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.

In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations. 

 

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

 

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?

The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,

or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

 

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.

Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.

 

Philippe

 

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net  
www.eduroam.us  
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C






 

On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H  > wrote:

 

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.  

Sent from Outlook Mobile  

 





On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios"  > wrote:

I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
 
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with 
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take 
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs, 
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has 
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D.  >

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253,  >

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
Constituent Group discussion list can be found at  
 http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

 

** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
http://www.educause.edu/groups/. 


**
Participation and subscription 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Philippe Hanset]

My ears have been burning…

I understand Hector's comment about the spirit of eduroam, but like Ryan I have 
also be tempted in the past to only support 5 GHz in certain areas
because 2.4 GHz was becoming too much of a pain (e.g. Dormitories).  The 
eduroam Compliance Statement requires 802.11, no frequency mentioned.

eduroam users with 2.4GHz devices will just not see the available SSID if a 
school decides to only offer it at 5 GHz in certain locations.
In a sense it is no different than schools only offering eduroam in certain 
locations. 

Now, if the entire eduroam SSID for all locations at the school is on 5 GHz, it 
might be challenging.

But how many clients REALLY can’t support 5 GHz?
The stats showing 2.4 GHz VS 5 GHz usage can be deceiving. Is it a client with 
both radios and a poor selection of spectrum,
or is it really 2.4 Ghz only capable devices? It seems that the best way to 
know if 5 GHz only is fine for your community is to “just do it”.

I checked cheap laptops at BestBuy and under specifications you find 
“Wireless-AC” or “Wireless-B, G, N". No reference to the type of radio.
Those darn marketing people, they will get you every time.
 
Philippe

Philippe Hanset
www.anyroam.net
www.eduroam.us
+1 (865) 236-0770

GPG key id: 0xF2636F9C






> On Apr 7, 2016, at 10:04 AM, Turner, Ryan H  wrote:
> 
> I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy 
> that applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a 
> long way from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move 
> forward.  
> 
> Sent from Outlook Mobile 
> 
> 
> 
> On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios"  > wrote:
> 
> I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I 
> personally think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit 
> the global availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.
> 
> Hector Rios
> Louisiana State University
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
> [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
> ] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
> Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
> To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
> 
> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?
> 
> On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> > We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with 
> > departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take 
> > that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> > So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs, 
> > and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has 
> > worked well and we can play together nicely
> 
> What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to 
> the third department that requests one and you've got none left for 
> yourselves?
> 
> And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on 
> the same frequency?
> 
> Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)
> 
> Matthew
> 
> 
> --
> Matthew Newton, Ph.D. >
> 
> Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
> Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom
> 
> For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253,  >
> 
> **
> Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent 
> Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/ 
> .
> 
> **
> Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent 
> Group discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/ 
> .
> ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
> Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
> http://www.educause.edu/groups/ .


**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Jeffrey D. Sessler]

I’ve yet to see anyone in EDU approach seamless 5 coverage, and looking at a 
report of current 2.4/5 client anchoring won’t tell the whole story. You’d need 
to focus more on association reports to see what percentage of time a client is 
on 2.4 vs 5 over a wide time period. In one of our recently renovated 
residential building, when in their room/suite, the near majority of clients 
sit on 5 (no band steering involved), but when those devices start moving 
outside of the room, down halls, and out into courtyards, what band they anchor 
to can be unpredictable despite a “shock and awe” of access points. It’s simply 
impossible to predict, and as such, 2.4 is going to serve a “filler” role for a 
very long time.

I think Cisco has the right answer with the software defined radio, 
specifically taking it the extra step to make the radio dynamically adjust 
between 2.4/5 as the conditions warrant. It puts the complexity of RF 
engineering the hands of the software, and unlike a manual process of setting 
it based on a point-in-time need, it’s going to continually adjust. Coupled 
with the dynamic channel width, you’re going to get the best possible client 
experience without having to continuously turn knobs – unless turning knobs 
provides some sort of job security. :)

Jeff

From: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
> 
on behalf of "Turner, Ryan H" 
>
Reply-To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Date: Thursday, April 7, 2016 at 6:47 AM
To: 
"wireless-lan@listserv.educause.edu" 
>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

As I am approaching the problem, I think there is a middle ground…  The middle 
ground is you elevate one SSID to 5 Gig only, and have a secondary SSID as 2.4. 
 In our situation, it would mean eduroam would be 5 and UNC-PSK would be 2.4 
and 5.  It creates an incentive for individuals to upgrade devices.  Also, 
since 2.4 is so cluttered, I think it makes troubleshooting easier to always 
know that if a client calls with an issue, you can know they were on the 5 gig 
band if they attached to one SSID.  Makes isolating the cause of the issue and 
replicating the issue much easier.

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Jerry Bucklaew
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 9:41 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

We are seeing the same, about 50/50


I would argue you are not going to turn off 2.4GHZ for a very long time.   It 
will take a while to get  all clients over to 5 GHZ.I see 2.4ghz becoming 
the place we put all the "Low bandwidth Non traditional" stuff.   You can leave 
your HVAC, Cameras, Controls, Specialty SSID's, Old clients, weird 
stuff.All on 2.4GHZ.  For most people who are not building new, we already 
paid for the 2.4GHZ radios.  Why not use the radios and bandwidth?   As people 
move to 5GHZ,  2.4GHZ will actually clear up and become a very usable choice, 
especially for low bandwidth stuff.
On 04/07/2016 09:24 AM, Hector J Rios wrote:
I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the 
percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us is still 
50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new laptops that only 
come with 2.4GHz adapters.

I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, but I 
don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.

[cid:image001.png@01D190B2.811747A0]

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Perry Correll
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other vendors 
supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, even up to 95% 
clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the advancement of SDR capabilities 
enables IT administrators to more efficiently and effectively address this 
evolution. However Wi-Fi in the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon 
either

Best Regards,
Perry


Perry Correll  |  Xirrus Principal Technologist


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726




From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Chris Adams 

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Thomas Carter]

We’re a fairly small campus, but we have almost a 50/50 split:
na – 34%
ng – 24%
a  - 22%
g – 20%

so that gives 56% on 5GHz and 44% on 2.4GHz.


Thomas Carter
Network & Operations Manager
Austin College

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Hector J Rios
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 8:24 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the 
percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us is still 
50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new laptops that only 
come with 2.4GHz adapters.

I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, but I 
don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.

[cid:image001.png@01D190AE.46186C50]

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Perry Correll
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other vendors 
supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, even up to 95% 
clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the advancement of SDR capabilities 
enables IT administrators to more efficiently and effectively address this 
evolution. However Wi-Fi in the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon 
either

Best Regards,
Perry


Perry Correll  |  Xirrus Principal Technologist


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726




From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Chris Adams (IT)
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Kees,

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with multiple 
5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same device will be a 
more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am in the process of getting a 
few AP250 to throw into a few of our smaller auditoriums, which should be a 
good test of their performance.

I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how well the 
deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, which eliminates many 
of the spectrum and channel availability issues found with 40mhz+ channel 
widths.

PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as 
Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now ☺

Thanks,

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Kees Pronk
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a few 
vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.

Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors marketing 
pages, but how about :
Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels plans 
(need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable DFS channels 
on every AP but what about false positive radar detects? What about the 2 
radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so send/receive at the same time.

Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this

1.   Innovation

2.   Marketing gimmick
(pick one ;-)

Best regards, Kees

Van: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] Namens Larry Dougher
Verzonden: donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
Aan: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Onderwerp: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Thanks Chris!


Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+ | 
Twitter | 
LinkedIn | 802.674.8336

On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 2:45 PM, Chris Adams (IT) 
> wrote:
Larry,

We have deployed 802.11ac WAPs in many locations, but only have 80mhz channels 
enabled sparingly around campus. My hope is that by 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Turner, Ryan H]

I don't think so.  I think anytime a university enforces a uniform policy that 
applies to all folks, it shouldn't be an issue.  Of course, we are a long way 
from actually doing this.  We'll involve Phillipe if we move forward.

Sent from Outlook Mobile




On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 7:01 AM -0700, "Hector J Rios" 
> wrote:

I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs,
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. 

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253, 

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Hector J Rios]

I would go back to Jason's comment and reference eduroam's policy. I personally 
think that only allowing 5GHz on eduroam goes against the spirit the global 
availability of eduroam. My 2 cents.

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:54 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with 
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take 
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs, 
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has 
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. 

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253, 

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Joseph M. Karam]

Good point, Matthew.  Luckily this was a small scale change we made and has 
worked well so far for the departments involved.  This would not work at all 
for a complicated setup with many potential conflicts.

Joe



-Original Message-
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Matthew Newton
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 9:54 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with 
> departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take 
> that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their labs, 
> and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So far it has 
> worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz channel to the 
third department that requests one and you've got none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their APs are on the 
same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


--
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. 

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services, I.T. Services, University of 
Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253, 

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] backhaul wifi comparison/suggestions

[Jake Snyder]

A couple suggestions on using low end devices for PTP.  These are directed at 
the UBNT line specifically, but are probably good advice for most outdoor 
installs.

Keep a spare.  Cheap doesn't happen by chance.  My experience with UBNT is that 
the cheaper the product, the higher the likely hood of hardware failures. If 
I'm using their products, I typically go for higher end models.  Regardless, if 
you can't tolerate a long RMA with a site down, keep a spare on hand.

Thoroughly test on the bench.  Before you put that bridge up, make sure you 
test it.  Backup configs and software images.  Once you are positive it works 
flawlessly, deploy it and "Never touch it again."  This was sage advice given 
my by a WISP that deployed UBNT. There have been a lot of times that features 
come and go in different versions, or work radically different.  Keep your 
config and software versions matched on your spare and make sure you have the 
software files saved someplace.

Keep purchase paperwork.  Warranty issues may require you to prove your 
purchase date.  Make sure you can show your purchase date, otherwise they may 
try to use the date it was sold into distribution. 

Thanks
Jake Snyder


Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 7, 2016, at 6:45 AM, Gregg Heimer  wrote:
> 
> I recommend the Ubiquiti PowerBeam for a 4-5 Mile link, 5GHz, up to 650Mbps 
> throughput.  About $85.00 per end.
>  
>  
>  
> From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
> [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Moore, Brandon
> Sent: Wednesday, April 6, 2016 2:12 PM
> To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] backhaul wifi comparison/suggestions
>  
> Anyone have long distance sites such as 4 or 5 miles?  We have a set of old 
> Cisco 1410 bridges to replace shortly.  Trees in the way, so no free space 
> optics option.  
>  
> Brandon
>  
> From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
> [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Hector J Rios
> Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2016 1:18 PM
> To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] backhaul wifi comparison/suggestions
>  
> I also recommend the Ubiquiti LocoM5. Affordable, easy to configure, and easy 
> to manage. You could also look into MikroTik. They are very versatile, 
> affordable, but can be a little challenging to configure.
>  
> Hector Rios
> Louisiana State University
>  
> From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
> [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Gregg Heimer
> Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2016 9:04 AM
> To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] backhaul wifi comparison/suggestions
>  
> Ubiquiti LocoM5 (5GHz – 300Mbps throughput) is the product you want.  You can 
> get them for about $55 through your reseller.  They are designed as CPE 
> devices, but work fine for PTP applications.  They are weatherproof and work 
> well indoors or outdoors.  We use them to supply network connectivity to job 
> trailers for construction projects around campus.  You can use AirView2 to 
> manage all of them, there are no license fees for the device or the 
> management software.  I highly recommend Ubiquiti, we have about 12 of their 
> devices on our production network from the locoM5 to the AirFiber units. 
>  
> If you need more throughput use the Ubiquiti NanoBeam AC, ($89).  This will 
> provide around 650Mbps throughput and is the size of a flood light. 
>  
>  
> LocoM5: https://www.ubnt.com/airmax/nanostationm/
>  
> NanoBeam AC: https://www.ubnt.com/airmax/nanobeam-ac/
>  
>  
> AirView2 Software:
> 
>  
> From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
> [mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of John Rodkey
> Sent: Tuesday, April 5, 2016 5:36 PM
> To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> Subject: [WIRELESS-LAN] backhaul wifi comparison/suggestions
>  
> I have need for a fairly inexpensive,  low bandwidth (10Mbps), short distance 
> (<200 ft)  point to point wireless connection .
> I am aware of the Cambrium ePMP 1000 and Ubiquiti nano.
> 
> Would anyone like to compare these items or propose other good solutions to 
> this type of situation?
> 
> John
> ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
> Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
> http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
>  
> 
> Montgomery County Community College is proud to be designated as an Achieving 
> the Dream Leader College for its commitment to student access and success.
> ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
> Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
> http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
> ** Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE 
> Constituent Group discussion list can be found at 
> http://www.educause.edu/groups/.
> ** Participation and subscription information for this 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Matthew Newton]

On Thu, Apr 07, 2016 at 01:27:04PM +, Joseph M. Karam wrote:
> We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work
> with departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space,
> then we take that channel out of our central infrastructure.
> So, for example we gave engineering channel 6 for all of their
> labs, and we took that out of our central infrastructure.  So
> far it has worked well and we can play together nicely

What do you do after you've given the last remaining free 2.4Ghz
channel to the third department that requests one and you've got
none left for yourselves?

And presumably Engineering have lots of CCI because all of their
APs are on the same frequency?

Not critcising, just trying to understand! :)

Matthew


-- 
Matthew Newton, Ph.D. 

Systems Specialist, Infrastructure Services,
I.T. Services, University of Leicester, Leicester LE1 7RH, United Kingdom

For IT help contact helpdesk extn. 2253, 

**
Participation and subscription information for this EDUCAUSE Constituent Group 
discussion list can be found at http://www.educause.edu/groups/.

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Turner, Ryan H]

As I am approaching the problem, I think there is a middle ground…  The middle 
ground is you elevate one SSID to 5 Gig only, and have a secondary SSID as 2.4. 
 In our situation, it would mean eduroam would be 5 and UNC-PSK would be 2.4 
and 5.  It creates an incentive for individuals to upgrade devices.  Also, 
since 2.4 is so cluttered, I think it makes troubleshooting easier to always 
know that if a client calls with an issue, you can know they were on the 5 gig 
band if they attached to one SSID.  Makes isolating the cause of the issue and 
replicating the issue much easier.

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Jerry Bucklaew
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 9:41 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

We are seeing the same, about 50/50


I would argue you are not going to turn off 2.4GHZ for a very long time.   It 
will take a while to get  all clients over to 5 GHZ.I see 2.4ghz becoming 
the place we put all the "Low bandwidth Non traditional" stuff.   You can leave 
your HVAC, Cameras, Controls, Specialty SSID's, Old clients, weird 
stuff.All on 2.4GHZ.  For most people who are not building new, we already 
paid for the 2.4GHZ radios.  Why not use the radios and bandwidth?   As people 
move to 5GHZ,  2.4GHZ will actually clear up and become a very usable choice, 
especially for low bandwidth stuff.
On 04/07/2016 09:24 AM, Hector J Rios wrote:
I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the 
percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us is still 
50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new laptops that only 
come with 2.4GHz adapters.

I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, but I 
don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.

[cid:image001.png@01D190B2.811747A0]

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Perry Correll
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other vendors 
supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, even up to 95% 
clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the advancement of SDR capabilities 
enables IT administrators to more efficiently and effectively address this 
evolution. However Wi-Fi in the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon 
either

Best Regards,
Perry


Perry Correll  |  Xirrus Principal Technologist


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726




From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Chris Adams (IT)
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Kees,

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with multiple 
5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same device will be a 
more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am in the process of getting a 
few AP250 to throw into a few of our smaller auditoriums, which should be a 
good test of their performance.

I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how well the 
deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, which eliminates many 
of the spectrum and channel availability issues found with 40mhz+ channel 
widths.

PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as 
Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now ☺

Thanks,

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Kees Pronk
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a few 
vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.

Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors marketing 
pages, but how about :
Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels plans 
(need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable DFS channels 
on every AP but what about false positive radar detects? What about the 2 
radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so send/receive at the same time.

Please keep us posted and maybe 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Jerry Bucklaew]

We are seeing the same, about 50/50


I would argue you are not going to turn off 2.4GHZ for a very long time. 
  It will take a while to get  all clients over to 5 GHZ.I see 
2.4ghz becoming the place we put all the "Low bandwidth Non traditional" 
stuff.   You can leave your HVAC, Cameras, Controls, Specialty SSID's, 
Old clients, weird stuff.All on 2.4GHZ.  For most people who are not 
building new, we already paid for the 2.4GHZ radios.  Why not use the 
radios and bandwidth?   As people move to 5GHZ,  2.4GHZ will actually 
clear up and become a very usable choice, especially for low bandwidth 
stuff.


On 04/07/2016 09:24 AM, Hector J Rios wrote:


I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the 
percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us 
is still 50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new 
laptops that only come with 2.4GHz adapters.


I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, 
but I don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.


Hector Rios

Louisiana State University

*From:*The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Perry Correll

*Sent:* Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
*To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
*Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other 
vendors supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, 
even up to 95% clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the 
advancement of SDR capabilities enables IT administrators to more 
efficiently and effectively address this evolution. However Wi-Fi in 
the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon either


Best Regards,

Perry


*Perry Correll*  | /Xirrus Principal Technologist/


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726

*From:*The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Chris Adams 
(IT)

*Sent:* Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
*To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 


*Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Kees,

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with 
multiple 5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same 
device will be a more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am 
in the process of getting a few AP250 to throw into a few of our 
smaller auditoriums, which should be a good test of their performance.


I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how 
well the deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, 
which eliminates many of the spectrum and channel availability issues 
found with 40mhz+ channel widths.


PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this 
conversation as Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays 
for many years now J


Thanks,

**

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services

Division of Information Technology

University of North Georgia

*From:*The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Kees Pronk

*Sent:* Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
*To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 


*Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a 
few vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.


Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors 
marketing pages, but how about :


Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your 
channels plans (need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you 
must enable DFS channels on every AP but what about false positive 
radar detects? What about the 2 radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while 
trying so send/receive at the same time.


Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this

1.Innovation

2.Marketing gimmick

(pick one ;-)

Best regards, Kees

*Van:*The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *Namens *Larry Dougher

*Verzonden:* donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
*Aan:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 


*Onderwerp:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Thanks Chris!


*Larry Dougher*
Chief Information Officer_
_Information Technology Services 
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union 
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email  | Google+  | 
Twitter  | LinkedIn 
 | 802.674.8336


On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 2:45 PM, Chris Adams (IT) 

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Joseph M. Karam]

We offer 2.4 and 5 GHz service.  When we have conflicts, we work with 
departments to give them a channel in the 2.4 GHz space, then we take that 
channel out of our central infrastructure.  So, for example we gave engineering 
channel 6 for all of their labs, and we took that out of our central 
infrastructure.  So far it has worked well and we can play together nicely ☺

Joe


From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Hector J Rios
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 9:24 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the 
percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us is still 
50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new laptops that only 
come with 2.4GHz adapters.

I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, but I 
don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.

[cid:image001.png@01D190AF.A4EE6B20]

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Perry Correll
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other vendors 
supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, even up to 95% 
clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the advancement of SDR capabilities 
enables IT administrators to more efficiently and effectively address this 
evolution. However Wi-Fi in the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon 
either

Best Regards,
Perry


Perry Correll  |  Xirrus Principal Technologist


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726




From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Chris Adams (IT)
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Kees,

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with multiple 
5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same device will be a 
more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am in the process of getting a 
few AP250 to throw into a few of our smaller auditoriums, which should be a 
good test of their performance.

I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how well the 
deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, which eliminates many 
of the spectrum and channel availability issues found with 40mhz+ channel 
widths.

PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as 
Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now ☺

Thanks,

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Kees Pronk
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a few 
vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.

Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors marketing 
pages, but how about :
Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels plans 
(need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable DFS channels 
on every AP but what about false positive radar detects? What about the 2 
radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so send/receive at the same time.

Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this

1.   Innovation

2.   Marketing gimmick
(pick one ;-)

Best regards, Kees

Van: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] Namens Larry Dougher
Verzonden: donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
Aan: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Onderwerp: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Thanks Chris!


Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+ | 
Twitter | 
LinkedIn | 802.674.8336

On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 2:45 PM, Chris Adams (IT) 

Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Larry Dougher]

And the other question Hector is how many of those 2.4 clients ARE capable
of 5ghz but choose 2.4 instead, right?

*Larry Dougher*
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services 
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union 
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email  | Google+  | Twitter
 | LinkedIn
 | 802.674.8336

On Thu, Apr 7, 2016 at 9:24 AM, Hector J Rios  wrote:

> I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the
> percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us is
> still 50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new laptops
> that only come with 2.4GHz adapters.
>
>
>
> I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, but
> I don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.
>
>
>
>
>
> Hector Rios
>
> Louisiana State University
>
>
>
> *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [mailto:
> WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] *On Behalf Of *Perry Correll
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
>
> *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?
>
>
>
> Chris,
>
>
>
> Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other vendors
> supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, even up to 95%
> clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the advancement of SDR
> capabilities enables IT administrators to more efficiently and effectively
> address this evolution. However Wi-Fi in the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going
> away anytime soon either
>
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Perry
>
>
>
> *Perry Correll*  |  *Xirrus Principal Technologist*
>
> o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [
> mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> ] *On Behalf Of *Chris Adams (IT)
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
> *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?
>
>
>
> Kees,
>
>
>
> I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with
> multiple 5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same device
> will be a more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am in the
> process of getting a few AP250 to throw into a few of our smaller
> auditoriums, which should be a good test of their performance.
>
>
>
> I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how well
> the deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, which
> eliminates many of the spectrum and channel availability issues found with
> 40mhz+ channel widths.
>
>
>
> PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as
> Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now
> J
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
> Chris Adams, CISSP
>
>
>
> Director, Network & Telecom Services
>
> Division of Information Technology
>
> University of North Georgia
>
>
>
> *From:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [
> mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> ] *On Behalf Of *Kees Pronk
> *Sent:* Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
> *To:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> *Subject:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?
>
>
>
> Hi Chris,
>
>
>
> “you could in theory double the airtime available”
>
>
>
> I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a few
> vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.
>
>
>
> Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors
> marketing pages, but how about :
>
> Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels
> plans (need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable
> DFS channels on every AP but what about false positive radar detects? What
> about the 2 radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so send/receive at
> the same time.
>
>
>
> Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this
>
> 1.   Innovation
>
> 2.   Marketing gimmick
>
> (pick one ;-)
>
>
>
> Best regards, Kees
>
>
>
> *Van:* The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv [
> mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> ] *Namens *Larry Dougher
> *Verzonden:* donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
> *Aan:* WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
> *Onderwerp:* Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?
>
>
>
> Thanks Chris!
>
>
> *Larry Dougher*
> Chief Information Officer
> Information Technology Services 
> Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union 
> 127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
> Email  | Google+  | Twitter
>  | LinkedIn
> 

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Turner, Ryan H]

What we are going to do is a test in one of our IT building of 5 GHz only wifi 
on eduroam.  We ran a report, and we are seeing about 25% of the connections 
running on 2.4.  We don’t know how many of these are a result of the failure to 
band steer, or if the devices are just not 5 gig capable.  We hope to have a 
better answer after the experiment.  We’re sending out some internal 
announcements about the test and hope to run it soon, for a few days.

Ryan

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Hector J Rios
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 9:24 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the 
percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us is still 
50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new laptops that only 
come with 2.4GHz adapters.

I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, but I 
don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.

[cid:image001.png@01D190B0.13736AF0]

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Perry Correll
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other vendors 
supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, even up to 95% 
clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the advancement of SDR capabilities 
enables IT administrators to more efficiently and effectively address this 
evolution. However Wi-Fi in the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon 
either

Best Regards,
Perry


Perry Correll  |  Xirrus Principal Technologist


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726




From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Chris Adams (IT)
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Kees,

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with multiple 
5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same device will be a 
more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am in the process of getting a 
few AP250 to throw into a few of our smaller auditoriums, which should be a 
good test of their performance.

I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how well the 
deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, which eliminates many 
of the spectrum and channel availability issues found with 40mhz+ channel 
widths.

PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as 
Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now ☺

Thanks,

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Kees Pronk
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a few 
vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.

Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors marketing 
pages, but how about :
Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels plans 
(need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable DFS channels 
on every AP but what about false positive radar detects? What about the 2 
radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so send/receive at the same time.

Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this

1.   Innovation

2.   Marketing gimmick
(pick one ;-)

Best regards, Kees

Van: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] Namens Larry Dougher
Verzonden: donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
Aan: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Onderwerp: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Thanks Chris!


Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+ | 
Twitter | 
LinkedIn | 

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Hector J Rios]

I guess this brings up another good question, and that is, what is the 
percentage of 5GHz vs 2.4GHz you all see in your institutions? For us is still 
50-50. And it’s been like that for a while. I still see new laptops that only 
come with 2.4GHz adapters.

I would love to start turning off 2.4GHz in some areas of our campus, but I 
don’t think that’s an option for us at the moment.

[cid:image001.png@01D190A6.D2C56DE0]

Hector Rios
Louisiana State University

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Perry Correll
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 7:49 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other vendors 
supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, even up to 95% 
clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the advancement of SDR capabilities 
enables IT administrators to more efficiently and effectively address this 
evolution. However Wi-Fi in the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon 
either

Best Regards,
Perry


Perry Correll  |  Xirrus Principal Technologist


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726




From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Chris Adams (IT)
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Kees,

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with multiple 
5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same device will be a 
more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am in the process of getting a 
few AP250 to throw into a few of our smaller auditoriums, which should be a 
good test of their performance.

I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how well the 
deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, which eliminates many 
of the spectrum and channel availability issues found with 40mhz+ channel 
widths.

PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as 
Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now ☺

Thanks,

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Kees Pronk
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a few 
vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.

Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors marketing 
pages, but how about :
Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels plans 
(need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable DFS channels 
on every AP but what about false positive radar detects? What about the 2 
radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so send/receive at the same time.

Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this

1.   Innovation

2.   Marketing gimmick
(pick one ;-)

Best regards, Kees

Van: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] Namens Larry Dougher
Verzonden: donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
Aan: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Onderwerp: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Thanks Chris!


Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+ | 
Twitter | 
LinkedIn | 802.674.8336

On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 2:45 PM, Chris Adams (IT) 
> wrote:
Larry,

We have deployed 802.11ac WAPs in many locations, but only have 80mhz channels 
enabled sparingly around campus. My hope is that by having the SDR option, we 
could configure 2x 5ghz radios with either 20Mhz or 40Mhz channels, logically 
operating as 2 WAPs. Our wireless use case is primarily for internet access – 
we just don’t have a need for true wave1/2 802.11ac throughputs at this time.

To see true Wave2 throughputs, I believe the client WNIC would need to be 
upgraded. If we could operate 2 “logical” 5ghz WAPs from a single unit for a 
small increase in price, I think this is where our greatest benefit would be at 
this time as you could in 

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Perry Correll]

Chris,

Not ‘chuckling’, just smiling as we are actually glad to see other vendors 
supporting this capability. Today we are seeing 70, 80, 90, even up to 95% 
clients supporting 5Ghz capabilities and the advancement of SDR capabilities 
enables IT administrators to more efficiently and effectively address this 
evolution. However Wi-Fi in the 2.4Ghz spectrum isn’t going away anytime soon 
either

Best Regards,
Perry


Perry Correll  |  Xirrus Principal Technologist


o: 805 376 5437  |  m: 321 505 7726




From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Chris Adams (IT)
Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2016 8:31 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Kees,

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with multiple 
5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same device will be a 
more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am in the process of getting a 
few AP250 to throw into a few of our smaller auditoriums, which should be a 
good test of their performance.

I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how well the 
deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, which eliminates many 
of the spectrum and channel availability issues found with 40mhz+ channel 
widths.

PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as 
Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now ☺

Thanks,

Chris Adams, CISSP

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Kees Pronk
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a few 
vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.

Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors marketing 
pages, but how about :
Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels plans 
(need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable DFS channels 
on every AP but what about false positive radar detects? What about the 2 
radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so send/receive at the same time.

Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this

1.   Innovation

2.   Marketing gimmick
(pick one ;-)

Best regards, Kees

Van: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] Namens Larry Dougher
Verzonden: donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
Aan: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Onderwerp: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Thanks Chris!


Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+ | 
Twitter | 
LinkedIn | 802.674.8336

On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 2:45 PM, Chris Adams (IT) 
> wrote:
Larry,

We have deployed 802.11ac WAPs in many locations, but only have 80mhz channels 
enabled sparingly around campus. My hope is that by having the SDR option, we 
could configure 2x 5ghz radios with either 20Mhz or 40Mhz channels, logically 
operating as 2 WAPs. Our wireless use case is primarily for internet access – 
we just don’t have a need for true wave1/2 802.11ac throughputs at this time.

To see true Wave2 throughputs, I believe the client WNIC would need to be 
upgraded. If we could operate 2 “logical” 5ghz WAPs from a single unit for a 
small increase in price, I think this is where our greatest benefit would be at 
this time as you could in theory double the airtime available.

This is based on several assumptions I am making – I have not gotten my hands 
on the new AP250 yet but I am actively looking to do so.

http://boundless.aerohive.com/blog/Designing-WLANS-What-If-we-could-double-our-airtime-at-5-GHz.html


Thanks,

Chris Adams

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU]
 On Behalf Of Larry Dougher
Sent: Wednesday, April 6, 2016 2:28 PM

To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

I have a 

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Chris Adams (IT)]

Kees,

 

I think your skepticism is well founded. We have many locations with multiple 
5ghz radios in the same room, but multiple 5ghz on the same device will be a 
more “uncharted” territory for our deployment. I am in the process of getting a 
few AP250 to throw into a few of our smaller auditoriums, which should be a 
good test of their performance.

 

I do believe that the channel width may be a differentiator in how well the 
deployment works – we are using 20mhz in most locations, which eliminates many 
of the spectrum and channel availability issues found with 40mhz+ channel 
widths.

 

PS: I’m sure some of the Xirrus guys are chuckling at this conversation as 
Xirrus has been well known for having large SDR arrays for many years now :)

 

Thanks,

 

Chris Adams, CISSP

 

Director, Network & Telecom Services

Division of Information Technology

University of North Georgia

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] On Behalf Of Kees Pronk
Sent: Thursday, April 7, 2016 7:45 AM
To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

 

Hi Chris,

 

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

 

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a few 
vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.

 

Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors marketing 
pages, but how about :

Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels plans 
(need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable DFS channels 
on every AP but what about false positive radar detects? What about the 2 
radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so send/receive at the same time.

 

Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this

1.   Innovation

2.   Marketing gimmick

(pick one ;-)

 

Best regards, Kees

 

Van: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] Namens Larry Dougher
Verzonden: donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
Aan: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
 
Onderwerp: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

 

Thanks Chris!




Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services  
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union  
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email   | Google+   | Twitter 
  | LinkedIn 
  | 802.674.8336

 

On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 2:45 PM, Chris Adams (IT)  > wrote:

Larry,

 

We have deployed 802.11ac WAPs in many locations, but only have 80mhz channels 
enabled sparingly around campus. My hope is that by having the SDR option, we 
could configure 2x 5ghz radios with either 20Mhz or 40Mhz channels, logically 
operating as 2 WAPs. Our wireless use case is primarily for internet access – 
we just don’t have a need for true wave1/2 802.11ac throughputs at this time.

 

To see true Wave2 throughputs, I believe the client WNIC would need to be 
upgraded. If we could operate 2 “logical” 5ghz WAPs from a single unit for a 
small increase in price, I think this is where our greatest benefit would be at 
this time as you could in theory double the airtime available.

 

This is based on several assumptions I am making – I have not gotten my hands 
on the new AP250 yet but I am actively looking to do so.

 

http://boundless.aerohive.com/blog/Designing-WLANS-What-If-we-could-double-our-airtime-at-5-GHz.html

 

 

Thanks,

 

Chris Adams

 

Director, Network & Telecom Services

Division of Information Technology

University of North Georgia

 

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
 ] On Behalf Of Larry Dougher
Sent: Wednesday, April 6, 2016 2:28 PM


To: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU 
 
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

 

Chris,

 

I have a question about the AP250, but may be a question about MU-MIMO more 
generally.  So, all things being equal, would a 5Ghz 802.11ac device/client see 
any benefit from a Wave 2 AP or would that device/client have to have an 
upgraded/new 802.11ac 5Ghz Wave 2 chip to see a benefit?

 

Thanks,




Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services  
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union  
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email   | Google+   | Twitter 
  | LinkedIn 
  | 802.674.8336  

 

On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 1:30 PM, Chris Adams (IT) 

RE: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

[Kees Pronk]

Hi Chris,

“you could in theory double the airtime available”

I would be interested in your actual experience with this. Now that a few 
vendors have taken this approach and others stay away from this.

Arguments in favor of 5/5 you will find these abundant on the vendors marketing 
pages, but how about :
Extra COGS (band pass filters etc), extra complexity with your channels plans 
(need a lot of separation between the 5/5 radios), you must enable DFS channels 
on every AP but what about false positive radar detects? What about the 2 
radio’s  ‘deafening’ each other while trying so send/receive at the same time.

Please keep us posted and maybe others testing with this

1.   Innovation

2.   Marketing gimmick
(pick one ;-)

Best regards, Kees

Van: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU] Namens Larry Dougher
Verzonden: donderdag 7 april 2016 03:11
Aan: WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Onderwerp: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Thanks Chris!


Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+ | 
Twitter | 
LinkedIn | 802.674.8336

On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 2:45 PM, Chris Adams (IT) 
> wrote:
Larry,

We have deployed 802.11ac WAPs in many locations, but only have 80mhz channels 
enabled sparingly around campus. My hope is that by having the SDR option, we 
could configure 2x 5ghz radios with either 20Mhz or 40Mhz channels, logically 
operating as 2 WAPs. Our wireless use case is primarily for internet access – 
we just don’t have a need for true wave1/2 802.11ac throughputs at this time.

To see true Wave2 throughputs, I believe the client WNIC would need to be 
upgraded. If we could operate 2 “logical” 5ghz WAPs from a single unit for a 
small increase in price, I think this is where our greatest benefit would be at 
this time as you could in theory double the airtime available.

This is based on several assumptions I am making – I have not gotten my hands 
on the new AP250 yet but I am actively looking to do so.

http://boundless.aerohive.com/blog/Designing-WLANS-What-If-we-could-double-our-airtime-at-5-GHz.html


Thanks,

Chris Adams

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU]
 On Behalf Of Larry Dougher
Sent: Wednesday, April 6, 2016 2:28 PM

To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

Chris,

I have a question about the AP250, but may be a question about MU-MIMO more 
generally.  So, all things being equal, would a 5Ghz 802.11ac device/client see 
any benefit from a Wave 2 AP or would that device/client have to have an 
upgraded/new 802.11ac 5Ghz Wave 2 chip to see a benefit?

Thanks,


Larry Dougher
Chief Information Officer
Information Technology Services
Windsor Southeast Supervisory Union
127 State Street, Windsor, VT 05089
Email | Google+ | 
Twitter | 
LinkedIn | 
802.674.8336

On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 1:30 PM, Chris Adams (IT) 
> wrote:
I echo Jeremy’s sentiment – our experience with band-steering has been 
overwhelmingly positive. We are also not (currently) using DFS channels – but 
may be revisiting this soon. I’d estimate almost 2/3 of our 2.4ghz radios are 
disabled.

I am very happy to see the new Aerohive AP250 has a SDR with the option of 
disabling the 2.4ghz radio in favor of having 2x 5ghz radios.

Thanks,

Chris Adams

Director, Network & Telecom Services
Division of Information Technology
University of North Georgia

From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv 
[mailto:WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU]
 On Behalf Of Jeremy Gibbs
Sent: Wednesday, April 6, 2016 1:27 PM
To: 
WIRELESS-LAN@LISTSERV.EDUCAUSE.EDU
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Turning off 2.4 on a select SSID?

I find the opposite to be true with band steering.  If we turn it off, the 
majority of our clients won't connect to 5 Ghz, even if they are right above an 
AP.  This causes lots of disconnect problems and congestion in the 2.4 Ghz 
spectrum.  Turning band steering on fixes the problem for us.


--

Jeremy L. Gibbs
Sr. Network Engineer
Utica College IITS
On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 1:18 PM, Turner, Ryan H