>That is the reason to ONLY run windows software in Parallels. You
>make a clean install once set it up the way you want. Save that file
>as master. Copy the file master file. Now run the copy until it gets
>wonky and toss it. Copy the master file again and start over. No
>prolonged reinstall
That is the reason to ONLY run windows software in Parallels. You
make a clean install once set it up the way you want. Save that file
as master. Copy the file master file. Now run the copy until it gets
wonky and toss it. Copy the master file again and start over. No
prolonged reinstall.
P
Didn't happen for macworld. No self destruct or MS-SS showing up in black
boots and batons. And they alerted the entire world via internet and print
they had violated the EULA. At worst, I think the software will install
fine, run great and get infected via web pages like many windows installs.
>On reflection, the proper way to think of the EULA might be this: You, the
>consumer, have purchased this software and we, the provider, will support
>you in your use of it, provided you agree to the following terms. If you
>don't agree, we're not a party to it, we're not liable for anything that
>FYI, the IEEE requires me to assign anything that I publish in their
>journals (for me, a lot) to them or I don't get published in their journals.
And it makes sense that IEEE does. IEEE's goal is to distribute what you
write via a variety of means (using known and as yet unknown
technologies)
On reflection, the proper way to think of the EULA might be this: You, the
consumer, have purchased this software and we, the provider, will support
you in your use of it, provided you agree to the following terms. If you
don't agree, we're not a party to it, we're not liable for anything that
hap
As I said, I respect your opinion.
FYI, the IEEE requires me to assign anything that I publish in their
journals (for me, a lot) to them or I don't get published in their journals.
Tom Piwowar wrote:
I am reluctant to enter into this discussion, since I am conflicted...
Were I 40 years younge
egads!
On 6/1/07, Stewart A. Marshall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I will go one step farther.
The left is but a mirror image of the right!
Stewart
At 12:15 PM 6/1/2007, you wrote:
>Except for all the radical left wing nutjob judges that pack our courts.
>Not much rational thought either way.
>But I can't help mentioning that, with the lawyers in the justice
>department and the judges in our courts packed with radical right wing
>corporate ideologues, are the laws and the courts based on morality or
>rational thought any more?
Today NPR ran a story about the Bush purge of military l
>If we want to do something about unfair practices in the computer
>industry, we have to do something about the monopolistic
>corporations. It matters how you vote, and what kind of leadership
>we have in Washington.
Yes. People who don't vote "because it doesn't matter." People who vote
f
I will go one step farther.
The left is but a mirror image of the right!
Stewart
At 12:15 PM 6/1/2007, you wrote:
Except for all the radical left wing nutjob judges that pack our courts.
Not much rational thought either way.
Mike
On 6/1/07, Jordman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Thank you al
Except for all the radical left wing nutjob judges that pack our courts.
Not much rational thought either way.
Mike
On 6/1/07, Jordman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Thank you all for a really interesting conversation here.
But I can't help mentioning that, with the lawyers in the justice
depart
It's a program...that you paid for...on a computer in your own
house. This
isn't a discussion about the nature of true evil.
I didn't think it was either, initially, but "banality of evil" has
been evoked in this discussion. I wanted to defend people who have
to use Microsoft Word--and
Thank you all for a really interesting conversation here.
But I can't help mentioning that, with the lawyers in the justice
department and the judges in our courts packed with radical right wing
corporate ideologues, are the laws and the courts based on morality or
rational thought any more?
How is this even possible? Talking about installing a program on a computer
has gone to talking about german resistance in WWII? In a few years are we
going to read the diary of a young girl who lived with her family in the
hidden basement of someone's home running vista home inside WINE in fea
If we all avoided software from convicted predatory monopolists it
would only take a few years for things
to get better. With competition and alternatives you would probably
not
be facing an EULA that you find so objectionable. Yes you have a
problem.
You should work to solve that problem.
The different versions have different capabilities that have nothing to do
with running them in virtualization nor anything to do with what MS gives as
a reason for not wanting someone to run them in VM. Running basic in VM
doesn't not 'enable' anything in basic. All versions run as is out of th
Now I am not completely familiar with contracts such as these, but I
am pretty sure the narrowly written contracts were the result of
legal advice companies got when they had to battle former employees
who took or attempted to patent items that were developed for
companies on company time and w
>I am reluctant to enter into this discussion, since I am conflicted...
>Were I 40 years younger, I would completely agree with Tom Piwowar...
>But over the years I have seen many changes...
>rson whose interests spans both engineering and artistic
>I see copyright and patent law from more than on
I am reluctant to enter into this discussion, since I am conflicted
about the issues.
Were I 40 years younger, I would completely agree with Tom Piwowar that
we all need to be honest as well as obeying the law -- all the stuff
taught in Civics course in High School (never mind that my high sc
!?!? You're kidding, right?
Morality, ethics can be based on not wanting to hurt others,
or it can be based on the notion that non-complicance by
even a significant few can poison the well, so we should comply.
AFAI can tell, contract and civil law is neither but based on the idea that
coopera
>Tom, I couldn't let this pass without comment:
>
>Please demonstrate. Buy some software, retail package or download,
>your choice. Start the installation. Decline the EULA. Return the
>product and try to get your money back. Let us know how that goes.
This is a hot topic in the Linux community. H
On 5/30/07, P Yasuda <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
When our civilization falls, it won't be because Harvey violated
Microsoft's EULA.
Heck, I would argue that if everyone complied with Microsoft EULAs, then our
civilization would have already fallen.
(It is one of the sure signs of the Apocalyp
Tom, I couldn't let this pass without comment:
On 5/30/07, Tom Piwowar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
As Bill Gates once said "If we tell them they have to put a ham sandwich
in every box, they have to put a ham sandwich in every box." Your
obligation is to read the EULA and according to the terms o
On 5/30/07, Tom Piwowar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Me, I would say that the store is being immoral. And the EULA wouldn't
hold
>up in most courts of law. And I would say the moral stand is to serve
>whatever food you buy from them to whomever you want.
So you are going to take the good old "
I totally agree that there is a lot of sleaze, and worse, in the
business world nowadays. But the fact that I try not to be sleazy
doesn't let me off the hook, as far as consequences are concerned. The
maxim of the law is, "Ignorance of the law is no excuse." So if I
violate a EULA in ignorance,
>Me, I would say that the store is being immoral. And the EULA wouldn't hold
>up in most courts of law. And I would say the moral stand is to serve
>whatever food you buy from them to whomever you want.
So you are going to take the good old "two wrongs make a right" defense.
As Bill Gates once
This is about what I had in mind when I raised the question of possibly
violating the Vista EULA. One one level, at least, it seems like the
prohibition against using any but the most expensive versions of Vista with
Parallels virtual machine software is just Bill Gates and company being
a**holes
On 5/29/07, Tom Piwowar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Good point. But alas, that's not what we are discussing. The topic of the
moment is deliberately violating specific terms of an EULA by purchasing
the low-cost version of a product and using it in a way that the EULA
only allows for the more-exp
>No, I don't violate EULA's, at least not consciously. But with all that
>legal and technical gobbledygook, I can't ever be 100% sure.
Good point. But alas, that's not what we are discussing. The topic of the
moment is deliberately violating specific terms of an EULA by purchasing
the low-cost
Breaking a contract is a violation of civil law (perhaps) not criminal.
The distinction is huge and is practical. As a fairly idealistic and
even ideological person, this angst seems misplaced.
Tom Piwowar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>So, my question is: What, precisely, are all the things t
t: Re: [CGUYS] The Consequences of EULA Violation
There are plenty of examples of contracts that we not able to
negotiate, that are still enforceable. Negotiation is not a legal
part of contract law. Did you enter into it with full knowledge is.
Stewart
Full knowledge of the EULA? Well, that&
There are plenty of examples of contracts that we not able to
negotiate, that are still enforceable. Negotiation is not a legal
part of contract law. Did you enter into it with full knowledge is.
Stewart
Full knowledge of the EULA? Well, that's part of the point, isn't it?
Does ANYBODY know a
On 5/28/07, Rev. Stewart Marshall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Then take them to court I would be interested in the outcome.
Actually, some people do that. As usual with the US legal system, the court
and lawyer costs are the biggest consideration.
There are plenty of similar precedents over
Wikipedia mentions some key legal cases, and which Federal court districts
have ruled in which ways:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EULA
"Enforceability
The enforceability of an EULA depends on several factors, one of them being
the court in which the case is heard. Most courts that have addresse
Have there been cases where the software developer succeeded in suing
for EULA violations? State? Federal? Foreign?
* ==> QUICK LIST-COMMAND REFERENCE - Put the following commands in <==
* ==> the body of an email & send
Then take them to court I would be interested in the outcome.
Stewart
At 01:03 PM 5/28/2007, you wrote:
On 5/28/07, Rev. Stewart Marshall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
The moment you click an EULA, it is a legally binding contract
between you and the producer of the product. Wether you like it
On 5/28/07, Rev. Stewart Marshall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
The moment you click an EULA, it is a legally binding contract
between you and the producer of the product. Wether you like it or
not does not matter. I do not like them anymore than you do, but in
a court of law, it would still be u
OK I am not a lawyer nor do I play one on TV nor did I stay in a
Holiday Inn Express last night.
The moment you click an EULA, it is a legally binding contract
between you and the producer of the product. Wether you like it or
not does not matter. I do not like them anymore than you do, but
On 5/28/07, Rev. Stewart Marshall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
EULA's get into contract law not criminal law.
What is a contract worth if you are not going to keep it. Or to echo
Tom's word, is it just a business decision.
Except the legal issue resolves around whether a EULA is a valid cont
EULA's get into contract law not criminal law.
What is a contract worth if you are not going to keep it. Or to echo
Tom's word, is it just a business decision.
Would you want to shop at a grocery store where they view contracts
as something only to be kept if it is to their advantage?
Wou
It'll work, there is nothing written into the code that keeps you from doing
it.
Mike
On 5/28/07, John Duncan Yoyo <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Given that EULA's aren't all that enforceable I'd say go ahead and try
to install it in parallels. If it works fine. If it doesn't work the
reason nob
Given that EULA's aren't all that enforceable I'd say go ahead and try
to install it in parallels. If it works fine. If it doesn't work the
reason nobody wants to support it because you haven't paid enough
money. MS will always take your money for an upgrade later if you
really need support.
On 5/25/07, Tom Piwowar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>So, my question is: What, precisely, are all the things that could go
wrong,
>were I to violate the EULA?
Have we gotten to the point where every crime is just another a business
decision? If the benefit exceeds the fine or the probability of
One of the sins that comprised the gist of what was once said as:
"Sir! Have you no shame?"
Mark Snyder
-Original Message-
>So, my question is: What, precisely, are all the things that could go
>wrong, were I to violate the EULA?
Have we gotten to the point where every crime is just an
>So, my question is: What, precisely, are all the things that could go wrong,
>were I to violate the EULA?
Have we gotten to the point where every crime is just another a business
decision? If the benefit exceeds the fine or the probability of getting
caught is not high then is there anything
You might feel bad late at night for having the nerve to purchase a copy of
vista and use it?
Mike
On 5/25/07, Harvey Simon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I have a copy of Vista Home Premium that I¹m going to install on my
MacBook.
(Some don¹t think this is advisable, but maybe we can put those is
I have a copy of Vista Home Premium that I¹m going to install on my MacBook.
(Some don¹t think this is advisable, but maybe we can put those issues aside
for the purposes of this discussion.) I would prefer to run Vista using
Parallels, but can¹t do so w/o violating the End User License Agreement
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