Re: Simple Text Editor with Synatx highlighting?
On Tue, May 23, 2000 at 09:39:16AM -0500, Jesse Jacobsen wrote: On 05/23/00, John S Jacobs Anderson addressed Re: Simple Text Editor with Synatx highlighting?: on 5/23/00 9:57 AM, Keith G. Murphy at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This leads to a question I've been interested in. I've noticed vim's Perl syntax highlighting to be, hmmm, not always what it should be. (As some have said, only perl can parse Perl). Any opinions on which editor has the *best* Perl syntax highlighting? (X)Emacs with CPerl mode. Even that's not, hmmm, what it should be. Cases that come to mind are certain regular expressions and here documents. Unless I've been using a different Perl mode in Emacs. It's possible. There's perl-mode and there's cperl-mode. I prefer that latter, although the highlighting is not perfect. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: umount - URGENT
On Fri, Jan 07, 2000 at 05:47:37PM +0100, Blazej Sawionek wrote: I've just fallen into serious trouble: can not umount my CD-ROM - it is reported as beeing used. I'm sure it is not, what may have happened is that I was examining it's contents with `mc' which died suddenly. I desperatly need this CD out _right_now_ so please if anybody knows the answer - give it ASAP. For future reference... while it's a good habit to demand successful umounts before removing media, remember that it IS a cdROM after all. You're certainly not going to damage it by just pushing the button and taking the thing out. Sure the os will complain, but you'll have the disk in your hand. (Do not apply this advice to floppies, zip disks, etc.) -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: umount - URGENT
On Fri, Jan 07, 2000 at 03:56:17PM -0500, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 1/7/2000 12:56:05 PM Central Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: while it's a good habit to demand successful umounts before removing media, remember that it IS a cdROM after all. You're certainly not going to damage it by just pushing the button and taking the thing out. Sure the os will complain, but you'll have the disk in your hand. I don't know about you - but I have two PCs that won't let me eject the CD unless I umount the device. Perhaps an undocumented feature? I think mine has (I know my old one did) a little hole, which I call the No, Really! button. Made for a paper clip to stick in. I have used this method while powered up before with no obvious bad results. I can't promise the same good fortune for all drives, though. Let me just take this moment to complain that while automating all of these things can be nifty, it's real pain sometimes, too. I wish manufactures would take more care in providing good physical overrides that don't say pushing this button will eject your cd, but it may also trash the drive. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Can't get scripts to work
On Wed, Jan 05, 2000 at 11:29:44PM -0500, Wayne Topa wrote: (Why does this work, by the way? Is /bin/sh the default interpreter?) I also thought this (Colin's comment), was the problem so I changed some of my bash scripts to test it. At least on my slink box, that isn't the answer. All of these worked : #!/bin/sh, # !/bin/sh, #! /bin/sh and the script even worked _without_ any #! line _at all_!!! I have no idea why it worked, but it does? I read somewhere (although I can't find it now) that /bin/sh _is_ the default interpreter for text files. With that in mind, your second example (# !/bin/sh) is not recognized as a shebang, it's passed off to sh by default, and sh ignores the first line as a comment. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Desperately need help on X! Please!
On Tue, Nov 23, 1999 at 10:25:26AM -0500, Tam Than Ma wrote: Hi all, Here is my problem: After I configure X. I typed startx, the screen goes blank and then turn white with an X mark in the middle(for about 2 seconds) and then it gives this only message: wait for X server to shut down. What does your .xinitrc look like? Do you have one? It may not be X that's dying. It may be your window manager. If you don't have an .xinitrc or you don't trust the one you have, try using one that looks like this: #!/bin/sh exec xterm and let us know what happens. If the xterm comes up (type exit in it), then you know that X is OK, but your window manager is failing. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Gnome panel and Enlightenment
On Thu, Nov 18, 1999 at 07:48:25AM +0700, Oki DZ wrote: What is the spec of your machine? Mine is a Pentium 100MHz/64MB, would this one run X/Gnome/E comfortably? I gotta bite... I sit in front of a Dual PII 400 w/ 512MB ram at work and recently switched back to afterstep (from Gnome/Enlightenment) largely because of speed. (Maybe afterstep spoils me, but still...) -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: How to Cc: mailing list with mutt
On Wed, Oct 20, 1999 at 10:28:41AM -0400, Michael Stenner wrote: On Wed, Oct 20, 1999 at 07:41:57AM -0600, Dwayne C . Litzenberger wrote: Does anyone know how to get mutt to, when replying to list, also reply to the sender of the message? If you hit g to reply (instead of r) it will do a group reply. You may want to take some people out the list of recipients this way, but it will default to replying to everyone involved in the mail. On Wed, Oct 20, 1999 at 01:16:10PM -0600, Dwayne C . Litzenberger wrote: I tried that, and it sends to the list and the *recipient* of the message, not the sender. Do you know how to get it to reply to the sender, instead of the recipient? Let me get this straight: Some person (Joe) writes to a list and you get the mail. You hit g and Joe is not listed as a recipient? That might be some funky reply-to stuff that I haven't run into. Sorry. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: How to Cc: mailing list with mutt
On Wed, Oct 20, 1999 at 07:41:57AM -0600, Dwayne C . Litzenberger wrote: Does anyone know how to get mutt to, when replying to list, also reply to the sender of the message? If you hit g to reply (instead of r) it will do a group reply. You may want to take some people out the list of recipients this way, but it will default to replying to everyone involved in the mail. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: slink and potato
On Mon, Oct 18, 1999 at 02:17:27PM +, RAVIKANT K RAO wrote: what is better about potato? ( i'm still new to debian ; so just wondering if i should go slink - potato ) Potato is newer stuff. The trade-off is that it is less stable - hasn't been tested as thoroughly. Potato is almost ready for release. It all depends on what you're comfortable with. The months before and after a freeze can be pretty rocky, so I might recommend waiting until it goes beta at least (since you're new to debian). (unstable - frozen - beta - stable) unstable = under development frozen= no new packages, bug fixes only beta = final testing stable= well, stable :) On the other hand, I guarantee that you'll learn more and faster if you upgrade :) Either way, have fun! -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
slink-potato and missing packages
So I'm upgrading from slink to potato (while it's still unstable so i can call myself adventurous) and there are a number of packages missing (from the ftp site, according to apt). Some of them look rather important (tcpd, etc). Two questions: 1) out of curiosity, how does this happen? 2) what do I do about it? I can just put those packages on hold and hope on dependency problems arise. What's the standard solution? Thanks, Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: emacs or xemacs ?
On Wed, Sep 15, 1999 at 02:17:53AM -0400, Rob Mahurin wrote: On Tue, Sep 14, 1999 at 07:32:22PM -0400, Kristopher Johnson wrote: I honestly don't mean to start a holy war here, but I'd like to know: Is there anyone who prefers Emacs to XEmacs, and why? I use emacs when I'm in a text terminal (like right now) because I haven't figured out how to use Xemacs' menus from the text terminal and some of the functions of Xemacs (e.g., syntax highlighting) seem inaccessible without mouse access to the proper menus. In addition, the cut and paste works differently in Xemacs (in a text terminal) than in any other text-based program, and it always messes with me. I am sure that these things are configureable, but I haven't found them and I don't feel like learning Lisp and reading the source. This preference means that I use emacs -nw to write email from mutt, even in X. try this for giggles here are snippets from .muttrc and .emacs_mutt.el I run this in a transparent aterm with yellow text and on a dark background (I tell you this because that colors I have below will look really nasty if you're one of those black-on-white people :). -Michael .muttrc ## set editor=xemacs -nw -q -l /home/einstein/mstenner/.emacs_mutt.el color hdrdefault cyandefault color indicator black green color markersyellow red color tree green default color status black green color quoted green default color signature magenta default ## .emacs_mutt.el # ;; -*- lisp -*- ; this is where I put my private lisp stuff (setq load-path (cons /home/einstein/mstenner/lib/lisp/ load-path)) (setq mouse-yank-at-point t) ; mouse insert where cursor is (line-number-mode 1) (column-number-mode 1) (setq scroll-step 10) (keyboard-translate ?\C-h ?\C-?) (keyboard-translate ?\C-? ?\C-h) (setq default-major-mode 'text-mode) ; turn on text-mode (sort of) ; turn on auto-fill (setq text-mode-hook '(lambda () (auto-fill-mode 1))) ; don't clutter with ~ files --- put them in .trash/ (defun make-backup-file-name (file) (concat /home/einstein/mstenner/.trash/ (file-name-nondirectory file) ~)) (defun backup-file-name-p (file) (string-match \\~$ file)) ; allows font-locking even on the terminal (if (eq 'tty (device-type)) (set-device-class nil 'color)) ; general color config (set-face-background 'modeline black) (set-face-background 'modeline green) ; here is where I associate faces with regex patterns. (defconst text-font-lock-keywords '( (^On .* . font-lock-variable-name-face) ; inital reply line (^ .* . font-lock-comment-face) ; quoted message ) Subdued level highlighting for Mutt mode.) (font-lock-mode) ; turn on font-lock-mode ; cyan blue magenta red green yellow white black == good color options ; Here is where I associate colors with faces (set-face-foreground 'font-lock-variable-name-face cyan) ; inital reply line (set-face-foreground 'font-lock-comment-face green) ; quoted message # -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: script command question
On Mon, Aug 30, 1999 at 09:17:38PM -0700, Mark Wagnon wrote: I'm taking a C class this semester and my instructer want us to use the script command to verify our work: cat the program, compile it, and enter test data while scripting. The program itself is easy to use, but I get control codes embedded in the file. Things like ^G, ^H, and ^M. Has anyone used this program (I didn't even know it existed until today), and experienced the insertion of control characters or know how to prevent it? If not, no big deal. It'll be an excuse to delve into writing a shell script to strip them out :) Another possibliity: are you using anything which will produce fun text properties, such as colors, underline or bold? I use ls with color and also use a cool prompt setting in bash (see below) which does REALLY nasty things to script. If you find a clever way to keep the colors and fix the script output, I'd be happy to hear it! -Michael # here's the relevant part of my .bashrc case $TERM in xterm*) PS1=\[\033]0;\w\007\]\\033[1;31m\h\033[0m$ ;; *) PS1=\h$ ;; esac -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: xterm
On Mon, Aug 30, 1999 at 10:21:50AM +0200, Csépes Zoltán wrote: Now I have an other problem with installing X-windows system. How can I get that the xterm doesn't appear with so great fonts. I have an ATI Mach64 videocard and I use a fairly good DELL monitor, but I dont know its sync frequencies. You have a couple of options: 1) you can specify your font on the command line. Start xterm as xterm -fn 10x20 (Here, 10x20 is my font of choice, normally... substitute your own) 2) also, you can put the following line in ~/.Xdefaults or ~/.Xresources xterm*font: 10x20 (again, substitute for desired font) -- Other tips: A) if you want all things that act like xterms to use a given font, use the line XTerm*font: 10x20 instead. B) you can find fonts with the (somewhat nasty... anyone know something better?) program xfontsel C) see man xterm for other cool command line and resource options such as colors and geometry (height, width, and position on the screen)!! Have fun! -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: system and bios time doubt (hwclock)
On Sun, Aug 22, 1999 at 12:13:24AM +0200, J Horacio MG wrote: Hi, just reviewing a script I was given which I have in /etc/ppp/ip-up.d/ to set the system clock from a server, and then the HARDWARE CLOCK (bios clock?) SET FROM THE SYSTEM'S: Why this part? There's no real harm in having hardware clock that has the incorrect time. I could see if you wanted to keep them in the same neighborhood, but since (almost) nothing USES the hardware clock, there's no great reason to set it frequently. -- #!/bin/sh # set the system clock from slug /usr/sbin/rdate -s slug.ctv.es # set the hardware clock from the system's /sbin/hwclock --systohc -- I noticed that the `--systohc' option, according to `man hwclock', means: Set the System Time from the Hardware Clock. I think you made a typo. Pasting from the manpage: _ --hctosys Set the System Time from the Hardware Clock. This is a good option to use in one of the system startup scripts. --systohc Set the Hardware Clock to the current System Time. ie., it does just the opposite I want it to do, or doesn't it? Shouldn't it be: /sbin/hwclock --set instead? hwclock --set is not used (I'm not sure why hwclock has such wacky syntax, but anyway). The --set option is used with --date as in 'hwclock --set --date=9/22/96 16:45:05' Also, since I have a dial on demand connection, I connect 1+ times a day, therefore the hardware clock is set times accordingly... could that cause any damage? I REALLY doubt that you're going to cause any physical damage, but it is a bit traumatic for a linux box to have it's system time adjusted while running. (rdate may do it nicely, I'm not sure). I've seen some wacky things happen, but nothing bad happened (no program crashes or lost data). -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: rsync from a cron script [SOLVED]
On Wed, Aug 18, 1999 at 08:39:42AM -0400, Michael Stenner wrote: I am running rsync from a script that is executed by cron. It is intended to mirror work stuff at home. It uses my personal accounts on both ends (different accounts). Sadly, rsync returns the following error (and doesn't work :) Permission denied unexpected EOF in read_timeout Thanks for all of the suggestions. They ware all very helpful. As it turns out, I had _SET_ RSYNC_RSH but had not exported it. I was looking for this sort of problem but was using set rather than env and so I didn't see it. It works nicely now! Thanks, Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
rsync from a cron script
I am running rsync from a script that is executed by cron. It is intended to mirror work stuff at home. It uses my personal accounts on both ends (different accounts). Sadly, rsync returns the following error (and doesn't work :) Permission denied unexpected EOF in read_timeout Here's what I've tried: The script works when executed by hand I have included the command ssh remotehost date in order to test that ssh is working from the script (it is) -- yes, I have RSYNC_RSH set to /usr/bin/rsync The only thing I can think of is that some environment isn't being set, but I can't figure out which one. Any ideas? Thanks, Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: rsync from a cron script
On Wed, Aug 18, 1999 at 04:24:06PM +0300, Heikki Vatiainen wrote: Michael Stenner [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have included the command ssh remotehost date in order to test that ssh is working from the script (it is) -- yes, I have RSYNC_RSH set to /usr/bin/rsync ^ Shouldn't this be ssh, not rsync? Doh... Yes, it should, and unfortunately, that IS how it appears in the script. I mistyped in the post :) -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: quick simple latex question
On Tue, Aug 10, 1999 at 08:34:55PM +1000, Shao Zhang wrote:
Hi,
I just cannot find out how to set the a4paper to landscape.
I use:
\usepackage{portland}
\begin{document}
\landscape
\end{document}
But it does not work
What do you mean, it does not work? I suggest you give use the
smallest bit of LaTeX code that is functuonally equivalent to what
you're doing. What you wrote above may be it if you add a
\documentclass and some text after the \landscape. Anyway, strip down
your document to get rid of superfluous crap and then post it. i'll
try to figure out what's wrong.
The problem is, there's nothing wrong with what you posted, so it must
be something else, but you gave us neither the LaTeX error output nor
the symptoms of not work[ing].
-Michael
--
Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513
Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: procmail question (was: looking for a mail client)
On Mon, Aug 09, 1999 at 10:31:51PM +0200, Peter Palfrader aka Weasel wrote: I think I will go for mutt since the PGP stuff works really fine now. However, I have some questions regarding procmail. You have chosen wisely. I switched recently and can't imagine using anything else. Is it possible to have it run automatically when new mail arrives without the need for every user to have his .forward set to |/usr/bin/procmail so only having a .procmailrc fur users that want it? The first paragraph of the procmail manpage says: Procmail should be invoked automatically over the .forward file mechanism as soon as mail arrives. Alternatively, when installed by a system administrator. It looks like you can set it up to automatically run for every mail that arrives (regardless of what people have or have not done to their .forward files) and just not DO anything unless they have a .procmailrc. Is this what you were asking? -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: looking for a mail client
On Sun, Aug 08, 1999 at 07:18:25PM -0700, Eric G . Miller wrote: I stand corrected. I was actually thinking of the mbox-hook, but that only processes messages /after/ they have been read. Seems procmail would be the ticket for filtering large volumes of mail. procmail also offers the following advantage: since it processes each message as it comes in, everything's ready when I sit down and type mutt (or pine, or whatever). In contrast, it's not much fun to watch my mailreader choke on a couple thousand messages if I've been away for a few days. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Shell scripts
On Mon, Aug 09, 1999 at 11:02:24AM -0500, Michael Merten wrote: I've written a rather elaborate shell script and was wondering... are there any script guru's out there with the time and the inclination to take a look at it, and possibly give me some suggestions/comments/pointers on how to improve it? I suggest that you post it here or (to be nice to those who pay per byte) post a URL for it here. If you put a lot of time into it, it's probably something useful, and we might be interested in it for our own selfish reasons, too. Anyway, I'd take a look. (Don't know if I'm a guru, though) -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Login script!
On Sat, Aug 07, 1999 at 08:44:30PM +0200, Rudy Broersma wrote:
Is it possible that Linux executes a script file when a user logs on?
So for example, if user RUDY logs on, it executes the /home/rudy/script
file, and when ROOT logs on, it executes the /root/script file!
your shell takes care of this for you. Note the bash manpage ('man
bash') for the specifics of what it executes and when, but the summary
is this:
if a shell is a login shell (like when you sit down and LOG IN) it
executes:
/etc/profile
~/.bash_profile
~/.bash_login
~/.profile
(note: login shells execute ~/.bash_logout when they exit)
if it is not a login shell (typically, xterms use non-login shells --
as a general, but not universal rule, if you need a password to start
it, it's a login shell), it executes:
~/.bashrc
Other shells have equivalent files, but you'll have to look in the
manpages for the details.
-Michael
--
Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513
Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: no bash commands work
On Wed, Aug 04, 1999 at 07:38:12PM -0500, Brian Servis wrote: *- On 4 Aug, wonko wrote about no bash commands work i use xdm to logon in x and everything works in x, but when i switch to a different terminal for any command it says bash command not found, and i can't restart without going into xdm since i can't run the command... Is it 'bash: command not found' or 'bash command not found', notice the lack of the colon in the second. If it is the first, bash is saying that it can not find whatever command you just tried to run. It sounds like a your path is not defined. What does 'echo $PATH' show in your X terminals compared to your console terminals? Can you run commands using explicit paths, like /bin/ls? I am not sure why your terminal windows in X are working and your console terminals are not. Maybe you have a conditional statement somewhere that sets up differnet environments for X and console. It could be a properly set up .xsession, but no .bash_profile Seems unlikely (since I think they system wide profile should set up some kind of minimal path. Then again, in my early days, I tried to add $HOME/bin to my path (via .bash_login) and accidentally emptied it. My point: make sure that the path statements in .bash_profile, .profile, and .bash_login regarding PATH are the same as in .xsession -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: The Hat: was Re: new logo on debian.org
On Wed, Jul 28, 1999 at 12:02:53AM -0400, Shannon wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], egm2@jps.net writes: What exactly is clever about the Hat? I got the jinni thing. Because that particular kind of hat is well known and it is the kind of thing that sticks in people's minds. It is actually valid to call it clever. OK, so a bunch of people think that the swirl sticks in people's minds as well. I find it more memorable than the hat, actually. Furthermore, what's with the penguin? That never made any sense either. Why not? It is a mascot. Not all mascots have any direct relationship to whatever they represent? Nor do all logos. This was my original point. (well, do a sed -e 's/direct/obvious/' on that first) -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Converting from Redhat to Debian
On Tue, Jul 27, 1999 at 12:05:41AM -, Jordan Howarth wrote: I am currently running Redhat and have decided to try Debian instead. I wish to yay! install from the hard drive from an existing linux partition and have read the instructions for doing this from http://www.us.debian.org/releases/slink/i386/install but am confuse by one aspect. The instructions state that, Note that the partition you are installing from should not be the same as the partitions you are installing Debian to (e.g., /, /usr, /lib, and all that). This is all well and good but how are you able to use that partition as part of the Debian installation. At a guess I would say that Debian only requires certain partitions for its base install and then leaves me to add to the rest including the partition from which I installed. If so, what partition(s) does the base install require? Technically, only one (well, two with swap) partition is required. You could have / with all else being simple directories underneath. This would work, but is not ideal (for a number of reasons not relevant to this discussion). Something standard would be /, /usr, /home, /var, /usr/local I don't have a separate partition for /var (and am regretting it because apt puts a bunch of stuff there). I also have a partition for /str (storage). Something like that would also work for you. If you have a partition that will not be essential for base use (like /str or /usr/local even) then you can use that to install the debian base system, then once you're running on the base debian system, you can clean the partition and mount it as whatever you want. Note: if, at install time, you don't tell Debian you have a separate partition for /usr/local/ (because you're installing from that partition) it MAY create the directory /usr/local/. I don't think that's bad -- you'll just have to: a) mount the partition as /mnt or something, b) mv /usr/local/* /mnt c) remount the partition as /usr/local and edit /etc/fstab If anyone knows a better way, I'd like to know it too! -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: bash scripting
On Mon, Jul 26, 1999 at 05:24:11PM +0930, Michael Talbot-Wilson wrote: I love how people insist on firing off this remark. It is sooo much more explanatory than pasting in a piece of the manpage then breaking it down to a newbies' terms. Then _calmly_ telling them (OFF THE LIST) that they should RTFM without using the RTFM flame. I just think we spend way too much time falming, and not enough time correcting these people who neglect to read People start to say it after they have politely answered the same question approximately 500 times. That's understandable, but I still discourage it. There are about 10,000 new newbies coming onto the Internet every day This is precisely the point. While it may be your 500th time to hear an easy, well-documented problem, it's not fair that when a frustrated newbie finally musters the courage to send email to several thousand people, he gets slapped in the face with RTFM. If it's a cronic offender, then fine, nail 'em, but it's a pretty rough welcome for those who may not know any better. Hell, early in my linux career, I was getting slapped with RTFM and didn't even know what it stood for -- that was useful! all with the same cluelessness and the same questions. Every day, every week, every month, every year. (I say this politely, really) Those who cannot tolerate this should probably not respond. There are others (perhaps those, like me, fresh out of newbie-school themselves) who will be happy to gently steer newbies rather than slam them in the right direction. The manual should only need to be written once, not thousands of times. The person who did write it is usually best qualified to do so. You seem to think anyone else in the world can express the matter better than the original author. If you were to read the bash manual page yourself you would see that it is a brilliant piece of writing that no-one is going to better. I agree, but it can be overwhelming. I was a solid linux user for a long time before I made it through that man page. (forgive the physics anology) You shouldn't hand a high school kid Jackson (graduate electricity and magnetism) when he asks how electromagnets work. It's just too much. The kindest thing you can do for anyone in difficulty is to persuade him that he really does need to study the manual. Agreed, the only way he'll ever make it though the manual is by trying _many_ times. He shouldn't even be posting questions until he has looked into the matter himself and drawn a blank on all fronts. I typically say you should ask for help after scratching your head (i.e. NO ideas) for 1/2 hour. So any question answered in the manual deserves either to be totally ignored or to be flamed. It does NOT deserve an answer. Now that's productive. I would think that even the most cynical oldbie would at least point them to the manual in case they don't know where it is. It is bad netiquette to paste part of the man page, because it creates traffic delivering something that the recipient already has. And no-one owes the newbie that kind of favor. He can cut from the man page himself. He has it, and he can do it. The rest of us are busy people and life is running out. Help where it is needed is one thing. A crutch for the lazy, or foolishly trying to do for someone else what he must surely do for himself, merely because he sent a message out into the wide world, is quite another. I agree with this entire statement. I just think that there is some middle ground between help for the desperate and a crutch for the lazy. The origin of this thread is the perfect example. The word sleep doesn't even appear in the bash man page. man sleep will work, but you first need to know you're looking for sleep. catch 22. Appropriate action? Ask. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: new logo on debian.org
On Mon, Jul 26, 1999 at 02:58:44PM +0200, andreas pålsson wrote: It's a nice idea, but it's too hard to get a grip on when only the swirl is visible. I am sure that people who who never seen the logo before will at some point ask what it supposed to look like. I've seen the swirl and the bottle together and my first reaction was a bottle with smoke or a bottle with something hot in it.. On the other hand maybe it's just me who is less intelligent than the rest of the world and doesn't get it :) I'm not complaining on the author or his artwork, in a artistic level I'm sure it's a fine piece of art. But for the normal guy/girl it's too hard to relate to something than a bottle with a puff of smoke. I'm not sure it's really necessary, though. If there's any meaning behind that hat, I don't know what it is. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Suggestion for Newbie Guide Lines (ITP)
On Thu, Jul 22, 1999 at 08:24:06PM +0200, Colin Marquardt wrote: * Michael Stenner [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: a) using html (this would help us -- we'd just mirror each other) We still need an ASCII document that tells newbies about lynx or Netscape in that case, IMO. Agreed. b) having a table of contents and index ( - index might be hard ) ^^ Not too much if the base is SGML or (La)TeX. That makes me happy. It will probably be in debiandoc-sgml by Martin Bialasinski's suggestion. I'll have to look into this, though. c) trying to keep the documentation very short (ideally a page or less) and step by step, with links to more complete info. This very short documenation should be in plain ASCII, IMO. It should include links, of course, whereever they may lead. What do you mean by ASCII links? You just mean references? I don't mind providing and ASCII version, but I think that for ease of navigation, well designed HTML (as a final version) would be best. Although I can think of a few scenarios that might make us both happy: HTML paths that all end in ascii docs, for example. I also think that the bigger newbie documentation you seem to have in mind (judging from the TOC and index reference) is already written, manyfold. We just need a jump-station to the best of them, put in a prominent place (/etc/motd was my suggestion for a jump-station to the jump-station). That's precisely what I had in mind. For example, On compiling in sound support, I would list the things they need to type and click with only modest fill. I would refer to the mountains of documentation if they want more detail. I see this project as more organizing documentation than writing documentation. On Fri, Jul 23, 1999 at 10:53:04AM +0200, Joachim Trinkwitz wrote: What about using/modifying/enhancing dwww -- I think it would be good to take an existing application as starting point instead of adding another one to those already there (dhelp is there to, but doesn't work for me). Great. At this point, what I am most interested in is finding what documentation and documentation frameworks already exist. In fact, I think I'd like to work on that exclusively for now. I will certainly make note of topics that should be included, but in the present, I will focus on _centralizing_ the documentation in the best way. If anyone else wants to tell me about 1) sources of documentation (LDP, /usr/doc/HOWTO/, etc) 2) documentation frameworks (dhelp, dwww, info, etc) both would be very welcome. There's so much good stuff out there that I'm sure even not-so-newbies like myself don't know about all of them. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Suggestion for Newbie Guide Lines (ITP)
On Thu, Jul 22, 1999 at 09:32:34AM +1000, Doug Young wrote: I think I posted a response to this already, but if not here it is. From a newbie point of view, the actual root of the problem faced by newbies in trying to come to grips with any unix based operating system is NOT that there is insufficient documentation ... but rather that there is TOO MUCH, and that the vast majority of that has been written by experts FOR experts !!! Will someone PLEASE get the message that the present format of MAN, HOWTO, and other stuff is NOT intelligible to the majority of newbies, and that is why there are so many postings on stuff regarded as trivial by experts !!! I agree. In fact, here is something I sent to Patrick offline yesterday in response to a list of items to be included. I would welcome any suggestions at all. We had taken the discussion about the content and structure of newbie-doc off the list, but it seems the list is still interested. I suggest that those who would like to be involved in this more permanently let me know, and I'll start constructing a mini-list that we can fall back to when the interest dies down on debian-user. -Michael Snip from my mail to Patrick: All of these sound great. My thoughts have mostly been about structure. Most of the info that any newbie will ever need already exists, but 1) they aren't aware that it exists 2) they don't know where it is 3) It's too technical or too big What do you think about: a) using html (this would help us -- we'd just mirror each other) b) having a table of contents and index ( - index might be hard ) c) trying to keep the documentation very short (ideally a page or less) and step by step, with links to more complete info. - Original Message - From: Michael Stenner [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Patrick Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Debian-User List debian-user@lists.debian.org; debian-devel@lists.debian.org Sent: Thursday, July 22, 1999 2:10 AM Subject: Re: Suggestion for Newbie Guide Lines (ITP) On Wed, Jul 21, 1999 at 03:58:22PM +0100, Patrick Kirk wrote: If anyone has a few links that they think every newbie should have read, please let me know and while I may not be able to package them, I'll definitesly host them. I'd definitely be willing to maintain such a thing. It would require more input from others than the standard package, though, so I think the idea of a dedicated web page maintainer and a dedicated package maintainer would probably work well. I'm excited. This sounds like fun! I have lots of ideas, too. -Michael Quoting Colin Marquardt([EMAIL PROTECTED]): * Stephan Engelke [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: the most common problem I have encountered when suggesting Linux as an OS to other people is, that even though there is a wealth of docs out there, new users don't know where to look for them. Newbies need to be told Indeed. Going a slight bit astray from the original topic, I´d suggest to add a few lines to /etc/motd, like: If you are a new user to Linux, you´ll want to read the New-User Guide. Do a `more /usr/share/doc/new-user-guide.txt'. This new-user-guide.txt would be a required package, and consist of just a few pointers to the most important information, and with the exact steps on how to read this information with a standard Debian installation. This would also help in reducing the traffic on this and other lists, IMO. Colin Very good idea, Colin. That would be _much_ better than a weekly posting to the list! We would have to find a Maintainer to package it, of course. -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305 -- Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null -- Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: PGP
On Thu, Jul 22, 1999 at 11:03:53AM -0400, Aaron Faby wrote: This may not be the appropriate place to ask, but does anyone know where I can get PGP Key? I'm not sure what you mean. Do you know how pgp works? (roughly) If you wnat to send encrypted mail to people, you need their keys, which you can get from them directly or from a server like http://pgp5.ai.mit.edu/ If you want to sign messages, you need to generate your own pgp key pair. In order to do this you need pgp. The documentation that comes with it should tell you most of what you need to know. If you have already read the documentation or you still have questions after reading it, please repost with a more specific question. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Suggestion for Newbie Guide Lines (ITP)
On Wed, Jul 21, 1999 at 03:58:22PM +0100, Patrick Kirk wrote: If anyone has a few links that they think every newbie should have read, please let me know and while I may not be able to package them, I'll definitesly host them. I'd definitely be willing to maintain such a thing. It would require more input from others than the standard package, though, so I think the idea of a dedicated web page maintainer and a dedicated package maintainer would probably work well. I'm excited. This sounds like fun! I have lots of ideas, too. -Michael Quoting Colin Marquardt([EMAIL PROTECTED]): * Stephan Engelke [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: the most common problem I have encountered when suggesting Linux as an OS to other people is, that even though there is a wealth of docs out there, new users don't know where to look for them. Newbies need to be told Indeed. Going a slight bit astray from the original topic, I´d suggest to add a few lines to /etc/motd, like: If you are a new user to Linux, you´ll want to read the New-User Guide. Do a `more /usr/share/doc/new-user-guide.txt'. This new-user-guide.txt would be a required package, and consist of just a few pointers to the most important information, and with the exact steps on how to read this information with a standard Debian installation. This would also help in reducing the traffic on this and other lists, IMO. Colin Very good idea, Colin. That would be _much_ better than a weekly posting to the list! We would have to find a Maintainer to package it, of course. -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: why so much hate?
On Mon, Jul 19, 1999 at 10:53:02PM +0100, Mark Brown wrote: usage summary. Anything else I thought of seemed to be loosing functionality. and we can't have stray functionality running about unchecked... sorry... -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: 'Inverse' chmod?
On Thu, Jul 15, 1999 at 04:47:26PM -0400, Bob Bernstein wrote: Carl Mummert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: perl -e 'printf %#o, ((stat(FILENAME))[2] 0x1ff)' Great! It works fine from the command line, but I tried it in a shell script with no luck. #! /bin/bash perl -e 'printf %#o, ((stat($1))[2] 0x1ff)' what do you mean, no luck? what was the error message? anyway, you should try #! /bin/bash /usr/bin/perl -e 'printf %#o, ((stat($1))[2] 0x1ff)' or whatever 'which perl' tells you. putting a perl command in a shell script seems silly though... why not just use #!/usr/bin/perl printf %#o, ((stat($ARGV[0]))[2] 0x1ff); -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: mutt address book
On Tue, Jul 13, 1999 at 03:02:04PM +0100, Patrick Kirk wrote: My Outlook address book has over 100 entries. I'd like to be able to import them all into the address book for mutt. Question is...what does Mutt use for address book? put these in your .muttrc: source ~/.mutt_aliases set alias_file=~/.mutt_aliases and .mutt_aliases (or whatever you choose) should contain lines like: alias aslist [EMAIL PROTECTED] (AfterStep) alias deb debian-user@lists.debian.org alias Sise [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Sise, Paul) alias foo Foo Bar [EMAIL PROTECTED] alias group jnb1, mhall, boyd, gauthier, bahar See alias in /usr/doc/mutt/manual.txt -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Mutt PGP Debian User Mailinglist
On Wed, Jul 07, 1999 at 05:14:35PM +0200, P. van Tilburg wrote: Hi all! I am sometime on this list now, and I have some questions. 1) I use mutt to read the debian-user-digest. It lists all attachments nicely in one mail. But how do I reply to a message. I can go in the attachment-list and save the mail I want to reply to, but that isn't very handy either ;) No ideas there. 2) I know nothing about PGP, but I want to try it and installed pgp5i from potato. As earlier mentioned on the list, pgp5.0 is composed of seperate programs: source(/2):~$ dpkg -L pgp5i /usr/bin /usr/bin/pgp5 /usr/bin/pgpe /usr/bin/pgps /usr/bin/pgpv /usr/bin/pgpk good. ** I added to /etc/Muttrc: set pgp_v5=/usr/bin/pgp5 don't do that. use: set pgp_v5=/usr/bin/pgp I know, I know, /usr/bin/pgp doesn't exist. Don't worry. It should never run /usr/bin/pgp. It will only run pgpe, pgps, pgpv, and pgpk (actually, not pgpk). If you tell it pgp5, it will look for pgp5e, pgp5s, etc. and they do not exist. set pgp_v5_language=mutt set pgp_v5_pubring=~/.pgp/pubring.pkr set pgp_v5_secring=~/.pgp/sekring.pkr fine. ** But I still get the following message from mutt while reading: [-- PGP output follows (current time: Wed Jul 7 16:55:09 1999) --] sh: /usr/bin/pgp: No such file or directory [-- End of PGP output --] [-- The following data is PGP/MIME signed --] ** So I symlinked /usr/bin/pgp5 to /usr/bin/pgp, but then I get: you correctly determined that it's looking for /usr/bin/pgp, but I suspect that it is looking for version 2. Try adding this to your .muttrc: set pgp_default_version=pgp5 (and remove your symlink) [-- PGP output follows (current time: Wed Jul 7 16:55:09 1999) --] PGP is now invoked from different executables for different operations: pgpeEncrypt (including Encrypt/Sign) pgpsSign pgpvVerify/Decrypt pgpkKey management pgpoPGP 2.6.2 command-line simulator (not yet implemented) See each application's respective man page or the general PGP documentation for more information. [-- End of PGP output --] This confirms my guess. If it thought it were running pgp5, it wouldn't be trying to run pgp without and e, s, v, or k on the end. Sorry for the loads of output! Loads of output is good!!! This is the kind of message we LIKE here. Thanks in advance for your help, No problem. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: pgp5 problems in mutt
On Mon, Jul 05, 1999 at 09:25:56PM -0700, Nate wrote: Hello all! I've had some problems reading pgp keys when the sender uses pgp5. When I upgraded to pgp5i and added the following lines to my .muttrc file set pgp_v5=/usr/bin/pgp5 ;; set pgp_v5_language=mutt ;; set pgp_v5_pubring= ~/.pgp/pubring.pkr ;; set pgp_v5_secring=~/.pgp/secring.skr When I send a message in mutt and type 'p' 's' to invoke pgp and sign a message, mutt gives me the following error... cannot find pgp5s I do not have a typo in my .muttrc. What is it talking about? Does the file /usr/bin/pgp5s exist? I doubt it. PGP 5 breaks up the functionality into separate programs, if you have installed from the debs, you probably have pgp2.? installed (if at all) as /usr/bin/pgp2 and pgp5 installed as (/usr/bin/pgp, /usr/bin/pgps, /usr/bin/pgpe, /usr/bin/pgpk, /usr/bin/pgpv). What you want to tell mutt is: set pgp_v5=/usr/bin/pgp set pgp_v2=/usr/bin/pgp2 # if you want to still use it mutt is taking the file that you give it and tacking on an s, e, or whatever it needs. -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Where's Apt?
On Fri, Jul 02, 1999 at 10:55:16AM +0300, per_adua32 wrote: I recently received an E-mail from this mailing list in response to a question about installing netscape. It was suggested that I make changes to: /etc/apt/sources.list It seems that this file does not exist on my system. Moreover I can't seem to find anything to do with apt. Could someone say a little about where I could get this program. A not-so-elegant, but effective way to get it: http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages type apt in the search box and hit search once you download it, use dpkg -i apt-.deb to install it I have been using dselect with a cd-dom that I bought, and I tried to use it to find apt but I've had no joy. strange that it's not on your cd... it it old? (the cd, that is) Does someone know any good sources of info viz the usage of apt. there is much documentation in /usr/doc/apt -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: question
On Fri, Jul 02, 1999 at 02:48:42AM -0700, Hung Vu wrote: Can you tell me what GUI is Debian compatible with? And what it is not compatible with? My e-mail is [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank you! not sure what you mean... Debian can use the X windowing system and comes with XFree86 Upon that, you can run any of a LARGE number of window managers. You can also run Gnome or KDE Is that what you meant? -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
color in emacs terminal
Can emacs do color when in terminal mode like mutt, ls, dselect, etc. can? I've become addicted to font-lock-mode and I'd like to do something similar even when I have to use it windowless (or in an xterm, anyway). -Michael -- Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: grep \ ... how
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I need to write a script to replace '\'s with '/', but how can I get grep to accept '\' as a regular expression (it assumes it to be line continue character, at least from the sh prompt)? -- stuff about tr and sed -- If backslashes will only appear in file paths, you are set. If they appear in some other contents where they need to be kept, then look at a more sophisticated tool like sed. This it true... the '\' also appears in printf's IE: fprintf(\t hello \n); At this point, it might be worth your time to learn a little perl. I know that sed and awk are rather powerful, too, but if you're porting a program, you must be reasonably proficient at programming. you will find a little time learning perl's regular expressions rather useful later on, too. -Michael I (and many others) can give you a little help with a perl script (less than 10 lines) that would correctly modify 99% of your backslashes. Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: grep \ ... how
On Fri, 11 Jun 1999, Kenneth Scharf wrote: Yeah I guess I really need to order a copy of the 'camel' book from amazon. I heartily recommend it! I have been extremely impressed with perl. In hindsight, it was one of my best investments (time and money). -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: PKUNZIP Equivalent?
go to http://www.debian.org/distrib/packages and search on zip and unzip I use the (un)zip-crypt packages and am pleased. -Michael On Sun, 30 May 1999, Kent West wrote: A friend sent me some images compressed into one file using PKZIP (for DOS/Windows); is there a tool on Linux to unzip that, or do I need to dual-boot into Windows and unzip it there? Thanks! -- Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Sound devices missing
On Sat, 29 May 1999, Mark Nellemann wrote: Whenever I install a Debian (slink or potato), it seems that the sound devices (/dev/dsp, /dev/mixer, ..) is missing. So I install the devices with a script from a 2.0.x kernel found in Documentation/sound. Am I wrong or is this the right thing to do ? I don't know if it's actively wrong, but the standard way to do it is to use the script in /dev/ calles MAKEDEV (or something like that.. you'll see it). Run MAKEDEV audio. You should look in the script to make sure that this is correct. It may have a manpage as well. A word of warning - by default, it makes the devices in your present working directory, so be in /dev/ when you run it :) -Michael
Re: emacs confused about alt and meta solved
The answer to this is interesting and should be in the docs somewhere, but I sure couldn't find it. Emacs DOES NOT seem to care about KEYSYMs at all. It is only interested in the Modifiers. As far as emacs is concerned MOD1 = META and MOD4 = ALT You can (using xmodmap) have MOD1 and MOD4 generated by whatever keysym you want (Alt_L, Meta_R, underscore). SPECIFICS TO MY PROBLEM: MOD1 was generated by Alt_R, MOD4 wasn't generated at all. I hope this is of use to future generations :) -Michael P.S. Thanks for the help, Jens. On Fri, 28 May 1999, Michael Stenner wrote: emacs seems to want to interpret ALT as META and ignore META altogether. I found no mention of this in the emacs docs. I'm pretty convinced that it's an emacs issue: I've used xev to confirm that it's getting the appropriate keysyms, so when I say it interprets ALT as META, what I mean is: It gets the ALT keysym, but behaves as if I pushed META. Summary: Keysymsemacs behavior ALT-x M-x META-x x I've used xmodmap to change the keysyms that are sent, but that doesn't change the way emacs interprets them. (Does emacs truly look at keysyms or does it use keycodes?) I've also followed the advice from a thread (included below) that heppened a while back, to no avail. suggestions are welcome :) -Michael REPOSTED FROM PREVIOUS THREAD = Re: Emacs and the ALT key. _ * To: Havoc Pennington [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Subject: Re: Emacs and the ALT key. * From: Jens B. Jorgensen [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 10:04:27 -0500 * CC: Allen B. Riddell [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Organization: Business Data Services, Inc. * References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ I posted a lengthy description of how to deal with this back in August (the problem was introduced with hamm). I'll repost the content here: This problem has come up so many times since hamm started getting used that it almost merits its own HOWTO. What's happened is that you've upgraded X and now you are using the XKEYBOARD extension. As you've noticed, the ALT key now does ALT and the windows key is now the META key. I've argued several times that this is a bug since it changes behavior. Alas no one listens to this raving madman. Where's whatcha do (as root): sed -e 's/Alt_L/Foo_L/' -e 's/Alt_R/Foo_R/' \ /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us |\ sed -e 's/Meta_L/Alt_L/' -e 's/Meta_R/Alt_R/' |\ sed -e 's/Foo_L/Meta_L/' -e 's/Foo_R/Meta_R/' \ /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us.new mv /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us.old mv /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us.new /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us (Now restart X and Things should work normally. Michael Symalla wrote: Dear Debian users, can anyone help me to let my Alt-key be the metakey in emacs? Now I am using the ESC key, which works fine but is not as comfortable as the ALT key. Thanks a lot. -- Bye Mitch Havoc Pennington wrote: On Wed, 12 May 1999, Allen B. Riddell wrote: the ALT key (on my PC keyboard) doesn't seem to work in emacs.. It works in netscape -- and aside from that, I have absolutely no problems at all with anything... Probably the Windows key (if you have one) is bound to the Meta keysym, which is what Emacs is looking for; I don't think Emacs uses the Alt keysym at all by default. If you don't have a Windows key, you need to move Meta to some other key of your choice. (Many people have the physical Alt key send both Alt and Meta keysyms, which is technically wrong but works nice in practice, since few apps use both keysyms. However, XEmacs insists on complaining about it every time you start up.) That said, I'm not sure how to do this without Xmodmap. Perhaps it will help to know what you're trying to achieve though. :-) Havoc -- Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
emacs confused about alt and meta
emacs seems to want to interpret ALT as META and ignore META altogether. I found no mention of this in the emacs docs. I'm pretty convinced that it's an emacs issue: I've used xev to confirm that it's getting the appropriate keysyms, so when I say it interprets ALT as META, what I mean is: It gets the ALT keysym, but behaves as if I pushed META. Summary: Keysyms emacs behavior ALT-x M-x META-x x I've used xmodmap to change the keysyms that are sent, but that doesn't change the way emacs interprets them. (Does emacs truly look at keysyms or does it use keycodes?) I've also followed the advice from a thread (included below) that heppened a while back, to no avail. suggestions are welcome :) -Michael REPOSTED FROM PREVIOUS THREAD = Re: Emacs and the ALT key. _ * To: Havoc Pennington [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Subject: Re: Emacs and the ALT key. * From: Jens B. Jorgensen [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 10:04:27 -0500 * CC: Allen B. Riddell [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Organization: Business Data Services, Inc. * References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] _ I posted a lengthy description of how to deal with this back in August (the problem was introduced with hamm). I'll repost the content here: This problem has come up so many times since hamm started getting used that it almost merits its own HOWTO. What's happened is that you've upgraded X and now you are using the XKEYBOARD extension. As you've noticed, the ALT key now does ALT and the windows key is now the META key. I've argued several times that this is a bug since it changes behavior. Alas no one listens to this raving madman. Where's whatcha do (as root): sed -e 's/Alt_L/Foo_L/' -e 's/Alt_R/Foo_R/' \ /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us |\ sed -e 's/Meta_L/Alt_L/' -e 's/Meta_R/Alt_R/' |\ sed -e 's/Foo_L/Meta_L/' -e 's/Foo_R/Meta_R/' \ /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us.new mv /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us.old mv /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us.new /usr/lib/X11/xkb/symbols/us (Now restart X and Things should work normally. Michael Symalla wrote: Dear Debian users, can anyone help me to let my Alt-key be the metakey in emacs? Now I am using the ESC key, which works fine but is not as comfortable as the ALT key. Thanks a lot. -- Bye Mitch Havoc Pennington wrote: On Wed, 12 May 1999, Allen B. Riddell wrote: the ALT key (on my PC keyboard) doesn't seem to work in emacs.. It works in netscape -- and aside from that, I have absolutely no problems at all with anything... Probably the Windows key (if you have one) is bound to the Meta keysym, which is what Emacs is looking for; I don't think Emacs uses the Alt keysym at all by default. If you don't have a Windows key, you need to move Meta to some other key of your choice. (Many people have the physical Alt key send both Alt and Meta keysyms, which is technically wrong but works nice in practice, since few apps use both keysyms. However, XEmacs insists on complaining about it every time you start up.) That said, I'm not sure how to do this without Xmodmap. Perhaps it will help to know what you're trying to achieve though. :-) Havoc
Re: Lexmark is less than helpful : -
An effective (although not completely honest :) ) way to do it is: Instead of saying: I just bought your printer -- do you have linux drivers Say: I'm thinking about buying your printer -- do you have linux drivers? -Michael On Fri, 28 May 1999, John Gay wrote: I just found the link, it is: http://www.picante.com/~gtaylor/pht/printer_list.cgi?make=Lexmark This will give you a list of ALL Lexmark printers. The 1000 is listed as 'paperweight' i.e. does NOT work with Linux : ( a number of other Lexmark printer do work, though. Like I said, the best thing is to use this list BEFORE buying a printer, not after, like I did. But, with the support Linux has been getting from all corners lately, I feel it will only be a matter of time before Lexmark and others start to fall in line. What ever happened to 'The customer is ALWAYS Right'? I let Lexmark know I was looking for Linux drivers for their printer, if enough of their other customer also start looking for Linux drivers, they may change their mind about supporting Linux. *WARNING This must NOT turn into an ugly battle. HATE Mail is always forwarded to /dev/null. legitimate requests from customers, though are never ignored for long. I believe there is a HOW-TO for Linux Advocacy which would be good reading before firing off loads of requests for drivers. Myself, when I find a device that isn't supported, I send a simple request for Linux drivers, and hope that others will do the same. That's my 1.575302 Euros worth. Cheers, John Gay -- Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: daylight savings time aint savin' ME time
Thanks, guys. That worked. But I'm still confused. Why is it necessary to use tzconfig to change my timezone from EDT to EDT? That's all I did, but now it behaves correctly. What does the install do differently? Also, It's not that I don't read docs. It just didn't occur to me that I needed to change the timezone -- It was right, after all :) -Michael On Sat, 22 May 1999, Bob Nielsen wrote: On Sat, May 22, 1999 at 03:40:15PM -0400, Michael Stenner wrote: Ever since Daylight savings time struck, my clock has been incorrect. I've tried setting it with hwclock --set --date=bla bla which seems to work, according to hwclock --show but when I reboot, the clocks (system AND hardware) are still wrong. I've also tried setting it in the BIOS. Again, my computer outsmarts me. Once, I used hwclock --set --date= followed by hwclock --systohw (or whichever one makes the system clock the same as the hardware clock) this did permanently change my clock (i.e. upon reboot it was still changed), but it changed it by TWO hours!! What am I doing wrong, here? 'man tzconfig' should help. Bob -- Bob Nielsen Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tucson, AZ AMPRnet: [EMAIL PROTECTED] DM42nh http://www.primenet.com/~nielsen Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
daylight savings time aint savin' ME time
Ever since Daylight savings time struck, my clock has been incorrect. I've tried setting it with hwclock --set --date=bla bla which seems to work, according to hwclock --show but when I reboot, the clocks (system AND hardware) are still wrong. I've also tried setting it in the BIOS. Again, my computer outsmarts me. Once, I used hwclock --set --date= followed by hwclock --systohw (or whichever one makes the system clock the same as the hardware clock) this did permanently change my clock (i.e. upon reboot it was still changed), but it changed it by TWO hours!! What am I doing wrong, here? Thanks, Michael Other info: slink Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
pgp help -- 2.6.2 5.0
Problem: debain folks all use 2.6.2 and RSA I have other friends (in the windows world) who use 5.* and DH/DSS. I would like to be able to deal with both without too much trouble. This suggests that I use 5.0 and import an RSA keypair generated by 2.6.2. Great! Question: How the )%(# do I do that? Lots of places say it can be done - some are helpful enough to say 1) import the public 2) modify the trust 3) import the private This is mostly useless to me. It still thinks that I have someone elses key - just that I trust them a lot. I'm sure someone has dealt with this before - I just need a quick tutorial. How did you handle it? -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: diskless box: fanless too ?
On Tue, 4 May 1999, John C. Ellingboe wrote: Michael Stenner wrote: I disagree that the cpu would need a fan - I used to run a very old P60 (a REALLY hot chip) without a fan (fan kept breaking...) and it was toasty but caused no problems. If you choose a cpu that runs cool, you should be OK. You can also look into thermoelectric (or Peltier) coolers -- no moving parts. You still have to get the heat (cpu + Peltier device) out of the box. Even though the cpu will be cool, when using a Pelier device the box will become quite toasty. One of the heat pipe devices would be a better choice. There you would have a heatsink plate mounted on the cpu and a tube running out side the case to a heatsink. Admittedly, I may not be as cautious as I should be about these things, but it doesn't seem to me that the box would necessarily get dangerously hot. When I was doing it, I left the box open, but as I said, that was a VERY hot chip. I've never heard of a heat pipe, but that sounds quite nice. I'm a little confused: is it a true pipe (i.e. with air inside) that relies on convection? or is it something like a copper rod? I must also say that the suggestions about controlling the Peltier cooler are quite good. You can buy a ready-made device for cheap. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: diskless box: fanless too ?
On Mon, 3 May 1999, G. Crimp wrote: I have been asked to help someone learn about Linux. So far, I have installed Linux on an existing box. I must also give advice on new hardware. One of the concerns this person has, is not having anything spinning in his office. He currently uses a diskless sparc station, which is apparently also fanless since it is very very quiet. Does anyone know if the same is possible in the ix86 architechture ? I know I could set him up with a diskless box booting off a server in another room, but could that diskless box also have a fanless powersupply ? I figure the cpu would still need its fan. Anyone think that the absence of a fan in a diskless box would cause heating problems ?? Thinking about what the power supply would need to power, if there were no moving parts at all, it would just have to feed the mb, chip and cards. That's not tiny, but better than 2 HDs, a CDROM, and a Floppy (you could still probably use the cdrom and floppy since they are typically used occasionally) Were you looking to find a special power supply that didn't have a fan? or were you planning on breaking a standard power supply? I disagree that the cpu would need a fan - I used to run a very old P60 (a REALLY hot chip) without a fan (fan kept breaking...) and it was toasty but caused no problems. If you choose a cpu that runs cool, you should be OK. You can also look into thermoelectric (or Peltier) coolers -- no moving parts. I think with an hour or so of reasearch you should have no trouble with a reasonable setup. -Michael P.S. I have a Dual PII 400 with something like 4 fans (not counting CPU fans) next to my desk. Sounds like a jet engine... I'm sympathetic Then again, how much can you complain about a Dual PII 400? Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: xhosts question..
On Mon, 3 May 1999, Allen B. Riddell wrote: Ok, I'm using xdm and everything, when I su to root from my normal account and try to use x programs -- the program yells at me and tells me to use xhost to add whatever host to the list of approved addresses... Anyway -- so I get out of the shell and type xhost localhost or something like that -- then I su back and everything works fine. I've read man xhost or xhosts, can't remember which -- but anyway, I can't decipher if there is some file that controls access that I could just add localhost or whatever to and avoid this whole mess in the first place? my understanding is that xhost is NOT the preferred way of handling this, although if you are not worried about nasty people getting onto you machine, it is certainly the simplest. If you are not real security worried, just put xhost +yourhostname (basically, the command you are already using) in your .xsession (I think that's the right file) or something. If you ARE careful about security issues, or you just want to establish good habits, use the xauth command instead. It's a little more work, but it's much more secure. I use the following command from a script as root: su mstenner -c 'xauth nextract - :0' | xauth nmerge - OK... I THINK that's the command I use. I'm at work at the moment. In any event, this command and the xauth manpage should tell you what you need to get started. You may need to explicitly tell xauth which files to use (see the -f option) The major reason that the latter method is more secure than the former: it allows only root to access your X session. xhost +localhost allows anyone on your machine to run x applications in your session, and to do some really nasty things (capture keystrokes) and some entertaining things (move your mouse pointer, change your background...) You decide :) -Michael
.debs using /usr/local/
I though that, as a general policy, .debs didn't put anything in the /usr/local/ tree. However, I'm pretty (i.e. 99%) sure that in my slink r0 install, a few things were put in there - some python, tex, and emacs things, actually. Anyone know anything about this? Am I just nuts? -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
silly mouse question
At least I hope it's silly Installing 2.1_r0 and I have a PS/2 mouse (says so on the mouse) plugged onto the PS/2 port on the box. Problem is, neither gpm nor X seem to be happy with it (i.e. see it at all) gpm's autodetect promptly rules out ALL possibilities claiming they have a different read() semantic and XF86Setup lets my try any combination I want... just that none of them work :) any clever ideas about what to try next? The only idea I have is to try lots of combinations of things and hope that one works. If anyone has any more systematic ideas, I'd be happy to hear them. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
RE: silly mouse question
On Fri, 30 Apr 1999, Person, Roderick wrote: I have to say that using the gpm autodetect never worked for me. Just type in the mouse type and info yourself Just use /dev/psaux for the mouse type. I did that, actually, with no luck. It claims that /dev/psaux is not a directory (which I agree with :) ). Sorry I didn't mention it I never used XF86Setup. Didn't like it. I prefer xf86config, much better! Try that and use the same driver for the mouse. Acually, I'll one-up ya'. I HATE xf86config! i either use XF86Setup or edit the file by hand. It didn't occur to me that the problem might be that the wrong stuff is being put into the file, though. -Michael Installing 2.1_r0 and I have a PS/2 mouse (says so on the mouse) plugged onto the PS/2 port on the box. Problem is, neither gpm nor X seem to be happy with it (i.e. see it at all) gpm's autodetect promptly rules out ALL possibilities claiming they have a different read() semantic and XF86Setup lets my try any combination I want... just that none of them work :) any clever ideas about what to try next? The only idea I have is to try lots of combinations of things and hope that one works. If anyone has any more systematic ideas, I'd be happy to hear them. Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
RE: silly mouse question
On Fri, 30 Apr 1999, Person, Roderick wrote: It claims that /dev/psaux is not a directory (which I agree with :) ). Sorry I didn't mention it [Person, Roderick] This sound like the you need to make the device, although I have to say I never had this problem, with a mouse of having to make the device. I'm not 100% on that better check with someone else. That seems to me a strange error. I'm sorry that I continue to be unclear. The device exists. ls /dev/ reveals a /dev/psaux, but I just mean that it is NOT a directory... Acually, I'll one-up ya'. I HATE xf86config! i either use XF86Setup or edit the file by hand. It didn't occur to me that the problem might be that the wrong stuff is being put into the file, though. [Person, Roderick] Well, I have to agree that editing by hand is the best by far. But, I haven't had time to figure out the monitor section, so I use it to get that working, and patch up the rest of the file. I do recall that XF86Setup and xf86config, write the the XF86Config file differently. It seems to me that when I did use XF86Setup the config file came out smaller. I didn't know if that was good or bad. But, since I could never get my X server to start with it, I assumed it was bad. I believe XF86Setup puts in only what you need (according to it, of course) whereas xf86config comments out things you don't need. This makes it much harder to read, but it contains more examples and such. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: NT vs Linux as web server
note the following about 4/5 of the way through Mindcraft, Inc. conducted the performance tests described in this report between March 10 and March 13, 1999. Microsoft Corporation sponsored the testing reported herein. -Michael On Wed, 14 Apr 1999, Peter S Galbraith wrote: My IT manager just EMailed me this article (CC'ed to a bunch of Directors, of course): http://www.mindcraft.com/whitepapers/nts4rhlinux.html Microsoft Windows NT Server 4.0 is 2.5 times faster than Linux as a File Server and 3.7 times faster as a Web Server. I'm sure I could dig up opposing reviews. Anyone know of any? Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: [off-topic] How to auto-run xlock?
On Thu, 8 Apr 1999, Rick Macdonald wrote: On Fri, 9 Apr 1999, Hamish Moffatt wrote: Shouldn't nicing it to the lowest level mean it only runs in idle time anyway? Or does it display things when running? I need to try various nice values and pay more attention, but I could feel it's presence when it's running at nice=1. It's all numerical nice=19 is the LOWEST priority, nice=-20 is the HIGHEST. Negative numbers are only available to root. So, when you moved it from 0 to 1, you didn't really do all that much. Try sending it all the way to 19. -Michael computation and soaks up lots of CPU. Memory isn't a problem for me (I have 256MB). It doesn't display anthing, just a stream of progress prints to stdout that you can /dev/null. Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: What DO you lose with Linux ???
I have to agree completely that there are SERIOUS holes that need to be filled. A short list of things that I miss every day (a suitable equivalent would be ok): egrep sed afterstep xv (not too big, not too small) tgif . . . Oh, lose with _linux_... my bad. I'm just making the point that there are things you _gain_ with linux, too. If you're going to miss music composition more than you like a good Window manager, that's fine, but there _are_ good programs for linux that aren't available on windows platforms. We can't forget that. Other things we can't forget: Since users won't use until apps exist and apps won't be written until there are lots of users, a slow ascent is as good as it gets. There is going to be incrimental improvement in # of users AND # number of apps. Period. The linux community is no more RESPONSIBLE for creating applications than Microsoft is. Does Microsoft make music composition software? My point is: Sometimes it feels like we are getting a bit defensive. We don't need to defend linux. There's nothing (major) wrong with it. If we want to _promote_ it, great. But there's no need to defend it. I no longer sweat it if people look into linux and don't see the apps they want. Lots of people who did that 6 months ago are ecstatic linux users today. I'll get worried when linux stops moving forward. Till' then, I'm enjoying the ride. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: My ip-ip.d directory not executed
I think it says in ip-up (the sript, not the directory) that all of the scripts are run with minimal (or even no) environment. So DISPLAY probably IS set, but ip-up is run without any of these variables. The wierdness here is not X or linux in general. It's the way pppd and ip-up work. -Michael On Wed, 24 Mar 1999, John Leget wrote: I ran into similar problems fortunately i had had some trouble with junkbuster ( one way of looking at it grin) and remembered seeing the following in the /etc/init.d/junkbuster startup script su nobody -c command so i tried this su myself -c proggy to launch and found it complained about not knowing where the X display was so i set DISPLAY=:0 ( in the script i set up for it ) and tried again and it worked fine. Im just wondering - wouldnt it be an idea to have the DISPLAY variable set when X is launched. ( And yes i know its possible to run multiple X servers but id assume those able to set that up would figure the rest out easily, me im just learning to crawl in linux ;0) ) Cheers Daniel Mashao wrote: On 23 Mar 1999, John Hasler wrote: Daniel Mashao writes: Is there any way to send the output of pppd to a file so I can debug what is happenning. Sure. Put this in your script: echo Running /etc/ppp/running and the string 'Running' will appear in the file /etc/ppp/running if the script executes. Thanks I did all these tests and indeed the scripts are running. I still have to figure out how to have xnetload to load immediately after pppd starts. It seems to be a problem with the display settings and path. /--/ Daniel J. Mashao Electrical Engineering [EMAIL PROTECTED] University of Cape Town http://www.ee.uct.ac.za/~daniel Rondebosch, 7700, S. Africa (w) 27+21+650 2816 (h) 27+21+705 8469 /--/ -- Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null -- Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: PLEASE READ! IMPORTANT! ALL THE MEMBERS! PLEASE READ!
On Fri, 12 Mar 1999, Marshall Savage wrote: Filtering gets the email messages from the listserver into the correct separate email box. However it does nothing for the overwhelming volumn problem which threading would considerably help. Both web based discussion managers news reader programs handle treading well. For a group of this volume you would need a good discussion server at least one public server that I know of just isn't up to the job. It's to busy for good service. I wonder why this listserver group hasn't long ago gone to a news/news server I agree that threading is pretty much necessary for reading these lists, but there is another reason I prefer that it stay with mail. I suspect (I have no data :) that because 1) a mailing list requires active subscription to use effectively 2) the mail is intrusive, people are much more thoughtful about what they post. With a news group, it's so easy to send tons of crap without feeling (as) guilty. The result is, this list stays on-topic comparatively well. Also, and this is not so persuasive, I keep up better because if I don't, I'll be flooded very quickly. -Michael P.S. Pine threads also (sort-of) Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: I can't beleive this
On Thu, 11 Mar 1999, Steve Lamb wrote:
On Thu, 11 Mar 1999 14:40:35 -0500 (EST), Michael Stenner wrote:
But it shouldn't be an exclusive or. As time has passed, I have come
to respect the people who view computers as tools. They don't want to
have to learn, they don't want to have to configure, and they don't want
fine-grained control. They just want to run mathematica, or type some
documents, etc.
I have no respect for those people. Yes, a computer is a tool. But
lets drop in a few other examples.
Say... a car. A car is a tool. People don't want to learn, they don't
want to have to learn how to drive, they certainly don't want stick shifts.
Wait, they don't want to learn how to drive... Well, do you want to be on
the road with those people? I don't.
How about... a tablesaw. A tablesaw is a tool. People don't want to
learn, they don't want to have to learn how to configure it, they certainly
don't want fine grained control. But, gee, if you don't know how to
configure it then, guess what, you lose a few fingers. I'm sure the trauma
centers around the world would much prefer these people to learn.
These are safety issues. I am all for users being educated in computer
related safety issues, like hmmm... can't think of any.
Take the old physicist down the hall... he has this great new thing for
numerical integration. It makes many things possible that just weren't
before. Why should he give a *^% about IRQs, printcaps, I/O addresses,
kernel modules, monitor hsync, or ipmasks?
1) safety? No.
2) so he doesn't get ripped off on crappy stuff? No. there are plenty
of good sources (friends, consumer reports, etc.) for answering this
UNAVOIDABLE question.
3) because he has to? certainly not. Win95 (and to a lesser extent,
RedHat) will take care of all of these things for him. Sure, there are
tradeoffs, but it's a reasonable one for him. After all, he just wants
to do some integrals. He doesn't really care if he has to reboot
occasionally.
So, why do you have no respect for this guy? He's not likely to hurt
any little kids with his ignorance. Must everyone be interested in the
inner workings of computers to earn your respect?
Others have said that you cannot have this automation and power. I
don't see why there cannot (physically) be two installation programs.
Choose which one to run at the beginning. One autodetects things and
makes assumptions about what you want, the other gives you
fine-grained control. Now if you guys in on the development say it's
impossible, and we've got to go one route or the other, i'll defer to
your judgement. But
\begin{point}
I'm getting really tired of us sitting around and insulting people who
don't have the same _interests_ that we do. That's just about as snobby
and pious as it gets.
\end{point}
-Michael
P.S.
(trailing off now...)
Why do people thing that windows is pure badness? You will have a hard
time convincing me that it's impossibe to have a system which DOES
autodetect my ethernet card install drivers, but DOES NOT crash all
the time. Whenever I point out that windows does something cool,
everybody lashes back that it's a pile of crap. I couldn't agree more,
but it still does some cool stuff.
I think they've got a good programmer chained in the basement or
something...
Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513
Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: I can't beleive this
On Fri, 12 Mar 1999, Steve Lamb wrote: On Fri, 12 Mar 1999 10:07:08 -0500 (EST), Michael Stenner wrote: These are safety issues. I am all for users being educated in computer related safety issues, like hmmm... can't think of any. They drive the point home that any tool you are likely to use needs training to PROPERLY operate it. That's why truck and bus drivers get different licenses than regular folk. Different training. No point in learning how to drive a truck if you don't need to haul stuff. If you don't need to maintain a network, why learn about it. So, why do you have no respect for this guy? He's not likely to hurt any little kids with his ignorance. Must everyone be interested in the inner workings of computers to earn your respect? No. But he must be willing to be trained with the tool instead of whining that things aren't easy enough. Who said he was whining? He doesn't whine. He just goes out and buys Windows 98. When we start rolling our eyes and telling him he should use linux, he politely explains that he doesn't want to take the time to mess with all that crap. The more we go back and forth, the more I suspect we're talking about different things. I'm saying its ok for people to WANT an OS which does administrative tasks for you. You're complaining about people who EXPECT an OS to do administrative tasks for you (and who bitch a lot when they don't get something). We're describing two different sets of people. You're complaints hardly apply only to the computer world (I know you didn't say they did). People just EXPECT everything in general. That bugs me to no end also, but in this case, there's nothing wrong with WANTING an easy OS. When I point out that windows does something cool, everybody lashes back that it's a pile of crap. I couldn't agree more, but it still does some cool stuff. Linux does more cool stuff. I agree. Linux is better. Lots better. Damn near every Cool think that Windows does Linux does smaller, faster, easier. If there is something that Windows does that Linux doesn't it is because the Windows design model is backwards that's pretty extreme. What's WRONG with autodetecting hardware and installing drivers? Sure, it messes up sometimes, but then you just do it by hand, like you do EVERY time in linux. I'm just saying that the IDEA is a good one. The code is REALLY bad, but we've got lots of good programmers... -Michael
Re: I can't beleive this
On Wed, 10 Mar 1999, George Bonser wrote: On Thu, 11 Mar 1999, Richard Lyon wrote: Yes I am new to linux and like dselect. Gives one a good grasp on what is going on and makes installing packages a breeze. Maybe we should form the dselect self-help group to try and convince ourselves that dselect is no good. Maybe repeating the following 500 times every morning will help: Good idea. I think people have gotten lazy when it comes to computers. If what they are doing is not immediately obvious then somehow they think the program is broken. The current mindset is that if you have to read instructions, it is too complicated. They are willing to sacrifice fine-grained control for simplicity. All one has to do is READ the directions and dselect becomes very easy to use ... but that is the part they all skip. Re: They are willing to sacrifice fine-grained control for simplicity But it shouldn't be an exclusive or. As time has passed, I have come to respect the people who view computers as tools. They don't want to have to learn, they don't want to have to configure, and they don't want fine-grained control. They just want to run mathematica, or type some documents, etc. Now, if we decide that we are not interested in those types of users, that's fine. With a limited amount of resources, we might just decide that we'd rather put the time into other things. It is neither fair nor reasonable, though, to dismiss them as lazy. It is just not worth the time for some people to read docs or tweek config files when they don't have to. (And they don't with RedHat and Windows... at least, not as much) -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: I can't believe this
On Sun, 7 Mar 1999, Mark Wagnon wrote: I can't really find any criticisms that were mentioned that reading through the docs, or asking on this list wouldn't solve. First off, I agree with you. However, people don't want to have to read through the docs, or rather, hunt through the docs. People want to have everything you need to know (ideally that is very little) on the screen as you need it. We're not there yet... RedHat is closer. Windows is there, but there are certain tradeoffs :) -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Vote Linus for Person of the Century - EXTREMELY OFF TOPIC
On Fri, 5 Mar 1999, George Bonser wrote: On Fri, 5 Mar 1999 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: just did, but is this list not moderated, Jesus Christ is so far I now, from a different century and he is on top? Matth Don't even think Linus should BE the person of the century. That honor probably goes to Thomas Edison. We owe our current culture and style of living to that guy. His experiments with his lightbulb led to the discovery of the Edison effect which led DeForest to do some more experiments which led to the Vacuum Tube which led to the Transistor, which lead to the IC Chip. Not only was Edison's work responsible for laying the ground work for radio and television, he also played vital roles in bringing motion pictures and recorded music to the public. Linus Torvalds is probablt important but nowhere near THE most important. Lets try to keep some perspective. This is why it's a vote rather than a consensus. (What about Thomas Edison's parents?) I'm all for giving the guy credit for what he DID... Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Is Linux addictive?
On Fri, 5 Mar 1999, Matthew Cocker wrote: Linux should have to be distributed with a surgeon generals warning about the possible addictive nature of Linux. What do you mean? I can quit any time I want... I just don't want to :) Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: latex
On Thu, 18 Feb 1999, Shao Zhang wrote:
Also, how do I break text into paragraphs without any white
spaces at the beginning of each paragraph. I am using paragraph within
section, but even if I use \noindent, it still put some white spaces at
the beginning of each paragraph. This is what I did:
\section{...}
\paragraph\noindent { ... }
'\parindent=0pt' would do it. Now, you won't be able to tell one
paragraph from another, unless you put extra vertical '\parskip'
between them. Again, why are you using \paragraph? I never ever use
it.
Thanks. I will try that. I don't know why I am using it. I just
want to break them into paragraphs, so what command should I use
instead??
In your .tex file, leave a blank line (nothing but a return). LaTeX
interprets this as a paragrach break. In general, LaTeX completely
ignores whitespace, but in this case it is significant. Multiple blank
lines don't change the behavior. If you want the space (say, to make
the .tex file readable) but you don't want a new paragraph, just comment
the line out (with a %).
I bought the book Latex Companion, I read a bit of it already, but
I still don't have an idea, when should I use what command. I guess I
must
be learning in a wrong way.
From what I've heard, it's a good book, but the best thing to do is to
get real life examples that are similar to the stuff you want to do. I
use books mostly for the gee, how do I make that symbol? type
questions. Good luck.
-Michael
Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513
Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: slashdot poll
On Wed, 10 Feb 1999, Randy Edwards wrote: I think overall we could eliminate a *lot* of the prompts in an install just by making assumptions. Perhaps a two-mode install should be used: expert and novice mode. Ask the expert everything, let them have full power. you could easily go even farther than that? OK, this might be impractical, but it sounds easy... Each step could be assigned (internally) a ranking according to user knowledge: 1 = what's a computer ---to--- 10 = Linus at the beginning of the install, you rank yourself. Then, for each step, 1) Explanation is automatically offered if it ranks higher than you AND 2) a default config is assumed if it ranks higher than you. You could make it so that the explanation is also available in expert modes via a help button This is Michael's suggestion v0.1 Just an idea. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Find
This is an application specific thing - three things pop to mind: 1) grep - you know what that's useful for 2) less - hit the / key and then type the thing your looking for (and hit return) hit n to find the next occurance. ? searches in reverse. 3) emacs - ctrl-s and type the word. Hit ctrl-s to find the next occurance. as I said, the behavior you want is handled by the specific program, not the OS. It just so happens that most programs in Windows use the same key (ctrl-f) and look the same. I think most good programs in linux will have a search behavior, but will just have different keys. I hope this helps. If you still have questions, ask away! -Michael NOTE: less is the standard man pager, so the search is VERY nice when flipping through man pages. On Tue, 9 Feb 1999, KTB wrote: I can't say I'm a grep whiz but I don't think it will do what I'm looking for. For example if I'm looking for a certain word in a long text file, the file is loaded in an xterm window, will grep find the word and place it in front of me highlighted? In windows I hit ctrl+f, I get a pop up that allows me to enter a word, search for the word up or down and the program places it in my view. Kent Steve Lamb wrote: On Tue, 09 Feb 1999 21:27:37 -0600, KTB wrote: Does anyone know if there's a program like the find program in windows? It allows you to search for a key word in most windows you have open, it finds the word, takes you to the word and highlights it. Do you mean in text files? grep Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Afterstep configuration.
On Wed, 27 Jan 1999, Andrew Ivanov wrote: I got a 14 monitor, and even with 1024x764 Wharf buttons in AfterStep do look kinda big. WHich file holds the size of buttons in AS? I realize that .xpm's will neen to be replaced as well to indicate new size or button, but it will not be a problem. I'm pretty sure you're out of luck. I think that's one of the few things that Afterstep (1.4 anyway) is not too flexible about. If you DO find a way to do it, let me know, but I've read all of the afterstep docs and haven't seen anything like that. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: xdm
New xdm question: My box is set up to start xdm automatically. Can I start linux without xdm starting? I would even settle for having it run but not on the screen. Reason I care: I had a video card go bad and I wasn't sure that my new video card could handle what xdm was going to automatically send it when my computer came up. I'm pretty sure that using a root disk and then mounting / to edit stuff (that was already mentioned on this thread) would work, but it surprises me that there isn't a more elegant solution. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Windows95 and Linux Installation
On Thu, 21 Jan 1999, Mike Archer wrote: ...them in a directory called C:\Linux. I ran the install.bat and went through the first few steps of the install, Keyboard setup,etc. Then partitioned the second(814MB) physical drive in my harddrive like this: /dev/hdb1 type 83 Linux Swap 96MB Logical /dev/hdb5 type 82 Linux 718MB Primary boot my first question is: is this correct? Don't know too much about this, but it seems odd to jump from hdb1 to hdb5 with no 2,3,4 in between. However, if it is working so far, it's probably OK. You should consider breaking things up into more partitions though. It is not necessary, but it is nice to have a few. My basic setup is: root, swap, usr, and home. This is nice in the event of crashes - not everything gets roasted - but the really nice thing is when upgrade time comes - you can wipe root and usr, but preserve home. It's not necessary, but you should consider it. Initialization, Mounting, seem to work fine. so you have mounted your windows partition? Are you sure? Where is it mounted to? When I get to the step Install Kernel and Modules, I can't find the original Win95 harddrive with the Linux files on it to continue. Do I need to make a DOS partition on the 814MB harddrive and copy the C:\Linux directory to that? or do I need to make the 814MB hard the master disk? you shouldn't have to do either of these. Linux doesn't really care what drive it's on, and it can read windows partitions. I guess the overall question I have is, Is it possible to add a drive to an existing Win95 system and install Linux on the new drive without erasing the Win95 drive? I would like to setup a dual boot - LILO right? I've read all the other messages on that as well, and it doesn't seem too hard, once i get the rest set up. Yes, it is most definitely possible. I did not do it the way you did, but if all else fails you can do it my way: remove the windows disk, put the .8Gb disk in as master, install from CD. Then put both disks back in (windows disk as master) and boot from the rescue disk (sounds daunting, but it's easy) and run lilo with appropriate config file. The only down side of this method is that you'll probably need to remove the drives to change the jumpers. I can give you more details on this method if what you are trying doesn't pan out. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Fwd: Re: Windows95 and Linux Installation
On Thu, 21 Jan 1999, Noah L. Meyerhans wrote: On Thu, 21 Jan 1999, Harrison, Shawn wrote: But, LILO will be installed on the slave drive? So you can't use it as the boot loader. Win95 is on the primary drive, so you'll use it as the bootloader and then run LOADLIN from within Windows (DOS, really) to boot your linux system. You can still use lilo to boot a slave drive. Just have lilo installed on the MBR for each drive. The boot options on the first drive would be hda1 for Windows and hdb for Linux. Then install LILO on the MBR of hdb and have it load Linux from hdb1 (or 5, as I believe the original poster was using). I've had LILO setup this way for quite some time. I'd post the lilo.confs, but I don't have access to my machine right now. There are 2 configuration files needed: one for hda's MBR and one for hdb's MBR. I disagree with both of you. You only need to install LILO on the MBR of your master disk. I also do not have the config file here, but you do not need LILO on both. It's a fairly logical config file, but if anyone wants it, I can send it. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Windows95 and Linux Installation
On Thu, 21 Jan 1999 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: *- Michael Stenner wrote about Re: Fwd: Re: Windows95 and Linux Installation On Thu, 21 Jan 1999, Noah L. Meyerhans wrote: On Thu, 21 Jan 1999, Harrison, Shawn wrote: But, LILO will be installed on the slave drive? So you can't use it as the boot loader. Win95 is on the primary drive, so you'll use it as the bootloader and then run LOADLIN from within Windows (DOS, really) to boot your linux system. You can still use lilo to boot a slave drive. Just have lilo installed on the MBR for each drive. The boot options on the first drive would be hda1 for Windows and hdb for Linux. Then install LILO on the MBR of hdb and have it load Linux from hdb1 (or 5, as I believe the original poster was using). I've had LILO setup this way for quite some time. I'd post the lilo.confs, but I don't have access to my machine right now. There are 2 configuration files needed: one for hda's MBR and one for hdb's MBR. I disagree with both of you. You only need to install LILO on the MBR of your master disk. I also do not have the config file here, but you do not need LILO on both. It's a fairly logical config file, but if anyone wants it, I can send it. I disagree with all of you, =). Why not just use Loadlin? 1) speed - no need to load dos just to run autoexec.bat and then flush it and load linux. 2) simplicity - we may (ok, probably) have different opinions about what is simpler, but LILO is made to start up immediately and then pick an OS. Why bother going through another OS? No messing with the MBR's. If this intimidates you (it intimidated me for a long time) then that's fine, but it shouldn't: the MBR is all backed up automatically by LILO. You don't have to worry about Win95 or virus scanners erasing it. OK, you've got me there - I don't know about virus scanners, but windows only screws you up if you reinstall it. Even then, you need only type lilo as root to put it back. *sigh* it's all a matter of opinion, I suppose - all this freedom with linux and we all get religious about the way we like to do things. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
S3 Virge AGP supported by XFree86?
Does anyone know if XFree86 supports the AGP versions of the S3 Virge cards? I'm looking to cheaply replace a fried Mystique and am wondering if I should go AGP or PCI. I have checked the hardware compatibility list and it makes no reference to PCI/AGP, so I don't know if it even cares. Thanks, Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Can I start X while other stuff going on?
On Tue, 10 Nov 1998, Kent West wrote: This will probably be one of those questions that EVERYBODY knows the answer to, so why are you asking such dumb questions, Kent? However, being entrenched in the Windows world where you didn't do such things, I wanted to ask before I hosed something. One of the magically cool things about linux is that AS A NORMAL USER there is a very limited amount of damage you can do. In this case, you did, in fact, know most of the things you needed to do - you were just hesitant to do them. Worst case scenario: you can fry your own account. On my machine, I keep a dummy account for just such a purpose; if I want to try some new thing and want to be sure not to fry any of my stuff, I try it with that account. This is also good for general experimentation - screw around all you want in a dummy account, you really can't hurt anything. Note: all of this assumes you have your machine set up in a reasonably secure (normal) way. That is, don't give any write permissions to anyone else, beware of setuid things, etc.. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: [HalloweenII] RedHat and Debian:
On Fri, 6 Nov 1998, Greg Vence wrote: Vincent Murphy wrote: Well, not to rock the boat, but I see more .rpm's that I do .deb's on the net. I mean, yeah, you can go to www.debian.org to get a whole boatload of packages, but that's about as far as you go. I think a lot of rpm's you see out there suck. One of the reasons I dig Debian so much is the .deb packages are so great, and because they (generally) (un)install themselves really well. The same can't be said of rpm, I think. All I know is I was pissed off when I was using .rpms with Redhat, and when I started using dpkg on debian, I was very pleased. And still am. If you think RH is bad at uninstall, you should run in M$ environment more often, PITA!! (I mean dude, why would you want to uninstall Office? -- M$ Tech Support (not words but attitude)) Why would you want to uninstall? Because the ONLY way to FIX anything is to RE-install it!! Grrr.. Sorry... touched a nerve :) -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: Creating HTML
I got hooked an asWedit. I don't think it's available in a debian package, but the install is so clean that it doesn't matter to me. (I think you just put the executable in your path somewhere, maybe one other file. It is not WYSIWYG, but has a very convenient preview feature that you can use every 10s if you want. What's nice is that it doesn't let you enter an incorrect tag and uses a (user definable) color scheme to make tags easier to read. - Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
xmkmf / imake
What package is xmkmf/imake in? I've looked all over with no success. I'm new to programming/development and don't know my way around this end of things very well. (Don't worry... I won't hurt myself with it... I just need it for development purposes.) Thanks for your help! -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
'nother netscape question
Couple of easy ones in case you guys have been thinkin' too hard... #1) Does Comm 4.06 ONLY exist as a libc6 version, or did I accidentally get the libc5 version. It installed rather smoothly (well, I didn't need to get any extra libraries...) and from what I've read here, that's odd. #2) Does messenger *really* support IMAP disconnected mode? The netscape web page has been somewhere between useless and confusing on this issue. www.imap.org claims that messenger does, but I haven't been able to make it? (This may be specific to the linux version... grrr) Thanks, Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: procmail
On Tue, 8 Sep 1998, Azog wrote: On Tue, 08 Sep 1998, Vincent Murphy wrote: What's the best recipe to use with this list for procmail? I use: :0: * ^TOdebian-user debian-user Well, I use :0: * ^From [EMAIL PROTECTED] debian-user I suggest you just take a look at a few messages (using less, or something like that) I don't know how much of what's in headers is local and how much will be common for all of us. -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: procmail
appologies for replying to my own mail, but I really like my setup. I
have my mail sent to a separate box and the use xbiff to watch that box
for me. I *do* want to be notified when debian mail arrives, but I got
tired of getting excited only to find out it was debian mail.
\begin{point}
Together, procmail and xbiff (or your favorite xbiff-type thing) can
make a handy little combo.
\end{point}
use something like:
xbiff -name deb -bg black -fg green -file ~/mail/debian-user
On Tue, 8 Sep 1998, Azog wrote:
On Tue, 08 Sep 1998, Vincent Murphy wrote:
What's the best recipe to use with this list for procmail?
I use:
:0:
* ^TOdebian-user
debian-user
Well, I use
:0:
* ^From [EMAIL PROTECTED]
debian-user
I suggest you just take a look at a few messages (using less, or
something like that) I don't know how much of what's in headers is local
and how much will be common for all of us.
-Michael
Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513
Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
--
Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null
Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513
Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Solved: win98/hamm dual boot problem
Thanks to all that offered suggestions on this one. For future use, I'm posting below the solution that worked (quite nicely) for me, since it wasn't posted previously. Michael Stenner wrote (Wed, 19 Aug 1998 09:39:43 -0400 (EDT) ): |Following instructions I found on this list some time ago, I installed |hamm and win98 separately: each have their own drive - only one was |hooked up at a time. Than, I put both drives in: Linux as hda and win |as hdb. THis was nothing new for linux, so I started up linux and ran |lilo with the following lilo.conf: | |boot=/dev/hda1 |delay=50 |image=/vmlinuz | root=/dev/hda1 | label=linux | read-only |other=/dev/hdb1 | label=win | table=/dev/hdb | |linux boots well via lilo now, but windows doesn't boot at all: after |typing win at LILO:, it just hangs. Any ideas at all would be very |much appreciated. Response from Alan Su: windows is generally unhappy about booting from a slave drive, if i'm correct. i would try to switch it around with the following steps: - change the master/slave settings on both drives - boot from the linux rescue disk and at the boot prompt, type 'rescue root=/dev/hdb1' - change lilo.conf to: boot=/dev/hda--- change to /dev/hda delay=50 image=/vmlinuz root=/dev/hdb1 --- change to /dev/hdb1 label=linux read-only other=/dev/hda1 --- change to /dev/hda1 label=win table=/dev/hda --- change to /dev/hda (lilo will install itself onto the master boot record of the windows drive. the rest of the drive references have been swapped.) - run lilo, and make sure there are no errors. - reboot! the reasoning behind installing lilo on the mbr rather than the boot partition is that i *believe* that windows needs that boot partition for something. i'm not entirely sure, but i know that a configuration like the one above works. hope that helps...(at least a little). -alan ___ Just a couple more notes: The installation CD works as a rescue floppy (I forgot that) Remember to change /etc/fstab. Linux is happy to move (ulike windows) as long as you *tell* it. :) Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
win98/hamm dual boot problem
Following instructions I found on this list some time ago, I installed hamm and win98 separately: each have their own drive - only one was hooked up at a time. Than, I put both drives in: Linux as hda and win as hdb. THis was nothing new for linux, so I started up linux and ran lilo with the following lilo.conf: boot=/dev/hda1 delay=50 image=/vmlinuz root=/dev/hda1 label=linux read-only other=/dev/hdb1 label=win table=/dev/hdb linux boots well via lilo now, but windows doesn't boot at all: after typing win at LILO:, it just hangs. Any ideas at all would be very much appreciated. Thanks, Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: X-windows
My problem is that I can only get X running in 320x200 mode. I configured the XF86Config file using XF86Setup. My video card is an OEM from Gateway - it's meant to be an STB Nitro DVD. I heard somewhere that it has a riva128 chipset, and I know that it has 4 megs RAM. In the XF86Setup program I chose riva128 as the card type from the card menu. I tried alot of the modes given in the modes section (up as far as 1024xwhatever) but I got the same resolution for all of them. I'm guessing that it was 320x200, cos it looked so bad, and from looking at the XF86Config file. In case it's any help here's the file : I think your problem is acutally with your monitor settings. XF86 seems to be convinced that your monitor can only handle 320x200, so no matter what you have for a video card, that's the best you will do. Presumably, this is not the appropriate configuration for the monitor. You'll want to check out the monitor part in XF86Setup. By the way, Did YOU actually enter 320x204 at some point? I think that's probably wrong.. I've never seen that before... -Michael Another note: remember the CTRL-ALT-KPD_Plus and CTRL-ALT-KPD_Minus for changing modes. I don't think it will work now with your config the way it is, but it you'll need it later. Section Monitor Identifier Primary Monitor VendorName Unknown ModelName Unknown HorizSync 30-69 VertRefresh 50-120 Modeline 320x20025.18 320 344 376 400 204 206 225 0 EndSection Section Device Identifier Primary Card VendorName Unknown BoardName RIVA128 Clocks 25.18 EndSection Section Screen Driver Accel Device Primary Card Monitor Primary Monitor DefaultColorDepth 16 SubSection Display Depth8 Modes320x204 EndSubSection SubSection Display Depth15 Modes320x204 EndSubSection SubSection Display Depth16 Modes320x204 EndSubSection SubSection Display Depth24 Modes320x204 EndSubSection SubSection Display Depth32 Modes320x204 EndSubSection EndSection Section Screen Driver SVGA Device Primary Card Monitor Primary Monitor DefaultColorDepth 8 SubSection Display Depth8 Modes320x204 EndSubSection SubSection Display Depth15 Modes320x204 EndSubSection SubSection Display Depth16 Modes320x204 EndSubSection SubSection Display Depth24 Modes320x204 EndSubSection SubSection Display Depth32 Modes320x204 EndSubSection EndSection Section Screen Driver VGA16 Device Primary Card Monitor Primary Monitor SubSection Display Depth4 Modes320x204 EndSubSection EndSection Section Screen Driver VGA2 Device Primary Card Monitor Primary Monitor SubSection Display Depth1 Modes320x204 EndSubSection EndSection Section Screen Driver Mono Device Primary Card Monitor Primary Monitor SubSection Display Depth1 Modes320x204 EndSubSection EndSection -- Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
IMAP via PPP
OK, I have a rather specific goal in mind when setting up my mail. My mail arrives at work. I read and send mail from both work and home. I know that I can (with pine, for example) manipulate and read mail from home via IMAP. Unfortunately, this is slow and ends up re-downloading mail messages or folder repeatedly. I can also have mail downloaded to home and stored there. Unfortunately, this disconnects the two work environments: if I read and delete 300 mail messages (as debian-user easily provides) on one system, I have to specifically (and personally) do the same to the other system. I would like a hybrid situation. I would like to mirror my work folders (collections, to use pine's word) at home and have my home machine sycronize the two systems on demand. That is, if I delete or move a message on one system, have it preform the corresponding action on the other. Any ideas? Please cc to me personally (I subscribe to this list, but Im about 2000 messages behind... short vacations.. whew). -Michael Michael Stenner Office Phone: 919-660-2513 Duke University, Dept. of Physics [EMAIL PROTECTED] Box 90305, Durham N.C. 27708-0305
Re: window manager cofiguration
On Mon, 13 Jul 1998, Tom Malloy wrote: Some window managers require you to have a mouse in a window for it to be active. Others allow you to click the mouse in the window and it stays active even if you move the mouse away. This is probably adjustable in the configuration files for each window manager. What is this feature called and do I turn it off or on. Thank You I have seen this called Focus Follows Mouse vs Click To Focus. Most (but not all) window managers will let you change this. To find it quickly, I suggest you search on focus in the rc file, and if that doesn't work, do the same search in the man page. Do you turn it on or off? Totally up to you. People often have trouble getting used to focus follows mouse, but I don't know very many people who have used both and still prefer click to focus. -Michael -- Unsubscribe? mail -s unsubscribe [EMAIL PROTECTED] /dev/null
Re: Xwindow from win95?
On Fri, 5 Jun 1998, Mikhali Mifsud wrote: Is there any program that people know of that will allow my to xwindow to my debian box from my win95 machine? Thanks. I'm not entirely sure that I know what it means to xwindow, but I'll assume you mean create an entire Xwindows environment, not just telnet, or something like that. I have used an Xwindows emulator called xwin32 that seemed pretty good. Last I checked, it was not free, but they had a free crippled version that would run for 2 hours at a time and would only allow one use at a time per network. Check out http://www.starnet.com/ -Michael -- To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a subject of unsubscribe. Trouble? Contact [EMAIL PROTECTED]
