Re: Re: Reality Check: You Are Not a Computer Simulation [Audio]

2012-11-19 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Bruno Marchal I thought that comp is exactly opposite to what you say, that computationalism is the belief that we can simulate the mind with a computer program-- that the mind is computable. [Roger Clough], [rclo...@verizon.net] 11/19/2012 Forever is a long time, especially near the end.

Comp, Chance and Necessity, the large and the small

2012-11-19 Thread Roger Clough
1) In his classic work on evolution, Chance and Necessity, Jacques Monod describes this natural process as consisting of a combination of chance mutations (contingency), which are blind but free, and necessity, which knows what it is doing but can do no other. If that is a basis for modellin

Re: Comp, Chance and Necessity, the large and the small

2012-11-19 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 06:03:03AM -0500, Roger Clough wrote: 1) In his classic work on evolution, Chance and Necessity, Jacques Monod describes this natural process as consisting of a combination of chance mutations (contingency), which are blind but free, and necessity, which knows what

Re: Against Mechanism

2012-11-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Nov 2012, at 19:30, John Clark wrote: On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: We just agreed that the helsinki man is the one who remember Helsinki, so that both the W and M man are still the Helsinki man. Fine, and Bruno Marchal said that you is the Helsinki

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Nov 2012, at 02:12, Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 07:48:57PM -0500, Stephen P. King wrote: Hi Russell, I agree with this view, especially the part about the compatibility of bases leading to a 'sharing of realities' that then gives rise to an illusion of a single

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Nov 2012, at 05:03, Stephen P. King wrote: On 11/18/2012 8:12 PM, Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 07:48:57PM -0500, Stephen P. King wrote: Hi Russell, I agree with this view, especially the part about the compatibility of bases leading to a 'sharing of realities'

Re: Reality Check: You Are Not a Computer Simulation [Audio]

2012-11-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Nov 2012, at 11:22, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Bruno Marchal I thought that comp is exactly opposite to what you say, that computationalism is the belief that we can simulate the mind with a computer program-- that the mind is computable. Yes that is correct (if by mind you mean the 3p

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 11/19/2012 9:16 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Nov 2012, at 02:12, Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 07:48:57PM -0500, Stephen P. King wrote: Hi Russell, I agree with this view, especially the part about the compatibility of bases leading to a 'sharing of realities' that

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Nov 2012, at 15:43, Stephen P. King wrote: On 11/19/2012 9:16 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Nov 2012, at 02:12, Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 07:48:57PM -0500, Stephen P. King wrote: Hi Russell, I agree with this view, especially the part about the compatibility

CORRECTIOB: Who am I ? The one or the many ?

2012-11-19 Thread Roger Clough
CORRECTION: I said ..for converting many sensations NOT into one conscious experience I meant to say: ..for converting many sensations into one conscious experience -- I would like to suggest that the brain

Re: CORRECTIOB: Who am I ? The one or the many ?

2012-11-19 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Nov 2012, at 17:17, Roger Clough wrote: CORRECTION: I said ..for converting many sensations NOT into one conscious experience I meant to say: ..for converting many sensations into one conscious experience

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Sunday, November 18, 2012 4:23:14 PM UTC-5, Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 08:12:51AM -0800, Craig Weinberg wrote: Can you explain, in the simplest layman terms, why this argument can be thrown out? The details are over my head, but it seems to me that the argument

Re: Reality Check: You Are Not a Computer Simulation [Audio]

2012-11-19 Thread meekerdb
On 11/19/2012 8:33 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: and the math shows that this will include some continuous/analog observable. How does it show that? Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To post to this group, send email to

Re: Reality Check: You Are Not a Computer Simulation [Audio]

2012-11-19 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2012/11/19 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/19/2012 8:33 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: and the math shows that this will include some continuous/analog observable. How does it show that? Brent Because the material reality is the sum of the infinity of computations going through your

Re: Reality Check: You Are Not a Computer Simulation [Audio]

2012-11-19 Thread meekerdb
On 11/19/2012 1:14 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2012/11/19 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net mailto:meeke...@verizon.net On 11/19/2012 8:33 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: and the math shows that this will include some continuous/analog observable. How does it show that? Brent

Re: Reality Check: You Are Not a Computer Simulation [Audio]

2012-11-19 Thread Quentin Anciaux
2012/11/19 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/19/2012 1:14 PM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: 2012/11/19 meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net On 11/19/2012 8:33 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: and the math shows that this will include some continuous/analog observable. How does it show that? Brent

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 09:29:58AM -0800, Craig Weinberg wrote: What I am asking is why would the single multiverse be any less dependent upon multiplicity to accomplish its infinities of preserved separations than a single universe does? If a universe needs a multiverse to justify

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 03:16:53PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Nov 2012, at 02:12, Russell Standish wrote: which is the Occam's catastrophe redux I point out in my book. I suspect that as human beings, we rank amongst the simplest of all possible observers. Do you think that

Re: Arithmetic doesn't even suggest geometry, let alone awareness.

2012-11-19 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Sunday, November 18, 2012 11:58:01 AM UTC-5, John Clark wrote: Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.com wrote: There is no mathematical justification for geometry though that I can think of. There are ways that numbers can describe geometry and ways that geometry can describe numbers.

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread meekerdb
On 11/19/2012 4:52 PM, Russell Standish wrote: On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 02:12:33PM -0800, Craig Weinberg wrote: I'm postulating infinite regress because the idea that universes are being created and preserved implies an meta-universal support which also must be made of some kind of

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 02:45:43PM -0800, Craig Weinberg wrote: What I am asking is why does the idea of a multiverse help explain why any one universe exists in the first place. This could be one of two different questions, both of which are evrything-list 101: 1) Why a universe, given a

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 04:48:14PM -0600, meekerdb wrote: On 11/19/2012 4:52 PM, Russell Standish wrote: What does this even mean? Anyone else know? It means Craig is a wordbot? :-) Brent :) -- Prof Russell

Re: Two possible ways of creating actual objects out of nothing

2012-11-19 Thread Russell Standish
On Mon, Nov 19, 2012 at 07:20:45AM -0500, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Russell Standish According to a web page, havege is probably the best random number generator known, but it still is not a true random number gen. There must be They are probably being modest. What they have is as close to

Re: Nothing happens in the Universe of the Everett Interpretation

2012-11-19 Thread Stephen P. King
On 11/19/2012 9:25 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Nov 2012, at 05:03, Stephen P. King wrote: On 11/18/2012 8:12 PM, Russell Standish wrote: On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 07:48:57PM -0500, Stephen P. King wrote: Hi Russell, I agree with this view, especially the part about the compatibility