On Nov 9, 11:36 pm, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote:
On 11/9/2011 8:00 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote:
On Oct 28, 10:59 am, Quentin Anciauxallco...@gmail.com wrote:
2011/10/28 Craig Weinbergwhatsons...@gmail.com
On Oct 28, 8:10 am, Stathis Papaioannoustath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri,
On Oct 28, 10:59 am, Quentin Anciaux allco...@gmail.com wrote:
2011/10/28 Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
On Oct 28, 8:10 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:13 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
Let's say that I watch a
On 11/9/2011 8:00 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote:
On Oct 28, 10:59 am, Quentin Anciauxallco...@gmail.com wrote:
2011/10/28 Craig Weinbergwhatsons...@gmail.com
On Oct 28, 8:10 am, Stathis Papaioannoustath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:13 AM, Craig Weinbergwhatsons...@gmail.com
This reminds me of something: this is the best test question I ever
came up with:
In the language of the Japanese quails, what was the gödel' statement
that started the universe over again at 0 AD? explain your answer
precisely in pure mathematical terms without appeal to the existence
of mayan
Apologies, meant to capitalize Gödel and explain. Anal-retentive
to post just to fix that, I know.
On Wed, Nov 9, 2011 at 11:50 PM, Felix Hoenikker fhoenikk...@gmail.com wrote:
This reminds me of something: this is the best test question I ever
came up with:
In the language of the Japanese
This is a joke.
Quantumly the quines computed the qualia of the quails and so on until...
That's why we have qualia before everything else!
On Wed, Oct 12, 2011 at 10:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/1676
As stated above,
On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:13 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Let's say that I watch a football game on TV and describe what I see.
Is there now a direct connection between my larynx and a football
field somewhere? What is this connection made of? Is this the kind of
purely
On Oct 28, 8:10 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:13 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Let's say that I watch a football game on TV and describe what I see.
Is there now a direct connection between my larynx and a football
field
2011/10/28 Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
On Oct 28, 8:10 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 6:13 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
Let's say that I watch a football game on TV and describe what I see.
Is there now a direct
On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:23 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Indirectly, the larynx must be connected to the optic nerve or we
wouldn't be able to describe what we see. Is that not obvious?
Indirectly everything is connected to everything. The foot is
connected to the ass
On Oct 27, 12:11 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:23 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Indirectly, the larynx must be connected to the optic nerve or we
wouldn't be able to describe what we see. Is that not obvious?
Indirectly
Craig: a redface reply
I made it in reverse, when I wrote (and your answer was correct TO THAT):
* *(JM: I like such distinction. Problem is: I see only how to
realizethe OBJECTIVE existence? we can THINK about it.
* *
*CW: It may be problematic to put subjectivity in objective
On Oct 26, 3:14 pm, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote:
Craig: a redface reply
I made it in reverse, when I wrote (and your answer was correct TO THAT):
I DO *NOT* see, how to realize OBJECTIVE existence, because all we can
perceive is
our subjective absorption, even that adjusted for
On Oct 24, 4:27 pm, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote:
*I* *interjected some remarks just for keeping order on the list*.- *JM
*
On Sun, Oct 23, 2011 at 5:04 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote:
On Oct 23, 4:14 pm, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote:
*Craig,*
**
*thanks
Sthatis, thanks for your inserted remarks. Here is a condensed copy of them
to facilitate my reflection:
---
*10-24 Stathis reply entries:
=
We may not know all the physics behind the brain but we know there must be
some physics, even if undiscovered.
*I* *interjected some remarks just for keeping order on the list*.- *JM
*
On Sun, Oct 23, 2011 at 5:04 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote:
On Oct 23, 4:14 pm, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote:
*Craig,*
**
*thanks for your explanation - B U T : let us accept the term
On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 2:15 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Are you seriously suggesting that I can talk about an actual event without
there be a causal chain between the event and the sound that comes out of my
mouth?
You can talk about anything you want though. If I talk
On Oct 24, 9:38 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 2:15 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Are you seriously suggesting that I can talk about an actual event without
there be a causal chain between the event and the sound that comes out of
On Sun, Oct 23, 2011 at 5:23 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
How do my vocal cords know to produce output relating to the
newspaper?
The vocal cords don't know that what they are doing is related to the
newspaper. There are parts of the brain which relate the aural
On Oct 23, 2011, at 6:23 AM, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote:
Stathis,
you wrote quite a 'study' to Craig. May I extract some sentences for my
reflections?
(I delete the entire discussion here)
John M
On Sat, Oct 22, 2011 at 10:42 AM, Stathis
On Oct 23, 7:01 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sun, Oct 23, 2011 at 5:23 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
How do my vocal cords know to produce output relating to the
newspaper?
The vocal cords don't know that what they are doing is related to the
On Oct 23, 8:36 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Oct 23, 2011, at 6:23 AM, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote:
It may well be. I am still at a loss how the physical (electrical) or
tissue measurements can explain mental effects (incl. consciousness, free
will,
On Oct 23, 11:56 am, Quentin Anciaux allco...@gmail.com wrote:
2011/10/23 Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
On Oct 23, 7:01 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sun, Oct 23, 2011 at 5:23 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
How do my vocal cords know to
*Craig,*
**
*thanks for your explanation - B U T : let us accept the term Multisense
Realism (whatever that may cover) and let me ask:*
*satisfactory to whom? *
*separation of what (OK, you call it an illusion). And I like your:
range of experience as a limited term. *
*Then again: to explain
On Oct 23, 4:14 pm, John Mikes jami...@gmail.com wrote:
*Craig,*
**
*thanks for your explanation - B U T : let us accept the term Multisense
Realism (whatever that may cover) and let me ask:*
*satisfactory to whom? *
To whoever understands how it applies to the Hard Problem.
*separation
On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 2:40 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
When I read the newspaper this morning the light
has a physical effect on my retina which through a series of complex
neural relays modulates the output of the motor neurons to my larynx,
tongue and diaphragm
On Oct 22, 10:42 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 2:40 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
When I read the newspaper this morning the light
has a physical effect on my retina which through a series of complex
neural relays modulates the
Stathis,
you wrote quite a 'study' to Craig. May I extract some sentences for
my reflections?
(I delete the entire discussion here)
John M
On Sat, Oct 22, 2011 at 10:42 AM, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.comwrote:
On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 2:40 PM, Craig
On Oct 18, 9:57 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Oct 18, 2011 at 1:01 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
The speech centres must, through a relay of neurons, receive
information from the visual centres if the subject is to make any
statement about what
On Oct 18, 9:57 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Oct 18, 2011 at 1:01 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
The speech centres must, through a relay of neurons, receive
information from the visual centres if the subject is to make any
statement about what
On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 1:46 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
When you speak about what you see the information carried in the light
that comes into your pupils must somehow get to the motor neurons
controlling your vocal cords. How do you think this happens?
There is no
On Oct 19, 7:30 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 1:46 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
When you speak about what you see the information carried in the light
that comes into your pupils must somehow get to the motor neurons
controlling
On Tue, Oct 18, 2011 at 1:01 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
The speech centres must, through a relay of neurons, receive
information from the visual centres if the subject is to make any
statement about what he sees.
What makes you think that's the case? That's a blatant
On Sun, Oct 16, 2011 at 11:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
As an engineering problem as well as for the purpose of the thought
experiment, we replace a part at a time and, as with the mechanic and
the car, see whether it works the same. If the subject says they have
gone
On Oct 17, 7:45 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sun, Oct 16, 2011 at 11:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
As an engineering problem as well as for the purpose of the thought
experiment, we replace a part at a time and, as with the mechanic and
the
On 10/17/2011 5:31 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote:
On Oct 17, 7:45 pm, Stathis Papaioannoustath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sun, Oct 16, 2011 at 11:44 PM, Craig Weinbergwhatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
As an engineering problem as well as for the purpose of the thought
experiment, we replace a part at a
On Oct 17, 8:56 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, Oct 18, 2011 at 11:31 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
On Oct 17, 7:45 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sun, Oct 16, 2011 at 11:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
On 10/17/2011 7:45 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote:
On Oct 17, 9:06 pm, meekerdbmeeke...@verizon.net wrote:
Since we know absolutely that we have experiences which cannot be
observed directly in the tissue of the brain,
We don't know that. We only know that we don't have the resolution and
On Oct 15, 10:48 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sat, Oct 15, 2011 at 4:39 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Functionalism assumes that the qualia will be reproduced if the
observable function of the brain is reproduced. The thought experiment
assumes that
On Sat, Oct 15, 2011 at 4:39 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
Functionalism assumes that the qualia will be reproduced if the
observable function of the brain is reproduced. The thought experiment
assumes that this is *not* the case. You have therefore missed one of
the most
On Fri, Oct 14, 2011 at 1:04 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
If you could make a functionally equivalent artificial brain that
lacks qualia (and that applies even if the brain is not computerised)
then you would be able to create a partial zombie. A partial zombie
*behaves*
On Oct 14, 11:08 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2011 at 1:04 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
If you could make a functionally equivalent artificial brain that
lacks qualia (and that applies even if the brain is not computerised)
then you
On Oct 12, 11:06 pm, meekerdb meeke...@verizon.net wrote:
Or is it telling the truth if it says it can see?
Then it wouldn't have blindsight?
Craig
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On Oct 13, 12:52 am, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Oct 12, 2011, at 9:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/1676
As stated above, blindsight is seen clinically as a contrast between
a lack of declarative
On Oct 13, 1:51 am, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 1:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/1676
As stated above, blindsight is seen clinically as a contrast between
a lack of declarative knowledge
On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 9:39 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote:
On Oct 13, 12:52 am, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Oct 12, 2011, at 9:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/1676
As stated
On Oct 13, 11:04 am, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 9:39 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote:
On Oct 13, 12:52 am, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Oct 12, 2011, at 9:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
2011/10/13 Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
On Oct 13, 11:04 am, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 9:39 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
On Oct 13, 12:52 am, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Oct 12, 2011, at 9:44 PM,
On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 1:43 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote:
On Oct 13, 11:04 am, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 9:39 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
On Oct 13, 12:52 am, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2011 at 1:50 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
A person who has the visual cortex of his brain replaced with a
functionally equivalent computer will behave as if he can see
normally, claim that he can see normally and believe that he can see
normally. It is
On Oct 13, 2:53 pm, Quentin Anciaux allco...@gmail.com wrote:
2011/10/13 Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
On Oct 13, 11:04 am, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 9:39 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
On Oct 13, 12:52 am, Jason
On Oct 13, 4:49 pm, Jason Resch jasonre...@gmail.com wrote:
On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 1:43 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote:
I think it's too simplistic to talk about a verbal center acting on
it's own. There is no suggestion that a sightblind patient has been
reduced to a
On Oct 13, 7:04 pm, Stathis Papaioannou stath...@gmail.com wrote:
On Fri, Oct 14, 2011 at 1:50 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
A person who has the visual cortex of his brain replaced with a
functionally equivalent computer will behave as if he can see
normally, claim that
http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/1676
As stated above, blindsight is seen clinically as a contrast between
a lack of declarative knowledge about a stimulus and a high rate of
correct answers to questions about the stimulus (1). People suffering
from blindsight claim to see nothing, and
On 10/12/2011 7:44 PM, Craig Weinberg wrote:
http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/1676
As stated above, blindsight is seen clinically as a contrast between
a lack of declarative knowledge about a stimulus and a high rate of
correct answers to questions about the stimulus (1). People
On Oct 12, 2011, at 9:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com
wrote:
http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/1676
As stated above, blindsight is seen clinically as a contrast between
a lack of declarative knowledge about a stimulus and a high rate of
correct answers to questions
On Thu, Oct 13, 2011 at 1:44 PM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.com wrote:
http://serendip.brynmawr.edu/exchange/node/1676
As stated above, blindsight is seen clinically as a contrast between
a lack of declarative knowledge about a stimulus and a high rate of
correct answers to questions
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