[FairfieldLife] Fwd: Guru Purnima :: The Day of the Divine Master

2006-07-11 Thread jiva jivazz

Note: forwarded message attached.


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--- Begin Message ---
Title: Guru Purnima : July 11, 2006





















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Guru Purnima • The Day of the Divine Master
11th July 2006
Guru Purnima to bestow fullness of life
“Guru Purnima is the day of infinite correlation. It is a day of supreme knowledge. It is a day of Brahman. It is the day of Guru — Guru Purnima, the fullness of Guru Dev, the fullness of the element of Guru, the fullness of pure knowledge. Guru is the _expression_ of Enlightenment, pure knowledge, the field of all possibilities, the field of infinite correlation. In that supreme awakening, in that supreme awareness, in the state of supreme knowledge we have wholeness of life, absolute value of Being, pure infinity, pure eternity, pure immortality. Guru Purnima day is structured in pure knowledge. It comes year after year to bring the awakening of totality of life. It unfolds the full potential of knowledge and brings to fulfilment the master-disciple relationship. It is the master-disciple relationship, and that expresses itself in its totality: Full potential of all possibilities. It is a very special day, it’s a very special day for us.” —Maharishi
Maharishi Yagyas for Guru Purnima
In Maharishi Jyotish the spiritual master is represented by the planet Guru (Jupiter). Guru is the significator of spiritual progress, good fortune, wealth and prosperity, children, education and knowledge. This renders this day highly favourable for progress in all spiritual and material fields. Maharishi Yagyas performed on the Guru Purnima day deepen the relationship with the Guru - the Divine Master - in a profound way and help to achieve the following purposes:




To promote spiritual progress
Upholding evolution in life
To promote overall progress
To promote fullness of life
Promotion of 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Palestinians & terrorism

2006-07-11 Thread nablus108
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Larry Potter 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> 
> bob_brigante <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Larry Potter 
>  wrote:
> >
> > ( with regard to nablus108 ).
> > 
> > I'm sorry to say that since the intafadah began I have uterly 
> lost any respect for Palestinians as a nation. They choose 
terrible 
> leaders and support terrible policies. They glorify terrible 
> murderers who celebrate in killing Israeli women and children. 
> > 
> > I am sad to say to you Palistinians, I have no sympathy for you.
> 
> 
> 
> >>http://tinyurl.com/qxtq8
> 
> >> Aggression Under False Pretenses 
>
>
> The aggression comes from the Palestinians side,
>   To remind you, or to tell you, since you conveniently left out, 
that Palestinians murdered of 18-year-old Eliyahu Asheri two and a 
half weeks ago.
>   Including that Hamas terrorists firing rockets and mortar bombs 
for weeks. Some of the rockets fell near the Israel city of 
Ashkelon. Some 17 rockets were fired between Saturday and Sunday 
morning. A man at a school in the Israel town of Sderot was wounded, 
Israel officials said.
>
>   Now, what would you think, USA will do (or any other country for 
that matter) if, let's say Mexico, will be constantly shooting 
rockets on USA cities and civilians. I'm just curious to know, how 
USA will react in your opinion.
>
>
>   http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?
cid=1150885975162&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull
>
>
>   so, there is more to it than one soldier as Haniyeh is falsely 
trying to paint.
>
>
>   
> 
Palestine is occupied by Israel, the land has been annected. They 
are at war. This discussion is out of proportion. When european 
contries was occupied by the nazis, it was seen as completely 
legimate to kill the occupying forces. The Israeli actions are 
condemned by the large majority of the nations in the world, which 
you, conveniently, left out. Only the americans continue to support 
and fund them. Thats why the USA is a major part of this vast 
problem, and it also largely explains the hatred directed against 
the americans from the Muslim world.

I will never, never forget what Maharishi said in Boppard in 
1982: "Why dont't they stop bombing the Palestinian villages... and 
all that." It adresses directly the key element of this tragedy.


Master's article: 
Aiding the cause of peace 
by the Master —, through Benjamin Creme 

It is frequently the case that, in acting for what is seen by them 
as the good of the world, countries wreak havoc on a world scale. So 
dense are the fogs of glamour which surround their actions, so 
illusory is their thinking, that great harm may be done, and much 
pain and suffering caused, for the best of reasons. 

Thus it is today. In recent times, the USA, under the banner of `the 
war against terrorism', has invaded Afghanistan and Iraq, causing 
thousands of civilian deaths and great physical damage to their 
infrastructures. The Taliban, fanatical and rigid but, in the main, 
uninvolved in terrorism, are dispersed but are now regrouping, 
training in the skills of terror. In Iraq, Saddam Hussein is no 
more, but a terrible legacy of deprivation and suffering, 
lawlessness and chaos, has replaced his baleful regime. 

Now the attention of the US administration has turned to Syria, Iran 
and North Korea; they are warned to change or face the wrath and 
might of the upholders of `peace', and the champions of `liberty' in 
the world. 

Thus does America plunge the world into the atmosphere of stress and 
fear, and thus do these give fruit to epidemics and natural 
disasters, which, in turn, serve to increase the fear and stress. 

Dangerous 

What can be done to stabilize this dangerous situation? How can the 
nations keep America in check? By what means can ordinary people 
bring their weight to bear? These are large questions and have, 
indeed, no simple answers. They require wisdom of an exceptional 
order and a co-ordinated approach. 

Firstly, the world must realize the true nature of the problem: the 
USA today is led by men responsive to a nefarious energy which 
prompts their actions and puts peace in jeopardy. It stimulates 
their glamour for power of an international extent, and threatens 
the peace of the world. It has outposts in Israel and Eastern 
Europe, Israel being the major focus. This destructive energy 
derives, though in diminished potency, from that which plunged the 
world into chaotic war during the twentieth century and which, men 
thought, was safely put to rest. 

It can be seen, therefore, how necessary it is that there be peace 
in the Middle East; how necessary it is that the Palestinians have 
true justice and a viable homeland. This is the most important 
problem facing men today. Failure to solve it would be disastrous 
for the world. 

Overcome 

It will take the combined resources of wisdom and will 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Palestinians & terrorism

2006-07-11 Thread Larry Potter



bob_brigante <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Larry Potter ...> wrote:>> ( with regard to nablus108 ).> > I'm sorry to say that since the intafadah began I have uterly lost any respect for Palestinians as a nation. They choose terrible leaders and support terrible policies. They glorify terrible murderers who celebrate in killing Israeli women and children. > > I am sad to say to you Palistinians, I have no sympathy for you.>>http://tinyurl.com/qxtq8>> Aggression Under False Pretenses       The aggression comes from the Palestinians side,  To remind you, or to tell you, since you conveniently left out, that Palestinians murdered of 18-year-old Eliyahu Asheri two and a half weeks ago.  Including that Hamas terrorists firing rockets and mortar bombs for weeks. Some of the rockets fell near the Israel city of Ashkelon. Some 17 rockets were fired between Saturday and Sunday morning. A man at a school in the Israel town of Sderot was wounded, Israel officials said.     Now, what would you think, USA will do (or any other country for that matter) if, let's say Mexico, will be constantly shooting
 rockets on USA cities and civilians. I'm just curious to know, how USA will react in your opinion.        http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1150885975162&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull        so, there is more to it than one soldier as Haniyeh is falsely trying to paint.         
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[FairfieldLife] Re: HAPPY GURU PURNIMA 2006

2006-07-11 Thread jim_flanegin
Thanks! It has been a great day!





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Re: [FairfieldLife] 'Madison Lecturer Cleared to Teach Course on Islam'

2006-07-11 Thread MDixon6569






In a message dated 7/11/06 1:14:55 P.M. Central Daylight Time, 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  
  9 AM Tuesday July 11, 2006 
  UW lecturer cleared for course on Islam 
  ANITA CLARK [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
   
  A controversial lecturer who was cleared Monday to 
  teach a course on Islam at UW- Madison said he's pleased with a review that 
  found no fault with his plans for the class. 
  
  "I don't blame them for taking a look," instructor Kevin Barrett said 
  after the university announced he would, as planned, teach a course this fall 
  called "Islam: Religion and 
Culture."

Kevin Barrett was on Hannity and Colmes last night and 
thoroughly embarrassed Allen Colmes.  Barrett said he didn't "think" the 
government blew up the World Trade Center, he "knew" they did. As for the train 
bombings in London and  Madrid and other large bombings like in Bali and 
else where, they were all insider jobs, not the work of Islamic terrorists. 

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Scores dead in Mumbai train bombs

2006-07-11 Thread bob_brigante
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "claudiouk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> I know it's not about America.. but as my last post regarding news 
> from Holland, it's TM-relevant news nevertheless, given the hype 
on 
> pundit groups & invincible Holland etc etc.. Lets face it, America 
> COULD be next...!
> 
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/5169332.stm
> 
> More than 160 people have been killed and 460 injured by seven 
bombs 
> on the train network in the Indian financial capital Mumbai 
> (Bombay), police say.


***

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/12/opinion/12fernandes.html






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  
wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  
wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > LOL, no these were students and initiates of the 
Shankaracharya 
> > of  
> > > > > the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on the back 
of 
> > the  
> > > > > tradition.
> > > > 
> > > > Ah.  So they had no firsthand knowledge of him.
> > > 
> > > Sorta like you, eh?  :-)
> > 
> > Not quite, no.
> 
> So tell us all about your "firsthand" knowledge of
> Maharishi. Was it live or Memorex?  :-)

Nope, you missed it.  Try again.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > LOL, no these were students and initiates of the Shankaracharya 
> of  
> > > > the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on the back of 
> the  
> > > > tradition.
> > > 
> > > Ah.  So they had no firsthand knowledge of him.
> > 
> > Sorta like you, eh?  :-)
> 
> Not quite, no.

So tell us all about your "firsthand" knowledge of
Maharishi. Was it live or Memorex?  :-)







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread new . morning
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> I guess meditation is something everyone has an opinion on...

I have no thoughts.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Palestinians & terrorism

2006-07-11 Thread bob_brigante
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Larry Potter 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> (  with regard to nablus108 ).
>
>   I'm sorry to say that since the intafadah began I have uterly 
lost any respect for Palestinians as a nation. They choose terrible 
leaders and support terrible policies. They glorify terrible 
murderers who celebrate in killing Israeli women and children. 
> 
> I am sad to say to you Palistinians, I have no sympathy for you.



http://tinyurl.com/qxtq8

Aggression Under False Pretenses

By Ismail Haniyeh
Tuesday, July 11, 2006; Page A17 Washington Post

GAZA, Palestine -- As Americans commemorated their annual 
celebration of independence from colonial occupation, rejoicing in 
their democratic institutions, we Palestinians were yet again 
besieged by our occupiers, who destroy our roads and buildings, our 
power stations and water plants, and who attack our very means of 
civil administration. Our homes and government offices are shelled, 
our parliamentarians taken prisoner and threatened with prosecution.

The current Gaza invasion is only the latest effort to destroy the 
results of fair and free elections held early this year. It is the 
explosive follow-up to a five-month campaign of economic and 
diplomatic warfare directed by the United States and Israel. The 
stated intention of that strategy was to force the average 
Palestinian to "reconsider" her vote when faced with deepening 
hardship; its failure was predictable, and the new overt military 
aggression and collective punishment are its logical fulfillment. 
The "kidnapped" Israeli Cpl. Gilad Shalit is only a pretext for a 
job scheduled months ago.
 
In addition to removing our democratically elected government, 
Israel wants to sow dissent among Palestinians by claiming that 
there is a serious leadership rivalry among us. I am compelled to 
dispel this notion definitively. The Palestinian leadership is 
firmly embedded in the concept of Islamic shura , or mutual 
consultation; suffice it to say that while we may have differing 
opinions, we are united in mutual respect and focused on the goal of 
serving our people. Furthermore, the invasion of Gaza and the 
kidnapping of our leaders and government officials are meant to 
undermine the recent accords reached between the government party 
and our brothers and sisters in Fatah and other factions, on 
achieving consensus for resolving the conflict. Yet Israeli 
collective punishment only strengthens our collective resolve to 
work together.

As I inspect the ruins of our infrastructure -- the largess of donor 
nations and international efforts all turned to rubble once more by 
F-16s and American-made missiles -- my thoughts again turn to the 
minds of Americans. What do they think of this?

They think, doubtless, of the hostage soldier, taken in battle -- 
yet thousands of Palestinians, including hundreds of women and 
children, remain in Israeli jails for resisting the illegal, ongoing 
occupation that is condemned by international law. They think of the 
pluck and "toughness" of Israel, "standing up" to "terrorists." Yet 
a nuclear Israel possesses the 13th-largest military force on the 
planet, one that is used to rule an area about the size of New 
Jersey and whose adversaries there have no conventional armed 
forces. Who is the underdog, supposedly America's traditional 
favorite, in this case?

I hope that Americans will give careful and well-informed thought to 
root causes and historical realities, in which case I think they 
will question why a supposedly "legitimate" state such as Israel has 
had to conduct decades of war against a subject refugee population 
without ever achieving its goals.

Israel's unilateral movements of the past year will not lead to 
peace. These acts -- the temporary withdrawal of forces from Gaza, 
the walling off of the West Bank -- are not strides toward 
resolution but empty, symbolic acts that fail to address the 
underlying conflict. Israel's nearly complete control over the lives 
of Palestinians is never in doubt, as confirmed by the humanitarian 
and economic suffering of the Palestinians since the January 
elections. Israel's ongoing policies of expansion, military control 
and assassination mock any notion of sovereignty or bilateralism. 
Its "separation barrier," running across our land, is hardly a good-
faith gesture toward future coexistence.

But there is a remedy, and while it is not easy it is consistent 
with our long-held beliefs. Palestinian priorities include 
recognition of the core dispute over the land of historical 
Palestine and the rights of all its people; resolution of the 
refugee issue from 1948; reclaiming all lands occupied in 1967; and 
stopping Israeli attacks, assassinations and military expansion. 
Contrary to popular depictions of the crisis in the American media, 
the dispute is not only about Gaza and the West Bank; it is a wider 
national conflict that can be resolved on

[FairfieldLife] Re: Palestinians & terrorism

2006-07-11 Thread bob_brigante
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Larry Potter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> (  with regard to nablus108 ).
>
>   I'm sorry to say that since the intafadah began I have uterly lost 
any respect for Palestinians as a nation. They choose terrible leaders 
and support terrible policies. They glorify terrible murderers who 
celebrate in killing Israeli women and children. 
> I am sad to say to you Palistinians, I have no sympathy for you.

*

 http://www.salon.com/opinion/feature/2006/07/11/gaza/index_np.html





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[FairfieldLife] HAPPY GURU PURNIMA 2006

2006-07-11 Thread George DeForest




HAPPY GURU PURNIMA 2006



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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
> > > >  wrote:
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
> > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of 
> unstressing 
> > he
> > > > > > couldn't handle.
> > > > > 
> > > > > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> > > > 
> > > > That's exactly the kind of response these people
> > > > can never 'get,' and likely will never 'get' for
> > > > the duration of their present incarnation. They're
> > > > locked into preserving their self-image of small
> > > > self, and as far as I can tell, will be locked into
> > > > it until the small self dissolves into the Bardo,
> > > > and for several incarnations past that point. They
> > > > just don't 'get' not having an ego to defend.
> > > 
> > > So, unstressing for you isn't a catch-all phrase?
> > 
> > This bozo is deeply, deeply terrified of *something*.
> 
> (Not you, Lawson, Barry.)
>

I know, but the observation applies to just about everyone--with some people 
its more 
obvious than others, I'll grant you...







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I'd sit down to meditate and my mind wouldn't settle down. It was
> outwardly focused and could no longer tolerate the escapism of
> transcending. I'd always looked at TM as a means of fixing what I
> felt was broken, and as such, TM was for me just another piece of 
> the toxic ego dynamic of grasping and aversion, preventing me from 
> being present in the here and now. 

You know, Alex, this doesn't even *sound* like you
talking.  It sounds artificial and rote and self-
conscious.

> However, TM never fixed what I wanted fixed, and I finally came to
> the end of the TM road. The right path for me ended up being one 
> where instead of tiptoeing around sleeping elephants, one goes 
> right up to the sleeping elephants and slaps them on the ass.

This does sound like you, though.  Where the heck
did that first paragraph come from?






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[FairfieldLife] Re: medical recommendations

2006-07-11 Thread feste37
I've been taking animals to the Vet Clinic on Burlington for 13 years.
They have never let me down. I highly recommend all the vets there, as
well as the admin. staff. They all love animals and they are always
courteous and efficient. 

For a physician, as Rick recommnended, try Larry Sutton. He's
unpretentious, helpful, inexpensive, and quite young, probably under
40. I think he knows what he's doing.  


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Ben Stallings" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Hi, folks!  I'm new in town and could use some recommendations...  I
> see from reading the archives that Drs. Roth and Holt are popular
> dentists.  Can someone recommend an optometrist?  How about a
> veterinarian?
> 
> I should also find a general practitioner for a checkup... I'm a
> 30-year-old man, so someone approximating that age and gender would
> probably be best.
> 
> One last question -- I have a suspected food intolerance that I need
> to get diagnosed and treated, and although I'm skeptical of holistic
> medicine, I had no luck at all with the gastroenterologists etc. in
> the Twin Cities, so I'm open to trying something new.  Who's good with
> guts around here?
> 
> Thank you in advance for sharing your knowledge!  --Ben
>






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
> > >  wrote:
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing 
> he
> > > > > couldn't handle.
> > > > 
> > > > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> > > 
> > > That's exactly the kind of response these people
> > > can never 'get,' and likely will never 'get' for
> > > the duration of their present incarnation. They're
> > > locked into preserving their self-image of small
> > > self, and as far as I can tell, will be locked into
> > > it until the small self dissolves into the Bardo,
> > > and for several incarnations past that point. They
> > > just don't 'get' not having an ego to defend.
> > 
> > So, unstressing for you isn't a catch-all phrase?
> 
> This bozo is deeply, deeply terrified of *something*.
>

Aren't we all?







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, gullible fool <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> > "Charging money for meditation is
> > like a mother charging
> > her baby for breast milk."
> 
> And charging a million dollars for a worthless course
> or for a crown would be like what?

A fundraiser?






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 5:36 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:47 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:
> >>
> > Vaj said: They felt he was a "seller of
> >>> the
>  Vedas" and thus destined for the deepest hell. Not the "saint"
> >>> some
>  imagine...
> 
> > Jim said: Emphasis on dogma can lead to all kinds of crazy ideas.
> > Just look at
> >>> the way the dharma of caste is often abused and misunderstood. 
Or
> >>> the state of the Catholic Church. You seem to put way too much
> >>> importance in titles.
> >>
> >>
> > Vaj said: I think the sages who said that originally saw it
> > as "cause and
> >> effect". Charging for the path to liberation was not seen as a
> > good
> >> "cause" and therefore had some bad effects...
> >>
> > I can't imagine why this would cause bad effects. Even money 
comes
> > from the same place everything else does...I suppose if they were
> > caught up into the thinking that making money was somehow
> > inconsistent with a spiritual life...I don't know, it seems 
silly to
> > me, given that a service is being provided.
> 
> 
> It's an interesting point Jim--I too have found this damnation by  
> jnanis to be bizarre--but not the point. The point was that 
Amma's  
> remarks were gentle by comparison--and the comparison to a mother  
> caring, touching to everyone (everyone has a mom).
>

I guess meditation is something everyone has an opinion on...





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" 
> > >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
> > > >  wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing 
> > > he
> > > > > > > couldn't handle.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> > > > > >
> > > > > 
> > > > > Do you think it isn't the case?
> > > >  
> > > > Unstressing had nothing to with it. I know you can't help but try to
> > > > pigeonhole my experience into your cultishly held TM worldview
> > > 
> > > Oh, for chrissake, Alex.  It's a perfectly reasonable
> > > question given your initial "would no longer tolerate"
> > > explanation for why you stopped.
> > >
> > 
> > Still is a reasonable explanation, IMHO. Basically, he's said: 
> > I couldnt' stand looking within any more. What explanation for
> > that save "unstressing?"
> 
> LOL!!! Actually, 2+ years of Waking Down gave me way deeper and way
> more looking within than anything I ever experienced with TM.
>

That might be. Doesn't change my point terribly, however.





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[FairfieldLife] Richard Linklater Interview

2006-07-11 Thread Bhairitu
I'm looking forward to seeing "A Scanner Darkly" which is Richard 
Linklater's new film based on the Phillip K. Dick story.  Here is an 
interview with Linklater:
http://infowars.com/articles/media/hit_movie_director_slams_bush_admin.htm



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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: "Maharishi said....."

2006-07-11 Thread Peter


--- jim_flanegin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
> "jim_flanegin"  
> wrote:
> > >
> > > So the question then becomes, how does each of
> us deal with 
> Reality, 
> > > the continual expansion of our Reality? Sounds
> simplistic, but all 
> > > of us long term meditators here, not just TM,
> have each worked out 
> > > our own strategies for doing so.
> > 
> > Do you honestly think there is only one Reality?
> >
> Sure, only one absolutely undefinable Reality, which
> each of us, as 
> experiencers of that one absolutely undefinable
> Reality will 
> comprehend completely differently.

The above statement is Absolutely wrong! ;-)



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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread gullible fool

Amma has probably already saved 1001 babies.

--- Peter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Vaj, (this said in good humor) I have a feeling that
> MMY could save 1000 babies from a burning building
> and
> you'd say, well, he didn't save 1001. ;-)
> 
> --- Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> 
> > LOL, no these were students and initiates of the
> > Shankaracharya of  
> > the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on
> > the back of the  
> > tradition.
> > 
> > On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:10 PM, authfriend wrote:
> > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:26 PM, authfriend wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Oh, had they all studied with MMY before they
> > saw
> > >>> the light?
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> They knew the tradition.
> > >
> > > Yes, but had they all studied with MMY before
> they
> > saw
> > > the light?
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
> __
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread Peter


--- Alex Stanley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"
>  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex
> Stanley" 
> > >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
> "sparaig"  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex
> Stanley"
> > > >  wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,
> "sparaig"  
> > > wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major
> bout of unstressing 
> > > he
> > > > > > > couldn't handle.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > If it makes you feel better to believe
> that, be my guest.
> > > > > >
> > > > > 
> > > > > Do you think it isn't the case?
> > > >  
> > > > Unstressing had nothing to with it. I know you
> can't help but try to
> > > > pigeonhole my experience into your cultishly
> held TM worldview
> > > 
> > > Oh, for chrissake, Alex.  It's a perfectly
> reasonable
> > > question given your initial "would no longer
> tolerate"
> > > explanation for why you stopped.
> > >
> > 
> > Still is a reasonable explanation, IMHO.
> Basically, he's said: 
> > I couldnt' stand looking within any more. What
> explanation for
> > that save "unstressing?"
> 
> LOL!!! Actually, 2+ years of Waking Down gave me way
> deeper and way
> more looking within than anything I ever experienced
> with TM.

Even SSRS says that his Sudarshan Kriya may not be for
everyone. Not a lot of people, but there could be
some.

 
> 
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> 
> 
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[FairfieldLife] 'MS-18' Terrorist Threat from South America'

2006-07-11 Thread Robert Gimbel



MS-18, a new brand or terrorism, based in El Salvador...  Is also a base for the importation of Cocaine, and worse, Crack Cocaine.  The most dangerous aspect of this group, is the training they receive;  By a man named 'EL DIABLo', in which he teaches to give all;  "For the cause"; they want to take over the cocaine producing areas.  Another dangerous tactic, is that sellers of Crack Cocaine;  The gang members of MS-18, are not permitted in using the Crack, themselves.  They are forbidden to sell Crack to any other member of their group;  The reason being: They don't want to be responsible for a group  members  Death...  I'm not sure what the government is doing about this threat;  As part of the immigration problem, naturally extends to these MS-18 members'  Who enter the U.S. illegally, importing the lethal Crack to
 American streets;  Further yet, is the introduction of Meth, which is just as lethal as Crack;  Or even more so, if that is possible.  There are many ways, the evil can steal a person's soul.  The depth and cutting arrogance of the evil that now exists in these groups;  Who worship the opposite of the Jesus Doctrine of Love.  These groups harbor hatred, destruction of all love, and of life.     Robert Gimbel   Madison,WI   2006 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  
wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
> > >  wrote:
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of 
unstressing 
> he
> > > > > couldn't handle.
> > > > 
> > > > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> > > 
> > > That's exactly the kind of response these people
> > > can never 'get,' and likely will never 'get' for
> > > the duration of their present incarnation. They're
> > > locked into preserving their self-image of small
> > > self, and as far as I can tell, will be locked into
> > > it until the small self dissolves into the Bardo,
> > > and for several incarnations past that point. They
> > > just don't 'get' not having an ego to defend.
> > 
> > So, unstressing for you isn't a catch-all phrase?
> 
> This bozo is deeply, deeply terrified of *something*.

(Not you, Lawson, Barry.)







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[FairfieldLife] India's guru of love conveys faith with an embrace

2006-07-11 Thread gullible fool

Article at:

http://www.suntimes.com/output/religion/cst-nws-amma06.html


India's guru of love conveys faith with an embrace 

July 6, 2006

BY CATHLEEN FALSANI Religion Reporter 
 
Her religion, she says, is love.

And her practice, in its purest form, is a hug. 

Not a loose, back-patting, hips apart, quick grasp,
like the kind that might be accompanied by an "air
kiss."

When Amma, the 52-year-old Indian holy woman, hugs
people, it's a firm, tender embrace. She cradles their
heads -- men and women, children or pensioners -- to
her right bosom like infants, all the while quietly
telling them how much she loves them. 

Amma greets her devotees with a firm, tender embrace
Wednesday at the Oak Brook Hills Marriott Resort. She
expects to hug more than 3,000 people in two days.
(KEITH HALE/ SUN-TIMES)

MATA AMRITANANDAMAYI DEVI, AKA "AMMA" 

Born: Sept. 27, 1953, to a poor family of fishermen in
Kerala, India. Her given name was Sudhamani. 

Hugging: Amma's devotees claim she personally has
hugged more than 30 million people in the last 30
years. The nonsectarian guru believes the hugs
alleviate suffering. 

Fun facts: Amma spoke at the 1993 Parliament of the
World's Religions in Chicago and has visited the
Chicago area every year since 1989. Her charitable
trust runs social service centers in 15 countries,
distributed $1 million in medicine to tsunami victims,
and donated $1 million to the Bush-Clinton Hurricane
Katrina Fund. 

Not-so-fun fact: Amma's followers stopped a
knife-wielding man about 15 feet from the "hugging
saint" during a prayer meeting in India last year.

Cathleen Falsani 


"Darling daughter, darling daughter, darling
daughter," Amma whispered lovingly into the ear of one
30-something woman who had waited nearly four hours
Wednesday in a meeting room at the Oak Brook Hills
Marriott Resort to meet the cherubic woman who
devotees believe is a living saint.

"Amma, amma, amma," the Indian woman known as "the
hugging saint" quietly chanted into the kneeling
visitor's ear. "To awaken the mother within you," the
guru explained. 

After a minutelong hug and several kisses on the
cheeks, Amma -- bright-eyed, swathed in layers of
diaphanous white cloth and smelling of hyacinth --
slipped a single Hershey's chocolate kiss and a red
flower petal into the visitor's hand and sent her on
her way before reaching out to embrace the next two
women waiting in line on their knees.

'Mostly about the chocolate'

More than 3,000 people were expected to be hugged by
Amma on Wednesday and today, when she will begin
doling out the sacred love at 10 a.m. Admission is
free. So are the hugs. 

Amma was born into the Hindu religion, but now "her
spiritual practices are universal," said Balan Nair, a
retired businessman from Oak Brook who hosted the
guru's visit. "She doesn't preach any particular
religion. It's value-based. ... Love is the cure-all.
That is her teaching."

Barrie Cole, a playwright and performer from Chicago's
Logan Square neighborhood, took her children Sita, 2,
and Ruben, 4, with her to see Amma. 

"It really doesn't make a lot of rational sense to
wait in line for a couple of hours to get a hug from
somebody who's supposed to be a saint, but it's not
really about the intellectual or rational part of your
brain," Cole said. "She's the universal mother, so we
want to bring our children here and get blessed.

"It is pretty amazing that someone could be that
present for thousands of people. So I think if there
is such a thing as a realized being, it would be
somebody like Amma," she said. "But for the kids, it's
mostly about the chocolate."

[EMAIL PROTECTED]


'Without love, you can never really move forward in
life' 


Amma answers three questions from the Sun-Times:


Q.Why do you think so many different kinds of people
come to see you?

A. There is no particular color, caste, creed or
religion -- love is universal, and that's what I'm
trying to give to people, and that's what I'm trying
to awaken in others. And that's why people come.

Q.Why does it seem so difficult for so many of us to
act lovingly?

A. Love should begin from the family. When parents
love their children, they should not consider the
children as objects. We can own a car or a house or
property. We can consider them all objects. But you
cannot consider children as objects. They are a
God-given gift. Parents are just instruments. 

Mostly people use each other. They don't consider each
other as living beings, as somebody whom you should
respect or love. 

Parents even suppress their children because they
project their own negativities on their children. And
in the process, [the children's] hearts become closed.
So they are neither able to give or take love when
they become old. ... Have deep respect for children.

You may give education to your children or you may
even give wealth to your children, but that's not
enough. Unless you give proper values, spiritual
values ... to your children, they will not go. It's
like even if there

[FairfieldLife] Re: Gooooooooool!!!

2006-07-11 Thread Armando



Usually I don't like stupids and stupid things, but sometimes they're useful...  An italian Chiacchiera con i tuoi amici in tempo reale!  http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/*http://it.messenger.yahoo.com 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
> >  wrote:
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing 
he
> > > > couldn't handle.
> > > 
> > > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> > 
> > That's exactly the kind of response these people
> > can never 'get,' and likely will never 'get' for
> > the duration of their present incarnation. They're
> > locked into preserving their self-image of small
> > self, and as far as I can tell, will be locked into
> > it until the small self dissolves into the Bardo,
> > and for several incarnations past that point. They
> > just don't 'get' not having an ego to defend.
> 
> So, unstressing for you isn't a catch-all phrase?

This bozo is deeply, deeply terrified of *something*.







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread gullible fool

> "Charging money for meditation is
> like a mother charging
> her baby for breast milk."

And charging a million dollars for a worthless course
or for a crown would be like what?

--- Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> on 7/11/06 11:03 AM, new.morning at
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > 
> > Any news, observations?
> > 
> I¹ve been immersed in it/her and just recovered from
> the sleep deprivation.
> We had a really good turn-out both days, in large
> part because it was the
> weekend. Filled the gymnasium. Many showed up who
> wouldn¹t have been caught
> dead there a year ago. Many of Amma¹s tour staff
> commented that Iowa is
> their favorite stop on the tour. We celebrated Guru
> Purnima at about 5am
> Monday morning. 
> 
> It was web cast:
> http://amritapuri.org/news/07/607distance.php
> 
> I¹m trying to stay focused to fit a month¹s work
> into two weeks, haven¹t
> been hanging out here much. I¹ll keep an eye on this
> thread and will be
> happy to elaborate if there¹s interest. One
> interesting comment Amma made to
> a friend of mine: ³Charging money for meditation is
> like a mother charging
> her baby for breast milk.²
> 
> An article:
>
http://www.thehawkeye.com/daily/stories/ln1_0710.html
> 



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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread Alex Stanley
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" 
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
> > >  wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
> > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing 
> > he
> > > > > > couldn't handle.
> > > > > 
> > > > > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> > > > >
> > > > 
> > > > Do you think it isn't the case?
> > >  
> > > Unstressing had nothing to with it. I know you can't help but try to
> > > pigeonhole my experience into your cultishly held TM worldview
> > 
> > Oh, for chrissake, Alex.  It's a perfectly reasonable
> > question given your initial "would no longer tolerate"
> > explanation for why you stopped.
> >
> 
> Still is a reasonable explanation, IMHO. Basically, he's said: 
> I couldnt' stand looking within any more. What explanation for
> that save "unstressing?"

LOL!!! Actually, 2+ years of Waking Down gave me way deeper and way
more looking within than anything I ever experienced with TM. 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  
wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" 
 
> > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  
wrote:
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > > There are a lot of reasons that TM would not work for a 
> > person 
> > > > but  
> > > > > > > they're probably similar or the same reasons other 
forms 
> > of  
> > > > > > > meditation might not work. IMO the most common reason 
is 
> > that 
> > > > the  
> > > > > > > person receiving the instruction, for whatever reason--
> > their 
> > > > > > mental  
> > > > > > > makeup, their worldview, their state of mind, etc.-- 
*just 
> > > > doesn't  
> > > > > > > get it*. A constitutional disconnect.  It just doesn't 
> > click 
> > > > with  
> > > > > > > where they're at. And of course this can happen with 
any 
> > form 
> > > > of  
> > > > > > > meditation. In a case such as this, it may be 
advantageous 
> > to 
> > > > wait  
> > > > > > > until a certain span of time has passed and then be re-
> > > > instructed.  
> > > > > > > The perspective of time can do wonders.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > As it happens, TM provides for exactly this and 
> > > > > > recommends TMers take advantage of it on a regular
> > > > > > basis.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > The checking procedure is essentially reinstruction
> > > > > > in the practice.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Not really. Its a reminder of effortlessness.
> > > > 
> > > > That's what TM instruction is.
> > > >
> > > 
> > > TM initiation isn't the same as the 3 nights of checking and 
> > > verification you get afterwards. 
> > > Certainly, there's overlap between checking and the three 
nights 
> > > checking. But that's not TM instruction.
> > 
> > Checking isn't *initiation*.
> > 
> > The differences from the initial instruction 
> > (the private session) are minor.
> >
> 
> I'd say they're major and all-important. The most obvious one is
> that initiation is a one-time deal.

Yes, that's why I just said "Checking isn't *initiation*."

I've been talking about instruction after the puja.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:42 PM, authfriend wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> >>
> >> LOL, no these were students and initiates of the Shankaracharya of
> >> the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on the back of the
> >> tradition.
> >
> > Ah.  So they had no firsthand knowledge of him.
> 
> 
> 
> The Shankaracharya knew quite a bit about Mahesh Varma--but that's  
> not the point my dear--this large and typical Judith non sequitur.  
> The point is Amma's remarks about him were gentle in comparison.
>

But still remarks nevertheless (to paraphrase Master Po from Kung Fu).






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
>  wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > >
> > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing he
> > > couldn't handle.
> > 
> > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> 
> That's exactly the kind of response these people
> can never 'get,' and likely will never 'get' for
> the duration of their present incarnation. They're
> locked into preserving their self-image of small
> self, and as far as I can tell, will be locked into
> it until the small self dissolves into the Bardo,
> and for several incarnations past that point. They
> just don't 'get' not having an ego to defend.
>


So, unstressing for you isn't a catch-all phrase? 






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
>  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning  wrote:
> > >
> > > Any news, observations?
> > 
> > I went to see her for the first time during her first ever stop in
> > Iowa, however many years ago that was. I'm not at all wired for
> > devotion to and worship of gurus, saints, etc., so the whole
> > experience was very underwhelming (except for the Indian lunch, 
> > which was quite good).
> > 
> > Having undergone so much transformation since her first visit, I
> > decided to go back and see how I'd react now. I was again 
> > underwhelmed by the hug, but I could appreciate the heart value 
> > of the gathering, and I was not inclined to make snarky, cynical 
> > comments about it like I was the first time. And, again, the 
> > Indian lunch was delicious.
> >
> > If I could structure an Ammachi experience according to my own
> > desires, I'd replace the hug with an equal amount of time just 
> > gazing directly into her eyes (i.e., like Waking Down's gazing 
> > meditation).
> 
> Thanks for the honest apraisal. It's not something 
> we've come to expect from anyone with a TM history.
>

Such as yourself?







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" 
>  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
> >  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing 
> he
> > > > > couldn't handle.
> > > > 
> > > > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> > > >
> > > 
> > > Do you think it isn't the case?
> >  
> > Unstressing had nothing to with it. I know you can't help but try to
> > pigeonhole my experience into your cultishly held TM worldview
> 
> Oh, for chrissake, Alex.  It's a perfectly reasonable
> question given your initial "would no longer tolerate"
> explanation for why you stopped.
>

Still is a reasonable explanation, IMHO. Basically, he's said: I couldnt' stand 
looking within 
any more. What explanation for that save "unstressing?"






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Gooooooooool!!!

2006-07-11 Thread uns_tressor
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "uns_tressor"  
> wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB 
> > > And an equally-unbelievable foul, later on. 
> > > 
> > > Sigh. :-)
> > 
> > This is reminiscent of the Wayne Rooney send off,
> > except that Rooney is a bit of a truculent teenager.
> > There is going to be a story about the comment made.
> > Cricketers call it sledging, for some odd reason. But
> > it is a sick practice.
> 
> The Times has a story that reports on Vidane's head-butt,
> but not the comment--it just says he "had words" with the
> guy he fouled.  What was the comment?

A Nationwide talk radio station today said that there was 
an unconfirmed report that the defender called Zidane an
Algerian terrorist.
Uns.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:47 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:
> 
> >>
> >> Given that the traditional comment would be that those who sells
> >> meditation would go to the Avachi Hell, I'd say this was much
> > nicer,
> >> even kind.
> >>
> >> When I visited with sannyasis of the Shankaracharya order and
> > naively
> >> mentioned that I learned meditation in the "Shanakaracharya
> >> tradition", they immediately asked "from who?" When I said it was
> > TM
> >> and Maharishi's meditation several of the sannyasis got very angry
> > at
> >> this, one was particularly loud and quietly escorted away. Not a
> > nice
> >> scene! Last time I ever said that. They felt he was a "seller of
> > the
> >> Vedas" and thus destined for the deepest hell. Not the "saint"
> > some
> >> imagine...
> >>
> > Emphasis on dogma can lead to all kinds of crazy ideas. Just look at
> > the way the dharma of caste is often abused and misunderstood. Or
> > the state of the Catholic Church. You seem to put way too much
> > importance in titles.
> 
> 
> I think the sages who said that originally saw it as "cause and  
> effect". Charging for the path to liberation was not seen as a good  
> "cause" and therefore had some bad effects...
>

Ah yes, the sages understood all there is to know about modern industrial 
societies.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:42 PM, authfriend wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> >>
> >> LOL, no these were students and initiates of the Shankaracharya 
of
> >> the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on the back of the
> >> tradition.
> >
> > Ah.  So they had no firsthand knowledge of him.
> 
> 
> 
> The Shankaracharya knew quite a bit about Mahesh Varma--but that's  
> not the point my dear--this large and typical Judith non sequitur.  
> The point is Amma's remarks about him were gentle in comparison.]

Yes, poopsie, I know what your point was.  I was
interested in your account of the Shank's sanyasi.
Check Mr. Dictionary for the meaning of "non
sequitur."







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > > > > 
> > > > > > There are a lot of reasons that TM would not work for a 
> person 
> > > but  
> > > > > > they're probably similar or the same reasons other forms 
> of  
> > > > > > meditation might not work. IMO the most common reason is 
> that 
> > > the  
> > > > > > person receiving the instruction, for whatever reason--
> their 
> > > > > mental  
> > > > > > makeup, their worldview, their state of mind, etc.-- *just 
> > > doesn't  
> > > > > > get it*. A constitutional disconnect.  It just doesn't 
> click 
> > > with  
> > > > > > where they're at. And of course this can happen with any 
> form 
> > > of  
> > > > > > meditation. In a case such as this, it may be advantageous 
> to 
> > > wait  
> > > > > > until a certain span of time has passed and then be re-
> > > instructed.  
> > > > > > The perspective of time can do wonders.
> > > > > 
> > > > > As it happens, TM provides for exactly this and 
> > > > > recommends TMers take advantage of it on a regular
> > > > > basis.
> > > > > 
> > > > > The checking procedure is essentially reinstruction
> > > > > in the practice.
> > > > 
> > > > Not really. Its a reminder of effortlessness.
> > > 
> > > That's what TM instruction is.
> > >
> > 
> > TM initiation isn't the same as the 3 nights of checking and 
> > verification you get afterwards. 
> > Certainly, there's overlap between checking and the three nights 
> > checking. But that's not TM instruction.
> 
> Checking isn't *initiation*.
> 
> The differences from the initial instruction 
> (the private session) are minor.
>

I'd say they're major and all-important. The most obvious one is that 
initiation is a one-
time deal.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Paranoia as cult bonding mechanism

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> >
> > This is my observation as well. It's actually quite bizarre 
> > to see--the "defenders of the faith" end up being perfect 
> > reasons *not* to start TM. 
> 
> But you have to admit it's pretty funny. All that 
> anyone has to do is mention the 'C' word, and the
> cultists start coming out of the woodwork to compete
> with each other to see who can sound the craziest 
> and the most paranoid.
> 
> Just when we thought Judy had the title sewed up,
> along come Peter Klutz and nabius to demonstrate
> what TM does for one's sense of reality. With 
> friends like these, the TMO really doesn't need 
> any enemies...  :-)
>

Explain to your friends about your experiences with levitation...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Paranoia as cult bonding mechanism

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 10, 2006, at 3:41 AM, TurquoiseB wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> >>
> >> This is my observation as well. It's actually quite bizarre
> >> to see--the "defenders of the faith" end up being perfect
> >> reasons *not* to start TM.
> >
> > But you have to admit it's pretty funny. All that
> > anyone has to do is mention the 'C' word, and the
> > cultists start coming out of the woodwork to compete
> > with each other to see who can sound the craziest
> > and the most paranoid.
> 
> Oh yeah, I know. I really is bizarre.
> 
> >
> > Just when we thought Judy had the title sewed up,
> > along come Peter Klutz and nabius to demonstrate
> > what TM does for one's sense of reality. With
> > friends like these, the TMO really doesn't need
> > any enemies...  :-)
> 
> LOL.

The idiocy of that comparison--speaking of a
defective sense of reality--really *is* 
pretty funny.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Paranoia as cult bonding mechanism

2006-07-11 Thread Vaj


On Jul 10, 2006, at 3:41 AM, TurquoiseB wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:  This is my observation as well. It's actually quite bizarre  to see--the "defenders of the faith" end up being perfect  reasons *not* to start TM.   But you have to admit it's pretty funny. All that  anyone has to do is mention the 'C' word, and the cultists start coming out of the woodwork to compete with each other to see who can sound the craziest  and the most paranoid.Oh yeah, I know. I really is bizarre.  Just when we thought Judy had the title sewed up, along come Peter Klutz and nabius to demonstrate what TM does for one's sense of reality. With  friends like these, the TMO really doesn't need  any enemies...  :-) LOL.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Vaj


On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:42 PM, authfriend wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:  LOL, no these were students and initiates of the Shankaracharya of   the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on the back of the   tradition.  Ah.  So they had no firsthand knowledge of him. The Shankaracharya knew quite a bit about Mahesh Varma--but that's not the point my dear--this large and typical Judith non sequitur. The point is Amma's remarks about him were gentle in comparison.
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Vaj


On Jul 11, 2006, at 5:36 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:   On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:47 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:  Vaj said: They felt he was a "seller of the Vedas" and thus destined for the deepest hell. Not the "saint" some imagine...  Jim said: Emphasis on dogma can lead to all kinds of crazy ideas.  Just look at the way the dharma of caste is often abused and misunderstood. Or the state of the Catholic Church. You seem to put way too much importance in titles.   Vaj said: I think the sages who said that originally saw it  as "cause and   effect". Charging for the path to liberation was not seen as a  good   "cause" and therefore had some bad effects...  I can't imagine why this would cause bad effects. Even money comes  from the same place everything else does...I suppose if they were  caught up into the thinking that making money was somehow  inconsistent with a spiritual life...I don't know, it seems silly to  me, given that a service is being provided. It's an interesting point Jim--I too have found this damnation by jnanis to be bizarre--but not the point. The point was that Amma's remarks were gentle by comparison--and the comparison to a mother caring, touching to everyone (everyone has a mom).
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Vaj


On Jul 11, 2006, at 6:10 PM, Peter wrote:Vaj, (this said in good humor) I have a feeling that MMY could save 1000 babies from a burning building and you'd say, well, he didn't save 1001. ;-) Get real Dr. P., if he can't do 1008, he ain't a very good Shaivite. :-)
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Kenny H" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning  
wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Any news, observations?
> > > 
> > > I went to see her for the first time during her first ever 
stop in
> > > Iowa, however many years ago that was. I'm not at all wired for
> > > devotion to and worship of gurus, saints, etc., so the whole
> > > experience was very underwhelming (except for the Indian 
lunch, 
> > > which was quite good).
> > > 
> > > Having undergone so much transformation since her first visit, 
I
> > > decided to go back and see how I'd react now. I was again 
> > > underwhelmed by the hug, but I could appreciate the heart 
value 
> > > of the gathering, and I was not inclined to make snarky, 
cynical 
> > > comments about it like I was the first time. And, again, the 
> > > Indian lunch was delicious.
> > >
> > > If I could structure an Ammachi experience according to my own
> > > desires, I'd replace the hug with an equal amount of time just 
> > > gazing directly into her eyes (i.e., like Waking Down's gazing 
> > > meditation).
> > 
> > Thanks for the honest apraisal. It's not something 
> > we've come to expect from anyone with a TM history.
> >
> 
> You know, Barry, I believe you say these kinds of things to see 
just
> how many people you can involve in lengthy argumentative 
diatribes. I
> am not going to get suckered in past this post. 
> 
> An old long-time friend of yours from Rama, who is a really long-
time
> friend of mine, recently told me that you really do seem to like to
> argue. 
> 
> I can see it clearly now. It's like when my parents finally got
> divorced and I would visit each separately. I discovered that one
> parent had done a brilliant job at manipulating popular opinion
> against the other. When they were no longer together, it was 
amazing
> to find that the one who had done the manipulating against the 
other
> was far more responsible than we were all led to believe. 
> 
> Your comment seems purposefully inflammatory. 
> 
> KH
>
If we can push against something, it reassures us we exist.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Kenny H" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
> >  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning  
wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Any news, observations?
> > > 
> > > I went to see her for the first time during her first ever 
stop in
> > > Iowa, however many years ago that was. I'm not at all wired for
> > > devotion to and worship of gurus, saints, etc., so the whole
> > > experience was very underwhelming (except for the Indian 
lunch, 
> > > which was quite good).
> > > 
> > > Having undergone so much transformation since her first visit, 
I
> > > decided to go back and see how I'd react now. I was again 
> > > underwhelmed by the hug, but I could appreciate the heart 
value 
> > > of the gathering, and I was not inclined to make snarky, 
cynical 
> > > comments about it like I was the first time. And, again, the 
> > > Indian lunch was delicious.
> > >
> > > If I could structure an Ammachi experience according to my own
> > > desires, I'd replace the hug with an equal amount of time just 
> > > gazing directly into her eyes (i.e., like Waking Down's gazing 
> > > meditation).
> > 
> > Thanks for the honest apraisal. It's not something 
> > we've come to expect from anyone with a TM history.
> >
> 
> You know, Barry, I believe you say these kinds of things to see 
just
> how many people you can involve in lengthy argumentative 
diatribes. I
> am not going to get suckered in past this post. 
> 
> An old long-time friend of yours from Rama, who is a really long-
time
> friend of mine, recently told me that you really do seem to like to
> argue. 
> 
> I can see it clearly now. It's like when my parents finally got
> divorced and I would visit each separately. I discovered that one
> parent had done a brilliant job at manipulating popular opinion
> against the other. When they were no longer together, it was 
amazing
> to find that the one who had done the manipulating against the 
other
> was far more responsible than we were all led to believe. 
> 
> Your comment seems purposefully inflammatory. 
> 
> KH
>
If we can push against something, it reassures us we exist.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] medical recommendations

2006-07-11 Thread Rick Archer
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] medical recommendations





on 7/11/06 6:38 PM, Ben Stallings at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


Hi, folks!  I'm new in town and could use some recommendations...  I
see from reading the archives that Drs. Roth and Holt are popular
dentists. 

There’s also Bob Yudin. I go to him.

 Can someone recommend an optometrist?  How about a
veterinarian?

You have two choices in town: the vet clinic near the west end of town and Bill Pollack.

I should also find a general practitioner for a checkup... I'm a
30-year-old man, so someone approximating that age and gender would
probably be best.

You might try Larry Sutton, MD. 472-0666. Office visit only $29

One last question -- I have a suspected food intolerance that I need
to get diagnosed and treated, and although I'm skeptical of holistic
medicine, I had no luck at all with the gastroenterologists etc. in
the Twin Cities, so I'm open to trying something new.  Who's good with
guts around here?

Probably someone up in Iowa City if you want to go the allopathic route.


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[FairfieldLife] medical recommendations

2006-07-11 Thread Ben Stallings
Hi, folks!  I'm new in town and could use some recommendations...  I
see from reading the archives that Drs. Roth and Holt are popular
dentists.  Can someone recommend an optometrist?  How about a
veterinarian?

I should also find a general practitioner for a checkup... I'm a
30-year-old man, so someone approximating that age and gender would
probably be best.

One last question -- I have a suspected food intolerance that I need
to get diagnosed and treated, and although I'm skeptical of holistic
medicine, I had no luck at all with the gastroenterologists etc. in
the Twin Cities, so I'm open to trying something new.  Who's good with
guts around here?

Thank you in advance for sharing your knowledge!  --Ben






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[FairfieldLife] Re: "Maharishi said....."

2006-07-11 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin"  
wrote:
> >
> > So the question then becomes, how does each of us deal with 
Reality, 
> > the continual expansion of our Reality? Sounds simplistic, but all 
> > of us long term meditators here, not just TM, have each worked out 
> > our own strategies for doing so.
> 
> Do you honestly think there is only one Reality?
>
Sure, only one absolutely undefinable Reality, which each of us, as 
experiencers of that one absolutely undefinable Reality will 
comprehend completely differently.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > >
> > > LOL, no these were students and initiates of the Shankaracharya 
of  
> > > the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on the back of 
the  
> > > tradition.
> > 
> > Ah.  So they had no firsthand knowledge of him.
> 
> Sorta like you, eh?  :-)

Not quite, no.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Kenny H
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
>  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning  wrote:
> > >
> > > Any news, observations?
> > 
> > I went to see her for the first time during her first ever stop in
> > Iowa, however many years ago that was. I'm not at all wired for
> > devotion to and worship of gurus, saints, etc., so the whole
> > experience was very underwhelming (except for the Indian lunch, 
> > which was quite good).
> > 
> > Having undergone so much transformation since her first visit, I
> > decided to go back and see how I'd react now. I was again 
> > underwhelmed by the hug, but I could appreciate the heart value 
> > of the gathering, and I was not inclined to make snarky, cynical 
> > comments about it like I was the first time. And, again, the 
> > Indian lunch was delicious.
> >
> > If I could structure an Ammachi experience according to my own
> > desires, I'd replace the hug with an equal amount of time just 
> > gazing directly into her eyes (i.e., like Waking Down's gazing 
> > meditation).
> 
> Thanks for the honest apraisal. It's not something 
> we've come to expect from anyone with a TM history.
>

You know, Barry, I believe you say these kinds of things to see just
how many people you can involve in lengthy argumentative diatribes. I
am not going to get suckered in past this post. 

An old long-time friend of yours from Rama, who is a really long-time
friend of mine, recently told me that you really do seem to like to
argue. 

I can see it clearly now. It's like when my parents finally got
divorced and I would visit each separately. I discovered that one
parent had done a brilliant job at manipulating popular opinion
against the other. When they were no longer together, it was amazing
to find that the one who had done the manipulating against the other
was far more responsible than we were all led to believe. 

Your comment seems purposefully inflammatory. 

KH





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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Rick Archer
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF





on 7/11/06 2:26 PM, Alex Stanley at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com  , Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> on 7/11/06 1:16 PM, Alex Stanley at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[snip]
> > If I could structure an Ammachi experience according to my own
> > desires, I'd replace the hug with an equal amount of time just
> > gazing
> > directly into her eyes (i.e., like Waking Down's gazing meditation).
> > 
> >  
> I often do that because she’s gotten to know me and we have 
> conversations. It’s nice.

Wow, I didn't know you speak Malayalam.

Not a word. She always has translators around her.

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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
>  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning  
wrote:
> > >
> > > Any news, observations?
> > 
> > I went to see her for the first time during her first ever stop in
> > Iowa, however many years ago that was. I'm not at all wired for
> > devotion to and worship of gurus, saints, etc., so the whole
> > experience was very underwhelming (except for the Indian lunch, 
> > which was quite good).
> > 
> > Having undergone so much transformation since her first visit, I
> > decided to go back and see how I'd react now. I was again 
> > underwhelmed by the hug, but I could appreciate the heart value 
> > of the gathering, and I was not inclined to make snarky, cynical 
> > comments about it like I was the first time. And, again, the 
> > Indian lunch was delicious.
> >
> > If I could structure an Ammachi experience according to my own
> > desires, I'd replace the hug with an equal amount of time just 
> > gazing directly into her eyes (i.e., like Waking Down's gazing 
> > meditation).
> 
> Thanks for the honest apraisal. It's not something 
> we've come to expect from anyone with a TM history.

ROTFL!!  Now you're tainted with the cult poison even
if you have decisively rejected TM.

Watch out, Barry.  You may be next.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  
wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" 
 
> > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  
wrote:
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > > There are a lot of reasons that TM would not work for a 
> > person 
> > > > but  
> > > > > > > they're probably similar or the same reasons other 
forms 
> > of  
> > > > > > > meditation might not work. IMO the most common reason 
is 
> > that 
> > > > the  
> > > > > > > person receiving the instruction, for whatever reason--
> > their 
> > > > > > mental  
> > > > > > > makeup, their worldview, their state of mind, etc.-- 
*just 
> > > > doesn't  
> > > > > > > get it*. A constitutional disconnect.  It just doesn't 
> > click 
> > > > with  
> > > > > > > where they're at. And of course this can happen with 
any 
> > form 
> > > > of  
> > > > > > > meditation. In a case such as this, it may be 
advantageous 
> > to 
> > > > wait  
> > > > > > > until a certain span of time has passed and then be re-
> > > > instructed.  
> > > > > > > The perspective of time can do wonders.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > As it happens, TM provides for exactly this and 
> > > > > > recommends TMers take advantage of it on a regular
> > > > > > basis.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > > The checking procedure is essentially reinstruction
> > > > > > in the practice.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Not really. Its a reminder of effortlessness.
> > > > 
> > > > That's what TM instruction is.
> > > >
> > > 
> > > TM initiation isn't the same as the 3 nights of checking and 
> > > verification you get afterwards. 
> > > Certainly, there's overlap between checking and the three 
nights 
> > > checking. But that's not TM instruction.
> > 
> > Checking isn't *initiation*.
> > 
> > The differences from the initial instruction 
> > (the private session) are minor.
> 
> Says the person

Quite accurately.

 who was always too terrified to 
> become a TM teacher because she thought it might
> get in the way of her ego.  :-)

Uh, no, I was never "terrified" to become a TM
teacher, nor did I think it would get in the way
of my ego.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Trials for drug that leaves HIV defenceless

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > On Jul 11, 2006, at 12:23 PM, TurquoiseB wrote:
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > >> On Jul 11, 2006, at 11:47 AM, TurquoiseB wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Good news. Now the question is going to be, will the
> > >>> company that developed this drug make it available
> > >>> at a reasonable cost to the millions in Africa and
> > >>> other places around the world who are dying of AIDS?
> => >>
> > >> I haven't heard a follow-up to this, but an Indian Industrial
> > >> Pharmacist IIRC learned the process for the current 
> > >> antiretrovirus "cocktail" and was going to give it to African 
> > >> governments gratis.
> > >> They would have been able to produce doses dirt cheap--dollars 
a
> > >> month--and the Africans refused.
> > >
> > > There is certainly more 'meat' to this story. *Why*
> > > would they refuse? For example, were they threatened
> > > with a cessation of or reduction of US aid if they
> > > went for it?
> > >
> > > That has certainly happened in the past, with the
> > > US threatening to cancel aid to a country if it
> > > allowed free abortions or dispensing of birth
> > > control products.
> > 
> > IIRC it had to do with conspiracy theories the African officials 
had  
> > about why we *really* wanted to give these drugs to them. For 
> > example one African president did not believe that HIV caused 
AIDS !
> 
> Sad. A truly sad commentary on how the 'word' of the
> United States of America has come to not only mean
> nothing in the view of the rest of the planet, but
> mean less than nothing.

Y'all seem to have missed that it was allegedly an
*Indian industrial pharmacist* who was going to
give the process for the drug cocktail (not the
drugs themselves) to African nations, not the U.S.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Blaming Isreal and the Jews'

2006-07-11 Thread Robert Gimbel
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shempmcgurk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> What kind of drugs
> Robert
> Did you take
> In the '60s
> And
> How often?

So anyway, when I went through this purification process, the last of 
the entities left, me, and wanted to make some statements, on the way 
to leaving;
So, it was like the last bad spirit leaving you, and in an arrogant 
way, sort of telling you off; 
Like you have rejected it; and it says, now your life will be boring.
It says, that it is in control of everything which I could see;
All the banks, all the media, all the power-structure;
And even my children, who though a nasty divorce in New Jersey;
became under the influece of the things of our time, we all know is 
not good, drugs, etc.
Thank God they have gotten through that period, and are now not under 
the thumb, of that demonic New Jersey energy, where my ex resides, 
with her curren husband, German Herman.
So, even though it seems stange to think our whole culture is living 
in some kind of illusion controlled and manipulated by Mr. Big Cheese,
Who knows, Really who is running things; who is making the money; 
wher is it being spent, wasted and what is it being used for?
What is the intension of an entity, that takes your name, gives you a 
number, and returns you in a box, not to be photographed, coming in 
the smoggy morning just south of New Jersy,
Down in Delaware way, at Dover; where the bodies are thick,
coming into the morgue, for shipment out, to who knows where>
???1960's 
BeatlesHendrix.Morrison.JoplinTMBobby K.??
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel  
> wrote:
> >
> > When push comes to shove throughout recent Western history;
> >   The Jews always seem to get scapegoated, over and over again;
> >   Now the Iranians and other elements wish the Jews annihilation.
> >   So, now the U.S. makes Iran an offer.
> >   You 'all should see the film "Munich";
> >   It's very good at showing what goes on- behind the scenes of 
> power.
> >   I really think it gives Israel or the Jews, to much power;
> >   To think they are behind everything?
> >   Do we blame Jesus, the Jew, for Christianity, Do we Blame 
> Einstein for the Atomic Bomb, do we blame Dylan for the anti-war, 
> hippie movement?
> >   But, Who? is really behind it all...???
> >   In my humble opinion, I think it is a network of people.
> >   At the top of the food chain, in the intelligence community.
> >   People like J. Hoover in the past, who had it in for the 
> Kennedy's.
> >   And people who understand and have studied the ways of money;
> >   And power...
> >   Who know how to manipulate the stock market;
> >   Know how to keep the military well funded.
> >   Know how to make money in oil.
> >   Have complete access to all intelligence, satellite, etc.
> >   Their allegiance is primarily to the quest of power and money.
> >   Many of them, I believe are worshipers of the evil one.(or Set 
> or Satan, Lucifer, Beelzebub).
> >   So, those are some of my thoughts on the subject.
> >   They seem to have gotten control;
> >   Around the time of the Kennedy assassination.
> >   And have pretty much consolidate their power now;
> >   With King George II;
> >   Playing the good part, they like him to play.
> >
> >   R. Gimbel  Madison,WI
> > 
> > 
> > -
> > Want to be your own boss? Learn how on  Yahoo! Small Business.
> >
>






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi/Israel & Secret Mysterious Deletions..'

2006-07-11 Thread bob_brigante
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Robert Gimbel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
> Isreal has nuclear weapons, they developed on their own.

***

Israel was given both nuclear and nuclear-bomb technology by France 
("In 1956 the French agreed to secretly build the Dimona nuclear 
reactor in Israel and soon after agreed to construct a reprocessing 
plant for the extraction of plutonium at the site." 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/France_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction ).

The reason that France supplied Israel with nuclear weapons was 
because France wanted a powerful military ally in the area (see also 
http://tinyurl.com/s8sfa ), and they got one: when Britain and France 
wanted to seize control of the Suez Canal in 1956, Israel agreed to 
join in this war and attacked Egypt in Oct 1956 (Eisenhower's strong 
diplomatic pressure ended this attempt to seize control of Suez -- see 
http://history.acusd.edu/gen/text/suez.html ).






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning  wrote:
> >
> > Any news, observations?
> 
> I went to see her for the first time during her first ever stop in
> Iowa, however many years ago that was. I'm not at all wired for
> devotion to and worship of gurus, saints, etc., so the whole
> experience was very underwhelming (except for the Indian lunch, 
> which was quite good).
> 
> Having undergone so much transformation since her first visit, I
> decided to go back and see how I'd react now. I was again 
> underwhelmed by the hug, but I could appreciate the heart value 
> of the gathering, and I was not inclined to make snarky, cynical 
> comments about it like I was the first time. And, again, the 
> Indian lunch was delicious.
>
> If I could structure an Ammachi experience according to my own
> desires, I'd replace the hug with an equal amount of time just 
> gazing directly into her eyes (i.e., like Waking Down's gazing 
> meditation).

Thanks for the honest apraisal. It's not something 
we've come to expect from anyone with a TM history.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Blaming Isreal and the Jews'

2006-07-11 Thread Robert Gimbel
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "shempmcgurk" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
wrote:
>
> What kind of drugs
> Robert
> Did you take
> In the '60s
> And
> How often?

For me it was not so much the drugs;
But I did get involved in Sedona Arizona, in the late eighties;
With some kind of mushroom, and a bit of strong pot;
But what really happened;
To cause some of this perspective;
Is some working with a partner, from Madison;
With the idea of Excorcism, and that I has accumlated;
Some entities, which had attatched themselves to me;
My friend has the ability, to close her eyes;
And look at my aura, and see these 'lower energies'
Had attatched themselves to me.
So, we decide to attempt to do an excorcism;
Using her knowledge of studying to be a Catholic Priest.
And the book by Malachai Martin, and the use of the chuch;
So it became quite an experience, as one by one;
These energies, or entities left me;
The last one to leave was the strongest;
And seemed to be like the Lucifer archetype.
This Lucifer archetype is like the 'God-Father type;
He's primarily charges with destoying souls, and likes to use life 
and death as his/her primary urge; someone like a Hitler liked to get 
off on just the sake of murder, he even got a sexual charge from it;
This is what happened at Mai Lai, Viet Nam, and In Iraq, when the sex 
thrill perverts, and becomes the urge to murder, and rape, and make 
blood flow, and degrade corpses.
It is a group possossion, as Malachai Martin called it in his book in 
the chapter on Mai Lai, where hundreds of men, woman and children, 
weer raped, and murdered in cold blood, by a platoon of American 
soldiers, in a 24 hour period; This is what is called mass possession 
of the 'Evil One', that Jesus called: "A murderer since the beginning 
of time.
So, then there are the other aspects to evil:
That is the Satan aspect which has to do with lust and greed 
tempations.
And the last is Beezebub, which is the drundard vibration; the dah, 
one
So, like the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, in the Light.
They have Lucifer, Satan and Beelezebub, doing their dirty work.
The battle between the sons of light and the sons of dark.
That's all for now;
By the way, I did use a bit of meth in the late sixties;
Nasty drug, which scared me- but did make you feel that meglemania 
feeling, but a terrible 'Crash'
Thank God I started TM and my ex-wife in those days.

"Those were the days, my friend, we thought they's never end'
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert Gimbel  
> wrote:
> >
> > When push comes to shove throughout recent Western history;
> >   The Jews always seem to get scapegoated, over and over again;
> >   Now the Iranians and other elements wish the Jews annihilation.
> >   So, now the U.S. makes Iran an offer.
> >   You 'all should see the film "Munich";
> >   It's very good at showing what goes on- behind the scenes of 
> power.
> >   I really think it gives Israel or the Jews, to much power;
> >   To think they are behind everything?
> >   Do we blame Jesus, the Jew, for Christianity, Do we Blame 
> Einstein for the Atomic Bomb, do we blame Dylan for the anti-war, 
> hippie movement?
> >   But, Who? is really behind it all...???
> >   In my humble opinion, I think it is a network of people.
> >   At the top of the food chain, in the intelligence community.
> >   People like J. Hoover in the past, who had it in for the 
> Kennedy's.
> >   And people who understand and have studied the ways of money;
> >   And power...
> >   Who know how to manipulate the stock market;
> >   Know how to keep the military well funded.
> >   Know how to make money in oil.
> >   Have complete access to all intelligence, satellite, etc.
> >   Their allegiance is primarily to the quest of power and money.
> >   Many of them, I believe are worshipers of the evil one.(or Set 
> or Satan, Lucifer, Beelzebub).
> >   So, those are some of my thoughts on the subject.
> >   They seem to have gotten control;
> >   Around the time of the Kennedy assassination.
> >   And have pretty much consolidate their power now;
> >   With King George II;
> >   Playing the good part, they like him to play.
> >
> >   R. Gimbel  Madison,WI
> > 
> > 
> > -
> > Want to be your own boss? Learn how on  Yahoo! Small Business.
> >
>






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> >
> > LOL, no these were students and initiates of the Shankaracharya of  
> > the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on the back of the  
> > tradition.
> 
> Ah.  So they had no firsthand knowledge of him.

Sorta like you, eh?  :-)








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[FairfieldLife] Re: "Maharishi said....."

2006-07-11 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> So the question then becomes, how does each of us deal with Reality, 
> the continual expansion of our Reality? Sounds simplistic, but all 
> of us long term meditators here, not just TM, have each worked out 
> our own strategies for doing so.

Do you honestly think there is only one Reality?








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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Peter
Vaj, (this said in good humor) I have a feeling that
MMY could save 1000 babies from a burning building and
you'd say, well, he didn't save 1001. ;-)

--- Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> LOL, no these were students and initiates of the
> Shankaracharya of  
> the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on
> the back of the  
> tradition.
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:10 PM, authfriend wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:26 PM, authfriend wrote:
> >>
> >>> Oh, had they all studied with MMY before they
> saw
> >>> the light?
> >>
> >>
> >> They knew the tradition.
> >
> > Yes, but had they all studied with MMY before they
> saw
> > the light?
> 
> 


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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > > > > 
> > > > > > There are a lot of reasons that TM would not work for a 
> person 
> > > but  
> > > > > > they're probably similar or the same reasons other forms 
> of  
> > > > > > meditation might not work. IMO the most common reason is 
> that 
> > > the  
> > > > > > person receiving the instruction, for whatever reason--
> their 
> > > > > mental  
> > > > > > makeup, their worldview, their state of mind, etc.-- *just 
> > > doesn't  
> > > > > > get it*. A constitutional disconnect.  It just doesn't 
> click 
> > > with  
> > > > > > where they're at. And of course this can happen with any 
> form 
> > > of  
> > > > > > meditation. In a case such as this, it may be advantageous 
> to 
> > > wait  
> > > > > > until a certain span of time has passed and then be re-
> > > instructed.  
> > > > > > The perspective of time can do wonders.
> > > > > 
> > > > > As it happens, TM provides for exactly this and 
> > > > > recommends TMers take advantage of it on a regular
> > > > > basis.
> > > > > 
> > > > > The checking procedure is essentially reinstruction
> > > > > in the practice.
> > > > 
> > > > Not really. Its a reminder of effortlessness.
> > > 
> > > That's what TM instruction is.
> > >
> > 
> > TM initiation isn't the same as the 3 nights of checking and 
> > verification you get afterwards. 
> > Certainly, there's overlap between checking and the three nights 
> > checking. But that's not TM instruction.
> 
> Checking isn't *initiation*.
> 
> The differences from the initial instruction 
> (the private session) are minor.

Says the person who was always too terrified to 
become a TM teacher because she thought it might
get in the way of her ego.  :-)
]






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Kenny H" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer  wrote:
> >
>  One interesting comment Amma made to
> > a friend of mine: ³Charging money for meditation is like a mother
> charging
> > her baby for breast milk.²
> 
> I find these comments made by one guru about the practices about other
> gurus to be curious. Why do they need to say anything about it all and
> instead just not charge for what they do and do things their way. It's
> kind of a self-aggrandizing/inflammatory/divisive comment (in my 
> opinion).

Could it possibly be an invitation to followers of
other spiritual traditions to actually *think* about
things for a change, something that their traditions
try to keep them from doing?








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:47 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:
> 
Vaj said: They felt he was a "seller of
> > the
> >> Vedas" and thus destined for the deepest hell. Not the "saint"
> > some
> >> imagine...
> >>
Jim said: Emphasis on dogma can lead to all kinds of crazy ideas. 
Just look at
> > the way the dharma of caste is often abused and misunderstood. Or
> > the state of the Catholic Church. You seem to put way too much
> > importance in titles.
> 
> 
Vaj said: I think the sages who said that originally saw it 
as "cause and  
> effect". Charging for the path to liberation was not seen as a 
good  
> "cause" and therefore had some bad effects...
>
I can't imagine why this would cause bad effects. Even money comes 
from the same place everything else does...I suppose if they were 
caught up into the thinking that making money was somehow 
inconsistent with a spiritual life...I don't know, it seems silly to 
me, given that a service is being provided.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing he
> > couldn't handle.
> 
> If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.

That's exactly the kind of response these people
can never 'get,' and likely will never 'get' for
the duration of their present incarnation. They're
locked into preserving their self-image of small
self, and as far as I can tell, will be locked into
it until the small self dissolves into the Bardo,
and for several incarnations past that point. They
just don't 'get' not having an ego to defend.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Trials for drug that leaves HIV defenceless

2006-07-11 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 12:23 PM, TurquoiseB wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> >> On Jul 11, 2006, at 11:47 AM, TurquoiseB wrote:
> >>
> >>> Good news. Now the question is going to be, will the
> >>> company that developed this drug make it available
> >>> at a reasonable cost to the millions in Africa and
> >>> other places around the world who are dying of AIDS?
=> >>
> >> I haven't heard a follow-up to this, but an Indian Industrial
> >> Pharmacist IIRC learned the process for the current 
> >> antiretrovirus "cocktail" and was going to give it to African 
> >> governments gratis.
> >> They would have been able to produce doses dirt cheap--dollars a
> >> month--and the Africans refused.
> >
> > There is certainly more 'meat' to this story. *Why*
> > would they refuse? For example, were they threatened
> > with a cessation of or reduction of US aid if they
> > went for it?
> >
> > That has certainly happened in the past, with the
> > US threatening to cancel aid to a country if it
> > allowed free abortions or dispensing of birth
> > control products.
> 
> IIRC it had to do with conspiracy theories the African officials had  
> about why we *really* wanted to give these drugs to them. For 
> example one African president did not believe that HIV caused AIDS !

Sad. A truly sad commentary on how the 'word' of the
United States of America has come to not only mean
nothing in the view of the rest of the planet, but
mean less than nothing.









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
>  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  
wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing 
he
> > > > couldn't handle.
> > > 
> > > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> > >
> > 
> > Do you think it isn't the case?
>  
> Unstressing had nothing to with it. I know you can't help but try to
> pigeonhole my experience into your cultishly held TM worldview

Oh, for chrissake, Alex.  It's a perfectly reasonable
question given your initial "would no longer tolerate"
explanation for why you stopped.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi/Israel & Secret Mysterious Deletions..'

2006-07-11 Thread Robert Gimbel
 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "nablus108"  
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Fascinating isn't, that postings here that are critical to 
Israel 
> > are 
> > > > deleted, not showing ?
> > > 
> > > If you mean the one about MMY saying, Why don't they
> > > stop bombing the Palestinians? it's still right here.
> > 
> >  No, the story behind was deleted, not showing.
> 
>  This whole CIA operation, the support of Israel, the false thought 
of 
> american hegemony will have to go. The time is up. According to 
> Vimalananda the USA is finished due to their arrogance.
> 
> That FairfieldLife is part of their operation is not surprising. 
> 
> 
Who is Vimalananda, and what do you mean Fairfield Life, is a part of 
what operation;
The support of Israel, is not a new thing; this has been going on 
since 1948;
Israel was created in the aftermath of Hitler's Holocaust.
Isreal has nuclear weapons, they developed on their own.
Israel is where a Jewish person can go, in a world which wanted to 
exterminate them, just a few years ago;
The arab population, still wants to do that; exterminate the Jewish 
Nation- Especially the Iranian Pres.
The whole thing now, is that everything is in the court of the powers,
That be.
It's not just the Jews, or just Bush, or just the 'Neo-Cons'
It's deeper and more subtle than that.
I guess it's just the way the money is made, as Maharishi would say.
Because now the military is getting about 500 billion a year now; 
plus more for the war;
And the continuation of this war, with the idea, that we have to stay 
the course, as Osama bin Laden, also, has to stay his course.
So, they are two sides of the same coin;
They make money, lot's of money with weapons, and drugs, and just 
gereral money, stored in warehouses in Iraq, and other places where 
the billions are stored; wherever that is?
So, who is really running the whole thing.
Some old cow hands from the Reagan years.
Some investment bankers at the ranch, in Santa Barbara?
And King George II, meets the demands of the elite;
As he was born into that special group of people.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread Alex Stanley
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley"
 wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > >
> > > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing he
> > > couldn't handle.
> > 
> > If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
> >
> 
> Do you think it isn't the case?
 
Unstressing had nothing to with it. I know you can't help but try to
pigeonhole my experience into your cultishly held TM worldview, so if
it makes you feel better to think that way about my experience, so be
it. But, for me, it was simply a matter of having reached the point
where I had to move on.
 
> > > > > In my case, I simply reached a point where my mind would no
longer
> > > > > tolerate doing TM, so I stopped and moved on.
> 
> Why couldn't you tolerate effortlessness any longer? And what
> "doing" are you referring to other than that?

I'd sit down to meditate and my mind wouldn't settle down. It was
outwardly focused and could no longer tolerate the escapism of
transcending. I'd always looked at TM as a means of fixing what I felt
was broken, and as such, TM was for me just another piece of the toxic
ego dynamic of grasping and aversion, preventing me from being present
in the here and now. 

However, TM never fixed what I wanted fixed, and I finally came to the
end of the TM road. The right path for me ended up being one where
instead of tiptoeing around sleeping elephants, one goes right up to
the sleeping elephants and slaps them on the ass. 





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Paranoia as cult bonding mechanism

2006-07-11 Thread TurquoiseB
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> This is my observation as well. It's actually quite bizarre 
> to see--the "defenders of the faith" end up being perfect 
> reasons *not* to start TM. 

But you have to admit it's pretty funny. All that 
anyone has to do is mention the 'C' word, and the
cultists start coming out of the woodwork to compete
with each other to see who can sound the craziest 
and the most paranoid.

Just when we thought Judy had the title sewed up,
along come Peter Klutz and nabius to demonstrate
what TM does for one's sense of reality. With 
friends like these, the TMO really doesn't need 
any enemies...  :-)








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[FairfieldLife] Re: "Maharishi said....."

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  
wrote:
> > 
> > > A gal I knew from another spiritual trip had an inter-
> > > esting theory about this stuff. She felt that although 
> > > there is a lot of variety among the spiritual seekers 
> > > one finds in this world, basically you can pretty
> > > safely "sort" them into two categories.
> > > 
> > > The first category is composed of the seekers who are 
> > > content with reading about other people's adventures.
> > > They get off on scriptures and tales of other people's
> > > enlightenment, and on intellectual discussions of other
> > > people's experiences, and that's enough for them.
> > > 
> > > The second category is composed of mystics, those who
> > > will settle for nothing less than having their *own*
> > > experiences. Reading about them isn't enough; talking
> > > about them isn't enough; coming up with entertaining
> > > (but essentially worthless) models to "explain" the
> > > experiences isn't enough. They want the Real Thing,
> > > and if the spiritual group or teacher they're assoc-
> > > iated with isn't providing it, they move on to some-
> > > thing that does.
> > 
> > Did she realize, do you think, that she was engaging
> > in the fallacy of the excluded middle?
> >  
> > > I've always tended to agree with her assessment. In
> > > general, the people in the first group say "Maharishi
> > > says" (or " > > here> says") a lot. Because they're not actually *having*
> > > very many spiritual experiences, they assume that no one
> > > else is either
> > 
> > Oh, well, perhaps it's just *you* who is indulging in
> > the fallacy of the excluded midde--in this case, that
> > middle being people who say "So-and-so sez..." and are
> > *also* having lots of spiritual experiences.
> > 
> > Maybe one a month, even.
> 
> Or every day, or all the time, or even: "it never stops."

That too.








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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> LOL, no these were students and initiates of the Shankaracharya of  
> the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on the back of the  
> tradition.

Ah.  So they had no firsthand knowledge of him.


 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:10 PM, authfriend wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:26 PM, authfriend wrote:
> >>
> >>> Oh, had they all studied with MMY before they saw
> >>> the light?
> >>
> >>
> >> They knew the tradition.
> >
> > Yes, but had they all studied with MMY before they saw
> > the light?






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[FairfieldLife] Scores dead in Mumbai train bombs

2006-07-11 Thread claudiouk
I know it's not about America.. but as my last post regarding news 
from Holland, it's TM-relevant news nevertheless, given the hype on 
pundit groups & invincible Holland etc etc.. Lets face it, America 
COULD be next...!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/5169332.stm

More than 160 people have been killed and 460 injured by seven bombs 
on the train network in the Indian financial capital Mumbai 
(Bombay), police say. 
The first of the near-simultaneous blasts went off at about 1830 
local time (1300 GMT), during the rush hour in the suburbs on the 
Western Railway. 

Correspondents spoke of scenes of pandemonium, with people jumping 
from trains and bodies flung onto tracks. 

There have been a number of bomb attacks in Mumbai in recent years. 

 HAVE YOUR SAY 
 We saw bodies lying around. It was horrifying 

Jay, Mumbai


Send us your accounts 
Eyewitness: Hospital scenes 
Eyewitness: Passengers hurt  
The city and the capital Delhi have been put on high alert, and 
Mumbai's entire rail network has been shut down, stranding hundreds 
of thousands of commuters. 

Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh appealed for calm and described 
the incidents as a "shocking and cowardly attempt to spread a 
feeling of hatred". 

Pakistani leaders also condemned the blasts as a "despicable act of 
terrorism".   

Police said the co-ordinated blasts took place at Matunga, Khar, 
Mahim, Jogeshwari, Borivali and Bhayandar, with most on moving 
trains and two at stations. 

Local reports said the bombs appeared to have targeted first-class 
compartments, as commuters were returning home from the city's 
financial district. 

A shopkeeper near one explosion said it was so powerful they thought 
they had been hit by lightning. 

Television images show dazed and bloodied commuters being carried by 
fellow passengers to waiting ambulances, as rescue workers clambered 
through wreckage to reach victims. 

The force of the blasts ripped doors and windows off carriages, and 
scattered luggage. 

Clothes and shoes were strewn along the tracks. 

An eyewitness at Mahim told the BBC some of those who had jumped 
from the train were run over by another train coming in the opposite 
direction. 

Hospitals across Mumbai have been swamped with casualties. 

A medical student at a hospital in Parel, which has received many of 
the wounded, told the BBC News website the "floors are filled with 
bloodstains". 

"There were so many [injured people], I couldn't really count," 
Sunny Jain said. 

Correspondents say the confusion in the city has been made worse by 
the collapse of mobile phone networks, and long queues have formed 
for the payphones still working. 

Repeated target 

There was no immediate claim of responsibility for the attacks, 
which are the worst in the city for more than a decade. 

 MUMBAI FACTS 
Changed named to Mumbai in late 1990s
Population: 17 million
HQ to many big Indian companies and foreign multinationals
Home of the Indian film industry, Bollywood
Thousands arrive monthly from rural areas, with many living in slums
Property prices are among the most expensive in the world
At least 250 people died in serial bomb blasts in the city in 1993


India looks for answers 
Railway lifeline  

Home Minister Shivraj Patil told reporters authorities had "some" 
information an attack was coming, "but place and time was not 
known". 

Analysts say Mumbai has been a repeated target because it is a 
financial hub and a centre for the underworld. 

More than 250 people died in a string of blasts in the city in 1993. 

Correspondents say Tuesday's bombers could hardly have struck a 
target with greater impact - both practical and psychological. 

The city's suburban train system is one of the busiest in the world, 
carrying more than six million commuters a day. 

The blasts came hours after suspected Islamic extremists killed 
seven people in grenade attacks in the summer capital of Kashmir, 
Srinagar. 







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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Vaj


LOL, no these were students and initiates of the Shankaracharya of the south, to them M. was a businessman riding on the back of the tradition.On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:10 PM, authfriend wrote:--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:   On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:26 PM, authfriend wrote:  Oh, had they all studied with MMY before they saw the light?   They knew the tradition.  Yes, but had they all studied with MMY before they saw the light? 
__._,_.___





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> on 7/11/06 1:12 PM, Kenny H at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
> > 
> > , Rick Archer  wrote:
> >> >
> >  One interesting comment Amma made to
> >> > a friend of mine: ³Charging money for meditation is like a mother
> > charging
> >> > her baby for breast milk.²
> > 
> > I find these comments made by one guru about the practices about other
> > gurus to be curious. Why do they need to say anything about it all and
> > instead just not charge for what they do and do things their way. It's
> > kind of a self-aggrandizing/inflammatory/divisive comment (in my opinion).
> > 
> It was just a private conversation. I probably shouldn¹t have repeated it.
>

Unlike the countless conversations and comments by MMY that end up here, taken 
out of 
context?





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Kenny H
Hey Rick
What do I know, maybe it's important for people to make comments like
she made, comment on! I mean if we are dedicated to cracking the rocks
of ignorance (or whatever that saying was) its probably good to hear
all viewpoints, eh?!
KH

In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> on 7/11/06 1:12 PM, Kenny H at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com

> > , Rick Archer  wrote:
> >> >
> >  One interesting comment Amma made to
> >> > a friend of mine: ³Charging money for meditation is like a mother
> > charging
> >> > her baby for breast milk.²
> > 
> > I find these comments made by one guru about the practices about other
> > gurus to be curious. Why do they need to say anything about it all and
> > instead just not charge for what they do and do things their way. It's
> > kind of a self-aggrandizing/inflammatory/divisive comment (in my
opinion).
> > 
> It was just a private conversation. I probably shouldn¹t have
repeated it.
>






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[FairfieldLife] Re: "Maharishi said....."

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  wrote:
> 
> > A gal I knew from another spiritual trip had an inter-
> > esting theory about this stuff. She felt that although 
> > there is a lot of variety among the spiritual seekers 
> > one finds in this world, basically you can pretty
> > safely "sort" them into two categories.
> > 
> > The first category is composed of the seekers who are 
> > content with reading about other people's adventures.
> > They get off on scriptures and tales of other people's
> > enlightenment, and on intellectual discussions of other
> > people's experiences, and that's enough for them.
> > 
> > The second category is composed of mystics, those who
> > will settle for nothing less than having their *own*
> > experiences. Reading about them isn't enough; talking
> > about them isn't enough; coming up with entertaining
> > (but essentially worthless) models to "explain" the
> > experiences isn't enough. They want the Real Thing,
> > and if the spiritual group or teacher they're assoc-
> > iated with isn't providing it, they move on to some-
> > thing that does.
> 
> Did she realize, do you think, that she was engaging
> in the fallacy of the excluded middle?
>  
> > I've always tended to agree with her assessment. In
> > general, the people in the first group say "Maharishi
> > says" (or " > here> says") a lot. Because they're not actually *having*
> > very many spiritual experiences, they assume that no one
> > else is either
> 
> Oh, well, perhaps it's just *you* who is indulging in
> the fallacy of the excluded midde--in this case, that
> middle being people who say "So-and-so sez..." and are
> *also* having lots of spiritual experiences.
> 
> Maybe one a month, even.
>

Or every day, or all the time, or even: "it never stops."







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Alex Stanley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > >
> > > 
> > > On Jul 11, 2006, at 8:20 AM, Alex Stanley wrote:
> > > 
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > > >
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> On Jul 11, 2006, at 4:35 AM, Mark wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >>> Is it possible that the criticism of TM, that it doesn't
> > > >>> accomplish
> > > >>> anything for many is because the Being by it's nature doesn't do
> > > >>> anything but must be enjoined with a relative agent such as a
> > > >>> mantra that would give It a relative focus. Mark _
> > > >>>
> > > >>
> > > >> There are a lot of reasons that TM would not work for a person but
> > > >> they're probably similar or the same reasons other forms of
> > > >> meditation might not work. IMO the most common reason is that the
> > > >> person receiving the instruction, for whatever reason--their mental
> > > >> makeup, their worldview, their state of mind, etc.-- *just doesn't
> > > >> get it*. A constitutional disconnect.  It just doesn't click with
> > > >> where they're at. And of course this can happen with any form of
> > > >> meditation. In a case such as this, it may be advantageous to wait
> > > >> until a certain span of time has passed and then be re-instructed.
> > > >> The perspective of time can do wonders.
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > > In my case, I simply reached a point where my mind would no longer
> > > > tolerate doing TM, so I stopped and moved on. My life focus took a
> > > > major turn for the better after Karunamayi's second visit to FF
> when I
> > > > started chanting the Gayatri Mantra. Everything just fell into place
> > > > after that.
> > > 
> > > 
> > > That's amazing. Just goes to show that mantras are constitutional
> and  
> > > what an excellent compass our own hearts can be.
> > >
> > 
> > Contrariwise, that Alex ran into a major bout of unstressing he
> > couldn't handle.
> 
> If it makes you feel better to believe that, be my guest.
>

Do you think it isn't the case?

> > > > In my case, I simply reached a point where my mind would no longer
> > > > tolerate doing TM, so I stopped and moved on.

Why couldn't you tolerate effortlessness any longer? And what "doing" are you 
referring to 
other than that?









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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:47 PM, jim_flanegin wrote:
> 
> >>
> >> Given that the traditional comment would be that those who sells
> >> meditation would go to the Avachi Hell, I'd say this was much
> > nicer,
> >> even kind.
> >>
> >> When I visited with sannyasis of the Shankaracharya order and
> > naively
> >> mentioned that I learned meditation in the "Shanakaracharya
> >> tradition", they immediately asked "from who?" When I said it was
> > TM
> >> and Maharishi's meditation several of the sannyasis got very 
angry
> > at
> >> this, one was particularly loud and quietly escorted away. Not a
> > nice
> >> scene! Last time I ever said that. They felt he was a "seller of
> > the
> >> Vedas" and thus destined for the deepest hell. Not the "saint"
> > some
> >> imagine...
> >>
> > Emphasis on dogma can lead to all kinds of crazy ideas. Just look 
at
> > the way the dharma of caste is often abused and misunderstood. Or
> > the state of the Catholic Church. You seem to put way too much
> > importance in titles.
> 
> I think the sages who said that originally saw it as "cause and  
> effect". Charging for the path to liberation was not seen as a
> good  "cause" and therefore had some bad effects...

And how many years ago was this?






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Kenny H" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer  wrote:
> >
>  One interesting comment Amma made to
> > a friend of mine: ³Charging money for meditation is like a mother
> charging
> > her baby for breast milk.²
> 
> I find these comments made by one guru about the practices about other
> gurus to be curious. Why do they need to say anything about it all and
> instead just not charge for what they do and do things their way. It's
> kind of a self-aggrandizing/inflammatory/divisive comment (in my opinion).
>

You noticed that, did you? Not that anyone ever indulges in it on this forum...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  
wrote:
> > > >
> > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > > There are a lot of reasons that TM would not work for a 
person 
> > but  
> > > > > they're probably similar or the same reasons other forms 
of  
> > > > > meditation might not work. IMO the most common reason is 
that 
> > the  
> > > > > person receiving the instruction, for whatever reason--
their 
> > > > mental  
> > > > > makeup, their worldview, their state of mind, etc.-- *just 
> > doesn't  
> > > > > get it*. A constitutional disconnect.  It just doesn't 
click 
> > with  
> > > > > where they're at. And of course this can happen with any 
form 
> > of  
> > > > > meditation. In a case such as this, it may be advantageous 
to 
> > wait  
> > > > > until a certain span of time has passed and then be re-
> > instructed.  
> > > > > The perspective of time can do wonders.
> > > > 
> > > > As it happens, TM provides for exactly this and 
> > > > recommends TMers take advantage of it on a regular
> > > > basis.
> > > > 
> > > > The checking procedure is essentially reinstruction
> > > > in the practice.
> > > 
> > > Not really. Its a reminder of effortlessness.
> > 
> > That's what TM instruction is.
> >
> 
> TM initiation isn't the same as the 3 nights of checking and 
> verification you get afterwards. 
> Certainly, there's overlap between checking and the three nights 
> checking. But that's not TM instruction.

Checking isn't *initiation*.

The differences from the initial instruction 
(the private session) are minor.







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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:26 PM, authfriend wrote:
> 
> > Oh, had they all studied with MMY before they saw
> > the light?
> 
> 
> They knew the tradition.

Yes, but had they all studied with MMY before they saw
the light?






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Rick Archer
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF





on 7/11/06 2:47 PM, sparaig at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Nyah, there's no agenda with Amma and friends. Going into the stronghold of a rival guru 
and criticizing the rival guru's actions isn't anything to take note of...

I don’t think Amma sees herself as being in competition with other gurus. Nor is FF Maharishi’s “stronghold”. MUM is his campus, but FF is not his town. MUM is a spiritual incubator, and many are hatching from it. Amma goes where there’s a demand, and judging from the popularity of her programs here, there’s one here. 

__._,_.___





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:26 PM, authfriend wrote:
> 
> > Oh, had they all studied with MMY before they saw
> > the light?
> 
> 
> They knew the tradition.
>

Yep, just like fundamentalist christians do. Or Hindus vs Buddhist. Or the 
Buddha vs Hindus. 
Or Shankara vs Buddhists.

Or MMY vs just about everyone else.






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Japa

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "sparaig"  wrote:
> >
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend"  wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> > > 
> > > > There are a lot of reasons that TM would not work for a person 
> but  
> > > > they're probably similar or the same reasons other forms of  
> > > > meditation might not work. IMO the most common reason is that 
> the  
> > > > person receiving the instruction, for whatever reason--their 
> > > mental  
> > > > makeup, their worldview, their state of mind, etc.-- *just 
> doesn't  
> > > > get it*. A constitutional disconnect.  It just doesn't click 
> with  
> > > > where they're at. And of course this can happen with any form 
> of  
> > > > meditation. In a case such as this, it may be advantageous to 
> wait  
> > > > until a certain span of time has passed and then be re-
> instructed.  
> > > > The perspective of time can do wonders.
> > > 
> > > As it happens, TM provides for exactly this and 
> > > recommends TMers take advantage of it on a regular
> > > basis.
> > > 
> > > The checking procedure is essentially reinstruction
> > > in the practice.
> > 
> > Not really. Its a reminder of effortlessness.
> 
> That's what TM instruction is.
>

TM initiation isn't the same as the 3 nights of checking and verification you 
get afterwards. 
Certainly, there's overlap between checking and the three nights checking. But 
that's not 
TM instruction.






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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Vaj


On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:47 PM, jim_flanegin wrote: Given that the traditional comment would be that those who sells   meditation would go to the Avachi Hell, I'd say this was much  nicer,   even kind.  When I visited with sannyasis of the Shankaracharya order and  naively   mentioned that I learned meditation in the "Shanakaracharya   tradition", they immediately asked "from who?" When I said it was  TM   and Maharishi's meditation several of the sannyasis got very angry  at   this, one was particularly loud and quietly escorted away. Not a  nice   scene! Last time I ever said that. They felt he was a "seller of  the   Vedas" and thus destined for the deepest hell. Not the "saint"  some   imagine...  Emphasis on dogma can lead to all kinds of crazy ideas. Just look at  the way the dharma of caste is often abused and misunderstood. Or  the state of the Catholic Church. You seem to put way too much  importance in titles. I think the sages who said that originally saw it as "cause and effect". Charging for the path to liberation was not seen as a good "cause" and therefore had some bad effects...
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "jim_flanegin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj  wrote:
> >
> > 
> > On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:12 PM, Kenny H wrote:
> > 
> > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer  
> wrote:
> > >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >  One interesting comment Amma made to
> > >
> > >> a friend of mine: ³Charging money for meditation is like a 
> mother
> > >>
> > > charging
> > >
> > >> her baby for breast milk.²
> > >>
> > >
> > > I find these comments made by one guru about the practices about 
> other
> > > gurus to be curious. Why do they need to say anything about it 
> all and
> > > instead just not charge for what they do and do things their 
> way. It's
> > > kind of a self-aggrandizing/inflammatory/divisive comment (in 
> my  
> > > opinion).
> > 
> > 
> > Given that the traditional comment would be that those who sells  
> > meditation would go to the Avachi Hell, I'd say this was much 
> nicer,  
> > even kind.
> > 
> > When I visited with sannyasis of the Shankaracharya order and 
> naively  
> > mentioned that I learned meditation in the "Shanakaracharya  
> > tradition", they immediately asked "from who?" When I said it was 
> TM  
> > and Maharishi's meditation several of the sannyasis got very angry 
> at  
> > this, one was particularly loud and quietly escorted away. Not a 
> nice  
> > scene! Last time I ever said that. They felt he was a "seller of 
> the  
> > Vedas" and thus destined for the deepest hell. Not the "saint" 
> some  
> > imagine...
> >
> Emphasis on dogma can lead to all kinds of crazy ideas. Just look at 
> the way the dharma of caste is often abused and misunderstood. Or 
> the state of the Catholic Church. You seem to put way too much 
> importance in titles.
>

Not to mention that "traditional" interpretation of texts from thousands of 
years ago.








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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Vaj


On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:26 PM, authfriend wrote:Oh, had they all studied with MMY before they saw the light? They knew the tradition.
__._,_.___





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:12 PM, Kenny H wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer  wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>
> >  One interesting comment Amma made to
> >
> >> a friend of mine: ³Charging money for meditation is like a mother
> >>
> > charging
> >
> >> her baby for breast milk.²
> >>
> >
> > I find these comments made by one guru about the practices about other
> > gurus to be curious. Why do they need to say anything about it all and
> > instead just not charge for what they do and do things their way. It's
> > kind of a self-aggrandizing/inflammatory/divisive comment (in my  
> > opinion).
> 
> 
> Given that the traditional comment would be that those who sells  
> meditation would go to the Avachi Hell, I'd say this was much nicer,  
> even kind.
> 
> When I visited with sannyasis of the Shankaracharya order and naively  
> mentioned that I learned meditation in the "Shanakaracharya  
> tradition", they immediately asked "from who?" When I said it was TM  
> and Maharishi's meditation several of the sannyasis got very angry at  
> this, one was particularly loud and quietly escorted away. Not a nice  
> scene! Last time I ever said that. They felt he was a "seller of the  
> Vedas" and thus destined for the deepest hell. Not the "saint" some  
> imagine...
>

Yep. Imagine how they felt about a Shankaracharya who actually *supported* him.

On theother hand, REAL sanyasis like Tatewale Baba were quite happy to wander 
in for a 
visit...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> on 7/11/06 11:03 AM, new.morning at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > 
> > Any news, observations?
> > 
> I¹ve been immersed in it/her and just recovered from the sleep deprivation.
> We had a really good turn-out both days, in large part because it was the
> weekend. Filled the gymnasium. Many showed up who wouldn¹t have been caught
> dead there a year ago. Many of Amma¹s tour staff commented that Iowa is
> their favorite stop on the tour. We celebrated Guru Purnima at about 5am
> Monday morning. 
> 
> It was web cast: http://amritapuri.org/news/07/607distance.php
> 
> I¹m trying to stay focused to fit a month¹s work into two weeks, haven¹t
> been hanging out here much. I¹ll keep an eye on this thread and will be
> happy to elaborate if there¹s interest. One interesting comment Amma made to
> a friend of mine: ³Charging money for meditation is like a mother charging
> her baby for breast milk.²
> 
> An article: http://www.thehawkeye.com/daily/stories/ln1_0710.html
>

Nyah, there's no agenda with Amma and friends. Going into the stronghold of a 
rival guru 
and criticizing the rival guru's actions isn't anything to take note of...






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[FairfieldLife] Re: "Maharishi said....."

2006-07-11 Thread sparaig
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Kenny H"  wrote:
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB  wrote:
> > > 
> > > A gal I knew from another spiritual trip had an inter-
> > > esting theory about this stuff. She felt that although 
> > > there is a lot of variety among the spiritual seekers 
> > > one finds in this world, basically you can pretty
> > > safely "sort" them into two categories.
> > > 
> > > The first category is composed of the seekers who are 
> > > content with reading about other people's adventures.
> > > They get off on scriptures and tales of other people's
> > > enlightenment, and on intellectual discussions of other
> > > people's experiences, and that's enough for them.
> > > 
> > > The second category is composed of mystics, those who
> > > will settle for nothing less than having their *own*
> > > experiences. Reading about them isn't enough; talking
> > > about them isn't enough; coming up with entertaining
> > > (but essentially worthless) models to "explain" the
> > > experiences isn't enough. They want the Real Thing,
> > > and if the spiritual group or teacher they're assoc-
> > > iated with isn't providing it, they move on to some-
> > > thing that does.
> > > 
> > > I've always tended to agree with her assessment. In
> > > general, the people in the first group say "Maharishi
> > > says" (or " > > here> says") a lot. Because they're not actually *having*
> > > very many spiritual experiences, they assume that no one
> > > else is either, and therefore they become dependent on
> > > intellectual analysis of Other People's Experiences, 
> > > especially those of their teacher, whom they *imagine*
> > > is having all *sorts* of good experiences.
> > 
> > Barry, there is no way you/we can know whether "...they're 
> > not actually having very many spiritual experiences..." 
> 
> Of course there is. If you're part of the spiritual
> group, and if the group (unlike TM) encourages its
> members to freely discuss their experiences, all you
> have to do is listen. :-)
> 
> > Who knows who "they" even are, how they would define 
> > spirituality, what they were really looking for, how 
> > their interpretations of their own growth in life 
> > have changed, etc.
> 
> My feelings on this are colored by who I studied with.
> The Rama guy, when I first ran into him, gave unmis-
> takably clear instructions about the importance of 
> having one's own experiences. His instruction to us
> was, "If you are studying with me and go for longer
> than a month without having at least one spiritual
> experience that completely and totally changes your
> life and rocks your world, it's time to move on." 
> 
> I stuck around for fourteen years.
> 
> Suffice it to say that the frequency of strong, clear,
> unmistakable spiritual experiences is not the same in
> all spiritual groups as it is in the TMO.
>

Not surprising since TM is about changing one's LIFE, not about having 
spiritual 
experiences.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Alex Stanley
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> on 7/11/06 1:16 PM, Alex Stanley at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
[snip]
> > If I could structure an Ammachi experience according to my own
> > desires, I'd replace the hug with an equal amount of time just
> > gazing
> > directly into her eyes (i.e., like Waking Down's gazing meditation).
> > 
> >  
> I often do that because she¹s gotten to know me and we have 
> conversations. It¹s nice.

Wow, I didn't know you speak Malayalam.






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[FairfieldLife] Palestinians & terrorism

2006-07-11 Thread Larry Potter



(  with regard to nablus108 ).     I'm sorry to say that since the intafadah began I have uterly lost any respect for Palestinians as a nation. They choose terrible leaders and support terrible policies. They glorify terrible murderers who celebrate in killing Israeli women and children. I am sad to say to you Palistinians, I have no sympathy for you. Hardly anyone I know respects you- even my Muslim friends in Australia are embarressed by you. While you continue to support and glorify your murderous leaders, I don't think you will ever have the respect of the world. Please dump these terrible people like Mashaal and follow people who can lead you with dignity. Then maybe us neutral people will respect you. Remember people like Ghandi and Martin Luther King achieved their goals far quicker, using peaceful methods than you have been able to do with your suicide bombings, rockets and other terrorist activities.
 So until you do choose a new tactic and new positive leaders, expect the world not to blink an eye or shed a tear while you slowly follow your suicidal course. Us neutral people really don't respect you at all anymore. P.S. Remember - if you are going to shoot your rockets from in the midst of women and children, you have only yourself to blame if women and children get struck by missiles.     
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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Rick Archer
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF





on 7/11/06 1:16 PM, Alex Stanley at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com  , new.morning <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> Any news, observations?

I went to see her for the first time during her first ever stop in
Iowa, however many years ago that was. I'm not at all wired for
devotion to and worship of gurus, saints, etc., so the whole
experience was very underwhelming (except for the Indian lunch, which
was quite good).

Having undergone so much transformation since her first visit, I
decided to go back and see how I'd react now. I was again underwhelmed
by the hug, but I could appreciate the heart value of the gathering,
and I was not inclined to make snarky, cynical comments about it like
I was the first time. And, again, the Indian lunch was delicious.

If I could structure an Ammachi experience according to my own
desires, I'd replace the hug with an equal amount of time just gazing
directly into her eyes (i.e., like Waking Down's gazing meditation). 

 
I often do that because she’s gotten to know me and we have conversations. It’s nice.

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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Rick Archer
Title: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF





on 7/11/06 1:12 PM, Kenny H at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com  , Rick Archer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
 One interesting comment Amma made to
> a friend of mine: “Charging money for meditation is like a mother
charging
> her baby for breast milk.”

I find these comments made by one guru about the practices about other
gurus to be curious. Why do they need to say anything about it all and
instead just not charge for what they do and do things their way. It's
kind of a self-aggrandizing/inflammatory/divisive comment (in my opinion).

It was just a private conversation. I probably shouldn’t have repeated it.

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Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread Larry Potter



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[FairfieldLife] Re: Amma's Visit to FF

2006-07-11 Thread jim_flanegin
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> 
> On Jul 11, 2006, at 2:12 PM, Kenny H wrote:
> 
> > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer  
wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>
> >  One interesting comment Amma made to
> >
> >> a friend of mine: ³Charging money for meditation is like a 
mother
> >>
> > charging
> >
> >> her baby for breast milk.²
> >>
> >
> > I find these comments made by one guru about the practices about 
other
> > gurus to be curious. Why do they need to say anything about it 
all and
> > instead just not charge for what they do and do things their 
way. It's
> > kind of a self-aggrandizing/inflammatory/divisive comment (in 
my  
> > opinion).
> 
> 
> Given that the traditional comment would be that those who sells  
> meditation would go to the Avachi Hell, I'd say this was much 
nicer,  
> even kind.
> 
> When I visited with sannyasis of the Shankaracharya order and 
naively  
> mentioned that I learned meditation in the "Shanakaracharya  
> tradition", they immediately asked "from who?" When I said it was 
TM  
> and Maharishi's meditation several of the sannyasis got very angry 
at  
> this, one was particularly loud and quietly escorted away. Not a 
nice  
> scene! Last time I ever said that. They felt he was a "seller of 
the  
> Vedas" and thus destined for the deepest hell. Not the "saint" 
some  
> imagine...
>
Emphasis on dogma can lead to all kinds of crazy ideas. Just look at 
the way the dharma of caste is often abused and misunderstood. Or 
the state of the Catholic Church. You seem to put way too much 
importance in titles.





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[FairfieldLife] Re: "Maharishi said....."

2006-07-11 Thread authfriend
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> A gal I knew from another spiritual trip had an inter-
> esting theory about this stuff. She felt that although 
> there is a lot of variety among the spiritual seekers 
> one finds in this world, basically you can pretty
> safely "sort" them into two categories.
> 
> The first category is composed of the seekers who are 
> content with reading about other people's adventures.
> They get off on scriptures and tales of other people's
> enlightenment, and on intellectual discussions of other
> people's experiences, and that's enough for them.
> 
> The second category is composed of mystics, those who
> will settle for nothing less than having their *own*
> experiences. Reading about them isn't enough; talking
> about them isn't enough; coming up with entertaining
> (but essentially worthless) models to "explain" the
> experiences isn't enough. They want the Real Thing,
> and if the spiritual group or teacher they're assoc-
> iated with isn't providing it, they move on to some-
> thing that does.

Did she realize, do you think, that she was engaging
in the fallacy of the excluded middle?
 
> I've always tended to agree with her assessment. In
> general, the people in the first group say "Maharishi
> says" (or " here> says") a lot. Because they're not actually *having*
> very many spiritual experiences, they assume that no one
> else is either

Oh, well, perhaps it's just *you* who is indulging in
the fallacy of the excluded midde--in this case, that
middle being people who say "So-and-so sez..." and are
*also* having lots of spiritual experiences.

Maybe one a month, even.







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