[FairfieldLife] Re: David Lynch in today's Guardian
--Your repeatability claim has no statistical relevance. Repeatability must cut across large numbers of samples and diverse subjects. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jul 3, 2008, at 2:42 PM, yifuxero wrote: --A lot depends on when and where, independent of the technique. Sure, if you're in a 3 week retreat with some Rinpoche and everybody is meditating, transcendence!. But where's the technique you can take with you, any time, any place; even on a plane? Try Vipassana on a plane. I was not in a retreat setting, just at home. It doesn't matter where I practice, if I have the intention to practice, that's all that is necessary. Repeatability is excellent. I've tried shamatha, vipassana, shamatha-vipassana, ishta-devata meditation, tantric meditation and open presence meditation on planes, cars, etc. They work fine for me. YMMV.
[FairfieldLife] Miracles of St. Padre Pio
from A Catholic Life website: He had the gift of Bilocation: Among the most remarkable of the documented cases of bilocation was the Padre's appearance in the air over San Giovanni Rotondo during World War II. While southern Italy remained in Nazi hands American bombers were given the job of attacking the city of San Giovanni Rotondo. However, when they appeared over the city and prepared to unload their munitions a brown-robed friar appeared before their aircraft. All attempts to release the bombs failed. In this way Padre Pio kept his promise to the citizens that their town would be spared. Later on, when an American airbase was established at Foggia a few miles away, one of the pilots of this incident visited the friary and found to his surprise the little friar he had seen in the air that day over San Giovanni. (Source: EWTN) There are numerous other bilocation miracles that have been confirmed by numerous eyewitnesses. Read about them here. In order to attract us, the Lord grants us many graces that we believe can easily obtain Heaven for us. We do not know, however, that in order to grow, we need hard bread: the cross, humiliation, trials and denials. Padre Pio He had the Gift of Levitation: In his life, St. Padre Pio was a miracle worker. He also could levitate. On one occassion, St. Padre Pio levitated through the air in order to reach the Confessional without being seen and stopped. He immediately began to receive penitents. A man in the church was amazed how the priest had gotten to the confessional because so many people were outside of his door waiting to talk with him. St. Padre Pio said to him that God made him invisible and he walked on their heads to the confessional. He healed others: In 1919, St. Padre Pio received a pentitent using two canes. The doctors could not help the 62-year-old man, but after Confession St. Padre Pio said, Stand up and go away! You have to throw away these canes. The man could walk perfectly again. There have been numerous other healings too. He had the Gift of Perfume: Sometimes God allows saints to emit a beautiful perfume in order to draw more people to Himself and holiness. This perfume is smelt only by a priveldged few, not all. St. Padre Pio had this gift and the smell of roses, incense, ammonia, and others was emitted from him. He said to some inquiring about them: They are only a sign of my presence. Father Agostino of San Marco in Lamis had a malfunctioned olfactory gland and could only smell strong odors. He said, I smelt a number of times the perfume that many people smell. Even when I was distant from San Giovanni Rotondo I smelt it. The Gift of Perfume continued after St. Padre Pio's death. Not just places connected with him but also places in American and distant places of the world smelt the distinct perfume. The Gift of Light: On October 5, 125, Dr. Giorgio Festa operated on St. Padre Pio for a hernia. Before he had to stitch the would, the doctor noticed St. Pio had lost consciousness. He took advantage of this and look at his left side - the place of Jesus's wound from his stigmata. And, he was the wound was fresh and of a vermilion red and in the shape of a cross...From the edges of the wound emitted small but unmistakable rays of light. Dr. Giorgio put on the bandage and St. Padre Pio regained his senses. He also had the Gift of Visions, the spirit of Prophesy, Clairvoyance, the power to read hearts in Confession, and Xenoglossy (The ability to write, speak, or understand an unknown language). This is a great part of our Faith - that we have saints like Padre Pio to pray for us. St. Padre Pio, pray for us all. posted by Seminarian Matthew at 6:13 AM 3 Comments:
[FairfieldLife] Chicago
CHICAGO by Carl Sandburg HOG Butcher for the World, Tool Maker, Stacker of Wheat, Player with Railroads and the Nation's Freight Handler; Stormy, husky, brawling, City of the Big Shoulders: They tell me you are wicked and I believe them, for I have seen your painted women under the gas lamps luring the farm boys. And they tell me you are crooked and I answer: Yes, it is true I have seen the gunman kill and go free to kill again. And they tell me you are brutal and my reply is: On the faces of women and children I have seen the marks of wanton hunger. And having answered so I turn once more to those who sneer at this my city, and I give them back the sneer and say to them: Come and show me another city with lifted head singing so proud to be alive and coarse and strong and cunning. Flinging magnetic curses amid the toil of piling job on job, here is a tall bold slugger set vivid against the little soft cities; Fierce as a dog with tongue lapping for action, cunning as a savage pitted against the wilderness, Bareheaded, Shoveling, Wrecking, Planning, Building, breaking, rebuilding, Under the smoke, dust all over his mouth, laughing with white teeth, Under the terrible burden of destiny laughing as a young man laughs, Laughing even as an ignorant fighter laughs who has never lost a battle, Bragging and laughing that under his wrist is the pulse. and under his ribs the heart of the people, Laughing! Laughing the stormy, husky, brawling laughter of Youth, half-naked, sweating, proud to be Hog Butcher, Tool Maker, Stacker of Wheat, Player with Railroads and Freight Handler
[FairfieldLife] Re: Philip K. Dick's writings about Fairfield Life
--right on...not even following in the footsteps of Guru Dev. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ruthsimplicity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: Tony Abu-Nader spends most of his time meditating on the Pursha team, I believe. Bevan and Hagelin both are doing what their guru told them was the right thing for them to do. I don't see much difference, as far as justification for their activities, between Invincible America course participants or the TM leadership. L. One thing to lie to yourself. Another thing to lie to yourself and to a lot of other people. Hagelin was trained as a scientist, presents himself as a scientist, but no longer is a scientist. Nader was (is?) an MD and has had scientific training. He was awared his weight in gold for his discovery that the Veda and Vedic Literature, the structure and function of Natural Law which is the managing intelligence of the universe, is at the basis of the human physiology. This isn't science. They use there credentials to promote their beliefs. Their beliefs probably are sincere, I have no reason not to think so, but I don't respect them at all.
[FairfieldLife] Gurus telling students what to do (was Re: Philip K. Dick)
--Still waiting for the 2nd 100%, and the rest of the first 100% - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jul 2, 2008, at 12:17 PM, Richard M wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: On Jul 2, 2008, at 10:07 AM, shempmcgurk wrote: The only rational explanation I can come up with for why Maharishi took a 180 degree turn on instructions for the outward stroke of life (ie, living in the relative) is that he had so many sycophants around him all the time insisting that he play guru to them that after repeating the correct instructions (as Barry reproduced, above) to them for 25 years about how to live in the relative, he just threw his hands up, declared that they wore him down, and gave them what they wanted. The Occam's razor answer to your question would be that he was in it for the money and a avaricious businessman disguised as a yogi. Pretty simple really. Since when did Occam's razor == glib? It didn't, it just may be too blatantly honest for TB's. Try this TB version then: Since Maharishi had encultured the nervous systems of his students with silence and direct knowledge of the Absolute through TM, seeing the continued suffering of humanity he decided to give the world the gift of 200% of life and thus brought out Pure Knowledge of the relative aspects of life.
[FairfieldLife] Deepockets off the deep end.
by Jody of Guruphiliac.: Deepockets Off The Deep End File under: Gurubusting and The Siddhi of PR Deepak Chopra, hot off his cameo in the recent flop, The Love Guru, lets us into his wacky world in an extensive interview in Newsweek: In a shopping mall in London, Chopra is explaining the connection between a journalist and his coffee cup. This is you,'' he says, pointing to the cup. You think it's a cup, but it isn't.'' Dressed in workout clothes, with no cell phone or watch, Chopra seems admirably at ease in the mall, so much so that he doesn't even check his placement at the bookstore. It's the conscious energy field that is manifesting as the cup and yourself. The same field.'' On the five-day silent'' retreats he takes every three months, sometimes with his wife, Rita, Chopra says he can actually see this field. Another day, another guru feeding us absolute nonsense about nondual truth. Not that there isn't a shared source of being between a person and a cup, just that it's never been something anyone would be able to see, outside the projection of their own imaginings about it. But that is the New Age way, and Deepockets is the most Indian New Age guru, so it makes perfect sense he'd spew a gaffe like this in Newsweek, despite our disappointment at finding out just how full of it he really is.
[FairfieldLife] Sar Bachan by Shiv Dayal Singh
0 Seeker! Every moment remain engrossed in the practice of Surat- Shabd-Yoga [union of the attention-faculty of the soul with Divine Light and Sound within during meditation] for there is no other comrade like the Word. Close your outer ears and then listen to the reverberations of the Word inside. The Word will drive I-ness (arrogance, self-centeredness, ego) out of you. Gain access to the Word and then you'll attain to steadiness and control of mind. After that you'll perceive the glowing and brilliant light of the flame and remain rapturous in the resonance of the Word every moment. You will then feel sick, disgusted and satiated with the objects of pleasures and forsake all of them for you would have soared high and heard the sonorous and resonant sound of the Word that is rich, deep and impressively loud. The guru directs that you must remain contented and engrossed in that Sound; and then you will hear the diapason and crescendo of the sound (glorious and harmonious burst of musical sound and gradual increase in its volume). Then the surat [soul] rises from there rapidly, as if walking with heavy or noisy footsteps, impressively, and arrives at Sunn (Spirit-Sphere) hearing the euphonious tinkling sound. Thereafter, you will hear the sound produced by overtones rather than volume and pitch -- that of timbrel and tambourine; what shall I say about the majesty of the Sound which is infinite and unlimited. Whatever I may talk about it, it will be found wanting. This is a matter which is enigmatic and mysterious; how can I unravel its mystery. The surat [soul] now gains access to the depths and dimensions of the Spaceless and Timeless (Adhar). It now sits with her beloved Lord enjoying his perennial blissful company. All the darkness and dirt of the inner recess of the heart is now eradicated; showers of Sound are falling like murmuring rain. Inside you, as the light spreads, drops of ambrosia fall as the drops of dew. The mind has become fed up (annoyed and bored) with all other modes and methods (except Surat-Shabd-Yoga); the surat is now constantly applying to its wounds the healing and soothing balm of the Word (Sound). I now surrender my body and mind and all to the guru; Radhasoami [Lord of the Soul] speaks in this wise, time and again, with every breath. -- Swami Ji Maharaj Sar Bachan Radhasoami Poetry, Volume One The Quintessential Discourse Radhasoami Translated by M.G. Gupta M.G. Publishers, Agra
[FairfieldLife] tumeric (Curcuma longa) assists in weight loss
(info only - I don't market): ...from Tango Advanced Nutrition: Potential Role of Common Curry Spice in Weight Loss and Diabetes Turmeric (Curcuma longa), an Asian spice found in many curries, has a long history of use in reducing inflammation, healing wounds and relieving pain, but can it help to prevent diabetes? Since inflammation plays a big role in many diseases and is believed to be involved in onset of both obesity and Type 2 diabetes, Drew Tortoriello, M.D., an endocrinologist and research scientist at the Naomi Berrie Diabetes Center at Columbia University Medical Center, and his colleagues were curious what effect the herb might have on diabetic mice. Dr. Tortoriello, working with pediatric resident Stuart Weisberg, MD, Ph.D., and Rudolph Leibel, MD, fellow endocrinologist and the co- director of the Naomi Berrie Diabetes Center, discovered that turmeric-treated mice were less susceptible to developing Type 2 diabetes, based on their blood glucose levels, and glucose and insulin tolerance tests. They also discovered that turmeric-fed obese mice showed significantly reduced inflammation in fat tissue and liver compared to controls. They speculate that curcumin, the anti- inflammatory, antioxidant ingredient in turmeric, lessens insulin resistance and prevents Type 2 diabetes in these mouse models by dampening the inflammatory response provoked by obesity. Their findings were presented at ENDO 2008, the Endocrine Society's annual meeting in San Francisco this week. The researchers tested high-doses of a dietary curcumin in two distinct mouse models of obesity and Type 2 diabetes: high-fat-diet- fed male mice and leptin-deficient obese female mice, with lean wild- type mice that were fed low-fat diets used as controls. The link between inflammation and obesity was previously shown to be due in part to the presence of immune cells called macrophages in fat tissues throughout the body. According to researchers in the Naomi Berrie Diabetes Center these cells produce cytokine molecules that can cause inflammation in organs such as the heart, and islets of the pancreas, while also increasing insulin resistance in muscle and liver. Researchers hypothesized that by suppressing the number and activity of these cells, with turmeric or an agent with similar actions, it could be possible to reduce some of the adverse consequences of obesity. Curcumin administration was also associated with a small but significant decline in body weight and fat content, despite level or higher calorie consumption, suggesting that curcumin beneficially influences body composition. Curcumin administration was also associated with a small but significant decline in body weight and fat content, despite level or higher calorie consumption, suggesting that curcumin beneficially influences body composition. It's too early to tell whether increasing dietary curcumin intake in obese people with diabetes will show a similar benefit, Dr. Tortoriello said. Although the daily intake of curcumin one might have to consume as a primary diabetes treatment is likely impractical, it is entirely possible that lower dosages of curcumin could nicely complement our traditional therapies as a natural and safe treatment. For now, the conclusion that Dr. Tortoriello and his colleagues have reached is that turmeric and its active antioxidant ingredient, curcumin reverses many of the inflammatory and metabolic problems associated with obesity and improves blood-sugar control in mouse models of Type 2 diabetes. In addition to exploring novel methods of curcumin administration to increase its absorption, they are also interested in identifying novel anti-inflammatory processes invoked by curcumin and in adapting those processes in the development of more potent curcumin analogues. Funding for the study comes in part from the National Institutes of Health's Child Health and Human Development branch and the Naomi Berrie Diabetes Center at Columbia University Medical Center. Source: http://www.scientificblogging.com) .
[FairfieldLife] Re: Philip K. Dick's writings about Fairfield Life
--thx...I agree completely. But taking things a step further, can one go on the offensive and still not incur bad karma due to interferring? Take a benign example, the Lotus Sutra, parable of the burning house. The wise Father tells the kids in a burning house about a gift of candy (or some similar angle) to get them out of the house. MMY mentioned examples in which white lies are OK. But now for a more extreme example of intervention. Take anybody - say an enemy, (if there are any, perhaps Osama Bin Laden). Sending the dude hateful vibes could make things worse. My recommendation - send prayers to Kali for HER to take care of the guy; and then let the chips fall where they may. However, such prayers to Kali are for anybody: friends, enemies, ourselves - so ironically, this method uses the same intervention in other's affairs that we might wish for ourselves. It's an interesting, Dharmic way to intervene in other people's lives without (imo) incurring bad karma. Try ityou'll like it. Take anybody with some unfinished karmic strings connected to you; and then bombard the person with Kali vibes. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, guyfawkes91 guyfawkes91@ wrote: And, he thought, I know why. They want to be the agents, not the victims, of history. They identify with God's power and believe they are godlike. That is their basic madness. A long time ago I gave a lecture on TM and the ME to some bright young people and one of them jumped down my throat at the suggestion that people should have the power to control others through thought alone. At the time I couldn't see his problem. Surely if we're doing good it's OK. But now I know better, it's not OK because it poisons the minds of the people who think they have a right to control other people without their consent. That you had no response to this line of argument only shows problems with your own attitude, not the theory behind the ME. There is no coercion with the Maharishi Effect. The idea is simply that when a large group of people calm themselves with TM,/TM-SIdhis, their calmness has a measurable effect on everyone around them. To call this coercive is like claiming that putting a park in an inner city violates the rights of gang members by providing a calming counter-effect to their anger. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Obama: faith useless without works.
also featured: actual photo of a pterodactyl killed by Civil War soldiers: http://www.tinyurl.com/4q7mof Now for Obama... Obama showed he was comfortable using the kind of language that is familiar in evangelical churches and Bible studies by calling his faith a personal commitment to Christ. He said that his time as a community organizer in decimated Chicago neighborhoods, supported in part by a Catholic group, brought him to a deeper faith and also convinced him that faith is useless without works. While I could sit in church and pray all I want, I wouldn't be fulfilling God's will unless I went out and did the Lord's work, he declared. His talk on faith in the battleground state of Ohio came a day after a speech on patriotism in Missouri, another November election battleground. Wednesday, he travels to Colorado Springs, Colo., a hub of conservative Christian organizations, for a speech focused on service. With 80 percent of Americans saying they identify themselves with some religion, Obama's campaign has struggled with the topic. Comments critical of America by Obama's longtime pastor, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, caused a firestorm during the primaries and brought Obama's brand of faith under scrutiny because of Wright's adherence to black liberation theology. Obama also has battled false but persistent rumors that he is a Muslim; they have been kept alive on the Internet despite his repeated talk about his longtime devotion to Christianity. Conservative Christians make up about a quarter of the electorate, and they helped put Bush in office twice. Many still are likely to oppose the Democratic nominee because of his support for abortion rights, gay rights and other issues. An AP-Yahoo News poll in June found that people who attend church at least once a week support Republican McCain over Obama, 49 percent to 37 percent. Those who attend church less often tend to favor Obama. White evangelical Christians who attend church weekly favor McCain by huge margins.
[FairfieldLife] Nan Mooney's advice
http://www.marthabee.com/nanmooney Through hundreds of interviews with families and individuals from across America, award-winning journalist Nan Mooney traces how and why today's educated professional middle class is experiencing financial volatility more profound and paralyzing than the struggles experienced by previous generations. In (Not) Keeping Up With Our Parents, Mooney illustrates how members of this class are increasingly opting out of creative and service-oriented careers, choosing to delay or forgo having children, carrying significant debt well into middle age, and struggling so hard to keep their own finances secure that they have little resources to offer those less fortunate. The issues they facenegotiating massive student loan and credit card debt, struggling to pay for health and child care, and choosing between funding their children's education and their own retirementreveal an entire segment of society teetering on the edge. In response, Mooney encourages today's professional middle class to overcome their sense of fear and resignation and engage in the prospect of change. She proposes ways individuals and communities can stop the economic downward spiralfrom advocating for more government support for education, child care, health care and retirement, to initiating a shift in values so that self worth is no longer defined by the size of one's bank account.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Congratulations on the Re-election of President Robert Mugabe of Zimbabwe
--Deepak Chopra [actually, I think the world would have been a lot better off if Jesus said that...; but anyway...take it away Deepak]: Here we face the most difficult challenge of all. Our conception of happiness has to move away from materialism. Every wise teacher has declared that external comforts are unreliable and not to be trusted. Christ didn't say The Kingdom of God is within a four-bedroom condo. He said it lies within us. In India, turning inward became a powerful social force because people agreed that the inner path was real and desirable. To back up this conviction, .most ancient people looked around and saw disease, poverty, and violence in all directions. The seductions of money and physical comfort weren't present. Our situation now teeters on the rink of peril, too. We have reached a crossroads that appears only once or twice a century. Two roads aren't diverging in a yellow wood, however the divide exists in consciousness. The world's wisdom traditions inform us which way to go. Only time will tell if waking up was the way we chose. If so, peril will turn into a creative opportunity. The other way surely leads into more inertia, reactionary values, dead habit, and worst of all, deeper and deeper sleep - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, off_world_beings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com , sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com , boo_lives boo_lives@ wrote: [...] There is no at least with Mugabe. Do a little googling and see the photos of Mugabe's history of torture and violence. The proposed TM programs there as I understood them involve mugabe stealing land from his political enemies and jointly farming them with tmo slave/devotees. There is no spiritual justification for trying to joint venture with this monster. Unless you believe that group meditation will overwhelm even HIS negative influence... Lawson Which has always been Maharishi's point. And it was Maharishi's announcement that Rick posted from almost a decade ago, not some underling going against Maharishi's stated wishes as the goons here on FFL want to believe. The idiots here think they have democracy, they are being ruled and kept down by the corporate control of government. Any politician that does not toe the corporate line is toast. The only solution is a powerful technology of consciousness to clear out the gunk from people's minds. OffWorld
[FairfieldLife] Sri Arunachala Mahatmya
Sri Arunachala Mahatmya1 (The Glory of Sri Arunachala) Nandi2 said: `That is the holy place! Of all Arunachala is the most sacred! It is the heart of the world! Know it to be the secret and sacred Heart-centre of Siva! In that place he always abides as the glorious Aruna Hill! `That day on which the ancient and wonderful linga of Arunachala took shape is the asterism of Ardra in the month of Mrigasira. And the day on which Vishnu and the other devas worshipped the Lord who emerged from the effulgence is the day of Maha Sivaratri.' Siva said: `Though in fact fiery, my lacklustre appearance as a hill on this spot is an act of grace and loving solicitude for the maintenance of the world. Here I always abide as the Great One (Siddha). Remember that in the interior of my Heart is transcendental glory with all the enjoyments of the world also. `Because they bind the beings of the worlds, know that relentless karmas become the bondage for jivas. The effulgent Arunachala is this (mountain), the mere sight of which causes them to become nonexistent. `What cannot be acquired without endless pains -- the true import of Vedanta [?] -- is easily attained by all who can either directly sight this hill or even mentally think of it from afar. 1Extracts from The Skanda Purana translated into Tamil by Sri Bhagavan. 2Nandi is the foremost devotee of Siva, always remaining in front of him. `I ordain that residence within a radius of three yojanas3 of this hill shall by itself suffice to burn off all defects and effect union with the Supreme even in the absence of initiation.' Devi said: `This is always the abode of pious devotees. Those who do evil to others here will, after suffering ills, be destroyed. Wicked persons will be completely bereft of their powers to do evil here in the twinkling of an eye. Do not fall into the burning fire of the anger of Lord Arunachala who has assumed the form of a hill of fire.' 3A yojana is ten miles.
[FairfieldLife] Cthulhu R'lyeh
featured at http://www.tinyurl.com/ytsye3
[FairfieldLife] Re: Cthulhu R'lyeh
-Indeed, you have out-Cthulhu'd me. Here's a minor encore: COLLECT CALL OF CTHULHU by Keith Allen Daniels My wife and I, having a ball, were taken aback by the call. We never expected he'd call us collect -- and the phone was unplugged from the wall. It seems, said Cthulhu, my spawn know nothing of 'getting it on.' Come morning, he said, as we cowered in bed, I shall ravish the crack of dawn. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig LEnglish5@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tertonzeno tertonzeno@ wrote: featured at http://www.tinyurl.com/ytsye3 Been there, done that: http://www.flickr.com/photos/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/sets/72157603581173041/ http://tinyurl.com/52ob2g See you there I meant that literally, Innsmouth is a Second LIfe simulator. Your avatar can walk through it. The creator hosts role-playing games based on Lovecraft. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: TESP gains governmental recognition at last!
---The basic underlying idea (this concept began early on in the Movement - thanks in large part to MMY and Jerry); is that big bucks (say 100 mil); would be sufficient to jump start the prison project (and other projects - peace palaces, pundits, etc). But MMY already acquired the 100 mil a few years back and that hasn't been accounted for. Bad karma, I'd say! In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, nablusoss1008 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, guyfawkes91 guyfawkes91@ wrote: I'm sure he'd love to rejoin the movement if it ever gets rid of the aliens and becomes a human organization again. He'd be a damm sight bigger asset to the movement than you. Rubbish ! I know Farouk better than you, he is an honourble person in the sense that he is innoscent, well-meaning, intelligent, hardworking; a laywer by birth and birth so to speak. Trouble is he does not understand how the Movement works, the underlying principle. Nor does Jarry Jarvis. The rectification thing came much later than his breaking off. You answered the question yourself by: how is he to make a living. Anyone thinking he can make a living off the knowledge given so generously by Maharishi is already off. It is not possible. The TMO is for Tapas and Tapas alone. There is no room for making a living off the Knowledge, never was, never will be. Those that cling to that notion will be fewer and fewer as time passes by. Already we see a new generation, often born into the families of meditators, that take these timeless priciples of the Masters of Wisdom for granted. The channels now are now open, since this morning, for more evolved souls to be born on earth. - Maharishi, 1977
[FairfieldLife] Re: What would FFL be without its most strident voices?
--Unfriendly should not be confused with constructive confrontations. There's an inner plane need for a forum like FFL. Basically, over the decades (recently since the 60's and especially); powerful religious-oriented memes or M-Fields have been clashing with stupendous consequences, analogous to the Clash of Civilizations theme originating in the 90's. What this amounts to is that the distinct M-fields seem to operate as if they were personalities with human-like goals. Each proclaims that it has the answer for the deplorable human condition. 2nd tenent: In order to fulfill those desires, each of the memes seeks to acquire as much power as possible in the entire meta- universe; and this entails a message: my program is better than the others. Confrontations arise when there are certain irreconciable differences between the memes. They clash, and their are sparks! What's going on in FFL is a mini-reflection of immense energy clashes going on globally, especially in the inner planes; and it's a life or death struggle. Some of the memes will be utterly destroyed, while others will be engulfed into the more powerful; while still others will be forced to make considerable changes to accommodate to the more highly evolved people incarnating in decades and centuries to come. The FFL confrontations are actually quite necessary; and I watch carefully to see how things are played out. This will give a small hint as to how the major M-Field clashes will become resolved over the centuries to come. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, danfriedman2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rick, I believe you to be a man of conscience and good will. If some of your moderation could lead to a more friendly FFL, I imagine an even more open-minded conversation could take place. Imagine it --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer rick@ wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of danfriedman2002 Sent: Friday, June 20, 2008 12:01 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: What would FFL be without its most strident voices? As a member of the 'lurkers', I took your warm invitation and posted. I'd hoped for discussion (got a bit of sarcasm instead). Perhaps FFL could be moderated a bit more closely. That's a slippery slope. We've taken a step or two down it once or twice. Don't want to go there.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What if?
--Right. Most succintly, there have been no clear testimonials of first hand GC (embracing Celestial/Glorified) levels of awareness; and how this is to be distinguished from CC. Also, the accounts of witnessing during sleep are suspiciously fleeting and sporadic. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: On Jun 20, 2008, at 10:39 AM, Patrick Gillam wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, danfriedman2002 wrote: TM requires practice for the development of full benefits. Going from 'boat to boat' will not get the seeker to the other shore. I understand Fairfield has a few score people who qualify as fully enlightened. If that's true, how many woke up after abandoning TM for something else? I think there are signs that people are beginning to awaken in FF and other places and some are just having nice meditative experiences-- common ones which are often mistaken for Enlightenment. But I have not heard of anyone who meets the criteria of CC as Maharishi Mahesh Yogi described it, so I think your claim of full enlightenment is a tad premature. I'm talking about unity consciousness. I understood there were people in Fairfield claiming unity consciousness. That's what I'm asking to confirm, deny or elaborate upon. In many ways it seems a typical neoadvaita scene. Please elaborate - I don't get a mental image of what a neoadvaita scene would be, for all the use of that term here. It seems many of these people did begin to have good experiences after leaving the movement, some with other meditation techniques, some remaining with TM and/or the TMSP. Such may be the case, but I'm questioning whether there are people in Fairfield who reached enlightenment after switching paths. Dan Friedman says it isn't done, but I somehow got the impression it had been done.
[FairfieldLife] Re: What if?
--Fine, let's see it. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, danfriedman2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I'll post the research, if you want to be openminded --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tertonzeno tertonzeno@ wrote: --Right. Most succintly, there have been no clear testimonials of first hand GC (embracing Celestial/Glorified) levels of awareness; and how this is to be distinguished from CC. Also, the accounts of witnessing during sleep are suspiciously fleeting and sporadic. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: On Jun 20, 2008, at 10:39 AM, Patrick Gillam wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, danfriedman2002 wrote: TM requires practice for the development of full benefits. Going from 'boat to boat' will not get the seeker to the other shore. I understand Fairfield has a few score people who qualify as fully enlightened. If that's true, how many woke up after abandoning TM for something else? I think there are signs that people are beginning to awaken in FF and other places and some are just having nice meditative experiences-- common ones which are often mistaken for Enlightenment. But I have not heard of anyone who meets the criteria of CC as Maharishi Mahesh Yogi described it, so I think your claim of full enlightenment is a tad premature. I'm talking about unity consciousness. I understood there were people in Fairfield claiming unity consciousness. That's what I'm asking to confirm, deny or elaborate upon. In many ways it seems a typical neoadvaita scene. Please elaborate - I don't get a mental image of what a neoadvaita scene would be, for all the use of that term here. It seems many of these people did begin to have good experiences after leaving the movement, some with other meditation techniques, some remaining with TM and/or the TMSP. Such may be the case, but I'm questioning whether there are people in Fairfield who reached enlightenment after switching paths. Dan Friedman says it isn't done, but I somehow got the impression it had been done.
[FairfieldLife] Totapuri
The phrase devoid of all conceptual forms might be construed as referring to Ramakrishna's practice of going into Samadhi: from Wiki: Ishwar Totapuri (also Tota Puri) affectionately known as Nangta Baba (1780-?), born likely in Punjab, India, was a parivrajaka (wandering monk) who is said to have followed the path of the Advaita Vedanta, which is often disputed due to the meager information that exists on Totapuri.[1] By the time he arrived at Dakshineswar Temple in 1864, he was a wandering monk of the Dasnami order of Adi Shankara, and head of a monastery in the Punjab claiming the leadership of seven hundred sannyasins. He is said to have initiated Ramakrishna into Advaita Vedanta [2], as well as Anandpuri Ji from the Advait Mat tradition.[3] Totapuri taught Ramakrishna that the sole reality of the impersonal Absolute could only be realized in a state of consciousness devoid of all conceptual forms.[4]Totapuri was a teacher of masculine strength, a sterner mien, a gnarled physique, and a virile voice. Ramakrishna affectionately addressed him as Nangta, the Naked One, because as a renunciate he did not wear any clothing.[2]
[FairfieldLife] Re: What if?
--passed What if? - me too, as a TM/TB; but it's not complete even from Guru Dev's perspective (Cf. http:/www.tinyurl.com/4hwm5s) since he advocates devotion to the gods along with Japa (outward chanting of mantras distinct from silent meditation or dhyan). But MMY streamlined the whole package, eliminating the Deity worship and japa; so his program doesn't conform to Guru Dev's or the traditional components of the Saraswati (and related) traditions. For example, examine the teachings of Swami Sivananda. But I wouldn't object to this since if we look at the history of innovations; we can find many examples of new inventions or old inventions used in a new context, or viewed differently. Often, the excess baggage is discarded, lending the new invention to increased popularity and respectability. But what if the accompanying baggage of the new invention was of REAL value? OK, fine - many people aren't into Deity worship or japa. There are then two courses of action, assuming one continues with TM: 1. Add an alternative program, say butt-bouncing and/or rounding. 2. Just do TM by itself, with no additional program. Personally, I prefer the more traditional approach as taught by Guru Dev; but since MMY failed to transmit the other techniques alluded to by Guru Dev, I've spliced on various techniques gleaned from a. Ramana Maharshi, b. Shree Maa (such as listening to the Durga Puja audio tape - very powerful!); and doing japa of the Mahamritunjaya mantra. (one of the foremost Shiva mantras). FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, danfriedman2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: For many Governors and long-term meditators, experiences are real. I'm past the point of asking: What if? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 sandiego108@ wrote: Much is written here to contradict the claims made about TM and TMSP, and granted the marketing done by the TMO is often over the top. However, whenever there is a new or reinvented technology introduced into the world, all of the proponents of the many representations of the technology will insist that their version is the best, the easiest, the most efficient. Although an imperfect analogy to meditation because of the need for external fuel, look at cars, with initial models running on steam, electricity, diesel and gasoline. A few years into this technology emerging, all looked like they had an equal shot. Then as time passed gasoline cars emerged as the clear winner in terms of power efficiency- literally the greatest bang for the buck. 50 or so years after it was brought out, much is written here and elsewhere about how TM cannot possibly live up to its promise about quickly bringing enlightenment to us all, with all of its resulting personal, social, economic, and political benefits. But 50 years is a very brief time-- not really enough to see the wide ranging benefits of a technology. The telephone for example was invented during the late 19th century and had only progressed to wired, rotary phones after 50 years, using electromechanical switches. Computers with Charles Babbage's computing engine arguably being the first, were even further behind after 50 years, compared to their uses and benefits today. So, many decry TM and TMSP, saying it cannot possibly fulfill its promise, and that it cannot possibly be the most effective meditation technology in the history of the world. That there are many other meditation technologies and each must be compared and contrasted and measured to this relative newcomer. But what if it is the most efficient, the easiest to practice, provides the greatest benefits after the shortest amount of time? What if after more years pass, after all the measurements have been made, and a global concensus reached, TM emerges beyond all the hype to be the supreme technology in its field? What if?
[FairfieldLife] Re: What if?
-- I agree with Lawson on the basis of direct experience: my TM mantra has tangible Shakti in it whereas I couldn't detect any significant Shakti in 2. The Ramakrishna mantra I received from the resident teacher at the Vedanta Temple in Hollywood, 3. Sant Mat Mantras, or 4. attempted use of Om Nama Shivaya or Om Shivaya Namah silently, after getting involved with Muktananda. These Shiva mantras are quite powerful if chanted by a group; but didn't measure up to my TM mantra when used silently. 5. and of course, just picking a mantra out of a book; as suggested by that idiot MD from Harvard. (Benson). Nope, after a direct experience taste test, TM turned out to be superior to others, in regard to the criterion of Shakti. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: sandiego108 wrote: But what if it is the most efficient, the easiest to practice, provides the greatest benefits after the shortest amount of time? What if after more years pass, after all the measurements have been made, and a global concensus reached, TM emerges beyond all the hype to be the supreme technology in its field? What if? Once again (for the thousandth time) THERE IS NOTHING SPECIAL ABOUT TM! It is just like any other yogic meditation for the masses though it uses Nope, not just like any other. And, while you keep insisting that your teacher and all other yogic meditation teachers teach the same innocent, effortless technique as TM, I question your judgement. TM is taughtr adically differently than what is most commonly taught under the label meditation. Sometimes the difference is subtle, sometimes radical. Consider teh meditation teacher who tells his students to grit their teeth and keep on plugging away at thinking the mantra, even when discomfort arises, and only stop if it gets so painful that they can't stand it any more. Consider the meditation traditions that tell you the pattern of breathing you must use when thinking the mantra. Consider the meditation traditions that insist that the mantra can NEVER change, and if it does, you must immediately work to ensure it is perfectly pronounced the same way at all times. Consider the meditation techniques that insist that the mantra is more important than any other thought. Or the ones that say substitute the mantra for other thoughts. And so on. None of these remotely describe TM in my opinion. Do they in yours? Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: What if?
--For those who would like to start chanting the Mahamritunjaya mantra: Om Tryambakam Yajamahe Sugandhim Pushtivardhanam Urvarukamiva Bandhanan Mrityor Mukshiya Maamritat We Meditate on the Three-eyed reality Which permeates and nourishes all like a fragrance. May we be liberated from death for the sake of immortality, Even as the cucumber is severed from bondage to the creeper. Simple. I recommend getting Shreemaa's audio tape of her continuous chant, from http://www.shreema.org Play it a number of times to get a big dose of Shakti, and then start. If you start chanting it on your own from scratch, the amount of Shakti will be far less than if you learn it from Shreemaa. But even before getting her audio, you can start right now. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Marek Reavis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: New, mostly walking (redwood forests, beaches) but driving, too; not often (if ever) sitting with eyes closed, but there were lots of evenings when I'd sit in front of the wood stove watching the flames and doing japa. It's a very friendly practice and a 5-hour drive down to San Francisco became an opportunity to do extra, non-counted, rounds. I followed tradition and made a vrat, or resolution, to do three rounds (108=round) a day and to do a total of 125,000 repetitions total. A total experiment. I really loved it and except for 2 days when I was seriously ill I kept to the vrat. (Of course, traditionally such lapses probably mean that I have cancelled out any and all good effects that might have accrued and, likely as not, have triggered all sorts of bad karma for fucking around in the first place.) But, in all honesty, I really feel like it did some structural work on the consciousness. It's very worthwhile to check some of these practices out and give them the old scratch 'n sniff test. Another thing that I've gotten into over the last 4-5 years is *ajapa* japa, where you don't count the repetitions of the mantra but just keep it running in your head. Like a song that you keep hearing in your head over and over but this time with a mantra, and instead of trying to get rid of it, you encourage it until it's always there, running its program (whatever that is) day and night. For that I used the Gayatri for several months, but then I substituted a longer (traditional)version of my TM mantra and that's always running. I'm working under the basic assumptions that, (1) there is some fundamental goodness at the basis of most of these Hindu/Buddhist traditions and it's unlikely that experimenting is going to make me crazy or make me lose my mind, and (2) I trust me as an organism and that I'm going to be alert enough to be able to feel when something is good for me and when something is not; I trust in the innate design structure of self-preservation to keep me lined up towards both the good, and what feels good. Those may be wrong assumptions but I got to a point where I wanted to get serious about what the whole thing was really about and was willing to commit myself to trying things out. So far I've been real pleased. ** --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Marek Reavis reavismarek@ wrote: For what it's worth to anyone else, my experience with japa using the Mahamritunjaya mantra (125,000 reps in a little over a year) was very rich. Took about a hour and twenty to do 3 rounds a day and doing japa is wonderfully addictive. Recommended by me. Thanks. if I may ask, did you do it sitting? eyes closed?, walking, driving, silently during boring testimony?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Realization-- from the FFL archives
--Thanks, right on target! - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, matrixmonitor matrixmonitor@ wrote: --Flaws in your interesting discourse... (by way of example): doesn't explain how an Enlightened person like A (mentioned before) can still be Enlightened and be a child molestor. It appears that some would attempt to render Paramatma [God] insignificant in order feel comfortable in their amorality and faux 'enlightenment'. The way of the group of those who believe in nirguNa [without qualities alone] spread more wickedness because these people do not accept the manifest form of Bhagavan [God] and suppose that the niraakaara [formless] cannot see or hear. So they do their mind's desires; they have no concern for what is wicked and what is sacred. ~~ Swami Brahmananda Saraswati - Guru Dev [Shri Shankaracharya UpadeshAmrita kaNa 88 of 108] http://www.paulmason.info/gurudev/upadesh.htm - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 sandiego108@ wrote: I stumbled across this in the vast archive of FFL messages, and thought it was worth a copy and paste (its not mine): Knowledge is different in different states of consciousness. I'm trying to get us to stop talking about devotion, free will, etc. from the waking state (the relative), and start talking about it from the Absolute side of the fence. Why? Because I've heard Maharishi say, on numerous occasions, that devotion is meaningless until CC (Self-realization) has dawned. Before that, he says, who is surrendering? We don't even know who we are, so how can we sur- render? We are unreal, so what are we giving up? What are we surrender- ing. Surrender only has meaning when something significant is to be given up, surrendered. Surrender is only meaningful from a place of strength. Only in CC do we know who we are. THEN surrender has some meaning. Before CC, all action is already being performed by the Self, but the in- dividual, unenlightened ego claims credit for everything. It claims to be surrendering, just like a prisoner in a prison might say in his de- lusion I'm here voluntarily. But no matter what he says, he is there at the control of a higher power. If he continues to insist that he has free will, those who know the reality will just smile and call him deluded. In ignorance, no individual is making any choices. They just PRETEND they are, and then they have discussions about the mechanics of making the best choice, and what will be the effects of my various choices. But it's all delusion. In CC, when we stop identifying with that ignorant individuality, and realize that we are the Self, then, for the first time, we realize that we actually DO have free will, because we are the One Self that exercises ALL the free will, we are finally The Doer. We are finally free, and only in freedom is free will possible. The prisoner in our example may decide to stay in jail, be locked in his cell to sleep at lights out, take a shower at 8am, etc. He may decide to surrender to the higher authority of the prison warden. But you and I know that he is going to do those things whether he thinks he believes that he's decided to surrender to them or not. Only, with one set of beliefs, his life will be full of pain and suffering, and with the other set of beliefs, he will flow with the reality THAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN ANYWAY. Even his choice of which prison warden has control over him is out of his hands. He doesn't choose his prison, or his warden. The system sends him where it thinks he will do best. Same with the choice of a guru. The system chooses for us, runs us around through life till we are brought to where we are meant to be. And from the outside, our actions may look like we've been exercising our own judgment, but we are in the matrix, and the program is being run by the Self (or by Nature, or God, or karma...) In CC, the decision to surrender to something even bigger can have mean- ing. In CC the surrender of infinity to a larger infinity is real. In waking state, the surrender of a finite dreamer, of a delusional exis- tence, to infinity is meaningless, is an illusion, and does not happen the way the ego would like to claim it does. The ignorant, relative ego is totally moved by the Self. It is just a wave of the Self. All thought, speech, and action is powered by the Self. 1. The resistance to That by the ego, the claim to be a separate power, is the actual content of ignorance, IS the ignorance. 2. The acceptance of That by the ego, IS the
[FairfieldLife] Religious fanaticism squared (was Re: Fairfield super radiance and Iowa weather)
---Right...not only a circular door but a Chinese box (or Russian doll): those that have jumped a quantum leap beyond ignorance of Self could very well be in another box; while ignoring the possibilities of another quantum leap to a world beyond with unimaginable possibilities. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Hugo richardhughes103@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote: On Jun 18, 2008, at 1:22 PM, Hugo wrote: Unfortunate things will happen to those who oppose it Jesus, I'm so glad I'm out of the TM mental hospital. But you're clearly *not,* Hugo, if you're still posting here. Nice try, though. :) Sal I can't resist peeping round the door to see if anything has changed. I hope the orderlies don't think I'm one of the inmates and put me back in the padded room. Haven't you figured out yet its a circular door?
[FairfieldLife] Slang terms of future Fairfield Pundits
bo-bos: prison-issued tennis shoes. bone yard: trailers used for conjugal visits brake fluid: psychiatric meds such as liquid Thorazine Buck Rogers time: a sentence with parole unimaginably far in the future. chalk: prison moonshine chin check: to punch an inmate in the jaw to see if he'll fight back clavo: (Spanish for nail), danterous contraband diaper sniper: child molester diesel therapy: a lengthy bus trip, used as a punishment. ding wing: mental health ward erasers: chunks of processed chicken high class: hepatitis C iron pile: weightlifting equipment jack book: any magazine with pictures of women the monster: HIV ninja turtles: guards dressed in riot gear robocop: guard who writes up every infraction, no matter how small six-five: warning that a guard is approaching. stainless-steel ride: lethal injection 13 1/2: 12 jurors, 1 judge, and 1/2 a chance; seen in prison tattoos. by Jen Phillips, Mother Jones, July/Aug 2008, p. 63.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Byron Katie's Awakening
---OK, we're in a dream; but an important point (IMO), is how important or signifant are the dream people to you in the context of non-duality. Are you taking the Neo-Advaitin position that (since everything is a dream), then I don't know and I don't care; or the Buddhist position that you/we are responsible for helping others - in fact, everybody in the entire universe. Practically speaking, that may not be feasible right now; but just follow Dalai Lama's words of wisdom - try to extend compassion to everybody. This may include various physical means to eradicate suffering. But being a Neo-Advaitin, I take it that you consider the dream- people to be virtually non-existent people and about as important as those Second Life Avatars (of no importance). Since we're all living in a type of Second Life cyberworld of dreamlike substance; then anything goes: suffering is equal to non-suffering since the dream- like Avatars just pop up again. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There's nothing in the waking state that could not be in a dream state. Ruth wrote: You can't do everything in your dreams that you can do when you are awake. You can't pick up the latest Dean Koontz novel that you have not yet read and read it. You could pick up the latest Dean Koontz novel that you have not yet read and read it in a dream. There's nothing in the waking state that could not be in a dream state. In dream states we can read novels and run and jump and consult with our friends, just like we do in the waking state. There's no proof that you are not in a dream state right now. The Chinese philosopher, Chuang Tsu (c. 369-268 B.C.) said: 'I once dreamt I was a butterfly. Suddenly I awakened, and there I lay like a man, myself again. Now, which am I? A man dreaming he is a butterfly, or a butterfly dreaming he is man?'
[FairfieldLife] Re: Enlightenment, Alzhiemers and Stoned Memory Loss -- was Byron Katie's
---Right - the neo-Advaitic Awakening; although non-dual, doesn't match various descriptions of Enlightenment. For one thing, the Awakened people almost never describe their own experiences through the progression of CC, GC, and UC. They then go on to say they are unattached to any manifestations of subtle realities and have thus fully transcended them. This doesn't mesh with the idea of Kundalini markers that MMY mentions; as well as the various subtlties of perception that one must pass through on the level of GC. The fact that one is unnattached to such signs means little. Neither are ignorant people attached to the signs. Imagine a bobsled race to Nome, Alaska; at which various referees are stationed along the raceway to record the passing of the competitors. If a competitor fails to be recorded at a station, he's out. Same way with the Awakened people. They can spout off buzz words like Awakening, Presence, etc; but that's all they can talk about since most are probably well short of the big E. In a nutshell, compare SBS with (so and so). Big difference! On Alzheimers, there's a new product out which might help (I don't market supplements). Check it out at http://www.prevagen.com Here's a testimonial: Male, in his 80's: I bought this product for my father, 81 years old, on the recommendation of a friend who is a doctor. He called me last week to tell me he finished the crossword puzzle in the newspaper for the first time in years. He was thrilled! He's been able to come pretty close to finishing the crossword every day now for the past week or so.* In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Marek Reavis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: New, thanks for writing this (below). My former mother-in-law has been progressing in her Altzheimer's dementia for several years now and from what I've observed over that time at infrequent intervals also strikes me as not a bad fade out from the world. She isn't uncomfortable except when confronted with radically unfamiliar situations and has a pleasant bemusement with whatever's going on. The recent posts from Jim and Ruth and Curtis within this thread have been particularly interesting for me. I'd appreciate your take on the disassociative state that has been discussed; I can't quite figure out what that is exactly or what that terms means to people. For some time now, but I couldn't say when it started because it's obviously always been, consciousness, or presence is always present. It's not what I understood witnessing to be but it fits the description mostly. It's not like lucid dreaming or anything but there's never a time when I'm not. Similarly, it's not characterized by unboundedness in the sense of vastness or infinity that Jim and Byron Katie speak of, but at the same time there's no sense that it's necessarily specifically locate-able or merely confined to the body. It's relationship to the body is that the body draws attention to it, like pinching a piece of fabric into a little bump or hummock -- now it stands out -- it's noticed, but it's just a bump in the fabric, just a bump on the horizon of attention. At the same time, it's impossible not to know it and impossible that it hasn't always been or that I haven't always been aware of it. I'm not sure if that presence or attention, that seems to be both at the base of me and at the same time not really identified with me is the disassociative state that both Ruth and Curtis relate that they find unpleasant and/or undesirable and is the same state that both Jim and Byron Katie describe in such magnificent terms as overwhelming infinite bliss. It does seem like the me of me, and if I let attention rest on it then it's very pleasant, and not unlike ganj. It has the sense of being before me and it has the sense of not being extinguishable, though I've got no way to test that feeling (at least not right now). Angela said that it feels to her that it could be permanent and survive death, and that feels right to me, too. It even feels right to call it death because it seems to be what is there that will experience the death of the body and maybe that's what this Altzheimer's stuff reminded me of. What is there when everything else is gone? I don't want to appeal to, or rely on, any enlightented authority for explanation because (I feel) it's important to figure this out from a personal perspective rather than from some received, traditional wisdom. It still is important to me to be a good man in the world and I feel that I've been more successful in that endeavor the last several years and directly as a consequence of this internal perspective. There are many people here on this forum whom I look to for insight and perspective, you being one. I'd appreciate any comment you would care to make regarding this. And that goes, of course, for anyone else
[FairfieldLife] The time has come!
Time Has Come Today - The Chambers Brothers Time has come today Young hearts can go their way Can't put it off another day I don't care what others say They say we don't listen anyway Time has come today (Hey) Oh The rules have changed today (Hey) I have no place to stay (Hey) I'm thinking about the subway (Hey) My love has flown away (Hey) My tears have come and gone (Hey) Oh my Lord, I have to roam (Hey) I have no home (Hey) I have no home (Hey) Now the time has come (Time) There's no place to run (Time) I might get burned up by the sun (Time) But I had my fun (Time) I've been loved and put aside (Time) I've been crushed by the tumbling tide (Time) And my soul has been psychedelicized (Time) (Time) Now the time has come (Time) There are things to realize (Time) Time has come today (Time) Time has come today (Time) Time [x11] Oh Now the time has come (Time) There's no place to run (Time) I might get burned up by the sun (Time) But I had my fun (Time) I've been loved and put aside (Time) I've been crushed by tumbling tide (Time) And my soul has been psychedelicized (Time) (Time) Now the time has come (Time) There are things to realize (Time) Time has come today (Time) Time has come today (Time) Time [x4] Yeah
[FairfieldLife] Re: Shiva sutras
--(from below): - When you realize this, all discontent and mental suffering come to an end, you are liberated: you know that you are free and immortal. You don't have to be reborn or come back anymore. My comment: I haven't seen much evidence that all discontent is eliminated. Also, Ramakrishna and Ramana died of cancer. Ramakrishna looked like one of those Andersonville prisoners of war toward the end. I can't figure how this (E) puts an end to physical suffering,...which you didn't mention. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, cardemaister [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: On Jun 6, 2008, at 3:04 AM, cardemaister wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: On Jun 5, 2008, at 6:45 PM, cardemaister wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, yifuxero yifuxero@ wrote: 44. What is meant by restraint in the centre of the brow? The left and right in the central channel. Seems like the translator doesn't know Sanskrit syntax very well. The last word of that suutra is a compound word: savyaapasavyasauSumneSu (savya-apasavya-sauSumneSu). Actually Mike is fluent in Sanskrit, although I never really liked his translation of the SS. Have you got any favourite translation of the above suutra? Shiva Sutras: The Supreme Awakening by Swami Lakshmanjoo He was the last living acharya of that tradition. My favorite translation of III 45 goes like this: 3-45 Concentrating on the center within the nose, what use are the left and the right channels or suSumna? naasikaantarmadhyasaMyamaat kimatra savyaapasavyasauSumNeSu 3-45 Concentrating (saMyamaat: ~performing saMyama) on the center within the nose (naasikaa+antar-madhya), what use are (kim atra: what here?) the left (savya: iDaa?) and the right (apasavya: pin.galaa?) channels or suSumna (sauSumNeSu)? http://www.shaivam.org/ssshivasuutra.htm
[FairfieldLife] Re: Rising Insanity of the Age of Enlightment
--I'm sure Jesus Christ would agree with you, Ruth. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ruthsimplicity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams willytex@ wrote: Ruth wrote: An example is the head twitching and vocalizations all my meditator friends made when learning the sidhis, which they perceived as a release of stress. We are not discussiong the 'TM-Sidhi Program', Ruth, we're just talking about plain old 'TM', a simple meditation that is transcendental. Plain TM is for relief of stress and strain - the siddhis are for obtaining an energizing enthusiasm AFTER you have practiced plain TM for about twenty minutes. ...the rest of your post is irrelevant to the points I was trying to make and you are still confusing unstressing with stress. Maybe so, but I don't think so, Ruth. In a nutshell, there's really no such thing as 'stress', in psychotherapy or medicine, that's just a word made up by Han Selye. There's no 'eu-tress', or Marshy 'unstress' - these are just phrases used by people in order to facilitate communications in a discussion. There's no medical definition of 'stress'. Oh Richard, you are so patronizing. I would blow off your post, but there is a nugget below that I want to discuss: In reality, there's only 'suffering', that is, lamentation and grief, brought on by karma or the samskaras of everyday life. All these apparent maladies can be corrected and erased by *dispelling* the illusion of an individual *soul-monad*. When you realize this, all discontent and mental suffering come to an end, you are liberated: you know that you are free and immortal. You don't have to be reborn or come back anymore. snip- you will be liberated from suffering. snip It's a simple as that. I am of the belief that what makes humans great is empathy. I also believe that there is no empathy without pain. I loved my parents. They suffered and died and I felt their suffering and I felt grief when they died. And I know it is the way of the world and one day I may suffer the same and certainly one day I shall die. I do not believe that enlightenment is life without pain. Instead, maybe just maybe, you realize that there is no love without pain and that pain is OK. The greatest flaw of MMY appears to me to be his lack of empathy.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Statement of Maharshi Mehi Paramhans (1885-1986)
---This could be what Ramakrishna called going into Samadhi. Don't be so hasty in your judgements, Dr.. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Maya...subtle bodies..bullshit. Lower knowledge ;-) --- yifuxero [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This Guru sought to fuse Sant Mat with the traditional Vedic sciences; but having a background in Sant Mat, his position on God is quite clear: one's subtle body must be able to separate itself from the physical body; and only then does true knowledge of God take place. A devotee is driven by an intense zeal to see God. That alone is the ultimate goal. The jeevaatmaa would identify itself and the God with the help of, or through, itself, but only after getting detached from the body, organs, (mind and intellect). We should learn the way to get detached from the body, organs, mind and intellect, the way to identify our own Self. The practice (of the method thus learnt) should be so vigorous that we can lift ourselves beyond body, organs etc; so that we can abide within ourselves as well as identify God. Sants have taught the way to this. For instance, what is `roop' (form/shape)? That which can be known with eyes. What is `shabd' (sound or word)? That which our ears can grasp. What is `ras' (taste)? That which can be perceived by the tongue. What is `gandha' (smell)? That which can be detected by the nose. What is `sparsh'? That which is discernible through the skin. Likewise, what is God? What are you within yourself? The answer to both these questions is the same: that which you (the soul) can identify within yourself. God is perceived through perception of the Self. Whatever is perceived by the conscious soul, transcending all the domains of `jad' (ignorant or devoid of consciousness) is God. What is God? That which is knowable only to the pure, conscious soul. The method or the means, through which the conscious soul can separate itself from the body, organs, (mind, intellect etc) and can keep it with itself, all alone, is the (truest or genuine) worship of God. Please keep this in mind. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[FairfieldLife] Look at me, I'm important! I know the Truth! (was Re: Shaken)
---Right-on! Neo-Advaitins make a big thing about not being attached to (say, Kundalini signs); but neither are ignorant people attached to those phenomena. The point is, one has to go THROUGH the signs. How about the Radiant form of the Master? Challenge to Neo-Advaitins on this forum: Which Master did you see the Radiant form of? In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jun 2, 2008, at 9:08 AM, TurquoiseB wrote: Go to almost any neoadvaita satsang like ones I've witnessed in New England or FF and you'll see a well of confusion--but they all think it's the greatest thing. I think that the reason for this is that the essential message of NeoAdvaita is valid, that there is nowhere to go and nothing to become to realize one's enlightenment. Yes, of course, but that is the POV of the nondual state from someone who has had that recognition. Different people may need considerable accomplishment or a damn good teacher to have that recognition (unless, of course, a person has certain predisposing factors). Consider both Ramana Maharishi and Nisargadatta who mastered samadhi and kundalini before their realization dawned. Few ever talk about that. Let's just skip that. Mention that to most neoadvaitin's and they'll fall back on nowhere to go and nothing to become crutch. The only ones who don't notice them limping, is them. But in general they just seem to be brewing ground for confusion and delusion and ego. Almost all are still at the state of talking about experiences, they still have not transcended that basic need... The thing I noticed most was that NONE of the experiences Jim talks about have anything to do with other people. They are ALL in terms of himself. Whenever I try to get him to even talk about other people, he evades and dodges the discussions. No realization of interdependent origination.
[FairfieldLife] Look at me, I'm important! I know the Truth! (was Re: Shaken)
--Radiant form of the Master: one of the important signs of Kundalini awakening (specifically the 3-rd eye center) that is especially important in the Surat Shabda Yoga tradition (Sant Mat, Radhaswami, Ruhani Satsang, etc); but also found as a marker of progress toward Self-Realization in a few other traditions. To quote from a Sant Mat website: As you look within, you will see a sky, or blue sky: If you look minutely into it, you will find it studded with stars, or you may see pinpoints of Light. If so, try to locate the big star out of them, and fix your whole attention on that. Then you may see the inner sun or moon. If so, focus all your attention into the middle; it will break into pieces, and you will cross it. Beyond you will see the radiant form of the Master or his Master... - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, mrfishey2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, tertonzeno tertonzeno@ wrote: ---Right-on! Neo-Advaitins make a big thing about not being attached to (say, Kundalini signs); but neither are ignorant people attached to those phenomena. The point is, one has to go THROUGH the signs. How about the Radiant form of the Master? Challenge to Neo- Advaitins on this forum: Which Master did you see the Radiant form of? Mr. Tertonzeno So that I can pass through it (how, if you have the time) when encountered, just what is a radiant form? ---
[FairfieldLife] Look at me, I'm important! I know the Truth! (was Re: Shaken)
---Precisely. Such things have to be judged at face value, not one set of Neo-Advaitin standards and another for the Proletariat calss. Mistakes are mistakes, and yes, Hitler was evil. Besides, the people in question are far from Buddhahood. Bourgeosie.fa In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: Those that are 'enlightened' live in a different reality than those that live in ignorance. The enlightened have an experience of 'gnosis' in that they realize the illusory aspect of reality. First, excellent detailed answers. Here is the fundamental problem that I have. How could we possibly know what a person's internal experience is? I can't really separate your points from a bunch of beliefs that any fundamentalist Hindu would have. The enlightened person is just making a claim of having special internal knowledge with no evidence. Most of your points were right out of scriptures. So anyone can claim to know in this special way. I think the difference is that some people get others to buy into the claim. Ones view doesn't necessarily need to be upheld by anyone. My view doesn't usually change because you don't see it that way. It may be good feedback and all, but my state is not dependent on anyone's approval. Evaluating mistakes' is quite relative to the evaluation criteria. And the definition of a mistake. Do cartoon characters make mistakes? Did the roadrunner make ANOTHER mistake that got him blown up one more time? Does Charlie Brown make a mistake when ready to kick the football when Lussy lets go of the it once again? Are spelling errors mistakes? In some contexts yes, in other's no. Spelling is anarbitrary convention. As are words. I choose not to buy into that convention, and spell Lucy as Lussy -- did I make mistake? Again -- by what standards, from what view, pursuant to which objective, and to what consequence. What if the maid slipped, fell down the stairs, mistakenly and accidently bumped Hitler over the rail, where he plunged to his death in 1940. Did the maid make a mistake? Did Scott McClellan make a mistake by not speaking up while press Secretary? He said this morning that he didn't figure out a lot of stuff until year ago. Are some things a mistake in hindsight, or with more knowledge, and not a mistake at the moment? One view, which I like, and which may be a mistake, is that everyone is doing the best with what they have. Is a '64 VW Beetle, on its last legs, choking and coughing to get to the end of the street, making a mistake? Or is it doing the best it can with what it still has? If everyone is doing their best, given all of everyone's limitations, where is are the mistakes? I flunked a course -- took it again, and now know more than anyone in wither class. Did I make a mistake in failing the first time? I hit 63 out of 478 balls into the net this morning. Were those mistakes -- or simply useful feedback to adjust the angle of my racquet head a bit? A child is learning to talk and is a bit inarticulate at times. Is she making a mistake --or on a perfect path to learn the language. I don't claim to have special knowledge, particularly the woo woo kind. I do have specialized knowledge that no one else has on this Forum. (Or ever had in the history of the universe -- for that matter). But its personal, or career, or academic training, or simply what I had for breakfast 2 days ago. And my specialized knowledge affects by views -- and vice versa. I picked up 6 instead of my intended 4 oranges at the store. Was that a mistake? Was it consequential? A man loses his fortune -- by various mistakes. And learns a shitload of valuable life lessons as a result. Was that a mistake? Mistakes are very relative to what. What view, objective, context, evaluation criteria, consequence, etc. Its possible to posit views in which every cloud has a silver lining and things happen for the best. Many people, far beyond enlightenment traditions, have some or much of this view. In that view, its all good good -- in the larger context. One step back, two steps forward. In that view, there are no mistakes. While I am not necessarily subscribing to such, it is a legitimate view.
[FairfieldLife] Sutras of Nityananda
Nityananda Institute presents Nityananda.us Selected Sutras, Part I These sutras were selected from The Sky of the Heart: Jewels of Wisdom from Nityananda, published by Rudra Press, the publishing division of Nityananda Institute. The accompanying commentaries are by Swami Chetanananda. SUTRA 1 The real sunrise is in the sky of the heart; It is the best one. Just as the water jar reflects the sun, So the entire universe shines In the heart-space of the Self. When you are in a train, the whole world Appears to pass by. Similarly, the whole universe can be known Within the Self. Commentary: Atman is used interchangeably with Self in these Sutras. Atman refers to the universal Self that manifests as a proliferation of rays emanating from itself. These rays are not different from the nature of their source, but only take on the appearance of separateness. Kundalini is the supreme conscious energy manifesting as an individuated person (jivatman). Paramatman is the Absolute. Both are Atman. It is the merging of Atman into Atman, like the merging of waves into water, that is the goal of spiritual practice: the union of the individual and the Divine. The Absolute, the Supreme, Paramatman, Brahman, the Self are all synonymous with Atman in these sutras. The image of chidakash is also central to Nityananda's teaching as given in these Sutras; the word is formed of the roots chit, consciousness, and akasha, space or sky, and is thus poetically translated as the sky of consciousness. It is synonymous with hridayakasha, sky of the heart. Chidakash is an experience; it is a state of consciousness in which perception is objectless and limitlessly vast, a state in which the individual and the universal are in complete union. In various disciplines, this experience of Oneness may be called samadhi, turiya, nirvana or shunya. Nityananda also called this heart-space of the Atman the Brahmarandhra, and the sahasrara chakra, the thousand-petaled lotus; for him, these were all the same. They all refer to that secret point in the head where the light of consciousness shines in its purest form. When an individual's kundalini energy is completely roused, it merges into this place in the head. The awakening that occurs in our understanding at that time reveals our complete and total unity in the Divine. When we realize that we are in God and that God is in us, then there is nothing outside of us. All knowledge is accessible from within. SUTRA 6 Why do you hold an umbrella? For protection from the rain. The illusion of duality is the rainMaya, Truth is the umbrella, And a steadfast mind is the handle. Truth is in everything but few people realize it. Maya, the cosmic power responsible for our Sense of duality, comes from the Self The Self does not come from Maya. The prime minister is under the king, But he is not the king. The mind is not the Self It is a reflection of the Self. The mind is two grades below the Self. The mind has an end, But the Self has no end. The mind is often deluded, But the Self is not deluded, and not subject To three forms of manifest reality The dense, the dynamic, the still. Such qualities apply only to the mind. The mind is to the Self As the river is to the sea. The Self is the sea, its water measureless. The Self is without beginning or end. The Self does not come and it does not go. Wherever you turn, it is there. Nothing else is seen. The Self is there before you and it is there After you; Even before you were born, there was creation. Only you are unaware. Commentary: The three primary gunas are sattva, rajas, and tamas. Collectively, they are Prakriti, cosmic Nature, the stuff of all manifestation. They are simply three different forms of manifestation: still, dynamic and dense. Sattva guna is pure space, pure light, pure peace. Tamas guna is the opposite; it is density, darkness and inertia. Rajas guna is fire and dynamic activity. They are at once hierarchical and not hierarchical, since the peace exists in everyone, everyone has dynamic capability, and there is also inertia in everyone. It is just another way of speaking about the spectrum of manifestation. Tamas guna (inertia, thickness) is one end of the spectrum, sattva guna (pure light) is the opposite end, and rajas guna is the meeting of the two, for when pure light and pure density meet, the result is fire. Yet upon reaching sattva guna, there is no more hierarchy. In the pure state of sattva guna, everything is seen as equal; there is no separate mind, no chakras, no nadisnothing is separate. Sattva guna is pure and perfect balance. In man, these gunas are found in a state of instability. Sattva causes moments of inspiration, meditative calm, quiet joy, and disinterested affection. Rajas brings out constructive activity, energy, enthusiasm, and physical courage as well as ambition and rage. Tamas is associated with the lowest qualities such as sloth, stupidity, helpless
[FairfieldLife] Re: Looking for a Buddy
-First thing to do is buy two audio CD's: 1. Arunachala Sthuti Panchakam and 2. Evening Veda Parayana; as well as the DVD Sage from Arunachala. All from http://www.arunachala.org Watch part of the video every day and WHILE doing TM, play one of the audio CD's at a low volume and consider it as simply background sound without interfering with the original TM instructions. Then, play the audios as much as possible during the day. Also, chant the Mahamritunjaya mantra throughout the day. Get the audio CD from Sreemaa of her chanting this powerful Shiva mantra. Do this program for 1 month and you will get out of your rut. Report back to me after 1 month. -- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, simon.groves123 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To whom-ever it might interest, I've been meditating (TM) for 7 years and have encountered a rough ride, (ongoing difficulty with temendous unstressing) since I began. Recently I have run up against much increase in physical unstressing and increased difficulty in and out of meditation, with tough physio- mental stuff disrupting my Asana routine. I would be grateful if any experienced meditator might be interested in helping me see through my mistakes in the intellect regarding my practice (Asanas, Pranayama, TM). In the role of an (online) TM Buddy I have had some insight into the nature of my mental obstruction (which is quite scary - tricky for me but my seeming ability to know how to proceed is in confusion. I've come to a self-made impasse and it might be good to have the occasional reminder that its not all so serious as it seems to me right now. Looking to to overcome, Best wishes Simon Groves
[FairfieldLife] Re: Looking for a Buddy
--Good advice, Vaj!. Thanks to you, I have the kundalinicare book; but it's somewhat short on techniques and long on kundalini descriptions. My advice, check out the online pic of the kundalinicare book. He's in the Saraswati lineage and his Guru or grand-guru frequented the area of Rishikesh. Therefore, we should look into what these Gurus have to offer. Simple: the Shiva-Shakti principle. The Saraswati Guru is shown standing about a mile away from Arunachala, the abode of Ramana Maharshi. Arunachala was considered by Ramana to be God Himself and the physical murti of the static aspect of Shiva. Thus, access the website http://www.arunachala.org and get the media items I mentioned, of Pundits from Ramana's Ashram at the foot of the Arunachala Hill. This will take care of the SHIVA aspect. Now for the Shakti aspect. Get Shreemaa's CD audio of the DURGA PUJA, as well as her rendition of the Mahamrityunjaya mantra (an important Shiva mantra). When Shiva's mantra is chanted by a living Divine Mother Incarnation such as Shreemaa, you get both Shiva and Shakti together. Also recommended. (from SYDA). Swami Muktananda chanting the Guru Gita. This is a powerful source of Shakti. Also, any media items from Karunamayi. There - I've given you the antidote to your being in a rut; so now get to the Shiva-Shakti program!. Your life will change for the better. Results guaranteed in 21 days. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On May 27, 2008, at 3:05 PM, curtisdeltablues wrote: As a TM teacher I doled out plenty of this kind of advice thinking that Maharishi's programs were complete and did not need any help from mental health professionals. I watched 3 friend's lose their minds in catastrophic breakdowns after ignoring their serious symptoms. Was this from TM or TMSP? WTF? Simon: Dump the TM, it's notorious for causing serious side effects in some people. Go see a therapist, a good one. Are you a vegetarian? TM alone or TM-sidhi program? Best of luck with your situation and your healing. You may also consider calling: http://www.kundalinicare.com/ ...as they have helped many TMers in your same situation, with good results. They are from the same lineage as Guru Dev. But please don't take that as a reason to bypass some good therapy.
[FairfieldLife] Eckankar on Soul Travel vs Kirpal Singh
from a tripod blog: Soul Travel All of the Radhasoami branches speak at length about leaving the body at will or dying while living or going within. Kirpal Singh, in particular, laid special emphasis on experiencing above body consciousness and seeing inner light and hearing inner sound. Indeed, he buttressed his claims for mastership by stating univocally that only a competent master could offer inner glimpses at the very time of initiation. Paul Twitchell seems to have been fascinated with out-of-body experiences. Most of his early 1960s articles, just prior to the founding of Eckankar, talk about bilocation or the ability to be in two places at the same time. By the time he started Eckankar in 1965, Twitchell had coined a term called soul travel to describe in a nutshell what his path was all about. Although it is clear that Twitchell learned of soul travel from his association with Swami Premananda and Kirpal Singh, in developing Eckankar he modified the term to represent something a bit different than what his original teachers had in mind. In Radhasoami meditation practice, for example, emphasis is placed on achieving out-of-body experiences while one is conscious. Thus any experiences that are derived during unconscious processes, like dreams and such, are not given much credence. However, the chief method by which Twitchell soul traveled was by sleeping and having dreams. In his numerous letters to Kirpal Singh, Twitchell repeatedly mentions how he left his body after lying down and going to sleep. Dreams for Twitchell were the gateway to other worlds. Kirpal Singh was suspicious of this modus operandi because in his tradition dreams are extremely unreliable and may not necessarily indicate a higher state of consciousness but rather a lower one. It was precisely on this point that Kirpal Singh critiqued Twitchell's manuscript, The Tiger's Fang, and which eventually led to their irresolvable rift. To achieve out-of-body experiences during the waking state is a very difficult thing, according to Radhasoami practitioners. To achieve such during dreaming is much more easy, even if much more suspect and unreliable. That Twitchell emphasized the latter and not the former (in Radhasoami an initiate is enjoined to spend not less than two and a half hours in meditation daily; in Eckankar the chela, as students are called, are enjoined to do about twenty minutes twice daily of spiritual exercises) proved to be one of the great attractions of Eckankar to new seekers. Since almost everybody dreams, the relative success rate of Eckists is bound to be much higher than those in Radhasoami, where only waking experiences are given value. Whether Twitchell consciously realized this as a marketing tool is unclear, but it is certain that it contrasted dramatically with Kirpal Singh's teachings. Today dreaming is perhaps the central way for Eckists to experience the truth of their path. The present leader Harold Klemp when describing most of his inner experiences bases them upon his dream excursions. Eckists have also followed suit.
[FairfieldLife] health benefits of flax hull lignans
disclaimer: (I don't market supplements): From http://www.goldflaxseed.com What are Flax naturally Lignans ? Our lignans are a unique group of phytonutrients found in the flax seed hull and include SDG (Secoisolariciresinol diglucoside). Studies indicate these lignans have tremendous health benefits that include anti-viral, anti-bacterial, anti-fungal and anti-cancer properties. It has also been concluded that these lignans act as anti-oxidants which enhance immune system functioning. Flax lignans are classified as phytoestogens (which means they resemble the hormone estrogen) and can be used to help balance hormones. Our premiere manufacturing process assures pure, high quality SDG flax lignans. Lignans can help support: - Energy Levels - Sleep patterns - Immune function - Hormone growth - Regular bowel function - Digestion - Skin hair condition - Anti-fungal functions - Anti-viral functions - Anti-parasitical functions -Anti-carcinogenic functions (Lignans have been shown to have anticancer properties. Breast and prostate cancers are the most affected by lignan activity)
[FairfieldLife] Dalai Lama on the natural life.
Dalai Lama Quote of the Week Compassion and love are not man-made. Ideology is man-made, but compassion and love are produced by nature. It is important to recognize natural qualities, especially when we face a problem and fail to find a solution. For example...in religious business, sometimes even due to religion, we create a problem. If we try to solve that problem using religious methods, it is quite certain that we will not succeed. So I feel that when we face those kinds of problems, it is important to return to our basic human quality. Then I think we will find that solutions come easier. Therefore, I usually say that the best way to solve human problems is with human understanding. It is very important to recognize the basic nature of humanity and the value of human qualities. Whether one is educated or uneducated, rich or poor, or belongs to this nation or that nation, this religion or that religion, this ideology or that ideology, is secondary and doesn't matter. When we return to this basis, all people are the same. Then we can truly say the words brother, sister; then they are not just nice words--they have some meaning. That kind of motivation automatically builds the practice of kindness. This gives us inner strength. ...Next, let us talk about the human being as a social animal. Even if we do not like other people, we have to live together. Natural law is such that even bees and other animals have to live together in cooperation. I am attracted to bees because I like honey--it is really delicious. Their product is something that we cannot produce, very beautiful, isn't it? I exploit them too much, I think. Even these insects have certain responsibilities, they work together very nicely. They have no constitution, they have no law, no police, nothing, but they work together effectively. This is because of nature. Similarly, each part of a flower is not arranged by humans but by nature. The force of nature is something remarkable. We human beings, we have constitutions, we have law, we have a police force, we have religion, we have many things. But in actual practice, I think that we are behind those small insects. Sometimes civilization brings good progress, but we become too involved with this progress and neglect or forget about our basic nature. Every development in human society should take place on the basis of the foundation of the human nature. If we lose that basic foundation, there is no point in such developments taking place. --from The Dalai Lama, A Policy of Kindness: An Anthology of Writings By and About the Dalai Lama compiled and edited by Sidney Piburn, Foreword by Sen. Claiborne Pell, published by Snow Lion Publications
[FairfieldLife] How can the God of destruction be supreme?
from http://www.saivam.org How can the god of destruction be the Supreme ? Destruction is one among the three activities that is undertaken by the Three Holy Manifestations of sanAtana dharma respectively. That being the case how could one say Lord Shiva who gets associated with the destruction be the Supreme God ? braHma, viShNu, rudra, often referred to collectively as trimUrti, play the role of masters of creation, protection and destruction respectively. If we take this world as an example it is an easy task for almost everybody to involve in the acts of creation. (This is not to say that the Universal creation is a trivial task. All due respects to Lord braHma). Whereas as for as protection is concerned it is only few good hearted people, who have the strength and inclination to help for the cause of goodness do the protection deeds. But... not everybody is provided with the power of destruction. When anybody starts doing the destruction then there would be chaos which they call the law and order problem. There is normally one authority called government is given the authority to destroy and not others. This would show how difficult is the action of destruction and how carefully it has to be dealt with. This is the reason the act of destruction (to be correct this word should be actually reduction, as things are not getting destroyed but only a change of state happens odukkam in thamiz and pralayam in saMskR^itam) is handled by a form of Lord shiva Itself, Who is called rudra. Since rudra is a form of the Lord, rudra is considered as Lord shiva Itself. Ok, so far only one part of the question is answered. Agreed, the importance of the act of reduction (destruction). But when this Lord being one among the Trinity, how can this Lord be considered the Supreme ? Let us take an example of a small shop. The owner employs a few skilled people to do the regular work and at peak hours or at critical periods, he/she also takes some important work and executes it. Now that individual wears two caps. One as the owner of the shop and other as the worker in the shop, but the individual is the same irrespective of whether he /she is acting as the owner or as a worker. Nobody questions his/her ownership because he/she shares the work load with the others in the shop. The same way though the Supreme Lord shiva is beyond the five deeds, It also takes roles in the critical deeds assuming a form specific to that role. So though Lord shiva gets associated with one of the three in the Trinity, He is the Supreme Itself. A point to note here is that it is not just these three actions, but there are totally five deeds which are the acts of/on behalf of the Supreme. These five activities referred to as panycha kR^ityam are creation, sustenance, reduction, illusioning and blessing. The holy masters for these five activities are braHma, viShNu, rudra, maheshwara, sadAshiva respectively. Of these the later three are nothing but the forms of the Supreme shiva (called parashivA). So to conclude Lord Shiva is the Supreme, Who assumes various critical roles and assumes appropriate names and forms, and also stands transcending all these.
[FairfieldLife] Rearranged letters in words - typical TM-speak trick.
For example, if we rearrange the letters in MMY's favorite word: Being (b-e-i-n-g), we get Geibn - which, as everybody knows, is a Kling-On word denoting one's satiation after drinking a hearty draft of blood wine. Here are more rearrangements: DORMITORY: When you rearrange the letters: DIRTY ROOM PRESBYTERIAN: When you rearrange the letters: BEST IN PRAYER ASTRONOMER: When you rearrange the letters: MOON STARER DESPERATION: When you rearrange the letters: A ROPE ENDS IT THE EYES:! When you rearrange the letters: THEY SEE GEORGE BUSH: When you rearrange the letters: HE BUGS GORE THE MORSE CODE: When you rearrange the letters: HERE COME DOTS SLOT MACHINES: When you rearrange the letters: CASH LOST IN ME ANIMOSITY: When you rearrange the letters: IS NO AMITY ELECTION RESULTS: When you rearrange the letters: LIES - LET'S RECOUNT SNOOZE ALARMS: When you rearrange the letters: ALAS! NO MORE Z 'S A DECIMAL POINT: When you rearrange the letters: IM A DOT IN PLACE THE EARTHQUAKES: When you rearrange the letters: THAT QUEER SHAKE ELEVEN PLUS TWO: When you rearrange the letters: TWELVE PLUS ONE AND FOR THE GRAND FINALE: MOTHER-IN-LAW: When you rearrange the letters: WOMAN HITLER
[FairfieldLife] flax hull lignans
http://www.proliberty.com/observer/20040408.htm Driving cancer cells to mass suicide A survivor's tale: concentrated flax hull lignans beat back cancer for 'hopeless' cases. If its power against cancer isn't enought, that's just the start.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Einstein letter: Belief in God childish
--From the Buddhist magazine Tricycle (but original source unknown). Einstein says I'm no Einstein. Sorry - wrong quote. Einstein said: Buddism has the characteristics of what would be expected in a cosmic religion for the future: It transcends a personal God, avoids dogmas and theology; it covers both the natural and spiritual; and it is based on a religious sense aspiring from the experience of all things, natural and spiritual, as a meaningful unity. Sounds suspiciously like something a Buddhist Magazine would make up on their own; but so far I have been unable to confirm the authenticity of the quote, as to source. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Hugo richardhughes103@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: On May 13, 2008, at 1:13 PM, Richard M wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajradhatu@ wrote: Albert Einstein described belief in God as childish superstition Einstein also wrote: In view of such harmony in the cosmos which I, with my limited human understanding, am able to recognize, there are yet people who say there is no God. But what really makes me angry is that they quote me for the support of such views. That's not you, Vaj, by any chance? No, I'm just commenting on the recently discovered remarks made late in his life. Unless it was written after the recent quote, I'll assume his later remarks in this letter supercede the one above. Can I ask a simple question? What the FUCK does it matter whether one intellectual guy whose theoretical work in physics had lamentably practical applications believed in God or not? Does what he believed affect any of you one way or another? Not actually *affected* but very interested because Einstein had a very deep insight into the nature of things, though not as much as the quantum physicists of his day, and consequently if he thought there was a god hiding anywhere he would have had a seriously good practical reason for thinking so. And? I'm not trying to argue with you...I hope you understand that. I'm just posing that question: And? What he believed about the existence or non-existence of God has no relationship to the existence or non-existence of God. Wouldn't relying on *his* judgment on this question as some kind of authority from the point of view of science be essentially the same thing as relying on the judgment of some supposed holy man in the past as being some kind of authority from the point of view of religion or spirituality? Bottom line was that Albert Einstein was just a guy. Buddha was just a guy. Shankara was just a guy. Put everything they believed about the existence or non-existence of God into a hat, shake it, and you still have what three guys thought about the existence or non-existence of God. As it turns out, one of these guys seemed to have believed in a God, one definitely did not, and the third walked the line and refused to commit one way or another. But even if all three had agreed, what affect would that have on the world? Why would what they believed have any more credence than what anyone else believes? You bring up quantum physics. Ok, give each of these three guys an electron microscope and have them describe for you the position of a single electron around the nucleus of an atom. According to quantum physics, each of them would give you a different answer. And each of them would be *right*, because for them the electron really IS where they perceive it to be. It is ALSO in no position at all, and exists only as a set of probabil- ities and potentials. Isn't it possible that the issue of the existence or non-existence of God is a similar conundrum? As far as I can tell, NONE of these three guys was an authority on anything but their own perceptions of the universe and what sense they'd managed to assign to those percep- tions. None of them knew the truth because the truth is as elusive as that electron; it can't be pinned down, and it exists only moment- arily, when perceived by a sentient being. And it is a *different* truth for every sentient being. Call me weird, but I find inspiration and uplift- ment in this concept, not any kind of challenge.
[FairfieldLife] Dalai Lama on Rainbow Light Body and Samsara
Dalai Lama Quote of the Week A tantric yogi who has gained control of the subtle energies of the body and the subtle levels of consciousness will have control over the inner and outer elements and consequently can transform his or her ordinary samsaric form into a joyous rainbow body. But until we can do this, we have to accept the fact that our physical basis is a magnet attracting every kind of discomfort and pain. ...This samsaric body keeps us running all of our lives. We have to run to fulfill its endless needs, to keep it away from things that may harm it, and to protect it from anything unpleasant. We have to give it pleasure and comfort. We become ordained, and at first this is very satisfactory; but soon our body makes it so difficult for us that we think our practice would be less disturbed if we were to live as a layperson. So we give up and return to ordinary life; but then we end up with a family to support, leaving us with no time or energy for meditation. We have the pressing tasks of feeding, clothing, and sheltering our children, and of arranging their education and so forth. Our lives are spent alternating between work and worry, with occasional short periods of pleasure, and then we have to die; but even this we cannot do in peace, for, when we lie down to die, our last thoughts are worried ones concerning the family we are leaving behind. Such is the nature of worldly existence. ...To care for our old people--these ones who have given us our body, our life, and our culture--is a sacred duty of humanity. But most humans act more like animals than people, and often we see old people who have been abandoned by their families. Family units were very strong in Tibet, and old people were usually cared for directly by relatives. The national care for the old that we see in the West is something very good, a healthy sign, although perhaps here the spiritual and psychological basis is somewhat lacking. The suffering of old age is something we all must face, unless we die prematurely. There is nothing we can do about it. Gone will be that false sense of personal ability and strength that made us so proud when we were young. Instead, helpers or friends will bathe us, dress us, spoonfeed us, and have to take us to the toilet. Rather than live under the delusion of permanence, we should engage in spiritual training so that we can enter old age at least with the grace of wisdom. ...So we can see that this body indeed causes us much grief in this life and, sadly, in their quest to satisfy its many needs, most people just collect an endless stream of negative karmic instincts that will lead them to lower rebirths in the future. These are the sufferings of the human world. ...The important point here is to become aware of the third type of suffering, the subtle suffering that pervades all imperfect existence, the all-pervading misery concomitant with having a perishable, samsaric base [All are] enmeshed in suffering because the nature of their body and mind is bound with compulsive cyclic processes. Until we develop the wisdom that is able to free the mind from these compelling forces, there is no doubt that we shall experience suffering throughout our lives, and that we shall continue to wander endlessly in the wheel of birth, life, death, and rebirth where the presence of misery can always be felt. --from The Path to Enlightenment by H.H. the Dalai Lama, edited and translated by Glenn H. Mullin, published by Snow Lion Publications
[FairfieldLife] Re: Caste (Was Guru Dev really Santa? )
--Yet, you're on the Spiritual Path (or not?). If so, and you're not just hanging out on this forum to shoot the breeze; I recommend the following: contact http://www.arunachala.org and get 1. the DVD Sage of Arunachala. View it for 10 min per day. Then get the following CD audios: 2. Veda Parayana, Evening (which has the Rudram). 3. Arunachala Stuti Panchakam. Then from the SYDA bookstore, get the Guru Gita video of Swami Chidvilisananda. (I have the VHS. Check out the website if they also have a DVD). Then 4. get the CD of Swami Muktananda chanting the Guru Gita. Play the foregoing media items regularly for one month and report back on the results. Since your mind will be occupied with powerful sources of Shakti, you'll forget that you are meditating silently. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ruthsimplicity [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: snip Ruth: So off your very interesting topic, so you might want to start a new topic if you respond, but how is the practice going? Is it the same as it ever was? I tried going back for a bit, but I was too twitchy to stay with it. Me: Thanks for asking. Hardly worth a new topic. I'm just like dozens of guys I taught back in the day who enjoyed meditating but didn't buy into any of the beliefs. (I used to feel sooo superior to guys like me then!) I started out last year, inspired by Sam Harris's call for a secular approach to meditation as a way of self inquiry. It made me wonder how much the belief effected the experience. I started just sitting without the mantra, which seems too long and cumbersome at first. I found that I really enjoyed the experience, it reminded me of how I used to feel in the silence after program before I opened my eyes. So the state I remember came back right away and it reconnected me with a part of my past. My regular TM practice coincided with Maharishi's death with so much time reminiscing about my years immersed in it all. I was catching a nice nostalgia buzz as well as a chance to process who Maharishi had been in my life. It seemed fitting to meditate as I considered his life in detail. Then after sitting for my very open style of meditation for a while, my old mantra started up after 18 years, the whole damn long ass thing. I was actually trying to avoid doing TM as an experiment, but I had spent too many years with that process so it seemed silly to resist what seems to be my style of meditation from Maharishi. I can't say it is any better than what I was doing without the mantra, but it isn't optional, so I am dare I say it, taking it as it comes. I kind of enjoyed the idea of doing my retro Beatles approved groovy old TM! I didn't stop 18 years ago because I didn't have good experiences with TM, I stopped because I thought Maharishi was wrong about the whole belief system around it. That is still where I am with the beliefs. I don't believe in stress release, or expansion of consciousness or even cumulative benifits really. I just enjoy the state itself and I do like how I feel afterwards. I think it must dump endorphins because I am back to the expansive enjoyable states of mind along with the usual thoughts mantra cycle. I can't imagine doing the sidhis again and would be really reluctant to devote any more time to this project. But it is like a well worn pair of shoes, and I am enjoying knocking around in them again. I think the long program was too much of a good thing for me which is why I avoided meditation all these years. I am not a fan of too much dissociation and that is a real issue with long programs IMO. As it is, I do feel the slight separateness from my thinking process is a thinking enhancement. I feel some of the benifits of meditation I used to crow so much about. I am looking back at the phrases Maharishi used to describe the experiences and my jury is not in on how I feel about his metaphors now. It took me a while to get over the oversell factor IMO. Thanks for letting me ramble. Did you ever round? I rounded for years and that may be why it is so easy for me to slip back into the practice without a checking, but you might consider it if you cared to try again. It may be a skill you can lose and you might need a reminder of the process. On the other hand passive relaxation is not for everyone so meditation just may not be for you. Did you used to enjoy it? I loved it from day one and couldn't get enough which became my downfall! (I hope someone else here is savoring the delicious irony of me recommending checking! But I think Maharishi was an excellent meditation teacher so I wouldn't rule it out if you know someone) It feels nice to not shut out meditation as an option for my life. I
[FairfieldLife] Candidates compared
Allegedly from a Dutch newspaper: We in Holland cannot figure out why you are even bothering to hold an election. On one side you have a lawyer married to a lawyer and another lawyer who is married to a lawyer. Yet on the other side, you have a true war hero married to a woman with a huge chest who owns a beer distributorship. Is there really a contest here?
[FairfieldLife] I Am a Strange Loop
In Hofstadter's POV, a person's existence existence is an endless loop. A defining event - some years ago - was the unfortunate death of his young daughter. Hofstadter seems to have difficulty grappling with her departure. He states that the entity that made up his Daughter's persona is a collection of experiences that he can currently tune into. Therefore, from his materialist POV, she's still present somehow. There's no room at all for a Transcendent Reality in his worldview. But of course, one can grok the Transcendent without believing in an afterlife state; and visa versa. Here's a synopsis.: [note: by consciousness Hofstadter admits that people are consciousness, but there's no room for Being (per MMY's definition) outside of the body/mind and especially the endless loop of thoughts. StoryCode says: click here to see more stories like this one. Synopsis:This is Douglas R Hofstadter's long-awaited return to the themes of Godel, Escher, Bach - an original and controversial view of the nature of consciousness and identity. Why do we say I? Can thought arise out of matter? By thought we mean not mere calculation, the manipulation of algorithms and patterns according to fixed rules, but something deeper: experience, self-awareness, consciousness. I Am a Strange Loop argues that the key to understanding the level on which consciousness operates is the feedback loop. After introducing the reader to simple feedback systems like a flush toilet, the ever-popular thermostat and his own experiments with a video camera pointed at its own monitor, he Hofstadter turns to the idea of strange loops - feedback loops, which exist on two levels of meaning, a theory, which Kurt Godel employed in the mathematical statements constructed for his famous Incompleteness Theorem. Like Godel's logical statements, the brain also exists on at least two levels: a deterministic level of atoms and neurons, and a higher level of large mental structures we call symbols. One of these symbols, perhaps the central one which relates to all others in our minds, is the strange loop we call I. By the time we reach adulthood, Hofstadter writes, I is an endless hall of mirrors, encompassing everything that has ever happened to us, vast numbers of counterfactual replays of important episodes in our lives, invented memories and expectations. But is it real? And if so, what does it consist of? Douglas Hofstadter's first book-length essay on a scientific subject since Godel, Escher, Bach, I Am a Strange Loop is a journey to the cutting edge of ideas about consciousness - a bold and provocative argument that is informed by the author's unique verbal whimsy and eye for the telling example. Compulsively readable and endlessly thought-provoking, this is the book Hofstadter's many readers have been waiting for.
[FairfieldLife] Realizing the dharmakaya of the Buddha
Once we realize emptiness, all phenomena are included within this reality, which is not separate from the cause and effect of karma and which is free of mental constructs. On this ultimate level of realization, it is possible to state that there is no wholesome or unwholesome action. When we have realized the nature of all phenomena, negative actions naturally subside and positive ones are spontaneously accomplished. Until this time, however, we would be slipping into nihilism if we said that the phenomena of relative truth, such as positive and negative actions or karma, do not exist. Just knowing this authentic view, however, is not enough. For others to be able to experience it, we must also know the scriptures and reasonings so that we can teach. Without the support of this knowledge, it will be difficult for others to trust what we say, and so Milarepa speaks of scripture and reasoning as an adornment to realization. Dissolving thoughts into the dharmakaya-- Is this not meditation naturally arising? Join it with experience To make it beautifully adorned. One way to understand meditation is to see it as a practice of working with the many thoughts that arise in our mind. With realization they arise as mere appearances of the dharmakaya, the natural arising of mind's essential nature. Being clear about this true nature of thought is called attaining the level of natural arising. At this point, there is no difference in any thought that may arise, because we see the nature of each thought to be emptiness, arising as the dharmakaya. Meditation could be defined as realizing the dharmakaya of the Buddha. --from Music in the Sky: The Life, Art Teachings of the 17th Karmapa Ogyen Trinley Dorje by Michele Martin, published by Snow Lion Publications
[FairfieldLife] factoids about India
http://www.theonion.com/content/atlas/
[FairfieldLife] Re: Fate of the liberated person according to Siva Advaita
-- Right!...besides, the following statement is made from the MIND's perspective: Yes, completely true from the MIND'S perspective - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- do.rflex [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, matrixmonitor matrixmonitor@ wrote: from the HT website on the 6 schools of Saivism: Note - this type of continuation of the liberated individual contradicts certain statements of MMY and/or his TMO TB: Upon death, the liberated soul goes to Siva along the path of the Gods, without return to earthly existence. The individual soul continues to exist in the spiritual plane, enjoying the bliss of knowing all as Siva, enjoying all experiences and powers, except that of creation of the universe. Ultimately, the soul does not become perfectly one with Brahman (or Siva), but shares with Brahman all excellent qualities. Man is responsible, free to act as he wills to, for Siva only fulfills needs according to the soul's karma. Shrikantha wrote in Brahma Sutra Bhashya, Siva associates Himself with the triple energies [knowledge, will and action], enters into the total agglomerate of effects, and emerges as the universe, comprising the triad of Deities [Vishnu, Brahma and Rudra]. Who can comprehend the greatness of Siva, the All-Powerful and the All-Knowing? Indeed. I've always thought that 'ker-plunk, the drop disappears and becomes the attributeless undifferentiated ocean', was not much to look forward to at all. If that was all there was to it, why bother in the first place. I just don't understand those who somehow think it's a desirable idea. Yes, completely true from the MIND'S perspective. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!'Yahoo! Groups Links mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] __ __ Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
[FairfieldLife] Re: WWF Title Match -- Shakti vs. Nirvikalpa Samadhi
---Right! My Kriya Yoga Guru (Swami Satyeswarananda Giri of the Himalayas) says in essence, that controlled out of body travel as a Kriya or Siddhi is basically like frosting on the cake. But he didn't say where he travels to. Another Guru of mine, Madhusadandas (died at 115 years of age) gave a demonstration of controlled out of body travel in 1976 at the East- West Cultural Center in LA. (btw - I have every reason to believe that he was in Brahman Consciousness already - so as you say, there's no more advancement in that department). Anyway, he sat in a lotus posture in front of the audience and hyperventilated for about 45 sec. Then he fell over virtually flat on his face as if dead. He appeared to be dead for 20 minutes then gradually regained outer awareness. He stated that he was conversing with Yogananda while out of the body. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, endlessrainintoapapercup endlessrainintoapapercup@ wrote: And what about the levels of nirvikalpa samadhi? Is it traditionally described as having deeper depths than one might initially experience? Personally, I have never experienced anyone spending too much time discussing states beyond nirvikalpa samadhi, because accord- ing to the definitions they use, there is no more to be done after it becomes estab- lished 24/7. There may, in fact, be many places to go and things to be seen after the realization of nirvikalpa samadhi, but I haven't heard those referred to as greater attainments, more like entertainment. The person in full- time nirvikalpa samadhi just gets to enjoy more and more aspects of life. And IS there more than what we conceive of from the POV of dualistic non-realization of nirvikalpa samadhi? I suspect there is. I suspect there are as many worlds and as many relative planes of existence as there are beings to imagine them, so the fun is only starting, and the learning continues. In the martial arts traditions I studied, a common saying was that attaining a first degree black belt was equivalent to finally becoming a beginner who could be taken seriously. The person has done the work necessary to prove that he or she was trustworthy enough to learn the really tech-y stuff that leads to greater expertise and higher belt ranks. In those schools, the highest belt rank was tenth-degree black belt, and I met a few of them. Without exception, ALL of them referred to themselves as beginners, just *starting* to get a handle on the art they practiced. I suspect that human evolution is a lot like that, that there is no end to it and no limits to what can be realized. I suspect that it's an endless process, not limited to this life- time, even after enlightenment. I suspect that although realizing and establishing nirvikalpa samadhi may be like winning the game, that the game goes into extra innings ANYWAY, and continues forever. :-) My own experience is described by the nirvikalpa samadhi descriptions, but I seemed to have just popped through the door, and there was definitely more, better, deeper, and beyond. Beyond, beyond, beyond the beyond... Just to continue rapping about something that is fun for me to rap about in my next-to-last post for the week, here's some of the continu- ation of that Wikipedia article I posted part of last night. I think it's *not bad*, given how Wikipedia is written and edited. Interspersed comments enclosed in brackets [...] are mine, just as if I were adding comments online in Wiki: * Entering samadhi in the beginning takes effort and holding on to a state of samadhi takes even more effort. [ This is dependent on the school of thought; some believe that holding on to nirvikalpa samadhi takes effort and intent, others do not. Still others don't think there is any value in ever trying to hold on to it, period. ] The beginning stages of samadhi (Laya and Savikalpa Samadhi) are only temporary. [ But way cool. ] By effort it is not meant that the mind has to work more. Instead, it means work to control the mind and release the self. Note that normal levels of meditation (mostly the lower levels) can be held automatically, as in being in the state of meditation rather than overtly meditating. [ A fine and subtle distinction this, one that many people don't get. ] The ability to obtain positive results from meditation is much more difficult than simply meditating. It is recommended to find a qualified spiritual master (guru or yogi) who can teach a meditator about the workings of the mind. [ This is the issue that Sandi Ego and sparaig and matrixmonitor seem to have some problems with. And I don't DENY their complaints. It would be a better world if all aspects of the liberation process could be learned and realized
[FairfieldLife] Re: monism = nondual
---Don't believe everything Vaj says!by any means. He's the King of Tomfoolery. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 21, 2008, at 1:52 AM, yifuxero wrote: Vaj would have us believe that a horse is really a zebra, and visa versa. Nope, Mr. Ed says a horse is a horse... From Wiki: (absolute monism). Hinduism Monism is found in the Nasadiya Sukta of the Rigveda, which speaks of the One being-non-being that 'breathed without breath'. The first system in Hinduism that clearly, unequivocally explicated absolute monism was that of Advaita (or nondualist) Vedanta (see Advaita Vedanta) as expounded by Adi Shankaracharya. It is part of the six Hindu systems of philosophy, based on the Upanishads, and posits that the ultimate monad is a formless, ineffable Divine Ground called Brahman. Such monistic thought also extends to other Hindu systems like Yoga and non-dualist Tantra. Kashmir Shaivism. Don't believe everything you read, esp. on the Wikipedia! Brahman is a vrtti.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Is Monogamy Required for Attaining Higher Levels of Consciousness?
-If by Catholic Church one means some secret version of the truth that only elitists know, one can conjure up any truth that appeals to us -say some weird Da Vinci secrets; or perhaps: only Mel Gibson knows the real truth about the Tridentine Mass. You tantalize and tease with such tidbits but offer only empty air. What's the truth here? Who conveyed it in an unbroken disciplic succession? I see no such succession from the Meister Eckhart. OTOH if you mean by The Catholic Church - the organization in Rome headed by the current Pope, as the former Grand Inquisitor his position on yoga is well known: Salvation is not an interior revelation, doesn't depend on Wisdom or Gnosis; but is an acceptance of one's dualist relationship with Jesus Christ who supposedly died on the cross for our sins and is based on faith and belief. Enlightenment is based on Transcendence of belief, not embracing a dogma. Basically, your're saying that the Pope's version of the Catholic Church's teachings is faulty and you know the real truth. OK, what's your evidence for this? - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Pope also excommunicated Galileo for finding the true nature of the planetary system. During Pope John Paul II tenure, the Catholic Church apologized to everyone for making a mistake--only about 500 years later. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander mailander111@ wrote: The Catholic Church offers several paths and recognized the phenomenon of enlightenment throughout its history. But they kept any techniques secret and behind monastery walls. In fact, if you even talked about enlightenment (as Eckhart did) you could get yourself excommunicated and burned at the stake. They are dead serious about not letting any such techniques out among the common folk even today. I taught at a Catholic college once and had the incredible experience of sitting in the dean's office in the late 20th c, defending my ass against the same questions Eckhart had to deal with from the Inquisition. They excommunicated him posthumously since he was too smart for them while he lived. They reinstated him early in hte 20th c. The college was so horrified by my views that they flew in a bishop from Chicago to give a college-wide lecture on how Eckhart's views are not to be favored in spite of that reinstatement. --- Patrick Gillam jpgillam@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, John wrote: It just appears to me that the accepted way to Realization, particularly among Christians, is to curb the urge for sexual indulgence. What Christian faiths offer a path to Realization, John? None I've encountered. My childhood church, the notably conservative Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod, considers enlightenment to be an impossible delusion. Hence the need for the external intervention of God. Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
[FairfieldLife] 10 myths about Gurus
from http://www.guruphiliac.blogspot.com Monday, April 04, 2005 Top Ten Myths About Gurus File under: Hagiographic Circus and The Great White Botherhood The pursuit of the truth has brought us to many strange and wonderful places, some of which were in the presence of persons considered divine because they are gurus. Around such people constellate clouds of occluding ideology about self-realization, despite the efforts of the guru, or because of them. We've compiled a list of the ten top occluding ideas people hold about their gurus or gurus in general, for your perusal: 10. Guruji knows what's best for you While we acknowledge the possibility that a real true guru could know what's best for you, s/he'd also know it's best to let you decide for yourself. Gurus who pretend to know what's best for all their devotees are fooling themselves as much as they are their disciples. 9. Guruji can read your mind Did you ever wonder why people seem so sanctimonious while in the presence of their guru, besides kissing ass by acting joyous or pious. They probably believe that their guru is reading their mind, and all the minds of the devotees in their presence. Or even those not in their presence. The fact is that self-realization confers no special power to read minds, despite the assertions of Patanjali and the Theosophists. There may be some gurus who seem to have a knack for coincidental occurrence, but no more than other people with the same knack. 8. Guruji doesn't feel pain We were going to suggest cutting off a guru's arm to see if s/he feels pain, but then we realized the shock of the trauma would probably just shut off the pain response. Believe us, gurus feel pain. They may know varying levels of emotional pain as well. 7. Guruji knows all your past lives More theosophical nonsense. Not that there aren't past lives, and not that they can't be known, but they can't be watched like a movie by a person with the right siddhi. They may see something they believe are your past lives, but it's much more likely to be something made up in their head in the moment, whether they believe it to be the truth or know that it isn't. 6. Guruji knows your future See number 1. No special powers outside of knowing the truth of self- realization are conferred by self-realization. 5. Guruji knows everything One of the major occluding expectations about self-realization is the idea that knowing yourself as the whole entails access to all the information in the whole. In truth, self-realization confers just one kind of special knowledge that only knows itself. There is no content there. That's why they call it emptiness. So anything your guru knows s/he knows because they heard it or read it. 4. Guruji has no desires This is based in the most pervasive of the occluding expectations, that desire somehow prevents self-realization. Desire is merely the way the body responds to conditions. The guru may (or may not) be over sex, but when they want a Twinkie, they go get a Twinkie. 3. Guruji is the avatar A guru proclaiming themselves to be the living avatar is like the Mission Impossible tape proclaiming it will self-destruct in ten seconds. 2. Guruji is divine Sure, and so is every other person on the planet, regardless of their spiritual status. Knowing who you really are doesn't change who you've always been in this life. It just adds the knowledge that we are all of the same, one being. Anything else is just publicist bullshit. 1. Guruji can enlighten with a touch You can have enlightenment in the presence of your guru, but it wasn't because s/he touched you. Transmission or shaktipat gurus merely tap into the power of mind by way of a ruse, the idea that they are God and can do such things. That ruse sometimes captures the mind of the guru just as much as that of the devotees, so they aren't all to be blamed for the subterfuge. posted by jody @ 7:32 PM 41 Comments: At 4/06/2005 4:37 PM, Anonymous said... While it's only a stretch to conclude what is, it's the height of arrogance to conclude what isn't. Sincerely At 4/06/2005 4:45 PM, Anonymous said... so jody, you're saying that you can see from one end of reality to the other and can enumerate what's there and what isn't? I call bullshit on that. 005 4:48 PM, jody said... Show me a positive demonstration of any of the myths I've presented, and I'll post a retraction. If it doesn't happen in the real world, it don't happen in the guru world. It's straight up magical thinking. There are medicines you can take for that now. At 4/06/2005 4:56 PM, Anonymous said... Q: How do you tell the difference between the
[FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience
--Precisely, Edg! IMO some misconceptions regarding Samadhi have crept into our history of what the experience is all about, due to some statements of Ramakrishna (1836-1886) regarding going into Samadhi - in which he was temporarily oblivious to the outer world, but had an inner awareness of Pure Consciousness coupled with (perhaps) some memories of inner visions. To a degree, MMY has made some headway in setting the record straight; along with Buddhism as a whole. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Since the Absolute is always there, the experience of a blackout is, er, go figure, AN EXPERIENCE OF THE ABSOLUTE. Since no memory can be dredged up about the experience, it could only be the Absolute that was present. Get that? Nothing is what was experienced. No thing. Not even awareness, not even amness. Sorry to tell ya TBs and bliss seekers, but that's the actual real deal bottomline goal of goals. Consult your local Buddhist about the void. It is that no-thingness that will be discovered to be the only identity one has ever had. The rest is a dross of verbiage floating on the illusion of consciousness. Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, endlessrainintoapapercup endlessrainintoapapercup@ wrote: Kirk said: Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. What exactly causes these alleged blocks? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk kirk_bernhardt@ wrote: That vampired look I have determined comes from squeezing the eyes shut for many hours a day which gives a person bruises under their eyes (dark circles) and also from the lack of sunlight. I used to look like that from rounding. Most people do at some point. - Original Message - From: Vaj To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:26 AM Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Your replies to my inquiries about TM technique and experience On Mar 11, 2008, at 12:56 AM, endlessrainintoapapercup wrote: I don't know what type of experience you are talking about, matrixmonitor...I'm only addressing the issue of conscious transcendence. If transcendence isn't conscious, how can anyone say with any certainty that it exists? My words about deeper states of meditative absorption were not intended to reflect TM-teach. I was just acknowledging that the experience I described, of pure consciousness beyond form, is just the beginning of culturing deeper and deeper meditative states. TM may not acknowledge them, but other meditation traditions do. My original question was simply whether TM produces conscious transcendence for others, as it doesn't seem to do so for me. Until you're centered and fully transcended at the level of the makara-bindu and open the eye of knowledge, the third eye as the TM puja mentions, most TMers will just languish in a laya-samadhi. The techniques to actually awaken awareness there aren't taught in TM, so unless you're somehow predisposed to awaken so highly, it just doesn't happen. Some yogis have noted TMers--esp. TM-Sidhi practitioners have blocks in their nervous system (actually their pranic bodies) that can prevent such full awakening. Rounding continuously for decades in a laya can't be a good thing. But if you've ever met the sickly Purusha's of the TMO and the resultant distorted personality types, one does start to wonder how healthy it is. Some of these guys looks like they were vampirized for years. It's also probably why TM doesn't make the brain very coherent at all like as is seen in deep meditation/samadhi.
[FairfieldLife] Re: From a recertified Governor
--Be careful in dealing with this Serb. He could be a member of the Black Hand. From Wiki: Black Hand (Serbian: Öðíà ðóêà / Crna Ruka), officially Unification or Death (Serbian: Ó¼åäèåå èëè ñìðò / Ujedinjenje ili smrt), was a secret society founded in Serbia in May 1911[1][2], as part of the Pan-Slavism nationalist movement, with the intention of uniting all of the territories containing South Slav populations (Serbs, Croats, Macedonians, Slovenes, etc) annexed by Austria-Hungary[3]. This society's possible connections to the June 28, 1914 assassination in Sarajevo of Franz Ferdinand, Archduke of Austria is considered to have been the main catalyst to the start of World War I. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Sal Sunshine Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2008 7:12 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] From a recertified Governor On Mar 11, 2008, at 5:40 PM, Rick Archer wrote: n the meantime, I've been following the thread on John Konhaus' email responses to the Serb's emails, and the truth of this interchange is very important to me because it speaks volumes concerning whether or not I can continue being an active part of any organization under such leaders. As I see it, the truth of this whole Konhaus/Serb interchange would be revealed if the Serb could post the complete, unaltered email messages between himself and supposedly Konhaus. The Serb--LOL. Geez, Rick, I don't blame this guy for wanting to keep his identity secret. Is he for real? Yes. He emailed me with his real name, but wants to remain anonymous, for obvious reasons. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.518 / Virus Database: 269.21.7/1325 - Release Date: 3/11/2008 1:41 PM
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Gita
---from http://www.syda.org in S. Fallsburg, NY; the HQ of SYDA. I just sent away this morning for a video of Swami Muktananda chanting the Guru Gita, as well as an audio CD. I have the small booklet in front of me. Comes in a book with larger pages also.Comes in a larger book size also. Transliteration starts out: Om. Lord Sadasiva is the seer of the mantras of this hymn, Shri Guru Gita Its verse patterns are diverse. The Guru, the Supreme Self, is its deity. Ham is its seed leter, sah its power, and drom its nail. The purpose of repeating it is to win the Guru's grace. The Guru, who dwells in the lotus surrounded by the divine petals ham and sahy, which reside in all beings and are the cause of the world, manifested the world in his own way and of his own free will. Meditate on the Guru, who revealt That, who is the expressionof teh shambhava state (Shivahood), who illumines like the flame of a lamp, who is eternal and all-pervasie, and who is a visible form of all letters. I repeat the Guru Gita to realize the four goals of life (dharma, righteousness; artha, wealth; kama, pleasure; moksha, libration). Suta said: On the beautiful summit of Mount Kailasa, Parvati, having bowed with reverence to Lord Shiva, who is the master of uniting one with devotion, asked: The Goddess said: Om. Salutations, O God, O lord of gods, O higher than the highest, O teacher of the universe, O benevolent one, O great God initiate me into the nowledge of the Guru. O Lord, by which path can an embodied Soul become one with Brahman (absolute reality)? Have compassion on me, O Lord! I bow to your feet. [then, the rest of the Guru Gita is Shiva's reply]...which amounts to devotion to the Guru and repeating the Guru Gita. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, suziezuzie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Can someone recommend a good version of the Guru Gita?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Description of mantra?? : D
--Dear Surya: What evidence do you have of an unbroken chain of Enlightened people in Judaism and/or Christianity? Thanks. Kindly supply some names. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mahamuni Das [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: How do you know that there is no unbroken lineage chain in Judiasm or one of its later sects named Christianity? Just because it is not completely public? There certainly are traceable lineages in Jewish Mysticism that are on the more public side. I believe the same would go for Christianity. How do you judge enlightenment? Does each disciple in the chain have to be fully enlightened, in order to pass on the lineage Shakti? JAI AMMA! Surya
[FairfieldLife] Re: The Chopra Letter
--Right, but being En. doesn't automatically imply good judgement. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, lurkernomore20002000 steve.sundur@ wrote: authfriend jstein@ wrote: ...As I was told, the meeting between Maharishi and Chopra was very strained. Maharishi was grim and Chopra was insistent. Chopra made his case by saying I am an intelligent human being and I see that what these people under you are doing is wrong. I can not any longer participate in this without you doing something about it. And Maharishi told him, I am your master. You will do what I say. Chopra said, I cannot accept that you refuse to see the reckless behaviour of these people. Maharishi repeated, I am your master. You will do what I say. Chopra looked at him and said, You are not my master. I am my own master. And he walked out of the room. Hadn't heard this. This makes sense. Thing is, Chopra decided that he had better judgement than MMY and could do more. Which is certainly his choice, but raises an interesting question: if he really thought that MMY was enlightened, as he now claims, why would he assume his judgemnt was better than MMY's? At the least, it would have made more sense for him to stick around, and work *within*the enlightened man's organization then to leave the only person on Earth he was certain was enlightened (to quote one of his articles about MMY). Lawson
[FairfieldLife] a flaw in Neo-Advaita
Per http://www.spiritualteachers.org website, the origins of Neo- Advaita may traced to to certain misinterpretations of Shankara; with some allegiance to the more nihilistic-oriented teachings and/or comments of Ramana Maharshi and Nisargadatta Maharaj. A key point of most Neo-Advaitins (Ramesh Balsekar, Eckart Tolle, Byron Katie, Gangaji, Andrew Cohen**...etc) is that one should constantly question one's beliefs: an assertion obviously contrary to MMY's approach. A quote from Nisargadatta Maharaj: I offer to you the following dialog from Nisargadatta Maharaj... Nisargadatta: To go beyond the mind, you must have your mind in perfect order. You cannot leave a mess behind and go beyond. He who seeks Liberation must examine his mind by his own efforts, and once the mind is purified by such introspection Liberation is obtained and appears obvious and natural. Q: Then why are sadhanas prescribed? Nisargadatta: Freedom to do what one likes is really bondage, while being free to do what one must, what is right, is real freedom. Q: How can the absolute be the result of a process? Nisargadatta: You are right, the relative cannot result in the absolute. But the relative can block the absolute, just as the non- churning of the cream may prevent butter from separating. It is the real that creates the urge; the inner prompts the outer and the outer responds in interest and effort. You seem to want instant insight, forgetting that the instant is always preceded by a long preparation. The fruit falls suddenly, but the ripening takes time. The way to truth lies through the destruction of the false. To destroy the false, you must question your most inveterate beliefs. ** on Cohen, though he's in the Neo-Advaitin category (being a former disciple of HWL Poonja - the most notorious Father of Neo-Advaitins), Cohen has (along with Wilber) subscripted to a more progressive orientation called Evolutionary Consciousness. The problem is that he hasn't come up with anything really new! My POV: as hinted at in the website, Neo-Advaitin-ism is a type of shell-game...for losers and easy marks. Learn about it but don't get sucked into it. t get.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Description of mantra?? : D
--- Cherry-picking statements as well as looking at the whole can be of value, depending upon one's intentions. For example, if one says: The Bible is the Inerrant Word of God, cherry-picking even a single obviously errant (misguided, a-dharmic) statement can disprove the premise. If we collect a few hundred statements unbecoming of a God-like Entity, then something's fishy, is it not? In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Stu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Finally: I am not familiar just off the top of my tired brain what part of Genesis talks about selling your daughter into sexual slavery. Can you quote the chapter/lines? Best regards, Fred [anip] Life is too short to go through and transcribe stuff out of the OT. I seem to remember it came either when Lot or Noah had some travelers over to his house and he offered up his daughter for their pleasure. Here is a quote in the same tone. I hope it will be as helpful to you as it has been to me. I just never know what to do with my slaves: Exodus Chapter 21, verse 1: Now these are the ordinances which you shall set before them. When you buy a Hebrew slave, he shall serve six years, and in the seventh he shall go out free, for nothing. If he comes in single, he shall go out single; if he comes in married, then his wife shall go out with him. If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the wife and her children shall be her master's and he shall go out alone. But if the slave plainly says, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children; I will not go out free,' then his master shall bring him to God, and he shall bring him to the door or the doorpost; and his master shall bore his ear through with an awl; and he shall serve him for life. I am so happy we have the OT because it tells us how to live morally. The trick is not to cherry pick g-d's word that would be making our own moral distinctions. Better to take it as a whole. s.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Selfless Service --- and Breaking the Link Between Fruit and Action
---The traditional expectation angle doesn't make much sense in terms of the obvious economic laws. The bottom line: get results or you're outta here. Expectation is an ingrained behavior prevalent in all evolutionary pathways of sufficiently advanced organisms. Can you feature a mountain lion chasing a coyote without expectation of results? In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: WHY I don't agree is because of the real nature of selfless service. It FREES you from having too much attachment to any *expectations* regarding the service performed. You do something nice for someone, or for some charity or group you care about, and you do it because it feels good JUST to do it. You don't need to believe that doing this good work is going to change the world; you just do the work. And the cool part of all this is that if the good work DOESN'T change the world, you don't feel that you have to bitch and moan and claim that your time was wasted An excellent point. It sparks in my mind part of the explanation for MMY's crazy project binges. They are not so crazy if MMY was doing, among other things, the following three things -- which I am certain he was. He even said Hey! This is what I am doing... 1) breaking the link between fruit and action. Getting rid of the expectation. Pititful is the man who lives for the fruit of action... A Purusha, on a nice long beach walk told me of some the projects M had him and peers doing -- the buying huge old crumbling hotels, Blackstone, etc. He said doing such really breaks the above link. And an added part is that the project is begun with great haste, and urgency -- almost emergency -- its cast as the most important project in the world, and then after it got rolling and people got into it, M. would yank the rug out from under them, rip apart the act fruit link, by starting a new urgent project. 2) demonstrating the power of sankalpa -- what he explained in one of his last lectures (on MOU) that for a project, any big task, we can see the whole thing, like a flash IMO, at the beginning of the project. That lively glowing seed impulse. We don't see all of the small details because they are wrapped up in the seed. But we can feel the whole thing, see it in our minds eye, we get it. This sankalpa, this seed, is precious and nurturing it brings the whole thing to fruition easily. (not that we are living for that fruit.) This is what he taught the rajas to do, he said. This is the administering in silence. And M was a machine gun firing a massive barrage of sankalpa golden bullets -- every hour of everyday. Well begun is half done. Just acknowledging and seeing the sankalpa as it arises is the begun part. Well begun. He planted all of these seeds. The next 3-4 generations of rajas have the opportunity to nurture each of those old crazy projects. If done, it would be amazing if all of those seeds sprouted and matured into huge trees. M was the Johnny Appleseed of spiritual transformation. 3) expansive thinking. Related to 2) above, but goes to the style of thinking. Letting your mind and imagine soar with no limits. Like a child is apt to do, but doing this in an adult mind. He would say to a small group, just keep your mind going with mine. Go with his flow as his imagination and mind soar to vast heights and depths. an Anything is possibly spirit. Doing such breaks the boundaries of the mind. Take these three things together (and perhaps a few others) and M's constant crazy project binges make sense, IMO, and puts it all in context. Seen in this light, his binges were a most wonderful and creative dance over 40 years. And a wonderful path for some who could keep up and withstand the craziness -- and enjoy inner fruit of the whole crazy exercise.
[FairfieldLife] Re: A short list of my grievances with the movement
---No, not a big leap from our perspective; but the Pope would disagree. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, abutilon108 abutilon108@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: Again, though, the circuit is within one's own consciousness, not a circuit between one's consciousness and something external (at least in the esoteric TM context). About this reply -- Most religions, or at least people's understanding of them, are based on something external to oneself which one is in relationship with. How could anyone who follows a religion embrace the above idea? Christianity, for one, is big on the notion of having God in one's heart. Many religious people have that type of experience. Even Maharishi, in the Gita, says it is a sin against God to argue over the principle of difference (between God and oneself, as opposed to perfect Unity with God). He says it is to be decided by oneself and God when one has reached the stage of Unity consciousness. It seems this argument won't work to convince many people who are invested in a religion that the mantras do not have any implication for their religious convictions. I think it's more a matter of experience than intellectual understanding, though. And in any case, it isn't experience of the mantra but experience of the transcendent that would be germane in this context. The mantra is a vehicle to *get to God* in one's consciousness, by going beyond the world of boundaries and differentiation, including even the mantra. The Western monotheistic religions all have the concept of God being beyond space and time, so I don't think it's all that big a leap.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Before TM
--By the same token, from a Chinese POV, Tibet was in the grip of rulership by religious feudal lords who kept the populace in bondage to a midieval way of life. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes you can still see the effects of that slaughter which removed intelligence from the gene pool. We do our dumbing down differently over here. - Original Message From: lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, February 1, 2008 6:07:45 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Before TM matrixmonitor@ ... wrote: snip . ... Old Mayo was also well versed in China's ancient wisdom that had been handed down from generation to generation. Ron passed many evenings in the company of such wise men, eagerly absorbing their words ... Matrix, you bring up a very important point, and one that has been overlooked by most historians. It is the issue of Old Mayo, and the role Old Mayo played in one of the most regressive times in Chinese history. From the time of Marco Polo China was known for it's fine silks, and subtle and captivating art. And then along came Old Mayo. Tell me, tell me earnestly, what culture would not be adversely affected by Old Mayo. It is a blight that cannot be ignored, or easily overcome. It is no wonder that only now is China finally recovering from the hangover caused by Old Mayo Lord, we thank you, that our brothers and sisters in the Orient no longer must wear the yoke of oppression brought on by Old Mayo. And Lord please keep this affliction of Old Mayo away from your other children. Thank you Lord. Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: Request to change RIP Scott Girard thread title
--All true, shemp! For beginners, in the Sant Mat Tradition, there's a statement to the effect that their goal (what MMY calls GC) takes 3 lifetimes; not 5-7 years, or whatever. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: --- shempmcgurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer rick@ wrote: Mr. Archer et al, I tried to post to this thread last night but cannot find it. I may have done something wrong. Rather than attempt to re-write my memories of my friend Scott Girard from high school and college, I would like to simply repeat my request that, as there appears to be no adult supervision on this discussion group, perhaps all of you might take your little arguments about exercise and your vicious threats against each other to a different subject line in order to stop the disrespect you are bringing to the name of a good and gentle man. This is precisely the kind of childishness that would have upset Scott the most. Were he to have learned that so many people have time to criticize each other behind anonymous pen-names, he would have been saddened indeed. I am certain he would ask all of you to rise above it, to seek to spend your limited time here on more significant matters. And, above all, he would ask you to stop with the childish name-calling and meaningless physical threats. So, please, start a thread called To exercise or not or something like that and let poor Scott and his memory actually begin to rest in peace. Tim Rowan Colorado Springs Dear Mr. Rowan, By suggesting that our silly yet insignificant bickering on this forum is preventing Mr. Girard's soul from finding peace, you imply that he spent the better part of 30 years on a program -- called The Thousand-Headed Purusha Progarm -- that wasn't very effective. After all, if all that rounding and deep meditation and countless hours spent at the feet of his Master, Maharishi Mahesh Yogi, wasn't enough to create a barrier of invincibility to overcome our admittedly childish infighting then what exactly are YOU saying about the most important choice that Mr. Girard made during his lifetime? I would therefore humbly suggest, Mr. Rowan, that it YOU who is showing disrespect for the dearly departed by implying that he was both wasting his time and had bad judgement by choosing a spiritual path that didn't achieve the most basic results one would, at the very least, expect from more than three decades of devotion. Sincerely, The Reverend, Most Perfect Shemp McGurk Jesus, man. Cut Tim some slack. He's bothered that a thread about a great guy passing away devolved into a ridiculous series of posts about exercise without a thread name change. He's right. Obviously Tim knew Scott quite well and is simply asking for some respect for Scott. Why can't we take Tim's request to heart without the sarcastic nonsense and name calling? Please, nobody answer that question! It really irked me that he referred to Scott (someone I never heard of nor knew) as poor Scott. That really probably more insulting to his memory than anyone else. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] __ __ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php? category=shopping
[FairfieldLife] Re: Please communicate to all governors
--How many TM teachers are needed (renegade teachers or TMO)?. What's wrong with Paul Brown: http://www.thequietpath.org ?? - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 sandiego108@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, shempmcgurk shempmcgurk@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 sandiego108@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer rick@ wrote: The main point is in the headline and the paragraph highlighted in red, below. Even more succinctly in these few words,...offering ourselves to the Totality of Brahm In other words, transcend our illusory individual nature. The rest is an intro lecture for the few fortunate souls that may stumble across this with open hearts and minds. If this is what it takes to continue to make the TM technique available in the world, what is there to take issue with? BECAUSE IT FUCKING DOESN'T WORK, THAT'S WHY. How many MORE years of cult-run TMO do you want? zero We've had 30 years...would ANOTHER 30 years make you happy? I don't get the question... The failure of the TMO since the success -- the INCREDIBLE success -- of the 1970s is the story of: IF IT AIN'T BROKE, DON'T FIX IT. yeah...but the 70's are long gone, and if the only org to keep this technique alive is the wacky inefficient one, well that's what we got, and better than nothing, imo. Fotunately, Maharishi gave us his we are satisfied answer in response to a question during a press conference several years ago in which the questioner asking him whether it was okay that he had learned TM from a non-TMO TM teacher. Maharishi's answer? We are satisfied...there was a wee bit more to it than that but that was the crux of it. Perhaps some enterprising TM teacher will multiply himself and offer an inexpensive TM taught in line with the purity of the teaching to millions across the world. I'll be satisfied if that would happen...will you? Yes, absolutely yes!
[FairfieldLife] Horns on a Rabbit
Thanks, Vaj for inspiring me to look for a real Horns on a rabbit creature: The Buddhist doctrine for this world Is not to be separated from worldly knowledge. To search for enlightenment apart from this world Is equivalent to seeking horns on a rabbit! Hui Neng It's #10: Ceratogaulus Rhinoceros. The Wired caption says This explains why there were no good golf courses in the Pliocene epoch. http://www.tinyurl.com/2ltzbz
[FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi's secret!
---This historical background is quite fascinating, but limited in relavance as I see the situation. For example, I haven't found any good techniques associated with the Sri Yantra. There's the Sri Vidya mantra which I have chanted (and discarded in favor of others), and the Lalita Sahasranama chant (available from Ammachi), which is powerful but I listen to other chants. What's the message and conclusion associated with the fact that SBS used the Sri Yantra as a devotional icon? That because he did this I'm supposed to go out and buy a Sri Yantra? In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Richard J. Williams wrote: There's only one Sri Yantra, Bharat2, associated with the Sri Vidya sect, and that is the Sri Chakra. Bhairatu wrote: My point was that many yantras have bij mantras on them so you can't claim that Sri Yantra is the source. There is only ONE Sri Yantra associated with the Sri Vidya sect - the one Shankaracharya placed on the mandir at Sringeri. On it are inscribed the mantras of the Sri Vidya sect. All thirteen bija mantras are innumerated in the Saundaryalahari, composed by Shankaracharya. Among the mantras is the bija mantra of Saraswati, that is, Sri, the Goddess of Learning, worshiped by all the Swamis of the Saraswati sect founded by Shankaracharya. All the Dasanami Swamis have appeneded to thir name - Saraswati. You still didn't answer my question: can you read Devanagri?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi's secret!
---It's the power in the mantra that's essential; and not present to the same degree in mantras of other traditions I've been intiated into. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Vaj Sent: Saturday, January 19, 2008 4:52 PM To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Maharishi's secret! I find it hard to believe that plenty of Japa practicers didn't chill out with a similar technique to TM. And of course they have. It's nothing new at all--except canned parts like checking and mantra selection. Don't know about mantra selection, but IMO checking and the 7- steps were a stroke of genius. No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.7/1232 - Release Date: 1/18/2008 7:32 PM
[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Maharishi Says: Work is Finished'
--that's a good one, Vaj. Or, a Chupacabra will do: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chupacabra - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jan 18, 2008, at 2:41 PM, matrixmonitor wrote: Then, Sheng Yen quotes Chan Master Hhineng: The Dharma is of the world; enlightenment is not realized apart fromt he world. If one seeks bodhi [enlightenment] outside the world, it is like searching for horns on a rabbit. You mean like a Jackalope?
[FairfieldLife] Re: The TMers Pledge
---For those of you unaware of the Pledge, I'm pasting it in (below). Please read, sign, and send in your pledge to Tom. Quote: In the United States, which was once thought to be a haven of religious liberty, we are the targets of unprincipled attacks in the court system by those who would line their pockets from our hard won coffers. Bigots in all branches of government, fearing the success of Scientology, are bent on our destruction through taxation and repressive legislation. We have been subjected to illegal heresy trials in two countries before prejudiced and malinformed judges who are not qualified or inclined to perceive the truth. In Canada and Germany, our Churches have been subjected to vicious raids reminiscent of the historical genocide attacks on religions that took place in `less informed' times and societies. The news media chooses to ignore the good works and miraculous successes of Scientology and instead seeks to poison public opinion through vilification of the religion and its Founder. The detractors of Scientology know full well that it is a proven, effective and workable system for freeing mankind from spiritual bondage. That is why they attack. They fear that they will somehow be threatened by a society which is more ethical, productive and humane through the influence of Scientology and Scientologists. Thus when we expand, to that degree we are attacked. Up to this day, the responsibility for defending Scientology has been on the shoulders of a desperate few. And so it will continue in large measure. Yet, in order to continue the quest for a new civilization where honest men have rights and freedoms abound, the assistance and dedication of each and every Scientologist and other men of goodwill is essential. The road may be difficult and may get worse due to the rapid decline of civilization and erosion of personal liberties at this time. But united in purpose and dedication, we shall prevail for the benefit of all mankind. We, the undersigned, pledge ourselves, without reservation or any thought of personal comfort or safety, to achieving the aims of Scientology: `A civilization without insanity, without war, where the able can prosper and honest beings can have rights, and where Man is free to rise to greater heights.' We invite Scientologists and other well intentioned people everywhere to join us in this pledge End quote. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, abutilon108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I signed the pledge much later on and I'm quite sure the wording was different. It seems not everyone would have signed the same pledge, although as I remember what you were agreeing to was pretty much the same.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Could someone kindly translate Joytish speak into English
--Western astrology has some advantages: the main one being precise transits of the planets and moon; information gained through a technological advantage. For example, Jan 17-th, 2008, I have : 1. Sun opp Venus at 9:24 2. Venus opp Midheaven at 10:09 3. Venus sq. Asc at 23:15, 4. Mercury sq. Moon (start of transit with 1 deg. orb) 5. Start of Venus sq. Asc transit. Through many years of experience in deciphering such transits, the foregoing simply represents a rather ordinary day with no surprises, conflicts, or unusual events. However, such Western transits don't tell us the content of events, just the background trends (analogous to currents of air or water. One can go with the flow or against it). For example if I had a Mars sq. Pluto transit, I would be a bit more careful about walking home at night. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, The Secret [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: OK, I don't want to go into details. Let's drop it. Thanks. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: It is probably NOT necessarily the most auspicious time in history but just an auspicious time. Depending on what you are doing these auspicious times or muhurtas can occur even frequently and less frequently (every few years) if more requirements are needed. I have no idea what horoscope they're basing this on. The Secret wrote: Thank you kindly. Now I would posit that the 8 day period which spans this yagna is happening during one of the most auspicious times in recorded history. Could someone kindly reveal to us just what this period is considered in terms of Jyotish? --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu noozguru@ wrote: Surya is the Sanskrit name for the Sun. A pratyantar dasha is the third
[FairfieldLife] Re: The TMers Pledge
So, you like aphorisms. You're probably a TMO or other Fundamentalist. Are you a TB? Here's a good Ginsberg quote: I saw the best minds of my generation destroyed by madness, starving hysterical naked, dragging themselves through the negro streets at dawn looking for an angry fix; Angel-headed hipsters burning for the ancient heavenly connection to the starry dynamo in the machinery of night. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, The Secret [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander mailander111@ wrote: Curtis, I really like your phrase about the move from the Age of Enlightenment to the Age of Embarassment. It has depth, it has irony, it has humor, it has truth and insight; it has what's called poetic texture in my line of work. And here's the deal: embarrassment is prolly closer to real enlightenment than most claims of higher states of consciousness I've seen. Show me a mensch who's not embarassed to look back on his stupid life. Have you ever read Gimpel the Fool by Isaac Bashevis Singer? Man is the only animal that blushes - or needs to. -- Mark Twain
[FairfieldLife] Re: A reason why Israel has such influence on US policy
---Precisely, Vaj, and it's freightening that people in the Pentagon believe this crap. Of course, in this scenario the Jews who convert to Christianity are saved, (whether physically alive), or alive then killed by the Anti-Christ. But a remnant of worthy saved Jews, the 144,000; remain on earth to spread the Gospel to the world. The 144,000 are subdivided into the 12 tribes of Israel. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jan 16, 2008, at 6:55 AM, do.rflex wrote: And what pisses me off is when anyone attempts to point this out or to even discuss this issue without immediately taking Israel's side, they are called 'anti-Semitic' or 'Jew haters' as you did above. There have actually been a number of TV comments on this, one a 60 Minutes segment on how an ~85% Christian nation which has grown progressively fundamentalist and tied into the belief that world destiny centers around a return of Jesus, their saviour, as a commander in chief type figure who will return in Israel--by prophetic decree--and slay the non-believers in the real war to end all wars. It's really a rather bizarre scenario: Christians supporting Israel so Jesus can return and then slaughter most of the Jews as Jesus establishes his kingdom. Jesus as cosmic suicide bomber in the sky. Blue-meme republican nut-cases like Bush actually believe this schlock. Haven't you seen the copies of the Left Behind series in racks your local supermarket? Walmart often prominently displays them. See: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/10/03/60minutes/main524268.shtml It is my belief that the Bible Belt in America is Israel's only safety belt right now, says Rev. Jerry Falwell, one of the leaders of the Christian Right. That's the bulk of Evangelical Christians; Falwell claims to speak for all of them. There are 70 million of us, he says. And if there's one thing that brings us together quickly it's whenever we begin to detect our government becoming a little anti-Israel. Falwell began to detect just that in April 2002 when President Bush called on Israel to withdraw its tanks from Palestinian towns on the West Bank. So Falwell shot off a letter of protest to the White House, which was followed by a hundred thousand e-mails from Christian conservatives. Israel did not move its tanks. Mr. Bush did not ask again. There's nothing that would bring the wrath of the Christian public in this country down on this government like abandoning or opposing Israel in a critical matter, Falwell says. The Christian public is, he says, Mr. Bush's core constituency. I really believe when the chips are down Ariel Sharon can trust George Bush to do the right thing every time, says Falwell. ...so it all winds up here in Israel where, according to the Book of Revelations, the final battle in the history of the future will be fought on an ancient battlefield in northern Israel called Armageddon. It will follow seven years of tribulation during which the earth will be shaken by such disasters that previous human history will seem like a day in the country. The blood will rise as high as a horse's bridle at Armageddon, before Christ triumphs to begin his 1,000-year rule. And the Jews? Well, two-thirds of them will have been wiped out by now. But the survivors will accept Jesus at last. The Jews die or convert. As a Jew, I can't feel very comfortable with the affections of somebody who looks forward to that scenario, says Gershom Gorenberg, who knows that scenario well. Gorenberg is the author of the End of Days, a book about those Christian evangelicals who choose to read the Bible literally. They don't love real Jewish people. They love us as characters in their story, in their play, and that's not who we are, and we never auditioned for that part, and the play is not one that ends up good for us. If you listen to the drama they're describing, essentially it's a five-act play in which the Jews disappear in the fourth act.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Guru Dev and his Brahman thingy
---Thanks, Guru Deb (SBS) appeared to me in a powerful, brilliant dream in 1988 and initiated me into a Durga manta. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Richard J. Williams [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, you think that the Adi Shankaracharya of Sringeri not only initiated disciples into Sri Vidya practices, but said: Worship of Sri Chakra is a must for the Swamis of the peetha. And, as noted, not by householders, but by Swamis. So, let's go figure. There is a shrine to Shankara at the Sri Vidya temple down in Kanchipuram peeth, wherein lies the Sri Cakra or Sri Yantra. And, the Swami Rama of the Himalayas recounted in his book, 'Living With the Himalyan Masters', a direct, first hand account of Guru Dev having a Sri Yantra in his possession at a yoga camp. So, is EVERYONE in the Shankaracharya tradition deluded? Guru Dev and Sri Vidya Does this mean the past Shankaracharyas, as well as the current ones, ascribed to a tantric cult? Is it a fact that the Adi Shankara installed an IDOL of a Goddess on a Sri Cakra (Sri Yantra) as the MAIN DEITY of the Sringeri Matha? Apparently, the 33rd Shankaracharya of the Sringeri Matha died before he could give all the initiations to the 34th, his successor. However, the 33rd is reputed to have said: Worship of Sri Chakra is a must for the Swamis of the Peetha. According to an authority on the subject, normally the Srividya mantropadesa would be done by the guru, but Narasimha Bharati had passed away before his disciple arrived at Sringeri. Hence the mantropadesa was done by Srikanta Sastri. He had been initiated into it by Narasimha Bharati Mahaswami the 34th. The Pontiff's reign was from 1912 to 1953, so he was a contemporary of Guru Dev. The 33rd. was Sri Narasimha Bharati Mahaswami, making him a contemporary of Guru Dev's Guru, Swami Krishanand. Mystic and Seer And, isn't it a fact that the principal deity, Saradambal, the Goddess of Learning, is a focus of a mighty spiritual force? According to my informant, Saradamba, by all legendary accounts, is a deity of Kashmir who was literally brought down to the south of India by Adi Shankara. He installed the idol made of sandalwood on a Sri Chakra drawn by himself. So, here we have Shankara installing an IDOL of a Goddess on a Sri Cakra (Sri Yantra) as the MAIN DEITY of the math! Indeed! Guru Dev and his Brahman thingy And, here we have a totally discredited and false history of the Kanchi matha, with claims that a Shankara founded the Matha BEFORE the historical Buddha was even born, and a direct disciple of Guru Dev who claims that Guru Dev never used any bija-mantras for devotional or self-knowledge purposes, and that Guru Dev was a Rasik Saint who never taught Adwaita in the first place, because he didn't have a Brahman thingy. So, I guess we will just have to go figure, you know what I mean? But it doesn't make much sense to say that Guru Dev didn't have a Brahman thingy when his name was Swami Brahmanand. Work cited: The True History of India by Swami Prakashanand Saraswati Barsana Dham, Austin, Texas Read the full post: 'Guru Dev and his Brahman thingy' http://tinyurl.com/yzjfsv
[FairfieldLife] Re: The Schizophrenic TM movement
-You're absolutely right on target!. Now, the TM Movement, (what's left of it), is berift of both real science and religion. All that remains is those phoney birthday Raja hats. -- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The last few days have really been helpful for me to get a look at what the modern movement is like. Being an outsider for the last 18 years, I have only gotten small glimpses of what goes on in the movement through print mostly. To have a chance to watch a celebration? online has been very instructive. Of course the movement is much more diverse than this event, but looking at the people at the top of the heap does give some insight into what its all about. At one point there was a song presented by Mother Divine singers where they basically repeated some of the names of Mother Divine. To get back to the perspective that they were talking about laws of nature seems like a long trek... Oh gravity, I love you so,you are divine from your head to your toe... These chicks were religiously devoted to Mother Divine as a living deity, period. Of course this has been going on undercover for years, but hearing it at such a public event offered some insight into the way it works for the movement now. You are either on board or off now. There is less of the sneakiness that I used to rail about when I first left the movement. You can't put your crazy uncle with the crown in the closet when guests come anymore. There was a lot of discussions by Rajas of all the land the movement bought around the world. Because it was in the background most of the time while I puttered around it often seemed like a real estate investor's convention. There was very little discussion of knowledge. These old dudes were talking acquisitions, land, building projects. I expected to have the Raja of county building permits step up to the mike at any moment. They seemed like a lot of rich guys whose conversations I overhear in posh restaurants in DC. Fat guys crowing about their stuff, and more stuff, and the plans for even more stuff, pass the mashed potatoes and don't forget the gravy. For God sake, don't forget the gravy. I think that the Indianization of TM has really torpedoed MMY's original goal of spreading meditation. It was inevitable because I believe that MMY was really just pretending to respect science for a while. He was only using it as a superficial cover for introducing his religious beliefs into Western culture. Now this isn't troubling for me really because I am a fan of studying religions. But the problem for me is that something else has been lost. That something else is a sincere desire to study meditation techniques to understand our humanity better. The spirit of brave exploration has been replaced with a glossy brochure explaining what it all means in basically fundamentalist Hindu terms. I am sort of thinking of Judy's perspective on what she knows and what she doesn't know from her meditation experiences. She seems pretty clear on drawing her own lines. I have to figure that she is not alone in practicing TM and not buying the whole belief package. Maintaining a wait as see attitude about some of the more extravigant claims. But overshadowing this approach is the 6 year old's birthday party with the silly hats...Guys like Heiglin gave up his science, chucked it willingly. And he was a physics badass in the day right? Tony nosejob Nadar throws out his science background to become Nadar Raj, WTF? He bought into a complete explanation from a traditional perspective instead of continuing the humble search for answers. He sold his intellectual integrity for a party hat. This may be the reason he gets such a rise out of me. He knew better. So these are just thoughts in progress. This is an interesting time to re-think the TM group and MMY. In his address I really got the impression that MMY has been winging it all. He just threw out his stuff and reacted to the world's interest. He keeps talking about his constant working. It is a theme for him, always has been. Tireless working is the highest virtue in his universe, and you find that out pretty quickly if you try to hang with him. He has always been a human doing, not a human being. A whirlwind of poorly planned new projects crushing old projects before any of them had a chance to work. In India he changed his mind every day about what we should be focusing on. We thought it was sooo cute and enlightened. Now I honestly believe the guy is seriously ADD and a little ritalin might have saved people around him a lot of pain. Lip service paid to knowledge, but never the patience to really develop thoughts beyond what could be put on a poster of slogans. MMY has always been a sloganeer,not a careful thinker IMO. Couldn't even finish the Gita commentary for God's sake! The
[FairfieldLife] Re: 'Maharishi Says: Work is Finished'
---No - he's only accomplished 2% of what Guru Dev wanted for the world. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, BillyG. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Robert babajii_99@ wrote: Dear Fellow Governors, Sidhas and Meditators of America, As many of you have certainly heard, our beloved Maharishi has announced that he is retiring from activity. Our great Maharishi, Jagadguru to the world, whose tireless efforts for more than 50 years have transformed the destiny of the human race, is, of necessity, retiring from his constant exertion on our behalf and on behalf of the entire world. I'm struck by the phrase of necessity. Seems to me it was put in to confirm what most of us suspect, that MMY has become too frail, and almost certainly too ill, to do much of anything but rest. It's not MMY's choice, in other words. Unless I've missed something, this is the only official assertion to this effect that we've seen so far. One can only hope he's relatively comfortable and not in pain. Of course he's not in pain, come on Judy, he's just a whisker away from MahaSamadhi(even though MMY has NEVER (to my knowledge) admitted what state of consciousness he was in, if he were in constant communion with the divine he would have said so!) No, no, all of this is strictly voluntary, he really accomplished all he set out to, and more...brother!!
[FairfieldLife] Re: The Same Grandfathers of Physics Speak Out.......was/The Grandfathers of Phy
---Right traveling backward in time may be an inappropriate phrase. However, the phrase backward causation is officially used; but the paradox is that there's no evidence of a signal, at least one that physicists can detect. The presence of a human observer has traditionally been a requirement in the Copenhagen viewpoint of QM, propounded by most of the 20's pioneers (Schroedinger, Heisenberg, Bohr, etc). Einstein was the antagonist to Borh in this controversey. Other physicists OTOH believe that the environment is the observer; and downplay the necessity of a human observer. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote: On Jan 14, 2008, at 7:11 PM, ruthsimplicity wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote: On Jan 14, 2008, at 4:23 PM, ruthsimplicity wrote: snip From what I have seen Vaj write, it looks like he is familiar with this stuff. snip Also check out: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_mysticism It's a very good synopsis. Quoting Vaj from an earlier post: What are you proposing Off, that the observer's consciousness emits some sort of signal that travels back through time and then tells the measuring apparatus what it's supposed to indicate when the particle interacts with the machine? What about when there is no human observer and some automatic recording machine does the observing? Does the machine travel back through time? I think you've merely uncritically accepted a good number of false propositions which were sold to you by a pseudo-master and his physicists-marketeers. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheeler's_delayed_choice_experiment I don't know if Vaj knows that the delayed choice experiment does not require a human participant. However, we have to be careful when drawing conclusions like travel back in time from his experiment and other related experiments as time travel is not necessary to develop a theory to account for the experiment. Interesting stuff though. Shows how elusive answers can be when you are out there on the cutting edge. Be careful of Judy's Golem, a peculiar form of strawman fallacy where our Dear Editor distorts or misrepresents an others thoughts, and then based on that distorted monster attempts to show who that misleading idea is wrong. The ideas she attributes to me have actually zero to do with my personal thoughts and a certainly not even close to what I was thinking of. Hang around here long enough and you'll see this often enough. It's just a common technique she uses to lure people into arguments. When you ignore her, she'll try to beg others on to further entice with her latest Golem. snicker Vaj's mantra when he's caught at it.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Nils Bohr on Off World
---True, but I'm still challenging any Enlightened person to predict tomorrow's stock market outcome. None have taken me up on the challenge (if they're tapping into quantum reality, some economists maintain an analogous parallel between certain laws of economics and the laws of QM). On the contrary, recently I received a phone call solicitation from a rep of Andrew Cohen's Enlightenment Magazine asking for $$ donations. Coming from a guy supposedly a pioneer in Evolotionary Enlightenment, I told Cohen's rep that there appears to be a gap between what's tacitly proclaimed as the benefits of Enlightenment and actual performance. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Samadhi Is Much Closer Than You Think -- Really! -- It's A No-Brainer. Who'd've Thunk It? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While quantum is usually discussed in realms of physics, meditation gets us to the quantum realm(s). Raising the kundalini past the anahat will present past, present and future as a tripartite of a singular whole and the most profound word resonating throughout your being will be NOW!, in your native language. From this threshold new paradigms can be created, answers to nearly any question are readily experienced and being in more than one place at a time is possible, among other progressively more subtle capabilities yet to become ubiquitous in human life on Earth. Quantum Psyche, that's for us, you betcha, by golly, and how! *Tantra Psychology *http://TantraPsychology.Learn.to http://tantrapsychology.learn.to/ *They are educated who have learned much, remembered much, and make use of their knowledge in everyday life. And of these lessons integrated into their life, moral conscience is the most imperative to learn and convey to others. Their virtues give true meaning to education. * On 1/10/08, Vaj [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Jan 10, 2008, at 2:43 AM, off_world_beings wrote: Anyone who is not shocked by quantum theory has not understood it. As quoted in Leadership and the New Science: Discovering Order in a Chaotic World (1999) by Margaret J. Wheatley, p. 32 The notion of complementarity does in no way involve a departure from our position as detached observers of nature...The essentially new feature in the analysis of quantum phenomena is the introduction of a *fundamental distinction between the measuring apparatus and the objects under investigation*...In our future encounters with reality we shall have to distinguish between the objective side and the subjective side, to make a division between the two, (Bohr's ital.) -Nils Bohr
[FairfieldLife] Re: The Same Grandfathers of Physics Speak Out.......was/The Grandfathers of Physic
--Right(all right!); Penrose takes the discussion a quantum leap beyond Schrodinger - (the latter a proponent of the Copenhagen viewpoint of QM, which emphasizes the importance of the observer; and proposes that any ultimate reality in the reductionist, relative sense is unreal - but not in the same sense as the usage relating to Shankara and Buddhism in general.) In any event, we must be careful to distinguish between consciousness and Consciousness. When Penrose states that consciousness is based on quantum operations, he means consciousness in the ordinary Western sense: i.e. as neurophysiologists and psychologists use the term but NOT as Wilber might use the term Consciousness. As Schroedinger pointed out, QM - regardless of how finely grained and reduced to some proposed ultimate formualtion (say, foam, or some field - the Higgs field), is still relative and does not come out of the Absolute). In short, quantum particles, atoms, molecules, compounds, tissues, brains, etc; are no less Consciousness being manifested on various levels; but generally (apart from Wilber), discussions relating to consciousness in the West revolve around the ordinary, non- Spiritual usage - as one might hear in a discussion at UCB, UCSD Harvard, Yale, etc). If any scientist dares bring the Spiritual term Consciousness into the discussion, well...as Schroedinger pointed out, that's a categorical error, and consciousness in the Western sense cannnot be conflated or confused with Consciousness in the Absolute Monistic sense. Therefore, Penrose is right, IMO...consciousness is based on quantum principles. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, off_world_beings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Vaj...they are saying religion no, consciousness yes. Erwin Schrödinger was among the first to point out that many of the unique characteristics of living organisms are consequences of the microscopic origins of life and quantum mechanical roots within the DNA among these characteristics, the phenomenon of consciousness.(1) Max Plank - regarded as one of the greatest minds of the 20th century regarded, quote: Consiousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative of consciousness.(1) French Physicist Bernard D'Espagnat: The doctrine that the world is made up of objects whose existence is independent of human consciousness turns out to be in conflict with quantum mechanics and with the facts established by experiment(2) In an essay entitled The Materialist Superstition, AI technology guru George Gilder writes the usual materialist assumption is that the brain, the hardware, comes first and mind somehow emerges from it. He then quotes neurosurgeon Wilder Penfield's conclusion after he'd conducted extensive research of the brain: I, like other scientists, have struggled to prove that the brain accounts for the mind. http://csmweb2.emcweb.com/durable/2001/06/28/p14s1.htm References: (1) Klien, D.B., 1984, 'The Concept of Consiousness: A Survey', Lincoln University of Nebraska press, (adjacent to title page). (2)'The Quantum Theory and Reality', D.'Espagnat, B., Scientific American, 1979, 241(5, p. 158). OffWorld --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Vaj vajranatha@ wrote: What is the relationship, if any between modern physics and transcendental mysticism? The present fashion of applying the axioms of physical science to human life is not only entirely a mistake but has also something reprehensible in it. -Albert Einstein I do not suggest that the new physics 'proves religion' or indeed gives any positive grounds for religious faith...For my own part I am wholly opposed to any such attempt. -Arthur Stanley Eddington Physics has nothing to do with it. Physics takes its start from everyday experience, which it continues by more subtle means. It remains akin to it, does not transcend it generically, it cannot enter into another realm. (An attempt to do so he says is quite simply sinister). -Erwin Schroedinger The attempts to unify physics with the transcendent are founded on misunderstanding, or, more precisely, on a confusion of the images of religion with scientific statements. Needless to say, the result makes no sense at all. -Max Planck What of the things which are not seen which religion assures us are eternal? There has been much discussion of late of the claims [scientific support for transcendental events]. Speaking as a scientist, I find the alleged proofs totally unconvincing; speaking as a human being, I find most of them ridiculous as well. -Sir James Jeans
[FairfieldLife] Re: Monism
-No. There's no connection between Pure Consciousness and the Vacuum
State of any Field, (say the long sought-after Higgs field). The
cosmic/quantum vacuum is seething with energy; but the vacuum can be
equated with an element, the space element; and is thus relative.
-- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Philosophical monism is a philosophical position that has a precise
definition, which is, roughly as we've been using the term, to
indicate that pure consciousness and the absolute vacuum state of the
quantum field are identical and coextensive, which makes the brain a
receiver of the impulses of a non-physical field rather than a
manufacturer of consciousness. This basic definition and basic
question does not change because we realize that the table we thought
solid is really mostly empty space and energy. So the initial
question still remains. The table may be an illusion (not the usual
definition of illusion) as you say. The individual consciousness may
be an illusion (using your implicit definition) also. But then, the
fundamental question still remains. Is pure consciousness identical
and coextensive with the absolute vacuum state of the quantum field,
or not? Most physicists still say not, while the number who
say yes to that proposition
is growing.
- Original Message
From: Stu [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 1, 2008 6:25:03 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Monism
--- In FairfieldLife@ yahoogroups. com, Angela Mailander
mailander111@ ... wrote:
I included you because you're the one who correctly insisted that
what folks were presenting as evidence wasn't evidence. The
attractiveness of the theory is that it makes life after death much
more possible than does the theory that consciousness is an emergent
property of the brain. Monism would make life after death a virtual
certainty in terms of consciousness persisting, though that says
nothing about individual consciousness persisting. On that score,
I'm with Nitzsche: And immortal Peter! Who could stand him?
I think there is a better way to approach monism. I don't think it
makes any sense to describe consciousness as an emerging property of
brain any more than the opposite, reality is the result of
consciousness. These both suggest Descartes style dualism. One puts
more emphasis on the spiritual/immateria l the other on the
physical/material.
It is my understanding that the physical/material is an illusion.
For all intents and purposes a table appears to be a static object
fixed in space. However that illusion is provided by a useful
evolutionary circuit in our brains that categorizes objects so we may
manipulate and interact with them. Otherwise reality would be
impossible for us to comprehend. Survival would be impossible.
This requires us to live in fiction. The truth requires us to go
beyond common sense. Common sense falsely suggests the sun arcs
across the sky yet the truth is we are on a turning planet. We can
not trust common sense. It does well for base survival challenges
but will get us nowhere when exploring the Kosmos as a whole.
Objects, physical, material things are not static. They are made
up of tiny centers of energy moving very fast. These energy fields
make patterns and our interconnected with all other fields of
energy. The table in front of me appears solid because it is moving
very fast. My perception of the table is further clouded by the fact
I do not directly interact with the table but instead hold a model of
the table in my consciousness in order to interact with it. Thus, I
use the history of tables from my past to understand this table.
Thus my mind uses shorthand to fill in my immediate experience of
this table.
From this point of view there is no primacy in mind/body dualism.
Mind does not rise from body or vice versa. Instead there is only
energy manifesting itself as a perceived thought or object. Both
object and thought are transient, alter experience, have limited
value, are limited in space/time and are fundamentally unified.
This is monism as I understand it.
s.
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Lingam in FF
---This online source says that there are 5 Shiva Lingams in India (associated with the 5 elements) but that the Arunachala Hill represents the fire element and extends 8 light years into the Heavens,...thus, being the biggest Limgam!: as a vast spiritual organism, Shiva-Sirius would be your first stop. This is the portal in. The Shiva lingam at Arunachala is a five-mile wide golden column of light that stretches straight from Earth to Sirius. That's an 8 Light Year stretch; no wonder the myths say neither Brahma nor Vishnu could find the feet or crown of this lingam. The lingam takes you right out to the furthermost edge of the manifest, however subtle it is at Sirius, so that, metaphorically, your cognitive nose is right up against the membrane of the transcendent where, not cosmic space but rather the diffused face of God, or the Absolute, surrounds the galactic membrane and Shiva's circle of fire. Here we may equate Shiva and the lingam, as two expressions of the same reality, and at Arunachala you may perceive Shiva as a celestial figure or a sheer fire pillar. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Dec 24, 2007, at 4:21 PM, authfriend wrote: Are these guys obsessed, or what? Something tells me they need to get out more, a lot more. Seems to me some folks here are at least as obsessed with it. At least the pundits are actually going to see it in the flesh, as it were. LOL. Y'all know ice lingams aren't just some wacky notion of MMY's, right? They're a big deal in India. Which explains a lot, actually. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: Too many Rajas spoil the Vedic broth
---Charlie Lutes agrees. (Charlie speaks from beyond the grave!!...) In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The Raja stuff and King Nader stuff is way too literal. Maharishi has fallen into the same pitfall as many other literalists like the Hare Krishna mov't who believe in a literal Gokulam.!! I just can't believe that Maharishi could make a mistake like this. That bullcrap ' butt bouncing' also has severely eroded his credibility. TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Fri, 21 Dec 2007 13:32:47 - Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: point of no return passed? TM-Jihad Not to *mention* having 72 virgins waiting for you in Bramhaloka if you get snuffed in the process of leading the TM-jihad. And the brilliant part of this, from the TMO point of view, is that they only need a *total* of 72 virgins. The TM-jihad martyrs die and go to Brahmaloka, and after they get there the 72 virgins *remain* virgins, because these dickless wonders can't think of anything to do with them except have them wash their robes and polish their crowns. :-) - Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Pseudo-Science vs Anti-Science
--right...most of what people do, and why; is based on the subconscious: concealed impulses deeply hidden within the psyche that emerge spontaneously given the stimulating input. I could read out reams of peer reviewed articles to my coworkers about any subject but the response would be the same: z - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Larry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am not anti-science - - I am suggesting that much of the intellectual findings of science don't impact me - - - for example, I know the earth is round, but for 99.9+% of my daily life activities, it makes no difference whether the world is flat or round. The issue of the flatness or roundness of the earth was historically of great importance to the pro and anti science peoples, and some lost their lives because of their positions - - but for the billions of average Joes like myself, the controversy doesn't amount to a hill of beans. Likewise, quantum mechanics may claim that the banana I had for breakfast is mostly empty space, but that fact has little bearing on the banana's comings and goings . . . I am not talking about the application of science in technology - but the intellectual discovery or resulting knowledge of the scientific process. It has little impact for most people, then there are a few who appreciate science for its entertainment value - then there are the very few scientists themselves who are actually engaged in the research. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, off_world_beings no_reply@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, ruthsimplicity ruthsimplicity@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason jedi_spock@ wrote: How many people in this forum Pseudo-science.?? And how many are Anti-science.?? How do you define both.?? I recently moved to town and found this forum. I signed up mostly to discuss this question. :) The first question really is what is science. The Merriam Webster dictionary definition works for me: http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/science 1: the state of knowing : knowledge as distinguished from ignorance or misunderstanding 2 a: a department of systematized knowledge as an object of study the science of theology b: something (as a sport or technique) that may be studied or learned like systematized knowledge have it down to a science 3 a: knowledge or a system of knowledge covering general truths or the operation of general laws especially as obtained and tested through scientific method b: such knowledge or such a system of knowledge concerned with the physical world and its phenomena : natural science 4: a system or method reconciling practical ends with scientific laws cooking is both a science and an art My favored and the most specific definition which pertains to how science is acquired is #3 3 a: knowledge or a system of knowledge covering general truths or the operation of general laws especially as obtained and tested through scientific method. Of key importance is that you acquire science through the scientific method of research. (Briefly, principles and procedures for the systematic pursuit of knowledge involving the recognition and formulation of a problem, the collection of data through observation and experiment, and the formulation and testing of hypotheses.} Pseudoscience is also defined as a system of theories, assumptions, and methods erroneously regarded as scientific. http://www.m-w.com/dictionary/pseudoscience If the scientific method is misused or conclusions misinterpreted, that could result in pseudoscience. For example, you develop a hypothesis, do an experience, and do not disprove your hypothesis. This does not mean that your hypothesis is now science. Maybe after many experiments it might become science, but relying on one experiment could very well result in pseudoscience. Also, problems with how you use the scientific method could also result in pseudoscience. Say the researcher had a strong bias or a financial interest. This could lead to erroneous conclusions and development of a pseudoscientific theory. Antiscience in my mind is the basic disbelief in the scientific method as the way to develop knowledge about the physical world. Hi Ruth, yes that is exactly what Curtis and TurquoiseB said in another thread. They tried to throw out the scientific method altogether in favor of their own opinion. The traits of Fox News the Neocons and the anti-science crowd: 1. Attack the person not the argument. 2. Attack the concept of science itself 3. Use science to back up their agenda when it suits them. 4. Shout until the argument is lost in non-related BS. These are typical traits
[FairfieldLife] blame it on Star Trek
A Rabbi writes (USA Today blog section): Rabbi wrote: Actually, come to think of it, Star Trek has definitely contributed to my rejection of religious principles!! I remember the first time I saw Who Mourns for Adonais - wherein the erstwhile crew of the Enterprise (A, if you will ) stumble upon the lonely God Apollo, the last of the remaining figures of Greek mythology after they all retired' to a planet far away. I remember thinking, yeah, that makes as much sense as what those Biblical stories claim about Yaweh talking with Adam in the Garden of Eden or walking with Moses in the desert. But, as I said earlier, I grew up in Sci-Fi household accepting of science and rejecting the myths and fairy-tales of scientifically illiterate cultures as just that: make believe stories!! So blame it on Star Trek!!
[FairfieldLife] Re: blame it on Star Trek
- It's in the Idea Blog 2/3-rd the way down the page, an interesting string on the Rabbi's comments, at: http://www.tinyurl.com/2zd2gq -- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Samadhi Is Much Closer Than You Think -- Really! -- It's A No-Brainer. Who'd've Thunk It? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Would you please forward the link for this rabbi's remark? On 12/20/07, tertonzeno [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A Rabbi writes (USA Today blog section): Rabbi wrote: Actually, come to think of it, Star Trek has definitely contributed to my rejection of religious principles!! I remember the first time I saw Who Mourns for Adonais - wherein the erstwhile crew of the Enterprise (A, if you will ) stumble upon the lonely God Apollo, the last of the remaining figures of Greek mythology after they all retired' to a planet far away. I remember thinking, yeah, that makes as much sense as what those Biblical stories claim about Yaweh talking with Adam in the Garden of Eden or walking with Moses in the desert. But, as I said earlier, I grew up in Sci-Fi household accepting of science and rejecting the myths and fairy-tales of scientifically illiterate cultures as just that: make believe stories!! So blame it on Star Trek!!
[FairfieldLife] The Highest Buddhist Masters Today
high on?? http://www.highestbuddhistmasters.org/english/enyingma.html
[FairfieldLife] Re: The Atheist Delusion
---thanks, I agree. I have an Einstein quote from a Buddhist magazine, Tricycle, but can't find the original source: Einstein says Buddhism has the characteristics of what would be expected in a cosmic religion for the future: It transcends a personal God, avoids dogmas and theology; it covers both the natural and spiritual; and it is based on a religious sense aspiring from the experience of all things, natural and spiritual, as a meaningful unity. Steven Wolfram said something similar. He's the inventor of Mathematica. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Stu [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think I'm a believer in the Einsteinian sense, very impersonal, not devotional at all. But I disagree with Haught that you can't surrender to it unless it's personal. I think that's because he makes a distinction between It and thou, and I don't (and I bet Einstein didn't either). That's the difference between Western religion and Advaita, I guess. I just read Walter Isaacson's Einstein biography. His philosophical stance is very interesting. On one hand he had this Spinoza influenced view of god as impersonal laws of the universe. A view that is highly determinist. On the other hand Einstein had a deep personal belief in individuality and the potential of individuals to make a difference. Reading it, one can see how this framework parallels Buddhism. Which incidentally Camus was getting interested in just before he died. There is a thin line between the atheism of the existentialist and the nontheism of the Buddhist monk. Reading through that article though it seems the author is stuck in that old Cartesian dualism. Trying to reconcile the internal with the external. Most of the writing is an attempt to rationalize a very limited linear view of the universe as if it was a motionless thing made up of separate objects. This thing is either ruled by a supreme king who puts it in motion. Or is realized by the scientist as a cold place. Its fortunate for us TMers that we are not so split. Understanding the external to be a mere reflection of the internal. It makes all this talk about creation, meaning and hope a bunch of dramatic hogwash. These guys are hypnotized by their own self delusion. The unified Kosmos carries no such contradictions, conceits and contradictions. s.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Do siddhis have ANYTHING to do with state of consciousness?
--Dr. Frederick Lenz, aka Rama An online testimonial: Which probably helped me survive six years with Rama, Dr. Fredrick Lenz. I met him in 1984 and was swept up like none of the other organizations was ever able to sweep me up. Even the JWs who got hold of my poor mind when I was young did not get so inside of me as this guy was able to. Before I knew what hit me, I was traveling all over the country, and giving this 'holy' man all of my hard earned cash. I was also able to recruit several people into this organization, which is something I never did in any of the others. I think this shows how much I was enraptured of Rama. After six years, I walked away, never realizing how much he had affected me. I only knew that he was screwing my ex-girlfriend and that she broke up with me because he told her to. I had already moved on, and wasn't that concerned, I didn't have deep relationships or anything like that in those days. But it did get me thinking. . .Friends don't do that to friends. Then I started paying attention to everything else and began to apply the same standards that I lived by for myself, and although I could never be held up as a saint by any stretch of the imagination, I realized that I lived a far more moral life (in that I caused less harm to others) than he did. Boy, did I feel stupid. 39 years has taught me very few truly interesting things, except perhaps one--no one has the answer for me but me. The only thing another person can do is offer perspective. Perspective is not worth slavery. So be careful of gurus bearing gifts :o) - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Samadhi Is Much Closer Than You Think -- Really! -- It's A No-Brainer. Who'd've Thunk It? [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There are several people, teachers for real or presumed, who use the name Rama. Do you have any additional names for this person, their original family name or a website, perhaps with photos to help determine which Rama you are referring to? On 12/13/07, lurkernomore20002000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Curits commenting on Turqs experience with Rama - Fred Lenz: So if this teacher had some version of this ability, and you were in deep rapport with him, it doesn't seem like too much of a stretch to think he might have developed some other interesting ways to shift a... Lurk: I have mentioned before that when I read an interview Rama gave back in the early 90's (I believe), I was blown away. The impression I got was that of full blown enlightenment. A second interview six or seven years later, still had, in my opinion, the unmistakeable mark of enlightenment, although it was a little dulled, but enlightenment still intact. That was my impression. Speculating, given the little I know about the guy, it seemed like he pushed the envelope to the extreme, but even for the enlightend, there is only so far you can push it, before you find yourself past the point of no return.
[FairfieldLife] Re: Jim announces new role for himself.
---re - statement below MMY doesn't have that problem. That's cuz he insulates himself against any contructive feedback that doesn't agree with his initial POV. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, do.rflex [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, jim_flanegin jflanegi@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander mailander111@ wrote: Yes, excellent point. I've never seen MMY actually communicate with anyone. Jim and Rory may well be enlightened, but they don't seem to have enough self-awareness to notice how they come across. Maybe they just don't give a shit. a How can I *control* your perception of me Angela? Even if I could, I have no interest in doing so. Why do we all have such different perceptions of what I say? In the eye of the beholder perhaps? Acid Trip and Jim and Rory [since they both seem to have missed the post] Reading Jim and Rory's posts reminds me of an acid trip I took decades ago. I was *on*, I was *clear* and I was *here*/*there* NOW. Movement that took place was totally done by the *on*, *clear* and *now* - the 'state' itself. It was ecstatic - ecstacy in motion. There was NO movement for 'good' or 'bad'. There was NO self-reflection or 'conscience'. Looking back I can see that some of the things I might have said and done while in fully *in* that 'state' could easily have been seen to be arrogant, uncaring, critical and offensive - and I can see why. There is no self-reflection or conscience. At the time however, I didn't care - there was only the flowing NOW ECSTASY - and had I remained in that 'state' I wonder if I ever *would* have cared. But of course, the acid wore off in about 8 hours so there was no way I could have known. I bring this to an analogy with Jim where he gives a hint that just maybe he *could*, in time, integrate his 'state' into being able to present himself without appearing to be an arrogant asshole. Jim says: I admit being somewhat slow on the uptake regarding my evaluation of others' attitudes towards a frank expression of enlightenment. As I've said before, I don't spend any time at all outside of this forum, and one other, expressing my observations of enlightenment, so my learning about how to express it, and learning about others' reactions are relatively new. I don't attend courses, or visit spiritual teachers or read so-called spiritually oriented books. Maybe Jim actually *is* capable of recognizing that the examples of some of his statements below can easily be considered by others to be arrogant, hostile and offensive. In any case, it's no surprise that any regular person might hold reservations [and even contempt] for statements such as these coming from someone within the context of his claimed 'enlightenment'. Jim says: I am not saying I was immune from this me-better-than-you or you- better-than-me condition, for it is automatic, left over from our animal lives probably. But to also apply it to spiritual pursuit? Oh my God, just *ask* outright for a few more turns on the wheel, why don'cha??? Jim says: Don't try to lay your moodmaking crap on me buddy. I am not condemning you, or me, if you want to see it that way- just calling you on your BS and your foolishness, your hypocrisy. If I read it correctly, Rory has been in this 'state' for 10+ years and seems to have the same problem of not integrating his consciousness to simple civil effective communication. [Hint: Guru Dev and Maharishi didn't/don't seem to have that problem.]
[FairfieldLife] Re: Ramana teaches how to meditate (Chopra's Intent blog)
---This is only true (no object sought, thus one gets straight to the Self) of more advanced persons. The vast majority will undoubtedly experience nothing but ordinary mental chatter, then become discouraged. TM cuts directly through the chatter. In any event, Self-Inquiry must absolutely be practiced in conjunction with the Holy Three: 1. Ramana, 2. Arunachala, and 3. Arunachala Shiva. If not, one will be berift of the Shakti necessary to transcend. In TM, the Shakti is in the mantra. In Self-Inquirty, it's only latent in the practitioner until ignited by the Fire of Arunachala Shiva. (this form of Shiva embodies the Fire element, thus Diwali celebrants light a gigantic fire on top of Arunachala Hill in Nov.). In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Duveyoung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Matrix, I think I see your point, but to me, when one asks the question: Who am I? yes, this is an act, a willfulness, but, unlike mantra-meditation, there is no object sought to be held in consciousness. The intellect and the heart do not get involved in Self Inquiry. The Self, not the intellect or heart is being sought. The phrase who am I is not a mantra, nor should it be repeated per se. Ramana is not suggesting that one take that phrase to subtler levels until amness is found. Instead, and this is huge, this is core, what Ramana's Self Inquiry involves is asking a question for which there is no answer. Even amness cannot answer this question. It is a koan, not really a question. Funnily enough, an answer comes nonetheless: silence is the answer. The correct answer to all koans. When doing Self Inquiry, one immediately listens for the Self to say, I am that I am, or, OM, but the only way for the realization of Self to be truthfully embodied is to, erp, not embody itsilence alone can serve as a symbol for the Self. At first, the silence is actually the screaming OM. TM will take you to this EXPERIENCE. Amness is loud. Then, suddenly, grace, and the identification with OM stops, and the Absolute is all that remains. That's the true Self -- not manifest Being/amness/soul. Buddha calls this the void. The mind grows in subtlety by this practice and at some point, amness itself is no longer needed as a symbol when the Absolute is, AHEM, RIGHT THERE IN THE FLESH!! When one asks Who am I? the mind is bypassed. The questioner asks who is experiencing ALL THIS, and since the ego does not exist, is not sentient, no one is home to answer a question that only an ego (by definition) can attempt to answer. Koans I tells ya -- stymieing the intellect which cannot see and the heart which cannot feel the Absolute. Effort ceases immediately as soon as the question is posed. Success is astoundingly immediate: one is COMPLETELY ENLIGHTENED for a nonce. Whereas in mantra meditation, one's gaze passively awaits for the faintest sign of the next mantra -- this is a continual willing of a witnessing alertness. An act. Will power. Self Inquiry is suddenly stopping thinking for a nanosecond and listening to nothing. One asks: Who am I? and if the question is sincere, of course, one PAUSES for an answer to come, and WHAMMO it is immediate, fully blown, not a titch less than all of the truth, silencesilence for as long as one can pause to hear it. No ego steps forward to say, I am you. That would be two I's then, donchasee? Self Inquiry results in an immediate REALIZATION (a non-action) (for however little a span of time doesn't matter) of the Self. Practicing this technique of Self Inquiry will lead to a strengthening of the power to perceive, cuz, well, you gotta have some ears on ya to hear nothing, right? Consider those phone company commercials that brag about having no lost connections. You see some person say something jokingly to another, and the phone disconnects at that precise moment, and the awkward silence is palpable as the joker listens for the laugh that never comes. Asking, Who am I? just such a joke. Finding out that the ego will not answer the question is the silence. Ramana instructs us to ask the question with all the egoic smugness and certainty one can muster -- all the more stunning when the truth, the silence, is seen instead of the expected reply from the other end of the phone line. Enter that silence. Home free Edg --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, matrixmonitor matrixmonitor@ wrote: ---More differences than similarities, chiefly: Self Inquiry involves mentation on meaning, at the initial level of experience. (in the advanced level of Self Inquiry, there's just the Self and no consideration of the meaning); but this is putting the cart before the horse, since the majority of practitioners will be in the beginning category. After some time with the practice of Self Inquiry, the Self emerges to a degree and one can perform true
[FairfieldLife] Re: TM and Improved Behavior
---Right, the false you has died, but the relative you still exists. It's the Rorybody.as opposed to other bodies, for example the Bushbody, the MMYbody, etc... The remaining questions regarding relativity revolve around the importance given to bodies. One can simply dismiss them (things) as being notational, implying unimportance; or, they are in a way notational but still important and significant. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff rorygoff@ wrote: (P.S. It looks as though you've apparently chosen yet again to ignore the main point of the post: the distinction between sattva and purusha, or judging it's a really, really *good* movie vs. actually freeing oneself from belief in the movie. While I enjoy sattvic behavior as much as the next guy, judging anyone's behavior as enlightened or not enlightened would to me fall into the category of judging the quality of the movie.) --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB no_reply@ wrote: Ah, the light dawns. Rory and Jim just don't have any *discrimination*. In a sense, that's true; I don't haplessly identify with the discriminator as I did before dying, as THAT or the Me or the Self is behind discrimination, behind buddhi. In another sense, that's quite untrue, as you may recall I have discriminated into your sloppy thinking here on FFL, which oddly enough appears to be about when you stopped seeing me as a semi- enlightened friend whose experiences you claimed to like to read, and started seeing me as a moodmake-y, unconvincing asshole. Of course, I am both, or neither. I repeat, I can make no claims to enlightenment or ignorance, I can make no claims to anything but having died, and even that from some POVs must be untrue, as here I apparently still am. As to shakti over the internet -- some get it, some don't. I couldn't care less either way. I think it's been pointed out many times on FFL that even the most inveterate shakti-junkies *still* manage to avoid dying. No great suprise there -- who would purposely trade all those great kicks for absolute Nothingness? Only those who have no choice. I am only here to (metaphorically) cut off your head, dance on it, throw your corpse into my fire, consume it utterly, and scatter the sparks to the breeze, and why would you want that unless you *knew* just how much suffering your head was causing you? I do not wonder how or why you so sedulously manage to ignore me. I'll wait. *lol*
[FairfieldLife] Re: new rajas today
---This is sounding more like Herr Himmler!: He then mercilessly hunted down the family, even to distant relatives and had them executed or shipped to concentration camps. Similarly, the disabled or mentally ill were killed or sterilised so as not to pass on their bad blood, and Germans who had intercourse with slave workers, Jews or other inferiors were harshly punished. On the other hand, the elite SS were rewarded for having children, and had special brothels - the children of which were supported by the state In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Jason [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A great man said, A Civilisation is known by how it treats it's weakest member. These factors should not impede an intellectual civilisation. Such a civilisation would know how to handle these problems in a Civilised and Scientific way. Remember the story of Buddha. A beautiful woman wanted to be his disciple. Buddha told her that when she becomes sick, diseased and loses all her beauty he will come and show her compassion and also the path to Enlightment. I think Barry would tell the story more accurately. What would you have done, had you been in Maharishi's shoes.?? Rick Archer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 09:57:06 -0600 Subject: RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: new rajas today Probably not Hawking because MMY feels that people with birth defects or crippling diseases are not qualified to represent the TMO. On a TTC I taught, he rejected a man who had an unsightly birthmark covering much of his face. He gave the TTC course office in FF hell for accepting a dwarf (Peggy?) to the course. __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: Was Rory Martin Bormann?
- Thanks - getting drunk, perhaps being an alcoholic; where do you draw the line, finally admitting that something is not OK?: and realize there's Spiritual work to do, instead of spending their lives watching the NFL and drinking beer? That too can be and actually is spiritual work :-) Sometimes a lifetime or two off getting drunk is just what the doctor ordered! How about if a person is a serial rapist. Would the doctor order that? Or, a methamphetamine salesman? Your POV seems to suggest that everything is OK. Aren't things that are not OK also the Light you talk about? That being case, it seems more logical to disapprove of a career of being a serial rapist or a drug pusher. -- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rory Goff [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, matrixmonitor matrixmonitor@ wrote: --- Thanks, can you see dead people? It's pretty easy for most to do so, I think; all we have to do is let go (at least temporarily) of the belief in the limiting power of spacetime, and trust the subtle body-messages we get. May not be sight; may be any sense or knowing. I did a lot of work (well, a lot of work by *my* standards, which have always been pretty slack) with the dead shortly after waking/dying. At that time, I was also doing a lot of channeling of the Love/Bliss of my higher selves and on some subtle planes our apartment had a huge column of light standing in it, which seemed to attract quite a few confused souls from a number of different time periods. The work mostly consisted of giving them loving attention, telling them they were healed and forgiven, one with their Light, and showing them where the Light is. As they move into it there is often a palpable lightening of the atmosphere, an infusion of sparkle, like ginger- ale. I also used to communicate with them for the bereaved for some years afterwards. I can't say that work has presented itself to me much at all in the last decade or so. If so, what's the status of most of themsay, ordinary people. I can't really say I have never met an ordinary person, or an extraordinary one! (Plus, every person is actually a hierarchical group- mind of countless billions of selves, and every person is a particle of Us.) (And as they are all particles of Us, when we give them our attention, they are immediately bathed in that Light, and usually realize their innate and ecstatic non-existence as Us.) How long does it take them to get their bearings That really varies. Many are actually asleep for several days after death, and many more are in hospital for some time after that. Others go directly into the Light/Bliss/Love, or whatever mansion they most desire/need. Some go through *gut- wrenching, heart-breaking* remorse immediately after dying, sometimes for what seem to me to be relatively minor refractions. Others get swept up immediately into a giant angel. And so on... and realize there's Spiritual work to do, instead of spending their lives watching the NFL and drinking beer? That too can be and actually is spiritual work :-) Sometimes a lifetime or two off getting drunk is just what the doctor ordered! Or, do they not realize there's a Spiritual life and spend their time planning for the next round of insanity? No matter what their conscious attitudes, We are enjoying them, learning from them, growing from them, and so their lives are all equally spiritual to Us. If they wish to join Us in their appreciation of themselves, that's good too -- their choice! And again, from the simplest, truest POV I am aware of in this moment, we are actually only describing particles of the Us, here and now. Many thanks matrix --- fun questions! *L*L*L*
[FairfieldLife] Re: Another Account of Financial Fraud and Danger
--Apart from ordinary tools of conscience, logic, etc; which everyone should use, the question targets those on the Spiritual path...how is their discernment different, adding certain practices, such as TM. Karma is ultimately unfathomable, but in addition to TM, chanting the Gayatri mantra helps one get into sync with Natural Law, along with certain Buddhist mantras. - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, BillyG. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, authfriend jstein@ wrote: Because if the course of action is unfathomable--even to the enlightened--as Krishna declares in the Gita, There is a group of Beings called the Lipika or the Scribes of the Akasa who do know the course of action; also called the Lords of Karma. As MMY does not address this in his BG I think it would be wrong to conclude that the course of action is unfathomable to any and at all times. MMY's point was it was not *necessary* to know the total course of action in order to benefit from acting in accord with it. In Hinduism they are called the Chaturdevas and are great spiritual Intelligences who keep the karmic records and adjust the complicated workings of karmic law Annie Besant The Ancient Wisdom. how would anyone ever know what right was in any given situation? I would think Intuition, based on ...spontaneous right action (like you mentioned), in CC where one becomes capable of performing actions in complete accordance with the laws of nature... MMY Gita 3:8
[FairfieldLife] Re: FairfieldLife : Photos
---Perhaps, only the behavior of not being Enlightened. In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, new.morning [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter drpetersutphen@ wrote: Always wondered with MMY and these other guys if just the laisha vidya is enough when surrounded by yes men to evoke these bizarre behaviors. Are you suggesting that some behaviors are not consistent with enlightenment?
[FairfieldLife] Re: Definitions sahaha, Sarrvikalpa, Nirvikalpa
--There's no false ego in Enlightenment; i.e. a delusional I associated with identification with mind, at the core of one's psyche. In spite of the vanishing act that eradicates the delusional I; evidence bears out the existence of other types of delusions, especially those pertaining to the Guru's notion of self-importance; and here the term self applies to body-mind. Your own Guru admits that there's a body-mind after Enlightenment. I read some of your messages. That body-mind is fully capable of the most egregious, grandious, Emperor/Empress - with no clothes types of delusions; e.g. Bevan, and your Guru in particular, who seems to be infatuated with herself. Besides, I dont' see any new information coming from her. OK, she's Enlightened, what does she want, a medal? - In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ron [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, BillyG. wgm4u@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ron sidha7001@ wrote: Om Namo Narayan Sahaja means effortless and continuous - (not simply the result of being in sitting meditation) This is rather a continous state of Consciousness versus an experience that comes and goes. Sarvikalpa - is still having an identity but it is merged in Oneness. Being One Nirvikalpa - is no me remaining - Simply IS. One does not percieve any story any longer it is over. There is only Pure Awareness without any attributes layered over. IN Nirvikalpa Sahaja there are no longer rising thoughts and oneness has dissolved into 0 point balance. Maha Shanti Sri Ramakrishna describes this distinction very well: Savikalpa Samadhi was compared by Sri Ramakrishna to a cotton doll which when put in water gets saturated with it, and Nirvikalpa Samadhi to a doll of salt which when immersed in water dissolves and loses itself in it. Nirvikalpa is the higher... It reminds me of the saying by Christ Jesus that: Whoever finds his life (ego) will lose it (Cosmic Awareness), and whoever loses his life (litte ego) for my sake will find it (Cosmic Consciousness). Little ego? as in small self? ego will do, there is no ego and enlightenment existing at the same time. You left out sahaja- in both cases with savikalpa and nirvikalpa, it will be different if the sahahja is either there or not. So Realization is Nirvalkalpa sahaja samadi. Sarvikalpa sahaja samadi while an exalted state has the me there. There is further to go yet this is a place one may stop in their journey. This again is a situation where when one is with a Guru resting in Realization, they will know where the disciple is at and then guide them to completion. This again is also the significance in knowing that the Guru is enlightened because they are only capable to take one as far as they themselves are. My Guru had this state and was ready to stop, it was only because of her Guru that she continued as instructed. Sarvikalpa sahaja Samadi is a very attractive place saturated in bliss. Here is an answer to a question from the newest enlightened in our group, resting in nirvakalpa shaja samadhi since 7 days ago: Namaste all, While reading through the posts a question popped up. In the realized state how do you feel about your loved ones? Do you feel as attached to them as before or do you now have a different love for them that is more detached? I am trying to understand how now you are feeling one with the everyone and everything in the world, how you could chose one person over another to spend your life with. Would you not love all people the same? I am not even sure my question makes sense, but hopefully someone will get the gist of it. Amy Namaste Amy You love them more than they have been loved, All IS love as all love itself. There is no *me* to enter in the act of loving, Love IS. Only responsibility to them no attachment and family remains as is, all is perfectly normal. most of what has been remains the same. if you are with a person who you share your life with there would be no reason to change that . But if you are single there is no reason to chase after some one because there is no desires. desires for the most part vanish one dose not feel lonely or dependent on an other. Realization is not an emotion and love is not a feeling but they are also the same. don't try to figure it out just do the practice an trust the Guru. Love Light Jyoti
[FairfieldLife] Yogic flyer spotted in Romania
Superman Seen Over Romania Romania: Investigations are underway into claims by approximately twenty villagers from Gemeni in Mehedinti county that a figure that looked remarkably like Superman flew above their village for a period of time. According to local police all the witness statements are consistent. He looked like Superman and was flying slowly at about 100 yards from the ground in a standing position. He didn't make any smoke or sound. Just cruising around, said one witness. We talked to people of different ages who are all reliable citizens in our village. They all said they saw this strange creature who flew over their houses in his shiny blue costume. We'll just have to see what happens next, said a police officer.
