Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
From: Xenophaneros Anartaxius anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] 
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com

To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2014 12:42 AM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God
 


  
I don't feel hurt or bitter, and I cannot tell if Barry has such emotions, for 
as a writer, he assumes various points of view, not necessarily what he is 
himself experiencing, so I am always curious how you determine these 
characterisations. 

If you're writing to Jimbo (I don't feel like scrolling down to find out), I'm 
pretty sure he does the same thing Willytex does, and just makes them up. 
...


I am pretty sure Barry thinks you are self-deluded about your alleged 
enlightenment, probably on the basis you promote it over much, but also he does 
not seem to consider what is generally called enlightenment here on FFL 
significant compared to other possible experiences. 

I used to think he was deluded about it, but now I think he's just lying out of 
a pathological need to attract attention. He doesn't even seem to know what 
Maharishi's teachings about enlightenment actually *were*, much less what more 
reputable teachers' teachings about enlightenment are.  

[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
It has been my unfortunate experience, to meet individuals, rarely Thank God, 
who can only feel better about themselves, by putting down others. Barry is one 
of those people. Unfortunately, like drinking too many beers, the heady feeling 
wears off over time, leaving one with no further success in life.  
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :

 Why a person feels the need to belittle others for their beliefs is what I 
find odd. 

 Someone like Barry will say, believers in God deserve this because of blah, 
blah, blah.
 

 Well, time on earth is a testing ground.  We get it wrong a lot, but hopefully 
we move ahead.  And people who feel the need to lord over others do not advance 
that purpose.
 

 It really only serves to hi-light their own pettiness.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 
 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 








Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
FYI, I think this is Barry's fourth or fifth post, on something I wrote, that 
he didn't read...I never did care much for fruitcake...
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote :

 From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2014 5:26 AM
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God
 
 
   Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as you 
perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, I do read 
some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional coarseness is a 
turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also sometimes a turn off, but I do 
not perceive him to have a genuine attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) 
Compassion for Jim is not necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, 
therefore not in need of it. 

 

 What he seems in need of is someone to obsess on. Namely me. 

 

 I wrote him off and deprived him of an audience when he feels like yelling at 
someone and telling them how low they are and how high he is. Rather than live 
with that, I guess what Xeno is saying is that Jim keeps writing posts about 
how much he hates Barry *anyway*. 

 

 If that's your idea of what enlightenment is, I wish you luck with it. To me, 
it makes it sound as if Jim is just another version of Steve and Ann and 
Willytex. Ignore any of them, and they obsess on you *more*, not less. 

 
















[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
'Taxius, you make this shit up, and I have no idea where it comes from. WTF do 
you mean, I have no need for compassion?! That is so...crazy. When I am not 
commenting (and sometimes cursing) on FFL, I enjoy a wonderful marriage, and 
being with my daughter, other relatives, and friends - Believe me, I am NOT 
some stone cold fool, off this forum. I lead a full, engaged life, with many 
wishes for success, and an abundance of love, both given and received.  I enjoy 
a unique means of expression, here, broaching subjects and views, that if not 
accepted, are at least discussed and challenged. I DO NOT live my life, 
according to statements I make, about my liberation, my enlightenment, here on 
FFL, to the many people I have relationships with. I live a normal and natural 
life, the guy picking up a sixer of Mexican Coke (contains real sugar, not corn 
syrup), at the Safeway. 
 I never see known 'spiritual teachers' or watch them on TV, or the net, or 
read books about God or spirituality or spiritual teachers, or associate with 
meditating, spiritual, or religious groups. Haven't been to a TM Center in 
almost twenty years. I have been at this spiritual life for nearly forty years, 
and aside from what I enjoy expressing here, the rest has long since been 
integrated, invisibly, into a normal life -- couldn't pick me out of a line-up. 
Hope that helps.:-) 

 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :

 Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as you 
perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, I do read 
some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional coarseness is a 
turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also sometimes a turn off, but I do 
not perceive him to have a genuine attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) 
Compassion for Jim is not necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, 
therefore not in need of it. I would have better understanding if he was a 
little more clarifying about his experience. Sympathy is generally worthless as 
it just imitates someone's suffering or discomfort, or coddles their 
conditioning, which is what we desire to minimise. 

 CYNIC: a person who believes that people are motivated purely by self-interest 
rather than acting for honourable or unselfish reasons.
 

I am probably more of a fatalist than a cynic. I am more of a sceptic than a 
cynic.
 

 I think people are motivated by those forces we call laws of nature, and that 
there is not a real entity in there performing the action. Rather there is an 
elegant machine with inputs and outputs, and getting the mind of the machine, 
the processes of the machine to realise it is a machine is of paramount 
importance for its happiness, satisfaction, and contentment; and from this 
arises tolerance, compassion, understanding, and with some machines, even 
sympathy. 
 

 If one is laid back enough, tolerance is a given. Compassion is recognising a 
situation for what it is so one can focus on the best possible resolution of 
difficulties so that the experience of what is, at the very least, most real, 
opens into experience; this does not necessarily imply any sympathy if it 
prolongs inconsonate, conditioned behaviour. Understanding requires some input, 
and there are certain situations where understanding simply cannot be 
assimilated so one must act in a more cursory fashion, and with probably less 
satisfactory results.
 

 There are many things I do not understand; the world is wide and vast beyond 
the grasp of the human intellect except in bits and pieces one at a time. If I 
have no heart, this is the way nature made my mind; you will need the tolerance 
to accept that for it is not in the power of a fictional entity to change the 
machine.
 

 People assume TM will change all these things, but in practice this does not 
seem to be the case most of the time, people remain more or less the same. 
Enlightenment is not about change. It is about what is always the same. 
Enlightenment does not change these things. Behaviour modification might, but 
this often does not come about by an act of will but by outside imposition, 
such as provided by being surrounded by the mores of an organisation or 
community; and often here, it is just token acceptance, not an actual change. 
 

 The reason you have all these so-called moral rules in religion, is faith, 
belief, and even technical practice — ritual, spiritual techniques — does not 
much alter human nature. Prison tends not to alter human behaviour, and social 
conventions form a psychological prison that has much the same effectiveness — 
that is, practically none, for if the stops are removed, all hell breaks loose.
 

 So if a person is to be 'good', then probably that body has to be born that 
way and will flow naturally along those lines of behaviour; and those that are 
not, well, we see them everyday. Rotten thoughts come from the source of 
thought, whatever that may be, just 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread nablusoss1008
Around 1977 Maharishi said that from that morning more evolved souls are able 
to enter incarnation. More and more I encounter young people who are happy, 
content, successfull, polite and generally positive which makes me believe that 
not only was Maharishi right, as usual, but that the population on this earth 
is being gradually replaced with souls representing higher vibrations.

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote :

 From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2014 5:26 AM
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God
 
 
   Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as you 
perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, I do read 
some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional coarseness is a 
turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also sometimes a turn off, but I do 
not perceive him to have a genuine attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) 
Compassion for Jim is not necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, 
therefore not in need of it. 

 

 What he seems in need of is someone to obsess on. Namely me. 

 

 I wrote him off and deprived him of an audience when he feels like yelling at 
someone and telling them how low they are and how high he is. Rather than live 
with that, I guess what Xeno is saying is that Jim keeps writing posts about 
how much he hates Barry *anyway*. 

 

 If that's your idea of what enlightenment is, I wish you luck with it. To me, 
it makes it sound as if Jim is just another version of Steve and Ann and 
Willytex. Ignore any of them, and they obsess on you *more*, not less. 

 

 Sorry dimwit. It is not because you ignore me (which you, unfortunately 
don't, you mention me all the time) but because your ideas and never-ending 
harping about the same things cries out to be addressed and corrected. It is 
because I disagree with you so much of the time and want to counterpoint your 
mistaken notions and conscious obsession with attributing false motives and 
characteristics to virtually everyone here - including the people you endorse. 
Face it bawee, people have a right to address your comments or you, for that 
matter, any time they bloody well please and it doesn't mean they'r obsessed 
with you or emotionally crushed because you ignore them. See, I had to 
correct you right now because, as usual, you're making up shit.
 
















Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]
On 10/8/2014 12:40 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] 
wrote:


What he seems in need of is someone to obsess on. Namely me.

I wrote him off and deprived him of an audience when he feels like 
yelling at someone and telling them how low they are and how high he 
is. Rather than live with that, I guess what Xeno is saying is that 
Jim keeps writing posts about how much he hates Barry *anyway*.


If that's your idea of what enlightenment is, I wish you luck with it. 
To me, it makes it sound as if Jim is just another version of Steve 
and Ann and Willytex. Ignore any of them, and they obsess on you 
*more*, not less.


/Great minds discuss ideas. Average minds discuss events. Small minds 
discuss people./ - Eleanor Roosevelt


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]


I don't feel hurt or bitter, and I cannot tell if Barry has such 
emotions, for as a writer, he assumes various points of view, not 
necessarily what he is himself experiencing, so I am always curious 
how you determine these characterisations.


On 10/8/2014 2:14 AM, TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] 
wrote:


If you're writing to Jimbo (I don't feel like scrolling down to find 
out), I'm pretty sure he does the same thing Willytex does, and just 
makes them up. 


/What I'm talking about is slowly lifting up off the sofa and sitting//
//in midair for two to three minutes. Or stepping up off the ground in//
//the desert and then flying around several feet above the ground for //
//a while. /

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/message/143231



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]

On 10/8/2014 5:45 AM, fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


FYI, I think this is Barry's fourth or fifth post, on something I 
wrote, that he didn't read...I never did care much for fruitcake...




/These two fellows don't seem to understand that when they create 
folders and filters for a group discussion, that indicates they are 
prejudiced against reading the messages of some the other informants.  
Barry already admitted that he was prejudiced.


You could hardly expect an intelligent conversation when they don't even 
view messages in a threaded format and instead read them as sequential 
email, and take almost everything out of context in their replies. In a 
fair and balanced debate, participants are supposed to read the messages 
BEFORE they post their comments.


They don't even have to be enlightened - just be able to think and 
reply with a little intelligence. Go figure./





---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote :

*From:* anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
*To:* FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
*Sent:* Wednesday, October 8, 2014 5:26 AM
*Subject:* [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe 
in God


Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as 
you perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, 
I do read some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional 
coarseness is a turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also 
sometimes a turn off, but I do not perceive him to have a genuine 
attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) Compassion for Jim is not 
necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, therefore not in need 
of it.


What he seems in need of is someone to obsess on. Namely me.

I wrote him off and deprived him of an audience when he feels like 
yelling at someone and telling them how low they are and how high he 
is. Rather than live with that, I guess what Xeno is saying is that 
Jim keeps writing posts about how much he hates Barry *anyway*.


If that's your idea of what enlightenment is, I wish you luck with it. 
To me, it makes it sound as if Jim is just another version of Steve 
and Ann and Willytex. Ignore any of them, and they obsess on you 
*more*, not less.









Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]

On 10/8/2014 6:19 AM, fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


'Taxius, you make this shit up, and I have no idea where it comes from.



/Mostly it comes from peer pressure - it's not difficult to see how much 
of an impression Barry has made on Xeno. The fact that Judy labeled Xeno 
a liar indicates that that Barry and Xeno would find an attraction 
with each other for ego self-defense. It's not complicated.//


It looks like Xeno was so impressed with Barry that he spent hours, if 
not days, creating folders and filters so he could skip over your 
messages and Judy's too. So why exactly, did Judy call Xeno a liar? Was 
it something Xeno said?


Until we figure out if these two guys are telling the truth, it's going 
to be difficult having a conversation with them. Go figure. /




WTF do you mean, I have no need for compassion?! That is so...crazy. 
When I am not commenting (and sometimes cursing) on FFL, I enjoy a 
wonderful marriage, and being with my daughter, other relatives, and 
friends - Believe me, I am NOT some stone cold fool, off this forum. I 
lead a full, engaged life, with many wishes for success, and an 
abundance of love, both given and received.


I enjoy a unique means of expression, here, broaching subjects and 
views, that if not accepted, are at least discussed and challenged. I 
DO NOT live my life, according to statements I make, about my 
liberation, my enlightenment, here on FFL, to the many people I have 
relationships with. I live a normal and natural life, the guy picking 
up a sixer of Mexican Coke (contains real sugar, not corn syrup), at 
the Safeway.
I never see known 'spiritual teachers' or watch them on TV, or the 
net, or read books about God or spirituality or spiritual teachers, or 
associate with meditating, spiritual, or religious groups. Haven't 
been to a TM Center in almost twenty years. I have been at this 
spiritual life for nearly forty years, and aside from what I enjoy 
expressing here, the rest has long since been integrated, invisibly, 
into a normal life -- couldn't pick me out of a line-up. Hope that 
helps.:-)


---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :

Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as 
you perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, 
I do read some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional 
coarseness is a turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also 
sometimes a turn off, but I do not perceive him to have a genuine 
attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) Compassion for Jim is not 
necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, therefore not in need 
of it. I would have better understanding if he was a little more 
clarifying about his experience. Sympathy is generally worthless as it 
just imitates someone's suffering or discomfort, or coddles their 
conditioning, which is what we desire to minimise.


CYNIC: a person who believes that people are motivated purely
by self-interest rather than acting for honourable or
unselfish reasons.

I am probably more of a fatalist than a cynic. I am more of a
sceptic than a cynic.

I think people are motivated by those forces we call laws of
nature, and that there is not a real entity in there performing
the action. Rather there is an elegant machine with inputs and
outputs, and getting the mind of the machine, the processes of the
machine to realise it is a machine is of paramount importance for
its happiness, satisfaction, and contentment; and from this arises
tolerance, compassion, understanding, and with some machines, even
sympathy.

If one is laid back enough, tolerance is a given. Compassion is
recognising a situation for what it is so one can focus on the
best possible resolution of difficulties so that the experience of
what is, at the very least, most real, opens into experience; this
does not necessarily imply any sympathy if it prolongs
inconsonate, conditioned behaviour. Understanding requires some
input, and there are certain situations where understanding simply
cannot be assimilated so one must act in a more cursory fashion,
and with probably less satisfactory results.

There are many things I do not understand; the world is wide and
vast beyond the grasp of the human intellect except in bits and
pieces one at a time. If I have no heart, this is the way nature
made my mind; you will need the tolerance to accept that for it is
not in the power of a fictional entity to change the machine.

People assume TM will change all these things, but in practice
this does not seem to be the case most of the time, people remain
more or less the same. Enlightenment is not about change. It is
about what is always the same. Enlightenment does not change these
things.Behaviour modification might, but this often does not come
about by an act of will but by 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]



What he seems in need of is someone to obsess on. Namely me.

I wrote him off and deprived him of an audience when he feels like 
yelling at someone and telling them how low they are and how high he 
is. Rather than live with that, I guess what Xeno is saying is that 
Jim keeps writing posts about how much he hates Barry *anyway*.


If that's your idea of what enlightenment is, I wish you luck with it. 
To me, it makes it sound as if Jim is just another version of Steve 
and Ann and Willytex. Ignore any of them, and they obsess on you 
*more*, not less.


On 10/8/2014 8:35 AM, awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:

Sorry dimwit. It is not because you ignore me (which you, 
unfortunately don't, you mention me all the time) but because your 
ideas and never-ending harping about the same things cries out to be 
addressed and corrected. It is because I disagree with you so much of 
the time and want to counterpoint your mistaken notions and conscious 
obsession with attributing false motives and characteristics to 
virtually everyone here - including the people you endorse. Face it 
bawee, people have a right to address your comments or you, for that 
matter, any time they bloody well please and it doesn't mean they'r 
obsessed with you or emotionally crushed because you ignore them. 
See, I had to correct you right now because, as usual, you're making 
up shit.


/The question is, why does Barry feel the need to make stuff up? His 
writing as art should be able to speak for itself. Why would there be 
any need to post fantastic claims of super-normal powers and that his 
teacher could levitate?


Barry seems to have a very big ego - in his own mind he is the most 
interesting guy on the planet. He simply cannot understand why a gal 
like you, that obviously has everything, would not be impressed with all 
his life accomplishments: spiritual teacher; author; science writer; 
talented artist; world traveler; old and wise and so experienced in life.


How could a gal from Texas living in Canada know anything? Go figure.
/


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread Share Long sharelon...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Nablusoss, I agree with you and learn about a lot of these amazing children 
from dailygood.org.
 

 On Wednesday, October 8, 2014 7:33 AM, nablusoss1008 
no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote:
   

     Around 1977 Maharishi said that from that morning more evolved souls are 
able to enter incarnation. More and more I encounter young people who are 
happy, content, successfull, polite and generally positive which makes me 
believe that not only was Maharishi right, as usual, but that the population on 
this earth is being gradually replaced with souls representing higher 
vibrations.  #yiv6736671806 #yiv6736671806 -- #yiv6736671806ygrp-mkp 
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[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Yes, I find the same thing. A more receptive environment for them.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, no_re...@yahoogroups.com wrote :

 Around 1977 Maharishi said that from that morning more evolved souls are able 
to enter incarnation. More and more I encounter young people who are happy, 
content, successfull, polite and generally positive which makes me believe that 
not only was Maharishi right, as usual, but that the population on this earth 
is being gradually replaced with souls representing higher vibrations.



Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
LOL 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :

 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote :

 From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2014 5:26 AM
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God
 
 
   Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as you 
perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, I do read 
some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional coarseness is a 
turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also sometimes a turn off, but I do 
not perceive him to have a genuine attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) 
Compassion for Jim is not necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, 
therefore not in need of it. 

 

 What he seems in need of is someone to obsess on. Namely me. 

 

 I wrote him off and deprived him of an audience when he feels like yelling at 
someone and telling them how low they are and how high he is. Rather than live 
with that, I guess what Xeno is saying is that Jim keeps writing posts about 
how much he hates Barry *anyway*. 

 

 If that's your idea of what enlightenment is, I wish you luck with it. To me, 
it makes it sound as if Jim is just another version of Steve and Ann and 
Willytex. Ignore any of them, and they obsess on you *more*, not less. 

 

 Sorry dimwit. It is not because you ignore me (which you, unfortunately 
don't, you mention me all the time) but because your ideas and never-ending 
harping about the same things cries out to be addressed and corrected. It is 
because I disagree with you so much of the time and want to counterpoint your 
mistaken notions and conscious obsession with attributing false motives and 
characteristics to virtually everyone here - including the people you endorse. 
Face it bawee, people have a right to address your comments or you, for that 
matter, any time they bloody well please and it doesn't mean they'r obsessed 
with you or emotionally crushed because you ignore them. See, I had to 
correct you right now because, as usual, you're making up shit.
 


















[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-08 Thread blue_bungalow2

 

 --- anartaxius@... wrote:
 
 Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as you 
perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, I do read 
some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional coarseness is a 
turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also sometimes a turn off, but I do 
not perceive him to have a genuine attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) 
Compassion for Jim is not necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, 
therefore not in need of it. 

 

--- turquoiseb@... wrote :


 What he seems in need of is someone to obsess on. Namely me.

I wrote him off and deprived him of an audience when he feels like yelling at 
someone and telling them how low they are and how high he is. Rather than live 
with that, I guess what Xeno is saying is that Jim keeps writing posts about 
how much he hates Barry *anyway*.

If that's your idea of what enlightenment is, I wish you luck with it. To me, 
it makes it sound as if Jim is just another version of Steve and Ann and 
Willytex. Ignore any of them, and they obsess on you *more*, not less. 

 

--- awoelflebater@... wrote :

Sorry dimwit. It is not because you ignore me (which you, unfortunately 
don't, you mention me all the time) but because your ideas and never-ending 
harping about the same things cries out to be addressed and corrected. It is 
because I disagree with you so much of the time and want to counterpoint your 
mistaken notions and conscious obsession with attributing false motives and 
characteristics to virtually everyone here - including the people you endorse. 
Face it bawee, people have a right to address your comments or you, for that 
matter, any time they bloody well please and it doesn't mean they'r obsessed 
with you or emotionally crushed because you ignore them. See, I had to 
correct you right now because, as usual, you're making up shit.

 

 

Once, all that Bob Price pointed out is that, aquamarine is 
'cobalt blue' and Uncle Tantra lashed out at him, by calling 
him a roach.

How objective is that? He is as foul mouthed as anybody else 
here. 

  
 

















[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 
 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 

 Phew, that was a lot of God coming through in you post Mac. Thanks for that.
 





[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Good morning! Back on the Beaut, and high on life, 1300 feet above the 
valley!  The dawn is a very quiet one. A few hours ago when I awoke, the sky 
was clear, with the full moon setting, and the last of the stars. Now, the sky 
is a blanket of soft grey, getting very gradually lighter.
 After months of transition, we are getting our furniture and belongings today! 
One of the first things I want to do, is set up a table and chairs in the 
dining nook, off the kitchen, overlooking heaven, in the back yard, for morning 
chai. A very good day! 
 
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :

 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 
 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 

 Phew, that was a lot of God coming through in you post Mac. Thanks for that.
 








[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Good morning! Back on the Beaut, and high on life, 1300 feet above the 
valley!  The dawn is a very quiet one. A few hours ago when I awoke, the sky 
was clear, with the full moon setting, and the last of the stars. Now, the sky 
is a blanket of soft grey, getting very gradually lighter.
 After months of transition, we are getting our furniture and belongings today! 
One of the first things I want to do, is set up a table and chairs in the 
dining nook, off the kitchen, overlooking heaven, in the back yard, for morning 
chai. A very good day! 
 

 Yes indeed, an excellent start to the day. 
 

 I am about to get into my Bogs and jeans and sweatshirt and toddle out to 6 
expectant horses and feed them. My four dogs will follow me out and they will 
run and play and bark all the while believing they are getting the horses 
back and doing something useful. Then I will turn the various horses out into 
the fields where they will pair up with their respective buddies and chomp away 
at the remaining grass - all dry and brown - and bask in the unseasonably warm 
day we seem to be having right now. Yup, I love the little things in life, the 
small rituals.
 

 

 










[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread j_alexander_stan...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but you are, unfortunately, in a prime 
viewing area to view tomorrow's blood moon lunar eclipse. I trust you will 
have the good sense to shut yourself away in a meditation bunker, remaining 
safely unsullied by inauspicious photons.

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com wrote :

 Good morning! Back on the Beaut, and high on life, 1300 feet above the 
valley!  The dawn is a very quiet one. A few hours ago when I awoke, the sky 
was clear, with the full moon setting, and the last of the stars. Now, the sky 
is a blanket of soft grey, getting very gradually lighter.
 After months of transition, we are getting our furniture and belongings today! 
One of the first things I want to do, is set up a table and chairs in the 
dining nook, off the kitchen, overlooking heaven, in the back yard, for morning 
chai. A very good day! 
 
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :

 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 

 Phew, that was a lot of God coming through in you post Mac. Thanks for that.
 










[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread j_alexander_stan...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Viewing Guide: Watch Blood Moon During Total Lunar Eclipse on Wednesday 
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/10/141006-blood-moon-lunar-eclipse-october-science/
 
 
 
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/10/141006-blood-moon-lunar-eclipse-october-science/
 
 
 Viewing Guide: Watch Blood Moon During Total Lunar Ec... 
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/10/141006-blood-moon-lunar-eclipse-october-science/
 A red-hued lunar eclipse will be visible across most of North America 
Wednesday morning.
 
 
 
 View on news.nationalgeogr... 
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/10/141006-blood-moon-lunar-eclipse-october-science/
 
 Preview by Yahoo 
 
 
 


 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, j_alexander_stan...@yahoo.com wrote :

 
 Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but you are, unfortunately, in a prime 
viewing area to view tomorrow's blood moon lunar eclipse. I trust you will 
have the good sense to shut yourself away in a meditation bunker, remaining 
safely unsullied by inauspicious photons.

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com wrote :

 Good morning! Back on the Beaut, and high on life, 1300 feet above the 
valley!  The dawn is a very quiet one. A few hours ago when I awoke, the sky 
was clear, with the full moon setting, and the last of the stars. Now, the sky 
is a blanket of soft grey, getting very gradually lighter.
 After months of transition, we are getting our furniture and belongings today! 
One of the first things I want to do, is set up a table and chairs in the 
dining nook, off the kitchen, overlooking heaven, in the back yard, for morning 
chai. A very good day! 
 
---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :

 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 

 Phew, that was a lot of God coming through in you post Mac. Thanks for that.
 












[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
--In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 
 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 

 ===
 

 Don't you think this last sentence is a bit presumptuous? I mean, you are 
enlightened and all that, and can tell the rest of us how enlightened or 
unenlightened we are, but how do you determine how rich a person's experience 
is, other than your own?
 





Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
From: anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com

To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Tuesday, October 7, 2014 5:00 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God
 


  
--In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :


Belief
is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This
belief remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there
are few times, when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.

So
it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, that is 
pursued, instead of a close, immediate,
ongoing relationship with Him and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in 
God, yet He and She make their presence known to
me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital and alive. 

I
did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to
write, or speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was
taught, this idea of God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the
spectrum, from static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote,
authoritarian God, to a universe brimming with God, in all of Her and
His creativity, endless expansion, and love. A creation that brings
so many aspects, so many dynamics, of God to light, that it makes
belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air and sunlight.

So,
Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for
it.:-)

===

Don't you think this last sentence is a bit presumptuous? I mean, you are 
enlightened and all that, and can tell the rest of us how enlightened or 
unenlightened we are, but how do you determine how rich a person's experience 
is, other than your own?

I stopped reading his posts some time ago, but unless he's changed his tune 
recently, by definition *everyone's* experience, other than his own, is lesser 
than Jimbo's.  *You* are being presumptuous to assume otherwise.  :-)

[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :

 --In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 
 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 

 ===
 

 Don't you think this last sentence is a bit presumptuous? I mean, you are 
enlightened and all that, and can tell the rest of us how enlightened or 
unenlightened we are, but how do you determine how rich a person's experience 
is, other than your own?
 

 Aw Xeno, play a little. When was the last time you did a little twirl in 
delight or skipped a step or two just because you had a moment of spontaneous 
happiness or joy and it made your body respond like a fawn or foal or puppy 
might? Are we ever too old or too tired or too unsurprised to be content with 
plodding? I sincerely hope not - kill me before I get to that point.
 







Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread Bhairitu noozg...@sbcglobal.net [FairfieldLife]
Hopefully that doesn't mean that they local fault lines don't decided to 
party and rock'n roll since the gravitational pull is even more during 
eclipses.


On 10/07/2014 07:50 AM, j_alexander_stan...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:



Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but you are, unfortunately, in a 
prime viewing area to view tomorrow's blood moon lunar eclipse. I 
trust you will have the good sense to shut yourself away in a 
meditation bunker, remaining safely unsullied by inauspicious photons.


---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com 
wrote :


Good morning! Back on the Beaut, and high on life, 1300 feet above 
the valley!
The dawn is a very quiet one. A few hours ago when I awoke, the sky 
was clear, with the full moon setting, and the last of the stars. Now, 
the sky is a blanket of soft grey, getting very gradually lighter.
After months of transition, we are getting our furniture and 
belongings today! One of the first things I want to do, is set up a 
table and chairs in the dining nook, off the kitchen, overlooking 
heaven, in the back yard, for morning chai. A very good day!


---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :




---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one 
experience of a subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth 
is round. This belief remains in place, and helps our world make 
sense, though there are few times, when we actually observe the 
curvature of our planet.



So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the *belief* 
in God, that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing 
relationship with Him and Her. I cannot honestly say that I *believe* 
in God, yet He and She make their presence known to me, moment to 
moment, and the relationship is always vital and alive.



I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to 
write, or speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was 
taught, this idea of God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. 
Running the spectrum, from static definitions, with no direct contact; 
a remote, authoritarian God, to a universe brimming with God, in all 
of Her and His creativity, endless expansion, and love. A creation 
that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, of God to light, that 
it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air and sunlight.



So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer 
for it.:-)



Phew, that was a lot of God coming through in you post Mac. Thanks for 
that.








Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 


 

 ===
 

 Don't you think this last sentence is a bit presumptuous? I mean, you are 
enlightened and all that, and can tell the rest of us how enlightened or 
unenlightened we are, but how do you determine how rich a person's experience 
is, other than your own?
 

 I stopped reading his posts some time ago, but unless he's changed his tune 
recently, by definition *everyone's* experience, other than his own, is lesser 
than Jimbo's.  *You* are being presumptuous to assume otherwise.  :-)
 

 The all-important proclamation - must come at the beginning of the paragraph. 
 

 


















Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]

On 10/7/2014 10:00 AM, anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] wrote:


Don't you think this last sentence is a bit presumptuous? I mean, you 
are enlightened and all that, and can tell the rest of us how 
enlightened or unenlightened we are, but how do you determine how rich 
a person's experience is, other than your own?




/It works like this - on social media in order to prove your life is 
richer than your debating opponent, all you have to do is post some 
para-normal claims that are grander, bigger and more fantastic than 
anyone else in the discussion. //

//
//For example, you might claim that space aliens abducted you and took 
you up into a ship and probed you, then put you back in your bed and 
covered you up with a blanket.


Or, you might claim that you saw an English professor lift up slowly 
off of a sofa out in the desert in the middle of the night, along with 
200 other hippies.//

//
//It's not complicated./





[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Barry knows the truth, as do I. No presumption made.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :

 --In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 
 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 

 ===
 

 Don't you think this last sentence is a bit presumptuous? I mean, you are 
enlightened and all that, and can tell the rest of us how enlightened or 
unenlightened we are, but how do you determine how rich a person's experience 
is, other than your own?
 







Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
In all honesty, you have never presented a very high bar for comparison, Barry. 
I mean, come on, drinking beer and watching TV, alone? Punctuated by regular 
screeds on how screwed up the rest of us are. 
 

 Hardly what I would call a raging success, on your part, after following 
spiritual teachers for decades. No wonder you sound hurt, and bitter. 
 

 Try TM. It works.
 

 ---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote :

 From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
 To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
 Sent: Tuesday, October 7, 2014 5:00 PM
 Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God
 
 
   --In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 

 ===
 

 Don't you think this last sentence is a bit presumptuous? I mean, you are 
enlightened and all that, and can tell the rest of us how enlightened or 
unenlightened we are, but how do you determine how rich a person's experience 
is, other than your own?
 

 I stopped reading his posts some time ago, but unless he's changed his tune 
recently, by definition *everyone's* experience, other than his own, is lesser 
than Jimbo's.  *You* are being presumptuous to assume otherwise.  :-)
 

 



















Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread Xenophaneros Anartaxius anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
I don't know what Barry does when he is alone, but he is living with others 
according to his own account, so how much aloneness he experiences seems a bit 
difficult to determine from across the pond; how much he drinks is also 
difficult to determine. He posted a photo of a glass of red wine, shot in a 
garden once, in the evening, next to his laptop. Kind of hard to avoid that if 
you live in France for a while.

I don't feel hurt or bitter, and I cannot tell if Barry has such emotions, for 
as a writer, he assumes various points of view, not necessarily what he is 
himself experiencing, so I am always curious how you determine these 
characterisations. He tried TM, and followed Lenz for a while. I suspect he 
learned something from those experiences. For myself, I did try TM; it worked 
quite well for some four decades plus though it seems a little frayed now; 
mindfulness works better now, which it did not in the beginning, but I learned 
mindfulness first, a long time ago. Not-doing now is a breeze. I tend not to 
follow spiritual teachers; I mine them for the information I desire. Spiritual 
teachers are a quirky lot. As just about everyone seems to have some screws 
loose before they get into spiritual concerns, I always wonder how much of that 
remains once they have been immersed in the spiritual quest for a time, and 
that goes for the 'masters' too. As we are part
 of that group that are, or were seekers, I suspect none of us are free of some 
individual quirks that might annoy others. A certain kind of luck is required 
because until a certain point, you cannot tell if a spiritual teacher is just 
screwing you over or giving you truly good advice, so going down blind alleys 
is always a potential result. 

I am pretty sure Barry thinks you are self-deluded about your alleged 
enlightenment, probably on the basis you promote it over much, but also he does 
not seem to consider what is generally called enlightenment here on FFL 
significant compared to other possible experiences. That is not my view, but 
then I have never met anyone who does have my view, other people think 
different things. Curious isn't that? For my part, based on what you have said, 
I think you had some sort of experience, epiphany, or awakening, but your 
descriptions of the result leave me in doubt because they seem to lack certain 
details, and you did not seem to grasp concepts found in Vedanta at all, even 
though this is way of looking at enlightenment is directly involved with 
Shankara, and Maharishi certainly seemed aware of it, though he did not seem to 
talk about it extensively. The concepts are not 'the truth' of course but you 
should be able to manipulate and explain the principles.
 I suppose I find your statements lack a certain precision, because I like 
precision, and that does not seem to be your way of expressing yourself. You 
tend, from my point of view, to block things out in broad strokes.

I sometimes drink beer and watch TV alone, but usually I drink tea or coffee or 
a soda, and usually I watch TV with someone else unless the content strains 
their sensibilities, as quite a few meditators seem to have difficulty with 
certain kinds of images, either by inclination, or by having been programmed by 
others to avoid such because it is not 'evolutionary'. 



 From: fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] 
FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com
To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Tuesday, October 7, 2014 6:06 PM
Subject: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God
 


  
In all honesty, you have never presented a very high bar for comparison, Barry. 
I mean, come on, drinking beer and watching TV, alone? Punctuated by regular 
screeds on how screwed up the rest of us are. 

Hardly what I would call a raging success, on your part, after following 
spiritual teachers for decades. No wonder you sound hurt, and bitter. 

Try TM. It works.

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, turquoiseb@... wrote :


From: anartaxius@... [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com

To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Tuesday, October 7, 2014 5:00 PM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God



 
--In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :


Belief
is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This
belief remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there
are few times, when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.

So
it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, that is 
pursued, instead of a close, immediate,
ongoing relationship with Him and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in 
God, yet He and She make their presence known to
me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital and alive. 

I
did not think up God on my own, just as I would not 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread 'Richard J. Williams' pundits...@gmail.com [FairfieldLife]
On 10/7/2014 5:42 PM, Xenophaneros Anartaxius anartax...@yahoo.com 
[FairfieldLife] wrote:

Not-doing now is a breeze.


/That's the most difficult part of the program for me. Although it looks 
easy, try doing nothing for a few minutes. That's actually the first 
practice step in Qigong - standing or sitting and doing absolutely 
nothing. You'll find it much more difficult than you thought.//

//
//There is only your mind - in reality; just sitting and doing nothing 
IS enlightenment./


Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread fleetwood_macnche...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :

 
 


 

 ===
 

 Don't you think this last sentence is a bit presumptuous? I mean, you are 
enlightened and all that, and can tell the rest of us how enlightened or 
unenlightened we are, but how do you determine how rich a person's experience 
is, other than your own?
 

 I stopped reading his posts some time ago, but unless he's changed his tune 
recently, by definition *everyone's* experience, other than his own, is lesser 
than Jimbo's.  *You* are being presumptuous to assume otherwise.  :-)
 

 The all-important proclamation - must come at the beginning of the paragraph. 
 

 I guess he felt pretty threatened by my imperial existence, in a trailer park, 
in the Central Valley, for four months, every day close to 100 F - Poor fella. 
Seems after all his smack talk blew up in his face, now he rehashes his 
accusation, that I feel superior to everyone. 
 Am I so uppity, now? I can't wallow in the hood, wit' da home boy. Can't 
adhere to the dogma, the austerity and limitations of a material life, the 
isolation and confusion of the waking state, the dimming memories when 
something was alive, once - what a truly fucked and wretched existence that 
would be.
 It will be a gorgeous sunset, soon - looks like a coyote was within twenty 
feet of the house, inside the fence. As long as he doesn't go for a swim...
 

 


















[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread steve.sun...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Why a person feels the need to belittle others for their beliefs is what I find 
odd. 

 Someone like Barry will say, believers in God deserve this because of blah, 
blah, blah.
 

 Well, time on earth is a testing ground.  We get it wrong a lot, but hopefully 
we move ahead.  And people who feel the need to lord over others do not advance 
that purpose.
 

 It really only serves to hi-light their own pettiness.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, fleetwood_macncheese@... wrote :

 Belief is a thought, that moves us through the gap, from one experience of a 
subject, to another. For example, we believe the earth is round. This belief 
remains in place, and helps our world make sense, though there are few times, 
when we actually observe the curvature of our planet.
 

 So it is, with a strong belief in God. Often it becomes the belief in God, 
that is pursued, instead of a close, immediate, ongoing relationship with Him 
and Her. I cannot honestly say that I believe in God, yet He and She make their 
presence known to me, moment to moment, and the relationship is always vital 
and alive. 
 

 I did not think up God on my own, just as I would not know how to write, or 
speak, or drive a car, or try to treat people well. It was taught, this idea of 
God - many different aspects, over a lifetime. Running the spectrum, from 
static definitions, with no direct contact; a remote, authoritarian God, to a 
universe brimming with God, in all of Her and His creativity, endless 
expansion, and love. A creation that brings so many aspects, so many dynamics, 
of God to light, that it makes belief in God, irrelevant. Like believing in air 
and sunlight.
 

 
 So, Barry, I too, do not believe in God, but only one of us is richer for 
it.:-)
 






[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread steve.sun...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
I will pray for you taxius, that maybe you will be able to get out of your head 
a little, and into your heart a little, and then you will understand the 
tenants of tolerance, compassion, understanding, and sympathy. 

 These are worthwhile emotions dude.
 

 I am not sure how you culture them, but for sure you don't culture them by a 
certain hard cynicism we often see here.
 

 It's not complicated.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :
 
 

 Don't you think this last sentence is a bit presumptuous? I mean, you are 
enlightened and all that, and can tell the rest of us how enlightened or 
unenlightened we are, but how do you determine how rich a person's experience 
is, other than your own?
 








Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread steve.sun...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
That is funny. 

 I wonder if we could improve upon it.
 

 I don't often read Jim's posts, but when I do, I do so indirectly
 

 Alright, pretty lame.
 

 Best I can do right now.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :
 

 

 The all-important proclamation - must come at the beginning of the paragraph. 
 

 





















Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :

 I don't know what Barry does when he is alone, but he is living with others 
according to his own account, so how much aloneness he experiences seems a bit 
difficult to determine from across the pond; how much he drinks is also 
difficult to determine. He posted a photo of a glass of red wine, shot in a 
garden once, in the evening, next to his laptop. Kind of hard to avoid that if 
you live in France for a while.
 

 I don't feel hurt or bitter, and I cannot tell if Barry has such emotions, for 
as a writer, he assumes various points of view, not necessarily what he is 
himself experiencing, so I am always curious how you determine these 
characterisations. He tried TM, and followed Lenz for a while. I suspect he 
learned something from those experiences. For myself, I did try TM; it worked 
quite well for some four decades plus though it seems a little frayed now; 
mindfulness works better now, which it did not in the beginning, but I learned 
mindfulness first, a long time ago. Not-doing now is a breeze. I tend not to 
follow spiritual teachers; I mine them for the information I desire. Spiritual 
teachers are a quirky lot. As just about everyone seems to have some screws 
loose before they get into spiritual concerns, I always wonder how much of that 
remains once they have been immersed in the spiritual quest for a time, and 
that goes for the 'masters' too. As we are part of that group that are, or were 
seekers, I suspect none of us are free of some individual quirks that might 
annoy others. A certain kind of luck is required because until a certain point, 
you cannot tell if a spiritual teacher is just screwing you over or giving you 
truly good advice, so going down blind alleys is always a potential result. 
 

 I am pretty sure Barry thinks you are self-deluded about your alleged 
enlightenment, probably on the basis you promote it over much, but also he does 
not seem to consider what is generally called enlightenment here on FFL 
significant compared to other possible experiences. That is not my view, but 
then I have never met anyone who does have my view, other people think 
different things. Curious isn't that? For my part, based on what you have said, 
I think you had some sort of experience, epiphany, or awakening, but your 
descriptions of the result leave me in doubt because they seem to lack certain 
details, and you did not seem to grasp concepts found in Vedanta at all, even 
though this is way of looking at enlightenment is directly involved with 
Shankara, and Maharishi certainly seemed aware of it, though he did not seem to 
talk about it extensively. The concepts are not 'the truth' of course but you 
should be able to manipulate and explain the principles. I suppose I find your 
statements lack a certain precision, because I like precision, and that does 
not seem to be your way of expressing yourself. You tend, from my point of 
view, to block things out in broad strokes.
 

 I sometimes drink beer and watch TV alone, but usually I drink tea or coffee 
or a soda, and usually I watch TV with someone else unless the content strains 
their sensibilities, as quite a few meditators seem to have difficulty with 
certain kinds of images, either by inclination, or by having been programmed by 
others to avoid such because it is not 'evolutionary'. 
 

 It doesn't take a Sherlock to be able to figure out how bawee spends his time 
- he tells us in almost every post. He also tells us what he believes, what he 
is feeling and not only that, he tells us what we should believe and what we 
should be feeling. It is right there Xeno, in black and white. bawee is no 
mystery nor does he choose to make his daily rituals and habits some sort of 
enigma.  How you think it all adds up to equate to the kind of person you seem 
to think he is varies from what some others sum it all up to indicate. I am not 
sure why you feel you need to explain or defend him. Maybe you feel bad for the 
guy or maybe you just like to provide an alternate viewpoint.
 

 As far as Mac goes I have no idea how to categorize someone as enlightened or 
not or whether how they describe it fills the bill (hey empty). It makes 
absolutely zero difference to me whether someone is enlightened or not. I hung 
around someone I believed to be enlightened for a while and it ended rather 
badly. Once bitten, twice shy or so someone  supposedly said. So, while I don't 
give a rat's ass about surrounding myself with enlightened people or reading 
about them I simply go by what a person does and says and how they interact 
with me and the world. Mac, to me, is a well-rounded, intelligent and 
interesting guy who doesn't suffer fools very well. I can relate to much of 
what he says here. All that is just fine and dandy with me. If he is 
enlightened on top of all that, then consider it the cherry.
 

 In your last paragraph you indicate you live with or associate with 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread awoelfleba...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]

 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :

 That is funny. 

 I wonder if we could improve upon it.
 

 I don't often read Jim's posts, but when I do, I do so indirectly
 

 Alright, pretty lame.
 

 Best I can do right now.
 

 Stevie, I'm lovin' you more with each post.
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, awoelflebater@... wrote :
 

 

 The all-important proclamation - must come at the beginning of the paragraph. 
 

 























[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as you 
perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, I do read 
some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional coarseness is a 
turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also sometimes a turn off, but I do 
not perceive him to have a genuine attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) 
Compassion for Jim is not necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, 
therefore not in need of it. I would have better understanding if he was a 
little more clarifying about his experience. Sympathy is generally worthless as 
it just imitates someone's suffering or discomfort, or coddles their 
conditioning, which is what we desire to minimise. 

 CYNIC: a person who believes that people are motivated purely by self-interest 
rather than acting for honourable or unselfish reasons.
 

I am probably more of a fatalist than a cynic. I am more of a sceptic than a 
cynic.
 

 I think people are motivated by those forces we call laws of nature, and that 
there is not a real entity in there performing the action. Rather there is an 
elegant machine with inputs and outputs, and getting the mind of the machine, 
the processes of the machine to realise it is a machine is of paramount 
importance for its happiness, satisfaction, and contentment; and from this 
arises tolerance, compassion, understanding, and with some machines, even 
sympathy. 
 

 If one is laid back enough, tolerance is a given. Compassion is recognising a 
situation for what it is so one can focus on the best possible resolution of 
difficulties so that the experience of what is, at the very least, most real, 
opens into experience; this does not necessarily imply any sympathy if it 
prolongs inconsonate, conditioned behaviour. Understanding requires some input, 
and there are certain situations where understanding simply cannot be 
assimilated so one must act in a more cursory fashion, and with probably less 
satisfactory results.
 

 There are many things I do not understand; the world is wide and vast beyond 
the grasp of the human intellect except in bits and pieces one at a time. If I 
have no heart, this is the way nature made my mind; you will need the tolerance 
to accept that for it is not in the power of a fictional entity to change the 
machine.
 

 People assume TM will change all these things, but in practice this does not 
seem to be the case most of the time, people remain more or less the same. 
Enlightenment is not about change. It is about what is always the same. 
Enlightenment does not change these things. Behaviour modification might, but 
this often does not come about by an act of will but by outside imposition, 
such as provided by being surrounded by the mores of an organisation or 
community; and often here, it is just token acceptance, not an actual change. 
 

 The reason you have all these so-called moral rules in religion, is faith, 
belief, and even technical practice — ritual, spiritual techniques — does not 
much alter human nature. Prison tends not to alter human behaviour, and social 
conventions form a psychological prison that has much the same effectiveness — 
that is, practically none, for if the stops are removed, all hell breaks loose.
 

 So if a person is to be 'good', then probably that body has to be born that 
way and will flow naturally along those lines of behaviour; and those that are 
not, well, we see them everyday. Rotten thoughts come from the source of 
thought, whatever that may be, just as easily as 'good' thoughts. The TMO 
simply removes those from the roster who fail to conform to the allegedly 
predicted results of meditation, and hopes nobody notices the change. The 
higher up in the organisation though, persistence rather than removal seems to 
be the rule.
 

 Would another, deeper awakening result in a looser, more compassionate 
emotional tenancy for 'me'? It might or it might not; I have no idea; I do not 
know what remains of and for my life, I just know it goes forward and it has 
been satisfactory for some time. It is now time for me to sit very quietly for 
awhile. I do this from habit and it seems to correlate with what I would call 
improvements in my grasp of life, but from this point on, as it has been for 
the last decade or so, how that might or might not unfold is a complete mystery 
to me.
 

 Allow me the space to have this happen. Prayer is not necessary, for nature 
takes its course in any case. All beings revolve as if mounted on a machine.
 

 
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, steve.sundur@... wrote :

 I will pray for you taxius, that maybe you will be able to get out of your 
head a little, and into your heart a little, and then you will understand the 
tenants of tolerance, compassion, understanding, and sympathy. 

 These are worthwhile emotions dude.
 

 I am not sure how you culture them, but for sure you don't culture them by a 
certain hard cynicism we often 

[FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread steve.sun...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
Well, you're right.  I'm really not the praying type. 

 I can see that I'm going to have to be more careful in picking the terms I use.
 

 I do enjoy it when you sprinkle in some of that dry humor in your responses.
 

 More comments below:
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, anartaxius@... wrote :

 Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as you 
perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, I do read 
some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional coarseness is a 
turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also sometimes a turn off, but I do 
not perceive him to have a genuine attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) 
Compassion for Jim is not necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, 
therefore not in need of it. I would have better understanding if he was a 
little more clarifying about his experience. Sympathy is generally worthless as 
it just imitates someone's suffering or discomfort, or coddles their 
conditioning, which is what we desire to minimise. 

 CYNIC: a person who believes that people are motivated purely by self-interest 
rather than acting for honourable or unselfish reasons.
 

I am probably more of a fatalist than a cynic. I am more of a sceptic than a 
cynic.
 

 I think people are motivated by those forces we call laws of nature, and that 
there is not a real entity in there performing the action. Rather there is an 
elegant machine with inputs and outputs, and getting the mind of the machine, 
the processes of the machine to realise it is a machine is of paramount 
importance for its happiness, satisfaction, and contentment; and from this 
arises tolerance, compassion, understanding, and with some machines, even 
sympathy. 
 

 Ouch, I hadn't meat robot in some time, and here you are bringing it up.
 

 Oh well.
 

 If one is laid back enough, tolerance is a given. Compassion is recognising a 
situation for what it is so one can focus on the best possible resolution of 
difficulties so that the experience of what is, at the very least, most real, 
opens into experience; this does not necessarily imply any sympathy if it 
prolongs inconsonate, conditioned behaviour. Understanding requires some input, 
and there are certain situations where understanding simply cannot be 
assimilated so one must act in a more cursory fashion, and with probably less 
satisfactory results.
 

 There are many things I do not understand; the world is wide and vast beyond 
the grasp of the human intellect except in bits and pieces one at a time. If I 
have no heart, this is the way nature made my mind; you will need the tolerance 
to accept that for it is not in the power of a fictional entity to change the 
machine.
 

 People assume TM will change all these things, but in practice this does not 
seem to be the case most of the time, people remain more or less the same. 
Enlightenment is not about change. It is about what is always the same. 
Enlightenment does not change these things. Behaviour modification might, but 
this often does not come about by an act of will but by outside imposition, 
such as provided by being surrounded by the mores of an organisation or 
community; and often here, it is just token acceptance, not an actual change. 
 

 The reason you have all these so-called moral rules in religion, is faith, 
belief, and even technical practice — ritual, spiritual techniques — does not 
much alter human nature. Prison tends not to alter human behaviour, and social 
conventions form a psychological prison that has much the same effectiveness — 
that is, practically none, for if the stops are removed, all hell breaks loose.
 

 So if a person is to be 'good', then probably that body has to be born that 
way and will flow naturally along those lines of behaviour; and those that are 
not, well, we see them everyday. Rotten thoughts come from the source of 
thought, whatever that may be, just as easily as 'good' thoughts. The TMO 
simply removes those from the roster who fail to conform to the allegedly 
predicted results of meditation, and hopes nobody notices the change. The 
higher up in the organisation though, persistence rather than removal seems to 
be the rule.
 

 Would another, deeper awakening result in a looser, more compassionate 
emotional tenancy for 'me'? It might or it might not; I have no idea; I do not 
know what remains of and for my life, I just know it goes forward and it has 
been satisfactory for some time. It is now time for me to sit very quietly for 
awhile. I do this from habit and it seems to correlate with what I would call 
improvements in my grasp of life, but from this point on, as it has been for 
the last decade or so, how that might or might not unfold is a complete mystery 
to me.
 

 I think I am gaining a better appreciation of what enlightenment, or the 
growth thereof can do in terms of modifying behavior, and yes, I'm not sure if 
it is much.
 

 But having a few mystical 

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God

2014-10-07 Thread TurquoiseBee turquoi...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife]
From: anartax...@yahoo.com [FairfieldLife] FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com

To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
Sent: Wednesday, October 8, 2014 5:26 AM
Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: Yes, Barry, there is no need to believe in God
 


  
Not likely, but why pray? How is that going to change the situation as you 
perceive it? I do have a certain tolerance for Jim; unlike Barry, I do read 
some of his posts, though their usual brevity and emotional coarseness is a 
turn off. (Barry's emotional coarseness is also sometimes a turn off, but I do 
not perceive him to have a genuine attachment to it, so mostly it is just fun.) 
Compassion for Jim is not necessary, he is enlightened by his own account, 
therefore not in need of it. 


What he seems in need of is someone to obsess on. Namely me. 


I wrote him off and deprived him of an audience when he feels like yelling at 
someone and telling them how low they are and how high he is. Rather than live 
with that, I guess what Xeno is saying is that Jim keeps writing posts about 
how much he hates Barry *anyway*. 


If that's your idea of what enlightenment is, I wish you luck with it. To me, 
it makes it sound as if Jim is just another version of Steve and Ann and 
Willytex. Ignore any of them, and they obsess on you *more*, not less.