Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

2012-10-13 Thread molveywda
Should have tied a string to the rabbit and dragged it along the floor.  They 
chase and eat anything that moves in my house!  If flies had enough protein 
several of mine could live off them.

Sent from my HTC Inspire™ 4G on ATT

- Reply message -
From: dlg...@windstream.net
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food
Date: Fri, Oct 12, 2012 4:09 pm
i TRIED RABBIT FROM A NEIGHBOR WHO RAISES HIS ORGANIC FOR HIS OWN FOOD.  THEY 
LOOKED AT IT LIKE IT WAS ALIEN, WOULD NOT EVEN TOUCH IT.  I ONLY HAVE 7, BUT 
KEEPING ENOUGH MEAT FOR THEM WOULD BE A PROBLEM.  i HAVE A SIDE BY SIDE AND THE 
FREEZER IS NOT THAT LARGE.  AND GETTING IT OUT IN TIME TO THAW WOULD BE A 
PROBLEM WITH MY MEMORY.

 Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote: 
 It would be nice if I could do that but I'm feeding around 35 cats right now. 
  Feeding raw would cost me around $9 a day with turns into around $250 a 
 month.  On top of which, I would be a little nervous to feed raw chicken to 
 the cats.  Some of them probably wouldn't even understand what it was while 
 others might throw it up at first.  Cooked chicken would add about 3 hours 
 work to my day.  My freezer would be full of frozen chicken, not defrosted in 
 time for their dinner and I would go insane.

The dry food costs me about $100 - $150 a month.  With the price of Kirkland 
going up it would cost me about equal to that because they eat less of the 
Kirkland due to fat content.  Seems to fill them up better.  I used to buy 
Friskies regular type, and Purina Cat Chow (no one wanted to eat that).  Then I 
bought HEB brand Hill Country Fair and all the cats began throwing up in 
unison.  Stopped buying that also.  They seem to be able to digest Paws and 
Claws, the Tractor Supply brand that cost $20 for 36 pounds but the older ones 
lose weight when they eat it.  One of my cats, Isadora lost most of her fur 
(long hair) and had scabs and sores on her skin.  I began feeding Kirkland 
about 3 months ago and the other day I realized that Isadora had no more scabs 
and had grown back her fur.  The fat content did her a whole lot of good. She 
looks like she has gained a pound or two and is much more active. Mr. Buttons 
(Big Butt-tons) also gained weight on
  Kirkland.  I need to widen the doorway for him.
I will probably have to keep buying the Kirkland and just work harder. 



Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!



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-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information. 


If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: 
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially 
http://vimeo.com/48445902




Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: 
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537

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Re: [Felvtalk] Dining out

2012-10-13 Thread Lorrie
On 10-12, dlg...@windstream.net wrote:

 While we are on the subject of raw diet, don't they eat some of those
 things when they catch a mouse, rabbit or squirrel or bird?  The only
 things my guys don't eat are the organs, especially intestines.  Other
 wise, they eat the whole thing.

Mine eat the critters they catch. I think that's why I can't get my
fat cat to lose weight. I've had him on a diet for years but he must
suppliment what I give him by dining out. 

Lorrie
 

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Re: [Felvtalk] Ta ta for now

2012-10-13 Thread Lorrie
Natalie, Your posts are so informative. You are one of the most
interesting ones in this group.  Why would you leave just because
of a brief discussion of politics??  In every group there are 
things that come up that upset us, but as Edna said the elections
will be over soon and I really hope you'll stay with us. We learn
a lot from you and you can learn from us. 

Lorrie

On 10-12, Edna Taylor wrote:
Sorry to see you leave the list Natalie :(  You should stick around
since the elections will be over soon ;)

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Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

2012-10-13 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
Actually, a lot of ferals live on/supplement with insects.   We don't have
water bugs inside here, but I've seen them around, so the cats must be
eating them.(BTW, just read that insects are the healthiest meat humans
can eat, as they are low-fat and animal fat is hard on humans.)


On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 3:34 AM, molvey...@hotmail.com 
molvey...@hotmail.com wrote:

 **
 Should have tied a string to the rabbit and dragged it along the floor.
  They chase and eat anything that moves in my house!  If flies had enough
 protein several of mine could live off them.

 Sent from my HTC Inspire™ 4G on ATT


 - Reply message -
 From: dlg...@windstream.net
 To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 Subject: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food
 Date: Fri, Oct 12, 2012 4:09 pm



 i TRIED RABBIT FROM A NEIGHBOR WHO RAISES HIS ORGANIC FOR HIS OWN FOOD.  THEY 
 LOOKED AT IT LIKE IT WAS ALIEN, WOULD NOT EVEN TOUCH IT.  I ONLY HAVE 7, BUT 
 KEEPING ENOUGH MEAT FOR THEM WOULD BE A PROBLEM.  i HAVE A SIDE BY SIDE AND 
 THE FREEZER IS NOT THAT LARGE.  AND GETTING IT OUT IN TIME TO THAW WOULD BE A 
 PROBLEM WITH MY MEMORY.

  Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com
  wrote:
  It would be nice if I could do that but I'm feeding around 35 cats right 
  now.  Feeding raw would cost me around $9 a day with turns into around $250 
  a month.  On top of which, I would be a little nervous to feed raw chicken 
  to the cats.  Some of them probably wouldn't even understand what it was 
  while others might throw it up at first.  Cooked chicken would add about 3 
  hours work to my day.  My freezer would be full of frozen chicken, not 
  defrosted in time for their dinner and I would go insane.

 The dry food costs me about $100 - $150 a month.  With the price of Kirkland 
 going up it would cost me about equal to that because they eat less of the 
 Kirkland due to fat content.  Seems to fill them up better.  I used to buy 
 Friskies regular type, and Purina Cat Chow (no one wanted to eat that).  Then 
 I bought HEB brand Hill Country Fair and all the cats began throwing up in 
 unison.  Stopped buying that also.  They seem to be able to digest Paws and 
 Claws, the Tractor Supply brand that cost $20 for 36 pounds but the older 
 ones lose weight when they eat it.  One of my cats, Isadora lost most of her 
 fur (long hair) and had scabs and sores on her skin.  I began feeding 
 Kirkland about 3 months ago and the other day I realized that Isadora had no 
 more scabs and had grown back her fur.  The fat content did her a whole lot 
 of good. She looks like she has gained a pound or two and is much more 
 active. Mr. Buttons (Big Butt-tons) also gained weight on
   Kirkland.  I need to widen the doorway for him.
 I will probably have to keep buying the Kirkland and just work harder.



 Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty 
 neighbors too!

 
 
 ___
 Felvtalk mailing list
 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 
 


 --
 
 Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

 If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
 life.  Contact your local pound for information.


 If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
 free up cage space.

 Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
 implementing the No Kill Equation: 
 http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/


 Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
 http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

 Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

 More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

 More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially 
 http://vimeo.com/48445902




 Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: 
 http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537


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 Felvtalk@felineleukemia.orghttp://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


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 listFelvtalk@felineleukemia.orghttp://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


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-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by

Re: [Felvtalk] Interferon

2012-10-13 Thread molveywda
Lisa,

You were lucky because 9 1/2 years is a long time for a FeLV cat, especially if 
he had it as a kitten.  Most cats that had FeLV as a kitten don't live past 3 
years.  Many live less than a year.  If you were giving him interferon then 
maybe that was it.  I have heard of some that lived about that long but not too 
often if they got it as a kitten from their mom.  One vet told me about one 
that lived until it was 18.  I kind of wonder if the vet was smoking dope cause 
that's really odd.

I had one that died at 2 years old that had a mediastinal tumor.  Like Prancer 
she was fine then one day her breathing became labored.  Before the vet and I 
could even discuss what to do she died.  At the time I did not know she had 
FeLV because she tested negative as a kitten.  They didn't see the tumor on 
X-ray because of all the fluid so we did a necropsy to see where the fluid was 
coming from.  Sure enough the vet found this large tumor and it had actually 
punctured her heart and the fluid in her chest was all blood.  Then the vet got 
curious and did a combo test and found the FeLV.  My guess is that most likely 
the tumor would have eventually ruptured Prancer's heart too so you probably 
did the best thing for Prancer.

I didn't know they could treat those kinds of tumors.  In my cat's case it was 
too late when we found it but I'm glad to know that in case something comes up 
in the future.

Maureen


Sent from my HTC Inspire™ 4G on ATT

- Reply message -
From: Terri Brown siggies...@hotmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: [Felvtalk] Interferon
Date: Fri, Oct 12, 2012 3:23 pm
I used interferon with Salome'.  I started her on it when she was 
about 3 years old, and I gave it to her as often as I could get a hold of 
it.

Salome' lived to be 9 1/2 years old, and she died from liver failure.

Hope that helps!

T

=^..^= Terri, Guinevere, Travis, Dori, Kimiko and 8 furangels: Ruthie, 
Samantha, 
Arielle, Gareth, Alec, Salome, Sammi and Siggie the Tomato Vampire =^..^=

- Original Message - 
From: Lisa Conner 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 

Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 1:48 
PM
Subject: [Felvtalk] Interferon




Hi 
All,

I think 
everyone was so hung up with this politcal debate,  no one saw my 2 
questions on Interferon and the length of years a Felv + cat has 
lived.

Ok-  so,  I joined 
when my 9 + year old boy, Prancer became very sick..literally overnight.  
He breathing was extremely labored and I rushed him to the Emergency 
Vet.  They said he was critical ,  and didn’t think he was going to 
make it.  May be best to put him to sleep since he was Felv+ and needed 
oxygen and and his gums were pale.  That night they extracted 3 ½ cups of 
fluid from his lungs.  Thank goodness, because that saved his life.  
In the morning we transferred him to our regular vet and our vet thought it 
was his heart.  He was right.  The ultrasound showed a huge mass 
tumor at the base of his heart.   The vet wasn’t sure how much time 
Prancer had, however, he said it might be a day or week,  depending on 
how much fluid built up in his lung area.  Within 4 days, the fluid was 
back and I could not have him suffer as I lost my Dad to the the suffering of 
congestive heart failure (with build up of fluid in the lungs).  


So, my vet 
believes that Interferon might have helped Prancer over the years, since in 
all his years in practice,  they have not seen a cat like Prancer, great 
health  for 9 ½ years, but be Felv +.  

Has anyone 
in this group used Interferon with their cats and what is the typical avg span 
life for Felv+ cats?  

Thanks!___Felvtalk 
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listFelvtalk@felineleukemia.orghttp://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org___
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Re: [Felvtalk] Ta ta for now

2012-10-13 Thread Natalie
It's not just the politics...as I wrote originally.

My new email address is:atia@gmail.com

-Original Message-
From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of
Lorrie
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2012 6:53 AM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Ta ta for now

Natalie, Your posts are so informative. You are one of the most interesting
ones in this group.  Why would you leave just because of a brief discussion
of politics??  In every group there are things that come up that upset us,
but as Edna said the elections will be over soon and I really hope you'll
stay with us. We learn a lot from you and you can learn from us. 

Lorrie

On 10-12, Edna Taylor wrote:
Sorry to see you leave the list Natalie :(  You should stick around
since the elections will be over soon ;)

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[Felvtalk] Off topic, of interest to many: Webcast: Fixing the Feline Housing Crisis (how sheltertsd canb make cats sick!!!)

2012-10-13 Thread Natalie
If anyone is interested, let me know, and I will send the entire page, how to 
register, with info privately; it’s too large to send to this group!

 

My new email address is:atia@gmail.com


 




Fixing the Feline Housing Crisis: How Shelter Housing Can Make Cats Sick – And 
What You Can Do About It 

It's a feline housing revolution – and it’s helping stop shelter cat upper 
respiratory infections in their tracks!


Image removed by sender. large_box_bottom.gif


Image removed by sender. spacer.gif


Cats are extremely sensitive to noise, crowding, and stress – three things that 
are in abundant supply in many animal shelters. These adverse conditions often 
lead to illness in sheltered cats, particularly the most common of all feline 
shelter diseases, upper respiratory infection (URI). 
The good news is that with a “feline wellness renovation project” – decreasing 
crowding and reducing stress – you can drastically cut the incidence of feline 
URI in your shelter's cat population.
Maddie's InstituteSM is pleased to announce the second in a two-part series on 
feline URI in shelters: Fixing the Feline Housing Crisis: How Shelter Housing 
Can Make Cats Sick - And What You Can Do About It. Join us for this free 
webcast on Thursday, October 25, at 9 PM Eastern, presented by Dr. Sandra 
Newbury of the Koret Shelter Medicine Program at the UC Davis School of 
Veterinary Medicine. 

Attendees will learn:

*   How to understand the natural behavior of cats 
*   How to set up shelter housing to reduce stress 
*   The importance of giving cats a place to hide when stressed or fearful 
*   The impact of housing cats near dogs 
*   How improvements in noise levels, light cycles, and enrichment can 
benefit cats 
*   Temperature, air quality and ventilation requirements for URI 
prevention 
*   How to understand exposure risks 
*   How to set up separation and isolation for sick cats 

Individuals attending the live webcast will be entered in a door prize drawing 
for one of ten copies of Maddie's® Animal Shelter Infection Control Manual! 
Fixing the Feline Housing Crisis: How Shelter Housing Can Make Cats Sick - And 
What You Can Do About It, is part of an ongoing series of educational programs 
from Maddie's Institute, a program of Maddie's Fund®, the nation's leading 
funder of shelter medicine education. Maddie's Institute brings cutting edge 
shelter medicine information from universities and animal welfare leaders to 
shelter veterinarians, managers and staff as well as private practice 
veterinarians, rescue groups and community members to increase the lifesaving 
of homeless dogs and cats community-wide. 

  _  

Presenter: Sandra Newbury, DVM



 

 

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Re: [Felvtalk] Scoopable Litter: The Return of the Clump

2012-10-13 Thread Lee Evans
Carpets?  With 30 cats in the house?  No Way!  I was actually thinking about 
planting grass on my floor but I cleaned it instead.


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!





 From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 4:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Scoopable Litter:  The Return of the Clump
 
LIKE I SAID WE MUST LOVE THEM TO GO THRU ALL THAT.  i HAVE FOUND wORLD'S 
gREATEST  and we all love it.  I especially love the fact that it is much 
lighter than clay and is biodegradeable.  I have a lite box compost pit to the 
east of the house and no smell from it all.  It is a bit dusty but so is every 
other litter I jsut keep the vaccumn out and after cleaning the boxes, suck the 
escaped bits here and there and pitch them in the trash.  Cost is a bit pricey, 
but it last longer and does not hurt your bare feet when you get up in the 
middle of the night.

ONE WORD OF CAUTION.  Blue buffalo has a litter made from walnut hulls/shells.  
It clumps and is relatively dust free, but is heavy and if you have light 
colored carpets you might have a problem.  I use walnut hulls as a very good 
dark brown dye.  AllI do is soak them in water and they dye everything they 
come in contact with.  I have quarry tile floors so not too much of a problem, 
but even quarry tile will take the dye.


 Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com wrote: 
 Lee, I almost pissed myself laughing.. Been there with the solid
 block of concrete stuck to the bottom of the litter boxes! 
 
 Lorrie
 
 On 10-11, Lee Evans wrote:
     This is a horror story.  It's true.  My cats will tell you it is.  One
     day, several years ago, I decided to purchase clumping litter.  In
     those days I was using Traditional, a brand put out by HEB
     supermarket.  Traditional is a white litter, not too much dust, at that
     time very inexpensive. Then I saw HEB Scoopable.  It wasn't very
     expensive so I lugged a couple of bags home.  Now, the horror part
     comes when you realize that I knew nothing about clumping litter except
     that it clumps when hit with something liquid.  So I poured the same
     amount of clumping clay into the cat boxes as I had with the ordinary
     stuff.  Sigh! Once in a while I should read directions.  The litter
     clumped to the bottom of the box.  Solid.  Cement.  Mixed with cat
     piss.  I had to take all the boxes out to the yard and use a hack saw
     to get the litter out.  Finally, hammer, chisel and garden hose got the
     boxes back to usable state.  Five hours wasted.  Cats giggling inside,
     waiting to see what I would do next.  I read the directions.  Needed
     was at least three inches of litter per box.  Ten boxes.  Five bags of
     cheap clumping clay.  Ah.  It clumped.  Did not stick to the bottom of
     the box.  Each perfectly formed clump weighed about three pounds.
     Hernia time. I purchased 5 bags of litter, each weighing 20 pounds.  I
     filled up about 10 boxes.  Used about 5 of the bags, give or take a few
     grains of sand.  Half a bag to a box.  That would be about 10 pounds of
     clay per box.  After all was said and done, I got over 24 pounds worth
     of clumps out of each box. I wish someone would make litter out of
     silver dollars that would triple when hit with a liquid substance.
     Used up an entire roll of garbage bags.  Sanitation department workers
     had to be hospitalized for hernias.  It was around that time that I
     discovered Feline Pine.  The cats were a little startled at having to
     do their thing on something that smelled like wood and rolled around
     like marbles but they got the hang of it finally.  Some like to bat the
     pine pellets all over the floor.  They especially like to bat them over
     to the door so when I come into the room I step rolly-polly pellets and
     go skidding into a wall.  Need a book on cat behavior modification.
  
 
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Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

2012-10-13 Thread Lee Evans
Yum!  It's lunch time here.  So glad I'm a vegetarian and don't have to face a 
plate of meat after that tidbit of information.  But yes, cats do eat the whole 
animal and I won't get into the things that they have so generously given me 
after they caught a bird or lizard but they don't eat cows or sheep or pigs or 
intestines with the crap in them and that's what commercial by-products are.  
No one is going to empty and wash out intestines before adding them to the heap.


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!





 From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 4:36 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food
 

They do eat by-products when they eat the whole prey, but they are getting all 
the rest, too, which they don't get with just by-products (where the good stuff 
has been taken out for human consumption).   By-products contain much less 
nutrition and are often indigestible.  Note that cats also get some minerals by 
eating the dirt that's on the animals.   Guess that's why some feral feeders 
just put the food on the ground.  :-)
That has always surprised me when people report that their cat doesn't eat the 
organs, as those (exept for feces-filled intestines) are the most nutritious 
things in the prey's body, and also (I've read that) the big cats eat the 
organs first and bury the rest of the body for the next day.




On Fri, Oct 12, 2012 at 12:22 PM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote:

While we are on the subject of raw diet, don't they eat some of those things 
when they catch a mouse, rabbit or squirrel or bird?  The only things my guys 
don't eat are the organs, especially intestines.  Other wise, they eat the 
whole thing.



-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information. 


If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: 
http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially http://vimeo.com/48445902




Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to 
respond: http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537

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Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

2012-10-13 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
It's even worse than that:
http://siriusdog.com/rendering-plants-pet-food.htm   And I've heard that at
a local plant, the animals weren't even all dead.   The tough guy who told
me that was crying, so I believe him.

On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 8:02 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Yum!  It's lunch time here.  So glad I'm a vegetarian and don't have to
 face a plate of meat after that tidbit of information.  But yes, cats do
 eat the whole animal and I won't get into the things that they have so
 generously given me after they caught a bird or lizard but they don't eat
 cows or sheep or pigs or intestines with the crap in them and that's what
 commercial by-products are.  No one is going to empty and wash out
 intestines before adding them to the heap.



 Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty
 neighbors too!


   --
 *From:* Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Sent:* Friday, October 12, 2012 4:36 PM

 *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

 They do eat by-products when they eat the whole prey, but they are getting
 all the rest, too, which they don't get with just by-products (where the
 good stuff has been taken out for human consumption).   By-products contain
 much less nutrition and are often indigestible.  Note that cats also get
 some minerals by eating the dirt that's on the animals.   Guess that's why
 some feral feeders just put the food on the ground.  :-)

 That has always surprised me when people report that their cat doesn't eat
 the organs, as those (exept for feces-filled intestines) are the most
 nutritious things in the prey's body, and also (I've read that) the big
 cats eat the organs first and bury the rest of the body for the next day.


 On Fri, Oct 12, 2012 at 12:22 PM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote:

 While we are on the subject of raw diet, don't they eat some of those
 things when they catch a mouse, rabbit or squirrel or bird?  The only
 things my guys don't eat are the organs, especially intestines.  Other
 wise, they eat the whole thing.



-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
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[Felvtalk] OT - The crying bull

2012-10-13 Thread Natalie
The crying bull: 
http://vedicviews-worldnews.blogspot.com/2012/07/crying-bull-true-story.html 

My new email address is:atia@gmail.com

 

From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of 
Kathryn Hargreaves
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2012 2:54 PM
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

 

It's even worse than that: http://siriusdog.com/rendering-plants-pet-food.htm   
And I've heard that at a local plant, the animals weren't even all dead.   The 
tough guy who told me that was crying, so I believe him.

 

On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 8:02 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:

Yum!  It's lunch time here.  So glad I'm a vegetarian and don't have to face a 
plate of meat after that tidbit of information.  But yes, cats do eat the whole 
animal and I won't get into the things that they have so generously given me 
after they caught a bird or lizard but they don't eat cows or sheep or pigs or 
intestines with the crap in them and that's what commercial by-products are.  
No one is going to empty and wash out intestines before adding them to the heap.

 

 

 

Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!

 

  _  

From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 

Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 4:36 PM


Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

 

They do eat by-products when they eat the whole prey, but they are getting all 
the rest, too, which they don't get with just by-products (where the good stuff 
has been taken out for human consumption).   By-products contain much less 
nutrition and are often indigestible.  Note that cats also get some minerals by 
eating the dirt that's on the animals.   Guess that's why some feral feeders 
just put the food on the ground.  :-)

 

That has always surprised me when people report that their cat doesn't eat the 
organs, as those (exept for feces-filled intestines) are the most nutritious 
things in the prey's body, and also (I've read that) the big cats eat the 
organs first and bury the rest of the body for the next day.

 

On Fri, Oct 12, 2012 at 12:22 PM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote:

While we are on the subject of raw diet, don't they eat some of those things 
when they catch a mouse, rabbit or squirrel or bird?  The only things my guys 
don't eat are the organs, especially intestines.  Other wise, they eat the 
whole thing.

 

 

-- 

Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

 

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
life.  Contact your local pound for information. 

 

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to 
free up cage space.

 


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
implementing the No Kill Equation: 
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/ 
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/ 

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially 
http://vimeo.com/48445902

 

 

 

Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: 
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537

 

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Re: [Felvtalk] OT - The crying bull

2012-10-13 Thread dlgegg
-I AM SAD BECAUSE NITNOY IS DYING, NOW THIS REALLY HAS THE TEARS FLOWING.

--- Natalie tonline.net wrote:  The crying bull: 
http://vedicviews-worldnews.blogspot.com/2012/07/crying-bull-true-story.html  
 My new email address is: atia@gmail.com From: Felvtalk 
[mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kathryn Hargreaves  
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2012 2:54 PM  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org  
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food It's even worse than 
that: http://siriusdog.com/rendering-plants-pet-food.htm And I've heard that at 
a local plant, the animals weren't even all dead. The tough guy who told me 
that was crying, so I believe him. On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 8:02 AM, Lee 
Evans wrote:   Yum! It's lunch time here. So glad I'm a vegetarian and don't 
have to face a plate of meat after that tidbit of information. But yes, cats do 
eat the whole animal and I won't get into the things that they have so 
generously given me after they caught a bird or lizard but they don't eat cows 
or sheep or pigs or intestines with the crap in them and that's what commercial 
by-products are. No one is going to empty and wash out intestines before adding 
them to the heap. Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your 
weird relatives and nasty neighbors too! _   From: Kathryn 
Hargreaves  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org   Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 
4:36 PMSubject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food They do eat 
by-products when they eat the whole prey, but they are getting all the rest, 
too, which they don't get with just by-products (where the good stuff has been 
taken out for human consumption). By-products contain much less nutrition and 
are often indigestible. Note that cats also get some minerals by eating the 
dirt that's on the animals. Guess that's why some feral feeders just put the 
food on the ground. :-) That has always surprised me when people report 
that their cat doesn't eat the organs, as those (exept for feces-filled 
intestines) are the most nutritious things in the prey's body, and also (I've 
read that) the big cats eat the organs first and bury the rest of the body for 
the next day. On Fri, Oct 12, 2012 at 12:22 PM, wrote:   While we are 
on the subject of raw diet, don't they eat some of those things when they catch 
a mouse, rabbit or squirrel or bird? The only things my guys don't eat are the 
organs, especially intestines. Other wise, they eat the whole thing.  
 --    Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal! 
If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save 
their life. Contact your local pound for information. If you can't 
bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to free up cage 
space.  Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their 
intake by implementing the No Kill Equation: 
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/   Here's 
the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Legislate 
better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org   More fun reading: 
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/   More fun 
watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially http://vimeo.com/48445902  
   Local feral cat crisis? See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: 
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537   

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Re: [Felvtalk] OT - The crying bull

2012-10-13 Thread dlgegg
-THE PROBLEM IS THAT MAN HAS BECOME SO CALLUS REGARDING DEATH THAT WE DON'T 
CARE ANYMORE ABOUT EVEN HUMANS.  HOW ELSE DO YOU EXPLAIN A MOTHER GLUING HER 2 
YEAR OLD CHILD TO THE WALL AND KICKING HER IN THE STOMACH, ETC.  JUST BECAUSE 
SHE COULDN'T POTTY TRAIN HER.  SHE GOT 99 YEARS.  ABOUT TIME .  



 Natalie tonline.net wrote:  The crying bull: 
http://vedicviews-worldnews.blogspot.com/2012/07/crying-bull-true-story.html  
 My new email address is: atia@gmail.com From: Felvtalk 
[mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Kathryn Hargreaves  
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2012 2:54 PM  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org  
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food It's even worse than 
that: http://siriusdog.com/rendering-plants-pet-food.htm And I've heard that at 
a local plant, the animals weren't even all dead. The tough guy who told me 
that was crying, so I believe him. On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 8:02 AM, Lee 
Evans wrote:   Yum! It's lunch time here. So glad I'm a vegetarian and don't 
have to face a plate of meat after that tidbit of information. But yes, cats do 
eat the whole animal and I won't get into the things that they have so 
generously given me after they caught a bird or lizard but they don't eat cows 
or sheep or pigs or intestines with the crap in them and that's what commercial 
by-products are. No one is going to empty and wash out intestines before adding 
them to the heap. Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your 
weird relatives and nasty neighbors too! _   From: Kathryn 
Hargreaves  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org   Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 
4:36 PMSubject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food They do eat 
by-products when they eat the whole prey, but they are getting all the rest, 
too, which they don't get with just by-products (where the good stuff has been 
taken out for human consumption). By-products contain much less nutrition and 
are often indigestible. Note that cats also get some minerals by eating the 
dirt that's on the animals. Guess that's why some feral feeders just put the 
food on the ground. :-) That has always surprised me when people report 
that their cat doesn't eat the organs, as those (exept for feces-filled 
intestines) are the most nutritious things in the prey's body, and also (I've 
read that) the big cats eat the organs first and bury the rest of the body for 
the next day. On Fri, Oct 12, 2012 at 12:22 PM, wrote:   While we are 
on the subject of raw diet, don't they eat some of those things when they catch 
a mouse, rabbit or squirrel or bird? The only things my guys don't eat are the 
organs, especially intestines. Other wise, they eat the whole thing.  
 --    Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal! 
If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save 
their life. Contact your local pound for information. If you can't 
bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and to free up cage 
space.  Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their 
intake by implementing the No Kill Equation: 
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/   Here's 
the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Legislate 
better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org   More fun reading: 
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/   More fun 
watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially http://vimeo.com/48445902  
   Local feral cat crisis? See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: 
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537   

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Re: [Felvtalk] Scoopable Litter: The Return of the Clump

2012-10-13 Thread dlgegg
RE:  carpets  I was thinking of people who have only one or two cats in their 
house and are stupid enough to have carpeting.


 Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote: 
 Carpets?  With 30 cats in the house?  No Way!  I was actually thinking about 
 planting grass on my floor but I cleaned it instead.


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!





 From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 4:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Scoopable Litter:  The Return of the Clump
 
LIKE I SAID WE MUST LOVE THEM TO GO THRU ALL THAT.  i HAVE FOUND wORLD'S 
gREATEST  and we all love it.  I especially love the fact that it is much 
lighter than clay and is biodegradeable.  I have a lite box compost pit to the 
east of the house and no smell from it all.  It is a bit dusty but so is every 
other litter I jsut keep the vaccumn out and after cleaning the boxes, suck the 
escaped bits here and there and pitch them in the trash.  Cost is a bit pricey, 
but it last longer and does not hurt your bare feet when you get up in the 
middle of the night.

ONE WORD OF CAUTION.  Blue buffalo has a litter made from walnut hulls/shells.  
It clumps and is relatively dust free, but is heavy and if you have light 
colored carpets you might have a problem.  I use walnut hulls as a very good 
dark brown dye.  AllI do is soak them in water and they dye everything they 
come in contact with.  I have quarry tile floors so not too much of a problem, 
but even quarry tile will take the dye.


 Lorrie felineres...@frontier.com wrote: 
 Lee, I almost pissed myself laughing.. Been there with the solid
 block of concrete stuck to the bottom of the litter boxes! 
 
 Lorrie
 
 On 10-11, Lee Evans wrote:
     This is a horror story.  It's true.  My cats will tell you it is.  One
     day, several years ago, I decided to purchase clumping litter.  In
     those days I was using Traditional, a brand put out by HEB
     supermarket.  Traditional is a white litter, not too much dust, at that
     time very inexpensive. Then I saw HEB Scoopable.  It wasn't very
     expensive so I lugged a couple of bags home.  Now, the horror part
     comes when you realize that I knew nothing about clumping litter except
     that it clumps when hit with something liquid.  So I poured the same
     amount of clumping clay into the cat boxes as I had with the ordinary
     stuff.  Sigh! Once in a while I should read directions.  The litter
     clumped to the bottom of the box.  Solid.  Cement.  Mixed with cat
     piss.  I had to take all the boxes out to the yard and use a hack saw
     to get the litter out.  Finally, hammer, chisel and garden hose got the
     boxes back to usable state.  Five hours wasted.  Cats giggling inside,
     waiting to see what I would do next.  I read the directions.  Needed
     was at least three inches of litter per box.  Ten boxes.  Five bags of
     cheap clumping clay.  Ah.  It clumped.  Did not stick to the bottom of
     the box.  Each perfectly formed clump weighed about three pounds.
     Hernia time. I purchased 5 bags of litter, each weighing 20 pounds.  I
     filled up about 10 boxes.  Used about 5 of the bags, give or take a few
     grains of sand.  Half a bag to a box.  That would be about 10 pounds of
     clay per box.  After all was said and done, I got over 24 pounds worth
     of clumps out of each box. I wish someone would make litter out of
     silver dollars that would triple when hit with a liquid substance.
     Used up an entire roll of garbage bags.  Sanitation department workers
     had to be hospitalized for hernias.  It was around that time that I
     discovered Feline Pine.  The cats were a little startled at having to
     do their thing on something that smelled like wood and rolled around
     like marbles but they got the hang of it finally.  Some like to bat the
     pine pellets all over the floor.  They especially like to bat them over
     to the door so when I come into the room I step rolly-polly pellets and
     go skidding into a wall.  Need a book on cat behavior modification.
  
 
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Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

2012-10-13 Thread dlgegg
That is especially true of my Harley, he will chase, catch and eat anything 
that moves.  He was chasing a moth one night an it flew to the ceiling.  He 
jumped and hit his head on the ceiling.  I didn't see if he caught the moth, I 
was laughing at him.  Had the funniest look on his face.


 Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com wrote: 
 Actually, a lot of ferals live on/supplement with insects.   We don't have
 water bugs inside here, but I've seen them around, so the cats must be
 eating them.(BTW, just read that insects are the healthiest meat humans
 can eat, as they are low-fat and animal fat is hard on humans.)
 
 
 On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 3:34 AM, molvey...@hotmail.com 
 molvey...@hotmail.com wrote:
 
  **
  Should have tied a string to the rabbit and dragged it along the floor.
   They chase and eat anything that moves in my house!  If flies had enough
  protein several of mine could live off them.
 
  Sent from my HTC Inspire™ 4G on ATT
 
 
  - Reply message -
  From: dlg...@windstream.net
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
  Subject: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food
  Date: Fri, Oct 12, 2012 4:09 pm
 
 
 
  i TRIED RABBIT FROM A NEIGHBOR WHO RAISES HIS ORGANIC FOR HIS OWN FOOD.  
  THEY LOOKED AT IT LIKE IT WAS ALIEN, WOULD NOT EVEN TOUCH IT.  I ONLY HAVE 
  7, BUT KEEPING ENOUGH MEAT FOR THEM WOULD BE A PROBLEM.  i HAVE A SIDE BY 
  SIDE AND THE FREEZER IS NOT THAT LARGE.  AND GETTING IT OUT IN TIME TO THAW 
  WOULD BE A PROBLEM WITH MY MEMORY.
 
   Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com
   wrote:
   It would be nice if I could do that but I'm feeding around 35 cats right 
   now.  Feeding raw would cost me around $9 a day with turns into around 
   $250 a month.  On top of which, I would be a little nervous to feed raw 
   chicken to the cats.  Some of them probably wouldn't even understand what 
   it was while others might throw it up at first.  Cooked chicken would add 
   about 3 hours work to my day.  My freezer would be full of frozen 
   chicken, not defrosted in time for their dinner and I would go insane.
 
  The dry food costs me about $100 - $150 a month.  With the price of 
  Kirkland going up it would cost me about equal to that because they eat 
  less of the Kirkland due to fat content.  Seems to fill them up better.  I 
  used to buy Friskies regular type, and Purina Cat Chow (no one wanted to 
  eat that).  Then I bought HEB brand Hill Country Fair and all the cats 
  began throwing up in unison.  Stopped buying that also.  They seem to be 
  able to digest Paws and Claws, the Tractor Supply brand that cost $20 for 
  36 pounds but the older ones lose weight when they eat it.  One of my cats, 
  Isadora lost most of her fur (long hair) and had scabs and sores on her 
  skin.  I began feeding Kirkland about 3 months ago and the other day I 
  realized that Isadora had no more scabs and had grown back her fur.  The 
  fat content did her a whole lot of good. She looks like she has gained a 
  pound or two and is much more active. Mr. Buttons (Big Butt-tons) also 
  gained weight on
Kirkland.  I need to widen the doorway for him.
  I will probably have to keep buying the Kirkland and just work harder.
 
 
 
  Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty 
  neighbors too!
 
  
  
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  Felvtalk mailing list
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  --
  
  Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!
 
  If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their 
  life.  Contact your local pound for information.
 
 
  If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and 
  to free up cage space.
 
  Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by 
  implementing the No Kill Equation: 
  http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/
 
 
  Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities: 
  http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/
 
  Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org
 
  More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/
 
  More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially 
  http://vimeo.com/48445902
 
 
 
 
  Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond: 
  http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
 
 
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  listFelvtalk@felineleukemia.orghttp://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 
 
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Re: [Felvtalk] Ta ta for now

2012-10-13 Thread dlgegg

Been telling everyone I know.  Had some say But he/she likes them  as their 
lame excuse for continuing to buy them.  They also think just because the FDA 
can't figure out what is bad in them tht they are safe to buy.  



 Kathryn Hargreaves  wrote:  They're still selling the from-China chicken 
breast doggie treats that  killed/sickened lots of animals, only because the 
FDA can't figure out  what's wrong with them.   On Fri, Oct 12, 2012 at 1:32 
PM, Natalie  wrote:Thanks, just spread the word on it, post on FB, etc. 
– I did. It’s a   shame that a company’s response would be “Buyer 
beware”….anything we buy   for our pets should be safe without question!  
My husband got a catnip/fabric toy, made in China at PetSmart…I was 
about   to let the cats use it, when I decided out of curiosity to read the  
 label..guess what? It said that “if ingested, could cause death”! Now, we   
have to read all small print on doggie treats, especially when made in   
China, and learned that American made treats had to be recalled because of   
salmonella! I’ll be making my own doggie and cat treats (haha, in my spare   
time). Natalie ** ** My new email address is: 
*atia@gmail.com* ** ** *From:* Felvtalk 
[mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] *On Behalf   Of *Bonnie Hogue  
 *Sent:* Friday, October 12, 2012 4:39 PM   *To:* 
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org   *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] Ta ta for now   
  ** ** Thanks for sharing the great information. Very helpful to me, 
as I seek   to use the best products for my beloved furry friends.
 Sorry to see you check out – you have been very helpful, to me. 
Bonnie ** ** *From:* Felvtalk 
[mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org]   *On Behalf Of *Natalie   
*Sent:* Friday, October 12, 2012 1:13 PM   *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  *Subject:* [Felvtalk] Ta ta for now ** ** It seems that 
this topic still isn’t closed, is it? There have been   comments *after* the 
one you just responded to here. ** ** I joined because a 
friend recommended this group, and it has been   helpful. I had 2 adult FeLV+ 
cats. One of the cats died of CRF, and the   other was adopted by a 
veterinarian and is still doing OK. Those 2 cats   lived with a large group 
of healthy cats for about 6 months, and I tested   all starting with very 
young and older cats – not a single cat contracted   the virus! 6 months 
should have been enough time to do so, shouldn’t it?*   *** Since I 
don’t have any FeLV positive cats right now, I decided that I will   get off 
this list – I learned things that I’d rather not have known, such   as 
someone hunting small game, another person having cats declawed   routinely, 
I guess because the vet offers such a great deal, etc.  But before 
I leave, I will post just one site about Clumping litter   containing sodium 
bentonite. Don’t forget, it doesn’t have to be listed in   the ingredients!~ 
And as long as it states that it can be flushed down the   toilet, is doesn’t 
contain SB, which would completely block the plumbing.*   *** I’ve 
seen so many reviews, often poo-pooing the dangers, misstating that   SB 
expands 5 times its weight (it’s capable of absorbing liquid and   moisture 
15 x its weight, and is- used in construction). The best article   was 
written in Tiger Tribe, a holistic cat magazine that is no longer   
published. When I heard that they were closing down operations, I bought   
all the back issues.   http://www.thelighthouseonline.com/articles/clump.html 
- Clumping clay   litters, a deadly convenience. This one is 
short and sweet.   
http://kapush.net/cat-litter/sodium-bentonite-cat-litter-dangers/ - 
Natalie *From:* Felvtalk 
[mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org]   *On Behalf Of *cindy reasoner 
  *Sent:* Friday, October 12, 2012 8:52 AM   *To:* 
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org   *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] Off topic: 
President ** ** I disagree. Please can we just end all the 
political talk.  Cindy Reasoner 
 --- On *Wed, 10/10/12, GRAS * wrote:   From: GRAS
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Off topic: President   To: 
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org   Date: Wednesday, October 10, 2012, 2:10 PM 
*I must respectfully disagree, this wasn’t about bashing anyone– to 
state   a platform on which a candidate is running is just that – no one was 
  calling any candidate horrible names!*  ** **
 ___   Felvtalk mailing list   
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org   
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   --    Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter 
Animal!   If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to 
save their  life. Contact your local pound for information. If you 
can't bottle feed, foster an older 

Re: [Felvtalk] Ta ta for now

2012-10-13 Thread dlgegg
As for toys for my cats, I have found that bottle caps, cardboard boxes, paper 
bags and my pot of lemongrass are great.  



 Natalie  wrote:  Thanks, just spread the word on it, post on FB, etc. – 
I did. It’s a shame that a company’s response would be “Buyer beware”….anything 
we buy for our pets should be safe without question!   My husband got a 
catnip/fabric toy, made in China at PetSmart…I was about to let the cats use 
it, when I decided out of curiosity to read the label..guess what? It said that 
“if ingested, could cause death”! Now, we have to read all small print on 
doggie treats, especially when made in China, and learned that American made 
treats had to be recalled because of salmonella! I’ll be making my own doggie 
and cat treats (haha, in my spare time).   Natalie My new email 
address is: atia@gmail.com From: Felvtalk 
[mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of Bonnie Hogue  Sent: 
Friday, October 12, 2012 4:39 PM  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org  Subject: 
Re: [Felvtalk] Ta ta for now Thanks for sharing the great information. 
Very helpful to me, as I seek to use the best products for my beloved furry 
friends.   Sorry to see you check out – you have been very helpful, to me.  
 Bonnie From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On 
Behalf Of Natalie  Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 1:13 PM  To: 
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org  Subject: [Felvtalk] Ta ta for now It 
seems that this topic still isn’t closed, is it? There have been comments after 
the one you just responded to here. I joined because a friend 
recommended this group, and it has been helpful. I had 2 adult FeLV+ cats. One 
of the cats died of CRF, and the other was adopted by a veterinarian and is 
still doing OK. Those 2 cats lived with a large group of healthy cats for about 
6 months, and I tested all starting with very young and older cats – not a 
single cat contracted the virus! 6 months should have been enough time to do 
so, shouldn’t it?   Since I don’t have any FeLV positive cats right now, I 
decided that I will get off this list – I learned things that I’d rather not 
have known, such as someone hunting small game, another person having cats 
declawed routinely, I guess because the vet offers such a great deal, etc.   
But before I leave, I will post just one site about Clumping litter containing 
sodium bentonite. Don’t forget, it doesn’t have to be listed in the 
ingredients!~ And as long as it states that it can be flushed down the toilet, 
is doesn’t contain SB, which would completely block the plumbing.   I’ve seen 
so many reviews, often poo-pooing the dangers, misstating that SB expands 5 
times its weight (it’s capable of absorbing liquid and moisture 15 x its 
weight, and is- used in construction). The best article was written in Tiger 
Tribe, a holistic cat magazine that is no longer published. When I heard that 
they were closing down operations, I bought all the back issues. 
http://www.thelighthouseonline.com/articles/clump.html - Clumping clay litters, 
a deadly convenience.   This one is short and sweet. 
http://kapush.net/cat-litter/sodium-bentonite-cat-litter-dangers/ -   Natalie 
  From: Felvtalk [mailto:felvtalk-boun...@felineleukemia.org] On Behalf Of 
cindy reasoner  Sent: Friday, October 12, 2012 8:52 AM  To: 
felvtalk@felineleukemia.org  Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Off topic: President   
   I disagree. Please can we just end all the political talk. Cindy 
Reasoner --- On Wed, 10/10/12, GRAS  wrote:From: GRAS   
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] Off topic: President  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
 Date: Wednesday, October 10, 2012, 2:10 PM   I must respectfully disagree, 
this wasn’t about bashing anyone– to state a platform on which a candidate is 
running is just that – no one was calling any candidate horrible names! 


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Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

2012-10-13 Thread dlgegg
I never thought about that!  I cry at $100 a month. $1000 would give me heart 
failure!  Will try those cards.  Great idea!




 Susan Hoffman  wrote:  I spend about $1000 a month with a population 
that ranges from 25-40, depending on adoptions and new intake.  We feed 
primarily canned but with dry (mostly Kirkland Premium and the no-grain in the 
orange bag).  It's a big chunk of money every month but the cats are happy and 
healthy.   For the past year I've been planning ahead and buying discounted 
PetSmart gift cards through http://www.giftcardbin.com/ and 
http://www.cardpool.com/  They also have petco cards but nothing for Costco.  
Take a look.  It really has helped my budget.  (I recently combined gift cards 
discounted by 18% with the PetSmart Friends  Family sale discount of 15%, and 
used a few random coupons.  For awhile there I had a lot of cases of friskies 
stacked up in the living room!)  From: 
dlg...@windstream.net  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org Sent: Thursday, 
October 11, 2012 11:40 AM Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food Since 
Homey and Nitnoy, I feed half canned and dry.  I also have water fountains and 
that makes a diffrence in how much they drink.  I have to fill up the 2 
fountains every morning and afternoon.  Each takes 64 ounces. Course Casey 
spills some.  She likes to bat at the water before she drinks.  I never thought 
about how much per day per cat, just feed them.  I usually give about 1/4 cup 
in morning, afternoon and evening of the dry Blue Buffalo and 1 can divided by 
7.  I mix the can with 2 cans of hot water.  The heat makes it smell more and 
they always drink the liquid and later on eat the meat.  Kathryn Hargreaves 
 wrote:  I'm curious as to how much you are spending per day per cat feeding 
dry.  I  am able to feed raw for 70 cents/day per cat.  If you didn't buy the 
 chicken from Whole Foods, which charges about twice as much as do, say  
local ethnic butchers, then you could roll in for around half that.   I've 
heard they have to eat more dry than raw, as it isn't as high-octane  of 
food.  Also, cats don't drink enough water to compensate for dry food,  
grain/starch-free or not, and stand a very good chance of ending up with  CRF. 
   On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 10:06 AM, Lee Evans  wrote:Oh, @#$%!!!.  
The price of Kirkland Adult Maintenance cat food used to be   $16.99.  Then 
it went up a year later to $17.59.  Well, I bought two 20 lb.   bags a week 
and a half ago.  This Tuesday, I went back to Costco because my   cats ate 
most of the Kirkland and the price had gone up to $18.99!!!  It   went up 
$1.49 in about a week.  This is robbery.  I'm so depressed.  The   crap I buy 
at the feed store doesn't have a high fat content and doesn't   have actual 
chicken like Kirkland and is $20  for a 36 pound bag.  Well,   kitties, 
you're going to be back on a diet of crap and corn meal unless   Mommy can 
get another job online.  Sigh.   Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs 
and your weird relatives and nasty   neighbors too!   
___   Felvtalk mailing list   
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org   
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org 
   --    Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter 
Animal!   If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to 
save their  life.  Contact your local pound for information. If you 
can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and  to free up 
cage space.Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their 
intake by  implementing the No Kill Equation:  
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/   
Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:  
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/   Legislate 
better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org   More fun reading: 
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/   More fun 
watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially  http://vimeo.com/48445902 


Local feral cat crisis?  See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:  
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537 
___ Felvtalk mailing list 
Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org 



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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
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Re: [Felvtalk] OT - The crying bull

2012-10-13 Thread Lee Evans
That is so awful.  Unfortunately this happens often - parents getting 
frustrated because their kid can't seem to get the hang of the potty.  A client 
of mine told me her husband hits her son because he isn't well potty trained.  
I told her that the husband should be put out and tied up to the fence in the 
yard.  In 18 years the kid will be using the potty because peer pressure will 
get the better of him.  It will be a little embarrassing when everyone around 
him  is using the restrooms and he goes into the men's room to change his 
Huggies.


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!





 From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Saturday, October 13, 2012 2:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] OT - The crying bull
 
-THE PROBLEM IS THAT MAN HAS BECOME SO CALLUS REGARDING DEATH THAT WE DON'T 
CARE ANYMORE ABOUT EVEN HUMANS.  HOW ELSE DO YOU EXPLAIN A MOTHER GLUING HER 2 
YEAR OLD CHILD TO THE WALL AND KICKING HER IN THE STOMACH, ETC.  JUST BECAUSE 
SHE COULDN'T POTTY TRAIN HER.  SHE GOT 99 YEARS.  ABOUT TIME .  ___
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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org


Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

2012-10-13 Thread Lee Evans
Hey Susan, where do you get PetsMart discounted gift cards.  I have never seen 
them.  Is this one of those online places or eBay or where?


 
Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty neighbors 
too!





 From: Susan Hoffman susan_hoff...@yahoo.com
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2012 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food
 

I spend about $1000 a month with a population that ranges from 25-40, depending 
on adoptions and new intake.  We feed primarily canned but with dry (mostly 
Kirkland Premium and the no-grain in the orange bag).  It's a big chunk of 
money every month but the cats are happy and healthy.
 
For the past year I've been planning ahead and buying discounted PetSmart gift 
cards through http://www.giftcardbin.com/ and http://www.cardpool.com/  They 
also have petco cards but nothing for Costco.  Take a look.  It really has 
helped my budget.  (I recently combined gift cards discounted by 18% with the 
PetSmart Friends  Family sale discount of 15%, and used a few random coupons.  
For awhile there I had a lot of cases of friskies stacked up in the living 
room!)

From: dlg...@windstream.net dlg...@windstream.net
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2012 11:40 AM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

Since Homey and Nitnoy, I feed half canned and dry.  I also have water 
fountains and that makes a diffrence in how much they drink.  I have to fill up 
the 2 fountains every morning and afternoon.  Each takes 64 ounces. Course Casey
 spills some.  She likes to bat at the water before she drinks.  I never 
thought about how much per day per cat, just feed them.  I usually give about 
1/4 cup in morning, afternoon and evening of the dry Blue Buffalo and 1 can 
divided by 7.  I mix the can with 2 cans of hot water.  The heat makes it smell 
more and they always drink the liquid and later on eat the meat.

 Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com wrote: 
 I'm curious as to how much you are spending per day per cat feeding dry.  I
 am able to feed raw for 70 cents/day per cat.  If you didn't buy the
 chicken from Whole Foods, which charges about twice as much as do, say
 local ethnic butchers, then you could roll in for around half that.
 
 I've heard they have to eat more dry than raw, as it isn't as
 high-octane
 of food.  Also, cats don't drink enough water to compensate for dry food,
 grain/starch-free or not, and stand a very good chance of ending up with
 CRF.
 
 
 On Thu, Oct 11, 2012 at 10:06 AM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:
 
  Oh, @#$%!!!.  The price of Kirkland Adult Maintenance cat food used to be
  $16.99.  Then it went up a year later to $17.59.  Well, I bought two 20 lb.
  bags a week and a half ago.  This Tuesday, I went back to Costco because my
  cats ate most of the Kirkland and the price had gone up to $18.99!!!  It
  went up $1.49 in about a week.  This is robbery.  I'm so depressed.  The
  crap I buy at the feed store doesn't have a high fat content and doesn't

  have actual chicken like Kirkland and is $20  for a 36 pound bag.  Well,
  kitties, you're going to be back on a diet of crap and corn meal unless
  Mommy can get another job online.  Sigh.
 
 
  Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty
  neighbors too!
 
 
  ___
  Felvtalk mailing list
  Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
  http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org
 
 
 
 
 -- 
 
 Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!
 
 If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
 life. 
 Contact your local pound for information.
 http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm
 
 If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
 to free up cage space.
 
 
 Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
 implementing the No Kill Equation:
 http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/
 
 Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
 http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/
 
 Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org
 
 More fun reading:
 http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/
 
 More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
 http://vimeo.com/48445902
 
 
 
 Local feral cat crisis?  See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
 http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537


___
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Felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
http://felineleukemia.org/mailman/listinfo/felvtalk_felineleukemia.org



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Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

2012-10-13 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
I spend half again that much.However, it's not a numbers game, it's
what you can handle.   I know of someone who has 40 colonies in three
cities.   She gets up at 2:30 a.m. each morning to do half each day, and
then goes to work full time.  (BTW, she spends $1000/month on mostly
kibble.)

Do you have pet food banks near you?   You can also contact pet food stores
to see if they will give you outdated food.   Even if the cans are dented,
they are OK, as they have a protective lining.


On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 6:13 PM, dlg...@windstream.net wrote:

 I never thought about that!  I cry at $100 a month. $1000 would give me
 heart failure!  Will try those cards.  Great idea!


  Susan Hoffman  wrote:  I spend about $1000 a month with a
 population that ranges from 25-40, depending on adoptions and new intake.




Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
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[Felvtalk] Fwd: The Price of Cat Food

2012-10-13 Thread Kathryn Hargreaves
Sending again.  Gmail makes it difficult to trim posts, as it doesn't show
everything.

-- Forwarded message --
From: Kathryn Hargreaves khargrea...@gmail.com
Date: Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 9:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org


These were the links she gave:  ``For the past year I've been planning
ahead and buying discounted PetSmart gift cards through
http://www.giftcardbin.com/ and http://www.cardpool.com/  They also have
petco cards but nothing for Costco.''


On Sat, Oct 13, 2012 at 8:35 PM, Lee Evans moonsiste...@yahoo.com wrote:

 Hey Susan, where do you get PetsMart discounted gift cards.  I have never
 seen them.  Is this one of those online places or eBay or where?



 Spay and Neuter your cats and dogs and your weird relatives and nasty
 neighbors too!


--
 *From:* Susan Hoffman susan_hoff...@yahoo.com
 *To:* felvtalk@felineleukemia.org felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
 *Sent:* Thursday, October 11, 2012 2:22 PM

 *Subject:* Re: [Felvtalk] The Price of Cat Food

 I spend about $1000 a month with a population that ranges from 25-40,
 depending on adoptions and new intake.  We feed primarily canned but with
 dry (mostly Kirkland Premium and the no-grain in the orange bag).  It's a
 big chunk of money every month but the cats are happy and healthy.

 For the past year I've been planning ahead and buying discounted PetSmart
 gift cards through http://www.giftcardbin.com/ and
 http://www.cardpool.com/  They also have petco cards but nothing for
 Costco.  Take a look.  It really has helped my budget.  (I recently
 combined gift cards discounted by 18% with the PetSmart Friends  Family
 sale discount of 15%, and used a few random coupons.  For awhile there I
 had a lot of cases of friskies stacked up in the living room!)



Go Get a Life---Go Get a Shelter Animal!

If you can't adopt, then foster bottle baby shelter animal, to save their
life.  Contact your local pound for information.
http://www.laanimalservices.com/volunteer_fostercare.htm

If you can't bottle feed, foster an older animal, to save their life, and
to free up cage space.


Ask your local animal pound to start saving over 90% of their intake by
implementing the No Kill Equation:
http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/no-kill-equation/http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/

Here's the current growing list of true No Kill communities:
http://www.nokillhouston.org/no-kill-shelters-in-north-america/

Legislate better animal pound conditions: http://www.rescue50.org

More fun reading: http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/shelter-reform/guides/

More fun watching: http://vimeo.com/nokill/videos especially
http://vimeo.com/48445902



Local feral cat crisis?   See Alley Cat Allies' for how to respond:
http://www.alleycat.org/page.aspx?pid=537
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