[Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
Hey team Frameworks, I just thought I would share news that I received from Kodak... not sure if the list already knew about this and it is repetition but I felt it warranted sharing. Probably in December Kodak will be announcing the discontinuation of a number of motion picture film products. The products I know about are: *7207 7203* 100’ *Tri-X* 400’ *5222* 1000’ *7222* 100’ 400’ There may be more than I am aware of. This is in addition to the sad news about Ektachrome and Hi Con. It may be time for Frameworks to consider contacting (or choosing a Frameworks representative to contact) the higher ups at Kodak to express the importance that the less industrial, less Hollywood products really need to be maintained during this challenging time in order that we can continue to expose young filmmakers and the public to the merits and beauty of film. All of us on this list help Kodak in various ways by creating our works on their film stock, and this in turn helps to ensure films presence moving forward in the motion picture world - whether it be workshops with kids who will become the filmmakers of the future, experimental cinema or the fine arts/gallery settings, our efforts help Kodak and we need to make sure we are pleading our case that they maintain the products we use. Mainly, I am speaking about Tri-X in 100' 16mm and S8... I was told they originally were going to discontinue the 100' loads of Tri-X 16mm. Thankfully, enough people (perhaps film schools and educators) sent letters to Kodak complaining that this would essentially hinder there ability to promote film and inspire new generations to appreciate it, so Kodak is continuing its sale for now. Perhaps we need a concerted effort from Frameworks to speak to Kodak about the merits of maintaining introductory, educational and smaller gauge film products during this time. I am thinking there must be some way to make them realize that the only way we will have Tarantinos lobbying major production companies to guarantee Kodak contracts in the future is to be able to show the next generation what it means to work on film. Thanks! ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
[Frameworks] Auto Response
Hello. My Yahoo account is being closed. Please send email to swet...@uwm.edu Thank you. Steve ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X. Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis Sent from my iPod On Aug 30, 2014, at 8:53 AM, Alex Balkam blueswingingd...@gmail.com wrote: Hey team Frameworks, I just thought I would share news that I received from Kodak... not sure if the list already knew about this and it is repetition but I felt it warranted sharing. Probably in December Kodak will be announcing the discontinuation of a number of motion picture film products. The products I know about are: 7207 7203 100’ Tri-X 400’ 5222 1000’ 7222 100’ 400’ There may be more than I am aware of. This is in addition to the sad news about Ektachrome and Hi Con. It may be time for Frameworks to consider contacting (or choosing a Frameworks representative to contact) the higher ups at Kodak to express the importance that the less industrial, less Hollywood products really need to be maintained during this challenging time in order that we can continue to expose young filmmakers and the public to the merits and beauty of film. All of us on this list help Kodak in various ways by creating our works on their film stock, and this in turn helps to ensure films presence moving forward in the motion picture world - whether it be workshops with kids who will become the filmmakers of the future, experimental cinema or the fine arts/gallery settings, our efforts help Kodak and we need to make sure we are pleading our case that they maintain the products we use. Mainly, I am speaking about Tri-X in 100' 16mm and S8... I was told they originally were going to discontinue the 100' loads of Tri-X 16mm. Thankfully, enough people (perhaps film schools and educators) sent letters to Kodak complaining that this would essentially hinder there ability to promote film and inspire new generations to appreciate it, so Kodak is continuing its sale for now. Perhaps we need a concerted effort from Frameworks to speak to Kodak about the merits of maintaining introductory, educational and smaller gauge film products during this time. I am thinking there must be some way to make them realize that the only way we will have Tarantinos lobbying major production companies to guarantee Kodak contracts in the future is to be able to show the next generation what it means to work on film. Thanks! ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X. Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis Sent from my iPod On Aug 30, 2014, at 8:53 AM, Alex Balkam blueswingingd...@gmail.com wrote: Hey team Frameworks, I just thought I would share news that I received from Kodak... not sure if the list already knew about this and it is repetition but I felt it warranted sharing. Probably in December Kodak will be announcing the discontinuation of a number of motion picture film products. The products I know about are: 7207 7203 100’ Tri-X 400’ 5222 1000’ 7222 100’ 400’ There may be more than I am aware of. This is in addition to the sad news about Ektachrome and Hi Con. It may be time for Frameworks to consider contacting (or choosing a Frameworks representative to contact) the higher ups at Kodak to express the importance that the less industrial, less Hollywood products really need to be maintained during this challenging time in order that we can continue to expose young filmmakers and the public to the merits and beauty of film. All of us on this list help Kodak in various ways by creating our works on their film stock, and this in turn helps to ensure films presence moving forward in the motion picture world - whether it be workshops with kids who will become the filmmakers of the future, experimental cinema or the fine arts/gallery settings, our efforts help Kodak and we need to make sure we are pleading our case that they maintain the products we use. Mainly, I am speaking about Tri-X in 100' 16mm and S8... I was told they originally were going to discontinue the 100' loads of Tri-X 16mm. Thankfully, enough people (perhaps film schools and educators) sent letters to Kodak complaining that this would essentially hinder there ability to promote film and inspire new generations to appreciate it, so Kodak is continuing its sale for now. Perhaps we need a concerted effort from Frameworks to speak to Kodak about the merits of maintaining introductory, educational and smaller gauge film products during this time. I am thinking there must be some way to make them realize that the only way we will have Tarantinos lobbying major production companies to guarantee Kodak contracts in the future is to be able to show the next generation what it means to work on film. Thanks! ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful! edo On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Pablo Marin pamari...@yahoo.com wrote: Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X. Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis Sent from my iPod On Aug 30, 2014, at 8:53 AM, Alex Balkam blueswingingd...@gmail.com wrote: Hey team Frameworks, I just thought I would share news that I received from Kodak... not sure if the list already knew about this and it is repetition but I felt it warranted sharing. Probably in December Kodak will be announcing the discontinuation of a number of motion picture film products. The products I know about are: *7207 7203* 100’ *Tri-X* 400’ *5222* 1000’ *7222* 100’ 400’ There may be more than I am aware of. This is in addition to the sad news about Ektachrome and Hi Con. It may be time for Frameworks to consider contacting (or choosing a Frameworks representative to contact) the higher ups at Kodak to express the importance that the less industrial, less Hollywood products really need to be maintained during this challenging time in order that we can continue to expose young filmmakers and the public to the merits and beauty of film. All of us on this list help Kodak in various ways by creating our works on their film stock, and this in turn helps to ensure films presence moving forward in the motion picture world - whether it be workshops with kids who will become the filmmakers of the future, experimental cinema or the fine arts/gallery settings, our efforts help Kodak and we need to make sure we are pleading our case that they maintain the products we use. Mainly, I am speaking about Tri-X in 100' 16mm and S8... I was told they originally were going to discontinue the 100' loads of Tri-X 16mm. Thankfully, enough people (perhaps film schools and educators) sent letters to Kodak complaining that this would essentially hinder there ability to promote film and inspire new generations to appreciate it, so Kodak is continuing its sale for now. Perhaps we need a concerted effort from Frameworks to speak to Kodak about the merits of maintaining introductory, educational and smaller gauge film products during this time. I am thinking there must be some way to make them realize that the only way we will have Tarantinos lobbying major production companies to guarantee Kodak contracts in the future is to be able to show the next generation what it means to work on film. Thanks! ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them. True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there, luckily. Jean-Louis On 2014-08-30, at 12:21 PM, Edward Choi wrote: I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful! edo On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Pablo Marin pamari...@yahoo.com wrote: Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X. Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Deleting Frameworks Account
Hi Jessica, I just checked, and the footers don't show up in iOS either. The Mail App on iPhone and iPad is not a full computer program so there is no way to see mail headers. I suggest FrameWorkers to use a computer e-mail client that can display full headers if they want to access their subscription options. -Pip At 18:53 -0500 28/08/14, J. Fenlon wrote: Those multiple options don't show for those reading email in 3d party clients, like on iOS devices (iPhone etc). You may want to throw an unsubscribe link into the message footer to get around that 'unsubscription block'. ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
This whole thing with Kodak is just so sad--historically, culturally, professionally, and personally. So disappointed as well. Tim From: bolext...@gmail.com Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2014 12:53:06 -0400 To: frameworks@jonasmekasfilms.com Subject: Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them.True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there, luckily. Jean-Louis On 2014-08-30, at 12:21 PM, Edward Choi wrote:I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful! edo On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Pablo Marin pamari...@yahoo.com wrote: Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X.Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Bill Greaves
Saddened to hear this--much love and respect for Bill Greaves. RIP. Tim From: sc...@financialcleansing.com To: FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2014 16:21:16 -0700 CC: smacd...@hamilton.edu Subject: [Frameworks] Bill Greaves FrameWorkers, Many of you no doubt know--though I've not seen a FrameWorks post on this--that William Greaves died this past Monday, after a long illness. Bill was one of the loveliest men to ever walk the earth, and his career (as songwriter, stage actor, film actor, acting teacher, documentary filmmaker, TV host, teacher, and director of the amazing SYMBIOPSYCHOTAXIPLASM:TAKE ONE) was a wonder. An obituary was in Monday's New York Times; SYMBIO is on a Criterion DVD. RIP, dear Bill. Scott ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
Hi Jean-Louis, I would be interested in hearing more about these other options for bw. I know of Orwo but I find it hard to obtain their stocks here in Canada unless you know of somewhere other then LIFT in Toronto? LIFT carries a few of there stocks but not all of them. Roger D. WilsonFilm Scientist613 324 - 7504rogerdwilson@sympatico.cahttp://www.rogerdwilson.ca Without failure you can never achieve success. I have based my process and my career as an experimental film artist on this statement; and I welcome it as it pushes me forward as an artist to try something different, something new. From: bolext...@gmail.com Date: Sat, 30 Aug 2014 12:53:06 -0400 To: frameworks@jonasmekasfilms.com Subject: Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them.True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there, luckily. Jean-Louis On 2014-08-30, at 12:21 PM, Edward Choi wrote:I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful! edo On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Pablo Marin pamari...@yahoo.com wrote: Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X.Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 9:53 AM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them. True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there, luckily. It is a little complicated with Kodak's recent discontinuation of stocks. I like ORWO, however ORWO stocks -- both UN54 and N74 -- do not run through one of my cameras without needing to make adjustments for running color vs. BW. I've had issues with ORWO in another camera as well. I've had few issues like this with Kodak BW stocks. Also, with Kodak, being in education, I get a discount which makes it lower in cost than ORWO. I've been shooting a project that uses Double-X (7222), Tri-X (7266) processed as negative and ORWO's UN54 and N74. When all of these stocks are printed to 7203 the differences are pretty slight. I don't know what labs are printing to ORWO's BW print stocks... though I would be curious to know, since 7203 and 3302 may be put on the chopping block soon. Ferrania (http://www.filmferrania.it/) might be starting production of color film stocks, but I have yet to see anything...and who knows when such a stock will become available in North America. I'm not disagreeing with you necessarily, I just think that ORWO and Ferrania will have to prove they have the same level of QC as Kodak does (and Fuji did). Not that Kodak is/was flawless, but it's amazing how close to perfect they can get in manufacturing their stocks. Alain On 2014-08-30, at 12:21 PM, Edward Choi wrote: I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful! edo On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Pablo Marin pamari...@yahoo.com wrote: Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X. Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks -- 40 FRAMES Alain LeTourneau Pam Minty 40 FRAMES 5232 North Williams Avenue Portland, Oregon 97217 USA +1 503 231 6548 www.40frames.org www.16mmdirectory.org www.emptyquarterfilm.org ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
When I was a student in the mid 1970s, Ferrania used to make a good colour reversal film and five bath processing kit. This was in the days, now mostly long gone, when people did things; knitting, sewing, repairing, developing etc. The colour was beautiful: soft and subtle, but hard to control in processing. Amazing they're still around, Nicky. -Original Message- From: 40 Frames i...@40frames.org To: Experimental Film Discussion List frameworks@jonasmekasfilms.com Sent: Sat, 30 Aug 2014 19:22 Subject: Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 9:53 AM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them. True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there, luckily. It is a little complicated with Kodak's recent discontinuation of stocks. I like ORWO, however ORWO stocks -- both UN54 and N74 -- do not run through one of my cameras without needing to make adjustments for running color vs. BW. I've had issues with ORWO in another camera as well. I've had few issues like this with Kodak BW stocks. Also, with Kodak, being in education, I get a discount which makes it lower in cost than ORWO. I've been shooting a project that uses Double-X (7222), Tri-X (7266) processed as negative and ORWO's UN54 and N74. When all of these stocks are printed to 7203 the differences are pretty slight. I don't know what labs are printing to ORWO's BW print stocks... though I would be curious to know, since 7203 and 3302 may be put on the chopping block soon. Ferrania (http://www.filmferrania.it/) might be starting production of color film stocks, but I have yet to see anything...and who knows when such a stock will become available in North America. I'm not disagreeing with you necessarily, I just think that ORWO and Ferrania will have to prove they have the same level of QC as Kodak does (and Fuji did). Not that Kodak is/was flawless, but it's amazing how close to perfect they can get in manufacturing their stocks. Alain On 2014-08-30, at 12:21 PM, Edward Choi wrote: I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful! edo On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Pablo Marin pamari...@yahoo.com wrote: Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X. Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks -- 40 FRAMES Alain LeTourneau Pam Minty 40 FRAMES 5232 North Williams Avenue Portland, Oregon 97217 USA +1 503 231 6548 www.40frames.org www.16mmdirectory.org www.emptyquarterfilm.org ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
forza ferrania! http://www.filmferrania.it/ 2014-08-30 14:50 GMT-04:00 nicky.ham...@talktalk.net: When I was a student in the mid 1970s, Ferrania used to make a good colour reversal film and five bath processing kit. This was in the days, now mostly long gone, when people did things; knitting, sewing, repairing, developing etc. The colour was beautiful: soft and subtle, but hard to control in processing. Amazing they're still around, Nicky. -Original Message- From: 40 Frames i...@40frames.org To: Experimental Film Discussion List frameworks@jonasmekasfilms.com Sent: Sat, 30 Aug 2014 19:22 Subject: Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 9:53 AM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them. True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there, luckily. It is a little complicated with Kodak's recent discontinuation of stocks. I like ORWO, however ORWO stocks -- both UN54 and N74 -- do not run through one of my cameras without needing to make adjustments for running color vs. BW. I've had issues with ORWO in another camera as well. I've had few issues like this with Kodak BW stocks. Also, with Kodak, being in education, I get a discount which makes it lower in cost than ORWO. I've been shooting a project that uses Double-X (7222), Tri-X (7266) processed as negative and ORWO's UN54 and N74. When all of these stocks are printed to 7203 the differences are pretty slight. I don't know what labs are printing to ORWO's BW print stocks... though I would be curious to know, since 7203 and 3302 may be put on the chopping block soon. Ferrania (http://www.filmferrania.it/) might be starting production of color film stocks, but I have yet to see anything...and who knows when such a stock will become available in North America. I'm not disagreeing with you necessarily, I just think that ORWO and Ferrania will have to prove they have the same level of QC as Kodak does (and Fuji did). Not that Kodak is/was flawless, but it's amazing how close to perfect they can get in manufacturing their stocks. Alain On 2014-08-30, at 12:21 PM, Edward Choi wrote: I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful! edo On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Pablo Marin pamari...@yahoo.com wrote: Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X. Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks -- 40 FRAMES Alain LeTourneau Pam Minty 40 FRAMES 5232 North Williams Avenue Portland, Oregon 97217 USA +1 503 231 6548 www.40frames.org www.16mmdirectory.org www.emptyquarterfilm.org ___ FrameWorks mailing listFrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.comhttps://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
Ferrania's got a survey up if you want to chime in: http://www.filmferrania.it/survey/ I wonder how long 3378e will be around... On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Francisco Torres fjtorre...@gmail.com wrote: forza ferrania! http://www.filmferrania.it/ 2014-08-30 14:50 GMT-04:00 nicky.ham...@talktalk.net: When I was a student in the mid 1970s, Ferrania used to make a good colour reversal film and five bath processing kit. This was in the days, now mostly long gone, when people did things; knitting, sewing, repairing, developing etc. The colour was beautiful: soft and subtle, but hard to control in processing. Amazing they're still around, Nicky. -Original Message- From: 40 Frames i...@40frames.org To: Experimental Film Discussion List frameworks@jonasmekasfilms.com Sent: Sat, 30 Aug 2014 19:22 Subject: Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 9:53 AM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them. True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there, luckily. It is a little complicated with Kodak's recent discontinuation of stocks. I like ORWO, however ORWO stocks -- both UN54 and N74 -- do not run through one of my cameras without needing to make adjustments for running color vs. BW. I've had issues with ORWO in another camera as well. I've had few issues like this with Kodak BW stocks. Also, with Kodak, being in education, I get a discount which makes it lower in cost than ORWO. I've been shooting a project that uses Double-X (7222), Tri-X (7266) processed as negative and ORWO's UN54 and N74. When all of these stocks are printed to 7203 the differences are pretty slight. I don't know what labs are printing to ORWO's BW print stocks... though I would be curious to know, since 7203 and 3302 may be put on the chopping block soon. Ferrania (http://www.filmferrania.it/) might be starting production of color film stocks, but I have yet to see anything...and who knows when such a stock will become available in North America. I'm not disagreeing with you necessarily, I just think that ORWO and Ferrania will have to prove they have the same level of QC as Kodak does (and Fuji did). Not that Kodak is/was flawless, but it's amazing how close to perfect they can get in manufacturing their stocks. Alain On 2014-08-30, at 12:21 PM, Edward Choi wrote: I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful! edo On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Pablo Marin pamari...@yahoo.com wrote: Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X. Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks -- 40 FRAMES Alain LeTourneau Pam Minty 40 FRAMES 5232 North Williams Avenue Portland, Oregon 97217 USA +1 503 231 6548 www.40frames.org www.16mmdirectory.org www.emptyquarterfilm.org ___ FrameWorks mailing listFrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.comhttps://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
On 2014-08-30, at 2:05 PM, Roger Wilson wrote: Hi Jean-Louis, I would be interested in hearing more about these other options for bw. I know of Orwo but I find it hard to obtain their stocks here in Canada unless you know of somewhere other then LIFT in Toronto? LIFT carries a few of there stocks but not all of them. Roger D. Wilson Hi Roger, http://www.orwona.com/ The site says they're out of UN54 but the N74 negative is listed as in stock. Cheers, Jean-Louis ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:06 PM, Ekrem Serdar ekremser...@gmail.com wrote: Ferrania's got a survey up if you want to chime in: http://www.filmferrania.it/survey/ I wonder how long 3378e will be around... My thoughts exactly... maybe Toscano has word on this?? Alain On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 1:57 PM, Francisco Torres fjtorre...@gmail.com wrote: forza ferrania! http://www.filmferrania.it/ 2014-08-30 14:50 GMT-04:00 nicky.ham...@talktalk.net: When I was a student in the mid 1970s, Ferrania used to make a good colour reversal film and five bath processing kit. This was in the days, now mostly long gone, when people did things; knitting, sewing, repairing, developing etc. The colour was beautiful: soft and subtle, but hard to control in processing. Amazing they're still around, Nicky. -Original Message- From: 40 Frames i...@40frames.org To: Experimental Film Discussion List frameworks@jonasmekasfilms.com Sent: Sat, 30 Aug 2014 19:22 Subject: Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 9:53 AM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them. True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there, luckily. It is a little complicated with Kodak's recent discontinuation of stocks. I like ORWO, however ORWO stocks -- both UN54 and N74 -- do not run through one of my cameras without needing to make adjustments for running color vs. BW. I've had issues with ORWO in another camera as well. I've had few issues like this with Kodak BW stocks. Also, with Kodak, being in education, I get a discount which makes it lower in cost than ORWO. I've been shooting a project that uses Double-X (7222), Tri-X (7266) processed as negative and ORWO's UN54 and N74. When all of these stocks are printed to 7203 the differences are pretty slight. I don't know what labs are printing to ORWO's BW print stocks... though I would be curious to know, since 7203 and 3302 may be put on the chopping block soon. Ferrania (http://www.filmferrania.it/) might be starting production of color film stocks, but I have yet to see anything...and who knows when such a stock will become available in North America. I'm not disagreeing with you necessarily, I just think that ORWO and Ferrania will have to prove they have the same level of QC as Kodak does (and Fuji did). Not that Kodak is/was flawless, but it's amazing how close to perfect they can get in manufacturing their stocks. Alain On 2014-08-30, at 12:21 PM, Edward Choi wrote: I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful! edo On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 12:04 PM, Pablo Marin pamari...@yahoo.com wrote: Although I agree with many of your points, Jean-Louis, I think that implying that Kodak doesn't have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking is kind of a cheap shot... when the issue is more complicated than that. Would hate to be mistaken for a capitalist/industry supporter here but the fact is I´m kind of afraid of what some of these committed firms will start charging for film once the big old dinosaurs are gone... not to mention I don't see a discount price for students being offered in most of these devoted manufacturers... All best, Pablo. On Saturday, August 30, 2014 12:52 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: I wouldn't be too dismayed at the disappearance of Tri-X. Both ADOX and ORWO produce black and white reversal that is at least equal in quality to Tri-X. The new ADOX CHS-II in Super8 has received rave reviews since it's introduction and most users seem to find it superior to Tri-X. I would prefer to support companies that have a firm commitment to analog filmmaking rather then those that can't wait to pull the plug on everything. Jean-Louis ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks -- 40 FRAMES Alain LeTourneau Pam Minty 40 FRAMES 5232 North Williams Avenue Portland, Oregon 97217 USA +1 503 231 6548 www.40frames.org www.16mmdirectory.org www.emptyquarterfilm.org
Re: [Frameworks] Deleting Frameworks Account
Those headers/footers are on every framworks email on my iPhone's built-in mail app. On Aug 30, 2014, at 8:02 PM, Pip Chodorov framewo...@re-voir.com wrote: Hi Jessica, I just checked, and the footers don't show up in iOS either. The Mail App on iPhone and iPad is not a full computer program so there is no way to see mail headers. I suggest FrameWorkers to use a computer e-mail client that can display full headers if they want to access their subscription options. -Pip At 18:53 -0500 28/08/14, J. Fenlon wrote: Those multiple options don't show for those reading email in 3d party clients, like on iOS devices (iPhone etc). You may want to throw an unsubscribe link into the message footer to get around that 'unsubscription block'. ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
Well, if 3378 goes away, there is always the Agfa ST-8 replacement. But I can see 3378 disappearing as projection prints become less and less in demand, and I can see an age where electroprinting returns. --scott ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
I wrote to the LA Kodak rep (who has always been very helpful) to get her response about the discontinuations. Will pass it along when I hear anything! Mark T On Aug 30, 2014, at 2:02 PM, Scott Dorsey klu...@panix.com wrote: Well, if 3378 goes away, there is always the Agfa ST-8 replacement. But I can see 3378 disappearing as projection prints become less and less in demand, and I can see an age where electroprinting returns. --scott ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
[Frameworks] This week [August 30 - September 7, 2014] in avant garde cinema
This week [August 30 - September 7, 2014] in avant garde cinema To subscribe/unsubscribe to the weekly listing, go to http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/mailto.pl?mailto=subscribe or send an email to weeklylist...@hi-beam.net. Enter your announcements (calls for entries, new work, screenings, jobs, items for sale, etc.) at: http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl NEW FILM/VIDEO: NON-FEATURE: === A wound we won't remember by Visto desde el zaguán http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=newworkreadfile=544.ann NEW CALLS FOR ENTRIES: = FLEXFest (Gainesville, FL, USA; Deadline: October 25, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1724.ann Newport Beach Film Festival (Newport Beach, CA; Deadline: September 19, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1725.ann Dallas Medianale (Dallas, Texas, USA; Deadline: October 06, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1726.ann MONO NO AWARE VIII (Brooklyn, NY USA; Deadline: October 31, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1727.ann Plug Projects (Kansas City, MO. USA; Deadline: September 19, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1728.ann DEADLINES APPROACHING: = BELOIT INTERNATIONAL FILM FESTIVAL (Beloit, WI, USA; Deadline: August 31, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1691.ann Alchemy Festival Touring Programme: Works from Scotland (Hawick, Scotland, UK; Deadline: September 01, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1708.ann MADATAC (Madrid, SPAIN; Deadline: September 08, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1714.ann Anchorage Museum of Art (Anchorage, AK United States; Deadline: September 01, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1717.ann the8fest (Toronto, Canada; Deadline: September 30, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1718.ann Big Muddy Film Festival (Carbondale, IL, USA; Deadline: September 15, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1723.ann Newport Beach Film Festival (Newport Beach, CA; Deadline: September 19, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1725.ann Plug Projects (Kansas City, MO. USA; Deadline: September 19, 2014) http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/ann.pl?type=callsreadfile=1728.ann Enter your event announcements by going to the Flicker Weekly Listing Form at http://www.hi-beam.net/cgi-bin/thisweek.pl Also available online at Flicker: http://www.hi-beam.net THIS WEEK'S PROGRAMS (SUMMARY): == * The Message Is Medium (At Best) ... A Yearning For Learning [August 30, Los Angeles, California] * Revitalization [August 30, Washington, DC] * Filmmobile Presents: Film Farm 20th Anniversary Show [August 31, Los Angeles, California] * Metamorphasis [August 31, Washington, DC] * Box Has Six Sides [September 3, Bilbao, Spain] * Open Screening - Ata Film videos [September 4, San Francisco, California] * Ata's 30-Hour 30th Anniversary Marathon Screening [September 5, San Francisco, CA] * Mann On the Street: videos By andy Mann [September 6, Austin, TX] * Resistfilm - Piezas De Cine Experimental En Super 8mm Y 16mm, De Pablo MarÃN [September 7, Buenos Aires, Argentina] Events are sorted by CITY within each DATE. - SATURDAY, AUGUST 30, 2014 - 8/30 Los Angeles, California: Echo Park Film Center http://www.echoparkfilmcenter.org/ 8 pm, 1200 N. Alvarado St. THE MESSAGE IS MEDIUM (AT BEST) ... A YEARNING FOR LEARNING Delving deep into dark recesses of the vaults of Smokehouse Films, archivist/filmmaker John Cannizzaro together with actor/singer/writer Gia Mora have gathered together a mind-popping, eye-blowing spectacle of campy educationals, bizarre documentaries, and just plain WACKY films for your entertainment and learning pleasure. Come laugh, cry, scream, act, and interact with these rare and remarkable gemsall projected on glorious 16mm filmjust like when you were in school. Class participation is a must! Refreshments and recess will be provided. 8/30 Washington, DC: National Gallery of Art http://www.nga.gov 2pm, National Mall between 3rd and 9th Streets, West Building Lecture Hall REVITALIZATION The decade of the 1990s was important for Canyon Cinema. A new generation of artists' works in 16 mm film resulted in a dynamic resurgence of film art and exhibition during that time. Moving into the new millennium, this program features films by Eve Heller, David Gatten, Naomi Uman, Tomonari Nishikawa, and others. (Total running time approximately 90 minutes) --- SUNDAY, AUGUST 31, 2014 --- 8/31 Los Angeles, California: Echo Park Film Center http://www.echoparkfilmcenter.org/ 8 pm, Corner of Echo Park Ave.
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
Alex Balkam wrote: It may be time for Frameworks to consider contacting the higher ups at Kodak to express the importance that the less industrial, less Hollywood products really need to be maintained during this challenging time in order that we can continue to expose young filmmakers and the public to the merits and beauty of film. Been there. Did that. Pleaded, cajoled, begged John Mason, former higher-up in Kodak's Ed division (now retired) that they continue making tungsten color reversal so schools with non-studio-style programs (and budgets) could still teach photo-chemical filmmaking in color. I told them they were driving us little-folk into digital. Deaf ears. All they really cared about were big schools that bought lots of stock and fed students into the industry as camera crew. Their position was: 'You teach basic cinematography in BW, and anyone doing an advanced project will have the time and resources for color negative.' I am thinking there must be some way to make them realize that the only way we will have Tarantinos lobbying major production companies to guarantee Kodak contracts in the future is to be able to show the next generation what it means to work on film. They know that. You have to understand Kodak was a giant industrial corporation that had no economic path to shrinkage, and is now is capitalist hospice, waiting out its last days. All they're trying to do now is slow the bleeding, and save as much stock value as they can for the next quarterly report. Even if someone in the higher-ups still plans to be around for the next generation of output by major production companies (and that's doubtful), they're not in a position to 'maintain less Hollywood products,' plan for the future, or do anything but maximize profits from the Cinema Division right now as a bandaid on the larger corporate hemorrhage. Kodak used to be a big sponsor of UFVA, throwing a big Banquet at the conference each year, and bringing in a major personage from ASC for a featured evening talk, e.g. Vilmos Zsigmond, Laszlo Kovacs... (Their concept of 'filmmaking education' beginning and ending with cinematography for narrative film. If any of the many Ed. reps who used to go to UFVA even knew who, say, Al Maysles or Jem Cohen were, they didn't give a poop.) Kodak even hosted the conference one year at their corporate HQ in Rochester, in the fancy RD building they had put up maybe a decade or two earlier. Most of the facility had been vacated, and the place already smelled of death. That was 2001. It was either around that time or in the next couple years (memory fails me) that they made their Big Move to show the next generation what it means to work on film. This was the introduction of the exact BW stocks they are now discontinuing or making unavailable in 100' loads (read 'phasing out'). The old Plus-X/Tri-X processing was considered too toxic, and they had to entirely reformulate the stocks for new chemistry. This cost them a lot of time and money, and it was all spearheaded by the Ed. Division. The read-between-the-lines message was: 'We don't make enough money on this to justify the RD economically, and if it was up to the bean-counters corporate would be dropping all of this stuff, but we (Ed. div.) went in and fought for you (teachers), and convinced them that profit-or-not, we need new BW stocks so the academies can still teach cinematography at a reasonable cost.' A few years later, the Ed. Division had shrunk to a fraction of it's former size, Kodak was no longer sponsoring UFVA as before, and the sumptuous Kodak Banquets and prestige ASC talks had been replaced by crackers-and-chesse receptions and bozo editing talks sponsored by Avid. By the last time I taught my photochemical filmmaking class in '09, I was spooling 100D off 400' cores onto 100' daylight reels so the students who could afford color stock could get something into our clockwork cameras. When I'd found out Kodak had discontinued the 100' loads of 100D, I had just shaken my head. What else was I to expect after 10 years of watching the ship sink, but another nail in the non-Hollywood-photochemical-film-education coffin? In conclusion, if non-Hollywood makers and educators are going to organize around the preservation of reasonable-cost 16mm stock, I think it would be wise to aim those efforts beyond Kodak. Try to funnel as much $$ as possible to the manufacturers that have the best prospects of staying in business the longest, try to make it in their interest to expand distribution in North America, and offer student discounts. Lobby them for the latter, perhaps by gathering commitments from schools to order X amount of stock if a discount becomes available. Explain to them that when Kodak goes under, the students aren't going to have the option of paying more for un-discounted stock, and they'll almost all just go digital. Look at the development rate of
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
I'll have to admit, I know of no other film manufacturer other than Kodak, probably because they have dominated the US market for years. Any recomendation on how to locate the others for those who are like me? On 8/30/2014 12:53 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin wrote: Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them. True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
Current manufacturers (Other than Kodak): Agfa Orwo Adox Kahl What format do you need? BW color, negative or reversal? Jean-Louis Sent from my iPod On Aug 30, 2014, at 8:24 PM, Fred Smith fsmit...@rcn.com wrote: I'll have to admit, I know of no other film manufacturer other than Kodak, probably because they have dominated the US market for years. Any recomendation on how to locate the others for those who are like me? On 8/30/2014 12:53 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin wrote: Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them. True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
The LIFT Store in Toronto carries a bunch: http://lift.ca/equipment/store On Sat, Aug 30, 2014 at 8:08 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin bolext...@gmail.com wrote: Current manufacturers (Other than Kodak): Agfa Orwo Adox Kahl What format do you need? BW color, negative or reversal? Jean-Louis Sent from my iPod On Aug 30, 2014, at 8:24 PM, Fred Smith fsmit...@rcn.com wrote: I'll have to admit, I know of no other film manufacturer other than Kodak, probably because they have dominated the US market for years. Any recomendation on how to locate the others for those who are like me? On 8/30/2014 12:53 PM, Jean-Louis Seguin wrote: Cheap shot? Maybe. I'm just so disappointed in Kodak, personally. I meet filmmakers all the time and it's surprising how many completely ignore the fact that there are other manufacturers in the world apart from Kodak that produce motion picture film stock. Some are truly amazed when I mention this to them. True, when it comes to color negative stocks, Kodak are the only source at the moment. For everything else, there are options out there ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks -- ekrem serdar austin, tx ___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
Re: [Frameworks] Kodak Film Stocks to be Discontinued, Announced in December
Edo, My understanding is all the recent discontinuations happen because the stock is expiring in the warehouse. So Kodak tightens up its product line by dropping the money losers. Of course with less stocks to choose from, film because less desirable to shoot. I imagine that the last stocks left standing will be 200T and 500T colour negative, which are the most popular with Hollywood. As David said in excellent detail, Kodak doesn't care about small time customers. They are only interested in mass market sales. They are still cheaper (especially in N.A.) but anyone interested in shooting film should put their support behind the smaller manufacturers. This gutting of BW stocks might make Orwo more viable in the long term. Much in the same way when Kodak dropped their BW papers they allow Ilford to fill the void and become viable again. I'm surprised that 3302 and 3378 weren't discontinued with the BW intermediate stocks of this go round. John On Saturday, August 30, 2014 9:21:49 AM, Edward Choi e...@uchicago.edu wrote: I'm a little confused about the discontinuation of 7203 and 7207 in 100' rolls. Does it really save them that much at the margins when they're continuing to manufacture the stock itself and offer it in larger quantities? If someone who knows more about the way their manufacturing chain is set up could explain this, and perhaps disabuse me of my naivety, I would be most grateful!___ FrameWorks mailing list FrameWorks@jonasmekasfilms.com https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks
