Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Smiles, agreeing with, Shawn, as the subject what to do. A decade old question with Mister North. Centerizing Blind games under a hud, in much the way Amazon, does with stores to get certain items. Or much like our own blind community of Blind Mice Mart Dot Com. In which, products and be polled and commented on. Once a game is marketed, the game programmer can work on new products or improving upon the one listed. To keep up with Technology, is the programmers hardest battle. Games over the years, will begin to get low ratings and comments, that gives the programmer on what is needed to bring a game back to life in a new version. I wish I could win the Lotto, to have the money, for such a grand idea. And I don't surf, the web like I use to, so there may be indeed a web site as I describe. But, I see so many Independent Game writers, from the ones testing the water to our best, in the last ten years and more. Around that time, there was only one real time card game on line, named ZFormed. A five draw poker game. Now, we have grown, to see others succeed, in many areas. A steady of watch dogs, to keep things up and up, through the years. My hhat off to them and the programmers, giving up time to supply games to enlught our lifes. I bow to you, for your work and love of an idea, and wanting to share it with the world and the blind community. For me, in my last words, before deleting this thread, like ot put in a wish list of a game. Adventures of the Trapper: A Mountin Man, who encounters characters during his time of trapping Beavers for sale. Indians of friend and foe. Outlaws and gunsligners. The Army Gold seekers and others. Set on missions, to help a friend or Army,. Piece together given info to complete missions and so on that can include arcade sections to say get pass a pack of. A free of charge Idea, from Crash. God Bless all. Bears, who want you for dinner. - Original Message - From: shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 5:29 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? we need more automated systems then that is the only answer or have others that can be trusted sending keys to people sort of like a cloud based network. I'd gladly do it as I often have time where I don't do anything at all. At 05:47 AM 6/24/2013, you wrote: Your comments, followed by my responses: Comment: If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. Response: So, if I were to purchase something on Saturday evening, the developer is to get my registration key to me by Sunday evening? If more people felt this way, there goes a developer's weekend with family, and they get no time off, all due to gamer's total lack of understanding and patience! This attitude is exactly what I was talking about in my original post on this thread, and there! is! no! excuse! for! it! being! tolerated!!! You say: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. my response: If your clients behave that way, then I strongly suggest that you get other clients. And to make matters worse, you? condone? piracy?? If I had anything to say about this list, and keep in mind that this is my personal opinion, you would be banned from this list, and I would do something about your advertising of the fact that you have no problem in having a hand in piracy for the simple fact that your clients are impatient. Suggesting to your clients that they should get a cracked copy of software rather than wait for a legal one is downright deplorable, and you should be ashamed of yourself, although you apparently are not. I know one thing for sure: Knowing what I now have read directly from you, I would never do any business with you, and I suggest that all others take the same stance against your despicable business practices. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Well, judging from the Chillingham review, the female voiceover sounds darn right miserable to the point she didn't really want to do it. The male voiceover didn't sound too bad. In Grizzly Gulch however, both voiceovers sounded like they were having fun and were really keen on doing it. Just my £0.02 worth and glad I haven't missed much from Chillingham. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:33, Desiree Oudinot wrote: Well, this is my personal opinion, but you didn't miss much by not playing Chillingham. That game really didn't impress me. However, Grizzly Gulch was fun the first few times I played it. It just lacks replay value. I can think of about 10 different ways I would have expanded it myself, content I would have added, etc., so that even if there were limits on randomizing the gameplay at that time either due to programmer inexperience or software and hardware limitations of then current systems, the game would have been at least a bit more worthy of praise. On 6/24/13, Chris H christopher...@gmail.com wrote: Lisa it sounds like it to me their games don't even work on the latest and greatest I did buy Grizzly Gulch and wanted Chillingham but time moved on and forgot all about it. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:06, Lisa Hayes wrote: bAvisoft was a unique case they didn't give a sausage about their customers or anyone else talk about bringing your demise on yourself. Lisa Hayes www.nutrimetics.com.au/lisahayes - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
You know, I always felt the same way. And none of the characters in Chillingham were really memorable, let alone worth making fun of. At least in Grizzly Gulch you could laugh at the Marshall's gravelly voice or Cecil whistling on every S. In Chillingham the only character you could really have fun with was Bill the Hermit. In fact although I don't think it's been available for quite a few years Liam Erven once did a sort of parody sketch using clips of Old Bill and the main character Frederic. Of course that particular bit of audio would probably not be suitable for those under eighteen or so and certainly not for those who are easily offended. But if like me you have an at times offbeat sense of humor it was pretty hilarious. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Chris H Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 2:07 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Well, judging from the Chillingham review, the female voiceover sounds darn right miserable to the point she didn't really want to do it. The male voiceover didn't sound too bad. In Grizzly Gulch however, both voiceovers sounded like they were having fun and were really keen on doing it. Just my £0.02 worth and glad I haven't missed much from Chillingham. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:33, Desiree Oudinot wrote: Well, this is my personal opinion, but you didn't miss much by not playing Chillingham. That game really didn't impress me. However, Grizzly Gulch was fun the first few times I played it. It just lacks replay value. I can think of about 10 different ways I would have expanded it myself, content I would have added, etc., so that even if there were limits on randomizing the gameplay at that time either due to programmer inexperience or software and hardware limitations of then current systems, the game would have been at least a bit more worthy of praise. On 6/24/13, Chris H christopher...@gmail.com wrote: Lisa it sounds like it to me their games don't even work on the latest and greatest I did buy Grizzly Gulch and wanted Chillingham but time moved on and forgot all about it. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:06, Lisa Hayes wrote: bAvisoft was a unique case they didn't give a sausage about their customers or anyone else talk about bringing your demise on yourself. Lisa Hayes www.nutrimetics.com.au/lisahayes - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Oh man I would love to hear that lol! -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Bryan Peterson Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 4:47 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You know, I always felt the same way. And none of the characters in Chillingham were really memorable, let alone worth making fun of. At least in Grizzly Gulch you could laugh at the Marshall's gravelly voice or Cecil whistling on every S. In Chillingham the only character you could really have fun with was Bill the Hermit. In fact although I don't think it's been available for quite a few years Liam Erven once did a sort of parody sketch using clips of Old Bill and the main character Frederic. Of course that particular bit of audio would probably not be suitable for those under eighteen or so and certainly not for those who are easily offended. But if like me you have an at times offbeat sense of humor it was pretty hilarious. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Chris H Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 2:07 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Well, judging from the Chillingham review, the female voiceover sounds darn right miserable to the point she didn't really want to do it. The male voiceover didn't sound too bad. In Grizzly Gulch however, both voiceovers sounded like they were having fun and were really keen on doing it. Just my £0.02 worth and glad I haven't missed much from Chillingham. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:33, Desiree Oudinot wrote: Well, this is my personal opinion, but you didn't miss much by not playing Chillingham. That game really didn't impress me. However, Grizzly Gulch was fun the first few times I played it. It just lacks replay value. I can think of about 10 different ways I would have expanded it myself, content I would have added, etc., so that even if there were limits on randomizing the gameplay at that time either due to programmer inexperience or software and hardware limitations of then current systems, the game would have been at least a bit more worthy of praise. On 6/24/13, Chris H christopher...@gmail.com wrote: Lisa it sounds like it to me their games don't even work on the latest and greatest I did buy Grizzly Gulch and wanted Chillingham but time moved on and forgot all about it. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:06, Lisa Hayes wrote: bAvisoft was a unique case they didn't give a sausage about their customers or anyone else talk about bringing your demise on yourself. Lisa Hayes www.nutrimetics.com.au/lisahayes - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Sent with AquaMail for Android http://www.aqua-mail.com On June 24, 2013 11:05:24 AM Sky Mundell s...@shaw.ca wrote: Hello Thomas, I checked the sight and it is indeed shut down. Onnistly I can't blame you guys. They are really really out of date, in my opinion -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Thomas Ward Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 8:07 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
I only wish I had it. LOL. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Darren Duff Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 4:44 AM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Oh man I would love to hear that lol! -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Bryan Peterson Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 4:47 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You know, I always felt the same way. And none of the characters in Chillingham were really memorable, let alone worth making fun of. At least in Grizzly Gulch you could laugh at the Marshall's gravelly voice or Cecil whistling on every S. In Chillingham the only character you could really have fun with was Bill the Hermit. In fact although I don't think it's been available for quite a few years Liam Erven once did a sort of parody sketch using clips of Old Bill and the main character Frederic. Of course that particular bit of audio would probably not be suitable for those under eighteen or so and certainly not for those who are easily offended. But if like me you have an at times offbeat sense of humor it was pretty hilarious. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Chris H Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 2:07 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Well, judging from the Chillingham review, the female voiceover sounds darn right miserable to the point she didn't really want to do it. The male voiceover didn't sound too bad. In Grizzly Gulch however, both voiceovers sounded like they were having fun and were really keen on doing it. Just my £0.02 worth and glad I haven't missed much from Chillingham. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:33, Desiree Oudinot wrote: Well, this is my personal opinion, but you didn't miss much by not playing Chillingham. That game really didn't impress me. However, Grizzly Gulch was fun the first few times I played it. It just lacks replay value. I can think of about 10 different ways I would have expanded it myself, content I would have added, etc., so that even if there were limits on randomizing the gameplay at that time either due to programmer inexperience or software and hardware limitations of then current systems, the game would have been at least a bit more worthy of praise. On 6/24/13, Chris H christopher...@gmail.com wrote: Lisa it sounds like it to me their games don't even work on the latest and greatest I did buy Grizzly Gulch and wanted Chillingham but time moved on and forgot all about it. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:06, Lisa Hayes wrote: bAvisoft was a unique case they didn't give a sausage about their customers or anyone else talk about bringing your demise on yourself. Lisa Hayes www.nutrimetics.com.au/lisahayes - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
I am not about to read 40 messages, so I will just comment on this first one. I agree with Thomas on his points. While I don't play many audio games mainly because I don't care for the content when I have other games on my ps2/ps3 that I play more, I see it all the time with this community that people aren't happy, that they bitch and moan about keys/cracks of games all the time after a game is released, and even after it's been released. However, you can't put the blind community at 100% fault. The same thing goes on with sighted gamers. But since we are a relatively smaller community it hits a lot harder. If you don't have a thick skin and can just let comments roll off, you're going to quit. This is why I don't develop. One reason is because I don't have the time to do it, the other reason is if I did and started to get a whole lot of complaints, I know I'd explode on somebody. I've said it before. These debs go through a lot of work to create a game for everyone to enjoy. It takes a while to code and find bugs and get rid of them. I'm glad Jeremy has not quit his work because right now, he's the only one that is making modern games for us. If he wasn't here, I doubt that TRTR would've been made or any of the other games that are starting to come out. The same thing happened with Entombed. That was the closest that I've ever seen an audio game come to final fantasy. I'd like to see more like that, however I know that that starts to get harder because with more complex things you want happening, the more code you need to put in/the more time you need to put into the game. Another person who has been working with this for a while is Dentin. He's actually put in code for us to make Alter better and easier to play. Not only does he put up with sighted people bitching at him because equipment gets dented or things are really hard, but he's putting up with the blind community complaining when mush-z doesn't work. Hopefully most of those messages get sent to the right channel but who knows. I don't know if I'll read this thread after I send this message. But I'll repeat what I said at the beginning of this reply. While we are a smaller community, we can not put all the blame on the blind people. This kind of thing happens on a much larger scale with the sighted players. However, if we keep this up pretty soon you're going to have no one left who wants to make games for the blind and then you all will start complaining about how you all have nothing that matches up with what todays consoles have. And whose fault will that be but your own? Not everyone can play todays games on the ps3 or Xbox360. I know I'm having trouble with the little amount of vision that I have. It's almost impossible for me to play anything new that comes out because the print is to small for me to read or I can't see what is on the screen. I know it's way harder if not completely impossible for totals to play anything but fighting games which I can not stand whatsoever. They just bore me after about 15 minutes. As I said, keep it up and see what happens. Mike. On Jun 22, 2013, at 10:00 PM, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Of course Tom. 3 working days should be enough, but the more responsible you are, more clients you will have. But 6 months? I understand that a developer invests in software, sounds etc, but it is not likely that one doesn't have at least a little profit from game developement. So if you want to make some money, even only to cover your investments, you have to be responsible, otherwise I said what will happen... Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 4:52 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Milos, While I do agree that a developer should send out new or replacement license keys in a timely fassion I have always have believed in the 72 hour rule. That is a customer can expect a replacement key within three days upon request excluding weekends and holidays. That frees the developer up to fulfill personal commitments be it a job, family, doctor appointments, whatever while giving his or her customers a reasonable time frame to expect his or her license information. I personally feel 24 hours is cutting it short unless there is an automated system in place to serve the human operator when he/she is unavailable. On 6/23/13, Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 8454 (20130616) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 8454 (20130616) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
P.S. When talking about those who offer us their games for free, that's completely another thing. No responsability of this kind, no possibility of making a crack, etc. Best, Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 4:52 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Milos, While I do agree that a developer should send out new or replacement license keys in a timely fassion I have always have believed in the 72 hour rule. That is a customer can expect a replacement key within three days upon request excluding weekends and holidays. That frees the developer up to fulfill personal commitments be it a job, family, doctor appointments, whatever while giving his or her customers a reasonable time frame to expect his or her license information. I personally feel 24 hours is cutting it short unless there is an automated system in place to serve the human operator when he/she is unavailable. On 6/23/13, Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 8454 (20130616) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 8454 (20130616) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
I have apologized for what I posted if I misunderstood his meaning. However, I reacted, perhaps in haste, based on what I read and how it was worded. As for the possibility of an automated key generation method for Liam, I don't know for sure, but I would think that it would not be cheap, and how much does he get in proffits from his games? Not much. That's probably one reason there isn't such an animal already in place. This is conjecture on my part. (Sent from my iPhone) On Jun 23, 2013, at 6:19 PM, Clement Chou chou.clem...@gmail.com wrote: The amount of flack that just flew around is absolutely unbelievable. Yes, on the one point, I can see how it could be taken with the particular wording used... however, I don't think there's any cause for ripping him one the way you did, Charles. I'm probably sticking my neck out onto the chopping block... but I think as well that some people are taking a miswritten comment and blowing it way, way out of proportion. As to the main topic.. I feel 72 hours is a reasonable amount of time to wait. After that I would start asking... but while I understand Liam's position one also has to look at the standpoint of the gamers. 3 days? Fine... but if no keys are being sent in months, then shouldn't there be something done? If Liam is too busy to check keys every few days which is again understandable, couldn't there be an automated system as with Draconis? - Original Message - From: Ryan Strunk ryan.str...@gmail.com To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 2:56 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
If you are asking if we would pirate, my answer is an absolute No! It is stealing, which I refuse to do when it comes to software. And, yes, I am telling the truth. I respect and appreciate the work that these people go through to produce games for us. (Sent from my iPhone) On Jun 23, 2013, at 7:07 PM, Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com wrote: Hello Bryan, english is not my first language although I study translation and know (or should have learned till now) the language very well. You got my point and thank you for thinking rather than jumping without using your brain. I still don't know what is wrong with my wording? Only that I said that in the first person? Yes, but let me ask something. How much of you would say that you would never ever do this? And if you all say no, how much of you would not tell the trooth? Everyone knows the answer to that. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 12:14 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Exactly. I know. It'd be almost impossible not to jump to that conclusion based on the wording he chose. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:13 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? I meant exactly what I said. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 5:06 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Or that he persuades them to opt for the cracked product. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:56 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
I doubt that it will come to that point, but every one that quits producing is a loss to all of us, and if it is due to a few impatient and childish gamers, it makes me furious! It is ture, though, that it should not take months to get a registration key after you have paid for one. Then again, in comparison to the number of good experiences, how often does this unfortunate mishap happen? And, has the developer never come through with the paid for key or keys? (Sent from my iPhone) On Jun 23, 2013, at 7:35 PM, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Sometimes things come up. Developers are in no way obligated to discuss their personal lives on list. I agree it isn't right but nor is it right to constantly harp on what few developers we have. People keep that sort of behavior up and the day won't be long in coming when we'll have no developers at all. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: MamaPeach Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 6:30 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You visit any other website or business like Ebay, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, etc, , purchase a product, then you expect delivery of said product within a reasonable amount of time, say 7 to 14 days? Would you wait 6 months before inquiring where your product is? I don't know anyone that would be willing to spend their money on something and then wait for an unspecified amount of time to receive their purchased item and not get upset over not getting what was paid for. I don't see that it should be any different for developer's of games. People buy their products expecting to receive what they order, and when it never arrives, they aren't supposed to worry about where it is or why they haven't received it, and although they have written asking about why they haven't gotten it, they receive no response for the person they bought the item from? This just doesn't make sense to me and it isn't good business practice, in my opinion. It makes me worry that if I choose to purchase a game, that the developer's do not care whether we ever get what we pay for. Six months? I know I would not appreciate waiting six months for something I spent money on. Patience is one thing, but come on, no one should have to wait that long when it is their money they are spending. -Original Message- From: James Bartlett Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:02 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:27 AM, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: I doubt that it will come to that point, but every one that quits producing is a loss to all of us, and if it is due to a few impatient and childish gamers, it makes me furious! It is ture, though, that it should not take months to get a registration key after you have paid for one. Then again, in comparison to the number of good experiences, how often does this unfortunate mishap happen? And, has the developer never come through with the paid for key or keys? (Sent from my iPhone) On Jun 23, 2013, at 7:35 PM, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Sometimes things come up. Developers are in no way obligated to discuss their personal lives on list. I agree it isn't right but nor is it right to constantly harp on what few developers we have. People keep that sort of behavior up and the day won't be long in coming when we'll have no developers at all. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: MamaPeach Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 6:30 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You visit any other website or business like Ebay, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, etc, , purchase a product, then you expect delivery of said product within a reasonable amount of time, say 7 to 14 days? Would you wait 6 months before inquiring where your product is? I don't know anyone that would be willing to spend their money on something and then wait for an unspecified amount of time to receive their purchased item and not get upset over not getting what was paid for. I don't see that it should be any different for developer's of games. People buy their products expecting to receive what they order, and when it never arrives, they aren't supposed to worry about where it is or why they haven't received it, and although they have written asking about why they haven't gotten it, they receive no response for the person they bought the item from? This just doesn't make sense to me and it isn't good business practice, in my opinion. It makes me worry that if I choose to purchase a game, that the developer's do not care whether we ever get what we pay for. Six months? I know I would not appreciate waiting six months for something I spent money on. Patience is one thing, but come on, no one should have to wait that long when it is their money they are spending. -Original Message- From: James Bartlett Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:02 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
And, as far as I know, they are no longer in existance. (Sent from my iPhone) On Jun 24, 2013, at 8:41 AM, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:27 AM, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: I doubt that it will come to that point, but every one that quits producing is a loss to all of us, and if it is due to a few impatient and childish gamers, it makes me furious! It is ture, though, that it should not take months to get a registration key after you have paid for one. Then again, in comparison to the number of good experiences, how often does this unfortunate mishap happen? And, has the developer never come through with the paid for key or keys? (Sent from my iPhone) On Jun 23, 2013, at 7:35 PM, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Sometimes things come up. Developers are in no way obligated to discuss their personal lives on list. I agree it isn't right but nor is it right to constantly harp on what few developers we have. People keep that sort of behavior up and the day won't be long in coming when we'll have no developers at all. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: MamaPeach Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 6:30 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You visit any other website or business like Ebay, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, etc, , purchase a product, then you expect delivery of said product within a reasonable amount of time, say 7 to 14 days? Would you wait 6 months before inquiring where your product is? I don't know anyone that would be willing to spend their money on something and then wait for an unspecified amount of time to receive their purchased item and not get upset over not getting what was paid for. I don't see that it should be any different for developer's of games. People buy their products expecting to receive what they order, and when it never arrives, they aren't supposed to worry about where it is or why they haven't received it, and although they have written asking about why they haven't gotten it, they receive no response for the person they bought the item from? This just doesn't make sense to me and it isn't good business practice, in my opinion. It makes me worry that if I choose to purchase a game, that the developer's do not care whether we ever get what we pay for. Six months? I know I would not appreciate waiting six months for something I spent money on. Patience is one thing, but come on, no one should have to wait that long when it is their money they are spending. -Original Message- From: James Bartlett Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:02 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
o didn't know that. On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:50 AM, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: And, as far as I know, they are no longer in existance. (Sent from my iPhone) On Jun 24, 2013, at 8:41 AM, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. On Jun 24, 2013, at 9:27 AM, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: I doubt that it will come to that point, but every one that quits producing is a loss to all of us, and if it is due to a few impatient and childish gamers, it makes me furious! It is ture, though, that it should not take months to get a registration key after you have paid for one. Then again, in comparison to the number of good experiences, how often does this unfortunate mishap happen? And, has the developer never come through with the paid for key or keys? (Sent from my iPhone) On Jun 23, 2013, at 7:35 PM, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Sometimes things come up. Developers are in no way obligated to discuss their personal lives on list. I agree it isn't right but nor is it right to constantly harp on what few developers we have. People keep that sort of behavior up and the day won't be long in coming when we'll have no developers at all. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: MamaPeach Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 6:30 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You visit any other website or business like Ebay, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, etc, , purchase a product, then you expect delivery of said product within a reasonable amount of time, say 7 to 14 days? Would you wait 6 months before inquiring where your product is? I don't know anyone that would be willing to spend their money on something and then wait for an unspecified amount of time to receive their purchased item and not get upset over not getting what was paid for. I don't see that it should be any different for developer's of games. People buy their products expecting to receive what they order, and when it never arrives, they aren't supposed to worry about where it is or why they haven't received it, and although they have written asking about why they haven't gotten it, they receive no response for the person they bought the item from? This just doesn't make sense to me and it isn't good business practice, in my opinion. It makes me worry that if I choose to purchase a game, that the developer's do not care whether we ever get what we pay for. Six months? I know I would not appreciate waiting six months for something I spent money on. Patience is one thing, but come on, no one should have to wait that long when it is their money they are spending. -Original Message- From: James Bartlett Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:02 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi all, Yeah, I don't think it will ever come to us not having any developers developing accessible audio games simply because there a lot of developers like Jeremy Kaldobski, Jim Kitchen, among others who do it for free, and as a result don't have to put up with nearly the crap Liam or anyone else who charges for their games have to put up with. Oh, sure, there have been times I myself had made it known I preferred they developed their games a different way, added such and such a feature, but I think that is pretty minor compared to the arguing I've seen over the lifetime of this list over some developer or other who failed to deliver a game or product keys in a certain time frame. That said, every loss is a loss to the community no matter how you cut it. Many people forget how instrumental someone like James North was to the early audio games community, because the controversy over Montezuma's Revenge, Raceway, and Max Shrapnel has overshadowed anything and everything he did before that point. Yet, he was one of the best developers we had during the late 90's and early 2000's developing such games as Alien Outback, Dynaman, ESP Pinball Classic, Monkey Business, ESP Whoopass, the original Change Reaction, and had a few other games in the works. He did all this in the space of a couple of years, and no one was complaining then. Its only around 2004 when he opened Alchemy Game Studios, got into a bit of a rough patch, the community crucified him for it and he quit. Thus we lost one of our better developers over what amounted to the fact he took pre-orders, and then was unable to meet project deadlines do to various personal issues. Other developers like Daniel Zingaro and Justin have come and gone for their own personal reasons. In the case of Justin and Daniel both have found steady employment so were unable to keep BSC Games and DanZ Games going as a sideline. That's understandable, and the way this community treats anyone regarding key replacements etc I probably wouldn't be developing games for this community if I were them because its difficult to put in a 40 to 50 hour week programming at a day time job, and come home to do more the same for a community who is ungrateful and disrespectful to what developers they have got. Anyway, my feeling is audio games will likely always be around, but the nature of those audio games and developers will change. In fact, it is changing now that newer more mobile devices like iPhones are accessible. Look at how fast the number of playable games for iOS has exploded onto the market, and the best part of that is games for iOS does not require a product key. Everything is handled through the Apple Store, and once you purchase a game from the app store your account keeps track of your purchases if you need to redownload and register a certain app or game which means there is no 24 hour, 72 hour, or week wait for a product key. So right there that is one area where I see audio games continuing to be developed and grow just because we don't have any of the pitfalls of PC game development. Then, there are the freeware/shareware developers who will likely continue developing free games for themselves and the community just because they don't have the same problems as the commercial developers. Granted the freeware games may not have great sounds, music, and seem a bit cheap compared to a game developed for commercial consumption, but I see that kind of developer always being around. There is less hassle involved in freeware development, and I think its understood that sort of game is a take it or leave it kind of thing. There is no obligation by the developer to be held accountable for keys, for developing a game on a certain schedule, or for adding feature x just because someone says so. The truth is after Raceway and MOTA I have considered restructuring USA Games around an open source type model for exactly the reasons listed above. This last year has been the most trying time in my life on a personal level do to illness, mental stress, and it really didn't help having people asking about Raceway, MOTA, whatever when I really wasn't up to programming them and running a business. Were those games open source or developed as freeware there would have been no pressure from people who had pre-ordered said games. So I feel taking donations or something like that is a better way to make money without having to go full commercial. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: I doubt that it will come to that point, but every one that quits producing is a loss to all of us, and if it is due to a few impatient and childish gamers, it makes me furious! It is ture, though, that it should not take months to get a registration key after you have paid for one. Then again, in comparison to the number of good experiences, how often does this unfortunate mishap happen? And, has the developer never come through with the paid for key or keys? (Sent
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hello Thomas, I checked the sight and it is indeed shut down. Onnistly I can't blame you guys. They are really really out of date, in my opinion -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Thomas Ward Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 8:07 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
what about others that have the game help the devs with keys etc so they don't get bogged. I'd do that for liam and others for nothing. At 01:15 AM 6/25/2013, you wrote: I have apologized for what I posted if I misunderstood his meaning. However, I reacted, perhaps in haste, based on what I read and how it was worded. As for the possibility of an automated key generation method for Liam, I don't know for sure, but I would think that it would not be cheap, and how much does he get in proffits from his games? Not much. That's probably one reason there isn't such an animal already in place. This is conjecture on my part. (Sent from my iPhone) On Jun 23, 2013, at 6:19 PM, Clement Chou chou.clem...@gmail.com wrote: The amount of flack that just flew around is absolutely unbelievable. Yes, on the one point, I can see how it could be taken with the particular wording used... however, I don't think there's any cause for ripping him one the way you did, Charles. I'm probably sticking my neck out onto the chopping block... but I think as well that some people are taking a miswritten comment and blowing it way, way out of proportion. As to the main topic.. I feel 72 hours is a reasonable amount of time to wait. After that I would start asking... but while I understand Liam's position one also has to look at the standpoint of the gamers. 3 days? Fine... but if no keys are being sent in months, then shouldn't there be something done? If Liam is too busy to check keys every few days which is again understandable, couldn't there be an automated system as with Draconis? - Original Message - From: Ryan Strunk ryan.str...@gmail.com To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 2:56 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
bAvisoft was a unique case they didn't give a sausage about their customers or anyone else talk about bringing your demise on yourself. Lisa Hayes www.nutrimetics.com.au/lisahayes - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Lisa it sounds like it to me their games don't even work on the latest and greatest I did buy Grizzly Gulch and wanted Chillingham but time moved on and forgot all about it. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:06, Lisa Hayes wrote: bAvisoft was a unique case they didn't give a sausage about their customers or anyone else talk about bringing your demise on yourself. Lisa Hayes www.nutrimetics.com.au/lisahayes - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Well, this is my personal opinion, but you didn't miss much by not playing Chillingham. That game really didn't impress me. However, Grizzly Gulch was fun the first few times I played it. It just lacks replay value. I can think of about 10 different ways I would have expanded it myself, content I would have added, etc., so that even if there were limits on randomizing the gameplay at that time either due to programmer inexperience or software and hardware limitations of then current systems, the game would have been at least a bit more worthy of praise. On 6/24/13, Chris H christopher...@gmail.com wrote: Lisa it sounds like it to me their games don't even work on the latest and greatest I did buy Grizzly Gulch and wanted Chillingham but time moved on and forgot all about it. Chris On 25/06/2013 00:06, Lisa Hayes wrote: bAvisoft was a unique case they didn't give a sausage about their customers or anyone else talk about bringing your demise on yourself. Lisa Hayes www.nutrimetics.com.au/lisahayes - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2013 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Brandon, Definitely. It is for that very reason Bavisoft is no longer around. Their website is history, and they were forced to shut down because of their inability to be contacted. So I highly doubt we will ever hear from them again. Cheers! On 6/24/13, Brandon Misch bmisch2...@gmail.com wrote: well, bavisoft would have to be put into that category of not coming through with its customers. Sure,, not with keys but with whole orders as the older members on this list knows. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi Shaun, Well, its mainly a matter of security. A developer's security is based on his or her key generator so naturally they want to keep that pretty close to the vest, and only hand it out to trusted individuals. Plus every time a developer gets an order a duplicate database of customer sales and keys would have to be transferred to the third-party. That in of itself gets messy because there is all kinds of things in there like credit card numbers, phone numbers, email addresses, whatever that most people want to keep confidential. It is for that reason I would never share my customer database with anyone. Too many eyes and hears looking at it is a security risk to both the developer and the customer. Cheers! On 6/24/13, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: what about others that have the game help the devs with keys etc so they don't get bogged. I'd do that for liam and others for nothing. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
[Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi Charles, You said it. The answer is those people need to grow up and stop living in their own zone. Stop with the entitlment attitude or whatever it is that makes them believe they should get whatever it is they want when they want it and not a second later. Certain people can be quite petty and childish when demanding they get new keys, new games, or whatever, and many have forgotten how to ask politely. On 6/22/13, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:00 AM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 8454 (20130616) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 8454 (20130616) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Your comments, followed by my responses: Comment: If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. Response: So, if I were to purchase something on Saturday evening, the developer is to get my registration key to me by Sunday evening? If more people felt this way, there goes a developer's weekend with family, and they get no time off, all due to gamer's total lack of understanding and patience! This attitude is exactly what I was talking about in my original post on this thread, and there! is! no! excuse! for! it! being! tolerated!!! You say: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. my response: If your clients behave that way, then I strongly suggest that you get other clients. And to make matters worse, you? condone? piracy?? If I had anything to say about this list, and keep in mind that this is my personal opinion, you would be banned from this list, and I would do something about your advertising of the fact that you have no problem in having a hand in piracy for the simple fact that your clients are impatient. Suggesting to your clients that they should get a cracked copy of software rather than wait for a legal one is downright deplorable, and you should be ashamed of yourself, although you apparently are not. I know one thing for sure: Knowing what I now have read directly from you, I would never do any business with you, and I suggest that all others take the same stance against your despicable business practices. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:00 AM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 8454 (20130616) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus,
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Slow your roll, Charles. We obviously have different interpretations of his second point, but I would guess, given the nature of his entire post, that he isn't advocating piracy. Rather he's saying that, given people's natural tendency toward impatience--misguided or not--if they don't get what they want, they will turn to piracy. The solution to that is to get your codes out quicker. Deep breaths, my man. -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:47 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Your comments, followed by my responses: Comment: If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. Response: So, if I were to purchase something on Saturday evening, the developer is to get my registration key to me by Sunday evening? If more people felt this way, there goes a developer's weekend with family, and they get no time off, all due to gamer's total lack of understanding and patience! This attitude is exactly what I was talking about in my original post on this thread, and there! is! no! excuse! for! it! being! tolerated!!! You say: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. my response: If your clients behave that way, then I strongly suggest that you get other clients. And to make matters worse, you? condone? piracy?? If I had anything to say about this list, and keep in mind that this is my personal opinion, you would be banned from this list, and I would do something about your advertising of the fact that you have no problem in having a hand in piracy for the simple fact that your clients are impatient. Suggesting to your clients that they should get a cracked copy of software rather than wait for a legal one is downright deplorable, and you should be ashamed of yourself, although you apparently are not. I know one thing for sure: Knowing what I now have read directly from you, I would never do any business with you, and I suggest that all others take the same stance against your despicable business practices. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:00 AM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
I completely agree. Please try to take a step back and look at this situation with a bit more objectivity. I don't think that 24 hours is necessarily a reasonable time frame, although with automated systems such as Draconus uses, I can see why someone would consider 24 hours to be enough. However, if you have to generate your codes manually, I would say a week or less is reasonable. Any more than that, and I think you start to gain a bad reputation, whether it's deserved or not. I, personally, don't like spending my money and seeing it hanging in limbo so to speak. I don't think that waiting for months for a key is really acceptable. Having said that, when I purchased Super Egg Hunt Plus, I had my key within a day, so I'm not complaining. However, a friend of mine asked for a replacement key for Judgment Day several months ago, and hasn't heard a response. I feel that some of the frustration being expressed here is reasonable, both on the side of the people who haven't received registration keys, and on Liam's side as well. I don't know the extent of Liam's job, but surely he could designate a certain time, maybe once a week, to go through emails and respond accordingly. By keeping to a schedule, both he and those who buy his games should be happy. Of course, unforeseen circumstances might still arise, and if that happens, people will just have to show a little patience. People being so frustrated that they want to register formal complaints with Paypal should be a serious wake-up call, however. It would be for me, at least. Something is wrong there, and, as I said, I see validity to both sides of this. On 6/23/13, Ryan Strunk ryan.str...@gmail.com wrote: Slow your roll, Charles. We obviously have different interpretations of his second point, but I would guess, given the nature of his entire post, that he isn't advocating piracy. Rather he's saying that, given people's natural tendency toward impatience--misguided or not--if they don't get what they want, they will turn to piracy. The solution to that is to get your codes out quicker. Deep breaths, my man. -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:47 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Your comments, followed by my responses: Comment: If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. Response: So, if I were to purchase something on Saturday evening, the developer is to get my registration key to me by Sunday evening? If more people felt this way, there goes a developer's weekend with family, and they get no time off, all due to gamer's total lack of understanding and patience! This attitude is exactly what I was talking about in my original post on this thread, and there! is! no! excuse! for! it! being! tolerated!!! You say: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. my response: If your clients behave that way, then I strongly suggest that you get other clients. And to make matters worse, you? condone? piracy?? If I had anything to say about this list, and keep in mind that this is my personal opinion, you would be banned from this list, and I would do something about your advertising of the fact that you have no problem in having a hand in piracy for the simple fact that your clients are impatient. Suggesting to your clients that they should get a cracked copy of software rather than wait for a legal one is downright deplorable, and you should be ashamed of yourself, although you apparently are not. I know one thing for sure: Knowing what I now have read directly from you, I would never do any business with you, and I suggest that all others take the same stance against your despicable business practices. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Ryan Strunk ryan.str...@gmail.com To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 1:53 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Slow your roll, Charles. We obviously have different interpretations of his second point, but I would guess, given the nature of his entire post, that he isn't advocating piracy. Rather he's saying that, given people's natural tendency toward impatience--misguided or not--if they don't get what they want, they will turn to piracy. The solution to that is to get your codes out quicker. Deep breaths, my man. -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:47 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Your comments, followed by my responses: Comment: If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. Response: So, if I were to purchase something on Saturday evening, the developer is to get my registration key to me by Sunday evening? If more people felt this way, there goes a developer's weekend with family, and they get no time off, all due to gamer's total lack of understanding and patience! This attitude is exactly what I was talking about in my original post on this thread, and there! is! no! excuse! for! it! being! tolerated!!! You say: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. my response: If your clients behave that way, then I strongly suggest that you get other clients. And to make matters worse, you? condone? piracy?? If I had anything to say about this list, and keep in mind that this is my personal opinion, you would be banned from this list, and I would do something about your advertising of the fact that you have no problem in having a hand in piracy for the simple fact that your clients are impatient. Suggesting to your clients that they should get a cracked copy of software rather than wait for a legal one is downright deplorable, and you should be ashamed of yourself, although you apparently are not. I know one thing for sure: Knowing what I now have read directly from you, I would never do any business with you, and I suggest that all others take the same stance against your despicable business practices. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:00 AM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur??
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Maybe they're descended from the Greek gods. LOL. Most of them were, after all, the very embodiment of petty. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Thomas Ward Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 7:28 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, You said it. The answer is those people need to grow up and stop living in their own zone. Stop with the entitlment attitude or whatever it is that makes them believe they should get whatever it is they want when they want it and not a second later. Certain people can be quite petty and childish when demanding they get new keys, new games, or whatever, and many have forgotten how to ask politely. On 6/22/13, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
I couldn't agree more. This is outrageous. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 11:47 AM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Your comments, followed by my responses: Comment: If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. Response: So, if I were to purchase something on Saturday evening, the developer is to get my registration key to me by Sunday evening? If more people felt this way, there goes a developer's weekend with family, and they get no time off, all due to gamer's total lack of understanding and patience! This attitude is exactly what I was talking about in my original post on this thread, and there! is! no! excuse! for! it! being! tolerated!!! You say: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. my response: If your clients behave that way, then I strongly suggest that you get other clients. And to make matters worse, you? condone? piracy?? If I had anything to say about this list, and keep in mind that this is my personal opinion, you would be banned from this list, and I would do something about your advertising of the fact that you have no problem in having a hand in piracy for the simple fact that your clients are impatient. Suggesting to your clients that they should get a cracked copy of software rather than wait for a legal one is downright deplorable, and you should be ashamed of yourself, although you apparently are not. I know one thing for sure: Knowing what I now have read directly from you, I would never do any business with you, and I suggest that all others take the same stance against your despicable business practices. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:00 AM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
The solution is actually for the community to stop being so petty about it. I agree with Charles. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:53 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Slow your roll, Charles. We obviously have different interpretations of his second point, but I would guess, given the nature of his entire post, that he isn't advocating piracy. Rather he's saying that, given people's natural tendency toward impatience--misguided or not--if they don't get what they want, they will turn to piracy. The solution to that is to get your codes out quicker. Deep breaths, my man. -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:47 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Your comments, followed by my responses: Comment: If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. Response: So, if I were to purchase something on Saturday evening, the developer is to get my registration key to me by Sunday evening? If more people felt this way, there goes a developer's weekend with family, and they get no time off, all due to gamer's total lack of understanding and patience! This attitude is exactly what I was talking about in my original post on this thread, and there! is! no! excuse! for! it! being! tolerated!!! You say: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. my response: If your clients behave that way, then I strongly suggest that you get other clients. And to make matters worse, you? condone? piracy?? If I had anything to say about this list, and keep in mind that this is my personal opinion, you would be banned from this list, and I would do something about your advertising of the fact that you have no problem in having a hand in piracy for the simple fact that your clients are impatient. Suggesting to your clients that they should get a cracked copy of software rather than wait for a legal one is downright deplorable, and you should be ashamed of yourself, although you apparently are not. I know one thing for sure: Knowing what I now have read directly from you, I would never do any business with you, and I suggest that all others take the same stance against your despicable business practices. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:00 AM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Exactly. There's no other possible interpretation for the way that was worded. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 2:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Ryan Strunk ryan.str...@gmail.com To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 1:53 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Slow your roll, Charles. We obviously have different interpretations of his second point, but I would guess, given the nature of his entire post, that he isn't advocating piracy. Rather he's saying that, given people's natural tendency toward impatience--misguided or not--if they don't get what they want, they will turn to piracy. The solution to that is to get your codes out quicker. Deep breaths, my man. -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:47 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Your comments, followed by my responses: Comment: If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. Response: So, if I were to purchase something on Saturday evening, the developer is to get my registration key to me by Sunday evening? If more people felt this way, there goes a developer's weekend with family, and they get no time off, all due to gamer's total lack of understanding and patience! This attitude is exactly what I was talking about in my original post on this thread, and there! is! no! excuse! for! it! being! tolerated!!! You say: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. my response: If your clients behave that way, then I strongly suggest that you get other clients. And to make matters worse, you? condone? piracy?? If I had anything to say about this list, and keep in mind that this is my personal opinion, you would be banned from this list, and I would do something about your advertising of the fact that you have no problem in having a hand in piracy for the simple fact that your clients are impatient. Suggesting to your clients that they should get a cracked copy of software rather than wait for a legal one is downright deplorable, and you should be ashamed of yourself, although you apparently are not. I know one thing for sure: Knowing what I now have read directly from you, I would never do any business with you, and I suggest that all others take the same stance against your despicable business practices. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:00 AM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Not enough games to play? that's ridiculous I have over 60 games on my computer --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Or that he persuades them to opt for the cracked product. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:56 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
I meant exactly what I said. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 5:06 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Or that he persuades them to opt for the cracked product. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:56 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Exactly. I know. It'd be almost impossible not to jump to that conclusion based on the wording he chose. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:13 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? I meant exactly what I said. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 5:06 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Or that he persuades them to opt for the cracked product. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:56 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
That doesn't make sense though. If he's selling something, and he doesn't get back to his clients within 24 hours, he wouldn't tell them, it's ok, just go out and crack my software. I don't give a damn. That's just plain idiotic. I think Ryan is right--I gave an objective viewpoint earlier in this thread, and I'm sticking to it. I think a few of you are taking one badly worded comment and blowing it way out of proportion. On 6/23/13, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Or that he persuades them to opt for the cracked product. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:56 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
The problem is his wording seems to indicate that he would, at least when it came to other people's products. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Desiree Oudinot Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:15 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? That doesn't make sense though. If he's selling something, and he doesn't get back to his clients within 24 hours, he wouldn't tell them, it's ok, just go out and crack my software. I don't give a damn. That's just plain idiotic. I think Ryan is right--I gave an objective viewpoint earlier in this thread, and I'm sticking to it. I think a few of you are taking one badly worded comment and blowing it way out of proportion. On 6/23/13, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Or that he persuades them to opt for the cracked product. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:56 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
No, it doesn't, as he wrote it in the first person. He was referring to himself as the hypothetical developer. But again, let's just ask him. I fully realize I'm contributing to the very problem I'm trying to stop by hashing and rehashing one silly little sentence someone may or may not have meant to write in the way they did, but I think this traffic is indicative of a much larger problem we have on this list. Milos writes a post expressing his viewpoint on a controversial topic about developers and the time they have available. The sentence wasn't particularly strong, and according to Milos' Twitter feed, English isn't his first language, adding a whole level of possible complications. Remember when JFK said he was a doughnut? So someone reads that sentence, interprets it a certain way, and goes off on what can only be described as a tirade, making some pretty strong statements about the author's character and comportment and recommending that developers stay clear of him. And if that's not enough, other people start writing in support of the tirade. Yeah! I can't believe that guy! What a jerk! But what if it turns out Milos mistyped that sentence? What if it turns out, English not being his first language, he didn't mean to word it as you interpreted it? Now a vocal section of the community has made him a villain because of one simple mistake that he likely didn't even realize he made. He's going to come back to his inbox and read a huge number of posts debating his status as a pirate because of 13 little words. What does that say about this community? We can talk all we want about the awful people who beat on developers, who whine about cheat codes and product keys, who are destroying the possibility of future games because of their actions. But all the while, those who aren't are preaching from soap boxes about their own virtues, and in cases like this, are likely making huge mistakes. If we're going to be holier than thou, there likely won't be much thou left after too long, and it's going to be a sad and lonely place. -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Bryan Peterson Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 5:26 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? The problem is his wording seems to indicate that he would, at least when it came to other people's products. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Desiree Oudinot Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:15 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? That doesn't make sense though. If he's selling something, and he doesn't get back to his clients within 24 hours, he wouldn't tell them, it's ok, just go out and crack my software. I don't give a damn. That's just plain idiotic. I think Ryan is right--I gave an objective viewpoint earlier in this thread, and I'm sticking to it. I think a few of you are taking one badly worded comment and blowing it way out of proportion. On 6/23/13, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Or that he persuades them to opt for the cracked product. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:56 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Well said Charles well said, who'd write games and get shit from people. Not me. I'd close this list down if i had the power and then no air would be given to the wingers of the blindness community., Lisa Hayes www.nutrimetics.com.au/lisahayes - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:00 PM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
well I don't mind waiting, especially when people are busy, after all game dev is not a full time job, but 6 months or more can be a bit steep. I also need to know that my messages are getting to where ever they should go what addresses to use, etc. I tried on twitter but the interface is really no good for dms. at any rate email I thought would be easier. I am more concerned than anything else I am not really complaining here I know liam is busy and he has said this. a lot of us do. I do not want to push people away. At 02:00 PM 6/23/2013, you wrote: A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
we need more automated systems then that is the only answer or have others that can be trusted sending keys to people sort of like a cloud based network. I'd gladly do it as I often have time where I don't do anything at all. At 05:47 AM 6/24/2013, you wrote: Your comments, followed by my responses: Comment: If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. Response: So, if I were to purchase something on Saturday evening, the developer is to get my registration key to me by Sunday evening? If more people felt this way, there goes a developer's weekend with family, and they get no time off, all due to gamer's total lack of understanding and patience! This attitude is exactly what I was talking about in my original post on this thread, and there! is! no! excuse! for! it! being! tolerated!!! You say: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. my response: If your clients behave that way, then I strongly suggest that you get other clients. And to make matters worse, you? condone? piracy?? If I had anything to say about this list, and keep in mind that this is my personal opinion, you would be banned from this list, and I would do something about your advertising of the fact that you have no problem in having a hand in piracy for the simple fact that your clients are impatient. Suggesting to your clients that they should get a cracked copy of software rather than wait for a legal one is downright deplorable, and you should be ashamed of yourself, although you apparently are not. I know one thing for sure: Knowing what I now have read directly from you, I would never do any business with you, and I suggest that all others take the same stance against your despicable business practices. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:00 AM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
The amount of flack that just flew around is absolutely unbelievable. Yes, on the one point, I can see how it could be taken with the particular wording used... however, I don't think there's any cause for ripping him one the way you did, Charles. I'm probably sticking my neck out onto the chopping block... but I think as well that some people are taking a miswritten comment and blowing it way, way out of proportion. As to the main topic.. I feel 72 hours is a reasonable amount of time to wait. After that I would start asking... but while I understand Liam's position one also has to look at the standpoint of the gamers. 3 days? Fine... but if no keys are being sent in months, then shouldn't there be something done? If Liam is too busy to check keys every few days which is again understandable, couldn't there be an automated system as with Draconis? - Original Message - From: Ryan Strunk ryan.str...@gmail.com To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 2:56 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Since this topic shows no sign of stopping anyway, I'll just point out that I added automatic credit card handling to Alter Aeon specifically so that people could get their credits instantly, without having to wait on me or anyone else. Now, with that experience under my belt, I understand why more developers aren't doing it: it's a huge amount of time and effort, and it requires carefully and painstakingly written code. Given the low volumes of shipments and key generation in the community, I can totally understand why devs wouldn't bother, and would rather do keys by hand. In short, most games don't have a big enough market to make automated systems worth the effort. Dennis Towne Alter Aeon MUD http://www.alteraeon.com On Sun, Jun 23, 2013 at 4:19 PM, Clement Chou chou.clem...@gmail.com wrote: The amount of flack that just flew around is absolutely unbelievable. Yes, on the one point, I can see how it could be taken with the particular wording used... however, I don't think there's any cause for ripping him one the way you did, Charles. I'm probably sticking my neck out onto the chopping block... but I think as well that some people are taking a miswritten comment and blowing it way, way out of proportion. As to the main topic.. I feel 72 hours is a reasonable amount of time to wait. After that I would start asking... but while I understand Liam's position one also has to look at the standpoint of the gamers. 3 days? Fine... but if no keys are being sent in months, then shouldn't there be something done? If Liam is too busy to check keys every few days which is again understandable, couldn't there be an automated system as with Draconis? - Original Message - From: Ryan Strunk ryan.str...@gmail.com To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 2:56 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
I aggree lisa. But you only get shit if you ask for it or give it yourself. And if you are not able to either close or ask for help. aprone has help with his stuff now and thats good. At 10:59 AM 6/24/2013, you wrote: Well said Charles well said, who'd write games and get shit from people. Not me. I'd close this list down if i had the power and then no air would be given to the wingers of the blindness community., Lisa Hayes www.nutrimetics.com.au/lisahayes - Original Message - From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 12:00 PM Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hello Bryan, english is not my first language although I study translation and know (or should have learned till now) the language very well. You got my point and thank you for thinking rather than jumping without using your brain. I still don't know what is wrong with my wording? Only that I said that in the first person? Yes, but let me ask something. How much of you would say that you would never ever do this? And if you all say no, how much of you would not tell the trooth? Everyone knows the answer to that. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 12:14 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Exactly. I know. It'd be almost impossible not to jump to that conclusion based on the wording he chose. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:13 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? I meant exactly what I said. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 5:06 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Or that he persuades them to opt for the cracked product. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:56 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
You said you would get them to opt for a cracked version. That's why people were jumping down your throat because it implies you condone piracy. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Milos Przic Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 6:07 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hello Bryan, english is not my first language although I study translation and know (or should have learned till now) the language very well. You got my point and thank you for thinking rather than jumping without using your brain. I still don't know what is wrong with my wording? Only that I said that in the first person? Yes, but let me ask something. How much of you would say that you would never ever do this? And if you all say no, how much of you would not tell the trooth? Everyone knows the answer to that. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs - Original Message - From: Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 12:14 AM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Exactly. I know. It'd be almost impossible not to jump to that conclusion based on the wording he chose. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 4:13 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? I meant exactly what I said. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. - Original Message - From: Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net To: 'Gamers Discussion list' gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 5:06 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Or that he persuades them to opt for the cracked product. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: Ryan Strunk Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:56 PM To: 'Gamers Discussion list' Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Bryan says there's no other interpretation for that quote than the one you supplied. That makes me sad, Brian. As for yours, Charles, let me try and help. Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. I.E. If I don't supply codes to my clients soon enough, they, not I, are going to opt for piracy instead of waiting. That doesn't make it right, but I believe that was the point. But hey! You're ripping the guy a new one for what you think he said. I'm defending him from the vigorous ripping you want to give him with what I think he said. So let's try this: What did you really mean? More deep breaths, gentlemen, and let's try not to think the worst of one another, shall we? -Original Message- From: Gamers [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On Behalf Of Charles Rivard Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 3:18 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
You visit any other website or business like Ebay, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, etc, , purchase a product, then you expect delivery of said product within a reasonable amount of time, say 7 to 14 days? Would you wait 6 months before inquiring where your product is? I don't know anyone that would be willing to spend their money on something and then wait for an unspecified amount of time to receive their purchased item and not get upset over not getting what was paid for. I don't see that it should be any different for developer's of games. People buy their products expecting to receive what they order, and when it never arrives, they aren't supposed to worry about where it is or why they haven't received it, and although they have written asking about why they haven't gotten it, they receive no response for the person they bought the item from? This just doesn't make sense to me and it isn't good business practice, in my opinion. It makes me worry that if I choose to purchase a game, that the developer's do not care whether we ever get what we pay for. Six months? I know I would not appreciate waiting six months for something I spent money on. Patience is one thing, but come on, no one should have to wait that long when it is their money they are spending. -Original Message- From: James Bartlett Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:02 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Sometimes things come up. Developers are in no way obligated to discuss their personal lives on list. I agree it isn't right but nor is it right to constantly harp on what few developers we have. People keep that sort of behavior up and the day won't be long in coming when we'll have no developers at all. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: MamaPeach Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 6:30 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You visit any other website or business like Ebay, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, etc, , purchase a product, then you expect delivery of said product within a reasonable amount of time, say 7 to 14 days? Would you wait 6 months before inquiring where your product is? I don't know anyone that would be willing to spend their money on something and then wait for an unspecified amount of time to receive their purchased item and not get upset over not getting what was paid for. I don't see that it should be any different for developer's of games. People buy their products expecting to receive what they order, and when it never arrives, they aren't supposed to worry about where it is or why they haven't received it, and although they have written asking about why they haven't gotten it, they receive no response for the person they bought the item from? This just doesn't make sense to me and it isn't good business practice, in my opinion. It makes me worry that if I choose to purchase a game, that the developer's do not care whether we ever get what we pay for. Six months? I know I would not appreciate waiting six months for something I spent money on. Patience is one thing, but come on, no one should have to wait that long when it is their money they are spending. -Original Message- From: James Bartlett Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:02 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list,
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
I aggree with both points. At 12:35 PM 6/24/2013, you wrote: Sometimes things come up. Developers are in no way obligated to discuss their personal lives on list. I agree it isn't right but nor is it right to constantly harp on what few developers we have. People keep that sort of behavior up and the day won't be long in coming when we'll have no developers at all. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: MamaPeach Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 6:30 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You visit any other website or business like Ebay, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, etc, , purchase a product, then you expect delivery of said product within a reasonable amount of time, say 7 to 14 days? Would you wait 6 months before inquiring where your product is? I don't know anyone that would be willing to spend their money on something and then wait for an unspecified amount of time to receive their purchased item and not get upset over not getting what was paid for. I don't see that it should be any different for developer's of games. People buy their products expecting to receive what they order, and when it never arrives, they aren't supposed to worry about where it is or why they haven't received it, and although they have written asking about why they haven't gotten it, they receive no response for the person they bought the item from? This just doesn't make sense to me and it isn't good business practice, in my opinion. It makes me worry that if I choose to purchase a game, that the developer's do not care whether we ever get what we pay for. Six months? I know I would not appreciate waiting six months for something I spent money on. Patience is one thing, but come on, no one should have to wait that long when it is their money they are spending. -Original Message- From: James Bartlett Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:02 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Milos half of these people act like they never would do anything wrong. Lets be real if you pay for a product you exspect to get it in at least a week. It didnt take them anytime to get my money I am talking about codes and things that you purchase and download. If it it is something that is being shipped times it might take a little longer I completely get that but I am not paying for something and waiting tell hell freezes over to get it. Find away to make things work. On 6/23/13, shaun everiss sm.ever...@gmail.com wrote: I aggree with both points. At 12:35 PM 6/24/2013, you wrote: Sometimes things come up. Developers are in no way obligated to discuss their personal lives on list. I agree it isn't right but nor is it right to constantly harp on what few developers we have. People keep that sort of behavior up and the day won't be long in coming when we'll have no developers at all. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: MamaPeach Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 6:30 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You visit any other website or business like Ebay, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, etc, , purchase a product, then you expect delivery of said product within a reasonable amount of time, say 7 to 14 days? Would you wait 6 months before inquiring where your product is? I don't know anyone that would be willing to spend their money on something and then wait for an unspecified amount of time to receive their purchased item and not get upset over not getting what was paid for. I don't see that it should be any different for developer's of games. People buy their products expecting to receive what they order, and when it never arrives, they aren't supposed to worry about where it is or why they haven't received it, and although they have written asking about why they haven't gotten it, they receive no response for the person they bought the item from? This just doesn't make sense to me and it isn't good business practice, in my opinion. It makes me worry that if I choose to purchase a game, that the developer's do not care whether we ever get what we pay for. Six months? I know I would not appreciate waiting six months for something I spent money on. Patience is one thing, but come on, no one should have to wait that long when it is their money they are spending. -Original Message- From: James Bartlett Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:02 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi Milos, While I do agree that a developer should send out new or replacement license keys in a timely fassion I have always have believed in the 72 hour rule. That is a customer can expect a replacement key within three days upon request excluding weekends and holidays. That frees the developer up to fulfill personal commitments be it a job, family, doctor appointments, whatever while giving his or her customers a reasonable time frame to expect his or her license information. I personally feel 24 hours is cutting it short unless there is an automated system in place to serve the human operator when he/she is unavailable. On 6/23/13, Milos Przic milos.pr...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Charles, Yes. About release dates I agree 100 percent. But about getting registrations not quite. If one doesn't get the key in 24 hours, then the developer should be blamed. If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer as they get frustrated quite like the developers do about the complaints. Best! Milos Przic twitter: MilosPrzic skype: Milosh-hs --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? and things like User Account Control, but nothing like what he commercial developers have had to face.
Hi Bryan, Let's hope it never comes to that, and I personally believe it won't come to that. Saying we will have no developers at all willing to develop audio games is a bit extreme. After all, there are a number of audio game developers who for their own reasons write free accessible games who haven't had to put up with nearly the crap the commercial developers have had to put up with. Jim Kitchen, for example, has always given his games away for free, and because of that I think most gamers trust him. He never announces a new game until he releases it so there is no false signals or expectations for people to constantly bajor him over. Sure I know some of us have given him a bit of grief over some technical aspects of him game such as over VB 6 On 6/23/13, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Sometimes things come up. Developers are in no way obligated to discuss their personal lives on list. I agree it isn't right but nor is it right to constantly harp on what few developers we have. People keep that sort of behavior up and the day won't be long in coming when we'll have no developers at all. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. -Original Message- From: MamaPeach Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 6:30 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? You visit any other website or business like Ebay, Amazon.com, Walmart.com, etc, , purchase a product, then you expect delivery of said product within a reasonable amount of time, say 7 to 14 days? Would you wait 6 months before inquiring where your product is? I don't know anyone that would be willing to spend their money on something and then wait for an unspecified amount of time to receive their purchased item and not get upset over not getting what was paid for. I don't see that it should be any different for developer's of games. People buy their products expecting to receive what they order, and when it never arrives, they aren't supposed to worry about where it is or why they haven't received it, and although they have written asking about why they haven't gotten it, they receive no response for the person they bought the item from? This just doesn't make sense to me and it isn't good business practice, in my opinion. It makes me worry that if I choose to purchase a game, that the developer's do not care whether we ever get what we pay for. Six months? I know I would not appreciate waiting six months for something I spent money on. Patience is one thing, but come on, no one should have to wait that long when it is their money they are spending. -Original Message- From: James Bartlett Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 8:02 PM To: Gamers Discussion list Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Sorry to say, but some people will never learn, and some people just don't care, so the people out there like you and me that appreciat and respact all the hard work that gos into making a game. With that said thank you to all the programmers and developers. Keep up all the hard work. bfn James -- From: Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com Sent: Saturday, June 22, 2013 10:00 PM To: audyssey gamers list gamers@audyssey.org Subject: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? A thought on impatience: Some people gripe about the length of time taken by developers to come out with a new game. Some people gripe if they don't get a registration key right away. Some people gripe about the fact that they don't have enough games to play. Strangely enough, these 3 complaints come from pretty much the same few people. These are also the same people who want cheat codes very shortly after they get a new game. Have you noticed what always seems to happen when these complainers really get on a roll? James North produced many very good games and then quit. Why did this occur?? Liam has voiced frustration, to say the least, and has openly voiced a consideration of quitting. Why? Other producers of games have also vacated the premises. Guess why? I commend those developers who have stuck it out and continue working for those of us who do care about and respect them. For those of us who don't, and who only care about themselves and what they want, when they want it and no later, what's it going to take for you to learn what you cause? It's about time you grow! up! and think about someone other than you for a change. Yes, I'm angry, and I think I have a darned good reason to be. Although I don't create games, I care about those who do, and it just flat burns me up when you drive these creators away with your selfish and downright childish behavior! --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi Bryan, Wrong. Apparently I am one of the few people who read Milos message and didn't take it the way you and Charles have. I generally understood Milos to mean if he were a developer and didn't get keys out to a customer within 24 hours those customers would then turn to piracy to get what they want simply because he was not timely enough for them. He was obviously not suggesting that he himself would pirate software, or that he expected anyone to either. Saying there is no other interpretation for what Milos said obviously sounds to me like you, Charles, and a few others are expecting the worst from a simple off-hand comment given by a non-English speaker who I am certain had no idea how it would be taken by English speaking listers across the world. Let's try and keep things like that in mind before we have him virtually tried and executed without considering the fact English is not his primary language, and while his wording could have been better obviously it confused some people as to its actual intent. On 6/23/13, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Exactly. There's no other possible interpretation for the way that was worded. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Wow! If this is the case, I really and truly apologize for what I sent to the list! -- If guns kill people, writing implements cause grammatical and spelling errors! - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 10:28 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Bryan, Wrong. Apparently I am one of the few people who read Milos message and didn't take it the way you and Charles have. I generally understood Milos to mean if he were a developer and didn't get keys out to a customer within 24 hours those customers would then turn to piracy to get what they want simply because he was not timely enough for them. He was obviously not suggesting that he himself would pirate software, or that he expected anyone to either. Saying there is no other interpretation for what Milos said obviously sounds to me like you, Charles, and a few others are expecting the worst from a simple off-hand comment given by a non-English speaker who I am certain had no idea how it would be taken by English speaking listers across the world. Let's try and keep things like that in mind before we have him virtually tried and executed without considering the fact English is not his primary language, and while his wording could have been better obviously it confused some people as to its actual intent. On 6/23/13, Bryan Peterson bpeterson2...@cableone.net wrote: Exactly. There's no other possible interpretation for the way that was worded. Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, Ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi Charles, I think what we have here is a failior to communicate properly. For the record I didn't take Milos post as advocating piracy in any shape or form. I understood it to mean if he were not responsible and prompt at getting keys out to his clients that they themselves would turn to piracy regardless of what he himself felt about it. As has been pointed out before Milos is not a native English speaker, and considering that fact let's give him some slack until he can explain his intentions clearer rather than dragging him off to the gallows to be hanged without a fair trial. So no I will not be banning him from the list unless he himself says he has a desire to pirate games, and that message is not as ambiguous as his initial message that started this flamewar. On 6/23/13, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: Quote: If I want money for my product, I have to check orders at least once in a day, otherwise I lose my clients and, yes, get them to opt for the cracked product rather than buying from another developer end quote. How else can that be taken? Isn't he suggesting that if they don't get their registration key within 24 hours, they should get a pirated copy? And blaming a developer for not getting a registration code to a customer within 24 hours, even though they may have a very fair policy that you should wait for at least 72 hours is just flat crazy, because there may be Internet problems, or, as I pointed out, it might be during a week end. --- Shepherds are the best beasts, but Labs are a close second. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi Charles, I should hope so. Upon coming home aafter a day with the wife and kids and finding my inbox over flowing with this argument I naturally went and located the message that had everyone up in arms and read it carefully. My initial read and subsequent reads found Milos post poorly worded, but I was pretty certain his intention was not that of someone actually advocating piracy. I see where some like Bryan and yourself took it the wrong way, but the difference was I came at it with an open mind, no set opinion on what it said, and found the message was a bit ambiguous and chucked it up to a failure to clearly communicate the thought. So I hope we can now lay this argument to rest and move on with life. On 6/23/13, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: Wow! If this is the case, I really and truly apologize for what I sent to the list! -- If guns kill people, writing implements cause grammatical and spelling errors! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
You betcha! -- If guns kill people, writing implements cause grammatical and spelling errors! - Original Message - From: Thomas Ward thomasward1...@gmail.com To: Gamers Discussion list gamers@audyssey.org Sent: Sunday, June 23, 2013 10:49 PM Subject: Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn? Hi Charles, I should hope so. Upon coming home aafter a day with the wife and kids and finding my inbox over flowing with this argument I naturally went and located the message that had everyone up in arms and read it carefully. My initial read and subsequent reads found Milos post poorly worded, but I was pretty certain his intention was not that of someone actually advocating piracy. I see where some like Bryan and yourself took it the wrong way, but the difference was I came at it with an open mind, no set opinion on what it said, and found the message was a bit ambiguous and chucked it up to a failure to clearly communicate the thought. So I hope we can now lay this argument to rest and move on with life. On 6/23/13, Charles Rivard wee1s...@fidnet.com wrote: Wow! If this is the case, I really and truly apologize for what I sent to the list! -- If guns kill people, writing implements cause grammatical and spelling errors! --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
Re: [Audyssey] what will it take for this community to learn?
Hi Desiree, I completely agree with you. Waiting more than a week for a key replacement is clearly unreasonable unless of course for some valid circumstance such as the person is away on vacation or is unable to do so because of a medical emergency. In such a case allowances should be made, but where there are no valid excuses for dragging a key replacement out for months the developer should be held accountable to their customers. On 6/23/13, Desiree Oudinot turtlepowe...@gmail.com wrote: I completely agree. Please try to take a step back and look at this situation with a bit more objectivity. I don't think that 24 hours is necessarily a reasonable time frame, although with automated systems such as Draconus uses, I can see why someone would consider 24 hours to be enough. However, if you have to generate your codes manually, I would say a week or less is reasonable. Any more than that, and I think you start to gain a bad reputation, whether it's deserved or not. I, personally, don't like spending my money and seeing it hanging in limbo so to speak. I don't think that waiting for months for a key is really acceptable. Having said that, when I purchased Super Egg Hunt Plus, I had my key within a day, so I'm not complaining. However, a friend of mine asked for a replacement key for Judgment Day several months ago, and hasn't heard a response. I feel that some of the frustration being expressed here is reasonable, both on the side of the people who haven't received registration keys, and on Liam's side as well. I don't know the extent of Liam's job, but surely he could designate a certain time, maybe once a week, to go through emails and respond accordingly. By keeping to a schedule, both he and those who buy his games should be happy. Of course, unforeseen circumstances might still arise, and if that happens, people will just have to show a little patience. People being so frustrated that they want to register formal complaints with Paypal should be a serious wake-up call, however. It would be for me, at least. Something is wrong there, and, as I said, I see validity to both sides of this. --- Gamers mailing list __ Gamers@audyssey.org If you want to leave the list, send E-mail to gamers-unsubscr...@audyssey.org. You can make changes or update your subscription via the web, at http://audyssey.org/mailman/listinfo/gamers_audyssey.org. All messages are archived and can be searched and read at http://www.mail-archive.com/gamers@audyssey.org. If you have any questions or concerns regarding the management of the list, please send E-mail to gamers-ow...@audyssey.org.
