From: lsr-boun...@ietf.org On Behalf Of Robert Raszuk
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 10:28 PM
To: lsr ; Aijun Wang ; Linda Dunbar
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
All,
There is a fundamental question in respect to your and Linda drafts
: John E Drake ; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
; Gyan Mishra ; lsr
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Hi Linda,
Thanks for explaining that “aggregated” doesn’t mean that all the previously
described application metrics are aggregated but
)
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2022 10:09 AM
To: Linda Dunbar ; Robert Raszuk
; Aijun Wang ;
muthu.a...@gmail.com
Cc: John E Drake ; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
; Gyan Mishra ; lsr
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Hi Linda,
Thanks for explaining
Wednesday, January 19, 2022 10:08 AM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar
> *Cc:* Aijun Wang ; Acee Lindem (acee) 40cisco@dmarc.ietf.org>; John E Drake 40juniper@dmarc.ietf.org>; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ;
> Gyan Mishra ; lsr
> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft
etf.org>>; Les
Ginsberg (ginsberg) mailto:ginsb...@cisco.com>>; Gyan
Mishra mailto:hayabusa...@gmail.com>>; lsr
mailto:lsr@ietf.org>>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Aijun,
Such metric will be same(because of the ANYCAST
; Gyan Mishra ; lsr
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Hi Linda,
You seem to be either missing or avoiding my question as to why the base IGP
metric can’t be used now that the draft has a single aggregated cost?
Aijun replied with two alter
> *Cc:* Aijun Wang ; Acee Lindem (acee) 40cisco@dmarc.ietf.org>; John E Drake 40juniper@dmarc.ietf.org>; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ;
> Gyan Mishra ; lsr
> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
.com>>; Gyan
Mishra mailto:hayabusa...@gmail.com>>; lsr
mailto:lsr@ietf.org>>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Aijun,
Such metric will be same(because of the ANYCAST address be advertised
simultaneously via R1/R2/R3 at the
isco.com>>, John E Drake
mailto:jdr...@juniper.net>>, "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)"
mailto:ginsb...@cisco.com>>, Gyan Mishra
mailto:hayabusa...@gmail.com>>, lsr
mailto:lsr@ietf.org>>
Subject: RE: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-
f change could be in weeks or
>> days. On rare occasions, there might need rate changes in hours..”*
>>
>>
>>
>> Your comments and suggestions are greatly appreciated.
>>
>>
>>
>> Linda
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Robert Raszuk
All,
There is a fundamental question in respect to your and Linda drafts - how
much service awareness should be carried by link state protocols.
Historically till today IGPs provide stable underlay reachability within
the IGP coverage area (including hierarchy). Yes they were extended to
carry
in hours..”
>>
>>
>>
>> Your comments and suggestions are greatly appreciated.
>>
>>
>>
>> Linda
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Robert Raszuk
>> Sent: Monday, January 17, 2022 5:29 AM
>> To: Aijun Wang
>&g
is the actual requirement
here?
Acee
From: Linda Dunbar
Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2022 at 10:52 PM
To: Robert Raszuk , Aijun Wang
Cc: Acee Lindem , John E Drake , "Les
Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , Gyan Mishra ,
lsr
Subject: RE: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compu
m>; John E Drake 40juniper....@dmarc.ietf.org>; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ;
> Gyan Mishra ; lsr
> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>
>
>
> Aijun,
>
>
>
> Such metric will be same(because of the ANYCAST addr
and suggestions are greatly appreciated.
Linda
From: Robert Raszuk
Sent: Monday, January 17, 2022 5:29 AM
To: Aijun Wang
Cc: Acee Lindem (acee) ; Linda Dunbar
; John E Drake
; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
; Gyan Mishra ; lsr
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge
erg (ginsberg)" , 'Gyan Mishra'
> , Robert Raszuk , "lsr@ietf.org"
>
> Subject: RE: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>
> Hi, Acee:
>
> My thought is that the traditional IGP metric is the cost fr
Hi, Robert:
I think redistribute the route with the additional cost is possible but we
should consider the aggregated cost may changed upon the server status,
although not very frequently or in one controllable manner.
The aggregated cost is measured and calculated at the egress router. It’s
Aijun,
Such metric will be same(because of the ANYCAST address be advertised
> simultaneously via R1/R2/R3 at the same time for one application server,
> for example, S1/aa08::4450).
>
That is not really correct.
On each router R1 or R2 or R3 when you for example redistribute or
originate in
; Robert Raszuk ; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Hi Linda,
I guess you misunderstood me. Since the only advertises a single aggregated
metric, you don’t need a new aggregated cost TLV or to use flex algorithm. Just
set
: Linda Dunbar
Date: Saturday, January 15, 2022 at 8:03 PM
To: Acee Lindem , Aijun Wang , John
E Drake
Cc: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , Gyan Mishra
, Robert Raszuk , "lsr@ietf.org"
Subject: RE: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Acee, J
"Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" mailto:ginsb...@cisco.com>>,
Linda Dunbar mailto:linda.dun...@futurewei.com>>,
Gyan Mishra mailto:hayabusa...@gmail.com>>, Robert
Raszuk mailto:rob...@raszuk.net>>,
"lsr@ietf.org<mailto:lsr@ietf.org>" mailto:lsr@ietf.org&g
.
Thanks,
Acee
From: Lsr on behalf of Aijun Wang
Date: Friday, January 14, 2022 at 10:38 PM
To: John E Drake
Cc: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" , Linda Dunbar
, Gyan Mishra , Robert
Raszuk , "lsr@ietf.org"
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar
t Raszuk
> *Sent:* Friday, January 14, 2022 4:20 AM
> *To:* Gyan Mishra
> *Cc:* Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; Linda Dunbar <
> linda.dun...@futurewei.com>; lsr@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>
>
>
>
at is not a big deal as you are in a much worse
>>>> off state connected to a dying server on its last leg as far as memory and
>>>> CPU.
>>>>
>>>> This solution I can see can apply to any client / server connection and
>>>> not just 5G and can
t;
>
> Juniper Business Use Only
> From: Aijun Wang
> Sent: Friday, January 14, 2022 6:58 PM
> To: John E Drake
> Cc: Robert Raszuk ; Gyan Mishra ;
> Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; Linda Dunbar
> ; lsr@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the re
PM
To: John E Drake
Cc: Robert Raszuk ; Gyan Mishra ; Les
Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; Linda Dunbar
; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
[External Email. Be cautious of content]
Hi, John:
Here I would also like to hear your own opinions
) ; Linda Dunbar
> ; lsr@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>
> [External Email. Be cautious of content]
>
> Gyan,
>
> This is not a network discussion. There are well proven techniques to direct
>
ob...@raszuk.net>>
Cc: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) mailto:ginsb...@cisco.com>>;
Linda Dunbar mailto:linda.dun...@futurewei.com>>;
lsr@ietf.org<mailto:lsr@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Robert
Here are
TLV and I think once that is all worked out I
>>> am in favor of advancing this draft.
>>>
>>> Kind Regards
>>>
>>> Gyan
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 10:16 PM Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <
>>> gin
;>
>>>
>>>
>>> The difference between ECMP and UCMP is not significant in this
>>> discussion.
>>>
>>> I don’t want to speak for Robert, but for me his point was that IGPs can
>>> do “multipath” well – but this does not transla
;
>Les
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Robert Raszuk
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 13, 2022 8:52 AM
> *To:* Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
> *Cc:* Linda Dunbar ; Gyan Mishra <
> hayabusa...@gmail.com>; lsr@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
>
has the correct intelligence.
Les
From: Robert Raszuk
Sent: Thursday, January 13, 2022 8:52 AM
To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
Cc: Linda Dunbar ; Gyan Mishra
; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
> and I agree that using the
ote:
>
> Robert,
>
>
>
> The draft is about distributing the Site Index and preferences of the
> Egress routers to which the application load balancers (or instances) are
> attached.
>
>
>
> Thanks, Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Robert Raszuk
> *Sent:* Th
g<mailto:lsr@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
> and I agree that using the IGP/Flex Algo as you are proposing is a viable
> solution.
Except that IGP usually does not run between application server and load
balancer ...
On
m:* Robert Raszuk
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 13, 2022 10:52 AM
> *To:* Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
> *Cc:* Linda Dunbar ; Gyan Mishra <
> hayabusa...@gmail.com>; lsr@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>
>
Mishra
; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
> and I agree that using the IGP/Flex Algo as you are proposing is a viable
> solution.
Except that IGP usually does not run between application server and load
balancer ...
On Th
ursday, January 13, 2022 7:58 AM
> *To:* Robert Raszuk
> *Cc:* Gyan Mishra ; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <
> ginsb...@cisco.com>; lsr@ietf.org
> *Subject:* RE: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>
>
>
> Robert,
>
>
>
>
rg
Subject: RE: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Robert,
For your scenario of TCP flows lasting more than 8~18 hours, multiple server
instances SHOULDN'T be assigned with the SAME IP address (ANYCAST address).
Each of those instances should have one d
aszuk.net>>
Cc: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) mailto:ginsb...@cisco.com>>;
Linda Dunbar mailto:linda.dun...@futurewei.com>>;
lsr@ietf.org<mailto:lsr@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Robert
Here are a few examples of UCMP d
;
>
>
>
> *From:* Robert Raszuk
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 13, 2022 5:00 AM
> *To:* Gyan Mishra
> *Cc:* Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; Linda Dunbar <
> linda.dun...@futurewei.com>; lsr@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft
sco.com>>;
Linda Dunbar mailto:linda.dun...@futurewei.com>>;
lsr@ietf.org<mailto:lsr@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Robert
Here are a few examples of UCMP drafts below used in core and data center use
cases.
ht
>>>
>>> The difference between ECMP and UCMP is not significant in this
>>> discussion.
>>>
>>> I don’t want to speak for Robert, but for me his point was that IGPs can
>>> do “multipath” well – but this does not translate into managing f
gt;> Please see my other responses on this thread.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanx.
>>
>>
>>
>> Les
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Gyan Mishra
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 12, 2022 5:26 PM
>> *To:* Robert Raszuk
se see inline in green:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Robert Raszuk
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 12, 2022 1:00 PM
>>> *To:* Linda Dunbar
>>> *Cc:* Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org
>>> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to
ost load balancing or intelligent traffic spread has always been
> done at the application layer *for example MPLS*
>
>
>
> Thx a lot,
>
> R.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 12, 2022 at 8:18 PM Linda Dunbar
> wrote:
>
> Robert,
>
>
>
> Please see inline i
: Gyan Mishra
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 5:26 PM
To: Robert Raszuk
Cc: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; Linda Dunbar
; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Robert
Here are a few examples of UCMP drafts below used in core and data
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 12, 2022 1:00 PM
>> *To:* Linda Dunbar
>> *Cc:* Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
>> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Linda,
>>
>>
r@ietf.org<mailto:lsr@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Linda,
> IGP has been used for the Multi-path computation for a long time
IGP can and does ECMP well. Moreover, injecting metric of anycast server
destination plays n
omputation.
>
> Using MPLS is too heavy.
>
>
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:* Robert Raszuk
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 12, 2022 1:23 PM
> *To:* Linda Dunbar
> *Cc:* Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
&g
, January 12, 2022 1:23 PM
To: Linda Dunbar
Cc: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Linda,
> IGP has been used for the Multi-path computation for a long time
IGP can and does ECMP well. Moreover, inject
Linda –
Inline. Look for LES2:
From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 10:48 AM
To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: RE: Seeking feedback to the revised draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Les,
Please see my questions to your suggestions inserted below:
Linda
From
* Linda Dunbar
> *Cc:* Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>
>
>
> Hi Linda,
>
>
>
> *[LES:] It is my opinion that what you propose will not achieve your goals
>
Robert,
Please see inline in green:
From: Robert Raszuk
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 1:00 PM
To: Linda Dunbar
Cc: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Hi Linda,
[LES:] It is my opinion that what you
Hi Linda,
*[LES:] It is my opinion that what you propose will not achieve your goals
> – in part because IGPs only influence forwarding on a per packet basis –
> not a per flow/connection basis.*
>
> *[Linda] Most vendors do support flow based ECMP, with Shortest Path
> computed by attributes
Les,
Please see my questions to your suggestions inserted below:
Linda
From: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 11:21 AM
To: Linda Dunbar ; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: RE: Seeking feedback to the revised draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Linda –
Please see inline.
From
Linda –
Please see inline.
From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 8:41 AM
To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: RE: Seeking feedback to the revised draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Les,
With regard to what You said about “needing to do load balancing
issues?
Linda
From: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2022 11:14 PM
To: Linda Dunbar ; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: RE: Seeking feedback to the revised draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Linda -
From: Linda Dunbar
mailto:linda.dun...@futurewei.com>>
Sent: Tuesday, January 11,
anuary 12, 2022 at 6:07 AM
> *To: *Aijun Wang
> *Cc: *"Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" ,
> lsr , Linda Dunbar
> *Subject: *Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
>
>
>
> Hi Aijun & Linda,
>
>
>
> I think based on your bel
ailto:lsr-boun...@ietf.org>> On Behalf Of Les Ginsberg
(ginsberg)
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 1:14 PM
To: Linda Dunbar
mailto:linda.dun...@futurewei.com>>;
lsr@ietf.org<mailto:lsr@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
L
Regards
Aijun Wang
China Telecom
From: lsr-boun...@ietf.org On Behalf Of Les Ginsberg
(ginsberg)
Sent: Wednesday, January 12, 2022 1:14 PM
To: Linda Dunbar ; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Linda -
From: Linda Dunbar
Linda -
From: Linda Dunbar
Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2022 7:47 PM
To: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr@ietf.org
Subject: RE: Seeking feedback to the revised draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Les,
Starting with a clean slate:
Problem:
Most applications are instantiated at multiple locations
g<mailto:lsr@ietf.org>
Subject: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
LSR experts,
We have revised the draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute to address the comments
and feedback from IETF 112.
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-comp
Hi Aijun,
> Just because some mechanism wants to use toplogy information does NOT imply
> that it should be part of the routing protocol.
>
> In this case, load balancing should be an independent mechanism. If it wants
> to peek into the LSDB, that would be perfectly acceptable, IMHO.
>
Hi, Tony:
From: lsr-boun...@ietf.org On Behalf Of Tony Li
Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2022 4:20 AM
To: Aijun Wang
Cc: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) ; lsr
; Linda Dunbar
Subject: Re: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
On Jan 10, 2022, at 9:05 AM, Aijun
Hi, Les:
From: Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
Sent: Tuesday, January 11, 2022 4:55 AM
To: Aijun Wang ; Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
Cc: lsr@ietf.org; Linda Dunbar
Subject: RE: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Aijun –
Top posting here.
I think what
: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
Hi, Les:
Aijun Wang
China Telecom
On Jan 10, 2022, at 23:48, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)
mailto:ginsberg=40cisco@dmarc.ietf.org>>
wrote:
Linda –
I believe the most valuable feedback you received during your presen
> On Jan 10, 2022, at 9:05 AM, Aijun Wang wrote:
>
> [WAJ] Selecting the most appropriate/optimized application server should base
> on the topology information which is routing protocol related.
Just because some mechanism wants to use toplogy information does NOT imply
that it should be
tracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-wang-lsr-stub-link-attributes-02
>
>Les
>
>
> From: Lsr On Behalf Of Linda Dunbar
> Sent: Friday, January 7, 2022 11:29 AM
> To: lsr@ietf.org
> Subject: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised
> draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-comp
On Behalf Of Linda Dunbar
Sent: Friday, January 7, 2022 11:29 AM
To: lsr@ietf.org
Subject: [Lsr] Seeking feedback to the revised draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute
LSR experts,
We have revised the draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute to address the comments
and feedback from IETF 112.
https
LSR experts,
We have revised the draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute to address the comments
and feedback from IETF 112.
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-dunbar-lsr-5g-edge-compute/
In a nutshell, the proposed solution
* advertises the "Site-Cost" via IP prefix reachability TLV
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