All,
I am a photographer and am very respectful of wildlife and the birding ethic
rules. In no way do I want to bring harm or stress any wildlife including
snowy owls. The opportunity to be able to see these magnificant birds this
winter is an awesome one. The birding list have been an
To jump into the fray here: I have personally witnessed more than just two
people harassing snowy owls, in fact, I have observed, on several occasions, up
to four or five photographers at a time deliberately flushing the bird,
approaching it too closely, causing the bird to have to continually
I've seen the same kind of behavior with folks trying to photograph seals
and getting too close, or trying to flush the, from haulout sites. Educating
these folks and having the MMPA as a threat goes a long way to help reduce
the offensive behavior.
I thoroughly understand the pique we all
The usual line is that it is just two bad apples. Since I spend a
fair amount of my birding time photographing, I've seen a lot of
photographers. The number of bad apples is more in the range twenty
to forty. (Think: in the course of one day two of us we documented 3
of them - how many more
I have been trying to avoid jumping in on this but feel I must. As a
birder, and photographer, I also find the vilifying of bird photographers a
disturbing and personally offensive trend. There is no doubt that some
photographers do things that are not within ethical bounds. In fact I was
The opinion I voiced, to stop posting about owls, is certainly not a new one
among birders and has been in practice for years. It is unfortunate.
Education will help to reduce disturbance, which is why I re-posted the ABA's
ethics principles. There are a number of web sites that have similar
Date: Feb. 5, 2012
Location: Croton, Westchester County
Our NYC Audubon birding group visited Croton. The lack ice and snow
prevented the Eagles from concentrating in any one spot. We were able to see
three adult Bald Eagles fly over at the Croton RR station and one adult fly
over at
To echo Janet's post and in response to Stella's - I too have seen
photographers being insensitive to snowy owls, on other ocassions. I remember
one time there was a fantastic photo op for one particular owl at Jones Beach a
few years ago I even took one of my kids out of school so he could
DATE:
2/6/12 9:34 AM [ Full Screen ] [ SIZE: 2.242KB ]
FROM: fal...@kidwings.com
TO:catbird...@yahoo.com
SUBJECT:Re: [nysbirds-l] Knee jerk reaction to 2 guys that just didn't
get it
Hello All,
This is a very interesting discussion, and I enjoy reading
Well put Cindy!
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 6, 2012, at 9:14 AM, Cindy catbird...@yahoo.com wrote:
To echo Janet's post and in response to Stella's - I too have seen
photographers being insensitive to snowy owls, on other ocassions. I remember
one time there was a fantastic photo op for one
The buying of photographic equipment for picture taking or the buying of
optics for birding does not include a code of ethics or an insertable moral
compass for the buyer.
Equipment does not make a great photographer or binoculars make an
excellent birder. I have seen motivation lead to
I think we should all solemnly swear--both birders and photographers-- to never
ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever look or take a picture of an owl ever again.
Jacob Drucker
On Feb 6, 2012, at 9:56 AM, Diana Teta wrote:
The buying of photographic equipment for picture taking or the buying
I too agree with Cindy's summation.
The birding community as a whole should not turn into insular cliques that make
it easy
not to report when you know you will hear about the bird anyway.
Do we want this board to only report Herring Gull's except of course when a
Ross' Gull shows up!
That
All,
We are responsible for the sightings we make and the people we share those
with. It is important to balance the need for documenting rare and
irregular species vs. our desire to share these excellent sightings with
others. This is especially true when dealing with sightings of territorial
I'll second Joe Giuta's email about Croton Point: it was very quiet yesterday in this unseasonable mildness. We saw one mature and one juvenile Bald Eagle during the afternoon in Croton Bay. A lone juvenile Red-tailed hawk and a too quickly glimpsed falcon rounded out the raptors. We did have a
Hi all,
I was going to stay out of this thread because it's an impossible situation.
I come from 3 directions. I'm a long time birder, a professional wildlife
photographer and a listowner of Metro Birding Briefs. As a listowner I've
always discouraged posting of specific owl locations. Letting
Hats off to Cindy, very well said. Also to others on here that have pointed out that it is not just photographers but birders too that exhibit inappropriate behavior. To say lets just not post on here any species worthwhile, to me is just undermining what this is suppose to be about. This is
I was just about to post the same question about purpose, since the group
rules state:
The primary purpose of the List is to disseminate information about wild
bird sightings in and around New York State in a timely manner and to
provide an effective electronic forum for New York State area
As a long-time resident and birder of New York state (more than 30 years) I
agree with Cindy.
We must not fall into any extremist position.
It would be beyond a shame to go back to the old word of mouth system, when
only a self-appointed elite knew about rarities.
Respond appropriately to
Go find a rare bird.
Sent from my iPhone4
Please, always leave a message, I screen every call. Thx.
On Feb 6, 2012, at 9:14 AM, Cindy catbird...@yahoo.com wrote:
To echo Janet's post and in response to Stella's - I too have seen
photographers being insensitive to snowy owls, on other
I agree that my position is unfortunate and inconvenient for many. But posts
on this list have a major impact. For example, I was out at Breezy Point on
Saturday. There were few birders and only one photographer when I was there,
and the owls were left in peace. Then, a post on NYSBirds,
We use THIS list (and others) to get in the loop. Not all of us have our
days free to wander all over the state looking for rarities or trying to
find other birders in the field to talk with to get the scoop on rarities.
We have full-time jobs, families, and many other commitments, which is why
I share David's and Cindy's views about the issue of restricting information
about bird sightings. Before the time of the Internet (before the 1990s)
birders got info about bird sightings mostly through phone calls. At that time,
the number of active birders (or bird watchers was smaller than
We arrived at JBWR at 6:45AM. We quickly located the Barrow's Goldeneye on the
West Pond in the company of nearly one hundred Common Goldeneye. The Barrow's
flew out to the bay (southwest direction) with the Common Goldeneye at 7:30AM.
While searching through the rafts of waterfowl on the
Sent to me directly, by mistake;
Begin forwarded message:
From: scotty...@aol.com scotty...@aol.com
Date: February 6, 2012 7:12:36 AM EST
To: Jim Osterlund james...@optonline.net
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point
It serves the ignorant, the lazy, and the the
Sorry I wrote in the wrong woodpecker, but the sentiments remain the same.
Thanks for the correction sent to me.
Diana Teta\
Long Island, NY
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
This topic is going on in most States right now because of the number of Snowy
Owls moving down. I think singling out the photographers is wrong but honestly
at least three quarters of the time when I see a birder make a dumb
controversial decision he/she usually has a camera present. Not
List Members:
I am a recent subscriber of this list-serve. Having read some but not all of
the comments and opinions on the encroachment of birds for whatever the motive,
I have decided to share some points. From my relative outside perspective, I
see this issue to be one of great controversy
In any profession, sport, hobby, occupation business, or whatever, there
are people who do bad things at the expense of others. Some are good
people who should know better and some are just bad people. The assumption
that may be in error is people learn from their mistakes or from feedback
On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:13 PM, Mark Barriger mark8b...@hotmail.comwrote:
My attitude is if your serious about photographing owls and your serious
about observing them then spend more time out looking for them and less
time checking online for other people sightings.
So lets go ahead and punish
Scotty - Your statement is beyond ridiculous.
On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:25 PM, scotty...@aol.com scotty...@aol.comwrote:
If your a good birder, then u should know your locations for finding
birds. Hiking is supposed to be part of the fun but its lost with the
public. Posting rare birds
I like Peter's posting and would like to add a few thoughts. Maybe I'm
missing something, but the question that doesn't seem to be fully addressed
is: What do we do about it?
Keeping sightings off the listserves is one solution, but one that a lot of
people, myself included, have difficulty
Well said Fred and Peter. -Original Message-
From: Fred Baumgarten
Sent: Feb 6, 2012 12:38 PM
To: NYSBirds-L@cornell.edu
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] ethics, photographers, knee-jerks, op-eds
I like Peter's posting and would like to add a few thoughts. Maybe I'm
The issue should not be one of them against us since that would not help at
all. As a birder and as a photographer, I am concerned that these issues will
have negative repercussions on the social interactions between us in the field.
BTW, most of the bird photographers that I know are not
The issue should not be one of them against us since that would not help at
all. As a birder and as a photographer, I am concerned that these issues will
have negative repercussions on the social interactions between us in the field.
BTW, most of the bird photographers that I know are not
Fred speaks well, and, indeed, we need to gather all these thoughts,
and, if nothing else, state clearly and succinctly what the problem
is. To contribute to this, thinking there might be significant legal
aspects to consider, I've placed inquiry with NYSDEC, thinking them
the most likely
Well, for me the way out of these annoyances was simple - I stopped chasing
rarities. My father was a stamp collector, and I remember how strange and
compulsive that 'hobby' became for him. When I began to develop that same weird
behavior, I decided it was time for me to cultivate mental
I just spoke with a couple of people at the DEC. They suggested contacting a
local conservation officer if you see someone harassing wildlife. There is a
list of DEC regional offices and agents on the following link:
http://www.dec.ny.gov/regulations/393.html
I tend to think that most folks
Thanks Dave. Yes I did not realize that and Jody filled me in too. Maybe that is where our problem lies. Should that be protected to only those who subscribe? Seems like that could go a long way to having more consistent civil birding community.-Original Message-
From: David Klauber
Birders et al,
BirdCallsRadio archive is now available of Feb 5 show with our wonderful guest
Pete Dunne
Chief Communications Officer of New Jersey Audubon and Director of the Cape May
Bird Observatory
Pete is also the Founder of the World Series of Birding.
Watching the brouhaha over inconsiderate photographers with interest.
Mostly, this is about owls, snowies in particular. I'm thinking there are
two categories of problem people, those who willfully and consciously
disturb and harass owls for the better shot, and those who lack the field
craft to
Hey Adam, I agree with all you said. To hear someone complain vehemently that was onsite and did not take the initiative to approach the offenders and then not to even back you up and have the nerve of criticizing all photographers when they themselves are out there photographing the birds is
The issue here is how to protect owls from being harassed by unethical and just
plain pathetic photographers/birders. Not whether we should chase birds or
whether we should report rare birds. So not sure why we got turned in that
direction but maybe we can focus back on the main problem.
I'm
Hey Dan,
I am fine with that as long as you at least try to educate the individuals
exhibiting the poor behavior. Some people are just ignorant and just need a
little guidance. Yesterday's example by Adam is a prime example. You approach
them, try to considerately educate them. When
Early this afternoon 2 Turkey Vultures were seen soaring over Southaven
County Park, Brookhaven, tending in a northerly direction. Rather early,
as multiples usually not seen here by us until March.
Peggy Joel Horman
Ridge, NY
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
I agree! Do not post owls as photographers like myself will probably want
to photograph them. The bashing continues and as walk with a lens I always
feel a sense of discomfort when I see birdwatchers. Which is why I learned a
long time ago to keep my mouth shut about any birds I find..
So
Careful. This post makes me uneasy. It smacks of vigilante justice.
Moderation in all things.
Bob Lewis
Sleepy Hollow NY
--- On Mon, 2/6/12, Dan peterbilt.bir...@yahoo.com wrote:
From: Dan peterbilt.bir...@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Knee jerk reaction to 2 guys that just didn't
Dan,
The problem with your suggestion is the potential danger of creating a kind of
birding war that would not help to solve any problem but may create new ones,
including potentially violent encounters in the field that we must avoid. More
productive could be the development of some flexible
When will Harry Potter fans get involved in this discussion?
Jacob
On Feb 6, 2012, at 4:45 PM, Felipe Pimentel wrote:
Dan,
The problem with your suggestion is the potential danger of creating a kind
of birding war that would not help to solve any problem but may create new
ones,
I usually don't like to become embroiled in these types of conversations for
obvious reasons. However, I would like to make some observations.
(1) In my personal experience some of the worst offenders have been those
ready to condemn others while citing some sort of ethics code or another.
They
All of us should follow sensible rules that serve the welfare of the
wildlife we care about, {and the rules of this list serve are that
you provide your name with your post.}
I know that the vast majority of photographers are not behaving
poorly, but it only
Photographers are clearly muggles, but the birding community has its share of
deatheaters.
Will Raup
Albany, NY
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Knee jerk reaction to 2 guys that just didn't get it
From: jacobdruc...@msn.com
Date: Mon, 6 Feb 2012 16:53:32 -0500
CC: gregoryfis...@sprintmail.com;
This afternoon I did a vigil on the West Pond at Jamaica Bay Wildlife
Refuge, in an effort to establish the time that the *Barrow's
Goldeneye*was returning to roost. After an hour and half of
constantly scanning the
West Pond, I finally picked up the Barrow's Goldeneye around 5:35 p.m.
From my
Here is my two cents based off of over 30 years of birding in this state. I
find this entire discussion absurd and think that everyone has pretty much
missed the real point. I have no clue why people get so up in arms about
flushing owls. Let me preface this by saying that some of the people
Scanned from Galeville Town park for the evening raptor show (from 4pm to
5:45pm). Things move around a lot but high counts included 2 Turkey
Vultures, a BLACK VULTURE, 13 Northern Harriers, 2 ROUGH-LEGGED HAWKS, 8
SHORT-EARED OWLS, and 2 Red-tailed Hawks. We also had a COYOTE hunting for
mice
RBA
* New York
* Syracuse
* February 06, 2012
* NYSY 02.06.12
Hotline: Syracuse Rare bird Alert
Dates(s):
January 30, 2012 - February 06, 2012
to report by e-mail: brinjoseph AT yahoo.com
covering upstate NY counties: Cayuga, Montezuma National Wildlife Refuge
and Montezuma Wetlands Complex
Bravo, Isaac! Phil Jeffrey threw me off ebirds for my heretical piece earlier
today. I'm happy to hear another birder criticize behavior that really needs to
be addressed. Not to be misunderstood, if hobbyists want to spend insane sums
of money, absolutely. I endorse capitalism, these sales are
Another pressing topic dare I forward this email?
--JD
Begin forwarded message:
From: Ian Lynch revianly...@gmail.com
Date: February 6, 2012 9:17:17 PM EST
To: MassBird massb...@theworld.com
Subject: [MASSBIRD] Loblolly Cove residents upset
Reply-To: Ian Lynch revianly...@gmail.com
Brilliant, Isaac. Thank you.
Ardith Bondi
bird photographer
On 2/6/12 7:31 PM, Isaac Grant wrote:
Here is my two cents based off of over 30 years of birding in this
state. I find this entire discussion absurd and think that everyone has
pretty much missed the real point. I have no clue why
Hi all,
It is great idea to post videos of bad behaviors of birders/photographers :) I
would love to take videos of bad behaviors of birders too, especially when
playback is involved too. (I am being sarcastic here). How about when 60 people
show up in someone's yard to see that rare bird?
As Listowner of NYSbirds-L, I am monitoring this thread in the background. This
is an important discussion to have on the eList.
Please continue to keep the comments considerate and thoughtful.
For reference again, here is the American Birding Association (ABA) Code of
Ethics - Principles of
Seriously? Get a grip people. Someone already mentioned how owls bring out
the worst in people, and I agree. The topic always sets off a flurry of
sanctimonious posts from people trying to tell everyone else what to do.
Mention was already made of joggers and dog walkers flushing the owls in
In light of some recent ill-chosen dialogue, I must remind those who choose to
post messages to this List that it is not okay to single out people or publicly
lambast them. Please keep the postings more constructive in nature, instead of
playing the blame game.
The List Rules specifically
All,
I am a photographer and am very respectful of wildlife and the birding ethic
rules. In no way do I want to bring harm or stress any wildlife including
snowy owls. The opportunity to be able to see these magnificant birds this
winter is an awesome one. The birding list have been an
To jump into the fray here: I have personally witnessed more than just two
people harassing snowy owls, in fact, I have observed, on several occasions, up
to four or five photographers at a time deliberately flushing the bird,
approaching it too closely, causing the bird to have to continually
I've seen the same kind of behavior with folks trying to photograph seals
and getting too close, or trying to flush the, from haulout sites. Educating
these folks and having the MMPA as a threat goes a long way to help reduce
the offensive behavior.
I thoroughly understand the pique we all
The usual line is that it is just "two bad apples". Since I spend a
fair amount of my birding time photographing, I've seen a lot of
photographers. The number of bad apples is more in the range twenty
to forty. (Think: in the course of one day two of us we documented 3
of them - how many more
I have been trying to avoid jumping in on this but feel I must. As a
birder, and photographer, I also find the vilifying of bird photographers a
disturbing and personally offensive trend. There is no doubt that some
photographers do things that are not within ethical bounds. In fact I was
The opinion I voiced, to stop posting about owls, is certainly not a new one
among birders and has been in practice for years. It is unfortunate.
Education will help to reduce disturbance, which is why I re-posted the ABA's
ethics principles. There are a number of web sites that have similar
Date: Feb. 5, 2012
Location: Croton, Westchester County
Our NYC Audubon birding group visited Croton. The lack ice and snow
prevented the Eagles from concentrating in any one spot. We were able to see
three adult Bald Eagles fly over at the Croton RR station and one adult fly
over at
To echo Janet's post and in response to Stella's - I too have seen
photographers being insensitive to snowy owls, on other ocassions. I remember
one time there was a fantastic photo op for one particular owl at Jones Beach a
few years ago I even took one of my kids out of school so he could
DATE:
2/6/12 9:34 AM [ Full Screen ] [ SIZE: 2.242KB ]
FROM: fal...@kidwings.com
TO:catbird...@yahoo.com
SUBJECT:Re: [nysbirds-l] Knee jerk reaction to 2 guys that just didn't
get it
Hello All,
This is a very interesting discussion, and I enjoy reading
Well put Cindy!
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 6, 2012, at 9:14 AM, Cindy wrote:
> To echo Janet's post and in response to Stella's - I too have seen
> photographers being insensitive to snowy owls, on other ocassions. I remember
> one time there was a fantastic photo op for one particular owl
The buying of photographic equipment for picture taking or the buying of
optics for birding does not include a code of ethics or an insertable moral
compass for the buyer.
Equipment does not make a great photographer or binoculars make an
excellent birder. I have seen motivation lead to
I think we should all solemnly swear--both birders and photographers-- to never
ever, ever, ever, ever, ever, ever look or take a picture of an owl ever again.
Jacob Drucker
On Feb 6, 2012, at 9:56 AM, Diana Teta wrote:
> The buying of photographic equipment for picture taking or the buying
I too agree with Cindy's summation.
The birding community as a whole should not turn into insular cliques that make
it easy
not to report when you know you will hear about the bird anyway.
Do we want this board to only report Herring Gull's except of course when a
Ross' Gull shows up!
That
All,
We are responsible for the sightings we make and the people we share those
with. It is important to balance the need for documenting rare and
irregular species vs. our desire to share these excellent sightings with
others. This is especially true when dealing with sightings of territorial
I'll second Joe Giuta's email about Croton Point: it was very quiet yesterday in this unseasonable mildness. We saw one mature and one juvenile Bald Eagle during the afternoon in Croton Bay. A lone juvenile Red-tailed hawk and a too quickly glimpsed falcon rounded out the raptors. We did have a
Hi all,
I was going to stay out of this thread because it's an impossible situation.
I come from 3 directions. I'm a long time birder, a professional wildlife
photographer and a listowner of Metro Birding Briefs. As a listowner I've
always discouraged posting of specific owl locations. Letting
Hats off to Cindy, very well said. Also to others on here that have pointed out that it is not just photographers but birders too that exhibit inappropriate behavior. To say lets just not post on here any species worthwhile, to me is just undermining what this is suppose to be about. This is
I was just about to post the same question about purpose, since the group
rules state:
"The primary purpose of the List is to disseminate information about wild
bird sightings in and around New York State in a timely manner and to
provide an effective electronic forum for New York State area
As a long-time resident and birder of New York state (more than 30 years) I
agree with Cindy.
We must not fall into any extremist position.
It would be beyond a shame to go back to the old "word of mouth" system, when
only a self-appointed elite knew about rarities.
Respond appropriately to
Go find a rare bird.
Sent from my iPhone4
Please, always leave a message, I screen every call. Thx.
On Feb 6, 2012, at 9:14 AM, Cindy wrote:
> To echo Janet's post and in response to Stella's - I too have seen
> photographers being insensitive to snowy owls, on other ocassions. I remember
>
I agree that my position is unfortunate and inconvenient for many. But posts
on this list have a major impact. For example, I was out at Breezy Point on
Saturday. There were few birders and only one photographer when I was there,
and the owls were left in peace. Then, a post on NYSBirds,
We use THIS list (and others) to get "in the loop". Not all of us have our
days free to wander all over the state looking for rarities or trying to
find other birders in the field to talk with to get "the scoop" on rarities.
We have full-time jobs, families, and many other commitments, which is
I share David's and Cindy's views about the issue of restricting information
about bird sightings. Before the time of the Internet (before the 1990s)
birders got info about bird sightings mostly through phone calls. At that time,
the number of active birders (or bird watchers was smaller than
We arrived at JBWR at 6:45AM. We quickly located the Barrow's Goldeneye on the
West Pond in the company of nearly one hundred Common Goldeneye. The Barrow's
flew out to the bay (southwest direction) with the Common Goldeneye at 7:30AM.
While searching through the rafts of waterfowl on the
Sent to me directly, by mistake;
Begin forwarded message:
From: scotty...@aol.com
Date: February 6, 2012 7:12:36 AM EST
To: Jim Osterlund
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Photographer problem at Breezy Point
It serves the ignorant, the lazy, and the the followers that have
nothing better to do
Sorry I wrote in the wrong woodpecker, but the sentiments remain the same.
Thanks for the correction sent to me.
Diana Teta\
Long Island, NY
--
NYSbirds-L List Info:
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsWELCOME
http://www.NortheastBirding.com/NYSbirdsRULES
This topic is going on in most States right now because of the number of Snowy
Owls moving down. I think singling out the photographers is wrong but honestly
at least three quarters of the time when I see a "birder" make a dumb
controversial decision he/she usually has a camera present. Not
List Members:
I am a recent subscriber of this list-serve. Having read some but not all of
the comments and opinions on the encroachment of birds for whatever the motive,
I have decided to share some points. From my relative outside perspective, I
see this issue to be one of great controversy
In any profession, sport, hobby, occupation business, or whatever, there
are people who do "bad" things at the expense of others. Some are good
people who should know better and some are just bad people. The assumption
that may be in error is people learn from their mistakes or from
On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:13 PM, Mark Barriger wrote:
"My attitude is if your serious about photographing owls and your serious
about observing them then spend more time out looking for them and less
time checking online for other people sightings."
So lets go ahead and punish the folks who are
Scotty - Your statement is beyond ridiculous.
On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 12:25 PM, scotty...@aol.com wrote:
> If your a good birder, then u should know your locations for finding
> birds. Hiking is supposed to be part of the fun but its lost with the
> public. Posting rare birds locations online
I like Peter's posting and would like to add a few thoughts. Maybe I'm
missing something, but the question that doesn't seem to be fully addressed
is: What do we do about it?
Keeping sightings off the listserves is one solution, but one that a lot of
people, myself included, have difficulty
Well said Fred and Peter. -Original Message-
From: Fred Baumgarten
Sent: Feb 6, 2012 12:38 PM
To: NYSBirds-L@cornell.edu
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] ethics, photographers, knee-jerks, op-eds
I like Peter's posting and would like to add a few thoughts. Maybe I'm missing something, but the
The issue should not be one of "them against us" since that would not help at
all. As a birder and as a photographer, I am concerned that these issues will
have negative repercussions on the social interactions between us in the field.
BTW, most of the bird photographers that I know are not
The issue should not be one of "them against us" since that would not help at
all. As a birder and as a photographer, I am concerned that these issues will
have negative repercussions on the social interactions between us in the field.
BTW, most of the bird photographers that I know are not
Fred speaks well, and, indeed, we need to gather all these thoughts,
and, if nothing else, state clearly and succinctly what the problem
is. To contribute to this, thinking there might be significant legal
aspects to consider, I've placed inquiry with NYSDEC, thinking them
the most likely
Well, for me the way out of these annoyances was simple - I stopped chasing
rarities. My father was a stamp collector, and I remember how strange and
compulsive that 'hobby' became for him. When I began to develop that same weird
behavior, I decided it was time for me to cultivate mental
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