Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

2016-01-17 11:51 GMT-03:00 Eliot Miranda : > > > On Jan 17, 2016, at 12:05 AM, Tudor Girba wrote: > > Hi, > > Indeed. See below how it looks like in the latest development version. > > We have not yet integrate this one because we still need little

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

On Mon, Jan 18, 2016 at 9:45 PM, Esteban A. Maringolo wrote: > 2016-01-17 11:51 GMT-03:00 Eliot Miranda : >> >> >> On Jan 17, 2016, at 12:05 AM, Tudor Girba wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> Indeed. See below how it looks like in the

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

> On 17 Jan 2016, at 16:52, Tudor Girba wrote: > > Hi, > >> On Jan 17, 2016, at 1:18 PM, David Allouche wrote: >> >> Cool. While you are there, could provide a way to separate instance >> variables from local variables (and class shared variables

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, Indeed, this is the goal. What is the deadline until when we could still do something visual with the debugger? Cheers, Doru > On Jan 17, 2016, at 9:55 AM, stepharo wrote: > > Please publish this change fast because after all the coding videos of the > mooc will be

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Please publish this change fast because after all the coding videos of the mooc will be impacted. Le 17/1/16 09:05, Tudor Girba a écrit : Hi, Indeed. See below how it looks like in the latest development version. We have not yet integrate this one because we still need little changes in

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Cool. While you are there, could provide a way to separate instance variables from local variables (and class shared variables too, maybe)? It could be different columns, filtering, tabs, I do not really care. Currently, when debugging classes with lots of instance variables (like morphic

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, Indeed. See below how it looks like in the latest development version. We have not yet integrate this one because we still need little changes in FastTable to be able to resize columns and not make the column names clickable. Cheers, Doru > On Jan 17, 2016, at 8:07 AM, Ben Coman

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Le 17/01/2016 15:51, Eliot Miranda a écrit : > > > I have to say that the column names are entirely redundant. They're > obvious from the information presented (unless empty when no stack frame > is selected). They eat vertical screen real estate and are one more set > of strings to localize.

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

> On Jan 17, 2016, at 12:05 AM, Tudor Girba wrote: > > Hi, > > Indeed. See below how it looks like in the latest development version. > > We have not yet integrate this one because we still need little changes in > FastTable to be able to resize columns and not make

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, > On Jan 17, 2016, at 3:51 PM, Eliot Miranda wrote: > > > > On Jan 17, 2016, at 12:05 AM, Tudor Girba wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Indeed. See below how it looks like in the latest development version. >> >> We have not yet integrate this one

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, > On Jan 17, 2016, at 1:18 PM, David Allouche wrote: > > Cool. While you are there, could provide a way to separate instance variables > from local variables (and class shared variables too, maybe)? > It could be different columns, filtering, tabs, I do not really care.

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

End of this week else I will just do it and people will adapt. Hi, Indeed, this is the goal. What is the deadline until when we could still do something visual with the debugger? Cheers, Doru On Jan 17, 2016, at 9:55 AM, stepharo wrote: Please publish this change fast

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Great. That should be enough time to do a couple of iterations. Doru > On Jan 17, 2016, at 6:30 PM, stepharo wrote: > > End of this week else I will just do it and people will adapt. > >> Hi, >> >> Indeed, this is the goal. What is the deadline until when we could still do

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

I'm going over the pdf descriptions of the lecture and after I will follow the pdfs and record. Stef Le 17/1/16 18:32, Tudor Girba a écrit : Great. That should be enough time to do a couple of iterations. Doru On Jan 17, 2016, at 6:30 PM, stepharo wrote: End of this

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Le 09/01/2016 10:32, Tudor Girba a écrit : > Hi, > > Could you be specific? What exactly do you find less intuitive? To be able to > react, it is useful to get concrete points. > > Cheers, > Doru > > > -- > www.tudorgirba.com > www.feenk.com > > "Value is always contextual." > > Hi, After

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

On Sun, Jan 17, 2016 at 9:48 AM, Cyril Ferlicot D. wrote: > > And more, it make the debugger "ventilated" (I don't know if the term > work in English too). I mean that with more space between the classes > and the methods it's better for the eye of the user. Never heard

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Le 9 janv. 2016 à 23:10, Tudor Girba a écrit : > Hi, > >> On Jan 9, 2016, at 3:29 PM, Christophe Demarey >> wrote: >> >> Not yet tested but looks good. > > Thanks. > >> I just noticed it misses the "run to here" action. > > It does not miss it. It is in the

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

- Can we have a setting to remove all the colors from the stack because sometimes the hilighting is more confusing than helping and especially for newbies - the argument about run to here not being a button is not about logical placement is it about making things easy to use and discover. -

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

> > Cheers, > Doru > > > > > > > Cheers > > Francisco > > > > > > > > On Sat, Jan 9, 2016 at 12:07 PM, Henrik Nergaard <henrik.nerga...@uia.no> > wrote: > > http://ws.stfx.eu/3KXXDAJ4EUF6 > > > > > > -Original Message--

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, > On Jan 10, 2016, at 11:58 AM, Nicolai Hess wrote: > > > 2016-01-09 23:10 GMT+01:00 Tudor Girba : > Hi, > >> On Jan 9, 2016, at 3:29 PM, Christophe Demarey >> wrote: >> >> Not yet tested but looks good. > >

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

On Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 12:54 PM, Stephan Eggermont wrote: > On 10-01-16 06:26, Tudor Girba wrote: > >> - There is no way to close the inspector if we miss click >>> >> >> Indeed, this is a problem. We did not want to have an >> > >extra tab line and that is why we do not have

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, > On Jan 10, 2016, at 10:51 AM, stepharo wrote: > > - Can we have a setting to remove all the colors from the stack because > sometimes the hilighting > is more confusing than helping and especially for newbies As Mariano said, there is one already. > - the argument

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

I wanted to say that I also like more the distribution that Esteban built instead of the original one of GT Debugger. So.. +1 for that. And yes, I also like the text besides the buttons since unfortunately the buttons are not extremely intuitive. +1 for that too. For the record I gave

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

2016-01-10 6:26 GMT+01:00 Tudor Girba : > Hi, > > Thanks for the detailed feedback. See my comments inline. > > > On Jan 10, 2016, at 12:12 AM, Ferlicot D. Cyril < > cyril.ferli...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Le 09/01/2016 10:32, Tudor Girba a écrit : > >> Hi, > >> > >> Could

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

On Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 5:51 AM, stepharo wrote: > - Can we have a setting to remove all the colors from the stack because > sometimes the hilighting > is more confusing than helping and especially for newbies > > There is a setting for this which allows you to disable it.

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

<mailto:pharo-dev-boun...@lists.pharo.org>] On Behalf Of Stephan Eggermont Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 3:36 PM To: pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org <mailto:pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org> Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0 On 09-

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

I've never used the bytecodes view, but when I see them listed in the inspector on a method I still often think "Wow! You can do that?!" Its cool a hook to let novices peek under the hood and build a sense of mastery. Though I haven't used the GTDebugger for a long time, so I'm not sure

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Yes this is my point On Jan 9, 2016, at 3:29 PM, Christophe Demarey > wrote: Not yet tested but looks good. Thanks. I just noticed it misses the "run to here" action. It does not miss it. It is

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

No one said, dont integrale it. Just not yet as the default Debugger. Am 09.01.2016 10:51 vorm. schrieb "Dimitris Chloupis" : > > Since I am the mainn maintainer of UPBE and pretty much alone, I will have to disagree, I have expressed my dislike for GT tools in the past, I

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Am 09.01.2016 11:03 vorm. schrieb "Esteban Lorenzano" : > > you have to confess that with text and icons looks a lot better than the old one :P > Yes alot better >> On 09 Jan 2016, at 11:01, Esteban Lorenzano wrote: >> >> again re-send because of exceed

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

there has been around a script to automate the screenshots, but personally I never bother using it because taking a screenshot and inserting in pillar is the easiest thing.On macos is just CMD+SHIFT+4 and you just choose the area you want to screenshot and thats it, it takes a second.

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

I wanted to say that I also like more the distribution that Esteban built instead of the original one of GT Debugger. So.. +1 for that. And yes, I also like the text besides the buttons since unfortunately the buttons are not extremely intuitive. +1 for that too. Stef, as for the bydecode

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

any idea when that will happen ? On Sat, Jan 9, 2016 at 12:19 PM Tudor Girba wrote: > You get it in the Moose image until it gets integrated :). > > Doru > > > > On Jan 9, 2016, at 12:11 PM, Dimitris Chloupis > wrote: > > > > looks lovely > > > > Is

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

On 08-01-16 21:22, stepharo wrote: - It looks a lot more complex to me and I do not want to have to redo all the screenshots of our lecture. What do you need to automate the screenshots? Stephan

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Not yet tested but looks good. I just noticed it misses the "run to here" action. Le 9 janv. 2016 à 11:01, Esteban Lorenzano a écrit : > again re-send because of exceed limits with the image (that’s new?) > > with a small tweak, texts (AND icons :P): > > > > > would that be aceptable for

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

You get it in the Moose image until it gets integrated :). Doru > On Jan 9, 2016, at 12:11 PM, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: > > looks lovely > > Is there a way to add the new debugger to my existing image ? How I get the > new debugger, I downloaded the latest image and

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

that’s just an example, default debugger does not have it :) I will commit my changes as soon as I can sit and clean it… the actions need to be changed to make explicit if you want text/icon/both so we can keep all behaviours (and keep compatible). Esteban > On 09 Jan 2016, at 14:08,

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, Thanks! Could you publish the code and then we can iterate over it? Cheers, Doru > On Jan 9, 2016, at 12:02 PM, Esteban Lorenzano wrote: > > you have to confess that with text and icons looks a lot better than the old > one :P > >> On 09 Jan 2016, at 11:01,

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Le 9/1/16 11:02, Esteban Lorenzano a écrit : you have to confess that with text and icons looks a lot better than the old one :P you mean both old ones GT and Spec. I hated the the GT icons because I was forced to wait for the fly by help I hate this interfaces that looks nice but are not

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

On 09-01-16 12:39, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: there has been around a script to automate the screenshots, but personally I never bother using it because taking a screenshot and inserting in pillar is the easiest thing. AFAIK the hard part is keeping things up to date. That's where automation

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

http://ws.stfx.eu/3KXXDAJ4EUF6 -Original Message- From: Pharo-dev [mailto:pharo-dev-boun...@lists.pharo.org] On Behalf Of Stephan Eggermont Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 3:36 PM To: pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0 On 09-01-16 12:39, Dimitris

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Very nice (also because of the Dark theme ;-) > On 09 Jan 2016, at 11:01, Esteban Lorenzano wrote: > > again re-send because of exceed limits with the image (that’s new?) > > with a small tweak, texts (AND icons :P): > > > > > would that be aceptable for you? > >

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Thanks for this wonderfully positive message !! That is the spirit. > On 09 Jan 2016, at 10:49, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: > > Since I am the mainn maintainer of UPBE and pretty much alone, I will have to > disagree, I have expressed my dislike for GT tools in the past, I

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Can you remove this useless _stack top and _thisContext? Who needs that? And also the bytecode and also the Step glamour that freezes by image and the Step petitParser So you see what I mean? Something that normal people can use...

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, It is impossible to satisfy everyone. What I would suggest is to have text + icons as default and a preference to only have icons. Christophe Le 9 janv. 2016 à 14:30, Dimitris Chloupis a écrit : > Which brings us to my question, where did tooltips go ? Squeak had them and > then they

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Dont do it for me , what I did with ChronosManager is only the tip of the iceberg, I will be redesigning the whole Pharo GUI from scratch. After I release ChronosManager 0.2 my next victim will be Nautilus, then inspector and finally debugger. So I will be building my own GUI for the debugger

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Thanks for this. Part of it is now in the repo. We need to work to find a reasonable solution to add text to Glamour. Cheers, Doru > On Jan 9, 2016, at 12:01 PM, Esteban Lorenzano wrote: > > again re-send because of exceed limits with the image (that’s new?) > > with a

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

.pharo.org] On Behalf Of > Stephan Eggermont > Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 3:36 PM > To: pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org > Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0 > > On 09-01-16 12:39, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: > > there has been around a script to automate the screens

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

J4EUF6 >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: Pharo-dev [mailto:pharo-dev-boun...@lists.pharo.org] On Behalf Of >> Stephan Eggermont >> Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 3:36 PM >> To: pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org >> Subject: Re: [Pharo-dev

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hello everyone, As expected, there was some feedback. Here is a summary: 1. The layout should mirror the classic debugger - The previous layout was chosen to show more of the stack and to make use of the screen real estate. - But, as that is not an essential component of GTDebugger, the current

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

> wrote: > http://ws.stfx.eu/3KXXDAJ4EUF6 > > > -Original Message- > From: Pharo-dev [mailto:pharo-dev-boun...@lists.pharo.org] On Behalf Of > Stephan Eggermont > Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 3:36 PM > To: pharo-dev@lists.pharo.org > Subject: Re: [Phar

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Henrik Nergaard <henrik.nerga...@uia.no> > wrote: > http://ws.stfx.eu/3KXXDAJ4EUF6 > > > -Original Message- > From: Pharo-dev [mailto:pharo-dev-boun...@lists.pharo.org] On Behalf Of > Stephan Eggermont > Sent: Saturday, January 9, 2016 3:36 PM > To: pha

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Thank you, indeed. Doru > On Jan 9, 2016, at 1:23 PM, Sven Van Caekenberghe wrote: > > Thanks for this wonderfully positive message !! That is the spirit. > >> On 09 Jan 2016, at 10:49, Dimitris Chloupis wrote: >> >> Since I am the mainn maintainer of

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, Thanks for the detailed feedback. See my comments inline. > On Jan 10, 2016, at 12:12 AM, Ferlicot D. Cyril > wrote: > > Le 09/01/2016 10:32, Tudor Girba a écrit : >> Hi, >> >> Could you be specific? What exactly do you find less intuitive? To be able >> to

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, > On Jan 9, 2016, at 10:43 AM, Esteban Lorenzano wrote: > > (re-send because I exceeded limit.) > > Hi, > > let’s think positive. Thanks :) > the GTDebugger is a step forward… it allow a lot of better interactions and > of course, it needs some iterations to make

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Hi, Could you be specific? What exactly do you find less intuitive? To be able to react, it is useful to get concrete points. Cheers, Doru > On Jan 9, 2016, at 4:23 AM, Ferlicot D. Cyril > wrote: > > Le 08/01/2016 21:22, stepharo a écrit : >> I'm sorry but this

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Since I am the mainn maintainer of UPBE and pretty much alone, I will have to disagree, I have expressed my dislike for GT tools in the past, I was quite vocal about my dislike about GTPlayground and especially the pages interface of GTInspector. Yet even though I am the one that usually ends up

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Bad math, the correct is 35.000 word are: *I repeat 100 UPBE BOOKS ! * On Sat, Jan 9, 2016 at 11:49 AM Dimitris Chloupis wrote: > Since I am the mainn maintainer of UPBE and pretty much alone, I will have > to disagree, I have expressed my dislike for GT tools in

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

you have to confess that with text and icons looks a lot better than the old one :P > On 09 Jan 2016, at 11:01, Esteban Lorenzano wrote: > > again re-send because of exceed limits with the image (that’s new?) > > with a small tweak, texts (AND icons :P): > > > > >

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

I'm sorry but this debugger should not be the default one. MONDAY we are filming our mooc and we have to explain the debugger and personally I do not see the gain: - It looks a lot more complex to me and I do not want to have to redo all the screenshots of our lecture. - Just that I

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

2016-01-08 21:22 GMT+01:00 stepharo : > > I think that experts can choose the debugger they want. The newbies don't. > +1 > > Stef > > >

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Thanks for your testimony. I'm not against GTDebugger per se. I believe that we should have better tools but we should take time for building better tools (even if this is two years that moosers use or not this new debugger). I would appreciate a process where users can give real feedback and

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

On Sat, Jan 9, 2016 at 4:22 AM, stepharo wrote: > I'm sorry but this debugger should not be the default one. > MONDAY we are filming our mooc and we have to explain the debugger and > personally I do not see the gain: > - It looks a lot more complex to me and I do not want

Re: [Pharo-dev] gtdebugger in pharo 5.0

Le 08/01/2016 21:22, stepharo a écrit : > I'm sorry but this debugger should not be the default one. > MONDAY we are filming our mooc and we have to explain the debugger and > personally I do not see the gain: > - It looks a lot more complex to me and I do not want to have to > redo all the