With all the anti-govenrment stuff in here, I though you might enjoy this.JimA Dead Horse: The tribal wisdom of the Dakota Indians, passed on from
generation to generation, says that, "When you discover that you are
riding a dead horse, the best strategy is to dismount."
However, in the
Hello Brian. This is most intriguing. Let me describe another sawdust expt. which I did in my kitchen. I first placed the sawdust in a clean wide mouthplastic feeding bottle, anchored it in a pot of water, and boiled for 30 min. with lid on to sterilise the sawdust. On cooling a small piece of
LOL Jim!
With all the anti-govenrment stuff in here, I though you might enjoy this.
Jim
Thankyou, I did. Couple of things though. It's not just
anti-government per se, it's rather pointed, it depends which
government and what the it's doing. Not to disparage the wisdom of
the Dakota
Greenpeace is doing well fighting Monsanto in Europe. - K
BIO-IPR docserver | http://www.grain.org/bio-ipr
TITLE: Monsanto files patent for new invention: the pig
AUTHOR: Brian Thomas Fitzgerald
PUBLICATION: Greenpeace news
DATE: 2
Bob A,
Pimentels research might be a valid representation of the results from a
very well defined process. The problem is that it is a very narrow set of
parameters and they look like they are chosen to get a predetermined result
and an argument that benefit those that wants to limit
Nepal's Biogas Program Bags Coveted Award
By Kunda Dixit
Nepal's internationally-recognised biogas promotion program has got
yet another feather in its cap. The Biogas Sector Program (BSP) has
won this year's prestigious Ashden Award for Sustainable Energy,
beating out hundreds of other
Thomas,
If you'd read the stir washing section most thoroughly, you would have
come away with the notion that pump washing can contribute more to
emulsions than stir washing. As well, the section is predominantly
dedicated to stir washing and only briefly mentions, pump washing, and
even
At this moment it is currently against the law to
transport waste cooking oil in most states
That's not exactly true. Substitute the word some for most. Even then the
permit required is not excessively expensive.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Wow, I said to myself I was not going to tell the
Still, all rather sad how ethanol has become the predominate alternative
fuel of choice for gasoline applications when methanol yields far higher
outputs per acre with far fewer inputs.
At 75% of the energy content as ethanol, the energy yield per acre (100
gallons per ton of dry biomass)
Todd, I see what you're saying on the energy output side but the main
problem with methanol is that it has a tendency to attack the castings in
carburettors. I know because I used methanol in my lawn mower, after a while
the jets became blocked with white stuff, I presume Aluminium oxide. So till
Hi All,
I don't think ethanol will be a dinosaur in 20 years but would appreciate why you think so if it is other than yields per hectare. Methanol has the capacity to produce some nasty tailpipe emmission (as does ethanol but less so) and is far more toxic to humans and animals than ethanol.
ah, the oil field. I grew up in Oklahoma, my dad was a geologist and so
was always finding me work when not in school. I have worked as a floor
hand, roustabout, and pumper at various times. Oil field work (as
dangerous an occupation as I ever got near) and the importance of a
student
Greeting all,
What would happen to the Cornell results if a crop like sugar beets was used instead of corn?
Tom Irwin
From: Hakan Falk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 07:45:27 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Cornell on ethanol, biodiesel,
In general it's rather a simple problem of substitution, Malcolm.
It will become even more simple as times become more desperate.
malcolm maclure wrote:
Todd, I see what you're saying on the energy output side but the main
problem with methanol is that it has a tendency to attack the
Dinosaur as a matter of necessity Tom. Economics may preclude or
designate that necessity.
What I find peculiar is the fact that the toxicity of gasoline isn't
mentioned here.
You also may care to take into consideration that energy farming will
inherantly reduce other industrial toxicity
Tom,
If you look at Sweden, that uses sugar beets for alcohol production, it
works quite well. At Cornell University, I do not know, guess that it
depends on who it is, that gives the research grants.
Hakan
At 04:18 PM 8/4/2005, you wrote:
Greeting all,
What would happen to the Cornell
Keith, Bob, Andrew et al.
Respectfully, I need to disagree with Keith and go with Bob on this one.
David Pimentel may rightfully deserve scorn for his repeatedly releasing
skewed reports long after the errors have been pointed out.
However, he should not be attacked for doing so, That is,
I think this whole discussion mightbe lessimportant if we didn't haveofficials in the current administration changing, misinterpreting and discrediting scientific reports thatdisagree with their agenda. What's worse is that some scientists are doing it for them!
Science has become
Tom Irwin wrote:
I don't think ethanol will be a dinosaur in 20 years but would
appreciate why you think so if it is other than yields per hectare.
Methanol has the capacity to produce some nasty tailpipe emmission (as
does ethanol but less so) and is far more toxic to humans and animals
than
Tom Irwin wrote:
Greeting all,
What would happen to the Cornell results if a crop like sugar beets was
used instead of corn?
Please don't call it the Cornell results. That implies the entire
university backs Pimentel's findings.
As to your question, I can't answer it directly, but you
Hello John
Keith, Bob, Andrew et al.
Respectfully, I need to disagree with Keith and go with Bob on this one.
David Pimentel may rightfully deserve scorn for his repeatedly
releasing skewed reports long after the errors have been pointed out.
However, he should not be attacked for doing
Still, thousands of people handle it on a daily
basis, with no extra special effort and no problems. About the
only problems I hear about is when methanol is mistaken for
ethanol. IIRC I read of 17 fatalities and 55 non-fatal cases
in 2002, involving methanol, which is better than ethanol's
So my unit is on the trailer in the backyard and
will not get set up any time soon. I work as the local carpenter, cabinet
maker, electriction, plumber,
etc. for a group of about 25 people who share my talents and really do not want
to see my 27 year
old ethanol plant becopme a sucess because
Thanks Manick
You are fortunate to have walking encyclopedia
in your dad. Nurture him well.
During my morning run I stopped by the area where
Dad was
attaching wire to the steel posts I pounded in over the weekend.
(Patting
myself on the back here for nurturing.) Hehe Anyway, Dad said it was
Now that you bring up this point about
yeast and fungi eating
sugar the same stuff needed to ferment, it occurs to me that these
fungi folks were unaware that I was trying to ferment the sawdust.
Their original plan as I recall was to help my friend who owns a small
sawmill to dispose of
Keith and Et. Al:
Jorma Ollila, Nokia's former chief executive is to
become the first outside chairman of the oil giant.
Shell. He may not know much about oil, but he led a
radical transformation of Nokia in the 1990s.
Investors will be hoping he can revitalize Shell.
My question to Biofuel
Hello Hakan,
One might be able to get values for sugar production per hectare from both crops and then compare the costs of planting both crops. I really like the idea of growing my own fuel but on the farm you need diesel unless someone is making ethanol fuelled tractors. I haven't given up
Ok, I
promised the
list admin I would look in the archives before I asked questions about
new
subjects. I did find some stuff about thermal depolymerization TDP.
http://www.mindfully.org/Energy/2003/Anything-Into-Oil1may03.htm
I really would like to know what the current group thinks about the
Hello Todd,
Let's forgo toxicity and byproducts for a moment and talk about efficiency. I could be mistaken but if I can take cellulose and biologically convert it to ethanol or methanol, I think I want the two carbon alcohol over the one carbon alcohol. If it is a question of biologically
Hello Brian
Ok, I promised the list admin I would look in the archives before I
asked questions about new subjects. I did find some stuff about
thermal depolymerization TDP.
http://www.mindfully.org/Energy/2003/Anything-Into-Oil1may03.htmhtt
Hi Keith , Andrew,
Thanks for the dialogue. I will update my info on Pimentel's work. If he
has indeed allowed bias to influence him to the detriment of honest inquiry
I will be glad to endorse your criticism.
Keep the thoughts flowing,
Bob A.
- Original Message -
From: Keith
Hi All,
Is it more economical to purchase 95% ethanol and run it through 3A molecular sieve or is it just best to purchase 100% ethanol? I have a muffle furnace in the lab and can reuse the mole sieve.
Tom Irwin
From: Ken Provost [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To:
On Aug 4, 2005, at 12:04 PM, Tom Irwin wrote:
Hi All,
Is it more economical to purchase 95% ethanol and run it through 3A
molecular sieve
or is it just best to purchase 100% ethanol? I have a muffle
furnace in the lab and can
reuse the mole sieve.
Depends what you mean by
I could be missing something, this is probably too simple an analysis.
Perhaps the process requires the entire equation to make sense? Maybe
cradle to grave energy inputs on both sides as well as energy outputs
are required to get an accurate perspective as to energy related
cost/benefits of
Keith,
The financing of University research projects should be official public
information. Somebody in US only have to ask for the information about the
project at Cornell university. I doubt that they have any obligation to
give the information to foreigners, so maybe someone of our US
Greetings Hakan,
I feel fairly confident that biological degradation will have a lower energy cost than pyrolysis. All of the reactions from oxidation of the lignin to hydrolysis of the cellulose occur at or below 35 degrees C. The conversion to alcohol by biomass occurs at that temperature
Man! I really like that one. I wish there were a written account ofnative Americanphilosophy. I imagine it would be a little like Confucius but,more Earthy (if that's a word) and humorous (like the hoarse analogy). Although it's obvious that many tribes were absolutely fearless in war, I have to
Hi Hakan and All ;
Trying to get back into this.
The process of converting biomass to methanol
requires pyrolization
(thermochemical) reactors which convert the biomass
to crude producer
gases. (See 19th century gas street lighting and the
process of charcoal
production.) After washing
What about this sweet sorghum (molasses) plant ... someone is saying
yields around 800 gallons of ethanol an acre and 1/3 the energy input
of corn...
sounds way to good to be true.. if it is... why are we wasting our time
with corn?
Ray J
In any event, btu per gallon vs. btu per
4.3 gallons of ethanol per hundred weight from sorghum
http://www.fsa.usda.gov/daco/bioenergy/2001/2001FactorsNFormulas.pdf
Average hundred weight per acre? Irrigated? Non-irrigated? Energy inputs?
Todd Swearingen
Ray J wrote:
What about this sweet sorghum (molasses) plant ... someone is
Ray,
I have no idea why you waste your time on over production of corn, but I
will once more tell the story about Germans and the WWII peace. After the
peace, the Germans needed food aid to avoid starving, US asked them what
they needed and they answered Korn (Rye in German). US started to
We talked about crop yields in at least one previous thread. Maybe this is helpful:
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg51322.html
MikeRay J [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
What about this sweet sorghum (molasses) plant ... someone is saying yields around 800 gallons of ethanol
Hi all,
Doing a bit of due diligence. Does anyone
have experience with Bill Anderson at this URL or with any of the advertised
publications regarding authenticity, accuracy, and usefulness? I could find no
hit in the archives.
Best,
Bob Adams
http://petroleum.berkeley.edu/UCOil/structure.htm
Structure of UC Oil Consortium
The UC Oil Consortium® was established at the University of California at Berkeley by Prof. T. W. Patzek in 1994. Over the years, the participants have been Aera Energy, BP, CalResources, Chevron USA, Mobil
Dirty Oil:
the West's Saviour, the Greens' Worst Nightmare
Source: Sunday Business; London (UK)
1 August 2005
WATCH the incredible, amazing, crazy-sensible world of Honda's new
hydrogen car marketing on television and you'll see weird cartoon rodents
taking showers in squeaky clean water
Nice work Jon!
MikeJon Kolk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
http://petroleum.berkeley.edu/UCOil/structure.htm
Structure of UC Oil Consortium
The UC Oil Consortium® was established at the University of California at Berkeley by Prof. T. W. Patzek in 1994. Over the years, the participants have
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