window eyes

[Dennis Long via Talk]

How is WE performing these days?  I would expect it to have issues with
Windows 10.  Is this the case?  It was a very good screen reader.

 

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Who wrote the script to have the contence of chrome address bar not spoken?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hi, could this person contact me off list?  I have a question.  My email is

dennisl1...@gmail.com

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RE: Help MLB.com

[Dennis Long via Talk]

There should be something like link current subscribers or something like
that.  Personally I would pay $10 a  month or $100 for the year and get tune
in premium you get the archives and the audio quality is much better than
MLB's.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Robert Ringwald via Talk
Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2019 4:53 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Robert Ringwald
Subject: Help MLB.com

I have paid my $19.99 to mlb.com to renew for this season. I have a new
password. Cannot find where to log in. Help!

Bob
r...@ringwald.com
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RE: Didn't someone create an alternative to this list?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Or send a message to 
windoweyesusers+subscr...@groups.io

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Friday, March 29, 2019 9:27 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: RE: Didn't someone create an alternative to this list?

Hi Tom,

Ok, so the URL for Dennis Long's email list subscription page which I sent
you got messed up by my Outlook email screener too.
So, here's what you can search for on google to find it.

Windoweyesusers

It is a groups.io list, and so you should have no problem finding it.

Alternatively, here's the URl in which I have place parentheses around the
http prefix so that Outlook won't convert it and mess it up:
(http)s://groups.io/g/WindowEyesUsers

All the best,

Rod

Sent from Outlook for Windows

-Original Message-
From: Talk  On
Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: March 29, 2019 11:23 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Tom Kingston 
Subject: Didn't someone create an alternative to this list?

If anyone has the subscription information I'd appreciate it.

Thanks,
Tom
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RE: game day audio on win 7 machine

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I can confirm it works fine using IE on win10.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of BK via Talk
Sent: Sunday, March 3, 2019 5:11 PM
To: AI Squared
Cc: BK
Subject: game day audio on win 7 machine

Hello, I have a win 10 laptop and a win 7 laptop and tested mlb game day
audio on both. I get the games on win 10 machine in chrome, IE, and even MS
edge, but in edge I use the elements dialog to navigate links and even
navigating it is painfully slow. 
In win 7, I get the games in chrome 7, but I had to use NVDA, because
wineyes 8.4 would not read the page. my IE on the win 7 machine is outdated
and needs to be updated, so I can't access the game day audio page. 
I have a desktop running win xp and will try the same test sometime this
week. 
If someone at MLB said you need windows 10 to access the games, that simply
is not true.

Butch
--
BK 

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RE: Link for Game day audio website

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I understand not supporting IE anymore I use chrome.  However there is no
excuse for the player not being accessible.

-Original Message-
From: Butch Bussen [mailto:but...@shellworld.net] 
Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2019 2:00 PM
To: Dennis Long via Talk
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Link for Game day audio website

I think it is a crock they require you to hav e an almost new computer. 
For an audio feed?  They lump tv and tatio into the same thing.  Hell, it
should work with explorer atleast on seven.
73
Butch
WA0VJR
Node 3148
Wallace, ks.


On Sat, 2 Mar 2019, Dennis 
Long via Talk wrote:

> I called and complained I helped make the previous  version accessible it
> looks like I'm in for another round of battle.  This is bullshit They made
> it accessible before it took 2 or 3 years.  The Android app isn't
accessible
> either.Trust me I will not quit until it is fully accessible again.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
> On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk
> Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2019 10:18 AM
> To: Dennis Long via Talk
> Cc: Butch Bussen
> Subject: RE: Link for Game day audio website
>
> 't know, not sure you can.  Last year they went to this combined page for
TV
> and radio which I don't find speech friendly.  Also it is very particular
on
> what will let you play the games on.  Their requirements says computer has
> to be no more than 3 years old.  In seven, explorer won't work, you have
to
> use firefox.  I called and complained and they didn't seem to care much.
> Also, I had to give them a different credit card number,  and they said
they
> couldn't do it on the phone, had to do it on line.  I told them I tried
that
> and couldn't make their page work with speech.  They finally had someone
> call me back.  I wish they'd stuck with their old page and player.
> I used my Amazon echo last year and it worked, but you couldn't get
archived
> games.  This year they say the Amazon skill won't be available as they are
> improving it.  Didn't they have the whole off season to do that?
>
>
> 73
> Butch
> WA0VJR
> Node 3148
> Wallace, ks.
>
>
> On Sat, 2 Mar 2019, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>
>> How do you get to the volume controls for the player?
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk
>> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
>> On Behalf Of Curtis Delzer via Talk
>> Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2019 12:56 AM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: Curtis Delzer
>> Subject: Re: Link for Game day audio website
>>
>> http://mlb.mlb.com/media/player/mpa/index.jsp
>> -
>> Curtis Delzer, HS.
>> WB6HEF
>> San Bernardino, CA
>>
>> ___
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>> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
>> For membership options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/dennisl1
>> 982%40
>> gmail.com.
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>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>
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> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
>> For membership options, visit
>
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> world.net.
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>>
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RE: Link for Game day audio website

[Dennis Long via Talk]

You shouldn't need Windows 10 to make it ok I have win10 what's there excuse 
now?  On Monday I will give them an ear full and let them know just what I 
think.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Nick Sarames via Talk
Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2019 2:57 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Nick Sarames
Subject: Re: Link for Game day audio website

Remember, it's about making money. It's in the best interest of software 
developers to require consumers to upgrade.

On 3/2/2019 2:00 PM, Butch Bussen via Talk wrote:
> I think it is a crock they require you to hav e an almost new computer. 
> For an audio feed?  They lump tv and tatio into the same thing.  Hell, 
> it should work with explorer atleast on seven.
> 73
> Butch
> WA0VJR
> Node 3148
> Wallace, ks.
> 
> 
> On Sat, 2 Mar 2019, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
> 
>> I called and complained I helped make the previous  version 
>> accessible it looks like I'm in for another round of battle.  This is 
>> bullshit They made it accessible before it took 2 or 3 years.  The 
>> Android app isn't accessible either.Trust me I will not quit 
>> until it is fully accessible again.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk
>> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
>> On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk
>> Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2019 10:18 AM
>> To: Dennis Long via Talk
>> Cc: Butch Bussen
>> Subject: RE: Link for Game day audio website
>>
>> 't know, not sure you can.  Last year they went to this combined page 
>> for TV and radio which I don't find speech friendly.  Also it is very 
>> particular on what will let you play the games on.  Their 
>> requirements says computer has to be no more than 3 years old.  In 
>> seven, explorer won't work, you have to use firefox.  I called and 
>> complained and they didn't seem to care much.
>> Also, I had to give them a different credit card number,  and they 
>> said they couldn't do it on the phone, had to do it on line.  I told 
>> them I tried that and couldn't make their page work with speech.  
>> They finally had someone call me back.  I wish they'd stuck with 
>> their old page and player.
>> I used my Amazon echo last year and it worked, but you couldn't get 
>> archived games.  This year they say the Amazon skill won't be 
>> available as they are improving it.  Didn't they have the whole off 
>> season to do that?
>>
>>
>> 73
>> Butch
>> WA0VJR
>> Node 3148
>> Wallace, ks.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, 2 Mar 2019, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>>
>>> How do you get to the volume controls for the player?
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Talk
>>> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
>>> On Behalf Of Curtis Delzer via Talk
>>> Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2019 12:56 AM
>>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>>> Cc: Curtis Delzer
>>> Subject: Re: Link for Game day audio website
>>>
>>> http://mlb.mlb.com/media/player/mpa/index.jsp
>>> -
>>> Curtis Delzer, HS.
>>> WB6HEF
>>> San Bernardino, CA
>>>
>>> ___
>>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of 
>>> the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>>
>>> For membership options, visit
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/dennis
>>> l1
>>> 982%40
>>> gmail.com.
>>> For subscription options, visit
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>> List archives can be found at
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>>
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>>> the
>> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>>
>>> For membership options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/butchb%
>> 40shell
>>
>> world.net.
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>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>>
>>>
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RE: Link for Game day audio website

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I called and complained I helped make the previous  version accessible it
looks like I'm in for another round of battle.  This is bullshit They made
it accessible before it took 2 or 3 years.  The Android app isn't accessible
either.Trust me I will not quit until it is fully accessible again.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk
Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2019 10:18 AM
To: Dennis Long via Talk
Cc: Butch Bussen
Subject: RE: Link for Game day audio website

't know, not sure you can.  Last year they went to this combined page for TV
and radio which I don't find speech friendly.  Also it is very particular on
what will let you play the games on.  Their requirements says computer has
to be no more than 3 years old.  In seven, explorer won't work, you have to
use firefox.  I called and complained and they didn't seem to care much.
Also, I had to give them a different credit card number,  and they said they
couldn't do it on the phone, had to do it on line.  I told them I tried that
and couldn't make their page work with speech.  They finally had someone
call me back.  I wish they'd stuck with their old page and player.
I used my Amazon echo last year and it worked, but you couldn't get archived
games.  This year they say the Amazon skill won't be available as they are
improving it.  Didn't they have the whole off season to do that?


73
Butch
WA0VJR
Node 3148
Wallace, ks.


On Sat, 2 Mar 2019, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:

> How do you get to the volume controls for the player?
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk 
> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
> On Behalf Of Curtis Delzer via Talk
> Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2019 12:56 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Curtis Delzer
> Subject: Re: Link for Game day audio website
>
> http://mlb.mlb.com/media/player/mpa/index.jsp
> -
> Curtis Delzer, HS.
> WB6HEF
> San Bernardino, CA
>
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> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
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> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
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RE: Link for Game day audio website

[Dennis Long via Talk]

How do you get to the volume controls for the player?

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Curtis Delzer via Talk
Sent: Saturday, March 2, 2019 12:56 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Curtis Delzer
Subject: Re: Link for Game day audio website

http://mlb.mlb.com/media/player/mpa/index.jsp
-
Curtis Delzer, HS.
WB6HEF
San Bernardino, CA

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RE: Windows 10 with narrator and jaws

[Dennis Long via Talk]

You would be better off using Chrome with Jaws.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Brenda via Talk
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2019 7:51 PM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Cc: Brenda
Subject: Windows 10 with narrator and jaws

Hi Listers,

Before my win7 machine dies and/or win7 is no longer supported I decided to 
learn to use my win10 laptop.

I like Narrator for most windows things but still need jaws for ff, tb, and 
chrome.

I can’t figure out MS edge which is the only internet program that works with 
narrator. It sure would be nice to be able to use it in case jaws gets too 
expensive.

Windows mail is usuable, but I still have a lot to figure out.

Any tips on Ms edge or win10 with jaws or narrator would be appreciated. I’ll 
save learning NVDA for later as that would just be too much to learn.

Thanks for any tips etc.

Brenda
Still missing Window-Eyes but trying to move on.

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

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RE: jaws and chrome

[Dennis Long via Talk]

What issues are you having with Jaws and Chrome?

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of BK via Talk
Sent: Monday, February 18, 2019 9:26 AM
To: gw micro
Cc: BK
Subject: jaws and chrome

I am running jaws 2019 with the latest update and sometimes have to use IE
because Jaws won't perform the same actions in chrome. I don't know if the
problem is with jaws or chrome, but that's why it's good to have two or more
browsers. 

Butch
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RE: Chrome app

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Mike switch to Jaws 2019 and you won't have an issue.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Mike via Talk
Sent: Sunday, February 17, 2019 11:54 AM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Cc: Mike
Subject: Chrome app

Hello


I am having problems with Google Chrome not reading enough.  The things that 
chrome isn't telling me is spoken in internet explorer but ie is incredibly 
slow.  Does anyone know if there is an app for chrome later than 1.01.


With thanks in advance


Mike.

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RE: Jaws List?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

The other list is more relibable and is followed by freedom scientific.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of John Covici via Talk
Sent: Sunday, February 3, 2019 9:01 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: John Covici
Subject: Re: Jaws List?

The main group seems to be j...@groups.io, so you would do
jfw+subscr...@groups.io to subscribe.  I don't know about the other
list.

On Sat, 02 Feb 2019 16:55:03 -0500,
joseph hudson via Talk wrote:
> 
> Hi Robert, here it is copied from the homepage. The directive dress to
join the group. And I will also place the link to the homepage in the
messages well.
> 
> jaws-users-list+subscr...@groups.io
> 
> https://groups.io/g/jaws-users-list
> > On Feb 2, 2019, at 3:13 PM, Robert Ringwald via Talk
 wrote:
> > 
> > Lloyd,
> > 
> > I  cannot get subscribed to the jaws list below. Are you sure that it is
correct?
> > 
> > -Bob
> > 
> > 
> > -Original Message- From: Loy Green via Talk
> > Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 2:47 PM
> > To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> > Cc: Loy Green
> > Subject: Re: Jaws List?
> > 
> > I have been a long time user of WE as well and still use it a  lot, but
also am using JAWS. It took me a while to learn. Here is subscription
address for one of the JAWS users groups.
> > jaws-users-list+subscr...@groups.io
> > - Original Message -  From: Robert Ringwald via Talk
> > To: Talk
> > Cc: Robert Ringwald
> > Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2019 3:38 PM
> > Subject: Jaws List?
> > 
> > 
> > I finally succumbed. Since WE is no longer supported, I figured that 
> > I had better get Jaws while the gettin' is good.
> > 
> > Since I had the latest version of WE with 2 SMAs, I got Jaws for free.
> > 
> > What is the email list for Jaws?
> > 
> > -Bob Ringwald
> > 
> > 
> > ---
> > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> > https://www.avast.com/antivirus
> > 
> > ___
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--
Your life is like a penny.  You're going to lose it.  The question is:
How do
you spend it?

 John Covici wb2una
 cov...@ccs.covici.com
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RE: Echoing group for the blind please share

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Feel free to subscribe it's a relatively low traffic list.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of BK via Talk
Sent: Monday, January 21, 2019 12:14 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: BK
Subject: Re: Echoing group for the blind please share

Dennis, approximately how much traffic is on the echoing email list? I am
interested in subscribing, but don't want to get overly swamped with email
messages. Thanks.

Butch

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chrome help needed jaws speaking things in address bar/omnibox even though it is turned off

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hi, as I start to type Jaws or NVDA  will start to speak I turned off
predictive and auto fill in settings and search suggestions it still will
speak how do I fix this?

 

 

 

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RE: chrome help needed

[Dennis Long via Talk]

That was the issue.  It is resolved.  I got it resolved had to remove it
delete the browsing data and completely deleted the history under program
files and it now works as expected I appreciate all your help.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 9:18 PM
To: Dennis Long via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: chrome help needed

I'm running Windows 10.
What exactly is happening? Can you get it to say pressed and then after
closing the window and re-opening it it's not pressed? i.e. when you tab to
it it just says button instead of button pressed.

On 12/27/2018 8:39 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
> I did that as well I can't get it to hold any ideas?  What version of 
> windows are you running?
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk 
> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
> On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 8:53 AM
> To: Dennis Long via Talk
> Cc: Tom Kingston
> Subject: Re: chrome help needed
> 
> It's a button not a check box. It says "Ask where to save each file 
> before downloading" followed by only button if it's not pressed and 
> button pressed if it is.
> I just opened Chrome and went to it. It said pressed. I pressed the 
> space bar and it said nothing. But I tabbed off and back onto it and 
> it just says the name and button. I closed the window with Control+W 
> and then closed Chrome with the same. I opened it again and it was still
not pressed.
> I then did the same in reverse to turn it back on and now it says 
> button pressed when I tab onto it.
> 
> 
> On 12/27/2018 8:12 AM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>> I check the option to ask me where to download a file it doesn't stay 
>> checked.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk
>> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
>> On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
>> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 4:10 AM
>> To: Dennis Long via Talk
>> Cc: Tom Kingston
>> Subject: Re: chrome help needed
>>
>> On a link you can open the context menu and press K for Save link as.
>> Otherwise, here's how to set the global download options.
>> 1. Press Alt to focus the Chrome button and the space bar to open the 
>> context menu.
>> 2. Press S for settings.
>> 3. Tab down to the Advanced button and press the space bar.
>> Turn on browse mode and press H to move through the settings by heading.
>> Under the downloads heading you should see the default folder 
>> followed by an unlabelled button. You can press that button to choose a
folder.
>> You can also skip that and go to the next button which is to tell 
>> Chrome to ask you where to download every time you download something.
>> Hth,
>> Tom
>>
>>
>>
>> On 12/26/2018 9:07 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>>> Could someone help me?  Maybe do a remote session if needed?  I 
>>> can't get Chrome to allow me to choose where to save each file when
> downloading.
>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> the
>> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>>
>>> For membership options, visit
>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tom.kin
>> g
>> ston%4
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>> 1
>> 982%40
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&

RE: chrome help needed

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I did that as well I can't get it to hold any ideas?  What version of
windows are you running?

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 8:53 AM
To: Dennis Long via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: chrome help needed

It's a button not a check box. It says "Ask where to save each file before
downloading" followed by only button if it's not pressed and button pressed
if it is.
I just opened Chrome and went to it. It said pressed. I pressed the space
bar and it said nothing. But I tabbed off and back onto it and it just says
the name and button. I closed the window with Control+W and then closed
Chrome with the same. I opened it again and it was still not pressed.
I then did the same in reverse to turn it back on and now it says button
pressed when I tab onto it.


On 12/27/2018 8:12 AM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
> I check the option to ask me where to download a file it doesn't stay 
> checked.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk 
> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
> On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 4:10 AM
> To: Dennis Long via Talk
> Cc: Tom Kingston
> Subject: Re: chrome help needed
> 
> On a link you can open the context menu and press K for Save link as.
> Otherwise, here's how to set the global download options.
> 1. Press Alt to focus the Chrome button and the space bar to open the 
> context menu.
> 2. Press S for settings.
> 3. Tab down to the Advanced button and press the space bar.
> Turn on browse mode and press H to move through the settings by heading.
> Under the downloads heading you should see the default folder followed 
> by an unlabelled button. You can press that button to choose a folder.
> You can also skip that and go to the next button which is to tell 
> Chrome to ask you where to download every time you download something.
> Hth,
> Tom
> 
> 
> 
> On 12/26/2018 9:07 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>> Could someone help me?  Maybe do a remote session if needed?  I can't 
>> get Chrome to allow me to choose where to save each file when
downloading.
>> Thanks.
>>
>> ___
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> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
>> For membership options, visit
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/tom.king
> ston%4
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>>
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RE: chrome help needed

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I did that it doesn't stick.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 8:53 AM
To: Dennis Long via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: chrome help needed

It's a button not a check box. It says "Ask where to save each file before
downloading" followed by only button if it's not pressed and button pressed
if it is.
I just opened Chrome and went to it. It said pressed. I pressed the space
bar and it said nothing. But I tabbed off and back onto it and it just says
the name and button. I closed the window with Control+W and then closed
Chrome with the same. I opened it again and it was still not pressed.
I then did the same in reverse to turn it back on and now it says button
pressed when I tab onto it.


On 12/27/2018 8:12 AM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
> I check the option to ask me where to download a file it doesn't stay 
> checked.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk 
> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
> On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
> Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 4:10 AM
> To: Dennis Long via Talk
> Cc: Tom Kingston
> Subject: Re: chrome help needed
> 
> On a link you can open the context menu and press K for Save link as.
> Otherwise, here's how to set the global download options.
> 1. Press Alt to focus the Chrome button and the space bar to open the 
> context menu.
> 2. Press S for settings.
> 3. Tab down to the Advanced button and press the space bar.
> Turn on browse mode and press H to move through the settings by heading.
> Under the downloads heading you should see the default folder followed 
> by an unlabelled button. You can press that button to choose a folder.
> You can also skip that and go to the next button which is to tell 
> Chrome to ask you where to download every time you download something.
> Hth,
> Tom
> 
> 
> 
> On 12/26/2018 9:07 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>> Could someone help me?  Maybe do a remote session if needed?  I can't 
>> get Chrome to allow me to choose where to save each file when
downloading.
>> Thanks.
>>
>> ___
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> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
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> ston%4
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RE: chrome help needed

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I check the option to ask me where to download a file it doesn't stay
checked.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tom Kingston via Talk
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2018 4:10 AM
To: Dennis Long via Talk
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: chrome help needed

On a link you can open the context menu and press K for Save link as. 
Otherwise, here's how to set the global download options.
1. Press Alt to focus the Chrome button and the space bar to open the
context menu.
2. Press S for settings.
3. Tab down to the Advanced button and press the space bar.
Turn on browse mode and press H to move through the settings by heading.
Under the downloads heading you should see the default folder followed by an
unlabelled button. You can press that button to choose a folder.
You can also skip that and go to the next button which is to tell Chrome to
ask you where to download every time you download something.
Hth,
Tom



On 12/26/2018 9:07 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
> Could someone help me?  Maybe do a remote session if needed?  I can't 
> get Chrome to allow me to choose where to save each file when downloading.
> Thanks.
> 
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chrome help needed

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hi, when viewing this link on internet explorer I press g when the site
loads it says im/sprite32 which is the play button.  I don't see that in
Chrome.  How do I find the video using chrome  The link is below.  Thanks
for your help. ?

http://www.fox2detroit.com/news/380277417-video

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RE: Jaws discussion list?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I strongly advise joining the jaws users list I posted about a week ago it
is very helpful.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of CJ MAY via Talk
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 3:30 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: CJ MAY
Subject: RE: Jaws discussion list?

I too moved across from Window-eyes to Jaws this year and am a reluctant
convert!
Firstly, when you are told the screen has lost focus, just hold down the alt
key and tap the tab key which will move you back to the screen.
I am still working my way through tutorials but have found the following
website with its podcasts very helpful. 
The podcasts have been written with former Window-eyes users in mind:


http://www.gwmicro.com/window-eyes/migrate/


-Original Message-
From: Talk  On
Behalf Of Norene Trappa via Talk
Sent: 25 October 2018 23:46
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Norene Trappa 
Subject: Re: Jaws discussion list?

Hello!
I have some questions about jaws.  I am just learning to use it.  Is there
more than one way to read with jaws?  If so, please explain.  Whenever I
turn on the computer, the speech tells me I have lost focus.  Is there a fix
for that?  Are there tutorials out there to teach basic commands,
keystrokes, etc.  This is more difficult than Window-Eyes was.  Any help
will be gratefully appreciated.  Norene Trappa



-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2018 2:24 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Jaws discussion list?

Yes subscribe by sending an email to this address.
jaws-users-list+subscr...@groups.io

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Bob Tinney via Talk
Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2018 11:21 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Bob Tinney
Subject: Jaws discussion list?

Is there a Jaws discussion list like this list for Window-Eyes?

Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net

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one password

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hi is anyone using one password?  How do I add a log in so it automatically
fills it in for me?  Can someone give instructions or a tutorial please.
Thanks.

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RE: Jaws discussion list?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Yes subscribe by sending an email to this address.
jaws-users-list+subscr...@groups.io

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Bob Tinney via Talk
Sent: Saturday, October 20, 2018 11:21 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Bob Tinney
Subject: Jaws discussion list?

Is there a Jaws discussion list like this list for Window-Eyes?

Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net

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RE: NoScript for Firefox

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I uninstalled the Mozilla maintenance service that should prevent the dam
thing from updating
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of David via Talk
Sent: Friday, September 7, 2018 7:52 PM
To: WE English Mailinglist
Cc: David
Subject: NoScript for Firefox

OK, we all know Win-Eyes has had trouble with the standard version of newer
updates to Firefox. For a long time, I have had the ESR version running
here, and let it update itself, to receive the newest fixes. 
everything has been in best order.


that is, two days ago, I received a new update. This time though, Firefox
updated itself to the latest ESR - which is something like 62. 
Poof. This meant that all the certain my WinEyes no longer works with
Firefox. Even Jaws 18, strikes and tells me it cannot do anything. NVDA
works fine with the new installation.


Looking through the archives on Mozillas FTP, I was abel to download and
install a version of the 52.9ESR - which seems to be the latest ESR that
WinEyes would work with. Yet, I have no clue if it is holding all the latest
fixes of that version. And letting it update, I am thinking maybe it just
will go way up to newest release, and be back to non-usable states.


Worse, through all the updating process, my NoScript addon got updated as
well. And now, that I have reversed back to the older version of Firefox,
the updated version of NoScript is no longer valid.


Would anyone happen to have the latest version of NoScript that works with
Firefox ESR that is compatible with WinEyes?


Even, if any of you have the latest updated fixes for Firefox that 
worked with our screen reader installed, Would you have a chance to zip 
up your Firefox folder under Program Files X86, and send it to me? Guess 
that is where the updates are stored, and so I could make sure things 
would be as updated as possible here. :)


Any other workaround, I am all ears. Thanks, listers.

-- 

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RE: Why Narrator will be better as a Screen Reader

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Windoweyes will never come to Android.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2018 9:14 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc.
Subject: RE: Why Narrator will be better as a Screen Reader

Doug a Senior Program Manager at Microsoft?  Wow, how I wish he had gone
over to Google!  Surely, he could help make Talkback another knock out!  I
look forward to the day when, somehow, Window-Eyes can become another TTS of
choice on the Android platform.  You know, Window-Eyes for Android?

Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado

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RE: Why Narrator will be better as a Screen Reader

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Dream on WindowEyes will never come to android

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Sky Mundell via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2018 10:36 PM
To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: Why Narrator will be better as a Screen Reader

Hello. I would agree, except for now, VFO has the source code for it.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2018 6:14 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc.
Subject: RE: Why Narrator will be better as a Screen Reader

Doug a Senior Program Manager at Microsoft?  Wow, how I wish he had gone
over to Google!  Surely, he could help make Talkback another knock out!  I
look forward to the day when, somehow, Window-Eyes can become another TTS of
choice on the Android platform.  You know, Window-Eyes for Android?

Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado

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RE: Considering VoiceOver

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Jaws is a very good screen reader.  People need to give it time.  You didn't
learn WindowEyes over night and you won't learn Jaws over night either.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of CJ MAY via Talk
Sent: Friday, August 24, 2018 4:12 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: CJ MAY
Subject: RE: Considering VoiceOver

I did consider going down this route but I am basically lazy and it would
mean learning a new operating system. I am so familiar with the Microsoft
operating system and Windows that in the end I bit the bullet and went over
to Jaws.
Do I still miss Window-eyes? Yes, but migrating to Jaws hasn't been as
challenging as I feared and it helped being so familiar with the Windows
operating system.

Alison
 

-Original Message-
From: Talk  On
Behalf Of George Savory via Talk
Sent: 23 August 2018 18:57
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: George Savory 
Subject: Considering VoiceOver

Listers,
Been using Win-Eyes  since Win-Eyes 3X. As Win-Eyes will not be updated, I
am strongly considering going to VoiceOver on Apple. Using VoiceOver on my
iPhone with Safari works perfectly. I don't know if Jaws will ever work well
with websites that use calenders; besides, I won't have to be upgrading a
screen reader  everytime there is an upgrade
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RE: JAWS Mobile?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Contact Freedom they will help you.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Ayers, David (ITCS) via Talk
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2018 12:53 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Ayers, David (ITCS)
Subject: JAWS Mobile?

Does JAWS have the option of creating a mobile version on a flash drive?  I
have tried looking, but cannot find anything that says if it does or not.

David Ayers
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puran utilities help needed

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hi, where do you get the set files to automatically do what you want?  I'm
wanting that will automatically delete browser when it closes.  Thanks for
the help.

 

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purine utilities help needed

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hi, where do you get the set files to automatically do what you want?  I'm
wanting that will automatically delete browser when it closes.  Thanks for
the help.

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PROGRAM that deletes browsing history automatically that is accessible

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hi, is there  a program other then Ccleaner that is accessible that will
delete browsing history automatically when a browser is closed?

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RE: chrome help needed

[Dennis Long via Talk]

That does nothing for me.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tony C via Talk
Sent: Monday, May 28, 2018 5:17 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Tony C
Subject: Re: chrome help needed

Hi, Try alt B for book marks.

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Monday, May 28, 2018 3:18 PM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: chrome help needed

IN Internet Explorer I hit altA to quickly get to my favorites.  Is there a
way like this to quickly get my bookmarks?   I also want to do letter
navigation through my bookmarks this doesn't seem possible.  I DO NOT WANT
TO TYPE INTO A SEARCH FIELD WHAT I WANT!  If it's not possible is there an
extension that makes it possible?





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chrome help needed

[Dennis Long via Talk]

IN Internet Explorer I hit altA to quickly get to my favorites.  Is there a
way like this to quickly get my bookmarks?   I also want to do letter
navigation through my bookmarks this doesn't seem possible.  I DO NOT WANT
TO TYPE INTO A SEARCH FIELD WHAT I WANT!  If it's not possible is there an
extension that makes it possible?

 

 

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RE: What's Doug up to?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I got it.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Sky Mundell via Talk
Sent: Monday, May 14, 2018 12:18 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: What's Doug up to?

Odd. I tried it and I could get Doug.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Butch Bussen via Talk
Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2018 8:55 PM
To: Butch Bussen via Talk
Cc: Butch Bussen
Subject: Re: What's Doug up to?

I tried alt left arrow and it just takes me to the beginning of the talk I'm
on.  I tried the next link several times and never did find Doug.
On
Sun, 13 May 2018, Butch Bussen via Talk wrote:

> Same here.
> 73
> Butch
> WA0VJR
> Node 3148
> Wallace, ks.
>
>
> On Sun, 13 May 2018, Lloyd Rasmussen via Talk wrote:
>
>>  I didn't hear Doug during the first 15 minutes. This was a Microsoft  
>> demonstration from their Buidld conference. Did I not listen far 
>> enough
or
>>  did my YouTube player go to the wrong place?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>
>>  Lloyd Rasmussen, Kensington, MD
>>  http://lras.home.sprynet.com
>>  -Original Message- From: Rod Hutton via Talk
>>  Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2018 4:46 PM
>>  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>>  Cc: Rod Hutton
>>  Subject: What's Doug up to?
>>
>>  Hi everyone,
>>
>>  I thought you might be interested in an accessibility training 
>> seminar
for
>>  software developers taught by our beloved Doug Geoffray:
>>
>>  http://bit.ly/2rHOahI
>>
>>  Enjoy,
>>
>>  Rod
>>
>>  Sent from Outlook 2010 for Windows
>>
>>  ___
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>>
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.com.
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>> 
>> 
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RE: Firefox Update, as of May 2018

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I have no issue with jaws and ebay as you describe.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of David via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, May 1, 2018 3:11 PM
To: WE English Mailinglist
Cc: David
Subject: Firefox Update, as of May 2018

I was met by a message today, that there was a new update for my Firefox.


as you all will remember, last summer there was a good deal of chatting here on 
the list, since the normal (standard) version of Firefox was changed, and no 
longer useful for WE users.


The solution, that I along with many have been using, has been the ESR version 
of the browser. And, that is the version I was prompted to update today. I 
believe it stated to be version 52.7, or something like that.


I was, due to some other technical reason, running NVDA at the moment. 
As the ESR version traditionally has been reliable for screen readers, I did 
just accept the update, and anticipated going on with my browsing. 
NVDA had no problem in handling the newly updated browser.


Shortly, I closed NVDA, and started WinEeys, ready to go into normal 
activity. Great was my disappointment, when >I realized that the new 
version on my system, seemed to display the same useless behavior under 
WinEyes, as the standard version.


First thing you will notice, is that the screen reader no longer says:

 Program Main Window,

when launching the browser. You now will rather hear a message, 
containing the phrase:

 Document Window.

And Wineyes does not recognize this "document window" as a browser 
window, hence Browse Mode will not turn on. You will be able to tab 
through the controls, and can click on them by hitting Enter. But you 
will not be able to navigate anything outside the controls.


Since Firefox tends to update, even when you tell it not to, I am afraid 
this might indicate the end of WinEyes altogether working with a 
well-established favorite browser - among many a blind person.


My hope would be, that anyone could tell me that they have updated, and 
experienced no trouble. But that hope is pretty thin. You might be able 
to deny the update, for a few days or weeks, but sooner or later, you 
are going to experience the browser simply updating itself, without your 
contentment.


Sure, I have a backup of my browser folder, from a few weeks back, and 
might reinstall it. But what good would that do, since it all will be 
only temporarily, till it self-updates next time.


Too bad, they couldn't just leave at least one version of the browser 
alone, with the old access method. If for no longer, why not letting it 
alone, till they had solved the screen reader issue, that they have 
promised us ever since the main version went bad for screen readers.


Then again, both NVDA and Jaws, do work with the new version. I even 
checked the newly updated system here, with Jaws. It works, but only so 
much. Jaws gets into big trouble, and has been there for ever so long as 
I have had it, when the website is auto-updating. That means, things 
like EBay, under Firefox and with Jaws - well, you'd better just forget 
it. Jaws will continually jump back to the top of the page, just because 
some tiny detail updates on the web. Besides, working with the Browse 
Mode of Jaws, reminds me the old-style (close to a decade ago) features 
we had under WinEyes, version pre-7. Strange they never had the idea of 
updating their browser functionality. What is it really, that they 
include in all the updates we are faced with, ever so often, when 
running Jaws? No, I don't want to start a long discussion, just wondering.


Long message, will end here. Just wanted to let you all know my 
experience of today. Hopefully, you might be able to abstain from 
loosing your browser, for a few moments longer.


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windowseyes list still around if you wish to subscribe

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hi my windoweyes list is still hear.   Feel free  to subscribe.

windoweyesusers+subscr...@groups.io.

 

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RE: Email List

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Its 
windoweyesusers+subscr...@groups.io

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Pastol Gil via Talk
Sent: Saturday, April 14, 2018 8:48 AM
To: t...@window-eyes.com
Cc: Pastol Gil
Subject: Email List

Dennis,

 

Can you send me a link to subscribe to Window-EyesUsers email list?

I have a new email address to need to subscribe.

 

Thanks,

 

Pastor Gil

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Re: Is it trure that window eyes won't work with windows 10 1803?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Yes

Sent from my Android phone using Aqua Mail



On February 21, 2018 4:11:06 PM BK via Talk  wrote:

> Rod, how does voice over compare with jaws and window eyes? And are
> there audio books or tutorials available to help learn the mac OS? Thank
> you much.
>
> Butch
>
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Re: Firefox 58.0 release overview

[Dennis Long via Talk]

This reminds me of the quote that over time apps and programs will not work 
now that WinEyes is no longer being supported this may be one example.
- Original Message - 
From: "David via Talk" 
To: "Window-Eyes Discussion List" ; 


Cc: "David" 
Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2018 11:36 PM
Subject: Re: Firefox 58.0 release overview



Thanks for the link.


Yes, they sure are aware of the screen reader issues - and have been so
ever since they started the whole 57+ cycle. What they don't tell in the
article you linked, is why they did not just fix it right away, when
they were to introduce version 58. Sounds somehow like the Microsoft
thing, where they took a pretty long time to have anything for a fix, in
the Edge browser issue. Being aware of a thing, does not automate you
will ever have a fix of it.


Well, let us keep positive. They are aware of the issues, and hope to
fix them. Now, what kind of issues is it they will fix? NVDA, and I
don't know Jaws, have had certain issues with modern versions of
Firefox. But they have still been able to read

SOMETHING

off the screen. WinEyes users, on the other hand, have been able to read
absolutely

 nothing

from the screen produced by version 57+. Even when we seemed to have
found a workaround, it took them less than a week to break even that
one, with a new "update". So when comes to them fixing things in a way
that WinEyes users again can go back to the latest ordinary version of
Firefox, I would not keep my breath - really. Chances are high, the
issues they are going to fix, will be the ones experienced by NVDA and 
Jaws.



For WinEyes users, currently you have to use the ESR version of the
Firefox - which most currently is at version 52.6. It updated here
yesterday, and still runs nicely with the screen reader. Let's just
hope, they don't break anything there, before they have fixed everything
in the main version.


Again, I do intend no negativity here, but wanted to keep things in
perspective.


On 1/25/2018 4:23 AM, Debby Franson via Talk wrote:

Hi Everyone!

My husband sent me this link. I know we have all had trouble with
Firefox since their major change, and I remember someone feeling
forgotten about by Mozilla due to being a screen reader user. Mozilla
hasn't forgotten about us. They are aware of the problems screen
reader users have. Here is the link.

https://www.ghacks.net/2018/01/22/firefox-58-0/

Debby

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getting start up and shut down sounds to work in win10

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hi, how do you get start up and shut down sounds to work in windows10?

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RE: typing passwords with jaws

[Dennis Long via Talk]

It's done this way for security.  Think about it a sighted person couldn't
see it either it would appear as stars or dots.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Nick Sarames via Talk
Sent: Friday, November 17, 2017 8:02 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Nick Sarames
Subject: Re: typing passwords with jaws

WE does the same thing, and as much as I don't like not knowing what I am
typing, I like the security of knowing I am typing my password in the
correct field.

On 11/17/2017 5:56 PM, BK via Talk wrote:
> Hello, jaws says star, star, star, when I type in a password. Does 
> anyone know how to change this so that jaws will say what is actually 
> being typed. I like to hear the actual characters, so I know I am 
> typing the password correctly. Thanks.
> 
> Butch
> 
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RE: IE or fx

[Dennis Long via Talk]

This makes no sense on windows7 with jaws 18 and jaws2018 I can use firefox 
just fine.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of brice Mijares via Talk
Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2017 10:46 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: brice Mijares
Subject: IE or fx

  I am still having navigational issues with IE or FX. Window eyes has the same 
problem that started a few weeks ago in FX 56.x where we lost navigational 
keys. Uninstalled FX 56.x and installed FX 52.4 and have the same problem with 
window eyes.
  I installed Jaws 2018 When i hit insert   f-function key 7 for a list of 
links, I hear "feature only available in  virtual document. Using firefox, or 
IE jaws 2018. Tried hitting escape key, no change, no navigational  keys work 
other than tab key. Whats going on?  By the way, NVDA works fine with my 
limited knowledge of NVDA. Using all current screen reader versions, window 10 
fall edition. Any advice will be welcomed. Thanks 
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RE: navigational keys in FX and now in jaws

[Dennis Long via Talk]

You need the new version of Jaws and you should be fine.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of brice Mijares via Talk
Sent: Thursday, October 26, 2017 10:02 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: brice Mijares
Subject: navigational keys in FX and now in jaws

  Ever since windows 10 fall update that came out last week, I cant 
navigate web pages using firefox with Jaws   or window eyes. I removed 
FX 56.x and installed FX 52.4 and still no navigational keys  using either
screen reader. NVDA works fine though. Before update Jaws to 2018, I need to
know why I lost navigational keys using wineyes and jaws. Any  help would be
appreciated.
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RE: SPAM: Re: Steps to Change JAWS Voice

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Lol I like the way he is by default.  Press insert j press enter on options go 
down to voices.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Natalie via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 5:12 PM
To: net bat via Talk
Cc: Natalie
Subject: Re: SPAM: Re: Steps to Change JAWS Voice

Do you have any idea how to change tone of voice?  I love Reed but with JAWS he 
sounds like he's just been woken up from a deep sleep.  I'd like to keep that 
voice but change the tone.


Natalie Johnson


On 10/24/2017 4:52 PM, net bat via Talk wrote:
> as far as getting more voices, open the jaws menu with jaws key j. go 
> to help. in there is the option to get more voices.
>
>
> -Original Message- From: Terry D. Eagle via Talk
> Sent: Tuesday, October 24, 2017 12:39 PM
> To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
> Cc: Terry D. Eagle
> Subject: Steps to Change JAWS Voice
>
> Hi,
>
>
>
> Will someone please provide me with the keyboard steps to select and 
> save a different JAWS voice?
>
>
>
> I also understand there are additional voices that can be downloaded from
> online site, but I cannot locate the website.
>
>
>
> Thanks.
>
>
>
> Terry
>
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
> http://www.avg.com
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RE: how to use any burn

[Dennis Long via Talk]

They might do that.  They did it for me a few months ago.


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of michael fridey via Talk
Sent: Thursday, October 19, 2017 5:55 AM
To: John Covici via Talk
Cc: michael fridey
Subject: Re: how to use any burn

Hi John i just do a control c to copy files then go to the dvd drive and do
a control v to paste it.

asit was said that it sounds like you do not have a full copy of WE.

I got a link sent to me by Doug before he left.

So now i can instal WE at any time i would email VFO and ask if they can
email you a link of the last full version of we.

Cheers Michael.


On 18/10/2017 9:10 PM, John Covici via Talk wrote:
> You will not be able to install it from the cd, if you could  not 
> install it from your downloads folder.
>
> On Wed, 18 Oct 2017 03:40:20 -0400,
> mack via Talk wrote:
>> i want to put my copy of the 9.5.4 w/e upgrade on a dvd using anyburn 
>> what are the steps to do this. the file is in my downloads folder, 
>> thanks
>>
>> --
>> from Mack
>>
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--
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RE: an NFL query

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Try installing flash.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Jesse delMuro via Talk
Sent: Sunday, October 15, 2017 1:57 AM
To: Tom Kingston via Talk
Cc: Jesse delMuro
Subject: an NFL query

Hi guys!  Just wondering, how to enable playback in Internet Explorer of NFL 
Audiopass?  I know it works since it plays in Firefox but am not sure what 
setting or icon to change.


I can _use Firefox but seem to favor IE and am not sure how, or what, to 
enable to make it go in IE as it does in Firefox so any help much appreciated.

Timeas gone by, all I needed was Flash and it hummed like that. 
Anyway, in 2017, not sure how to enable playback in IE, similar to that in 
Firefox.  Again, thanks and any help much appreciated.
Jesse
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RE: WE and transferring exception dictionary to Jaws

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I believe it lives in your user settings of Jaws a good question for the
Jaws List I gave you earlier.  The subscribe address is below.  If I can be
anymore help to anyone else feel free to ask I am here to help.
vjaws-users-list-j...@jaws-users.com

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Jeff Samco via Talk
Sent: Friday, October 13, 2017 8:59 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Jeff Samco
Subject: WE and transferring exception dictionary to Jaws

I just took the plunge and began learning Jaws this afternoon. Is there a
way of transferring all my WE exception dictionary entries over to Jaws? I
know the WE dictionary is merely a text file. Is this true for Jaws? If so,
where would I find that file?

Thanks,
Jeff

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RE: How to get web browse control labels to be spoken after the associated text

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Jeff subscribe to this Jaws list.  The VFO product manager posts on it every
once in a while.
jaws-users-list-j...@jaws-users.com
it's a very helpful Jaws list.
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Jeff Samco via Talk
Sent: Friday, October 13, 2017 9:02 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Jeff Samco
Subject: How to get web browse control labels to be spoken after the
associated text

As I'm learning Jaws I prefer having the control labels like link and button
spoken after the associated text. The default is spoken before. How can I
change this?
Thanks,
Jeff

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RE: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I think reserving
 Judgment until after the jaws 2018 cycle is complete and jaws2019 is out.
You don't know what they have planned for the year.  They may have had the
first features planned for a while possible before the got window Eyes.
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Charles Adkins via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2017 6:41 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Charles Adkins
Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts

let me make one thing clear, I am not bitter. I am not sure about what merge
is being talked about, Window-eyes was dropped, not merged with Jaws. My
point was Vfo had the chance to retain the best of Window-eyes and jaws in
both technology and people and produce one hell of a screen reader unlike
anything the world has ever seen and they chose not to do that, they just
trashed their "compeditor" completely like they never existed. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 11, 2017, at 5:05 AM, Rod Hutton via Talk
 wrote:
> 
> Hi Josh,
> 
> As for Office support in NVDA, as I am subscribed to Office 365, and will
be for the  foreseeable future, I will be using NVDA to navigate it should
Window-Eyes no longer suffice.
> I've been keeping my ear to the ground, though, and I know that Office
support for NVDA is a high priority.
> We'll keep everyone posted.
> As I've said, I will not be using the offering of the enemy of GW Micro.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Rod
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk 
> [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
> Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
> Sent: October 10, 2017 6:11 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
> Cc: Josh Kennedy 
> Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts
> 
> oh  well then maybe I will just stay with NVDA and I may not bother 
> buying jaws, not sure yet. I heard jaws has better microsoft office 
> support than NVDA does. But maybe that is no longer true?
> 
> 
> 
>> On 10/10/2017 1:33 PM, net bat via Talk wrote:
>> you might as well junk it now.
>> 2018 release will be in about 2 weeks.
>> f s has had the same 27 years as window eyes had  and it still 
>> doesn't work as good.
>> i can't even pay my credit card with it. a web page that is suppose 
>> to be jaws compatible doesn't work.
>> window eyes works fine.
>> money talks. if gwmicro was the one that had all the money it would 
>> of been f s that would be out of business now.
>> 
>> -Original Message- From: Bob Tinney via Talk
>> Sent: Tuesday, October 10, 2017 7:01 AM
>> To: Chuck Adkins via Talk
>> Cc: Bob Tinney
>> Subject: Re: Window-eyes and Jaws, thoughts
>> 
>> Chuck,
>> 
>> 
>> I agree with you!  My s m as were carried over from W E, but when I 
>> have to pay for an upgrade, Jaws will disappear from my computer.
>> 
>> Bob, K8LR, tinn...@charter.net
>> 
>>> On 10/10/2017 8:33 AM, Chuck Adkins via Talk wrote:
>>> Well, I've been using Jaws for a while now and I must confess the 
>>> Window-eyes was the much better product both in speed, browsing, 
>>> usability, layout, and so much more. Like on the Ohio Lottery 
>>> Website, when reading the pick 5 Jaws will not scroll down 
>>> continuously down the page like NVDA, Narrator, and Window-eyes do. 
>>> I also find Window-eyes synthesizer support was much better. I am 
>>> not whining, I am just bemoaning the fact that a company got by with 
>>> trashing a product completely, borrowing or using nothing from the 
>>> product they trashed and acting like Window-eyes never existed, not 
>>> to mention charging so much for the product. Don't give me that 
>>> similar stuff, because I've found webpages where Jaws just doesn't 
>>> work and NVDA and Narrator do.
>>> 
>>> So why won't I just shut up? I will, just wanted to point out in my 
>>> view what I've realized, and hopefully NVDA, Narrator and others 
>>> will be able to say Thank You to VFO for pushing us to a day when a 
>>> 2 thousand dollar screen reader is no longer need.
>>> 
>>> Thanks for reading, I'm now shutting up.
>>> ___
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>>> the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>> 
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>>>
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>> 
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>> 
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>>
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st.net.
>> For subscription 

RE: Latest Firefox, and accessibility

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Jaws won't interfere.  And yes you would use one of your 3 installs of jaws if 
you removed it and re installed.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of David via Talk
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2017 8:31 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List; Lloyd Rasmussen
Cc: David
Subject: Re: Latest Firefox, and accessibility

Seems this is going to be the kind of never-ending story.


This morning, I had to restart my computer for some reason. After rebooting, 
all the sudden I do see the same behavior in Firefox, as reported by others. 
You can turn off Browse mode, and tab around the website. You can reach all the 
menus. But with browse mode turned on, there is absolutely no luck in having 
WinEyes read anything to you.


Now, i would not let this throw me off. I have been experimenting quite a bit 
here now, and here is at least some kind of a workaround. Wonder if some of you 
- who have trouble with Firefox 56 - please could report back if you see the 
same behavior.


1. Open Firefox.

2. Open any website of your choice, by typing in the address in the address 
bar, and hitting enter, just like you have always done.

3. The site comes up, but you cannot navigate it with WinEyes.

4. Try turn off Browse mode, and now use tab. Do you hear the different links 
and controls spoken?


Then the workaround.

1. with all firefox windows closed, open Firefox, and direct it to any 
website you might like.

2. Hit Ctrl-N, and a new session of Firefox will open in a separate window.

3. In this new window, open any website you desire - even the very same 
one you opened in the first window.

3. The website in the new ((or second) window, can be navigated just 
like ever before.

4. Go back to the first window you had opened with Firefox, and close it 
with F4.

5. From here, keep navigating Firefox as much as you like, in the newest 
window. You even can open as many windows and tabs as you want, and 
WinEyes seems to work just fine.


The ones of you, who have been able to work with Firefox 56 so far, have 
you rebooted your computer after updating to this version? If not, I am 
starting to wondering if there could be something going on.


Why I had to reboot my computer this morning, was because I had started 
Jaws, and it reported that an update for version 18.04 was available. 
After updating, it requested the computer rebooted.


Funny thing is, that yesterday my WinEyes worked perfectly well with 
Firefox 56. This morning, updating Jaws and then rebooting the computer, 
my WinEyes starts to have trouble with Firefox.


Sure, it all would be coincidents, wouldn't it? And of course, we could 
go on asking if anyone who are having no trouble with WinEyes in 
Firefox, also do not have Jaws installed, or even have not updated their 
Jaws version. i would have been willing to uninstall Jaws, just to make 
sure there is no cross-over issues, but would that not cause me to use 
an extra Jaws installation when reinstalling it on the computer? Or, 
does Jaws recognize it has already been installed here before, and hence 
abstain from counting the new reinstallation against my three available 
installations under the license? I really would have been willing to 
say, there would be no way for Jaws to interfere, all the time only 
WinEyes is loaded on the computer. But still, it all makes me wonder a bit.


OK, I could live with the extra hazzle, of always opening a Firefox 
session, and then hitting Ctrl-n, and start my browsing from the new 
session. The thing that now puzzles me, is why things work in the second 
session, but never in the first, of Firefox. Could that be due to some 
bug in the browser, or is the second session opening with different 
settings - deep down in the hundreds of settings of the browser? Wonder 
if a report to Mozilla would bring some clarification here, but not sure 
where or how to submit any bug report to the Mozilla team.


To spin a little bit further on the whole issue, I did try Firefox in 
its dedicated safe mode, and there I was able to navigate with WinEyes. 
it of course might all be due to some kind of add-on, that troubles 
WinEyes in the newest Firefox version. But that all will have to be 
determined through intensified further investigation.


Till now, these are my findings, and I hope others can contribute with 
further findings, confirmations and ideas for solutions. Somehow seems 
we have to trace exactly what causes the issue, before we can start 
determining if WinEyes and Firefox 56+ can ever be made to work 
hand-in-hand.


All just for your information.


On 10/7/2017 7:02 PM, Evan Reese via Talk wrote:
> That was me, using WE 8.4 on a Windows 7 laptop with Firefox 56.0 32 bit.
> I just had it open and went to three different sites, including the 
> BARD site. It works the same as always for me.
> Evan
>
> -Original Message- From: Lloyd Rasmussen via Talk
> Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2017 

RE: "stand-by" ? mode in jaws

[Dennis Long via Talk]

My bad I hit d instead of s.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2017 4:58 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Carol and Roger
Subject: Re: "stand-by" ? mode in jaws

Hi Dennis,

Using insert-spacebar is the primary task.  The second letter determines
what is done.  Ducking is done, with versions of Windows above 8, by
pressing D after insert-space.  The insert-space and then the letter s is
used to mute the synthesizer.  There is a list of commands that can be used
with insert-space available by pressing insert-space and then the question
mark.

Carol



On 10/4/2017 3:26 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
> This controls audio ducking which is not available in windows7.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk 
> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
> On Behalf Of Micallef Michael at FITA via Talk
> Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2017 3:13 PM
> To: bjn...@windstream.net; Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Micallef Michael at FITA
> Subject: RE: "stand-by" ? mode in jaws
>
> Press insert+spacebar+s to shut off the speech and then repeat the 
> steps to get the speech back.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk
> [mailto:talk-bounces+michael.micallef=gov...@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
> Behalf Of Brenda via Talk
> Sent: Wednesday, October 4, 2017 4:10 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Brenda
> Subject: "stand-by" ? mode in jaws
>
> Hi List,
>
> I thought I ran across something about a function in jaws where you 
> can put it in "stand-by" ? mode so a sighted person can use the 
> computer without actually shutting jaws down?
>
> If so how do you do that?
>
> Thanks for any input.
> brenda
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RE: My SMA purchase experience

[Dennis Long via Talk]

That and they probably had to verify everyones status with WindowEyes as
well.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Carol and Roger via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2017 5:03 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Carol and Roger
Subject: Re: My SMA purchase experience

Well, of course, there could have been a real bottleneck back when the
migration was taking place.  After all, I wonder how many WE users took
advantage of the offer during those couple of months.  And, of course, there
was still the normal amount of Jaws, etc. business.

Carol


On 10/4/2017 3:50 PM, Joseph Norton via Talk wrote:
> Hi listers:
>
> This is the first (and probably only) time I get to use an SMA, but, I
took the plunge and ordered it.
>
> I have to say VFO is pretty quick when upgrading to an SMA.  I ordered it
yesterday and within a few minutes, the activation server showed the change
to version 18.0 plus 2.
>
> This certainly seems quicker than the migration purchases.
>
> One has to wonder why the migration purchases  couldn't be executed in the
same amount of time.
>
> Anyway, I am covered for the next 2 years, if needed.
>
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
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RE: "stand-by" ? mode in jaws

[Dennis Long via Talk]

This controls audio ducking which is not available in windows7.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Micallef Michael at FITA via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, October 04, 2017 3:13 PM
To: bjn...@windstream.net; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Micallef Michael at FITA
Subject: RE: "stand-by" ? mode in jaws

Press insert+spacebar+s to shut off the speech and then repeat the steps to
get the speech back.

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+michael.micallef=gov...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Brenda via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, October 4, 2017 4:10 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Brenda
Subject: "stand-by" ? mode in jaws

Hi List,

I thought I ran across something about a function in jaws where you can put
it in "stand-by" ? mode so a sighted person can use the computer without
actually shutting jaws down?

If so how do you do that?

Thanks for any input.
brenda
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RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I get this message.
Page Not Found
Is the link not right?


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of bj colt via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 5:23 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: bj colt
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi Denniws,

Here is the link to their web site. They have reduced it even further. You
can subscribe a month at a time or yearly. Annualy is of course much
cheaper. I am running windows 7 and it works great.

http://www.nordvpn.com/nord/vpn




-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 9:12 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Can you please send a link to there website?  Is there windows app
accessible.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of bj colt via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 3:46 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: bj colt
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi Dennis,

It is called Nord vpn. When I first installed it. The accessibility was
almost non existant but it is around 95 per cent accessible now. I contacted
them and they have done everything to help with accessibility. It costs $45
or thereabouts per year. I know there are free ones out there but I like
this one.

Live long and prosper, John

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 8:33 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

What vpn service are you using?

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of bj colt via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 12:43 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: bj colt
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi Dennis,

I agree but intend to keep using firefox till it bites the dust. Although I
use a vpn and I got an email it can now work with cdhrome. I might give that
a try.

Live long and prosper, John

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 5:33 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

If your using windows7 and are willing to jump through hoops IE use internet
explorer reinstall fire fox everytime it updates etc you will be fine for a
few years.  Do I think in 3 years you will be able to use WE on win10?  NO.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tony C via Talk
Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2017 7:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Tony C
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Yep! I've noticed that everytime Windows updates that WE develops more and
more glitches. It's becoming less and less useable.

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 8:54 PM
To: mattc...@verizon.net ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Unfortunately I don't think you can do much.  This is what will happen more
and more with WE.  Jaws updated to fix  a firefox release.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Matthew Chao via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 9:37 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Matthew Chao
Subject: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi, any Window-Eyes Users Still Out There.  I just updated Firefox, and when
I try to navigate with MSAA mode on, I just get a ding where before I could
go up and down the page.  How can I change it so it works?  What
happened?--Matthew Chao.
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Any views or opinions

RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Can you please send a link to there website?  Is there windows app
accessible.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of bj colt via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 3:46 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: bj colt
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi Dennis,

It is called Nord vpn. When I first installed it. The accessibility was
almost non existant but it is around 95 per cent accessible now. I contacted
them and they have done everything to help with accessibility. It costs $45
or thereabouts per year. I know there are free ones out there but I like
this one.

Live long and prosper, John

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 8:33 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

What vpn service are you using?

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of bj colt via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 12:43 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: bj colt
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi Dennis,

I agree but intend to keep using firefox till it bites the dust. Although I
use a vpn and I got an email it can now work with cdhrome. I might give that
a try.

Live long and prosper, John

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 5:33 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

If your using windows7 and are willing to jump through hoops IE use internet
explorer reinstall fire fox everytime it updates etc you will be fine for a
few years.  Do I think in 3 years you will be able to use WE on win10?  NO.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tony C via Talk
Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2017 7:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Tony C
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Yep! I've noticed that everytime Windows updates that WE develops more and
more glitches. It's becoming less and less useable.

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 8:54 PM
To: mattc...@verizon.net ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Unfortunately I don't think you can do much.  This is what will happen more
and more with WE.  Jaws updated to fix  a firefox release.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Matthew Chao via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 9:37 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Matthew Chao
Subject: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi, any Window-Eyes Users Still Out There.  I just updated Firefox, and when
I try to navigate with MSAA mode on, I just get a ding where before I could
go up and down the page.  How can I change it so it works?  What
happened?--Matthew Chao.
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RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

[Dennis Long via Talk]

What vpn service are you using?

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of bj colt via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 12:43 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: bj colt
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi Dennis,

I agree but intend to keep using firefox till it bites the dust. Although I
use a vpn and I got an email it can now work with cdhrome. I might give that
a try.

Live long and prosper, John

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2017 5:33 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

If your using windows7 and are willing to jump through hoops IE use internet
explorer reinstall fire fox everytime it updates etc you will be fine for a
few years.  Do I think in 3 years you will be able to use WE on win10?  NO.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tony C via Talk
Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2017 7:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Tony C
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Yep! I've noticed that everytime Windows updates that WE develops more and
more glitches. It's becoming less and less useable.

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 8:54 PM
To: mattc...@verizon.net ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Unfortunately I don't think you can do much.  This is what will happen more
and more with WE.  Jaws updated to fix  a firefox release.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Matthew Chao via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 9:37 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Matthew Chao
Subject: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi, any Window-Eyes Users Still Out There.  I just updated Firefox, and when
I try to navigate with MSAA mode on, I just get a ding where before I could
go up and down the page.  How can I change it so it works?  What
happened?--Matthew Chao.
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RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

[Dennis Long via Talk]

If your using windows7 and are willing to jump through hoops IE use internet
explorer reinstall fire fox everytime it updates etc you will be fine for a
few years.  Do I think in 3 years you will be able to use WE on win10?  NO.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Tony C via Talk
Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2017 7:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Tony C
Subject: Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Yep! I've noticed that everytime Windows updates that WE develops more and
more glitches. It's becoming less and less useable.

-Original Message-
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 8:54 PM
To: mattc...@verizon.net ; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Unfortunately I don't think you can do much.  This is what will happen more
and more with WE.  Jaws updated to fix  a firefox release.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Matthew Chao via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 9:37 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Matthew Chao
Subject: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi, any Window-Eyes Users Still Out There.  I just updated Firefox, and when
I try to navigate with MSAA mode on, I just get a ding where before I could
go up and down the page.  How can I change it so it works?  What
happened?--Matthew Chao.
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Re: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Yes you can. Its in the firefox settings.

Sent from my Android phone using Aqua Mail



On September 30, 2017 10:58:30 PM Butch Bussen via Talk
 wrote:

> This is not good.  I  still use window-eyes and fire fox.  Wonder if I
> can tell it not to update?
> 73
> Butch
> WA0VJR
> Node 3148
> Wallace, ks.
>
>
> On Sat, 30 Sep 2017, Lloyd Rasmussen via Talk
> wrote:
>
>>   Version 56 has come out in the last few days. VFO said in their release
>> notes that they had done some work to prepare for version 57, which comes out
>> some time in November.
>> I thought I had been successfully running version 56 on a couple of other
>> computers, but now I'm not quite so sure. Tonight I updated my Windows 7
>> laptop to version 56. At first, no SET file was being loaded; Window-Eyes
>> didn't seem to recognize the correct file association for Firefox. Then,
>> reading in the Control Panel and back out to Firefox, it began to associate
>> with Firefox.set. But this didn't seem to help. I can still read the items in
>> the tab order if MSAA mode is off, but this isn't helpful in reading the full
>> contents of a page. More investigation is called for, but this may be an
>> early warning sign of the lack of support for Window-Eyes. I'm not giving up
>> yet, but passing along my findings.
>>
>>
>>
>> Lloyd Rasmussen, Kensington, MD
>> http://lras.home.sprynet.com
>> -Original Message- From: Matthew Chao via Talk
>> Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 9:37 PM
>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: Matthew Chao
>> Subject: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate
>>
>> Hi, any Window-Eyes Users Still Out There.  I just updated Firefox, and
>> when I try to navigate with MSAA mode on, I just get a ding where before
>> I could go up and down the page.  How can I change it so it works?  What
>> happened?--Matthew Chao.
>> ___
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>> and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
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>>
>>
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RE: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Unfortunately I don't think you can do much.  This is what will happen more
and more with WE.  Jaws updated to fix  a firefox release.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Matthew Chao via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 30, 2017 9:37 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Matthew Chao
Subject: Firefox Updated and Unable to Navigate

Hi, any Window-Eyes Users Still Out There.  I just updated Firefox, and when
I try to navigate with MSAA mode on, I just get a ding where before I could
go up and down the page.  How can I change it so it works?  What
happened?--Matthew Chao.
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Deck talk fixed in Jaws 18 latest version

[Dennis Long via Talk]

. Resolved a customer reported issue where changes to voice profile settings
were not being honored for the DECTalk USB hardware synthesizer.



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RE: App Central.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Could someone please  upload all the apps to send space drop box or the like
for easy grabbing?
  Thanks.
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Jeff Weiss via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2017 11:43 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Jeff Weiss
Subject: Re: App Central.


Goto App Central and get a package called InstallPackages.wepm When you
install this app you have several options right in the dialog about how many
packages you want to see:
all
new
updates
both (which means new packages and updates)

Choose all
It will say there are 171 packages, but the first one is a blank package
that should have been removed.  When you try to download it, the app says
error--but don't worry, the rest will be downloaded when you tab to get
packages.
press enter and you will be prompted for a folder to store apps.
I use
c:\apps
Type that in and press enter.
All the packages listed will be downloaded to your computer.

hth,
Jeff Weiss


gl
-Original Message-
From: Robin via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2017 4:32 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Robin
Subject: App Central.

some one gave instructions how to download all of the those apps on App
Central.
I have mislayed those instructions so if anyone can help i would be
greatfull.
many thanks.
Cheers Robin.
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RE: webaim screen reader survey

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I contacted them someone guessed the link.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Kevin Huber via Talk
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2017 10:33 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Kevin Huber
Subject: Re: webaim screen reader survey

Hi Josh:
I opened the link to the Webaim survey and all it said was, "the survey will
soon be available".

Kevin Huber


On 9/12/17, Josh Kennedy via Talk  wrote:
> hi
>
> the new webaim screen reader survey is out if you want to take it.
>
>
> http://webaim.org/projects/screenreadersurvey7/
>
>
>
> --
> sent with mozilla thunderbird
>
> --
> sent with mozilla thunderbird
>
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RE: window-eyes open source?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

urrently managed. But there is something about being the
>   >> biggest and only one in town. You also will have to deal with ALL the
>   >> queries. And, though the world map looks far more International today
>   >> than two decades ago, many customers are facing ecconomic issues that
>   >> might affect their chances of buying a wildly priced product. Somehow,
>   >> we could think this to be some of the consequences of the WEForOffice
>   >> program, which did open up for even the less bolstered wallet to provide
>   >> the needy one with a full-fledged screen reader. Now that this program
>   >> eventually will be obsolete, NVDA might be the choice -even the ONLY
>   >> choice - for many a private user. Or, they might - if their activity
>   >> does not rely solely on Windows - leave the whole computer world
>   >> together, and go mobile.
>   >>
>   >>
>   >> The somehow dominant position VFO has taken at the moment, might hence
>   >> not be the fact we see tomorrow. That will all depend much on what
>   >> happens in the electronic world all generally. A decade ago, prior to
>   >> the first IPhone, everyone would have claimed that Windows was here to
>   >> stay. Then came the first IPhone, then the IPad, and today many a user
>   >> does not even own a computer any longer. Recently, I did see a
>   >> relatively up-to-date Android device, straight from the store shelf,
>   >> with all warrantees intact, advertised well under 100 dollars. Turn it
>   >> on, hold two fingers anywhere on the screen, and your device is fully
>   >> loaded with a screen reader, in less than five minutes. Just HOW well
>   >> will Jaws face that figure? Buy yourself a computer for anything from
>   >> 300 to 1500 dollars, invest another 1200 dollars of software, add on
>   >> 1200 for the screen reader; spend an hour or two in installing,
>   >> licensing and updating your brand new pet. Guess you see my point. You
>   >> do all of this, should you need to. But for the user who doesn't 
> need to?
>   >>
>   >>
>   >> Further, keep in mind, that many who turns blind today, already are
>   >> quite familiar with Android and Phone/Ipad products. Being the kind of
>   >> equipment many - even school kids - now aday are acquainted with, they
>   >> might not even have the skills needed for starting out with a computer.
>   >> Turning blind today, you don't have one or two years to spend in a
>   >> special institution for the blind, hoping to learn something
>   >> old-fashioned, then imagining yourself getting back into some kind of a
>   >> daily living. You simply HAVE TO get going more or less right away. And
>   >> since you already own the mobile device, and all you need is to activate
>   >> the screen reader pre-installed on it, you soon enough will choose that
>   >> avenue. Should you now, in addition want to get your computer going for
>   >> certain tasks, why go through all the hazzle of raising the 1200
>   >> dollars, when you can be in business simply by downloading and
>   >> installing NVDA, and be up running in less than ten minutes? You know,
>   >> you don't even need two eyes to download it for you; you've got Narrator
>   >> for that part of the job.
>   >>
>   >>
>   >> Again, Jaws might be well enough for those of us who have more heavy
>   >> needs on the Windows-based systems. But as time moves on, we likely will
>   >> slide in the background. Tomorrow's user, likely won't need Jaws, and
>   >> can enjoy a heavy good load of donuts and coffee, for the 1200 saved. :)
>   >>
>   >>
>   >> David
>   >>
>   >> On 9/11/2017 12:54 AM, Loy via Talk wrote:
>   >>> NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it 
> happening that people will download the free program instead of paying 
> hundreds of dollars for a very similar program.
>   >>> - Original Message -
>   >>> From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
>   >>> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>   >>> Cc: Josh Kennedy
>   >>> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
>   >>> Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
>   >>>
>   >>>
>   >>> Why couldn't it happen?
>   >>>
>   >>>
>   >>>
>   >>> On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>   >>> > I don't see that happening.
>   >>> >
> 

RE: window-eyes open source?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Agree with you!

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Marvin Commerford via Talk
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2017 8:59 AM
To: Josh Kennedy via Talk
Cc: Marvin Commerford
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

Big surprise!  You've clearly demonstrated over time that you want something
for nothing.  Harping on WE becoming open source has as much chance of being
successful as all of us getting sight.  This nagging behavior sometimes
works for children with exhausted parents but this case is much larger than
that.  Demonstrate support for the open source concept by supporting
projects that use that model.  I'm also not happy about what has happened to
WE but the sun still comes up every day.  I didn't get my way with this
situation so it's time to move on.

On 9/9/2017 9:37 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
> NVDA is fine to use. I like its business model better than VFO's 
> business model.
> 
> 
> 
> On 9/9/2017 10:14 PM, mr. Chikodinaka Nickarandidum Oguledo via Talk
wrote:
>> your brakeing the law! you court room jude judy or juje patricia 
>> dimigao in the court room
>>
>> On 9/9/17, Tom Kingston via Talk  wrote:
>>> Your question makes absolutely no sense in the context of this 
>>> discussion. NVDA's business model has no correlation to VFO's 
>>> ownership of Window-Eyes.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 9/9/2017 9:40 PM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
 then how does NVDA work the way it does? and how is it so successful?



 On 9/9/2017 9:37 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
> Your board of directors would not allow you to spend a pile of 
> money to purchase your competitor and then allow you to put that 
> competitor right back in business against you. And no business 
> owner with a drop of sense would want to do it anyway. Businesses 
> like Apple, google, and Microsoft buy a heap of smaller businesses 
> every year. They don't do so to turn around and give them away. FS 
> is no doubt picking through the Window-Eyes code looking for ways 
> to improve JAWS or features to add.
>
> On 9/9/2017 9:19 PM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
>> if I no longer cared about the product then yes I probably would 
>> turn around and just open source it. if the product was no longer 
>> supported by my business I'd just tell people do what you want 
>> with it, we moved on. take it apart, open source it, whatever. we 
>> do not care.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 9/9/2017 9:14 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
>>> No. Think about it. If you were in business and bought your 
>>> number one competitor would you turn around and give it away for 
>>> someone else to continue its development?
>>>
>>>
>>> On 9/9/2017 9:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
 hi

 Is there any possibility since window eyes is no longer 
 supported to get the window-eyes source code make it open 
 source and put it up on the github website? then other 
 developers could keep developing window eyes.


>>> ___
>>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those 
>>> of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>>
>>> For membership options, visit
>>>
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/joshuakennedy2
01%40comcast.net. 
>>>
>>> For subscription options, visit
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>> List archives can be found at
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>> --
>> sent with mozilla thunderbird
>>
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of 
> the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
> For membership options, visit
>
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/joshuakennedy2
01%40comcast.net. 
>
> For subscription options, visit
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
> List archives can be found at
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
 --
 sent with mozilla thunderbird

>>> ___
>>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of 
>>> the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>>
>>> For membership options, visit
>>>
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/ochikodinaka%4
0gmail.com. 
>>>
>>> For subscription options, visit
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>> List archives can be found at
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>>
>>
> 
___
Any views or 

RE: window-eyes open source?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

No you don't dictation bridge is being developed for jaws it won't cost
$400.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Monday, September 11, 2017 7:42 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

NVDA works with dragon naturally speaking, and windows speech recognition,
and it does it for free, with an addon called dictation bridge. with jaws
you have to pay an extra $400 or so for that functionality.



On 9/10/2017 11:51 PM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:
> The problem is that FS has too much of a monopoly in the paid market.
> Monopolies are illegal.
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
> Behalf Of Dennis Long via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 8:51 PM
> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
> Cc: Dennis Long
> Subject: RE: window-eyes open source?
>
> It is far from being as good as jaws!
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk 
> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
> On Behalf Of Loy via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 6:55 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Loy
> Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
>
> NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it happening 
> that people will download the free program instead of paying hundreds 
> of dollars for a very similar program.
>- Original Message -
>From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
>To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>Cc: Josh Kennedy
>Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
>Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
>
>
>Why couldn't it happen?
>
>
>
>On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>> I don't see that happening.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk
> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
> Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
>> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
>> To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: Josh Kennedy
>> Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
>>
>> I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their 
> business profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more 
> popular than jaws and would still be open source?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
>>> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
>>> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
>>> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a 
> quick look at facts.
>>>
>>> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone
software,
>>> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been 
> pretty easy.
>>> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
>>> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
>>>
>>> Things are not that easy!
>>> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
>>> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with
-
>>> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
>>> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these
techniques
>>> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
>>> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
>>> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of
the
>>> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for
unwanted
>>> activity, or even malware development.
>>>
>>> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many
of
>>> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
>>> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
>>> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
>>> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
>>> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
>>> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather 
> details, and process them for you.
>>> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
>>> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under
the
>>> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
>>> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By do

RE: window-eyes open source?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Iagree.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Nick Sarames via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 11:54 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Nick Sarames
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

Just because something dominates a market, doesn't mean it is a monopoly.

On 9/10/2017 11:51 PM, Sky Mundell via Talk wrote:
> The problem is that FS has too much of a monopoly in the paid market.
> Monopolies are illegal.
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+skyt=shaw...@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
> Behalf Of Dennis Long via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 8:51 PM
> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
> Cc: Dennis Long
> Subject: RE: window-eyes open source?
> 
> It is far from being as good as jaws!
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk 
> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
> On Behalf Of Loy via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 6:55 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Loy
> Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
> 
> NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it happening 
> that people will download the free program instead of paying hundreds 
> of dollars for a very similar program.
>- Original Message -
>From: Josh Kennedy via Talk
>To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>Cc: Josh Kennedy
>Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
>Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
> 
> 
>Why couldn't it happen?
> 
> 
> 
>On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
>> I don't see that happening.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk
> [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
> Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
>> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
>> To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
>> Cc: Josh Kennedy
>> Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
>>
>> I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their 
> business profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more 
> popular than jaws and would still be open source?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
>>> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
>>> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
>>> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a 
> quick look at facts.
>>>
>>> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone
software,
>>> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been 
> pretty easy.
>>> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
>>> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
>>>
>>> Things are not that easy!
>>> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
>>> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with
-
>>> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
>>> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these
techniques
>>> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
>>> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
>>> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of
the
>>> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for
unwanted
>>> activity, or even malware development.
>>>
>>> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many
of
>>> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
>>> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
>>> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
>>> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
>>> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
>>> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather 
> details, and process them for you.
>>> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
>>> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under
the
>>> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
>>> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
>>> cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code
of
>>> the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.
>>

RE: window-eyes open source?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

It is far from being as good as jaws!

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 6:55 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Loy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

NVDA is not far from being as good as JAWS and  I can see it happening that
people will download the free program instead of paying hundreds of dollars
for a very similar program.
  - Original Message - 
  From: Josh Kennedy via Talk 
  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
  Cc: Josh Kennedy 
  Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 4:23 PM
  Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?


  Why couldn't it happen?



  On 9/10/2017 3:47 PM, Dennis Long via Talk wrote:
  > I don't see that happening.
  >
  > -Original Message-
  > From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf
Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
  > Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
  > To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
  > Cc: Josh Kennedy
  > Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?
  >
  > I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business
profits? If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than jaws
and would still be open source?
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
  >> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the
  >> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get
  >> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick look
at facts.
  >>
  >> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software,
  >> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty
easy.
  >> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop
  >> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
  >>
  >> Things are not that easy!
  >> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better
  >> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with -
  >> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of
  >> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques
  >> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the
  >> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to
  >> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the
  >> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted
  >> activity, or even malware development.
  >>
  >> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of
  >> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app
  >> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This
  >> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and
  >> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity.
  >> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like
  >> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather details,
and process them for you.
  >> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the
  >> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the
  >> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble
  >> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the
  >> cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of
  >> the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.
  >>
  >> Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing
  >> the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
  >> They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer,
  >> thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might
  >> sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a
  >> message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had
  >> broken the cryptizer.
  >>
  >> Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps
  >> directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the
  >> servers of GW. It is unlikely that they want to have these credencials
  >> open-sourced. In particular so, if you remember the attack someone
  >> gave them a few years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked,
  >> and gave many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on
  >> their computer, and got a threatening message on their screen.
  >>
  >> Mind you, GW got into a cooperation with Microsoft, when they
  >> introduced the WEForOffice program. Even here, they told that this
  >> agreement 

RE: window-eyes open source?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Your giving it more credit then it deserves.  It doesn't cut into jaws as
much as you claim.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Saturday, September 09, 2017 9:40 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

then how does NVDA work the way it does? and how is it so successful?



On 9/9/2017 9:37 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
> Your board of directors would not allow you to spend a pile of money 
> to purchase your competitor and then allow you to put that competitor 
> right back in business against you. And no business owner with a drop 
> of sense would want to do it anyway. Businesses like Apple, google, 
> and Microsoft buy a heap of smaller businesses every year. They don't 
> do so to turn around and give them away. FS is no doubt picking 
> through the Window-Eyes code looking for ways to improve JAWS or 
> features to add.
>
> On 9/9/2017 9:19 PM, Josh Kennedy wrote:
>> if I no longer cared about the product then yes I probably would turn 
>> around and just open source it. if the product was no longer 
>> supported by my business I'd just tell people do what you want with 
>> it, we moved on. take it apart, open source it, whatever. we do not 
>> care.
>>
>>
>>
>> On 9/9/2017 9:14 PM, Tom Kingston via Talk wrote:
>>> No. Think about it. If you were in business and bought your number 
>>> one competitor would you turn around and give it away for someone 
>>> else to continue its development?
>>>
>>>
>>> On 9/9/2017 9:01 PM, Josh Kennedy via Talk wrote:
 hi

 Is there any possibility since window eyes is no longer supported 
 to get the window-eyes source code make it open source and put it 
 up on the github website? then other developers could keep 
 developing window eyes.


>>> ___
>>> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of 
>>> the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>>
>>> For membership options, visit
>>>
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/joshuakennedy2
01%40comcast.net.
>>> For subscription options, visit
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>> List archives can be found at
>>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
>>
>> --
>> sent with mozilla thunderbird
>>
> ___
> Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the 
> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>
> For membership options, visit
>
http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/joshuakennedy2
01%40comcast.net.
> For subscription options, visit
> http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
> List archives can be found at
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--
sent with mozilla thunderbird

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and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.

For membership options, visit
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RE: window-eyes open source?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I don't see that happening.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Josh Kennedy via Talk
Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2017 1:08 PM
To: David; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Josh Kennedy
Subject: Re: window-eyes open source?

I wonder what VFO would do if NVDA starting eating into their business profits? 
If free open source NVDA would become way more popular than jaws and would 
still be open source?




On 9/10/2017 2:54 AM, David wrote:
> Matter of fact, this question was raised a couple of days after the 
> anouncement of the discontinued development of WinEyes. I will get 
> back to what Doug said back then. First of all, let's take a quick look at 
> facts.
>
> Had it been as easy as WinEyes would have been a stand-alone software, 
> with all its coding done 'in-house', things would have been pretty easy.
> And had it been that Doug and Dan had been the only ones to develop 
> the software, they could have decided whatever they wanted.
>
> Things are not that easy!
> First of all, what doug pointed out, was that to get the better 
> functionality of WinEyes, they had to reach certain agreements with - 
> for instance Adobe - to get access to third-party software, kind of 
> behind the scene. If they open-sourced the code, now these techniques 
> might be disclosed to the public, threatening the products of the 
> third-party manufacturer. In turn, this of course would lead to 
> people, not working on assistive technology at all, to get hold of the 
> key for the backdoor of - say Adobe's reader - and use it for unwanted 
> activity, or even malware development.
>
> Secondly, WinEyes had a feature of offering you loads of apps. Many of 
> them are open-sourced, but WinEyes holds a chance for the app 
> developer to cryptize his code, for protecting against peekers. This 
> was a benefit, for instance when the app has to access a server, and 
> maybe even use some login credencials, to perform the activity. 
> Without me knowing for sure, we could think of an app like 
> WeatherOrNot, which has to access a server, retrieve weather details, and 
> process them for you.
> Now if the developer has reached a given agreement with the 
> weather-server provider, that his app will gain free access, under the 
> condition of not disclosing the login credencials, we are in trouble 
> in open-sourcing WinEyes. By doing so, we would disclose the 
> cryptizing code, opening up for people to break the cryptized code of 
> the app, get to the credencials, and then misuse it.
>
> Part of the agreement GW made with their app developers, by providing 
> the cryptizing feature, was to keep the app code an enclosed program.
> They might get into legal issues, should they disclose the cryptizer, 
> thereby lay bare the very code of the app developer, who in turn might 
> sue GW for breaking the agreement. This is kind of backed up, by a 
> message Doug posted several years back, when someone claimed they had 
> broken the cryptizer.
>
> Furthermore, it has been confirmed from Aaron, that some of the apps 
> directly from GW, like AppGet, do hold credencials for accessing the 
> servers of GW. It is unlikely that they want to have these credencials 
> open-sourced. In particular so, if you remember the attack someone 
> gave them a few years back, when the code of the GWToolkit was hacked, 
> and gave many a WinEyes user quite a shock the morning they turned on 
> their computer, and got a threatening message on their screen.
>
> Mind you, GW got into a cooperation with Microsoft, when they 
> introduced the WEForOffice program. Even here, they told that this 
> agreement would put them in specially close relationship with the 
> ingeneers of Microsoft. Who knows what closures might be involved 
> there, and which would be broken, had WE got open-sourced.
>
> Now let's move back to the answer Doug gave back in the spring this 
> year. The above is a bit of an elaboration of what he said. You will 
> find his answer in the archives, but in very short terms:
>   NOPE! WinEyes code CANNNOT go open-source; If for no other 
> reasons, due to the infringement of third-party agreements involved.
>
> All of this, actually leads me to once again raising the very question:
>   Does VFO even have access to the WinEyes code?
> VFO might have bought AISquared, thereby also the former GWMicro. But 
> they might not have bought the copyright of the source-code. And 
> perhaps that was never intended either. Seems all they wanted, was to 
> rid the market of any competition, period. Who knows, maybe Doug 
> simply hit the Delete-key, the last thing before he handed in the key 
> for the Office front-door?
>
> And to assume that VFO's tech personel would bother to plow the 
> thousands of lines of coding for WinEyes, in hope of hitting the 
> technique used to perform a simple task, is out of range. It would 
> take hours, days or even weeks, to figure 

RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Subscribe to this   jaws list it is at least sometimes looked at  by VFO
product manager Eric Damery.

jaws-users-list-j...@jaws-users.com
You can send suggestions to 
suggesti...@vfogroup.com
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Debby Franson via Talk
Sent: Friday, September 08, 2017 10:08 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Debby Franson
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

Hi Darrell or anyone!

So, that means that I would have to know what script I am looking for
exactly, or I wouldn't be able to find  it?

Is there a way to find out when a new script is released such as an FS news
only list or if I supscribed to one of the JAWS lists?

App Central is great. It's too bad no one ever thought of having a scrip
central for JAWS users.

Debby

At 09:07 PM 8/30/2017, Darrell Bowles via Talk wrote
>No, the only way to get them is to go finding them on the internet.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dgbowles=msn@lists.window-eyes.com] 
>On Behalf Of Paulette Vickery via Talk
>Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 10:06 PM
>To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
>Cc: Paulette Vickery <paule...@evickery.com>
>Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018
>
>Okay, but is there a list of scripts, free or for purchase, from which 
>to make selections?
>
>Paulette
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Talk 
>[mailto:talk-bounces+paulette=evickery@lists.window-eyes.com]
>On Behalf Of Darrell Bowles via Talk
>Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 9:23 PM
>To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>Cc: Darrell Bowles
>Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018
>
>Some scripts you have to pay for and some even are done in this SMA 
>style of pricing.
>
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dgbowles=msn@lists.window-eyes.com] 
>On Behalf Of Paulette Vickery via Talk
>Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 9:19 PM
>To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
>Cc: Paulette Vickery <paule...@evickery.com>
>Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018
>
>Hi David,
>
>Window Eyes had a heading or department known as APP CENTRAL. This is 
>where you could find apps that had been developed for Window Eyes and I 
>presume approved by the program developers for use by everyone.  It was 
>easy to look through the collected apps and find ones that looked 
>interesting and put them on your computer.
> From what I understand, there is no such collection in what in JAWS is  
>called scripts, which can be browsed through to find scripts that are  
>interesting and can be installed on individual computers.
>If this is true, what is the use in writing scripts if only a select 
>few can find them. They should all be kept in one, easy to locate place 
>for general use.
>Thank you for answering my question.
>
>Paulette
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Talk 
>[mailto:talk-bounces+paulette=evickery@lists.window-eyes.com]
>On Behalf Of David Moore via Talk
>Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 6:20 PM
>To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
>Cc: David Moore
>Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018
>
>Hi all!
>I just listened to the latest FS Cast for JAWS 2018 as well, and it is 
>the best version of JAWS that has come out in years. I have been a JAWS 
>user since 2001 with version 3.7 LOL! I would say that the features 
>that are being included in this 2018 version, are the best since 
>version 12. That is a long time ago. JAWS will now do pretty much of 
>what Open Book does, but just not advanced. You can use JAWS 2018 to 
>scan .JPG images, and JAWS will read any text to you that is in that 
>image. You are in virtual PC cursor mode, so you can copy and paste the 
>text into a Word document. The new installer will be very good as well. 
>When JAWS updates throughout the year, only the new fix will be installed
instead of an entire new copy of JAWS.
>This will save a lot of time with a slow internet connection!
>Give this FS Cast a listen!
>I feel for all of you, but once you get used to this new version of 
>JAWS, you will slowly forget Window Eyes. JAWS, and a laptop web cam, 
>will now act like KNFB reader on the iPhone. You can just use the Web 
>Cam on your laptop, take a picture of print, and JAWS will do the OCR. 
>This is very powerful.
>Take care, guys!
>Please ask me any questions, because I even script for JAWS.
>David Moore
>Email:
>jesusloves1...@gmail.com
>Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>
>From: Dennis Long via Talk
>Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 2:28 PM
>To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
>Cc: Dennis Long
>Subject: really impressed with Jaws2018
>
>I just

RE: question about re installing wineyes

[Dennis Long via Talk]

They gave me a download link to down load my purchased copy of WE a few
months ago I want to say it was June.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Friday, September 08, 2017 11:02 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes

Hi Loy,

If you truly know this, then, that's fine.
I don't feel as certain about this as you seem to be.
If you can explain this a bit, I'd appreciate it.

Best,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf
Of Loy via Talk
Sent: September 8, 2017 10:40 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Loy 
Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

There has never been an online activation. I doubt that you can get a
downloadable copy from VFO now, but if you can get a copy from someone else
then you could install it. Being it is no longer being sold or developed
then using some one else's copy would not matter.
  - Original Message - 
  From: Micallef Michael at FITA via Talk 
  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
  Cc: Micallef Michael at FITA 
  Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 10:24 AM
  Subject: RE: question about re installing wineyes


  And then after installation of WE how about the online activation?

  -Original Message-
  From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+michael.micallef=gov...@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of aad leeflang via Talk
  Sent: Friday, September 8, 2017 12:07 PM
  To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
  Cc: aad leeflang
  Subject: Re: question about re installing wineyes

  ok thanks
  i used window eyes 9.4 on my old pc but i did not get a cd newer than 9.0.
  i downloadee most versions.
  but how do i get a more acurate version though?
  or is there a way to copy the files from my old pc to my new pc.
  i guess not.
  aad
  On Fri, 8 Sep 2017 09:46:16 +
  Rod Hutton via Talk  wrote:

  > Hi Aad,
  > 
  > In order to install Window-Eyes for Windows 10, you require at least
version 9.2.
  > 
  > Hth,
  > 
  > Rod
  > 
  > -Original Message-
  > From: Talk 
  > [mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
  > Behalf Of aad leeflang via Talk
  > Sent: September 8, 2017 5:15 AM
  > To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
  > Cc: aad leeflang 
  > Subject: question about re installing wineyes
  > 
  > hello all
  > i have moved to a new pc with windows 10.
  > i wanted to re-install window eyes but i get a message that it does 
  > not work under windows 10.
  > i had the cd version 9.0.
  > is there a way to get an fresh installation cd for window eyes so that 
  > i re install it?
  > there are still some issues with jaws that don't work well and could 
  > work better with window eyes.
  > anyway i still don't understand why people think that jaws sould be 
  > better tan window eyes anyway.
  > aad
  > 
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RE: App updates

[Dennis Long via Talk]

This would be nice.  The only way I see problem if core things in Window
Eyes quit working.  I also doubt you will get good support after a while
from VFO.


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of peter Chin via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, September 06, 2017 4:34 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List; windoweyesus...@groups.io
Cc: peter Chin
Subject: Re: App updates

Hello Listers,

It looks like many of us would be interested in such an undertaking. I do
hope that someone will be able to take  up Rod's idea and set up a website
to house all the old apps as well as new ones. Who knows, if apps could be
added to the list of apps, the use of Window-Eyes could be prolonged even
after updates to Windows 10.

-Original Message-
From: Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, September 6, 2017 5:52 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: App updates

Hi everyone,

I have updates for a couple of my apps, and even a new app or two, but VFO
is no longer accepting app submissions.
Is anyone still interested enough in Window-Eyes to wish for someone to set
up an independent website for the purpose of app updates?
I am trying to get a handle on who is still interested in receiving support
for Window-Eyes, and so please circulate this question to any Window-Eyes
users you know.

Sincere thanks,

Rod Hutton
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RE: App updates

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Rod absolutely do that.  You might want to post it to the other WindowEyes
list your on.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, September 05, 2017 5:52 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: App updates

Hi everyone,

I have updates for a couple of my apps, and even a new app or two, but VFO
is no longer accepting app submissions.
Is anyone still interested enough in Window-Eyes to wish for someone to set
up an independent website for the purpose of app updates?
I am trying to get a handle on who is still interested in receiving support
for Window-Eyes, and so please circulate this question to any Window-Eyes
users you know.

Sincere thanks,

Rod Hutton
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RE: Learning JAWS and NVDA

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Use the search box in settings center of jaws it's your friend.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Loy via Talk
Sent: Friday, September 01, 2017 10:46 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Loy
Subject: Learnig JAWS and NVDA

In learning JAWS as a WE user, my biggest problem is learning the JAWS menus
and settings. I find it hard to find what I need. Some are not as
descriptive as I would like. I do like the Microsoft mobile voice Mark, I
find it responsive and easy to listen to. 
I find that NVDA and JAWS have some similarities. I find that NVDA does some
things better than JAWS.

I do want to get a working knowledge of both screen readers just in case WE
stops working in future releases of Windows. But right now still like WE
best.
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what's new in Jaws2018

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Here is a list of features new in Jaws2018

The following features are new to JAWS 2018. For more information and
complete demonstrations, go to the FSCast web page and listen to episode
143.

 

JAWS Version Number Change

 

Beginning with this release, JAWS will now be numbered using the year it
will be shipping in, rather than an arbitrary number. You can think of it as
though this is the 2018 model of JAWS coming out this Fall, just as they do
with cars. The versions of ZoomText and Fusion that get released following
this new JAWS 2018, will also have the same 2018 numbering. This will make
it easier for users to know which versions go together, and when they were
released.

 

New Microsoft Edge Support

 

JAWS 2018 introduces support for Edge, the latest web browser from Microsoft
included in Windows 10. To use JAWS with Edge, you must be running the
Windows 10 Creators update (version 1703) or later. While there are still
several JAWS features that are not available in Edge such as selecting and
copying using the Virtual Cursor, PlaceMarkers, Smart Navigation, Flexible
Web, and domain-specific settings, we have made the overall experience of
navigating pages in Edge using both speech and braille as similar as
possible to working in Internet Explorer, Chrome, or Firefox. As we continue
to work with Microsoft to improve the Edge experience, future JAWS updates
will include greater functionality. This initial Edge support will also be
ported back to a JAWS 18 update.

 

The Virtual Cursor is used to read pages in Edge just like in other
browsers. You can use the standard reading commands as well as most of the
Navigation Quick Keys to navigate through pages. Currently, there are a few
Navigation Quick Keys that are not yet supported in Edge, however the most
used commands; moving by headings, paragraphs, forms, tables, lists,
graphics, and regions, are available. More Navigation Quick Keys will be
supported in future updates.

 

By default, JAWS uses Semi-auto Forms Mode in Edge, which turns on Forms
Mode automatically only when you move to a form control using TAB or
SHIFT+TAB. Due to the way Edge displays pages, Auto Forms Mode is not
available as it is possible to have multiple controls on a single line. You
will need to press ENTER to turn on Forms Mode if you use the ARROW keys to
move to form fields.

 

Other familiar JAWS features that are currently supported include:

.Displaying a list of links, headings, or form controls by pressing
INSERT+F7, INSERT+F6, or INSERT+F5.

.Searching for text on the current page by pressing CTRL+F.

.Obtaining font information by pressing INSERT+F.

.The ability for JAWS to detect changes in the language used on a web page
and automatically switch to the appropriate voice if available.

 

As you begin using Edge, one important item to note is that Edge is a Modern
app with no menu bar that can be accessed using the ALT key. To access Edge
specific features, press TAB from the bottom of a page or SHIFT+TAB from the
top. Continue using TAB or SHIFT+TAB to move through the various controls
until you cycle back around to the content area. Alternatively, Edge offers
many of the same shortcut keys found in other browsers such as CTRL+T to
open a new tab, CTRL+H for History, CTRL+I for Favorites, CTRL+J for
Downloads, and so on.

 

Convenient OCR Adds Support for Freedom Scientific Cameras and Flatbed
Scanners

 

The Convenient OCR (Optical Character Recognition) feature, which enables
you to recognize the text of inaccessible PDF documents opened in Adobe
Reader or the text of images on the screen, has been expanded to support the
recognition of image files as well as images captured by Freedom
Scientific's PEARLR reading camera or a flatbed scanner. The PEARL is a
highly portable document camera that allows you to capture and recognize a
page within seconds, and also features an automatic mode that senses motion
which causes it to capture an image whenever a page is turned.

 

To recognize text in image files saved as BMP, JPG, JPEG, GIF, TIF, TIFF,
PNG, PCX, or PDF, press the layered keystrokes INSERT+SPACEBAR, O, F while
focused on the specific file in File Explorer. The recognized text will be
displayed in the results viewer where you can use standard reading commands
to review the text or select and copy it to other applications.
Alternatively, press the APPLICATIONS key to open the context menu and
choose "Recognize File with JAWS," or "Recognize File with ZoomText Fusion"
if Fusion is running.

 

 

Note: If JAWS is not able to perform OCR on a PDF due to its security
settings, try opening the PDF in Adobe Reader and then use the
INSERT+SPACEBAR, O, D command to recognize PDF documents.

 

To acquire and read a document with the PEARL camera, position a page under
the camera aligned with the page guide, and then press the layered
keystrokes INSERT+SPACEBAR, O, A. This will open the new Camera and Scanner
Recognition dialog box and if you have a PEARL 

RE: Installing Jaws.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Call VFO they will fix it.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Singing Sparrow via Talk
Sent: Thursday, August 31, 2017 11:04 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Singing Sparrow
Subject: Re: Installing Jaws.

I am having the issue where it can not install I believe it is a visual run 
time but Not sure which run time I would need to use.


On 8/31/2017 9:41 AM, Carl Wake via Talk wrote:
> My computer crashed. I am trying to reinstall Jaws.When I start 
> installing  it stops and says Jaws can not install the required 
> component. What does that mean and how do you fix that.
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RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Try hear this has some. 
http://www.jaws-users.com/scripts/
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Darrell Bowles via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 10:08 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Darrell Bowles
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

No, the only way to get them is to go finding them on the internet. 

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dgbowles=msn@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Paulette Vickery via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 10:06 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Cc: Paulette Vickery <paule...@evickery.com>
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

Okay, but is there a list of scripts, free or for purchase, from which to
make selections?

Paulette

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+paulette=evickery@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Darrell Bowles via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 9:23 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Darrell Bowles
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

Some scripts you have to pay for and some even are done in this SMA style of
pricing.


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dgbowles=msn@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Paulette Vickery via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 9:19 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Cc: Paulette Vickery <paule...@evickery.com>
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

Hi David,

Window Eyes had a heading or department known as APP CENTRAL. This is where
you could find apps that had been developed for Window Eyes and I presume
approved by the program developers for use by everyone.  It was easy to look
through the collected apps and find ones that looked interesting and put
them on your computer.
>From what I understand, there is no such collection in what in JAWS is
called scripts, which can be browsed through to find scripts that are
interesting and can be installed on individual computers.
If this is true, what is the use in writing scripts if only a select few can
find them. They should all be kept in one, easy to locate place for general
use.
Thank you for answering my question.

Paulette

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+paulette=evickery@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of David Moore via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 6:20 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: David Moore
Subject: RE: really impressed with Jaws2018

Hi all!
I just listened to the latest FS Cast for JAWS 2018 as well, and it is the
best version of JAWS that has come out in years. I have been a JAWS user
since 2001 with version 3.7 LOL! I would say that the features that are
being included in this 2018 version, are the best since version 12. That is
a long time ago. JAWS will now do pretty much of what Open Book does, but
just not advanced. You can use JAWS 2018 to scan .JPG images, and JAWS will
read any text to you that is in that image. You are in virtual PC cursor
mode, so you can copy and paste the text into a Word document. The new
installer will be very good as well. When JAWS updates throughout the year,
only the new fix will be installed instead of an entire new copy of JAWS.
This will save a lot of time with a slow internet connection!
Give this FS Cast a listen!
I feel for all of you, but once you get used to this new version of JAWS,
you will slowly forget Window Eyes. JAWS, and a laptop web cam, will now act
like KNFB reader on the iPhone. You can just use the Web Cam on your laptop,
take a picture of print, and JAWS will do the OCR. This is very powerful.
Take care, guys!
Please ask me any questions, because I even script for JAWS.
David Moore
Email:
jesusloves1...@gmail.com
Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 30, 2017 2:28 PM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: really impressed with Jaws2018

I just listened to the FS cast for Jaws 2018.  You can set verbosity levels
for what is spoken on the web.  You can take a picture of a file and ocr it
with Jaws very impressed.

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ckery.co

What's new in Jaws2018

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Here is a podcast discussing what is new in Jaws2018 I like it.  Enjoy.

Description: what's new in Jaws2018

You can use the following link to retrieve your file:

https://www.sendspace.com/file/55xh80

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really impressed with Jaws2018

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I just listened to the FS cast for Jaws 2018.  You can set verbosity levels
for what is spoken on the web.  You can take a picture of a file and ocr it
with Jaws very impressed.

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RE: Jaws browse mode

[Dennis Long via Talk]

It is insert f7 not f5.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of michaels mail via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2017 6:09 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: michaels mail
Subject: Re: Jaws browse mode

Jaws works the same as we v for visited links and i think l for next link.
And inser plus f 5 will put jaws in a dialog box with all the links just
like we did by pressing insert tab.
Cheers michael.

-Original Message-
From: David via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2017 6:16 PM
To: WE English Mailinglist
Cc: David
Subject: Jaws browse mode

OK, finally, they managed to send me a license code for Jaws, and so I am
ready to start my fooling around, for a bit more than 40 minutes.


One of my first issues, is to operate the web. Boy, does Jaws take us a
decade back in the way of operating the websites! Am I right, there is no
single way to jump to the next link; that you will have to determine if it
is a visited or unvisited link you are looking for? Sure, I can see the
benefit of making this distinction - when you are visiting a page you know
you have been before. But if you are browsing the net for something in
particular, and you land by chance on a page you have been before, now you
will have to remember that you have some visited, and some unvisited links
to browse. Or, have I overlooked - even missed - some hotkey here?


Next, seems you only can go to the next line of text, coming up after
non-text controls. Meaning you will have to first find the start of the text
block, by the navigation key of N, and then move your hand to the
arrow-keys. Now you have to arrow, til you get to a non-text control, and
then move your hand back to the main keyboard, to hit the N, so as to get to
the next block of text. Again, if I have missed some operational feature,
please will someone be kind to educate me?


Most of all, listers. Could someone please tell me the hotkey to turn on/off
the browse mode. In Window-Eyes, we have the Ctrl-Shift-A, but what is the
equivalent in Jaws?


Thanks so far. I've sure got numerous other things to ask, but they will go
into individual threads.


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RE: not getting at my home e-mail

[Dennis Long via Talk]

This is my own speculation I don't know we will have a jaws august update.
Jaws 2018 which is next version to come will be out in October.  The beta
will be in early September.  Anyone can run it but you will need the sma to
get Jaws 2018.  They have a document scanning feature in Jaws 2018 as well I
know no more than that.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Pastor Gil Pries via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2017 9:51 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Pastor Gil Pries
Subject: RE: not getting at my home e-mail

Me too.

Pastor Gil

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+gilp=embarqmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Russ Kiehne via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2017 6:47 AM
To: Richard; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Russ Kiehne
Subject: Re: not getting at my home e-mail

I'm waiting for the August update to jaws to see if the VFO group fixed the
triple talk issue?

-Original Message-
From: Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 29, 2017 12:45 AM
To: Richard ; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Rod Hutton
Subject: not getting at my home e-mail

Hi Richard and all,

To clarify, my recent experience testing Jaws influences me to accept the
Jaws SMAs which were converted from Window-Eyes, and, once expired, to
simply use NVDA and Narrator.
I've recently bought a Mac, and, along with my iPhone and iPod Tuch,  have
seen what good design really is through my use of these Apple products.
As far as keeping in touch with everyone, my lifeline will be the list
Dennis Long created at windoweyesus...@groups.io, and  I rely on this list
into the future.
So, Richard, we'll keep in touch if you subscribe to Dennis's list. (smile)

Take care,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf
Of Rod Hutton via Talk
Sent: August 29, 2017 2:37 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List 
Cc: Rod Hutton 
Subject: RE: not getting at my home e-mail

Hi Richard,

Well, I'm still here.
If this list shuts down, that will do it for me, since I'm not interested in
the Shark.

Hth,

Rod

-Original Message-
From: Talk
[mailto:talk-bounces+rod_hutton=hotmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf
Of richard kurlander via Talk
Sent: August 29, 2017 1:17 AM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Cc: richard kurlander 
Subject: not getting at my home e-mail

is the talk list still active? For some reason I'mnot getting my messages at
my verizon e-mail r.kurlan...@verizon.net

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List 

RE:

[Dennis Long via Talk]

There will be no more WE.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of mrChikodinakaOguledo via Talk
Sent: Thursday, August 24, 2017 8:19 AM
To: talk@lists.window-eyes.com
Cc: mrChikodinakaOguledo
Subject: 

what is next for gwmicro.com?  so far no more windo eyes but i am
useing NVDA and a add on for dectalk from gwmicro.com
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RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

As Joseph said it's Jaws 2018.  One thing that was very briefly touched on  in 
the latest FS cast was document scanning in Jaws2018 that is all I know.

-Original Message-
From: Russ Kiehne [mailto:russ94...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2017 9:43 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: Re: contacting Doug.

I  wonder what new features  jaws 19 will offer in October?

-Original Message- 
From: Dennis Long via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 9:15 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

Jaws2018 as it will be called will be important to see what WE features 
might be in the next version.  I suggested a few to the company  we'll have 
to see if and what  gets implemented.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] 
On Behalf Of Nick Sarames via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 9:11 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Nick Sarames
Subject: Re: contacting Doug.

I am realmly unclear as to what VFO has done since the acquisition.
Forget about what they did before the "mehrger (that's no longer
relevant).  While it would be nice for VFO to continue with  production
of WE, thus selling two "competing" screen readers, it's likely not a
good business decision, and whether we like it or not, Jaws is more
popular, which logistically makes more sense.

On 8/22/2017 2:07 PM, Darrell Bowles via Talk wrote:
> I agree.  VFo doesn't seem like a family, more like  an evil captain of a 
> pirate ship driving his slave crew to the bitter end.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Loy 
> via Talk
> Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 2:04 PM
> To: bjn...@windstream.net; Window-Eyes Discussion List 
> <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
> Cc: Loy <loyrg2...@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> When I heard the head at AISquared speak at the time of the merger, I did 
> not like him, I could since he was not being totally honest about the 
> future of WE and AISquared.
>- Original Message -
>From: Brenda via Talk
>To: Butch Bussen via Talk
>Cc: Brenda
>Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:59 PM
>Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
>
>I too was hopeful the AI Squared merge would be good for Window-eyes.
>but, the merge was lopsided and seems more like a sale as GW had no 
> more
>control.
>
>I always thought AI Squared was directed by VFO to bring them
>Window-eyes as VFO didn't absorb AI Squared until after W-e was
>acquired. Maybe AI Squared was also in bad shape financially and felt
>selling out to VFO was in their best interest.
>
>It is possible doug, Dan and Aaron were offered positions at VFO but
>refused them. Perhaps this was the same for other GW employees too.
>Perhaps not.
>
>True, technology changes, and products/programs get discontinued, but
>for me Window-eyes was more than just another program. I have heard the
>term VFO Family" but VFO is not my family - GW Micro was and is and I'm
>still dealing with the loss.  some may not like these posts, but they
>are helping me deal with the situation.
>
>I should have written this post using jaws to help me practice - oh 
> well
>- I'll
>  move on eventually.
>Brenda
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On 8/22/2017 12:04 PM, Butch Bussen via Talk wrote:
>> Yes, that is my understanding as well. Again, i wonder if gw people 
> had
>> a clue a i squared would sell them down the drain. Again I wonder, 
> was
>> this a i squared's agenda all along? Only the shadow knows.
>> 73
>> Butch
>> WA0VJR
>> Node 3148
>> Wallace, ks.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 22 Aug 2017, Steve Jacobson via Talk wrote:
>>
>>> It is possible I am misinterpreting this note, but I really think 
> that
>>> both Doug and Dan thought that the merger with AI Squared would give
>>> Window-Eyes a fresh burst of resources to get over the hump on 
> changes
>>> that were very much needed. Once they sold the company, even though
>>> they remained active employees, they would not have had a say
>>> regarding the purchase of AI Squared by VFO. I remember at the time
>>> GW Micro was purchased by AI Squared, that Doug wrote in some 
> context
>>> or other about the number of engineers and developers AI Squared had
>>> compared to GW Micro, and I think there was some real optimism 
> there.
>>> The idea of the Fusion product with Window-Eyes m

RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

That would be correct.  

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Joseph Norton via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 23, 2017 11:08 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: joseph.nor...@gmail.com
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

They're changing the version numbering scheme.  JAWS 19 is now going to be
JAWS 2018.  I think all their software is going to the year model version
numbering.

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RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Jaws2018 as it will be called will be important to see what WE features might 
be in the next version.  I suggested a few to the company  we'll have to see if 
and what  gets implemented.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com] On 
Behalf Of Nick Sarames via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 9:11 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Nick Sarames
Subject: Re: contacting Doug.

I am realmly unclear as to what VFO has done since the acquisition. 
Forget about what they did before the "mehrger (that's no longer 
relevant).  While it would be nice for VFO to continue with  production 
of WE, thus selling two "competing" screen readers, it's likely not a 
good business decision, and whether we like it or not, Jaws is more 
popular, which logistically makes more sense.

On 8/22/2017 2:07 PM, Darrell Bowles via Talk wrote:
> I agree.  VFo doesn't seem like a family, more like  an evil captain of a 
> pirate ship driving his slave crew to the bitter end.
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Loy via 
> Talk
> Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 2:04 PM
> To: bjn...@windstream.net; Window-Eyes Discussion List 
> <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
> Cc: Loy <loyrg2...@gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
> 
> When I heard the head at AISquared speak at the time of the merger, I did not 
> like him, I could since he was not being totally honest about the future of 
> WE and AISquared.
>- Original Message -
>From: Brenda via Talk
>To: Butch Bussen via Talk
>Cc: Brenda
>Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:59 PM
>Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
> 
> 
>I too was hopeful the AI Squared merge would be good for Window-eyes.
>but, the merge was lopsided and seems more like a sale as GW had no more
>control.
> 
>I always thought AI Squared was directed by VFO to bring them
>Window-eyes as VFO didn't absorb AI Squared until after W-e was
>acquired. Maybe AI Squared was also in bad shape financially and felt
>selling out to VFO was in their best interest.
> 
>It is possible doug, Dan and Aaron were offered positions at VFO but
>refused them. Perhaps this was the same for other GW employees too.
>Perhaps not.
> 
>True, technology changes, and products/programs get discontinued, but
>for me Window-eyes was more than just another program. I have heard the
>term VFO Family" but VFO is not my family - GW Micro was and is and I'm
>still dealing with the loss.  some may not like these posts, but they
>are helping me deal with the situation.
> 
>I should have written this post using jaws to help me practice - oh well
>- I'll
>  move on eventually.
>Brenda
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>On 8/22/2017 12:04 PM, Butch Bussen via Talk wrote:
>> Yes, that is my understanding as well. Again, i wonder if gw people had
>> a clue a i squared would sell them down the drain. Again I wonder, was
>> this a i squared's agenda all along? Only the shadow knows.
>> 73
>> Butch
>> WA0VJR
>> Node 3148
>> Wallace, ks.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 22 Aug 2017, Steve Jacobson via Talk wrote:
>>
>>> It is possible I am misinterpreting this note, but I really think that
>>> both Doug and Dan thought that the merger with AI Squared would give
>>> Window-Eyes a fresh burst of resources to get over the hump on changes
>>> that were very much needed. Once they sold the company, even though
>>> they remained active employees, they would not have had a say
>>> regarding the purchase of AI Squared by VFO. I remember at the time
>>> GW Micro was purchased by AI Squared, that Doug wrote in some context
>>> or other about the number of engineers and developers AI Squared had
>>> compared to GW Micro, and I think there was some real optimism there.
>>> The idea of the Fusion product with Window-Eyes may have provided the
>>> new market and exposure that Window-Eyes really needed. I really
>>> don't think there were two mor decent people in this industry.
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> Steve Jacobson
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
>>> Dennis Long via Talk
>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:00 AM
>>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
>

RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I agree Dan and Doug thought it would help WE.  I don't think they would've 
done it otherwise.  My point with yesterday's message is AI Squared gave them 
an offer they couldn't refuse.  Then at that point Dan and Doug had no say if 
AI squared got bought by VFO They had no say if AI squared said we don't want 
to develop WE anymore.  I'm not saying that would've happened it's an example.  
My point is they had little say.  I do find it interesting David Woo
 Is now  a top person at VFO.
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Steve 
Jacobson via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 8:58 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Steve Jacobson
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

It is possible I am misinterpreting this note, but I really think that both 
Doug and Dan thought that the merger with AI Squared would give Window-Eyes a 
fresh burst of resources to get over the hump on changes that were very much 
needed.  Once they sold the company, even though they remained active 
employees, they would not have had a say regarding the purchase of AI Squared 
by VFO.  I remember at the time GW Micro was purchased by AI Squared, that Doug 
wrote in some context or other about the number of engineers and developers AI 
Squared had compared to GW Micro, and I think there was some real optimism 
there.  The idea of the Fusion product with Window-Eyes may have provided  the 
new market and exposure that Window-Eyes really needed.  I really don't think 
there were two mor decent people in this industry.

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson
 
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Long 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:00 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
Cc: Dennis Long <dennisl1...@gmail.com>
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

When GW sold out to AI squared that was effectively the end of WE.  Remember 
everyone has their price Dan and Doug got there price.  


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Reeva Webb 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Reeva Webb
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

Watch fs make zt bloated and terrible with yearly updates. Oh, ai2, y'all 
shouldn't have gotten with the shark.

"the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night 
has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho

Reeva

On Aug 21, 2017 11:22 AM, "Sky Mundell via Talk" <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:

> And Zoomtext will be getting yearly updates, and so on like JAWS does.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
> Russ Kiehne via Talk
> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:50 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Russ Kiehne
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> You are correct, the article was posted for historical purposes.
> It's interesting to see how many screen readers we had back then.  
> Jaws wonthe the battle and now is king of the hill.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Debby Franson via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:50 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Debby Franson
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> Hi Loy!
>
> No, I agree that the article would not be fair today, but I think this 
> article was posted for historical purposes, not anything about the 
> current day.
>
> Debby
>
> At 10:25 AM 8/19/2017, Loy via Talk wrote
> >This would not be a air comparison now, Window Eyes progressed much faster
> >than JAWS since 1996.   - Original Message -   From: Russ Kiehne
> >via Talk   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List   Cc: Russ Kiehne   Sent:
> >Saturday, August 19, 2017 9:42 AM   Subject: Re: contacting Doug.   Check
> >this out from times past!   Date:Tue, 11 Jun 1996 14:49:26 EDT   From:
> >Jamal Mazrui <7.1...@compuserve.com>   Subject: CSUN "Dueling
> Windows"
> >Sensory Access Foundation has published a "Dueling Windows"   report in
> the
> >Spring 1996 issue of Access Review.  It   summarizes a competition among
> >Windows screen readers that was   held at the 1996 CSUN conference in
> >March.  I am prefacing the   article with some tabulations I did with its
> >data.   Since the article does not quantify the performance of each
> >screen reader according to its criteria, I did such an analysis   for the
> >interest of readers.  I assigned a value of 2 for   accomplishing a task,
> 1
> >for accomplishing it with difficulty, and   0 for failing it.  If anyone
> >observes an error in my arithmetic,   please let me know.   Artic's
> >WinVision   accomplished: 7   a

RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I don't see how.  The company name changed to AI Squared.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky Mundell 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 1:34 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

So they couldn't control Window-Eyes or anything.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Long 
via Talk
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 10:22 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

Simple at that point they had no control over anything.  They couldn't control  
what AI squared did.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky Mundell 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 1:20 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

How do you know it was the end when they sold out?

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Long 
via Talk
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 10:00 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

When GW sold out to AI squared that was effectively the end of WE.  Remember 
everyone has their price Dan and Doug got there price.  


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Reeva Webb 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Reeva Webb
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

Watch fs make zt bloated and terrible with yearly updates. Oh, ai2, y'all 
shouldn't have gotten with the shark.

"the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night 
has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho

Reeva

On Aug 21, 2017 11:22 AM, "Sky Mundell via Talk" <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:

> And Zoomtext will be getting yearly updates, and so on like JAWS does.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
> Russ Kiehne via Talk
> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:50 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Russ Kiehne
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> You are correct, the article was posted for historical purposes.
> It's interesting to see how many screen readers we had back then.  
> Jaws wonthe the battle and now is king of the hill.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Debby Franson via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:50 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Debby Franson
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> Hi Loy!
>
> No, I agree that the article would not be fair today, but I think this 
> article was posted for historical purposes, not anything about the 
> current day.
>
> Debby
>
> At 10:25 AM 8/19/2017, Loy via Talk wrote
> >This would not be a air comparison now, Window Eyes progressed much faster
> >than JAWS since 1996.   - Original Message -   From: Russ Kiehne
> >via Talk   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List   Cc: Russ Kiehne   Sent:
> >Saturday, August 19, 2017 9:42 AM   Subject: Re: contacting Doug.   Check
> >this out from times past!   Date:Tue, 11 Jun 1996 14:49:26 EDT   From:
> >Jamal Mazrui <7.1...@compuserve.com>   Subject: CSUN "Dueling
> Windows"
> >Sensory Access Foundation has published a "Dueling Windows"   report in
> the
> >Spring 1996 issue of Access Review.  It   summarizes a competition among
> >Windows screen readers that was   held at the 1996 CSUN conference in
> >March.  I am prefacing the   article with some tabulations I did with its
> >data.   Since the article does not quantify the performance of each
> >screen reader according to its criteria, I did such an analysis   for the
> >interest of readers.  I assigned a value of 2 for   accomplishing a task,
> 1
> >for accomplishing it with difficulty, and   0 for failing it.  If anyone
> >observes an error in my arithmetic,   please let me know.   Artic's
> >WinVision   accomplished: 7   accomplished with difficulty: 2   failed: 6
> >total points: 16   average: 1.06   Berkeley's OutSpoken for Windows
> >accomplished: 9   accomplished with difficulty: 5   failed: 1   total
> >points: 23   average: 1.53   GW Micro's Window-Eyes   accomplished: 5
> >accomplished with difficulty: 1   failed: 9   total points: 11   average:
> >.73   Henter-Joyce's JAWS for Windows   accomplished: 13   accomplished
> >with difficulty: 1   failed: 1   total points: 27   average: 1.8   IBM's
> >Screen Reader/2   accomplished: 13   accomplished with difficulty: 1
> >failed: 1   total points: 27   average: 1.8   Syntha-Voice's Window Bridge
>

RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Simple at that point they had no control over anything.  They couldn't control  
what AI squared did.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky Mundell 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 1:20 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

How do you know it was the end when they sold out?

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Long 
via Talk
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 10:00 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

When GW sold out to AI squared that was effectively the end of WE.  Remember 
everyone has their price Dan and Doug got there price.  


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Reeva Webb 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Reeva Webb
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

Watch fs make zt bloated and terrible with yearly updates. Oh, ai2, y'all 
shouldn't have gotten with the shark.

"the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night 
has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho

Reeva

On Aug 21, 2017 11:22 AM, "Sky Mundell via Talk" <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:

> And Zoomtext will be getting yearly updates, and so on like JAWS does.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
> Russ Kiehne via Talk
> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:50 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Russ Kiehne
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> You are correct, the article was posted for historical purposes.
> It's interesting to see how many screen readers we had back then.  
> Jaws wonthe the battle and now is king of the hill.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Debby Franson via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:50 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Debby Franson
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> Hi Loy!
>
> No, I agree that the article would not be fair today, but I think this 
> article was posted for historical purposes, not anything about the 
> current day.
>
> Debby
>
> At 10:25 AM 8/19/2017, Loy via Talk wrote
> >This would not be a air comparison now, Window Eyes progressed much faster
> >than JAWS since 1996.   - Original Message -   From: Russ Kiehne
> >via Talk   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List   Cc: Russ Kiehne   Sent:
> >Saturday, August 19, 2017 9:42 AM   Subject: Re: contacting Doug.   Check
> >this out from times past!   Date:Tue, 11 Jun 1996 14:49:26 EDT   From:
> >Jamal Mazrui <7.1...@compuserve.com>   Subject: CSUN "Dueling
> Windows"
> >Sensory Access Foundation has published a "Dueling Windows"   report in
> the
> >Spring 1996 issue of Access Review.  It   summarizes a competition among
> >Windows screen readers that was   held at the 1996 CSUN conference in
> >March.  I am prefacing the   article with some tabulations I did with its
> >data.   Since the article does not quantify the performance of each
> >screen reader according to its criteria, I did such an analysis   for the
> >interest of readers.  I assigned a value of 2 for   accomplishing a task,
> 1
> >for accomplishing it with difficulty, and   0 for failing it.  If anyone
> >observes an error in my arithmetic,   please let me know.   Artic's
> >WinVision   accomplished: 7   accomplished with difficulty: 2   failed: 6
> >total points: 16   average: 1.06   Berkeley's OutSpoken for Windows
> >accomplished: 9   accomplished with difficulty: 5   failed: 1   total
> >points: 23   average: 1.53   GW Micro's Window-Eyes   accomplished: 5
> >accomplished with difficulty: 1   failed: 9   total points: 11   average:
> >.73   Henter-Joyce's JAWS for Windows   accomplished: 13   accomplished
> >with difficulty: 1   failed: 1   total points: 27   average: 1.8   IBM's
> >Screen Reader/2   accomplished: 13   accomplished with difficulty: 1
> >failed: 1   total points: 27   average: 1.8   Syntha-Voice's Window Bridge
> >accomplished: 5   accomplished with difficulty: 4   failed: 6   total
> >points: 14   average: .93   TeleSensory's Screen Power for Windows
> >accomplished: 5   accomplished with difficulty: 7   failed: 3   total
> >points: 17   average: 1.13   Based solely on this analysis, JAWS for
> >Windows and Screen   Reader/2 were tied for top.  They were followed by
> >OutSpoken for   Windows, Screen Power for Windows, WinVision, Window
> Bridge
> >and Window-Eyes.   Let me remind readers that Windows access products are
> >rapidly   deve

RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

It was a "merger" however money had to have exchanged hands.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky Mundell 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 1:21 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

When GW Micro sold out to AI Squared. Because here in Canada, I've been 
promoting the free version to organizations and some of them accepted it.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Long 
via Talk
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 10:00 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

When GW sold out to AI squared that was effectively the end of WE.  Remember 
everyone has their price Dan and Doug got there price.  


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Reeva Webb 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Reeva Webb
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

Watch fs make zt bloated and terrible with yearly updates. Oh, ai2, y'all 
shouldn't have gotten with the shark.

"the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night 
has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho

Reeva

On Aug 21, 2017 11:22 AM, "Sky Mundell via Talk" <talk@lists.window-eyes.com>
wrote:

> And Zoomtext will be getting yearly updates, and so on like JAWS does.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
> Russ Kiehne via Talk
> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:50 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Russ Kiehne
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> You are correct, the article was posted for historical purposes.
> It's interesting to see how many screen readers we had back then.  
> Jaws wonthe the battle and now is king of the hill.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Debby Franson via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:50 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Debby Franson
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> Hi Loy!
>
> No, I agree that the article would not be fair today, but I think this 
> article was posted for historical purposes, not anything about the 
> current day.
>
> Debby
>
> At 10:25 AM 8/19/2017, Loy via Talk wrote
> >This would not be a air comparison now, Window Eyes progressed much faster
> >than JAWS since 1996.   - Original Message -   From: Russ Kiehne
> >via Talk   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List   Cc: Russ Kiehne   Sent:
> >Saturday, August 19, 2017 9:42 AM   Subject: Re: contacting Doug.   Check
> >this out from times past!   Date:Tue, 11 Jun 1996 14:49:26 EDT   From:
> >Jamal Mazrui <7.1...@compuserve.com>   Subject: CSUN "Dueling
> Windows"
> >Sensory Access Foundation has published a "Dueling Windows"   report in
> the
> >Spring 1996 issue of Access Review.  It   summarizes a competition among
> >Windows screen readers that was   held at the 1996 CSUN conference in
> >March.  I am prefacing the   article with some tabulations I did with its
> >data.   Since the article does not quantify the performance of each
> >screen reader according to its criteria, I did such an analysis   for the
> >interest of readers.  I assigned a value of 2 for   accomplishing a task,
> 1
> >for accomplishing it with difficulty, and   0 for failing it.  If anyone
> >observes an error in my arithmetic,   please let me know.   Artic's
> >WinVision   accomplished: 7   accomplished with difficulty: 2   failed: 6
> >total points: 16   average: 1.06   Berkeley's OutSpoken for Windows
> >accomplished: 9   accomplished with difficulty: 5   failed: 1   total
> >points: 23   average: 1.53   GW Micro's Window-Eyes   accomplished: 5
> >accomplished with difficulty: 1   failed: 9   total points: 11   average:
> >.73   Henter-Joyce's JAWS for Windows   accomplished: 13   accomplished
> >with difficulty: 1   failed: 1   total points: 27   average: 1.8   IBM's
> >Screen Reader/2   accomplished: 13   accomplished with difficulty: 1
> >failed: 1   total points: 27   average: 1.8   Syntha-Voice's Window Bridge
> >accomplished: 5   accomplished with difficulty: 4   failed: 6   total
> >points: 14   average: .93   TeleSensory's Screen Power for Windows
> >accomplished: 5   accomplished with difficulty: 7   failed: 3   total
> >points: 17   average: 1.13   Based solely on this analysis, JAWS for
> >Windows and Screen   Reader/2 were tied for top.  They were followed by
> >OutSpoken for   Windows, Screen Power for Windows, WinVision, Window
> Bridge
> >and Window-Eyes.   Let me remin

RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

When GW sold out to AI squared that was effectively the end of WE.  Remember 
everyone has their price Dan and Doug got there price.  


-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Reeva Webb 
via Talk
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2017 12:12 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Reeva Webb
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

Watch fs make zt bloated and terrible with yearly updates. Oh, ai2, y'all 
shouldn't have gotten with the shark.

"the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised night 
has just begun, so sing with me we're all fucked" Walls Of Jericho

Reeva

On Aug 21, 2017 11:22 AM, "Sky Mundell via Talk" 
wrote:

> And Zoomtext will be getting yearly updates, and so on like JAWS does.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
> Russ Kiehne via Talk
> Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 6:50 AM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Russ Kiehne
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> You are correct, the article was posted for historical purposes.
> It's interesting to see how many screen readers we had back then.  
> Jaws wonthe the battle and now is king of the hill.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Debby Franson via Talk
> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:50 PM
> To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
> Cc: Debby Franson
> Subject: Re: contacting Doug.
>
> Hi Loy!
>
> No, I agree that the article would not be fair today, but I think this 
> article was posted for historical purposes, not anything about the 
> current day.
>
> Debby
>
> At 10:25 AM 8/19/2017, Loy via Talk wrote
> >This would not be a air comparison now, Window Eyes progressed much faster
> >than JAWS since 1996.   - Original Message -   From: Russ Kiehne
> >via Talk   To: Window-Eyes Discussion List   Cc: Russ Kiehne   Sent:
> >Saturday, August 19, 2017 9:42 AM   Subject: Re: contacting Doug.   Check
> >this out from times past!   Date:Tue, 11 Jun 1996 14:49:26 EDT   From:
> >Jamal Mazrui <7.1...@compuserve.com>   Subject: CSUN "Dueling
> Windows"
> >Sensory Access Foundation has published a "Dueling Windows"   report in
> the
> >Spring 1996 issue of Access Review.  It   summarizes a competition among
> >Windows screen readers that was   held at the 1996 CSUN conference in
> >March.  I am prefacing the   article with some tabulations I did with its
> >data.   Since the article does not quantify the performance of each
> >screen reader according to its criteria, I did such an analysis   for the
> >interest of readers.  I assigned a value of 2 for   accomplishing a task,
> 1
> >for accomplishing it with difficulty, and   0 for failing it.  If anyone
> >observes an error in my arithmetic,   please let me know.   Artic's
> >WinVision   accomplished: 7   accomplished with difficulty: 2   failed: 6
> >total points: 16   average: 1.06   Berkeley's OutSpoken for Windows
> >accomplished: 9   accomplished with difficulty: 5   failed: 1   total
> >points: 23   average: 1.53   GW Micro's Window-Eyes   accomplished: 5
> >accomplished with difficulty: 1   failed: 9   total points: 11   average:
> >.73   Henter-Joyce's JAWS for Windows   accomplished: 13   accomplished
> >with difficulty: 1   failed: 1   total points: 27   average: 1.8   IBM's
> >Screen Reader/2   accomplished: 13   accomplished with difficulty: 1
> >failed: 1   total points: 27   average: 1.8   Syntha-Voice's Window Bridge
> >accomplished: 5   accomplished with difficulty: 4   failed: 6   total
> >points: 14   average: .93   TeleSensory's Screen Power for Windows
> >accomplished: 5   accomplished with difficulty: 7   failed: 3   total
> >points: 17   average: 1.13   Based solely on this analysis, JAWS for
> >Windows and Screen   Reader/2 were tied for top.  They were followed by
> >OutSpoken for   Windows, Screen Power for Windows, WinVision, Window
> Bridge
> >and Window-Eyes.   Let me remind readers that Windows access products are
> >rapidly   developing so that new versions might lead to significantly
> >different results today.  In fact, some developers have already   made
> >enhancements to address problems encountered at this
> >competition.   --Dueling Windows:  An Overviewby
> >Kenneth Frasse(re-printed with permission of Sensory Access
> >Foundationfrom Access Review, Vol. I, No. 1, Spring 1996)
> >Abstract   In March, at the CSUN International Conference on Technology
> and
> >Persons with Disabilities held in Los Angeles, California, Mark   Nelson
> of
> >the Foundation for Blind Children hosted a pre-conference   seminar called
> >"Dueling Windows".  This seminar attempted to   contrast and compare
> >graphical user interface (GUI) screen review   software in applications
> for
> >Windows.  The format of the seminar   was to pose identical tasks to each
> >of the vendors in alternating   order and have the vendors demonstrate the
> >ability of their   

RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

[Dennis Long via Talk]

They don't care WE is no more.  As Aaron said when they announced the
discontinuing
 Of WE it will not work properly with programs etc. especially as time goes
on.
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky
Mundell via Talk
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2017 12:15 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

Because their still needs to be improvements made to Window-Eyes, for
example, Edge support, it needs rewritten braille support, it needs
touchscreen support, it needs this and that.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Nick
Sarames via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 9:12 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Nick Sarames
Subject: Re: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

Why would they?

On 8/20/2017 9:22 PM, Debby Franson via Talk wrote:
> Hi!
> 
> I wonder if VFO would ever sell the code.
> 
> Debby
> 
> At 12:37 PM 8/20/2017, Dennis Long via Talk wrote
>> They won't give code up.  Come on think that through.  What company 
>> do you know that gives code that was a product that was sold for 
>> profit to just give it away.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
>> Sky Mundell via Talk
>> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 1:19 PM
>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
>> Cc: Sky Mundell
>> Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
>>
>> They might give the Window-Eyes code up to a company like Humanware.
>>
>> -----Original Message-
>> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
>> Dennis Long via Talk
>> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 10:04 AM
>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
>> Cc: Dennis Long
>> Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
>>
>> I'm pretty sure they own the code.  I say this for a few reasons 1 
>> they bought AI Squared and their products.  What are their products?
>> WE is one of those.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
>> Sky Mundell via Talk
>> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:46 PM
>> To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
>> Cc: Sky Mundell
>> Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
>>
>> I hope it does VFO didn't say anything about owning the Window-Eyes 
>> code or anything.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
>> Olusegun
>> -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk
>> Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 9:06 AM
>> To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'; 'Dennis Long'
>> Cc: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc.
>> Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
>>
>> Tom, hopefully I'm not being overtly patronizing especially now that 
>> Window-Eyes is dead!!  That aside, Window-Eyes is an impressive 
>> screen reader whose ageless awareness outshines the sun!  Maybe--just 
>> maybe--someday, someone will UNSCRAMBLE the Window-Eyes code and PORT 
>> IT OVER to Android thus avoiding some crappy nonsense on the part of V F
O.
>> Should that happen, it's glorious days migh yet return again!
>>
>> Sincerely,
>> Olusegun
>> Denver, Colorado
>>
>>
>> ---
>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
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>> author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared.
>>
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>> http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/skyt%40
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>>
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>> 

RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Lol not at a price we could afford.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Debby
Franson via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 9:23 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Debby Franson
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

Hi!

I wonder if VFO would ever sell the code.

Debby

At 12:37 PM 8/20/2017, Dennis Long via Talk wrote
>They won't give code up.  Come on think that through.  What company do 
>you know that gives code that was a product that was sold for profit to 
>just give it away.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky 
>Mundell via Talk
>Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 1:19 PM
>To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
>Cc: Sky Mundell
>Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
>
>They might give the Window-Eyes code up to a company like Humanware.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
>Dennis Long via Talk
>Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 10:04 AM
>To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
>Cc: Dennis Long
>Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
>
>I'm pretty sure they own the code.  I say this for a few reasons 1 they 
>bought AI Squared and their products.  What are their products?  WE is 
>one of those.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky 
>Mundell via Talk
>Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:46 PM
>To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
>Cc: Sky Mundell
>Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
>
>I hope it does VFO didn't say anything about owning the Window-Eyes 
>code or anything.
>
>-Original Message-
>From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of 
>Olusegun
>-- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk
>Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 9:06 AM
>To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'; 'Dennis Long'
>Cc: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc.
>Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
>
>Tom, hopefully I'm not being overtly patronizing especially now that 
>Window-Eyes is dead!!  That aside, Window-Eyes is an impressive screen 
>reader whose ageless awareness outshines the sun!  Maybe--just 
>maybe--someday, someone will UNSCRAMBLE the Window-Eyes code and PORT 
>IT OVER to Android thus avoiding some crappy nonsense on the part of V F O.
>Should that happen, it's glorious days migh yet return again!
>
>Sincerely,
>Olusegun
>Denver, Colorado
>
>
>---
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>
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>aw.ca
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>An

RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I had asked about a keyboard layout and was told they would have to make
sure it didn't conflict with other programs like fusion.
 That was why they didn't do that WE keyboard layout.  
-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Tom
Kingston via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 7:48 PM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Tom Kingston
Subject: Re: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

Butch,
Actually, VFO initially promised Doug they would create a Window-Eyes
keyboard layout and then they reneged on that promise, which is typical and
says a lot about who they are.
And yes, their number one priority since day one has been governmental and
charitable money money money.
I nailed them many years ago for telling the Massachusetts Commission for
the Blind that Open Book, a self-voicing program, required JAWS. 
Needless to say the head of technology was absolutely livid when he
considered how many JAWS licenses they paid for to give Window-Eyes users
Open Book.
Regards,
Tom


On 8/20/2017 6:44 PM, Butch Bussen wrote:
> You are so right, Tom.  When I was a client in Nevada and  for a short 
> time an employee, they pushed Jaws totally.  they bought from cross 
> roads, a division of easter seals and those vendors wined and dined 
> the counselors to convince them to buy their products.  Of course, if 
> any scripting was done, the state paid through the nose .  I know Doug 
> tried to get vfo to do a window-eyes keyboard interface as window-eyes 
> did for jaws, and vfo flat refused.  To me, jaws isn't intuitive at 
> all and I still run window-eyes.  I will do so until it quits working.  
> When that time comes, I may go to a braille-sense or something like 
> that for e-mail and internet.  On Sun, 20 Aug 2017, Tom Kingston via Talk
wrote:
> 
>> You're right, Dennis. VFO bought their biggest competitor. They have 
>> the code. They're not going to give it or sell it to anyone. It's no 
>> different than the countless companies that Apple, Microsoft, Google, 
>> and Facebook  are constantly buying. They either buy them to kill the 
>> competition or because they want the technology. It's very hard for 
>> new startups with new technology today because who can say no when 
>> they've been struggling for years and then one of the aforementioned 
>> giants dangles three-hundred million under their nose, which for you 
>> conspiracy theorists, is *not* what happened with GW Micro.
>>
>> FS may pick and poke at the Window-Eyes code to see if there's 
>> anything they can use as long as none of us can see that it came from 
>> Window-Eyes. That's their egotistical manner of operation. And I'm 
>> not even sure if they care enough to do that. I think the beast is 
>> out of control and they'll never spend the time to reel it back in 
>> unless they realize their life depends on it and it's not too late. 
>> Today iOS or Android is enough for many people to do everything they 
>> want: surf the web, email, social media, music, movies, news, and on 
>> and on. And of course there's the NVDA and up and coming Narrator avenues
as well.
>>
>> Users are not the priority at FS. I've known this for years. But the 
>> little time I've spent with JAWS has really confirmed it big time.
>> I've never in my thirty years of computing seen a less user friendly 
>> non-intuitive user interface. They'd have to be brain-dead not to 
>> know this. Screen readers have gotten more complicated over the 
>> years. And as Doug realized years ago it was time for a new UI. But 
>> it's a considerable project; one that the folks at FS obviously are 
>> not willing to take on. To lifelong JAWS users it defined the norm. 
>> But to anyone else the JAWS UI is a disgrace compared to that of 
>> Window-Eyes, which comparatively speaking is self-explanatory. I now 
>> can see why non-power-users have to simply accept what it is out of the
box.
>> They're not willing to spend days trying to figure out how to make a 
>> simple change in the convoluted labyrinth they call a UI. It's like 
>> buying a home with a thousand rooms and that home has a thousand 
>> doors on its exterior. Virtually nothing is obvious or self-explanatory.
>>
>> And Olusegun? It's virtually impossible to crack a big low-level 
>> program like Window-Eyes. And even if someone could there's no such 
>> thing as porting it over to Android. At best it could be used as a 
>> template for an extremely skilled group of programmers to use as a 
>> guideline. Mobile operating systems like Android do not possess the 
>> inherent ability, programability, or processing power to do half of 
>> what a full blown screen reader can do.
>>
>> Re

RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

[Dennis Long via Talk]

They won't give code up.  Come on think that through.  What company do you
know that gives code that was a product that was sold for profit to just
give it away.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky
Mundell via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 1:19 PM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

They might give the Window-Eyes code up to a company like Humanware.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Dennis
Long via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 10:04 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Dennis Long
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

I'm pretty sure they own the code.  I say this for a few reasons 1 they
bought AI Squared and their products.  What are their products?  WE is one
of those.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky
Mundell via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:46 PM
To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

I hope it does VFO didn't say anything about owning the Window-Eyes code or
anything.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun
-- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 9:06 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'; 'Dennis Long'
Cc: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc.
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

Tom, hopefully I'm not being overtly patronizing especially now that
Window-Eyes is dead!!  That aside, Window-Eyes is an impressive screen
reader whose ageless awareness outshines the sun!  Maybe--just
maybe--someday, someone will UNSCRAMBLE the Window-Eyes code and PORT IT
OVER to Android thus avoiding some crappy nonsense on the part of V F O.
Should that happen, it's glorious days migh yet return again!

Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado


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RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

[Dennis Long via Talk]

You can do that in Windows7 only difference is press on the volume entry in
system tray.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Martha
via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 9:54 AM
To: Steve Nutt; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: Martha
Subject: Re: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

Thanks, Ian.  I was wondering...

On Mon, 22 May 2017 14:22:54 +0100
Steve Nutt via Talk  wrote:

 Hi,
 
 But you can, in Windows 10, adjust the volume of JAWS as a whole.
 
 Go to System Tray, find your sound card and right click or press
applications key, then Open Volume Mixer.  Now you will see a volume
specifically for JAWS.  If you turn that down, it will turn Eloquence down.
 
 All the best
 
 Steve
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+steve=comproom.co...@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Joseph Norton via Talk
 Sent: 22 May 2017 08:01
 To: Richard Petty ; Window-Eyes DiscussionList

 Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
 
 This is only true with Eloquence.
 
 If you are using Vocalizer or SAPI speech, you can adjust volume of the
speech.
 
 To do this, press Insert-j for the JAWS window.  In the options menu,
select Voices.  Under that, select Voice Adjustment.  You'll be asked to
select a default voice profile.  Once you select Sapi or Vocalizer profile,
you will find that there is now a control you can tab to in order to set the
speech volume.
 
 Hope this helps.
 
 Sent from Mail for Windows 10
 
 From: Richard Petty via Talk
 Sent: Sunday, May 21, 2017 7:38 PM
 To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
 Subject: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume
 
 Is it correct that volume cannot be adjusted and set within JAWS, but
instead only with the system volume or physical volume controls on the
computer? If it can be set within JAWS, how is this done?
 
 Thanks in advance.
 
 Richard Petty
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Richard Petty [mailto:richard.pe...@earthlink.net]
 Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2017 6:31 AM
 To: 'Lloyd Rasmussen'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
 Subject: RE: WordNav Functionality in JAWS
 
 Thanks so much.
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Lloyd Rasmussen [mailto:l...@sprynet.com]
 Sent: Monday, May 15, 2017 9:45 PM
 To: Richard Petty; Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Subject: Re: WordNav Functionality in JAWS
 
 I think that the Word Nav app was inspired by a feature that was already in
JAWS. And you go in and out of its browse mode with insert-Z, which is the
same keystroke that is used with web browsers in JAWS.
 
 
 
 Lloyd Rasmussen, Kensington, MD
 http://lras.home.sprynet.com
 -Original Message-
 From: Richard Petty via Talk
 Sent: Monday, May 15, 2017 10:21 PM
 To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
 Subject: WordNav Functionality in JAWS
 
 All,
 
 I will soon make the move to JAWS. The Wordnav app has provided very nice
functionality for navigating MS Word documents.
 
 What are the JAWS commands, if any, closest to those in Wordnav for moving
through headings, tables and other document features?
 
 Thanks in advance.
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Talk
 [mailto:talk-bounces+richard.petty=earthlink@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Marcie Chaney via Talk
 Sent: Monday, May 15, 2017 8:29 PM
 To: 'Doug Geoffray'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
 Subject: RE: Window-Eyes to JAWS Migration
 
 I talked to customer service about something related to your question and
they told me that zoomtext fusion 11 will be using JAWS for the screen
reader portion of fustion and that the upgrade from zoomtext fustion 10 to
 11 is quite costly but not as expensive as getting magic with JAWS. This is
not a direct answer to your concern about ap central. It is what happens to
WE after WE goes away.
 Marcie Brink-Chaney CVRT
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Talk
 [mailto:talk-bounces+chaneyma=ameritech@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Doug Geoffray via Talk
 Sent: Monday, May 15, 2017 11:35 AM
 To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
 Subject: RE: Window-Eyes to JAWS Migration
 
 Reeva,
 
 Good question.  At this point we have no plans on taking down app central
but clearly at some point in the future will become irrelevant and go down. 
 I would hope as long as Window-Eyes can continued to be used it would be up
and if it does need to go down we would give people ample notice.
 
 Doug
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Talk
 [mailto:talk-bounces+dgeoffray=vfogroup@lists.window-eyes.com] On
Behalf Of Reeva Webb via Talk
 Sent: Monday, May 15, 2017 11:17 AM
 To: cov...@ccs.covici.com; Window-Eyes Discussion List

 Subject: Re: Window-Eyes to JAWS Migration
 
 Question, since we is done, how much longer will app central be around for
those using we/the we version of zt fusion?
 
 "the world has been against you from day one, tomorrow's never promised
night has just begun, so sing with me we're all 

RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I'm pretty sure they own the code.  I say this for a few reasons 1 they
bought AI Squared and their products.  What are their products?  WE is one
of those.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Sky
Mundell via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 12:46 PM
To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'
Cc: Sky Mundell
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

I hope it does VFO didn't say anything about owning the Window-Eyes code or
anything.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Olusegun
-- Victory Associates LTD, Inc. via Talk
Sent: Sunday, August 20, 2017 9:06 AM
To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List'; 'Dennis Long'
Cc: Olusegun -- Victory Associates LTD, Inc.
Subject: RE: JAWS Software Synthesizer Volume

Tom, hopefully I'm not being overtly patronizing especially now that
Window-Eyes is dead!!  That aside, Window-Eyes is an impressive screen
reader whose ageless awareness outshines the sun!  Maybe--just
maybe--someday, someone will UNSCRAMBLE the Window-Eyes code and PORT IT
OVER to Android thus avoiding some crappy nonsense on the part of V F O.
Should that happen, it's glorious days migh yet return again!

Sincerely,
Olusegun
Denver, Colorado


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RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Hear is why I say Jaws is going nowhere.  1 state agencies and government
contracts.  2 it's better than any other screen reader currently in
development.  3 NFB.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-boun...@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of
ratshtron via Talk
Sent: Thursday, August 17, 2017 10:50 AM
To: ukekearu...@valtdnet.com; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Cc: ratshtron
Subject: RE: contacting Doug.

hmmm, if you can't beat the competition, kill it! I believe I'm going to
switch to apple, BIG GRIN!


Legend has it that on Wednesday 8/16/2017 08:02 PM, Olusegun -- 
Victory Associates LTD, said:

>Well, Michael, I once opined that the war Freedom Scientific could not win
>in the courts, was well fought and won outside; with its cohorts and
coterie
>of friends, it succeeded in drowning the boat!
>
>The merger with AI Square came to me as a surprise; I didn't want to see it
>happen, but what voice do I have?
>
>I long for the day when all these adaptive equipment
>developers/manufacturers can TRADE THEIR STOCKS publicly; may be, just may
>be, they'll have better stability!  Now, we keep our eyes on the sparrow,
>Jaws may be taking its last breath as the venture capitalists will soon
>squash its fins!  Then it'll be Apple and Google to fill the void at least
>here in the United States!
>
>Sincerely,
>Olusegun
>Denver, Colorado
>
>
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RE: contacting Doug.

[Dennis Long via Talk]

I'm not surprised by this.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of michael fridey via Talk
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2017 7:48 PM
To: window eyes help list
Subject: contacting Doug.

Hi guys i sent Doug an email and got the responce below saying he does not
work for VFO any more.

Its a bit sad he did not get to say good by on the list.

Doug was a good person and did his best for us Window Eyes users.

Cheers michael.



 Forwarded Message 
Subject:FW: helo Doug from michael.
Date:   Wed, 16 Aug 2017 20:08:39 +
From:   Julie Moore 
To: michaelandjea...@aapt.net.au 



Hello Michael,

Doug Geoffray no longer works for VFO.  His emails are being forwarded to
me, and unfortunately, I do not have a forwarding address for him.

Kind Regards,

Julie

*Julie Moore*

*VFOT *| Manager, Enterprise Compliance

11800 31^st Court North, St. Petersburg, FL 33716

*T*800-444-4443 x6112 *F* 802-362-1670

jmo...@vfogroup.com 

www.vfo-group.com 

*From:*michael's emails [mailto:michaelandjea...@aapt.net.au]
*Sent:* Wednesday, August 16, 2017 12:51 AM
*To:* Doug Geoffray >
*Subject:* helo Doug from michael.

Hi Doug i was wondering if your still around and working.

cheers Michael.

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RE: nfl tunein premium does it require itunes?

[Dennis Long via Talk]

You can do that go hear
https://tunein.com/premium/

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of tony via Talk
Sent: Saturday, August 12, 2017 10:32 AM
To: Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: nfl tunein premium does it require itunes?

tried to subscribe to tunein pre for nfl but seems to need itunes,

just want to listen on pc via ie

no other device.

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RE: nfl game pass

[Dennis Long via Talk]

Ok with tune in premium you can go back and listen to games you miss.

-Original Message-
From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+dennisl1982=gmail@lists.window-eyes.com]
On Behalf Of Alan Paganelli via Talk
Sent: Thursday, August 10, 2017 10:49 AM
To: tony; Window-Eyes Discussion List
Subject: Re: nfl game pass

The NFL season is about to start. The NFL wants you to shell out $99.99 for
the 2017 season.  watching the games on television is worthless to me
because they say things such as look at that! He dropped the ball! Fumble!
where has if you listen to the radio, you get a full audio description. The
NFL just can't get that through their effing heads. I don't need coaches
Phil or any of that  crap.  I have been complaining for several seasons that
it is not fair that I have to pay 100 bucks the audio pass only cost 40
colors are year until the and FL got really. greedy. I'm just not going to
pay them $100 this year



Alan

Sent from my iPhone 5s

> On Aug 10, 2017, at 7:39 AM, tony via Talk 
wrote:
> 
> I also had no success in listening to home team audio radio broadcast,
> 
> tried again last night with tex/car no sound,
> 
> have you had any success yet?
> 
> 
>> On 8/4/2017 14:43, Kurlander Richard (75) via Talk wrote:
>> Does anyone know how  to access nfl game pass for 2017? I logged in last
night and could find the audio for the game between dallas and Arizona. If
anybody has  the number to nfl game pass digital care I need it.
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