Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-08-04 Thread Craig Bennett
Having talked to IBM (who were as usual amazingly helpful, thankyou 
Jonathan and Leroy), their conclusion was that when a blink error occurs 
in a file, the action taken will depend on the type of file corruption 
that has occured:

When a READ is performed and a group is dicovered to have a blink error 
but the group is otherise OK, the ON ERROR clause will be followed and 
the error number can be accessed using STATUS()

If however the entire group header is wrong, UV sends a warning to 
stderror but because there is no group header, the record cannot be 
found so UV decides the record does not exist and takes the ELSE branch 
--  no further warnings or STATUS() code available.

When our files were being corrupted, the corruption overwrote the group 
header with an error message (trashing the entire group header), hence 
the ELSE clause was taken.

If you wish to follow this problem, the case number is 373556*AUS. IBM 
had not determined the effort required to correct the problem and could 
not give me a time frame in which it might be fixed.

hope you never come across this,

Craig
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Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-26 Thread Leroy Dreyfuss
But Leroy, the program neither aborts nor takes the ON ERROR branch, it
takes the ELSE branch and continues.
That might be a problem. I guess you see something in the errlog file, but
does anything display on the screen? If so, then perhaps that is a problem.
The code is a bit tricky and blink errors are tested a bit deep in it, but
it should probably be a non-recoverable fatal error that drops to TCL
regardless of the clause used.

On the other hand, it is coded such that it takes the ELSE clause, probably
not being set as fatal. it has also been that way since blink checking was
added to UV, and that has been for quite a few years. I am not sure why
this behavior is a problem now.

Regards,

LeRoy F. Dreyfuss
Advanced Technical Services - U2 Technology Analyst
IBM U2 Data Management Solutions
Tel: 303-672-1254  Fax: 303-294-4832
Mobile: 720-341-4317
External email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WWW:  http://www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support

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 Craig Bennett
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   Subject
   Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption
 07/25/2004 08:24  error, but ON ERROR branch not
 PMtaken


 Please respond to
 u2-users






 I am not sure I would agree that blink errors not taking ON ERROR clauses
 is a defect. While inconvenient to the user to have a program stop
 abruptly, the error needs to be dealt with as quickly as possible or the
 problem will perpetuate. The abort in this case is a deliberate one, i.e.
 it is intended to occur and not meant to be trapped programmatically.

 I'll address this internally as well.

But Leroy, the program neither aborts nor takes the ON ERROR branch, it
takes the ELSE branch and continues.

Craig
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RE: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-26 Thread Glenn Herbert
Exactly!  When I implemented the blink checking logic (wow 10 yrs ago!) it 
was decided that this WAS a FATAL, stopping the current process in its 
tracks with that nice blink error message so that it could be fixed 
immediately.   Has the logic changed since 9.6 in uv such that a blink is 
no longer an immediate FATAL?   It sounds that way, since there would never 
have been a chance to take an ELSE or ON ERROR clause.  Just curious to 
know since I added that functionality.  Thanks!

At 02:13 AM 7/26/2004, you wrote:
Sorry, but I have to disagree. File corruption is not something you should
ever ignore, not even for a moment. You have no idea what the problem
really is, and to let it go is a bad thing that will only get worse.
Since UniVerse doesn't have two-phased commits, there is no way to have UV
handle ROLLBACK and ABORT TRANSACTION and have a foreign database
understand do the same. You must be code it yourself, which it sounds like
you are doing. UV will roll back its own transactions but we cannot roll
back transactions within foreign databases without the programmer forcibly
doing so through coding.
Since the ELSE clause is taken anyway (whether or not is moot for your
purposes), you can still do your rollbacks and so forth through your code.
As I mentioned in my last post (not on this particular thread), it has been
this way since blink checking was introduced, and that has been for a
number of years. This is really nothing new.
Regards,
LeRoy F. Dreyfuss
Advanced Technical Services - U2 Technology Analyst
IBM U2 Data Management Solutions
Tel: 303-672-1254  Fax: 303-294-4832
Mobile: 720-341-4317
External email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WWW:  http://www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support
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Online!
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 David Jordan
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 stserver.u2ug.org
   Subject
   RE: [U2] [UV] File corruption
 07/25/2004 09:16  error, but ON ERROR branch not
 PMtaken
 Please respond to
 u2-users


Hi LeRoy
Although an immediate abort is probably ideal to prevent further damage to
a
situation, the ON ERROR clause enables us to identify to operators and
support staff the issue that caused a problem as well as deal with
transactions with 3rd party database including roll backs, issues with web
services and message queques.
I had a scenrio, where an upgrade of UniVerse introduced a bug that caused
a
fatal termination of UniVerse.  Not only was this difficult to debug, but
the fatal did not release the UniVerse licenses.  Trying to resolve the
issue remotely was a nightmare.  I eventually tracked down that the
UniVerse
bug caused a file not to be opened when it should have been.  The next step
then started a transaction on an unassigned file variable and caused a
fatal
that terminated the session without going through an on-error clause.  I
think an unassigned file variable could have gone to the on error clause
without causing any other damage.  (although the application had been
tested
on the new release, the bug only occurred after the programs were compiled
on the new release)
Programmaticaly handling fatals, although not always easy, is highly
important for mission critical applications like 24x7 banking.
Regards
David Jordan
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Leroy Dreyfuss
Sent: Monday, 26 July 2004 11:53 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken
When (if?) we find a solution I'll post the results. IBM have suggested
that the initial corruption problem which sent us this way is patched
in UV 10.0.17 or later (including 10.1), but they believe that not
taking the ON ERROR clause when a blink error is encountered may be a
bug.
I am not sure I would agree that blink errors not taking ON ERROR clauses
is
a defect. While inconvenient to the user to have a program stop abruptly,
the error needs to be dealt with as quickly as possible or the problem will
perpetuate. The abort in this case is a deliberate one, i.e. it is intended
to occur and not meant to be trapped programmatically.
I'll address this internally as well.
Regards,
LeRoy F. Dreyfuss
Advanced Technical Services - U2 Technology Analyst
IBM U2 Data Management Solutions
Tel: 303-672-1254  Fax: 303-294-4832
Mobile: 720-341-4317
External email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WWW:  http://www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support
www.ibm.com/software/data/u2

Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-26 Thread Clifton Oliver
How does the application program determine it is in the ELSE clause due 
to an error rather than due to record not found?

--
Regards,
Clif
On Jul 25, 2004, at 23:13, Leroy Dreyfuss wrote:
Since the ELSE clause is taken anyway (whether or not is moot for your
purposes), you can still do your rollbacks and so forth through your 
code.
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Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-26 Thread Craig Bennett
Leroy,
But Leroy, the program neither aborts nor takes the ON ERROR branch, it
takes the ELSE branch and continues.
That might be a problem. I guess you see something in the errlog file, but
does anything display on the screen? If so, then perhaps that is a problem.
The code is a bit tricky and blink errors are tested a bit deep in it, but
it should probably be a non-recoverable fatal error that drops to TCL
regardless of the clause used.
On the other hand, it is coded such that it takes the ELSE clause, probably
not being set as fatal. it has also been that way since blink checking was
added to UV, and that has been for quite a few years. I am not sure why
this behavior is a problem now.
The user sees a message, there is an entry in errlog and then it takes 
the ELSE branch -- as you say, a problem. I have a case open with 
techsupport in Australia and hope to supply them with more information 
today.

regards,
Craig
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RE: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-26 Thread Leroy Dreyfuss
Since it was said that the ELSE clause is being taken when a blink error
occurs, I am still not sure why this cannot be dealt with as before.
Recently it was stated that the need for ON ERROR in this situation was to
deal with allowing foreign systems to roll back and what not. In the ELSE
clause as with ON ERROR, STATUS() is set to indicate the potential problem.
If the error is a write error, then the error number returned comes from
SYS.MESSAGE. It does sound like in that circumstance, the issue can still
be dealt with. However, as Dave Meeks said, it is intended to fall over and
alert the user to the problem.

I couldn't find where this anything has changed in this area of our code,
nor could I reproduce the condition of it taking the ELSE clause.


Regards,

LeRoy F. Dreyfuss
Advanced Technical Services - U2 Technology Analyst
IBM U2 Data Management Solutions
Tel: 303-672-1254  Fax: 303-294-4832
Mobile: 720-341-4317
External email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WWW:  http://www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support

www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support - Open, Query, Update, Search -
Online!

Don't miss out on the IBM DB2 Information Management Technical Conference
September 19-24, 2004 - Las Vegas, NV



 David Jordan
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   RE: [U2] [UV] File corruption
 07/26/2004 04:50  error, but ON ERROR branch not
 PMtaken


 Please respond to
 u2-users






The problem here is if the abort does not return through the On Error
clause, programmers cannot force roll backs on other applications, cannot
report errors to operators and support staff or in anyway gracefully stop
the application.  One of the main reason for the ON ERROR clause was to
deal
with fatal issues.  If this is not possible in the current structure of Uv
is there an alternative.

As software developers, our applications are compared to products on
Oracle,
DB2, etc.  Does DB2 just abort an application if it hits a corrupted table,
or does it return a message for products like MQ series, two phase commits
and other proceses to allow a gracefull close to an exit?

I would sugggest that this is something worth reviewing in enhancements as
it is becoming a major issue in mission critical applications.

Regards

David Jordan



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Leroy Dreyfuss
Sent: Monday, 26 July 2004 4:14 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken


Sorry, but I have to disagree. File corruption is not something you should
ever ignore, not even for a moment. You have no idea what the problem
really
is, and to let it go is a bad thing that will only get worse.
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Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-26 Thread Leroy Dreyfuss
Perhaps it is a problem, perhaps not. Have you corrected the blink error?
If you are finding you have blink issues on a somewhat frequent basis,
perhaps the focus is not in the right place? I might be trying to ascertain
why my files are becoming damaged and worry about how BASIC deals with it
after the corruption is taken care of. That takes the pressure of you and
allows you to reproduce the BASIC concern in a controlled environment for
support.

I am not convinced hiding behind ON ERROR when file corruption is detected
is the right thing to do. But, someday putting a toggle in uvconfig might
make everyone happy. Perhaps someday.


Regards,

LeRoy F. Dreyfuss
Advanced Technical Services - U2 Technology Analyst
IBM U2 Data Management Solutions
Tel: 303-672-1254  Fax: 303-294-4832
Mobile: 720-341-4317
External email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WWW:  http://www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support

www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support - Open, Query, Update, Search -
Online!

Don't miss out on the IBM DB2 Information Management Technical Conference
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 Craig Bennett
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   Subject
   Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption
 07/26/2004 05:05  error, but ON ERROR branch not
 PMtaken


 Please respond to
 u2-users






Leroy,

But Leroy, the program neither aborts nor takes the ON ERROR branch, it
takes the ELSE branch and continues.

 That might be a problem. I guess you see something in the errlog file,
but
 does anything display on the screen? If so, then perhaps that is a
problem.
 The code is a bit tricky and blink errors are tested a bit deep in it,
but
 it should probably be a non-recoverable fatal error that drops to TCL
 regardless of the clause used.

 On the other hand, it is coded such that it takes the ELSE clause,
probably
 not being set as fatal. it has also been that way since blink checking
was
 added to UV, and that has been for quite a few years. I am not sure why
 this behavior is a problem now.

The user sees a message, there is an entry in errlog and then it takes
the ELSE branch -- as you say, a problem. I have a case open with
techsupport in Australia and hope to supply them with more information
today.


regards,


Craig
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Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-26 Thread Craig Bennett
I couldn't find where this anything has changed in this area of our code,
nor could I reproduce the condition of it taking the ELSE clause.
Leroy,
I have a corrupted file which reports the following on a READ from the 
corrupted group:
  File '/path/FILE':
  Computed blink of 0x74617C20 does not match expected blink of 0x0!
  Detected within group starting at address 0x172000!
  Program *cross*TESTCRPT: Line 10, Internal data error.

And then takes the ELSE branch. STATUS is 0.
No ABORT, no ON ERROR, no way to tell a group is corrupt.
I'm just about to send this to Jonathan Evans in IBM Australia.
regards,
Craig
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Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-25 Thread Leroy Dreyfuss
When (if?) we find a solution I'll post the results. IBM have suggested
that the initial corruption problem which sent us this way is patched in
UV 10.0.17 or later (including 10.1), but they believe that not taking
the ON ERROR clause when a blink error is encountered may be a bug.

I am not sure I would agree that blink errors not taking ON ERROR clauses
is a defect. While inconvenient to the user to have a program stop
abruptly, the error needs to be dealt with as quickly as possible or the
problem will perpetuate. The abort in this case is a deliberate one, i.e.
it is intended to occur and not meant to be trapped programmatically.

I'll address this internally as well.


Regards,

LeRoy F. Dreyfuss
Advanced Technical Services - U2 Technology Analyst
IBM U2 Data Management Solutions
Tel: 303-672-1254  Fax: 303-294-4832
Mobile: 720-341-4317
External email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WWW:  http://www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support

www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support - Open, Query, Update, Search -
Online!

Don't miss out on the IBM DB2 Information Management Technical Conference
September 19-24, 2004 - Las Vegas, NV



 Craig Bennett
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 auTo
 Sent by:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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 stserver.u2ug.org
   Subject
   Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption
 07/25/2004 05:37  error, but ON ERROR branchnot
 PMtaken


 Please respond to
 u2-users






 The suggestion made by Ray using uvbackup as a check of files is the
 philosophy we have adopted after experiencing this type of corruption.
We
 run this every Saturday night over all our files and email the result
 reporting any likely problems.

We are still discussing this one with IBM. They suggested that fixtool
in UV 10.0.14 or later will find more errors than uvbackup.

When (if?) we find a solution I'll post the results. IBM have suggested
that the initial corruption problem which sent us this way is patched in
UV 10.0.17 or later (including 10.1), but they believe that not taking
the ON ERROR clause when a blink error is encountered may be a bug.


Craig
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Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-25 Thread Craig Bennett
I am not sure I would agree that blink errors not taking ON ERROR clauses
is a defect. While inconvenient to the user to have a program stop
abruptly, the error needs to be dealt with as quickly as possible or the
problem will perpetuate. The abort in this case is a deliberate one, i.e.
it is intended to occur and not meant to be trapped programmatically.
I'll address this internally as well.
But Leroy, the program neither aborts nor takes the ON ERROR branch, it 
takes the ELSE branch and continues.

Craig
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RE: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-25 Thread David Jordan
Hi LeRoy

Although an immediate abort is probably ideal to prevent further damage to a
situation, the ON ERROR clause enables us to identify to operators and
support staff the issue that caused a problem as well as deal with
transactions with 3rd party database including roll backs, issues with web
services and message queques.

I had a scenrio, where an upgrade of UniVerse introduced a bug that caused a
fatal termination of UniVerse.  Not only was this difficult to debug, but
the fatal did not release the UniVerse licenses.  Trying to resolve the
issue remotely was a nightmare.  I eventually tracked down that the UniVerse
bug caused a file not to be opened when it should have been.  The next step
then started a transaction on an unassigned file variable and caused a fatal
that terminated the session without going through an on-error clause.  I
think an unassigned file variable could have gone to the on error clause
without causing any other damage.  (although the application had been tested
on the new release, the bug only occurred after the programs were compiled
on the new release)

Programmaticaly handling fatals, although not always easy, is highly
important for mission critical applications like 24x7 banking.

Regards

David Jordan

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Leroy Dreyfuss
Sent: Monday, 26 July 2004 11:53 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken


When (if?) we find a solution I'll post the results. IBM have suggested 
that the initial corruption problem which sent us this way is patched 
in UV 10.0.17 or later (including 10.1), but they believe that not 
taking the ON ERROR clause when a blink error is encountered may be a 
bug.

I am not sure I would agree that blink errors not taking ON ERROR clauses is
a defect. While inconvenient to the user to have a program stop abruptly,
the error needs to be dealt with as quickly as possible or the problem will
perpetuate. The abort in this case is a deliberate one, i.e. it is intended
to occur and not meant to be trapped programmatically.

I'll address this internally as well.


Regards,

LeRoy F. Dreyfuss
Advanced Technical Services - U2 Technology Analyst
IBM U2 Data Management Solutions
Tel: 303-672-1254  Fax: 303-294-4832
Mobile: 720-341-4317
External email:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
WWW:  http://www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support

www.ibm.com/software/data/u2/support - Open, Query, Update, Search - Online!

Don't miss out on the IBM DB2 Information Management Technical Conference
September 19-24, 2004 - Las Vegas, NV
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Memo: Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-20 Thread asvin . dattani
Hi Craig,

What we do here is to produce a como whenever a program is run from the
menu system and then to check the como for common errors such as variable
not assigned a value etc.

The menu system executes a como on before executing the program. When the
program returns back to the menu system, it reads the como record from
COMO and searches for error strings. If it finds any, it logs the error
and disables that program so that it cant be run again. If the como is
clean, then it is deleted.

Perhaps you could use a similar system...

cheers,

asvin.




Craig Bennett [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 20 Jul 2004 03:16

Please respond to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Sent by:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

To:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
cc:
bcc:

Subject:Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not
taken


Hi All,

we have a site which is experiencing file corruption problems (in one
particular file).
The clients are trying to find problems in their SAN etc, and have
created the errlog item in the UV account so we are logging the
Internal Data Error messages when the corruption occurs (UV 10.0.7,
AIX 5.1, no details for the SAN). I believe that the client has not
applied APAR IY35927 for AIX as previously suggested on the list,
despite our hope that this may fix the problem. At some point they will
upgrade to UV 10.1, but I don't know when).

Leaving aside the problem underling the corruption, we wanted to try and
catch this error and halt the sytem until the file has been fixed.

We tried testing a copy of the corrupted file:

We wrote this program:
PROGRAM TESTCRPT
OPEN CRPT TO CRPT ELSE STOP

READ AREC FROM CRPT,X ON ERROR
 PRINT ERROR :STATUS()
 STOP
END ELSE
 PRINT ELSE
END
END

I was expecting the ON ERROR clause to be taken, but when we run the
program we see:

RUN PGMS TESTCRPT

   File '/data/TEST/CRPT':

   Computed blink of 0x74617C20 does not match expected blink of 0x0!

   Detected within group starting at address 0x172000!

   Program TESTCRPT: Line 4, Internal data error.

ELSE

Can anyone tell me why the ON ERROR clause is not taken?
Or suggest another way that we can programmaticaly tell that this error
has occurred?


thanks,


Craig
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Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-19 Thread Craig Bennett
Hi All,
we have a site which is experiencing file corruption problems (in one 
particular file).
The clients are trying to find problems in their SAN etc, and have 
created the errlog item in the UV account so we are logging the 
Internal Data Error messages when the corruption occurs (UV 10.0.7, 
AIX 5.1, no details for the SAN). I believe that the client has not 
applied APAR IY35927 for AIX as previously suggested on the list, 
despite our hope that this may fix the problem. At some point they will 
upgrade to UV 10.1, but I don't know when).

Leaving aside the problem underling the corruption, we wanted to try and 
catch this error and halt the sytem until the file has been fixed.

We tried testing a copy of the corrupted file:
We wrote this program:
PROGRAM TESTCRPT
OPEN CRPT TO CRPT ELSE STOP
READ AREC FROM CRPT,X ON ERROR
PRINT ERROR :STATUS()
STOP
END ELSE
PRINT ELSE
END
END
I was expecting the ON ERROR clause to be taken, but when we run the 
program we see:

RUN PGMS TESTCRPT
  File '/data/TEST/CRPT':
  Computed blink of 0x74617C20 does not match expected blink of 0x0!
  Detected within group starting at address 0x172000!
  Program TESTCRPT: Line 4, Internal data error.
ELSE
Can anyone tell me why the ON ERROR clause is not taken?
Or suggest another way that we can programmaticaly tell that this error 
has occurred?

thanks,
Craig
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RE: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-19 Thread David Jordan
Try the On Error with the file open command, the error may be occuring at
the file open.
Have you played aroubnd with the FILEINFO Command, that may pick up the
issue.  I have noticed in the path if there is an error with the File
Variable that the on error clause does not work in the read statement.


Regards

David Jordan

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Craig Bennett
Sent: Tuesday, 20 July 2004 12:16 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken


Hi All,

we have a site which is experiencing file corruption problems (in one 
particular file).
The clients are trying to find problems in their SAN etc, and have 
created the errlog item in the UV account so we are logging the 
Internal Data Error messages when the corruption occurs (UV 10.0.7, 
AIX 5.1, no details for the SAN). I believe that the client has not 
applied APAR IY35927 for AIX as previously suggested on the list, 
despite our hope that this may fix the problem. At some point they will 
upgrade to UV 10.1, but I don't know when).

Leaving aside the problem underling the corruption, we wanted to try and 
catch this error and halt the sytem until the file has been fixed.

We tried testing a copy of the corrupted file:

We wrote this program:
PROGRAM TESTCRPT
OPEN CRPT TO CRPT ELSE STOP

READ AREC FROM CRPT,X ON ERROR
PRINT ERROR :STATUS()
STOP
END ELSE
PRINT ELSE
END
END

I was expecting the ON ERROR clause to be taken, but when we run the 
program we see:

RUN PGMS TESTCRPT

   File '/data/TEST/CRPT':

   Computed blink of 0x74617C20 does not match expected blink of 0x0!

   Detected within group starting at address 0x172000!

   Program TESTCRPT: Line 4, Internal data error.

ELSE

Can anyone tell me why the ON ERROR clause is not taken?
Or suggest another way that we can programmaticaly tell that this error 
has occurred?


thanks,


Craig
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Re: [U2] [UV] File corruption error, but ON ERROR branch not taken

2004-07-19 Thread Craig Bennett
Try the On Error with the file open command, the error may be occuring at
the file open.
Have you played aroubnd with the FILEINFO Command, that may pick up the
issue.  I have noticed in the path if there is an error with the File
Variable that the on error clause does not work in the read statement.
Thanks for the suggestion David, I tried that, but the corruption is 
occuring in a specific group the OPEN works fine.

Craig
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