Bob,
I'm getting ready to work on implementing what you suggested.
Could you take a look at this sketch to see if this is what you are
suggesting for hooking up the oscilloscope?
http://www.lenr-coldfusion.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/08/power-measurement.png
I won't be able to do 10 amps for
Hi Jack,
I have started doing a little digging into the electrical implementation of
typical spot welders. Basically it appears that the spot welder arms are
just the output of a low voltage transformer (probably with a saturating
core). What this means is that the output will be AC current and
Hi Jack,
I have created some diagrams to help communicate the setups that I am going
to describe. It on my Google drive at:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5Pc25a4cOM2MTlIX1pwMC1PdHc/edit?usp=sharing
These setups presume that when you measure between the high current bars
and the pins of
Hi Bob,
Unfortunately, I do not get infinite resistance. On the plugin ground pin,
I get 1 ohm on the bottom electrode bar and the top bar I get different
behavior. Specifically, when the top and bottom electrodes are close
together, but not touching, I get infinite resistance between the top
Hi Jack,
That is unfortunate. We need to find a schematic for this spot welder or
open it up and create one. It could be the secondary is just grounded to
the ground pin. If so, we need to know how it is grounded. Ground loops,
when such high currents are involved, can ruin your test
I haven't been able to find anything. It is an Arksen. S/N 009-we-90309
Regardless, I need to take it apart anyway. I need to add a connection to
control the ignition switch programmatically. Otherwise, it puts a lot
more power into the material than needed after the light has already
On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 8:47 PM, Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com wrote:
In the final analysis, the actual topics that are being discussed are
not that relevant in the present context. It's the hijacking of the
conversation in a direction that people have expressed displeasure with and
On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 1:16 AM, Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com wrote:
***Then why do some Vorts say that the discussion is not for Vortex, even
when the thread title is obviously [OT Off Topic]?
Just my personal view on this one. There are some off-topic discussions
that are benign and
There are some off-topic discussions that are benign and others that lead
to flamewars because they're polarizing and contentious.
***What we need for the internet is a heavily moderated TIP (Third
Independent Party) website where the discussion can be transferred and
disputes settled. I'm
On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 10:06 AM, Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com
wrote:
The topic of aliens is totally benign,
***I have not found that topic to be benign.
I'm not talking about in discussions about aliens in general, I'm talking
about discussions about them in the context of Vortex. I've
So... you think the topic is totally benign here on Vortex. I think it
isn't. Go ahead and post the topic and we shall see.If one side thinks
it's magic water lilies, and the other side thinks it's pixie dust, then do
the forum rules apply to both sides? No sneering, that kind of thing? Or
You're just going to reply to anything I say.
On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 10:28 AM, Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com
wrote:
So... you think the topic is totally benign here on Vortex. I think it
isn't. Go ahead and post the topic and we shall see.If one side thinks
it's magic water
If you want to avoid giving a real reply, such an answer is suitable.
Why do you post if you don't want someone to reply? Why do you evade from
giving an intelligent response?
On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 10:29 AM, Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com wrote:
You're just going to reply to anything I
I just realized that what you said upthread is an interesting and perhaps
appropriate reply:
I will take your cavalier response as an indication that you don't care
about whether you're being a burden on other people on this list...
But then, you used it as a pretext to engage in censorship when
On Fri, Aug 29, 2014 at 1:39 PM, Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com wrote:
Perhaps you should get in touch with Bill Beaty
and ask him to censor you as well, for generating such a cavalier response.
Bill does not censor, he relegates you to vortex...@eskimo.com a sort
of purgatory. When you
-
From: Eric Walker
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2014 11:06 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
On Wed, Aug 27, 2014 at 5:50 PM, Jojo Iznart jojoiznar...@gmail.com wrote:
PS. Most of my responses are answers to queries. Carbon Dating
: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It's a slow time. If something interesting occurs, I'm sure people will stop
asking me questions and I will stop responding.
You should not begrudge a few off-topic discussions. It helps while the time
away. Besides, I am not starting
Evolutionists here:
I have a simple question:
1. What is your best evidence of Darwinian Evolution occuring?
From: jojoiznar...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Date: Thu, 28 Aug 2014 18:28:48 +0800
It's a slow time
accuse me of spamming this forum.
Jojo
- Original Message -
From: Sunil Shah
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2014 9:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Jojo said: Besides, I am not starting these threads.
Hehe : ) Yes
Some of the oldest tree on record are older than the flood.
http://www.rmtrr.org/oldlist.htm
https://answersingenesis.org/bible-timeline/timeline-for-the-flood/
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com
On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 3:28 AM, Jojo Iznart jojoiznar...@gmail.com wrote:
It's a slow time. If something interesting occurs, I'm sure people will
stop asking me questions and I will stop responding.
You should not begrudge a few off-topic discussions. It helps while the
time away.
Thanks, Eric. While I deeply sympathize with the plight of the
irrationally religious and believe they are due more than mere tolerance as
long as they don't impose, the non-imposition condition has clearly been
breached.
On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 11:16 AM, Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 3:28 AM, Jojo Iznart jojoiznar...@gmail.com wrote:
It's a slow time. If something interesting occurs, I'm sure people will
stop asking me questions and I will stop responding.
You should not begrudge
I did not get booted out from there.
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
danieldi...@gmail.com
I have seen the problem with measuring the input. To me it seems simple
although that might because I am ingnorant.
Why don't you just put a low ohm (10mohm) and hook up the scope over that?
For what it's worth...
I do not want to see Jojo get banned. NTL, I suspect there are a few on this
list who may still consider Jojo on probation, considering some past posting
behavior that in all honesty really did get way out of hand. But enuf said
about that.
I would like to point
On Thu, Aug 28, 2014 at 7:39 PM, Orionworks - Steven Vincent Johnson
orionwo...@charter.net wrote:
The point is, there is NO ONE on this planet that I know who doesn't
possess a personal collection of faults for which they are trying to find a
better way of juggling in a more elegant way.
In reply to Jojo Iznart's message of Tue, 26 Aug 2014 21:37:25 +0800:
Hi,
[snip]
Yeah, looks like the last two are indeed more intense. Could it just be a
trick of the camera? Does it really look more intense in person?
If it is indeed more intense, I think Randy may have something
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
On Tue, Aug 26, 2014 at 4:39 PM, Bob Higgins rj.bob.higg...@gmail.com
wrote:
If you embed the electrodes reasonably well into the water, you may be
able to avoid most of the error for the heat that goes into the electrodes.
Asking
with or without water just in
principle.
Dave
-Original Message-
From: Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tue, Aug 26, 2014 10:49 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
On Tue, Aug 26, 2014 at 4:39 PM, Bob Higgins
Last night it struck me that these voltage measurements are going to
require a compensating loop to subtract out the induced voltage in the
measurement loops. If you had a simple twisted pair wire to make the
measurement, you would still end up with a measurement loop through which
the magnetic
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 9:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Last night it struck me that these voltage measurements are going to require
a compensating loop to subtract out the induced voltage in the measurement
loops. If you had
This type of spot welder is likely to deliver something in the range of
50-300 joules, without any means of controlling it (but measurable). Mills
only claims that he should be able to detonate his wet particles with 5
joules and get the same output, but has never demonstrated this AFAIK. The
this,
we can control how much input energy is being delivered. From there, we can
verify the 5J claim.
Jojo
- Original Message -
From: Bob Higgins
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 10:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
In his previous bomb calorimetry, only a COP of about 2 was reported. I
have previously pointed out in detail the flaw in this calorimetry owing to
the variable heat taken away by the large copper electrodes between the
control and the actual experiment. Because of this flaw, the COP could be
a hydrino transition
reaction. Remember Ed's mantra - you can not ignore the Chemical environment.
Jojo
- Original Message -
From: Bob Higgins
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 11:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
In his
It would appear that you are not qualified to say that calorimetry using
water is a non-starter. First, in DI water there is no electrolyte added
(just the opposite) and there will be no current flowing through this water
being used to capture the heat and thermalize the UV. The DI water has no
to answer this for himself so that he can decide
which direction to go. This is his experiment after all.
Jojo
- Original Message -
From: Bob Higgins
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2014 1:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
You do not appear to know what you are talking about; except in one
respect: You are correct that it is Jack's experiment and his course of
action is absolutely his choice.
My inputs to this topic are terminated. I have no intention to
contributing to this becoming a flame like some of the
: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
You do not appear to know what you are talking about; except in one respect:
You are correct that it is Jack's experiment and his course of action is
absolutely his choice.
My inputs to this topic are terminated. I have no intention
On Wed, Aug 27, 2014 at 5:50 PM, Jojo Iznart jojoiznar...@gmail.com wrote:
PS. Most of my responses are answers to queries. Carbon Dating is
science (supposedly) and Darwinian Evolution is science (as Jed would
claim) so what off topic flame are you referring to. Responses to
religious
...@aol.com wrote:
Good warning. Chlorine gas can do great damage to your lungs and even
cause death.
Dave
-Original Message-
From: Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Mon, Aug 25, 2014 11:02 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication
was that the spark with or without fuel (water pellets)?
Jojo
- Original Message -
From: Jack Cole
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2014 9:15 AM
Subject: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Hi Folks,
I was excited to receive my spot welder
great damage to your lungs and even
cause death.
Dave
-Original Message-
From: Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Mon, Aug 25, 2014 11:02 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
On Mon, Aug 25, 2014 at 7:59 PM, Jack Cole
:
was that the spark with or without fuel (water pellets)?
Jojo
- Original Message -
*From:* Jack Cole jcol...@gmail.com
*To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Sent:* Tuesday, August 26, 2014 9:15 AM
*Subject:* [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Hi Folks,
I was excited to receive my
, August 26, 2014 6:39 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It was with a tiny piece of copper wire that I dipped in water and put
between the electrodes. The amount of water is minuscule (the amount that
managed to adhere to the metal). You don't get that without
:* Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It was with a tiny piece of copper wire that I dipped in water and put
between the electrodes. The amount of water is minuscule (the amount that
managed to adhere to the metal). You don't get that without the water.
On Tue, Aug 26, 2014 at 5
: Tuesday, August 26, 2014 7:06 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Yes, I was planning to do that. I'll make a video of each test case. I'll
try with just the electrodes, with the copper wire only, and then dip it in
water.
I'm also planning to try with titanium
-
*From:* Jack Cole jcol...@gmail.com
*To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Sent:* Tuesday, August 26, 2014 7:06 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Yes, I was planning to do that. I'll make a video of each test case.
I'll try with just the electrodes, with the copper wire
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Jojo,
I'll see if I can accomplish that. In the meantime, here are the results of
testing.
http://www.lenr-coldfusion.com/2014/08/26/sun-cell-lite-testing/
We do get sparks without dipping in water. The last two are after
Jack Cole, I will give you a few tips.
Do not try pressures above 10milibars. It will hardly block FUV. And you
need vacuum to detect XUV.
Also, do not get in contact directly with the firing. These can yield
neutrons and you can get very high doses overtime.
--
Daniel Rocha - RJ
- Original Message -
*From:* Jack Cole jcol...@gmail.com
*To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Sent:* Tuesday, August 26, 2014 8:39 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Jojo,
I'll see if I can accomplish that. In the meantime, here are the results
of testing
It seems to me that Jack needs to find some way of objectively measuring
light output through some sort of instrumentation. Any ideas?
On Tue, Aug 26, 2014 at 10:54 AM, Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com
wrote:
Jack Cole, I will give you a few tips.
Do not try pressures above 10milibars. It
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It does look more intense. I also got to thinking that the electrodes could
have condensation on them, thus producing a little bit of the effect. After I
wiped them down and did another control run with electrodes only, there was
very
: Axil Axil
To: vortex-l
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2014 11:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It seems to me that Jack needs to find some way of objectively measuring
light output through some sort of instrumentation. Any ideas?
On Tue, Aug 26, 2014 at 10
Iznart jojoiznar...@gmail.com wrote:
was that the spark with or without fuel (water pellets)?
Jojo
- Original Message -
From: Jack Cole
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2014 9:15 AM
Subject: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Hi
:* Tuesday, August 26, 2014 11:38 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It seems to me that Jack needs to find some way of objectively measuring
light output through some sort of instrumentation. Any ideas?
On Tue, Aug 26, 2014 at 10:54 AM, Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com
*To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Sent:* Tuesday, August 26, 2014 11:31 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It does look more intense. I also got to thinking that the electrodes
could have condensation on them, thus producing a little bit of the effect.
After I wiped them down and did
on the electrodes.
Jojo
- Original Message -
From: David Roberson
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 12:01 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Interesting results Jack. Could it be that with copper only the conductivity
of the path
match with the water film.
Dave
-Original Message-
From: Jack Cole jcol...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tue, Aug 26, 2014 6:39 am
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It was with a tiny piece of copper wire that I dipped in water and put
. Another option is an oscilloscope on the
electrodes.
Jojo
- Original Message -
*From:* David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com
*To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Sent:* Wednesday, August 27, 2014 12:01 AM
*Subject:* Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Interesting results Jack
that this is a weakness in his test system.
Dave
-Original Message-
From: Jack Cole jcol...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tue, Aug 26, 2014 12:22 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
David, the spot welder works with extremely low impedance to begin
.
Dave
-Original Message-
From: Jack Cole jcol...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tue, Aug 26, 2014 12:06 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Thanks Jojo.
I use the same piece of wire for the control and experimental. The only
difference
...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tue, Aug 26, 2014 12:18 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Dave,
A very thin film of water on a piece of wire should not change the impedance
that much. Certainly not explain the clearly more intense light output
-
*From:* David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com
*To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Sent:* Wednesday, August 27, 2014 12:01 AM
*Subject:* Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Interesting results Jack. Could it be that with copper only the
conductivity of the path is so low that the voltage is nearly
- Original Message -
*From:* David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com
*To:* vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Sent:* Wednesday, August 27, 2014 12:01 AM
*Subject:* Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Interesting results Jack. Could it be that with copper only the
conductivity of the path
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It was with a tiny piece of copper wire that I dipped in water and
put between the electrodes. The amount of water is minuscule (the amount
that managed to adhere to the metal). You don't get that without the
water.
On Tue, Aug 26
Now that I have demonstrated a roughly equivalent level of light with
nitinol (comparing dry and dipped in water), I believe it invalidates the
hypothesis that there is something special going on here. The light
intensity with nitinol was far greater than any other trial with or without
the
There are detectors commercially available, but I think the most expensive
part is to keep this near vacuum. But, let me warn that it is likely that
all will be seen is hot fusion. What is happening is z-pinch, which is an
even older attempt than Tokamak.
2014-08-26 12:38 GMT-03:00 Axil Axil
Jack,
You are on the verge of the LENR precipice - where you dive off into the
meat of the phenomenon. What you are seeing is that it is hard to discover
whether anything special has been achieved. How do you whether something
special has happened? Well, you need to measure the energy balance.
your
argument. Any Ideas on how to measure input power accurately?
Jojo
- Original Message -
From: David Roberson
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 1:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Note that the constantan wire
: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 12:27 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
I don't know how to measure the input power. We're talking 2-5V and
3000-4000 amps. I'd be scared to hook my oscilloscope up to it. You could
maybe do it on the supply side from the 110AC with a watt
@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 1:59 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It is the initial contact point that I am thinking about Jojo. The water in
that immediate path should rapidly turn into gas or plasma due to the energy
deposited
On Tue, Aug 26, 2014 at 4:39 PM, Bob Higgins rj.bob.higg...@gmail.com
wrote:
If you embed the electrodes reasonably well into the water, you may be able
to avoid most of the error for the heat that goes into the electrodes.
Asking as someone who knows little about electronics, what are the
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tue, Aug 26, 2014 8:18 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Dave, you have a valid argument.
However, it might also be possible that constantan is a material able to
catalyze an LENR (maybe hydrino transition) reaction more, hence, it would
Eric,
I am an EE. I would try it myself, but I don't have a spot welder. DI
water is very high resistance - essentially an insulator. But it won't stay
non-conductive for long if you are welding in it. One of the electrodes is
likely ground. To boot, you are normally connecting the electrodes
of the input energy at any
location except within close proximity to the load.
Dave
-Original Message-
From: Jojo Iznart jojoiznar...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tue, Aug 26, 2014 8:24 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
If you measure
, August 27, 2014 11:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
Eric,
I am an EE. I would try it myself, but I don't have a spot welder. DI water
is very high resistance - essentially an insulator. But it won't stay
non-conductive for long if you are welding
-
From: David Roberson
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2014 1:59 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
It is the initial contact point that I am thinking about Jojo. The water in
that immediate path should rapidly turn
refrain from
holding on to the electrodes with or without water just in principle.
Dave
-Original Message-
From: Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tue, Aug 26, 2014 10:49 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
On Tue, Aug 26
Hi Folks,
I was excited to receive my spot welder today. After ensuring it was in
working order, I decided to get right to it and see if I could get anything
like what BLP showed. Lo and behold I got something on the first try.
I remembered Mills talking about all the different possibilities
Dear Jack,
I would be interested in seeing what happens when some chlorine bleach is
used instead of water.
Chlorine produces a UV laser output when combined with hydrogen in an arc.
Mills uses chlorine and so did Papp.
On Mon, Aug 25, 2014 at 9:15 PM, Jack Cole jcol...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi Axil,
I can give that a try. What would you expect to see and how will we know
if UV is emitted?
Best,
Jack
On Mon, Aug 25, 2014 at 8:55 PM, Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:
Dear Jack,
I would be interested in seeing what happens when some chlorine bleach is
used instead of
On Mon, Aug 25, 2014 at 7:59 PM, Jack Cole jcol...@gmail.com wrote:
I can give that a try. What would you expect to see and how will we know
if UV is emitted?
Be careful about fumes. I recall reading that chlorine can form some
pretty nasty compounds under the right conditions.
Eric
A UV light, say at 244 nm or 300 nm, can not be seen at all with a human
eye. However if you put a piece of paper in its path the paper will glow
blue. This happens because the UV excites blue dyes in the paper (the paper
manufacturers put blue dyes in all papers to make them appear more
'white').
Good warning. Chlorine gas can do great damage to your lungs and even cause
death.
Dave
-Original Message-
From: Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Mon, Aug 25, 2014 11:02 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:SunCell - Initial Replication Attempt
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