Re: [WSG] How to make DHML cover flash

2007-10-17 Thread Tony Crockford
On 17 Oct 2007, at 04:56, Nick Cowie wrote: I was experimenting with HTML over flash, and while param name=wmode value=transparent / works great on Windows. The flash plugin could not get the order right for OsX or *nix, no matter what I tried (source order, z-index etc). It was purely

RE: [WSG] How to make DHML cover flash

2007-10-17 Thread Michael Kear
Nick I'm away from my Mac machine for a couple of weeks .. Do you think you (or someone else with a mac) could do me a favour and have a look at the page in question and tell me if the problem is fixed or not on your mac? It's not all that critical for us, because Macs aren't very big

Re: [WSG] How to make DHML cover flash

2007-10-17 Thread Tony Crockford
On 17 Oct 2007, at 08:01, Michael Kear wrote: Nick I'm away from my Mac machine for a couple of weeks .. Do you think you (or someone else with a mac) could do me a favour and have a look at the page in question and tell me if the problem is fixed or not on your mac? I see the dropdown

Re: [WSG] How to make DHML cover flash

2007-10-17 Thread Kit Grose
Mike, The drop-down menus drop down over the Flash for me in Safari 2.0.4 (on OS X v10.4.10), but not at all smoothly: the slide-down animation appears to flicker (especially noticeable on the stock service one). The flicker problem is an issue that happens a lot for Safari 2 users (but

Re: [WSG] How to make DHML cover flash

2007-10-17 Thread Nick Cowie
Michael No problems with flash and the menu on my Mac OsX 10.4.9 with FF, Safari or Opera Other than issues above, menu typeface is tiny in both FF and Opera, increasing font size to read them does do damage to the menus with FF, still usable though. Flickering is also visible for me with

Re: [WSG] introducing a prompt to download or open a pdf

2007-10-17 Thread Nick Fitzsimons
On 17 Oct 2007, at 04:50, Chris Knowles wrote: Kit Grose wrote: Just a note: Your function doesn't currently use the RegExp function for anything useful (you might as well use indexOf). RegExp is the right way to do it, though, so you can enforce word boundaries to match complete classNames

[WSG] References for best web video practices

2007-10-17 Thread Roberto Gorj√£o
Hi, I'm trying to write a paper on the use of video on the web. This paper might be used as reference on a web based organization, so I would like it to be thorough but precise. I'm looking for fundamental references on this subject. Could you point me to some of your bookmarks or other

Re: [WSG] introducing a prompt to download or open a pdf

2007-10-17 Thread Chris Knowles
Nick Fitzsimons wrote: Word boundaries aren't right either; for exmple, they will match a hyphen, so matching on some-thing will match some-thing-else. As per the HTML spec, class names are space-separated, so you need to match on spaces and the beginning or end of the string. of course,

[WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Rick Lecoat
Hi, can anyone tell me what is the best accessible way (if any) of encoding a mailto: link? I want to make the email addresses on a site usable to screen reader users, but don't want them harvested by spambots. Javascripted solutions seem like they would create a headache for screen readers,

RE: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Patrick Lauke
Rick Lecoat Is there a way out what seems, to my inexperienced eyes, like a catch-22 situation? Fix your spam issues at the mail server + mail client end, not at the web page end, would be my advice. P Patrick H. Lauke Web Editor Enterprise Development

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Chris Knowles
Rick Lecoat wrote: can anyone tell me what is the best accessible way (if any) of encoding a mailto: link? I want to make the email addresses on a site usable to screen reader users, but don't want them harvested by spambots. Javascripted solutions seem like they would create a headache

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Chris Knowles
Rick Lecoat Is there a way out what seems, to my inexperienced eyes, like a catch-22 situation? Patrick Lauke wrote: Fix your spam issues at the mail server + mail client end, not at the web page end, would be my advice. This is good advice and raises the question of whether theres

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Anders Nawroth
Hi! Chris Knowles skrev: maybe harvesters look for the ASCII value of the @ symbol and find addresses still? Some harvesters decodes the links, so this is not a solution to the spam problem. The decoding is really trivial to perform in most programming languages. /anders

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread David Dorward
On 17 Oct 2007, at 13:55, Rick Lecoat wrote: can anyone tell me what is the best accessible way (if any) of encoding a mailto: link? I want to make the email addresses on a site usable to screen reader users, but don't want them harvested by spambots. I, long ago, gave up trying. Methods

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Andrew Maben
On Oct 17, 2007, at 8:55 AM, Rick Lecoat wrote: can anyone tell me what is the best accessible way (if any) of encoding a mailto: link? To answer a question w/ a question: I have started encoding email address strings, but your question makes me wonder how accessible this may be? How

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Rick Lecoat
On 17/10/07 (14:16) Patrick said: Fix your spam issues at the mail server + mail client end, not at the web page end, would be my advice. David said: I, long ago, gave up trying. Methods are either highly ineffective, or block out users you want as well as spam bots. I take the view that

Re: [WSG] intranet benchmarking quiz

2007-10-17 Thread Carl Reynolds
plasmo wrote: Hi, I am currently reviewing an area of an intranet, and getting a lot of anecdotal comments such as all the intranets I've ever seen worked like this. To deal with this somewhat, I am taking a short quiz of people's experiences with their current intranets. If anyone here can

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Or Golan
Why not simply display the email address as a simple mailto only when the browser is a screen reader? On 10/17/07, Rick Lecoat [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 17/10/07 (14:16) Patrick said: Fix your spam issues at the mail server + mail client end, not at the web page end, would be my advice.

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Rick Lecoat
On 18/10/07 (15:20) Chris said: Well I guess now I really think about it you can't solve it as you could append an email address to the DOM from an obfuscated javascript function and that would likely solve the problem but it's not an accessible solution. For screen readers you need to have the

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Chris Knowles
Rick Lecoat wrote: I'm surprised that there isn't a workaround -- only because almost everything else that I thought would be impossible some clever person has found a way to do. Well I guess now I really think about it you can't solve it as you could append an email address to the DOM from an

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Rick Lecoat
On 17/10/07 (15:33) Or said: Why not simply display the email address as a simple mailto only when the browser is a screen reader? If you mean by CSS (display: none -- or similar -- for aural media types), I'm not sure that would work because AFAIk spambots just look through the source code of

Re: [WSG] How to make DHML cover flash

2007-10-17 Thread nate hanna
Michael, No problems with flash and the menu on my Mac OSX 10.4.10 with FF, and Safari 419.x (Tiger version (not the new beta)). Ditto on the font being too small on the drop-down menu (see the attachment); and with the movie taking too long to download (you may want to either break the movie up

RE: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Patrick Lauke
Because you can't detect when a screen reader is there or not... From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Or Golan Sent: 17 October 2007 15:33 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links Why not simply

RE: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Patrick Lauke
Rick Lecoat To join with Andrew Maben, however, I'd be curious to know whether spambots decode encoded entity text, eg: 'user' becomes '#117;#115;#101;#114;' (ignore quote marks). I assume that they can read them perfectly easily -- browsers can, after all -- but it'd

RE: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Patrick Lauke
Rick Lecoat If you are talking about actually hiding markup from certain agent types, I'd certainly like to know your method. Screen readers run on top of normal browsers like IE of Firefox, so user-agent-wise you won't be able to really distinguish them. You *may* be able to catch some

Re: [WSG] introducing a prompt to download or open a pdf

2007-10-17 Thread Nick Fitzsimons
On 17 Oct 2007, at 13:47, Chris Knowles wrote: Nick Fitzsimons wrote: Word boundaries aren't right either; for exmple, they will match a hyphen, so matching on some-thing will match some-thing-else. As per the HTML spec, class names are space-separated, so you need to match on spaces and

[WSG] javascript/DOM scripting in cross-browser-land

2007-10-17 Thread Ray Leventhal
Hi all, I've been lurking on this list for a bit and am now sending my first post/question. Having been looking for a client-side solution to sorting tabular data, I came upon a phenomenal script by Stuart Langridge called 'sorttable' [1]. Easy to implement, seemingly stable in all Win/6+

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Andrew Maben
On Oct 17, 2007, at 11:19 AM, Patrick Lauke wrote: All that would take for a spambot is to do a two-pass: replace all encoded entities, then scan the result for email-address-like patterns. Trivial. Thanks, Patrick - guess I'll abandon that effort... Andrew

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Mike at Green-Beast.com
Or Golan wrote: Why not simply display the email address as a simple mailto only when the browser is a screen reader? A screen reader attaches to a visual browser as an add-on thus it cannot be detected. It's a shame as that would solve some problems. Text browsers can be detected, but screen

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Rick Lecoat
On 17/10/07 (16:20) Patrick said: Screen readers run on top of normal browsers like IE of Firefox Ah, I did *not* know that -- I thought that they were a sort of self- contained browser themselves. Thanks for that heads-up. -- Rick Lecoat

[WSG] Site check requested

2007-10-17 Thread Rick Lecoat
Hi; I'm recreating a table-based site that I did a few years back, rebuilding it (hopefully) to web standards and making it as accessible as I can. Currently it's one static page and the links largely don't go anywhere, but I would appreciate feedback from the list before I proceed with more

Re: [WSG] intranet benchmarking quiz

2007-10-17 Thread Christian Snodgrass
plasmo wrote: Hi, I am currently reviewing an area of an intranet, and getting a lot of anecdotal comments such as all the intranets I've ever seen worked like this. To deal with this somewhat, I am taking a short quiz of people's experiences with their current intranets. If anyone here can

Re: [WSG] intranet benchmarking quiz

2007-10-17 Thread Hassan Schroeder
plasmo wrote: To deal with this somewhat, I am taking a short quiz of people's experiences with their current intranets. Though I'm a self-employed consultant now, I've been involved with a number of intranets dating back to one of the first (1994) cited here:

Re: [WSG] javascript/DOM scripting in cross-browser-land [UPDATE]

2007-10-17 Thread Ray Leventhal
Ray Leventhal wrote: Hi all, I've been lurking on this list for a bit and am now sending my first post/question. Having been looking for a client-side solution to sorting tabular data, I came upon a phenomenal script by Stuart Langridge called 'sorttable' [1]. Easy to implement,

Re: [WSG] javascript/DOM scripting in cross-browser-land [UPDATE]

2007-10-17 Thread Nick Fitzsimons
On 17 Oct 2007, at 17:29, Ray Leventhal wrote: Are there known issues with DOM scripts and Win/FF2, or is there something that I as a newbie to JS/DOM have overlooked? So, the question then becomes, is there an accessible and standards-valid way to make the script continue to execute? Not

Re: [WSG] javascript/DOM scripting in cross-browser-land

2007-10-17 Thread E Michael Brandt
[2] seems to sort just fine for me in FF2win. Just to muddy your waters. -- E. Michael Brandt www.divaHTML.com divaPOP : standards-compliant popup windows divaGPS : you-are-here menu highlighting divaFAQ : FAQ pages with pizazz www.valleywebdesigns.com/vwd_Vdw.asp JustSo PictureWindow

Re: [WSG] javascript/DOM scripting in cross-browser-land [UPDATE]

2007-10-17 Thread Ray Leventhal
Nick Fitzsimons wrote: On 17 Oct 2007, at 17:29, Ray Leventhal wrote: Are there known issues with DOM scripts and Win/FF2, or is there something that I as a newbie to JS/DOM have overlooked? So, the question then becomes, is there an accessible and standards-valid way to make the script

Re: [WSG] javascript/DOM scripting in cross-browser-land

2007-10-17 Thread Ray Leventhal
E Michael Brandt wrote: [2] seems to sort just fine for me in FF2win. Just to muddy your waters. Hi Michael, Yes, it works fine until one browses away and then back to it (not 'back', but to the specific URI). At that point, for me at least, the columns aren't sortable. Again, it may well

Re: [WSG] Site check requested :: Lecoat

2007-10-17 Thread David Laakso
Rick Lecoat wrote: Hi; I'm recreating a table-based site that I did a few years back, rebuilding it (hopefully) to web standards and making it as accessible as I can. Currently it's one static page and the links largely don't go anywhere, but I would appreciate feedback from the list before I

Re: [WSG] javascript/DOM scripting in cross-browser-land [UPDATE]

2007-10-17 Thread E Michael Brandt
I am indeed able to reproduce the problem following your steps. FF2/win reports a syntax error with line 1, the DTD. I'll be real interested to see the explanation that someone comes up with. Won't be me though! Sorry. -- E. Michael Brandt www.divaHTML.com divaPOP : standards-compliant

Re: [WSG] introducing a prompt to download or open a pdf

2007-10-17 Thread Chris Knowles
Nick Fitzsimons wrote: On 17 Oct 2007, at 13:47, Chris Knowles wrote: Nick Fitzsimons wrote: Word boundaries aren't right either; for exmple, they will match a hyphen, so matching on some-thing will match some-thing-else. As per the HTML spec, class names are space-separated, so you need to

RE: [WSG] How to make DHML cover flash

2007-10-17 Thread Michael Kear
Thanks for your help Nick, and all the others who helped me with this. This demo file is a rush job, done at a distance - the flash designer is a relative of the client and lives in China, and doesn't understand any English. Makes it difficult. So there are a number of design issues on

RE: [WSG] How to make DHML cover flash

2007-10-17 Thread Michael Kear
Gday Nate, Thanks for your comments. The reason for using wmode was to fix the problem that existed before. All I wanted was to make sure the dhtml drop down menu came down on top of the flash movie not underneath it. Is that not the best way ? Cheers Mike Kear Windsor, NSW,

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Dejan Kozina
Hello list. This is what I use in my Smarty templates: a href=mailto:{ #email#|escape:hex } { #email#|escape:hexentity } /a With this, [EMAIL PROTECTED] becomes: a href=mailto:%6d%65%40%6d%65%2e%63%6f%6d;

Re: [WSG] How to make DHML cover flash

2007-10-17 Thread Kit Grose
The reason for using wmode was to fix the problem that existed before. All I wanted was to make sure the dhtml drop down menu came down on top of the flash movie not underneath it. Is that not the best way ? I believe he's referring more to your use of wmode = transparent (rather than

Re: [WSG] introducing a prompt to download or open a pdf

2007-10-17 Thread Michael MD
My pet hate is people forcing pdfs to open in browser windows with javascript! A plain old ordinary link at least lets you right click and download - some of us hate having the browser locked up for ages locked up waiting for the slow pdf plugin to load. I think anything that takes more than

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Chris Williams
This technique (as well as almost all others in this thread) is/has been cracked by virtually every spam harvester. Security by obfuscation is no security at all. Just put in straightforward mailto: links pointing to a designated email address. Then help your customers get a good spam filter

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Nikita The Spider The Spider
On 10/17/07, Rick Lecoat [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, can anyone tell me what is the best accessible way (if any) of encoding a mailto: link? I want to make the email addresses on a site usable to screen reader users, but don't want them harvested by spambots. Hi Rick, You might be

[WSG] Offline Accessible Chat Room and CMS Software

2007-10-17 Thread marvin hunkin
Hi. doing a couple of web projects for a couple of subjects doing in my web design course. one of the pages, needs either to link to a chat room, and need an offline version, so that i can install it locally on my flash drive, and then link it to my local files and folders and able to load

Re: [WSG] introducing a prompt to download or open a pdf

2007-10-17 Thread E Michael Brandt
By including an icon (and a title attribute) that indicates that the pdf will open in a new window, the knowledgeable user can easily right click if she wishes to override and take some other action. That's how divaPOP works. This seems to me to be the best of both worlds: novices will see

Re: [WSG] Offline Accessible Chat Room and CMS Software

2007-10-17 Thread Alan Vo
Offline CMS and chat room software? Rather than looking for something like that, why don't you setup a local server (e.g Apache) and install CMS systems + chat rooms on it? That way you'll have it 'locally' Cheers. On 10/18/07, marvin hunkin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi. doing a couple of

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Michael MD
Fix your spam issues at the mail server + mail client end, not at the web page end, would be my advice. not a solution ... we all know how hard it is for any filtering software to determine whether something is spam or not... ...and any machine-readable version of an email address on a page

Re: [WSG] Encoded mailto links

2007-10-17 Thread Michael MD
Why not simply display the email address as a simple mailto only when the browser is a screen reader? If you mean by CSS (display: none -- or similar -- for aural media types), I'm not sure that would work because AFAIk spambots just look through the source code of the page for mailto links.