[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-08-06 Thread Siegfried Gevatter
** Changed in: zeitgeist
Milestone: 0.4.1 = 0.5.0

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What value should subject.origin have?
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Bug description:
 +   origin = 
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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-08-04 Thread Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen
** Changed in: zeitgeist
   Status: Triaged = Fix Released

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-07-26 Thread Launchpad Bug Tracker
** Branch linked: lp:~zeitgeist/zeitgeist/sort-by-orig

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-07-02 Thread Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen
Considering Siegfried's comment #23 and Michal's comment #24, and with a
free interpretation of Seif's domain moniker in comment #27 I think we
actually agree more or less on what to put in origin. I'll write a draft
docstring and put up a branch for review.

Watch this space - we may actually be able to close this bug at long
last ;-)

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-06-29 Thread Seif Lotfy
Ok this issue has to be settled once and for all
IMHO I think it makes sense to look at origin as the domain  of the subject 
of the event in question. Maybe Subject.origin is a better interpretation than 
event.origin but this would mean an API break.
The benefits of having origin follow the proposed schema is:
1) we can sort by domain (websites or folders)
2) we assist kamstrup and the unity team with their development
3) it will allow easier grouping on a UI level :)

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-06-29 Thread Michal Hruby
I personally don't like that, you can have a simple method which will
extract the domain from uri, on the other hand having possibility to
create at least a partial tree of how you got to a uri is more useful.

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-06-12 Thread Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen
** Changed in: zeitgeist
Milestone: 0.3.4 = 0.4.1

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-05-14 Thread Michal Hruby
I think that it makes sense to store in subject.origin the location
where subject.uri can be found. Therefore the web page visit events
could have as origin set either their referrer page or the domain (only
if referrer is unavailable, since we can parse the domain from uri
anyway).

As for Mikkel's IM use case, I don't think it's ZG's job to log every message, 
so there'd be only some kind of CONVERSATION_STARTED event, and I'd suggest 
this:
event.actor = mailto:john@example.com;
subject.uri = # uri of conversation log *
subject.origin = # location where log is saved
subject.text = Conversation with %s % real_name
subject.mimetype = # mimetype of uri

* If there's no log, uri, origin and mimetype are empty.

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Re: [Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-05-14 Thread Siegfried Gevatter
2010/5/14 Michal Hruby michal@gmail.com:
 Therefore the web page visit event could have as origin set -- the domain
Completely agree.

 As for Mikkel's IM use case, I don't think it's ZG's job to log every 
 message, so there'd be only some kind of CONVERSATION_STARTED event
Completely agree.

:)

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Re: [Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-05-14 Thread Seif Lotfy
So lets say i switched from i opened a website the a document
will the website be the origin of the document... if yes i think this is
kinda wrong. since we are talking about a subject origin as opposed to what
you are suggesting what i would call a event origin...
Lets have an irc meeting...
With the wildcards coming up we could rethink that...


On Fri, May 14, 2010 at 8:19 PM, Siegfried Gevatter rai...@ubuntu.comwrote:

 2010/5/14 Michal Hruby michal@gmail.com:
  Therefore the web page visit event could have as origin set -- the domain
 Completely agree.

  As for Mikkel's IM use case, I don't think it's ZG's job to log every
 message, so there'd be only some kind of CONVERSATION_STARTED event
 Completely agree.

 :)

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-- 
This is me doing some advertisement for my blog http://seilo.geekyogre.com

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-04-12 Thread Siegfried Gevatter
** Changed in: zeitgeist
Milestone: 0.3.1 = 0.3.4

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-01-08 Thread Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen
One use case I want to cover also is IM messages, I am working on a
Telepathy observer that logs chats to Zg. How would I model this via the
Zg datamodel? Let's see...

So I observe that john@example.com sends me the message Hello
Dolly via MSN. His real name is John Doe, I can this from Telepathy as
well. The formal identifier for the sender should be mailto:
john@example.com using the standard IANA mailto URI-scheme, I would
tend to store this in subject.origin - the alternative would
event.actor.

It doesn't make much sense to store app://telepathy.desktop or
app://empathy.desktop in event.actor because I have no way of knowing
which app shows the message to the user - it could indeed be multiple
apps...

It would be most convenient if I also stored the real name, John Doe
somehwhere with the event so that apps wouldn't have to talk Telepathy
to display real names. I could either prepend it to subject.text or
somehow encode it in event.payload (fx. a json map of extra attributes).

event.timestamp = int(time.time()*1000)
event.interpretation = Interpretation.RECEIVE_EVENT
event.manifestation = Manifestation.WORLD_ACTIVITY ***
event.actor = ??
event.payload = 
subject.interpretation = Interpretation.IM_MESSAGE
subject.manifestation = ??
subject.origin = mailto:john@example.com;
subject.text = Hello Dolly
subject.mimetype = text/plain

***) I tentatively introduced the WORLD_ACTIVITY event manifestation
because I think USER_NOTIFICATION would be wrong here

Anyway - it's just a very real use case which is relevant to this
discussion...

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-01-08 Thread Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen
I missed a subject.uri in my previous comment... I don't really know
what to store in there..?

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Re: [Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-01-08 Thread Seif Lotfy
u forgot the subject uri
I agree we shouldnt put telepathy.desktop in
This is a use case where empathy cant even inform us what happened since we
r hooked into telepathy. plus a telepathy .desktop does nto exist.
yet i see no alternative atm.
Let us think about it today in some sort of meeting...
when do u have time?

2010/1/8 Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen mikkel.kamst...@gmail.com

 I missed a subject.uri in my previous comment... I don't really know
 what to store in there..?

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Re: [Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-01-08 Thread Siegfried Gevatter
2010/1/8 Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen mikkel.kamst...@gmail.com:
 subject.origin = mailto:john@example.com;

Good point.

I suppose finding out whether you are talking to John Doe because you
clicked on a link in some file isn't really doable, so storing the
mail there for IM and the web for browser activities (if you agree
with having that) sounds good to me. Can we find some description for
the origin field which covers both cases without having to list them
explicitly (ie. not having a different explanation of it for every
activity type)?

 It doesn't make much sense to store app://telepathy.desktop or
 app://empathy.desktop in event.actor because I have no way of knowing
 which app shows the message to the user

Uhm, that may be problematic.

Maybe we can just have something a la genericapp://im and let apps
look up what the default IM client is and show that. There may be
different clients for supporting different protocols though, so it's
not so easy.

 I missed a subject.uri in my previous comment... I don't really know
 what to store in there..?

IMHO it should be something which when clicked shows the logs of the
conversation.

I discussed this with Gerfried Fuchs (upstream developer for the IRC
client Smuxi), who wants to add Zeitgeist support to Smuxi, and he
said he'd think of a scheme for irc://, which we can then discuss with
other IM client developers.

-- 
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Free Software Developer   363DEAE3

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Re: [Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-01-07 Thread Seif Lotfy
yes event origin should tell us which subject triggered it
but Again this is going to be a hard implementation. Imagine opening a doc,
then quickly check mail, then open something related to the doc (call it x).
the little mail there messes up the equations plus there is not way to have
the event.origin(x) = doc
just my opinion

2010/1/7 Siegfried Gevatter rai...@ubuntu.com

 2009/12/8 Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen mikkel.kamst...@gmail.com:
  Domain seems to imply that it is the place where the subject is
  currently located. It also strikes me as a very vague and possibly
  ambiguous  word here.

 Agreed, root would be a better name.

  If we take an example where I donwload the file from the above URL,
  there are three interesting URIs to log:

 I don't remember how we came to discussing this, but let me explain my
 position on this again.


 If you really want root -let's call it like this for now- for
 optimizing whatever you want to optimize (I'm still not sure what you
 want it for...), then it should be an implementation detail which
 isn't exposed in the API. It doesn't make any sense for it to be
 there.

 Completely unrelated, I propose that we add a new property to events,
 called origin. This property would cover where does this event come
 from, ie. what other subject triggered it.

 So for example if you open project.odt and there click on
 searchengine.com and search for elephants which brings you to
 searchengine.com/elephants and there you click on
 elephants.com/the-truth-about-them that would give you the events:
  - uri: file:///home/humanoid/project.odt, origin: None
  - uri: searchengine.com, origin: file:///home/humanoid/project.odt
  ... some other events because in the middle you talked to an IM contact
 ...
  - uri: searchengine.com/elephants, origin: searchengine.com
  ... some other events because you switched to another tab and looked
 up photos of elements there ...
  - uri: elephants.com/the-truth-about-them, origin:
 searchengine.com/elephants

 The case of downloads gets more complicated so let's not get into it
 just right now.

 Cheers,

 --
 Siegfried-Angel Gevatter Pujals (RainCT)
 Free Software Developer   363DEAE3

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Re: [Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-01-07 Thread Siegfried Gevatter
2010/1/7 Seif Lotfy s...@lotfy.com:
 yes event origin should tell us which subject triggered it
 but Again this is going to be a hard implementation. Imagine opening a doc,
 then quickly check mail, then open something related to the doc (call it x).

No, because origin would be something the data provider gives (in my
example above, I guess we can forget for now about knowing that
searchengine.com came from the ODT, but the other ones between Firefox
items only are certainly possible).

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Re: [Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2010-01-07 Thread Seif Lotfy
We will then have to fully rely on external dataproviders for that

2010/1/7 Siegfried Gevatter rai...@ubuntu.com

 2010/1/7 Seif Lotfy s...@lotfy.com:
  yes event origin should tell us which subject triggered it
  but Again this is going to be a hard implementation. Imagine opening a
 doc,
  then quickly check mail, then open something related to the doc (call it
 x).

 No, because origin would be something the data provider gives (in my
 example above, I guess we can forget for now about knowing that
 searchengine.com came from the ODT, but the other ones between Firefox
 items only are certainly possible).

 --
 Siegfried-Angel Gevatter Pujals (RainCT)
 Free Software Developer   363DEAE3

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2009-12-08 Thread Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen
 There is no need for event origin. If u want the origin of an event u look
 for the subject of the event before

The client has no rigorous way to find out which event came before. We
can apply heuristics, but I don't like that

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2009-12-08 Thread Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen
 there are three interesting URIs to log:

  - The URL my brower window points to

 That's what I consider as origin, and why I'm asking for other stuff
 to use a different name (be it domain or whatever else).

Ok. Let's skip the finer details of the naming as long as we agree on
the basic concepts :-)

  - The URL of the file I download

I think this is something Tracker is supposed to store.

So you don't consider the actual URL that I download part of the event?
Imho that's more relevant to the event than the location of my browser
window. But honestly I think both are quite relevant!

  - The local file:// URL that I save the file under
 aka uri

 - as I said in the line following that :-)

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Re: [Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2009-12-08 Thread Siegfried Gevatter
2009/12/8 Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen mikkel.kamst...@gmail.com:
 So you don't consider the actual URL that I download part of the event?

No. If the user just downloaded a file, he will want to work with the
local version, not download it again. Knowing where the file came from
is also important (in case you want to give someone else the link or
you already removed the local file) so it's metadata worth keeping,
and we have a great metadata store called Tracker where we can put
that (and I think I read somewhere that Tracker/NEPOMUK/whatever
already planned to do that).

-- 
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Free Software Developer   363DEAE3

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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2009-12-07 Thread Seif Lotfy
Ok lets keep origin at the physical location at which the subject
resided. This can be closed if we just agree.

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 +   origin = 
 info.get_uri().rpartition(/)[0]

WHY?



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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2009-12-07 Thread Mikkel Kamstrup Erlandsen
I think Physical location at which the subject resided at the moment of
interaction is a good formulation. It is still incomplete though. We
need to define whether or not trailing slashes should be included - and
stuff like that. I'd like to keep this bug open until all of this is
thoroughly documented in our API docs.

-- 
What value should subject.origin have?
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/487321
You received this bug notification because you are a member of Zeitgeist
Framework, which is the registrant for Zeitgeist Framework.

Status in Zeitgeist Framework: Triaged

Bug description:
 +   origin = 
 info.get_uri().rpartition(/)[0]

WHY?



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[Zeitgeist] [Bug 487321] Re: What value should subject.origin have?

2009-12-03 Thread Seif Lotfy
IMHO we should stick to using the origin as the domain of the subject

/path/to/file == /path/to
youtube.com/aflkasflkasjf == aflkasflkasjf

It will give us the option of knowing which are the most used documents
in a folder or most watched videos on youtube.com

-- 
What value should subject.origin have?
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/487321
You received this bug notification because you are a member of
Zeitgeist-Engine, which is the registrant for Zeitgeist Framework.

Status in Zeitgeist Framework: Triaged

Bug description:
 +   origin = 
 info.get_uri().rpartition(/)[0]

WHY?

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