Hi Ernest, Yes, on Wednesday. I didn't see your name in the attendee list.
If you are attending the APNIC meeting let me know and we can meet before that. David Hilario *IP Manager* *Larus Cloud Service Limited* p: +852 29888918 <+852%202988%208918> m: +359 89 764 1784 <+359%2089%20764%201784> f: +852 29888068 <+852%202988%208068> a: Flat B5, 11/F, TML Tower, No.3 Hoi Shing Road, Tsuen Wan, HKSAR w: laruscloudservice.net/uk e: [email protected] <[email protected]> On 27 February 2017 at 12:08, Ernest Tse <[email protected]> wrote: > Hello David, > > Are you going to speak at APRICOT ? > I want to know more your proposal policy. > > > Best Regards, > > > Ernest Tse > Pacswitch Globe Telecom Ltd. > // Web: http://www.pacswitch.com > // Tel: +852-21570550 > //Mobile: +852-62536678 > //Skype: codesixs > > On Mon, 27/02/2017 18.00, David Hilario <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > Hi Aftab, > > I am not sure that what you look for can be found, this policy proposal is > not fixing something fundamentally broken. > > It merely looks to simplify the administrative burden placed on the > receiving party and the APNIC secretariat while reassuring the offering > party that the transfer will go through for the agreed size. > > One of the real life scenario getting "fixed" is the 2 steps transfers. > When the recipient gets the first half of a given prefix as they only > qualify for that right now and later the second half when they can justify > it too. > > This leaves the recipient in a weak position, the offering party is still > the registered holder of the other half and are policy wise free to > transfer to anyone else or can even have their membership closed and the > space returned to the free pool, leaving the recipient without the whole > prefix they intended... > > > > David Hilario > > *IP Manager* > > *Larus Cloud Service Limited* > > p: +852 29888918 m: +359 89 764 1784 > f: +852 29888068 > a: Flat B5, 11/F, TML Tower, No.3 Hoi Shing Road, Tsuen Wan, HKSAR > w: laruscloudservice.net/uk > e: [email protected] <[email protected]> > > On 26 February 2017 at 08:42, Aftab Siddiqui <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> Hi George, >> Thanks for quick response and clarification. >> >> Again, still not sure what problem we are trying to solve? Haven't seen a >> single use case. >> >> On Sun, 26 Feb 2017 at 10:02 George <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> >>> Hi Aftab, >>> >>> We are happy to share more information if we have the permission from >>> the account holder. Otherwise, it is not possible for the APNIC >>> Secretariat to disclose individual account and request information on >>> the public mailing list. >>> >>> >>> George Kuo >>> APNIC >>> >>> On 25/2/17 10:04 pm, Aftab Siddiqui wrote: >>> > Interesting. >>> > >>> > I hope secretariat/hostmaster can comment. >>> > >>> > On Sat, 25 Feb 2017 at 12:32 Pacswitch Email <[email protected] >>> > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> > >>> > Dear all, >>> > >>> > I can tell you my real experience with APNIC, when I want to >>> > transfer my unused IP ranges to a Singapore based ISP from my >>> > account, they deny it!! That is ridiculous! They said I cannot >>> > transfer! I cannot believe it if the IP address I owned but I >>> cannot >>> > transfer it to a new owner. >>> > >>> > Can anyone tell me who has the same experience? >>> > >>> > Ernest Tse >>> > >>> > Sent from Mobile >>> > >>> > David Hilario <[email protected] >>> > <mailto:[email protected]>> 於 2017年2月25日 12:24 寫道： >>> > >>> >> >>> >> Hi, >>> >> >>> >> The justification for the needs was/is great to have in place to >>> >> protect a free pool of scarce resources. >>> >> >>> >> Maintaining a correct registry, with the proper information is one >>> >> of the core responsibilities of the RIRs, and as a community we >>> >> must develop policies that allows the RIR to do that job in the >>> >> most easy and convenient manner, no need would enable that for >>> >> APNIIC, their time can then be spent on other things. >>> >> >>> >> Unused resources, ideally should be returned to the free pool, but >>> >> that almost never happen voluntarily, they will instead be >>> >> transferred, or even simply assigned or sub-allocated, no real big >>> >> difference here, just different values in the Database and >>> >> different real world contracts, some Database editing you can do >>> >> yourself, others you need to ask your RIR for assistance. >>> >> >>> >> Resources that get transferred are not issued by the RIR from >>> >> their free pool, they are already out there, I do not see any >>> >> positive impact if APNIC rejects a transfer because the recipient >>> >> cannot justify the whole prefix to be transferred. >>> >> >>> >> It will not increase the free pool available at APNIC. >>> >> It may as well cancel the whole transfer. >>> >> If initially rejected and further information is needed, it delays >>> >> what is a very sensitive process, where both the offering and >>> >> receiving party wants the whole process rounded up as fast as >>> >> possible. >>> >> >>> >> RIPE region has had the "no need policy" in place for years, I >>> >> don't believe any sign of massive hoarding for speculative purpose >>> >> is visible over there (Multiple membership process gets abused, >>> >> but that is another issue altogether). >>> >> Large transfers were made, and you do not need to have access to >>> >> any stats to know those organisations needed that space, >>> >> justifying large allocations can be extremely time consuming and >>> >> ultimately detrimental to the overall LIR's business. >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> David Hilario >>> >> >>> >> /IP Manager/ >>> >> >>> >> *Larus Cloud Service Limited* >>> >> >>> >> p: +852 29888918 <tel:+852%202988%208918> m: +359 89 764 1784 >>> >> <tel:+359%2089%20764%201784> >>> >> f:+852 29888068 <tel:+852%202988%208068> >>> >> a:Flat B5, 11/F, TML Tower, No.3 Hoi Shing Road, Tsuen Wan, HKSAR >>> >> w:laruscloudservice.net/uk <http://laruscloudservice.net/uk> >>> >> e: [email protected] >>> >> <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> On 25 February 2017 at 02:03, Owen DeLong <[email protected] >>> >> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> I disagree… >>> >> >>> >> I believe that needs testing still preserves the idea of >>> >> distributing addresses to those with need even in a >>> >> post-exhaustion world. >>> >> >>> >> This serves to discourage speculative transactions and other >>> >> transfers to those not actually needing addresses which would >>> >> only drive prices up and not provide any benefit to the >>> community. >>> >> >>> >> Owen >>> >> >>> >>> On Feb 24, 2017, at 08:32 , Pacswitch Email >>> >>> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Hello all, >>> >>> >>> >>> I agreed that APNIC should accept all transfer without >>> >>> question because IP resource could be count into a assets to >>> >>> the IP holder in accounting. That's mean the ip holder have >>> >>> the right to request transfer to or from other APNIC members >>> >>> or other RIR. >>> >>> >>> >>> Ernest Tse >>> >>> >>> >>> Sent from Mobile >>> >>> >>> >>> David Hilario <[email protected] >>> >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> 於 2017年2月24日 >>> >>> 22:04 寫道： >>> >>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Hi Aftab, >>> >>>> >>> >>>> This is only to simplify things, need based policies are >>> >>>> there to protect the free pool from exhaustion and ensure >>> >>>> fair distribution. >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Space that is already out there can already be transferred >>> >>>> without much hassle, removing the need base justification >>> >>>> just simplifies the whole process, making the transfer >>> >>>> faster and smoother. >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> David Hilario >>> >>>> >>> >>>> /IP Manager/ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> *Larus Cloud Service Limited* >>> >>>> >>> >>>> p: +852 29888918 <tel:+852%202988%208918> m: +359 89 764 >>> >>>> 1784 <tel:+359%2089%20764%201784> >>> >>>> f:+852 29888068 <tel:+852%202988%208068> >>> >>>> a:Flat B5, 11/F, TML Tower, No.3 Hoi Shing Road, Tsuen Wan, >>> >>>> HKSAR >>> >>>> w:laruscloudservice.net/uk <http://laruscloudservice.net/uk >>> > >>> >>>> e: [email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> On 22 February 2017 at 10:04, Aftab Siddiqui >>> >>>> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected] >>> >> >>> >>>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Thanks Guangliang for the update. >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Hi David, what are we trying to fix? >>> >>>> >>> >>>> On Wed, 22 Feb 2017 at 14:13 Guangliang Pan >>> >>>> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Hi Aftab,____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> We don't have a case that rejected because the >>> >>>> recipient could not demonstrate need. However, >>> >>>> during the evaluation process, APNIC Hostmasters >>> >>>> often ask for more support documents before approve >>> >>>> large transfers. ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Kind regards,____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Guangliang____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ========== ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> *From:*Aftab Siddiqui >>> >>>> [mailto:[email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>] >>> >>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, 22 February 2017 12:23 AM >>> >>>> *To:* David Hilario; Guangliang Pan >>> >>>> *Cc:* [email protected] <mailto: >>> [email protected]> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> *Subject:* Re: [sig-policy] prop-118-v001: No need >>> >>>> policy in APNIC region____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Hi Guangliang,____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Do you have any stats on rejection rate due to weak >>> >>>> requirement justifications? ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> On Tue, 21 Feb 2017 at 18:34 David Hilario >>> >>>> <[email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> wrote:____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Dear Benny,____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Thank you for asking for clarifications. ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> This proposal is for any transfer, within in or >>> >>>> out of region.____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> The need based part is only needed to match any >>> >>>> registry requiring a need based justification, >>> >>>> this can be another RIR or even an NIR.____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> David Hilario____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> /IP Manager/____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> *Larus Cloud Service Limited*____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> p: +852 29888918 >>> >>>> <tel:+852%202988%208918> m: +359 89 764 1784 >>> >>>> <tel:+359%2089%20764%201784> >>> >>>> f:+852 29888068 <tel:+852%202988%208068> >>> >>>> a:Flat B5, 11/F, TML Tower, No.3 Hoi Shing Road, >>> >>>> Tsuen Wan, HKSAR >>> >>>> w:laruscloudservice.net/uk >>> >>>> <http://laruscloudservice.net/uk> >>> >>>> e: [email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> On 21 February 2017 at 05:38, Guangliang Pan >>> >>>> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> wrote:____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Dear David,____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> From implementation point of view, I would like >>> >>>> to double check if the following proposal will >>> >>>> also apply to transfers within the APNIC >>> region.____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> - APNIC shall accept all transfers of >>> >>>> Internet number resources to its____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> service region, provided that they comply >>> >>>> with the policies relating____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> to transfers within its service >>> region.____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Best regards,____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Guangliang Pan (Benny)____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Registration Services Manager, APNIC____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Email: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected] >>> >____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> SIP: [email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Phone: +61 7 3858 3188 >>> >>>> <tel:+61%207%203858%203188>____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> http://www.apnic.net <http://www.apnic.net/ >>> >____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ----------------------------- >>> ------------------------------------------------____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> * You can now call APNIC Helpdesk for free using >>> >>>> Skype. For more information____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> visit: www.apnic.net/helpdesk >>> >>>> <http://www.apnic.net/helpdesk>____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> *From:*[email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >>>> [mailto:[email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>] >>> *On >>> >>>> Behalf Of *David Hilario >>> >>>> *Sent:* Friday, 17 February 2017 12:17 AM >>> >>>> *To:* [email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >>>> *Subject:* Re: [sig-policy] prop-118-v001: No >>> >>>> need policy in APNIC region____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Dear list,____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> We are only a few days away from the meeting in >>> >>>> Saigon.____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> There has been no opposition to the policy, but >>> >>>> only very little support as well.____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> As the proposer of this policy I would like to >>> >>>> know if there is interest in streamlining the >>> >>>> policy a bit in order to make transfers between >>> >>>> two regions more compatible, it is really more >>> >>>> of a small patch the way I see it.____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Any opposition to it is very much welcome too, >>> >>>> only the "positive" sides were really >>> >>>> investigated and I would gladly hear any >>> >>>> opposition to it as well as any support.____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> David Hilario____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> /IP Manager/____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> *Larus Cloud Service Limited*____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> p: +852 29888918 >>> >>>> <tel:+852%202988%208918> m: +359 89 764 1784 >>> >>>> <tel:+359%2089%20764%201784> >>> >>>> f:+852 29888068 <tel:+852%202988%208068> >>> >>>> a:Flat B5, 11/F, TML Tower, No.3 Hoi Shing Road, >>> >>>> Tsuen Wan, HKSAR >>> >>>> w:laruscloudservice.net/uk >>> >>>> <http://laruscloudservice.net/uk> >>> >>>> e: [email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> * sig-policy: APNIC SIG on >>> >>>> resource management policy * >>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>>> sig-policy mailing list >>> >>>> [email protected] >>> >>>> <mailto:[email protected]> >>> >>>> https://mailman.apnic.net/mai >>> lman/listinfo/sig-policy____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> -- ____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Best Wishes,____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> __ __ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Aftab A. Siddiqui____ >>> >>>> >>> >>>> -- >>> >>>> Best Wishes, >>> >>>> >>> >>>> Aftab A. Siddiqui >>> >>>> >>> >>>> >>> >>>> * sig-policy: APNIC SIG on resource management >>> >>>> policy * >>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>>> sig-policy mailing list >>> >>>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected] >>> .net> >>> >>>> https://mailman.apnic.net/mailman/listinfo/sig-policy >>> >>> * sig-policy: APNIC SIG on resource management >>> >>> policy * >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> sig-policy mailing list >>> >>> [email protected] <mailto:[email protected] >>> .net> >>> >>> https://mailman.apnic.net/mailman/listinfo/sig-policy >>> >> >>> >> >>> > * sig-policy: APNIC SIG on resource management policy >>> > * >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > sig-policy mailing list >>> > [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> >>> > https://mailman.apnic.net/mailman/listinfo/sig-policy >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Best Wishes, >>> > >>> > Aftab A. Siddiqui >>> > >>> > >>> > * sig-policy: APNIC SIG on resource management policy >>> * >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > sig-policy mailing list >>> > [email protected] >>> > https://mailman.apnic.net/mailman/listinfo/sig-policy >>> > >>> >> -- >> Best Wishes, >> >> Aftab A. Siddiqui >> >> * sig-policy: APNIC SIG on resource management policy >> * >> _______________________________________________ >> sig-policy mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://mailman.apnic.net/mailman/listinfo/sig-policy >> > > * sig-policy: APNIC SIG on resource management policy * > _______________________________________________ > sig-policy mailing list > [email protected] > https://mailman.apnic.net/mailman/listinfo/sig-policy > >
* sig-policy: APNIC SIG on resource management policy * _______________________________________________ sig-policy mailing list [email protected] https://mailman.apnic.net/mailman/listinfo/sig-policy
