Tones, good to get your feedback.
There is no database that I am aware of implementing Toulmin's model. However, I have been thinking about several applications for some time now. One is clinical guidelines for major diseases, like melanoma. These documents are thick and heavy but most of it is background info for emerging clinicians and interested public, in educational mode. Then there are the actual guidelines, written like 'rules' with pointers to the evidence. One thought I had was for a member of the public to enter relevant details about their condition and the application to advise what to do or not to do. The background info can also be used to explain the reasoning behind the advice. So, the 'rules' are the statements, and the background advice are the warrant, backing, etc. Also, thinking overnight, it seems now obvious that statements themselves may be classified according to type. So in the above case, the 'rules' equate to the Toulmin model statements but important sentences from the rest of the material could be considered 'assertions', as in this paper Management of Wool Dark Fibre Risk Knowledge Using Hypertext <https://www.researchgate.net/publication/267195462_Management_of_Wool_Dark_Fibre_Risk_Knowledge_Using_Hypertext?_sg=A5fl9dNa9YY2z8Et2p0aDF_2C5ZOTAFev6uH-O3cy4O6UzQfbbzobHAWVr5MwMaU_AazckxbAd2oKmchK64riQO1V7VdLoErCrvaJWEp.Y8-Lc0anQISAomUWnPaN67V_maR1G1MDTQPPjhYwkuoFZq3mwXJaUCFpsLGTkbpG2LeazI40yECaO284uYHexg>. This project trialled those of 'assertions' as simple statements extracted from the research papers but forming a navigation structure into the content of those papers. Assertions can be considered analogous to outline statements, as per Word's outliner. BTW, this smallish application might be a useful starting point for further investigations of the use of Toulmin's model. I did start authoring my research papers from an outline model and proved, to me at least, that the assertions were a very useful structure for subsequent paper access. As for expert system maintenance, have a look at Ripple Down Rules (PDF <http://turtlelane.com.au/Papers/TR-FD-89-01.pdf> and PDF <http://turtlelane.com.au/Papers/AI88.pdf>). This is a mechanism Paul Compton and I (but mainly Paul) devised many years ago now to overcome the brittleness of KBS without major re-engineering. An additional rule was merely added into the rule base to cover the particular case wherein the KBS failed this time. Paul has extended the RDR approach much further and there any many papers describing its use and enhancements. Your description reminded me of this approach. This approach to maintenance also hinges on the availability of a cornerstone case database, a database of conditions that caused a rule to be created. This is useful for running against the KBS at any time to prove its accuracy. As for more info on Toulmin, the obvious place is his book, The Uses of Argument. I picked up a copy many ywars ago from a second hand book seller. Not sure if a copy can be bought online. Otherwise, do a google images search for toulmin model and see some of the examples that come through that. Charlie, just a query. How does this approach sit with your ideas? bobj On Thursday, 3 December 2020 at 17:35:50 UTC+11 TW Tones wrote: > Bob, > > Very interesting. I can see plenty of ways to implement and automate the > data model but need to digest the the meaning of each element and how to > support discovery. Are there any examples or databases using this method we > could get an example of? > > I have a few ex-CSIRO's staff in my friend and acquaintance circles. > Retirement of people with broad and deep knowledge is a creative and > productive opportunity, so often neglected. > > I imagine there may be information found in various domains that could be > used to pre-populate such a database. > > I have considered in depth expert systems learning, particularly in > complex technical support areas, when the act of solving problems. builds a > repository of knowledge and uses analytics and actual use to strengthen the > expert system. I imagine this solution could be similar. The idea is to use > the information so far and add when a gap is found, but with the gaps > filled in a reusable way and when the answer/element exists promote the > path taken to find an answer/mpodel according to its effectiveness. In > effect providing conditional multi-dimensional decision trees, that respond > to future interactions. > > Only once a larger dataset exists can we start to derive new methods and > mechanisms with less effort. > > Regards > Tones > > > On Thursday, 3 December 2020 at 16:00:47 UTC+11 [email protected] wrote: > >> Colleagues, >> >> all this thinking started by Charlie's initial posting, has led me to >> begin building a simple TW utilising the Toulmin Argument Model for >> representing links and associations between TW tiddlers. This is something >> I have been planning to do for some time, now that I am 'retired' I have >> the time. >> >> My reasoning is that a completed statement represents the context in >> which the link between Ground and Claim can be made. This then also >> supports many different reasons for creating an association between a set >> of Grounds and Claims each one providing a single instance of context in >> which the association is deemed valid. >> >> My thoughts so far: >> A statement can be considered like an IF...THEN statement but more >> complicated due to the additional elements, Warrant, Backing, Rebuttal and >> Qualifier. The IF part represents the Ground and the THEN part the Claim. >> >> The Qualifier could be a percentage value or some other statement of >> possibility/plausibility. >> >> Not all elements need to be utilised in any statement, only those that >> make sense for that particular statement. >> >> Elements can be re-used between statements >> >> Statements can be collected together into a domain of thought or >> applicability. Thus a single TW could cater for many domains. >> >> Each element is represented by its own tiddler and all tiddlers for a >> statement are linked together to form the completed statement. Links are >> stored as Field values in the statement tiddler and also in a Statement >> field of each element tiddler as the links are essentially many-to-many in >> ER terms. >> >> Quandries: >> >> How to handle content elements not text? Images, audio, video, etc... >> >> How to produce an 'active' instance of the domain, ie. an instance that >> functions follow some reasoning mechanism (ie. forward chaining...) >> >> Shared TW: >> >> http://turtlelane.com.au/Development/ToulminModel/toulmin.html >> >> Happy to have your input/thoughts/etc. >> >> bobj >> >> On Wednesday, 2 December 2020 at 15:30:11 UTC+11 Charlie Veniot wrote: >> >>> Like misery, hyperactive-firing-on-all-cylinders synapses love company >>> ... >>> >>> Although right here in this group is fine by me, I'm interested wherever >>> discussion happens. >>> >>> On Tuesday, December 1, 2020 at 11:30:48 PM UTC-4 [email protected] >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Charlie, Tones, TiddlyTweeter >>>> >>>> first off, I hold you personally responsible for firing up my dormant >>>> synapses. Thanks for that, you have provided renewed impetus for me to >>>> continue pondering these issues, which I essentially ceased to do in any >>>> meaningful way since I left my research position at CSIRO (the Federal >>>> Government's research body in Australia). A dormant area of my brain has >>>> reawakened :-) This will also require me to unbox my library so suitable >>>> books can be re-queried (all my books are in storage as we have been >>>> living >>>> most of the time in South Korea for the past decade. Corona has left us >>>> 'stranded' in Sydney). >>>> >>>> I will respond to the recent postings but, like Tones, need to think >>>> things through a bit more rather than provide a rambling nonsense of ideas >>>> and thoughts. >>>> >>>> One thought though. Maybe it is time to take discussion outside of this >>>> group. Not that I want to disenfranchise anybody but the discussion has >>>> wider ramifications/application than Tiddlywiki. It also can be applied to >>>> Mediawiki and even Bill Atkinson's original Hypercard and its offshoots. >>>> Also, this discussion can then take advantage to TW's linking facility, >>>> etc. Just a thought. >>>> >>>> Ciao for now. >>>> >>>> bobj >>>> On Wednesday, 2 December 2020 at 14:19:52 UTC+11 Bob Jansen wrote: >>>> >>>>> TiddlyTweeter wrote: >>>>> "Very good case example (http://cultconv.com/ [footnote---on mobile >>>>> its too minuscule!])." >>>>> >>>>> yes, I know of the sizing issue on mobile devices. Not sure how to >>>>> handle that other than a redesign which I am loathe to do given usage >>>>> stats >>>>> (~8,000 per month over last calendar year). The basic design is for >>>>> multiple synchronous channels of information, in this case four >>>>> (video/audio, transcript, table of contents and images with captions). >>>>> Altogether too much for a small screen. Plus on iPhone, the video takes >>>>> over the whole screen anyway. >>>>> >>>>> bobj >>>>> >>>>> On Tuesday, 1 December 2020 at 03:50:57 UTC+11 TiddlyTweeter wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Ciao bobj >>>>>> >>>>>> Very good case example (http://cultconv.com/ [footnote---on mobile >>>>>> its too minuscule!]). >>>>>> >>>>>> BTW, I really took to your last point ... >>>>>> >>>>>> Throughout all of my research career, the issue that continually >>>>>>> crops up is context. I think this is the crucial component to keep >>>>>>> things >>>>>>> understandable. Yet no agreed understanding of context exists yet we >>>>>>> all >>>>>>> use it ... >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Right. In terms of information design issues there is no algorithm >>>>>> for accurately deriving either "scope of meaning" or "scope of inference >>>>>> (context implying)". Though it is pretty clear on net that within >>>>>> "fields >>>>>> of interest" context is ALWAYS playing an implicit role in successful >>>>>> sites. >>>>>> >>>>>> I thought the site you gave access to excellent. *Very honed to >>>>>> purpose*. It is an unusual (uplifting) thing seeing such a >>>>>> "schematization" work so well. >>>>>> I think that is the point. You have to "sniff/tease" out context and >>>>>> back generate (derive) schema from that first-felt understanding that >>>>>> isn't >>>>>> otherwise derivable. >>>>>> >>>>>> Best wishes >>>>>> TT >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TiddlyWiki" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/7252b102-1d46-4f94-aaa6-6908b686885en%40googlegroups.com.
