Lomax uses guile and deception again to spin the issue.
It's very simple friends. Supposedly, they showed an original to snopes
with the seal, the folding and other distinctive marking. Snopes then
certified it to be true and original and posted a blog about it. Just show
that to a respected Tea Party member or some respected individual.
Finished. End of the Birther movement.
But no, Lomax has to spin it with his verbal diarrhea. Typical and I am not
surprised.
Jojo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Abd ul-Rahman Lomax" <a...@lomaxdesign.com>
To: <vortex-l@eskimo.com>; <vortex-l@eskimo.com>
Sent: Thursday, December 27, 2012 3:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:[OT] Moon God, Dozens of wives, and marriageable age
At 01:07 AM 12/26/2012, Jojo Jaro wrote:
Lomax is lying again. I'm not surprised. It is OK for him to lie as long
as his goal are "honorable" and good for islam and muhammed.
No. It is not OK for me to lie for a supposedly noble goal. I wrote about
when it's permissible to lie, and it's only permissible to prevent serious
physical harm. And "islam" and "muhammad" can't be harmed.
OK, let me ask anybody here. Who has actually seen Obama's Birth
Certificate in actuality?
I'll answer that. What is a "birth certificate?" I had to supply oodles of
them to the U.S. government, to the Chinese government, and the Ethiopian
government. What they actually wanted was something that is legally
*completely equivalent* to the "original birth certificate." That is, a
copy that is signed and sealed by a state employee as being a true copy of
the "original."
But perhaps Jojo means the "original." Okay, it's been seen by the clerk
who filled it out. The doctor who signed it. The state agency that filed
it. Any employee of that agency who made a copy of the birth certificate
had to see it, legally, to verify that the copy was a true copy. And the
original sat in an archive, being occasionally accessed to make copies.
Then Hawaii computerized. Apparenty all the birth certificates in the
state were computerized. They entered the data into a secure computer
system. Did they enter all the data? No. They only entered the legally
relevant data that is needed for what birth certificates are needed for.
The date and time of birth, the parents, the location of birth, and other
information, but not such things as the name of the delivering physician.
Once that was done, providing a "birth certificate" for Hawaii then became
a matter of accessing the computer record and printing it out, and
certifying the copy.
That's what Obama originally provided, *the same as everyone else needing
to certify a birth in Hawaii.* But the birthers demanded to see the
"vault" certificate. It was legally insane. If someone really suspected
that the ordinary certificate was forgery, the appropriate action would be
to make a complaint under Hawaiian law (and to knowingly provide a false
birth certificate for federal purpose could also violate federal law).
Hawaii does not routinely provide a copy of the vault certificate, and the
reason is obvious: they want to limit access to those highly valuable
original documents. Obama eventually requested a copy. He *cannot* request
the original. Members of the public cannot view these, access is
restricted. A court could order inspection, to be sure. If there were a
criminal investigation, where fraud were suspected, the original is there,
and that is the very reason it is so protected. So it will be there. I
would assume tight access control.
The Hawaiian Secretary of State, who has authority over the records,
decided to allow a certified copy of the vault certificate to be made.
This is all covered in news reports, by the way. An offical signed the
copy, and it was provided to Obama.
Obama then held a press conference. He showed the certified copy. He also
provided ordinary copies to the press. A scan was put up on the internet.
Had the scan been a full, high-resolution scan, it would have been an
enormous file, and given the demand for the copy, it would have crashed
the server.
Not the scanned and altered copy posted on the Internet.
There copy on the internet is "altered." Not in a way that you can
casually see, though, because the alteration is simply file compression,
using standard procedures, it's done automatically by PDF programs. What
they do is to search the document for areas that are similar enough to
each other that they can be replaced by a single image, with the other
similar instances becoming *exact* copies of that. You see this all the
time, most images on the internet have been compressed. It's subtle, you
have to closely examine these similar areas -- which have become *exact*
areas -- and notice that the fine detail, pixel by pixel, is identical --
which is highly unlikely in an original scan of typewritten material.
Letters are very similar, but not exact on a pixel scale.
So people looked at the internet images and noticed letters that were
exact copies of other letters. Aha! Caught them! They were really excited,
and I can understand. They thought that, in order to alter the document,
someone had copied and pasted letters from one place on the document to
another, in order to alter the text, replacing the original text with
something else.
When I first saw the birther excitement about the "alterations," I thought
they might have something. I know about image compression, but simply
didn't think of it. The claim raised a severe puzzle, but, hey, life can
be puzzling. But I continued searches, and found quickly that this claim
had been quite carefully addressed, by experts. Artifact of file
compression.
Now, I know that thinking is uncommon for people like Jojo, but one might
try this on: We are talking about an alleged forgery over an issue that,
in the thinking of the birthers, involves governmental-level issues. If a
President wanted to forge a fake birth certificate, how would he do it?
He certainly and absolutely would not do it this way. It would be
phenomenally clumsy. No, there would be a very covert break-in at the
Hawaiian record facility. An employee there might be compromised. (What
would be the budget of this project?) The original certificate would be
replaced with a copy made on the same model of typewriter, effectively
indistinguishable from the original, except, of course, for the
alterations.
Now, back up. What alterations? Is there a certificate for Obama in
Hawaii? There are "judicial certificates" issued for people not born in a
state, I know, because I've obtained them twice. That's pretty much it.
Was Obama adopted? Well, this idea has two major problems: a judicial
certificate would still show the location of birth, it's not the same as
an original certificate. The computerized copies would be different from
ordinary certificates. (I don't know Hawaaian details, but I'd assume that
the state procedures are not *utterly incompetent.*) The other problem is
the birth announcements in Hawaiian newspapers. He was born in Hawaii, or
someone was setting up a fraud that long ago.
Not snopes which is a political hack job.
It's all over the internet. It's not just one site. And precisely what is
wrong with snopes. I didn't cite snopes and I don't recall even seeing it.
If Obama supposedly was issued an official Birth Certificate by the State
of Hawaii as Lomax claims, that originally issued BC should be in the
possesion of Obama, right?
Yes.
OK, if Obama wants to kill the Birther movement, just show it to one, only
one, highly respected individual.
He showed it to the press. I do not know what individuals he's shown it
to.
Let's say, Ron Paul, Mike Huckabee, Sarah Palin or the like. Just one
well respected Tea Party member or a well respected Republican congressman
or senator. Let him handle that original BC, feel the official seal,
look at the folds, and make an official scan open to the public and call
an open honest press conference.
Has any such "well-respected individual" been refused? The prominent
"birthers" fell silent. There aren't enough serious birthers left to
justify calling a press conference. It's not news any more. It's over.
It's *far* more over than, say, cold fusion in 1990. It's truly dead.
But Jojo never gives up. Talk about "die-hard believer." There is no
credible evidence that Obama was not born in Hawaii. The claims were all
based on speculation, generally of the "how come" variety. How come his
father claimed his race as "African" in 1961? Wasn't that an anachronism?
Well, did he? People assume *so* much. Fathers don't provide the
information on birth certificates, generally, mothers do. The father was
an academic. He was, indeed, from Africa. And Stuff Happens. You can
*always* find suspicious "facts" if you look hard enough.
Not a white house press conference which is questionable to begin with.
Everything he does is wrong, out of the box, to Jojo. Why *not* a "white
house press conference"? Is Jojo claiming that every reporter there would
be "in on the scam"?
This is very simple and the Birther movement will die an untimely death
and I will apologize and tuck my tail between my legs in shame and go
away.
Liar. It's already dead.
Lomax lies when he says we have seen the official BC.
You never will, unless you go to Hawaii and are hired to work in the
archive, and you break the law and access the record on your personal
initiative. Or legally, and legally, if you get yourself elected Secretary
of State, you might be able to see it as well. Not sure that would be
legal, though. There is *legal process* for access to those records.
You will also never see the certified copy. You have already seen a copy
of the certified copy. Now, you can bet that the reporters at the press
conference looked that "original certified copy," i.e., the sealed copy.
If they were worth their salt, they knew the contested fields. Is Jojo
claimng that they would not blow the whistle? All of them would not?
Okay, there is another way to Keep the Dream Alive. The "original" shown
at the press was fake. If anyone here thinks that a sophsticated forger --
and a U.S. President would have access to one, through the CIA, if nowhere
else (the risk of doing so is something else, it's a reason why conspiracy
theories like this are prety implausible) -- wouldn't have a very
good-looking seal, quite like the real thing. It would, in fact, be easy
to make such a seal, if you have the original sealed copy.
Do we think that Obama is showing a fake certificate, knowing that it's
fake? That would be an impeachable offense, and would *actually risk
losing the office.* Why would he take such a risk? To satisfy "birthers"?
You have *got* to be kidding! He could have stonewalled forever. He had no
legal necessity to obtain and show the original. And he does happen to
have a government to run.
We have not; no one has.
He's lying. Quite simply, Jojo says whatever he wants to say, without any
regard for the truth. He should know that many people have seen the
original, including the clerk who copied the original data into the
Hawaiian computerized records, and the state official who certified the
copy, who would be guilty of a crime if it was a false certification. The
latter was very recent, knowing that this whole thing was receiving great
public attention. Those are not conditions which inspire forgers and
accomplices to think they can get away with it. All it would take is a
court order to see the original, and the jinx would be up. And some people
would go to prison, and a President, if complicit -- and maybe even if
not, depending on what the original shows -- would lose his office.
That official knows what the issues are. If the released copy is
materially different from the vault copy, he'd know it.
What we've seen which Lomax claims is the official BC is a scanned
photoshop file.
No. Jojo is not careful in what he says. Obama was provided with a printed
copy, probably scanned and printed from the original. You can see the
shadows from the original being bound in a book, that is how these things
are done. (It's much harder to loose a bound book than a single piece of
paper. Someone could walk out of a secure area with a piece of paper, not
so easy with one of these thick books.)
Since Jojo mentioned Snopes, it's now the number one hit if you google
"Obama birth certificate."
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/birthcertificate.asp
If it's a "political hack job," someone deserves a raise. I'm going to
stop giving detailed evidence. That page is thorough.
No one except Obama and alledgedly snopes have seen it.
Snopes has seen it? They don't seem to claim that!
Why? Is anybody buying Lomax's argument?
It really doesn't matter, because nobody sane is buying the birther story
any more. This is what Jojo bring here, and he's got a whole string of
these, I'm sure he could trot out more.
It's very simple my friends, if there is an officially issued BC, complete
with seal, and signature of the official representative of the State of
Hawaii, just show it.
It's been shown. A copy was given to reporters (I would assume that this
copy was not made from a compressed scan. If so, yeah, that would be
*stupid.*) A copy that to the eye looks the *same* was released on the
internet. That's what good file compression does, remove information that
is irrelevant to the eye.
No amount of spin or eloquence or tiresome lengthy essay will overcome
this very strong argument. Just show it. Period.
Why are you telling me this? This is a variety of an old argument: Do as I
say or you are a liar and a fraud.
Funny thing is, the new governor of Hawaii Ambercrombie - a democrat,
strong supporter of Obama, wanted to silence the birther movement once and
for all. So, he sought to dig into Obama's vault BC. Guess what? Even
he can't penetrate the veil of corruption Obama has put up to block access
to his vault records. Why is there an executive order to block access to
Obama's vault BC.
Fascinating. Is there such an Executive Order? That would be quite odd.
Legally, the President has no authority over Hawaiian officials, unless a
federal issue could be shown. and this would not qualify.
This is the first time it has ever happened to a sitting president.
Indeed. Has it happened? I have not researched this. I do not doubt that
the governor of Hawaii might not be able to look at the documents, on his
own initiative. That, however, would not apply just to Obama's records,
but to *all birth records.* I'd assume that Hawaiian law or legally
established departmental regulation would protect the records from access
outside established procedure. An Executive Order? My, my.
True story? I will research it, this is fascinating, even though Jojo has
a *really low batting average,* close to zero.
What the heck is wrong with seeing the original vault copy BC?
Plenty. There are very good reasons why access to them is limited. It's to
protect them from loss or alteration, in fact.
If he has alledgedly issued an official copy, what's wrong with verifying
it with the vault copy?
That was done by the state officials.
Why does Obama feel the need to go out of his way to issue an executive
order to block access?
Did he?
You know, only corrupt and lying leaders find the need to hide their
history. Obama is a corrupt lying usurper.
Or someone is, at least, corrupt and lying. Hey, Jojo, there is an old
technique: repeat after me, "The curse of God on me if I'm lying." I just
said that for myself. Your turn.
Don't say it if you are not sure.
And Lomax's is really naive to think that only Republicans are concerned
with this issue. Over 60% of Americans feel Obama should come clean on
this issue. But of course, the illiminati finds it convenient to forcibly
reintall their puppet president. And they have found willing sheeple in
Lomax. LOL......
If over 60% of Americans believe that, there is something they could do.
How does Jojo know what "60% of Americans believe"?
I believe that President Obama "should come clean" on this, if there is
anything hidden. I don't get that there is anything hidden, so how I'd
answer a survey would depend on the question, and, as well, on when it was
asked.
This post is separately sent, I have not yet verified or falsified the
claim that Abercrombie, the governor of Hawaii, could not access the Obama
birth records because of an "executive order." I will follow up.
Jojo
(I am now removing copies of prior posts in the thread, per list rules.
Jojo was respondng to the following post.)
----- Original Message ----- From: "Abd ul-Rahman Lomax"
<a...@lomaxdesign.com>
To: <vortex-l@eskimo.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 26, 2012 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:[OT] Moon God, Dozens of wives, and marriageable age
