its the cultural differences that influence the policy, so who's culture is more significant than everyone elses that will dictate the policies.
On 8 August 2017 at 08:14, John Erling Blad <jeb...@gmail.com> wrote: > Yes there are cultural differences between wikipedias on _content_, but > there should be no differences on _policy_ about that content. > Note also that there are some differences on use of _facts_ that are highly > troublesome, and that comes from relaxed core policies. > Armenian genocide for example. > > On Mon, Aug 7, 2017 at 3:48 PM, Gnangarra <gnanga...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > to quote, worth a read before even considering policies being global > > http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/asi.23901/abstract > > > > This article explores the relationship between linguistic culture and the > > > preferred standards of presenting information based on article > > > representation in major Wikipedias. Using primary research analysis of > > the > > > number of images, references, internal links, external links, words, > and > > > characters, as well as their proportions in Good and Featured articles > on > > > the eight largest Wikipedias, we discover a high diversity of > approaches > > > and format preferences, correlating with culture. We demonstrate that > > > high-quality standards in information presentation are not globally > > shared > > > and that in many aspects, the language culture's influence determines > > what > > > is perceived to be proper, desirable, and exemplary for encyclopedic > > > entries. As a result, we demonstrate that standards for encyclopedic > > > knowledge are not globally agreed-upon and “objective” but local and > very > > > subjective. > > > > > > > On 4 August 2017 at 10:18, Ziko van Dijk <zvand...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > The number of pillars depends on the language version... > > > And whether some rules is called pilöar not dpes not seem to be pf much > > > importance > > > Ziko > > > > > > John Erling Blad <jeb...@gmail.com> schrieb am Do. 3. Aug. 2017 um > > 14:42: > > > > > > > Five pillars are moot. > > > > > > > > On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 2:59 PM, Gnangarra <gnanga...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > The moment you have a centralised policy you take away the ability > to > > > > > discuss, makes decisions, and achieve consensus from the community > > that > > > > > create the projects. Importantly you create the opportunity for > > banned > > > > and > > > > > blocked editors to decide what happens in a community. > > > > > > > > > > By having a base set of simple policies in the Incubator that are > > > > > atuomatically created when a project starts up you give them the > best > > > > guide > > > > > to establishing themselves well before that project goes live, > ince a > > > > > project is live it has to be allowed to develop its community. > > > > > > > > > > We already have the 5 pillars which are the basis for the projects, > > but > > > > > meta is not a place that the content creating community spends a > lot > > of > > > > > time. > > > > > > > > > > On 3 August 2017 at 19:07, John Erling Blad <jeb...@gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Having centralized core policies would lessen the maintenance and > > > > > process, > > > > > > not increase them. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Aug 3, 2017 at 11:17 AM, Strainu <strain...@gmail.com> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > The core policies should be the ones pushed by board > resolution, > > > and > > > > > > > those should be the absolute minimum required to keep the > > projects > > > > > > > safe from a legal POV. Period. Otherwise, people with little > > > > > > > understanding of small Wikipedias will try to push stuff from > > > en.wp. > > > > > > > Just recently someone was trying to have an RFC on meta on all > > the > > > > > > > different processes that en.wp has and ro.wp does not have, > with > > > > > > > little consideration on whether the manpower to implement, let > > > alone > > > > > > > maintain, these processes exists. No thank you to rule pushing > > > > without > > > > > > > local context. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Having a community take a rule from en.wp is different, just as > > > long > > > > > > > as some kind of discussion happens within the community about > it. > > > > Even > > > > > > > if the rule is really useless or harmful and the community did > > not > > > > > > > realize that in the beginning, at least it can evolve > differently > > > > from > > > > > > > the English one. Have a centralized repository and trying to > > change > > > > > > > the rules there by consensus would be much more difficult for > > small > > > > > > > communities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Strainu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2017-08-02 17:05 GMT+03:00 John Erling Blad <jeb...@gmail.com > >: > > > > > > > > Nearly all Wikipedia projects has virtually the same core > > content > > > > > > > policies, > > > > > > > > but with slightly different wording. Nearly all, because a > lot > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > > smaller lacks them, and a lot has outdated or only partial > > > > policies. > > > > > It > > > > > > > > takes a lot of time to actually make them and keep them > > updated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Creating and maintaining the core content policies should not > > be > > > > > > > something > > > > > > > > that small projects should invest a lot of time in, they > should > > > > > simply > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > able to point to existing policies on Meta. The central > > policies > > > > > should > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > localized if necessary. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Checking Meta I find > > > > > > > > - https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/The_no_original_research_ > > > policy > > > > > > > > - https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Neutral_point_of_view > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I can't find anything like "Verifiability". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Would it be possible for Wikimedia Foundation to make some > > sound > > > > > > baseline > > > > > > > > policies, and with the option for local projects to refine > > those? > > > > > > Perhaps > > > > > > > > with assistance from editors on Wikipedia? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lets try to make the policies accurate, without "no original > > > > > research" > > > > > > > > diverging into verifiability of external sources. It should > be > > > > about > > > > > > > > original research in content on Wikipedia. Likewise, at some > > > > projects > > > > > > > > neutral point of view has become "do not diverge from > creators > > > > point > > > > > of > > > > > > > > view"… > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Would this be possible? It would be really nice if those > > baseline > > > > > > > policies > > > > > > > > pages could be copied to the individual projects like central > > > user > > > > > > pages, > > > > > > > > so they would be "internal" to the projects. Thus the > projects > > > > would > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > more "ownership" of them. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The same thing apply to other meta projects (Wikipedia, > > > Wikibooks, > > > > > > > > Wiktionary, etc). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jeblad > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > > > > > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > > > > > wiki/Wikimedia-l > > > > > > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > > > > > > > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/ > > > > > mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > > > > > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject= > > > unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > > > > > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > > > > > wiki/Wikimedia-l > > > > > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > > > > > > > Unsubscribe: > > > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > > > > > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject= > > > unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > > > > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > > > > wiki/Wikimedia-l > > > > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > > > > > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/ > > > mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > > > > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject= > > unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > GN. > > > > > President Wikimedia Australia > > > > > WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra > > > > > Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > > > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > > > wiki/Wikimedia-l > > > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > > > > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/ > > mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > > > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject= > unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > > > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/ > mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > > wiki/Wikimedia-l > > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > GN. > > President Wikimedia Australia > > WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra > > Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com > > _______________________________________________ > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > > wiki/Wikimedia-l > > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> > > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/ > wiki/Wikimedia-l > New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> > -- GN. 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