Hi Al,

I somehow sense that you are trying to say something to some particular 
person(s).  If so, then please ignore what I wrote below.

As you know, there are many schools.  Some school ask for money for 
class or session of finite numbers.  These are generally for beginner's 
class.  This way, because of the money, students would commit a little 
deeper into say a three month period of painful sitting. 

For advanced class, dedicated students are difficult to find and less in 
number. Advanced teachers would usually teach for free to committed 
students.

In our school, everyone is called a Senior School Brother『師兄』 or 
Senior School Sister『師姐』, even one or two year old kids are also 
addressed the same.  Reasons being we don't know how many generations 
has he(she) be practicing.  When we meet our enlightened Master, he 
always stands up to greet and ask us to sit down first.  When we leave, 
he would always stand up and walk with us to the door.  We have over 60 
teachers in our school, yet we often don't care to be addressed as 
teachers, just Senior School Brother or Senior School Sister.  Because 
we "know" Buddha Nature are all equal.  Learning is endless and everyone 
is a teacher.  The key is to get to the initial understanding and 
foundation and proper practice to begin.  This takes about 4-5 years.  
Then it is up to the individual.

Our Master constantly remind us, be ware of the "Eight Winds" as a 
teacher.  The higher you go, the tougher the challenge.  Therefore most 
of us don't consider ourselves as teachers and even less wanted to be a 
Master, because of all the karma he is undertaking. This bring up 
another critically important subject perhaps missing.

One day when the practitioner reached a certain state,  he(she) will 
experience Karma in its physical and spiritual form.  On that day, you 
would  know what Chan is all about. Then perhaps the practice could be 
deeply committed.  Without the teaching and practice to witness Karma 
and Cause and Effect, it is incomplete.

JM

Al wrote:
>
> From: "mike brown" <I honestly don`t think certification of a person`s
> understanding means much.>
>
> I agree with you. There are people achieving satori who have never 
> heard of
> zen or meditation, etc. There are people who reach enlightened states who
> may not even have any spiritual beliefs at all.
>
> However, anyone who is asking for money in exchange for teaching is by
> definition a professional teacher. Therefore if that person is advertising
> here I would like to know what their experience is.
>
> That is just my opinion. I am not stopping anyone from sending money to
> anyone. The person in question may very well be Fudo or Genryu or some 
> roshi
> from a well-known temple. Since he is not talking, then I cannot guess.
>
> The whole point is that you cannot be dishonest and be spiritual too. 
> So lay
> your cards on the table. What is your experience? A lot, a little, or none
> at all? No big deal. We have all interacted with the person and we can all
> make our own judgments, but we should not be asked to fly blind and trust
> someone who does not trust himself.
>
> Al the Pal.
>
>  


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